From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jan 15 00:17:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA04641 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 00:17:15 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA04612 for ; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 00:17:09 -0800 Received: (from phk@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id AAA12444; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 00:16:41 -0800 From: Poul-Henning Kamp Message-Id: <199501150816.AAA12444@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: ache@astral.msk.su (Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage) Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 00:16:40 -0800 (PST) Cc: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr, dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: from "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" at Jan 15, 95 00:49:07 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 535 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > In message <199501131627.IAA03431@ref.tfs.com> Poul-Henning Kamp > writes: > > >PLEASE DON'T COMMIT BINARIES INTO THE TREE. > > >A good definition of "not binary": > > > The file has no 0x00 or 0xff in it. > > Chars A0-FF at least is valid in both iso8859-* and koi8-r, > we already have such files in the tree. 0xff is forbidden nontheless. It confuses too much code out there. -- Poul-Henning Kamp TRW Financial Systems, Inc. FreeBSD has, until now, not one single time had an undetected error. :-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Jan 15 00:56:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA07368 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 00:56:47 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA07362 for ; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 00:56:45 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA02835 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Sun, 15 Jan 1995 11:51:33 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Sun, 15 Jan 95 11:51:33 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id LAA08922; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 11:48:51 +0300 To: Poul-Henning Kamp Cc: dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr References: <199501150816.AAA12444@ref.tfs.com> In-Reply-To: <199501150816.AAA12444@ref.tfs.com>; from Poul-Henning Kamp at Sun, 15 Jan 1995 00:16:40 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 11:48:50 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: CVS stuff Lines: 24 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 919 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199501150816.AAA12444@ref.tfs.com> Poul-Henning Kamp writes: >> In message <199501131627.IAA03431@ref.tfs.com> Poul-Henning Kamp >> writes: >> >> >PLEASE DON'T COMMIT BINARIES INTO THE TREE. >> >> >A good definition of "not binary": >> >> > The file has no 0x00 or 0xff in it. >> >> Chars A0-FF at least is valid in both iso8859-* and koi8-r, >> we already have such files in the tree. >0xff is forbidden nontheless. It confuses too much code out there. 0xff is valid russian letter and I already do basic things in source tree to handle it correctly. If you know any code confused, please tell me. -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:17:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA00202 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:17:33 -0800 Received: from rz-wb.fh-sw.de (rz-wb.fh-sw.de [192.129.23.111]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA00178 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:17:21 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by rz-wb.fh-sw.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id UAA06263; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 20:44:00 +0100 Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 20:44:00 +0100 (MET) From: Michael Reifenberger To: Martin Renters cc: Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: About readonly root partition In-Reply-To: <199501131534.HAA11820@freefall.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 13 Jan 1995, Martin Renters wrote: ... > I do agree that it would be a good idea to do something to allow selective > mounting at system startup time. Perhaps init could tell that it is running > diskless and run some sort of shared '/etc/diskless.rc' script which could > mount the correct /etc, /tmp and /var filesystems based on some system > administrator defined scheme. Istn't amd supposed to do this sorts of things. Bye! .... Michael Reifenberger From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:23:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA01120 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:23:34 -0800 Received: from ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (ghpc6.ihf.RWTH-Aachen.DE [134.130.90.6]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA01102 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:23:27 -0800 Received: (from thomas@localhost) by ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id KAA25859 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 10:09:40 +0100 From: Thomas Gellekum Message-Id: <199501160909.KAA25859@ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: small addition to vt220 termcap entry To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 10:09:39 +0100 (MET) Organization: Institut f. Hochfrequenztechnik, RWTH Aachen X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 700 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Moin moin, could someone please add the following patch to /usr/src/share/termcap/termcap.src? It defines the sequences emitted by the PageUp, PageDown and Keypad-[79513] keys. tg *** /usr/src/share/termcap/termcap.src.orig Wed Oct 26 03:16:00 1994 --- /usr/src/share/termcap/termcap.src Thu Jan 12 14:37:47 1995 *************** *** 2171,2176 **** --- 2172,2178 ---- :ce=\E[K:cl=\E[H\E[J:cd=\E[J:cm=\E[%i%d;%dH:nd=\E[C:up=\E[A:\ :so=\E[7m:se=\E[27m:us=\E[4m:ue=\E[24m:\ :md=\E[1m:mr=\E[7m:mb=\E[5m:me=\E[m:\ + :K1=\EOw:K2=\EOy:K3=\EOu:K4=\EOq:K5=\EOs:kP=\E[5~:kN=\E[6~:\ :is=\E>\E[?3l\E[?4l\E[?5l\E[?7h\E[?8h\E[1;24r\E[24;1H:\ :rs=\E>\E[?3l\E[?4l\E[?5l\E[?7h\E[?8h:\ :tc=vt100: From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:26:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA01640 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:26:54 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA01612 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:26:45 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id VAA06150 for ; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 21:13:42 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA01971; Sun, 15 Jan 95 21:13:45 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.6.9/keltia-uucp-1.21) id VAA00428 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 21:09:21 +0100 From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199501152009.VAA00428@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: More on emacs To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 21:09:20 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier Robert) X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#280 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 603 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I rebooted under my old kernel (ctm#279, just before the big changes from Bruce in sys) and emacs runs fine... Something is broken in the kernel. As for INN and MMAP, I'm afraid we cannot use it (we had this discussion before) and the sympthoms are the same as in the FAQ (error messages about symlinking some crossposted articles and some broken overview data) about MMAP usage. I've recompiled without MMAP and will see if it happen again. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #6: Sun Jan 15 01:32:17 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:26:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA01658 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:26:58 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA01633 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:26:52 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id UAA06049 for ; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 20:38:47 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA01929; Sun, 15 Jan 95 20:38:50 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.6.9/keltia-uucp-1.21) id UAA07670 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 20:30:23 +0100 From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199501151930.UAA07670@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: I'm afraid we broke something in emacs... To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 20:30:23 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier Robert) X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#280 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 3476 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk With a ctm#280 level kernel (date below), we broke something in emacs 19.28. Before rebooting on 15th jan, at 2 AM in the morning emacs worked fine. It now dies with a bus error and the following stack frame : It happens when you're under X and launch emacs in its own window. When running with -nw it runs fine. (it is not a off_t problem :-)) Anyone encountered this behaviour ? After a complete recompilation, it keeps dying. With -O or with -g. #0 0xefbfe14e in end () #1 0xefbfca04 in end () #2 0x16bc in Fredraw_frame (frame=236602880) at dispnew.c:171 #3 0x186c in redraw_garbaged_frames () at dispnew.c:239 #4 0xb86e in echo_area_display () at xdisp.c:357 #5 0xb5fe in message2 (m=0x19b100 "Loading my-init...", len=18) at xdisp.c:241 #6 0xb7f8 in message (m=0x99ed9 "Loading %s...", a1=1706548, a2=-272643108, a3=4) at xdisp.c:328 #7 0x9a217 in Fload (str=52038188, noerror=18152452, nomessage=18152452, nosuffix=18152452) at lread.c:429 #8 0x8e79b in Ffuncall (nargs=2, args=0xefbfcc30) at eval.c:2067 #9 0xa920b in Fbyte_code (bytestr=51351864, vector=68129096, maxdepth=2) at bytecode.c:422 #10 0x8ef19 in funcall_lambda (fun=101683472, nargs=1, arg_vector=0xefbfcd00) at eval.c:2231 #11 0x8eb8d in apply_lambda (fun=101683472, args=85736412, eval_flag=1) at eval.c:2160 #12 0x8d95a in Feval (form=85736404) at eval.c:1685 #13 0x9ad31 in readevalloop (readcharfun=18187144, stream=0x82a3c08, sourcename=52038048, evalfun=0x8d2b0 , printflag=0) at lread.c:741 #14 0x9a2c5 in Fload (str=52038048, noerror=18152492, nomessage=18152492, nosuffix=18152492) at lread.c:443 #15 0x8e79b in Ffuncall (nargs=5, args=0xefbfcf78) at eval.c:2067 #16 0xa920b in Fbyte_code (bytestr=51430892, vector=68208176, maxdepth=5) at bytecode.c:422 #17 0x8ef19 in funcall_lambda (fun=101762516, nargs=0, arg_vector=0xefbfd09c) at eval.c:2231 #18 0x8e87f in Ffuncall (nargs=1, args=0xefbfd098) at eval.c:2097 #19 0xa920b in Fbyte_code (bytestr=51432412, vector=68209652, maxdepth=1) at bytecode.c:422 #20 0x8d838 in Feval (form=84986828) at eval.c:1655 #21 0x8c394 in Fcondition_case (args=85735948) at eval.c:1060 #22 0xa9bcf in Fbyte_code (bytestr=51431212, vector=68208992, maxdepth=5) at bytecode.c:575 #23 0x8ef19 in funcall_lambda (fun=101762836, nargs=0, arg_vector=0xefbfd35c) at eval.c:2231 #24 0x8e87f in Ffuncall (nargs=1, args=0xefbfd358) at eval.c:2097 #25 0xa920b in Fbyte_code (bytestr=51430072, vector=68207380, maxdepth=5) at bytecode.c:422 #26 0x8ef19 in funcall_lambda (fun=101761696, nargs=0, arg_vector=0xefbfd434) at eval.c:2231 #27 0x8eb8d in apply_lambda (fun=101761696, args=18152452, eval_flag=1) at eval.c:2160 #28 0x8d95a in Feval (form=85370788) at eval.c:1685 #29 0x395ae in top_level_2 () at keyboard.c:888 #30 0x8c48b in internal_condition_case (bfun=0x395a0 , handlers=18152752, hfun=0x39150 ) at eval.c:1096 #31 0x39655 in top_level_1 () at keyboard.c:896 #32 0x8bf31 in internal_catch (tag=18152732, func=0x39630 , arg=18152452) at eval.c:886 #33 0x394f6 in command_loop () at keyboard.c:858 #34 0x38fb1 in recursive_edit_1 () at keyboard.c:694 #35 0x390c8 in Frecursive_edit () at keyboard.c:736 #36 0x384c1 in main (argc=1, argv=0xefbfd660, envp=0xefbfd668) at emacs.c:762 -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #6: Sun Jan 15 01:32:17 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:27:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA01703 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:27:13 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA01667 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:27:04 -0800 Received: from masi.ibp.fr (root@masi.ibp.fr [132.227.60.23]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id SAA05722 for ; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:54:55 +0100 Received: from ares.ibp.fr (card@ares.ibp.fr [132.227.64.31]) by masi.ibp.fr (8.6.9/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id SAA18515 for ; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:54:05 +0100 From: Remy.Card@masi.ibp.fr (Remy CARD) Received: by ares.ibp.fr (8.6.9/jtpda-5.0) id SAA21932 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:51:31 +0100 Message-Id: <199501151751.SAA21932@ares.ibp.fr> Subject: Yet another bogus path in a Makefile To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:51:31 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 540 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, The Makefile in usr.sbin/xten incorrectly uses an absolute patch to reference /usr/src/libexec/xtend. The enclosed patch fixes the problem. Can someone please commit it? Thanks Remy *** usr.sbin/xten/Makefile.orig Sun Jan 15 17:55:35 1995 --- usr.sbin/xten/Makefile Sun Jan 15 17:56:00 1995 *************** *** 2,8 **** PROG= xten SRCS= xten.c ! CFLAGS+=-I. -I/usr/src/libexec/xtend MAN1= xten.1 --- 2,8 ---- PROG= xten SRCS= xten.c ! CFLAGS+=-I. -I${.CURDIR}/../../libexec/xtend MAN1= xten.1 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:36:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA03228 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:36:03 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id DAA03147 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:35:19 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA28429; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:31:25 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id TAA26117 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:31:24 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id TAA04197; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:01:32 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501151801.TAA04197@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: uid 32767 on /var: file system full To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:01:31 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <199501142327.QAA13800@clem.systemsix.com> from "Steve Passe" at Jan 14, 95 04:27:01 pm X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 680 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Steve Passe wrote: | | I don't know how clean this is, but it works, modify /etc/daily by | adding the following 2 lines before the first actions: | | TMPDIR=/usr/tmp | export TMPDIR This is ugly (at least to accept it as default). It should always be possible to mount /usr read-only (e.g. via NFS). If some local /tmp is unable to hold enough space, make it a symlink to somewhere with more space instead. Does locate.updatedb use /var/tmp or /tmp? -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:37:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA03363 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:37:20 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id DAA03300 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:36:37 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA27913; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:03:06 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id TAA26048 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:03:06 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id SAA03889; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:30:20 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501151730.SAA03889@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Something really devilish :-) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:30:19 +0100 (MET) X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 3853 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well, several systems outside obviously like to have their logo bouncing around on the screen when the screen saver is active. (The half OS and SGI come to mind...) Now i thought it might be a nice hack to have the BSD daemon right in the xlock modi for `image' and `life'. The patch below is against an older xlock port (1.1 CD) i just had lying around. I don't know about the copyright implications for the BSD daemon -- does someone know the mail address for Kirk McKusick, or even has a `hot line' to him? If people would find this neat, and the copyright issues are checked, i could go and commit the patch below to the current xlock port (is there any? i hope so). begin 644 xlock-patch.gz M'XL(")!)&2\"`WAL;V-K+61A96UO;@#5&FMOVS;PL_LKF`P;8E=)3+WEK`/V M0(=M&#"L`UJ@*`*:HFRABA5(,IIL[7\?7Q*I%R6C[1Y&*MCBW?'>Y-UUM5J! M&)&[_'"U3:NKO$AWB^=%"GY&!P`=8-L;&VY@"&`4>4\N+R\UX`X<##<%#OP\G@H\5[@7=,G_?LB)DEZ('+[VW=I7.V![_97]H13Y$ME MA:H4`THMW1U(#/`>%34<55SY^@UX!OYBVP"P?EBOK8]]0NL48F&--`8S1,R? M0NH\(Q.QL6<\!3-$S.-/!VN`H8F,RU<)4<2X4-"(1/AJ*,1/V#.8Y@SI)-&T M@`T+-3&'OT!&U=O:=P$?M>&'.'/$]T#I+\:F3:):KS4Q++3B3+L`#A7A>%IG MPCJVR]_87-%XVIH4OB'&D1S7B,17;8_;U%8V-7*&.1+D(F.!9!1?P'A.0PS9 MTR$D/"R!&F=PDC,!DG!N"#1NXJM-B"*&S&Y)N,[@0'"/7 MPV*H[-7?)!%/OLF:=,\`SXCD**&DFP23UA1>A:*N)YF/&->1WQMB[HQS*9S8 MI,V90+*Q1@!-;X(X(XYV!I!II)C'(X+6&/S@Z<1UY@LD=\;I&76MZ4\C)?Y) M.I-)4%?Z#,Y([0FG<"8B-$E&T^409U`+\4YB-FRB^]D,I-:Y&5,\(15OH`:-UNWIW17 M>ZH37>A)9H>^SEP5C[&6:IIM^VI MYX<;7NZE=VA'KK`H*%_2&NC;XPY`"&B5:`<;SV-EE\.K00G9JB;AQO$W:SA> M3=+C"T:BH@2\6`.`_GV1'G!VC`DX?\AR6@#NSY^<:2_+XR'+=SFK7<\%@BS4 M7OW$>`!LD1=F@'^80-9BL;A>`5[V64#6>'0[7L9R'G@=.Y\'53Y_+`M#:O$\ MRW<:M=!/DA?@(J44US<@!5^#]/[RFQ3G!YP?#Q5]]?3IDF^V2!-P<5:OWN4Q M6;*WC,2KYVF6_4YPA0Z[C%S$Y;U%F3E8X`4N7I>X(.3PYFJ'+2HFY90B,"H/ M6T#+8*%O632OFLW+U^F;JX2,TNVCO1Y50H$.< MWUTLP9><,M5"5M[T(!\'((O\'85D5A%VLV)>X)?M\>"+^ M<7<2\DEW^G3RS?"+$[UBVB=:L@W9,O0MN-:-":1KTAQ85'^D=X2Z1DGHQG%Y M(=SLC,/PK!VC"M'U"]Y,6RT;[;*&VHT.*(1^UK9&"T(*^JQCH1;,]K$BY>T] M*6XSUN6C&[=]YBD(EN`:A#=*E%<_DNIE2CW[W;=55:3;(Z6@6?&KA]T[U&B* MR5USRA:N))MJM>&2+[=9;.*++BM*U\,R-R$F@27AZY[X:N\Z13&YU5Y?`QN\ M?Z_1HR^40(D`;;*;S'K")5EZK'\^MG\VR9*^A3?LK&-O`-^>GZK,WUN1>\(-7S MO""[@J[&PO[=`/XN0_CM;^D#R<2Z6%LNQ1$CXT0EA8^*$ZWO/!@F>E@/1TDK MU">"I)5X_ILQ,B3P:(AT9/]?1\C`H3`O0(;.AW\I/M@Y4MZA++N=G%K9GII: M=5$ZU88;;%Q_YNS*B;JSJW-._?P_/\/2E2"]P%N/K4MC58+^I--M?!I M!2B:3=@[K9KU3BJ-B=Y-Q<9F,M'*==<@9JC7];@WX>I#.G(`5!.SPXF18=/^ MMO&DF**Q(GH0=F#L>'D:-].-6Z0U5L8ZZ@)R2[2>2F"PIFB?14@->LRC,T]U M@4-O1C-/M)J#45X;`VA3(^R81+-%G]S51HS&QJU0;JRU_49X#7UMC&8*)Z)/ MA[@2G,@T>*&0S>BBUSYK":AWH.S)SKEHW6$Q8$73$Q"':)TZ?[+9[82]9IZQ MI:RWX?&,T<74]+DF)D:ND3N=:F1K.Q[@V)#/D#7)L:\/"_#/+G<<-Y&0'6(]KY)C:JS20#A&6.E, MC.U%_QR/S*U$<&/MO/)-_[-!`.K*G6QPF_Q,-K*S-&GUL9^3+;`=`-V-!S

6'M(J15GZ)XGK:DZ]X=5:_>XV0:S4Y9PL!@OU9BM1J@,)5G.K:^*HV9SY0J[K=<_ATJNZ7'L/J'BA!/J?*>S7,/ZCVOP%_`P-/ $>BD``%R, ` end -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:37:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA03366 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:37:19 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id DAA03322 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:36:56 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA10622 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:56:27 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA00338; 15 Jan 95 19:32:37 CST (Sun) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA00332; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:32:35 -0600 Message-Id: <199501160132.TAA00332@bonkers.taronga.com> X-Authentication-Warning: bonkers.taronga.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard), peter@bonkers.taronga.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Soundcards and interruptless drivers and lost characters, oh my! In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 13 Jan 95 18:23:07 PST." <199501140223.SAA00485@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.4.1 7/21/94 Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:32:31 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I said: > > > OK, so I set my soundcard to IRQ 7 and selected > > > device lpt0 at isa? port? tty > > > device snd2 at isa? port 0x220 irq 7 drq 1 vector sbintr > > > which should have run the driver interruptless and did a config and a Jordan said: > > I'll bet you your parallel port card is still sharing IRQ 7 though. > > I'm not surprised. Don't do this - it's evil! Yep, it was still using IRQ7. Rod says: > If your card has a jumper on it to select IRQ5 or IRQ7, simple remove > the jumper and this should eliminate the driving conflict. OK, I traced wires and removed this jumper, and even hacked the lpa driver back in and I'm still losing characters with either lpa0 or lpt0/interruptless. Is this really soggy and hard to light in 1.1.5.1, or do I need to get a new serial/parallel card? Tomorrow I'm going to start tracing wires and trying to figure out how to disable COM2 (my Amiga) and put the sound card on IRQ3. I was hoping to get this done before my wife got back from her convention. She doesn't like me rebooting from underneath her.... On the plus side I've got a nifty TK wrapper for tracker (in ports) if anyone's interested... lets you save comments on each file and build a playlist. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:37:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA03419 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:37:56 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id DAA03385 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:37:32 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA10616 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for freebsd.org!hackers); Sun, 15 Jan 1995 19:56:16 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA11333; 15 Jan 95 17:53:54 CST (Sun) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA11330 for ; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 17:53:53 -0600 Message-Id: <199501152353.RAA11330@bonkers.taronga.com> X-Authentication-Warning: bonkers.taronga.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: UUCP in 1.1.5.1 versus the G protocol. In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 13 Jan 95 18:23:07 PST." <199501140223.SAA00485@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.4.1 7/21/94 Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 17:53:50 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk How do you tell uucico to accept anything other than g or e on dialin? I've put "protocol izvg" into port, sys, and the sys entry, and we still send them Pge on startup. Also, it seems to be messing up the g protocol startup on received calls. The other side gets a bad checksum on INITA. The source code is less than explanatory... the checksum code is weird, including a variable iyyy that's included in the checksum but not (as far as I can see) in the packet. :-< From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 03:42:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA03964 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:42:41 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA03947 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:42:34 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.8/8.6.6) id BAA03730 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 01:26:09 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 01:26:09 -0500 From: Wankle Rotary Engine Message-Id: <199501160626.BAA03730@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: serial consoles and keyboard probes Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Greetings: At one point I suggested making it possible to allow people to install FreeBSD on a system with only a dumb terminal on a serial port as a console. Today, I finally took a look at the serialboot code and I think I've found a way to make this idea work. However, I've encountered one snag which I'm hoping some of you guys can help me with. First, a bit on what I have managed to do. The problem with the existing COMCONSOLE setup is that the only way to use a serial port as a console is to make a custom kernel with the COMCONSOLE option enabled and install a special boot block. Essentially this means you can have it one way or the other: you can't use just one kernel and boot block to do both. Unfortunately, using one kernel and boot block to do both is exactly what's required. So, to that end, I've made the following hacks: - Merged biosboot and serialboot -- the keyboard i/o routines and the serial port i/o routines are contained in the same boot block: putchar() writes to both the serial port and the standard graphics display, and getchar() can be told to read either from the serial port of the PC's keyboard. - Modified the bootblock's gets() function to check for keystrokes on both the keyboard and the serial port. Whichever you type with first gets precedence (more on this in a bit). - Added another boot flag ('-h') and coresponding definition to . The definition is RB_SERIAL (0x1000). The -h stands for 'Hardwired terminal.' With the -h flag, you can force the kernel to boot in 'serial console' mode even if you're typing from the PC's keyboard. The -h switch is really somewhat redundant, but since all the other RB_ flags have switches associated with them I thought I'd be consistent. - Modified /sys/i386/isa/sio.c to do away with the COMCONSOLE option entirely. The kernel will give COM1 priority as a console device if the RB_SERIAL flag is set in the boothowto word instead. - /sys/i386/boot/serialboot now contains just a Makefile which differs from the biosboot Makefile only in that it specifies a special compile-time option: -DFORCE_SERIAL. This can be used to create a boot block that gives precedence to the serial port over the keyboard, instead of the other way around. This last bit is the part that I could use some help with. The way I have things working now, the following things happen: - The boot block prints its usual banner message and prompt to both the VGA display and the serial port. - It then waits for the user to press a key on either the serial port or the keyboard. Whichever one generates a character first gets precedence; a flag is set if input comes from the serial port. - If the 'serial' flag is set, the RB_SERIAL bit in the 'howto' word is set, and this is then passed to the kernel. - If the kernel sees that the RB_SERIAL bit is set, COM1 is given priority as a console, and it becomes the console device. If the RB_SERIAL flag isn't set, the VGA display is used as the console as usual. The only problem with this is autobooting: with the default boot block I have now, the 'serial' flag is cleared by default, which means the VGA display is assumed to be the console device. If the user types nothing and the timeout expires, the system will boot in 'VGA console' mode. The ony way to have it boot in 'serial console' mode by default is to change the boot block. I consider this to be a less than optimal solution. Sun workstations get around this problem by checking for the presence of a keyboard. If you unplug the keyboard, the system will use serial port A as the console (I believe you can specify a different port, but A is the factory default). With PCs, things are a little different: if you just unplug the keyboard, the system won't boot: you have to go into the CMOS configuration menu and set the keyboard to 'not installed' in order to bypass the keyboard probe. (This is how my system works at least; I'm pretty sure this is true of most PC/AT BIOSes.) What I need to know is this: - Is there a way to read the 'keyboard installed/not installed' flag from the CMOS configuration, or is there some probe routine in the BIOS that would allow you to reliably detect the presence or absence of the keyboard? This would provide an ideal mechanism for chosing the default console device: if the user unplugs the keyboard, then the serial port is assumed to be the console device (the 'serial' flag is set by default instead of cleared) and autobooting would work as expected. This in turn would make it possible to support using either the VGA display or a serial port as a console without requiring any code changes, which is what I'm after. (If I can't get 2.1 installed on my office system using just a dumb terminal, I'll be very upset. :) So, anyone have any ideas? I'm hoping to save myself a trip to Columbia's engineering library. -Bill ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~T~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Møøse Illuminati: ignore it and be confused, or join it and be confusing! ~~~~~~~~ FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #0: Fri Jan 13 22:04:07 EST 1995 ~~~~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 05:27:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA03490 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:38:39 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id DAA03395 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 03:37:42 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA27403; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:30:11 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id SAA25606 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:30:10 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id SAA03567; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:08:12 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501151708.SAA03567@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 18:08:12 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <199501150930.BAA21553@genesis.nred.ma.us> from "Steve Gerakines" at Jan 15, 95 01:30:22 am X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 813 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Steve Gerakines wrote: | | Next, make sure the device is configured into your kernel. By default | it is disabled because it apparently causes problems with some peoples' | systems. You will need to build a new kernel. Your config should have: | | disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 | disk fd1 at fdc0 drive 1 | tape ft0 at fdc0 drive 2 | | make sure this last line isn't commented out. As far as i know, the fdc line in the config file does also need a ``flags 0x1'' clause (right after the `bio' keyword), otherwise the ft probe will be skipped. -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 11:17:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA03454 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 11:17:36 -0800 Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA03422 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 11:17:20 -0800 Received: from utis156.cs.utwente.nl by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (5.0/csrelayMX-SVR4_1.0/RB) id AA04603; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 13:30:23 --100 Received: by utis156.cs.utwente.nl (4.1/RBCS-1.0.1) id AA21233; Mon, 16 Jan 95 13:30:13 +0100 To: Garrett Wollman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Netinet internals (Was: Patching a running kernel) In-Reply-To: Your message of Fri, 13 Jan 1995 15:07:10 EST Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 13:30:08 +0100 Message-Id: <21232.790259408@utis156> From: Andras Olah content-length: 0 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 13 Jan 1995 15:07:10 EST, Garrett Wollman wrote: > Create a sysctl interface for it. It's trivial to do. Thanks, done. > -GAWollman > > PS: How's T/TCP coming? (FYI: T/TCP is an extension of TCP for transactions [RFC-1644] I'm trying port to FreeBSD with the help of Garrett. Interested people can get the current - buggy - code from me. My observations with stock 2.0 networking code maybe interesting for people on this list, so I cc'd it to hackers.) A bit slowly, I'm sorry for it. I haven't had much time since the status report I forwarded to you before X-mas (I hope you got it). It seems that I have to dive deeper into tcp_input/tcp_output to really understand what goes wrong. During the last week, I made some experiments with the stock 2.0 code and found some problems. I want to straighten them out before further debugging the T/TCP extensions. /* * If this is a small packet, then ACK now - with Nagel * congestion avoidance sender won't send more until * he gets an ACK. */ if ((unsigned)ti->ti_len < tp->t_maxseg) { tp->t_flags |= TF_ACKNOW; tcp_output(tp); } else { tp->t_flags |= TF_DELACK; } The above code fragment from tcp_input (in the header pred code and at the end of the `slow' path) has a number of bad effects (1) every character in telnet sessions is echoed in two packets (immediate ACK and then the echoed character); (2) in bulk transfer (series of full sized packets) when options are used: because ti_len = maxseg - length of options every packet will be acked immediately, and window updates after application reads will always be in a separate packet. Thus in short, all the advantages of delayed ACKs are lost. The alignment by rounding of the MSS to a nice value in tcp_mss is also lost if options are used, because the actual data length in packets will be MSS - options. This is less important now because the ethernet MTU is less than MCLBYTES, but will decrease efficiency over ATM or FDDI, for example. Finally, even if I switch off the do_rfc1323 flag (to assure that MSS sized packets are sent), I don't quite understand the implementation of delayed acks. Using ttcp with 16k read/writes on the loopback interface (MTU set to 1500), I collected traces where 10 segments were sent in a series and then the receiver acked them in one ACK. Isn't it a violation of RFC-1122 which requires that at least every second MSS sized segment should be acked? I couldn't find any code in tcp_input that set ACKNOW or needoutput when two MSS sized segments were received since the last ACK was sent. Did I miss something here? Andras From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:19:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA22040 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:19:33 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA22032 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:19:32 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA13735; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 16:08:24 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: Something really devilish :-) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 15 Jan 95 18:30:19 +0100." <199501151730.SAA03889@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 16:08:23 -0800 Message-ID: <13734.790301303@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Well, several systems outside obviously like to have their logo > bouncing around on the screen when the screen saver is active. (The > half OS and SGI come to mind...) This is not commercial - Kirk should have no problem with its use. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:21:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA22134 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:21:29 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA22111; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:21:21 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA20083; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 12:23:42 +1100 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 12:23:42 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501170123.MAA20083@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr Subject: Re: I'm afraid we broke something in emacs... Cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >With a ctm#280 level kernel (date below), we broke something in >emacs 19.28. I hope I fixed this a few minutes ago. Try again with a sys/i386/i386/machdep.c dated later than `Tue Jan 17 01:21:47 GMT 1995'. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:21:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA22169 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:21:42 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA22149 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:21:37 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA14499; Mon, 16 Jan 95 19:49:30 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (UAA09311); Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:55:11 +0100 Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:55:11 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199501161955.UAA09311@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: after snap kernel build blues Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Past Friday (13th!) I ran a ftp session on freebsd.cdrom.com to grab the latest snapshot. The ftp session ran all day at avge. rates of 0.36 KB/s and after I had it downloaded at last I found that sh do_cksum returned an error on two files (bindist.ah and bindist.aw) I downloaded these files today since I was busy with other things over the weekend and found that sh extract.sh returned something like gzip: stdin not gzip format. I rebooted my machine and tried again a cat bin* | tar ztvf - and found everything OK (COPYRIGHT was the last file being shown). I started over executing the extract.sh script and things went fine this time. Now I tried to build a new kernel (which was overdue for long but always failed for obscure reasons: seg faults 10 and 11 and such during gcc passes) and I get the following error: Script started on Mon Jan 16 19:44:10 1995 blues# make cpp -DLOCORE -I. -I../.. -I../../sys -DJAZZ -DI486_CPU -DBOUNCE_BUFFERS -DNCONS= 8 -DSCSI_DELAY=15 -DFAT_CURSOR -DUCONSOLE -DCOMPAT_43 -DPROCFS -DCD9660 -DMSDOSF S -DNFS -DFFS -DINET -DKERNEL -Di386 -DLOAD_ADDRESS=0xF0100000 ../../i386/i386/l ocore.s | as -o locore.o ../../i386/i386/locore.s: Assembler messages: ../../i386/i386/locore.s:786: Error: Unimplemented segment type 6 in parse_operand *** Error code 1 Stop. blues# exit Script done on Mon Jan 16 19:44:15 1995 --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de (still runnung a GENERIC 2.0 kernel) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:23:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA22396 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:23:34 -0800 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [192.48.107.36]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA22219 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:21:54 -0800 Received: (from jhs@localhost) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id BAA29561; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 01:43:07 +0100 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 01:43:07 +0100 From: Julian Howard Stacey Message-Id: <199501170043.BAA29561@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: CD-1.1 & 1.7 Gig FS - Someone in Germany, preferably near Heidelberg ? Reply-To: jhs@regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de X-Phone: +49 89 268616 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk There's a guy with an installation problem `out of inodes' his environ: 1.7 G scsi cd 1.1 (he told it 255 heads 63 sectors 214 cyls 486 dx 33MHz adaptec 1542cf BTW linux, os/2, dos all run ok I spent some time telling him to try: first slowing the bus, then dd if=/dev/rsd0d of=/dev/null & see if it reports 34000 sectors ( also to check if freebsd can handle the Then do fsck /dev/rsd0a ; fsck /dev/rsd0d Then maybe assume 1.7G breaks freebsd-1.1, & lie to the installation, about disc capacity, & go for a 1.3G file system (as my 1.4G was acceptable to freebsd-1.1) He's supposed to be an experienced unix guy i believe, so i guess it was just an oversight that he tried fsck he noticed it accessed the floppy, & didnt guess to try fsck something (like /dev/rsd0a) As a last resort, I also pointed out the 2.0 CD-ROM was now available from Walnut Creek, but that I couldnt remember when any large disc file system problem may have been fixed. anyway, if there's a friendly freebsd person nearer him than me in Munich, he'd be grateful, (simply mail me your tel no, & i'll tell him when he phones me next, so he can phone you, so you don't get a phone bill He is German, so if a fellow national is willing for him to contact you, he'd also probably be pleased to no longer have his ears assaulted by my poor German pronunciation & grammar ;-) He is: Rudiger Studanski, Haupstr 55 Heidelberg plz 69117 06221 12401 ab 20:30 privat buro (tagsuber darmstadt 06151 108303 0900-1900 Email ? ... No he doesn't have that ! (no provider & no freebsd to drive it) Anyone feel like letting him phone you sometime ? PS I wouldn't rush to suggest loads of things for me to ask him, I can't afford to phone Heidelberg for free remote debugs he really just needs a friendly _local_ FreeBSD guy, not me about 600 kilometers away. PPS (He got my name from cd-rom:/SUPPORT.TXT, where it clearly says COMMERCIAL SUPPORT, but he of course turned into yet another request for free telephone support, (Perhaps one day some real company near me (Munich) will start using FreeBSD, (yup, I know `go out & promote it' is the answer :-) --- Julian Stacey , ( is an intermittent phone link ) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:23:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA22414 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:23:40 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA22397 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:23:35 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.8/8.6.6) id QAA00387; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 16:14:26 -0500 From: Wankle Rotary Engine Message-Id: <199501162114.QAA00387@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 16:14:22 -0500 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501161534.QAA02863@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> from "J Wunsch" at Jan 16, 95 04:34:51 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 4920 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk They say this J Wunsch person was kidding when he wrote: > > As Wankle Rotary Engine wrote: > | > | - Merged biosboot and serialboot -- the keyboard i/o routines and the > | serial port i/o routines are contained in the same boot block: putchar() > | writes to both the serial port and the standard graphics display, and > | getchar() can be told to read either from the serial port of the > | PC's keyboard. > > Two problems i'm seeing here: i had already a hard job to even fit the > serial boot stuff w/o VGA/kbd BIOS into the existing boot blocks. > Having both there would bloat them again, and space is really a scarce > resource. Yes, I know. I had to cheat a bit to actually make all of my most recent changes fit. First, I had to compile with -O2, and second I had to yank out what appeared to me to be an archaic section of code from boot.c: /* if(addr < ouraddr) { if((addr + head.a_text + head.a_data) > ouraddr) { printf("kernel overlaps loader\n"); return; } if((addr + head.a_text + head.a_data + head.a_bss) > 0xa0000) { printf("bss exceeds 640k limit\n"); return; } } */ It seems to me that since the kernel is now always loaded into high memory that the condition that this code tests for can never happen: 'addr' can never be less than 'ouraddr' unless things are compiled differently, so what's the point. > Second: assume sio0 is connected to a modem. Since the bootblocks > would then echo all their neat garbage to the modem, too, the modem > might get confused. Consider the case the user on the keyboard hits > ``?'' to see the file list, and on of the files has the nifty name > ``atd2345''... :-) Okay, I've taken care of this. I have managed to find a way to probe for a keyboard: syscons does it by trying to reset the keyboard hardware, so I yanked the snippet of code that does this and created a small probe routine. What happens now is this: - The serial port is initialized whether we intend to use it or not, but nothing it printed to it initially. The 'serial' flag is cleared by default. - The probe_keyboard() function tries to reset the keyboard. If it fails, we assume the keyboard isn't plugged in and the 'serial' flag is set. From here, we assume that that the serial port is the default console device. If the keyboard is reset successfully, then we assume that the VGA display is the console device and nothing is printed to the serial port. - Whether we default to serial mode or not, the serial port is still probed for characters along with the PC's keyboard. When combined with the stuff I mentioned in my previous message, this allows for the following functionality: - If the keyboard is present, we can accept input from either it *or* the serial port, although the banner message will only be printed to the VGA display so that we don't confuse any modems that might be present on COM1. (Happy now? :) - If the keyboard is not present, we do the opposite: the banner message goes to the serial port (along with an extra 'No keyboard found' message) but we still probe for characters on both the serial port and the keyboard (in case the user plugs the keyboard back in). - The user can force the kernel to boot into 'serial console' mode using the -h flag from the keyboard, if he/she wants. - In either case, 'options COMCONSOLE' becomes a thing of the past and booting from a serial port is now possible without any special modifications, like God intended it to be. :) We also don't need a seperate 'serialboot' boot block. The cost of this extra functionality: an added 224 bytes: -r--r--r-- 3 bin bin 512 Jan 9 13:09 wdboot -r--r--r-- 3 bin bin 6864 Jan 9 13:09 bootwd -rw-r--r-- 1 root bin 512 Jan 16 15:30 boot1 -rw-r--r-- 1 root bin 7088 Jan 16 15:30 boot2 Again, this is with -O2. This is quite a bit bigger than before, but it it's still within the limit (I think the upper limit is 7168). > The above aside: i like the idea. So what do you think of it now? :) > -- > cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- > private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de -Bill -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~T~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Møøse Illuminati: ignore it and be confused, or join it and be confusing! ~~~~~~~~ FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #0: Fri Jan 13 22:04:07 EST 1995 ~~~~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:28:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA22994 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:28:09 -0800 Received: from bigdipper.umd.edu (bigdipper.umd.edu [128.8.220.139]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA22791; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:26:38 -0800 Received: (from adhir@localhost) by bigdipper.umd.edu (8.6.8/8.6.6) id PAA13968; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 15:57:13 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 15:57:13 -0500 (EST) From: "Alok K. Dhir" To: questions@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: GUS question and LPT question Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hey all - on my 2.1-development system (Jan2 or so kernel), I am trying to get my sound cards to work. I have both a GUS and a PAS16 in my machine. I have compiled in support in my kernel like this: device snd4 at isa? port 0x240 irq 15 drq 6 vector gusintr device snd3 at isa? port 0x388 irq 10 drq 7 vector pasintr device snd2 at isa? port 0x220 irq 5 drq 1 vector sbintr All three devices get recognized at boot time. I am not sure, however, how to differentiate between tvarious devices MAKEDEV has created for them - that is, how do I know which audio, audio or audio1 is my PAS or my GUS? Also, there is a dsp, dsp1, and a dsp16. Finally there is a midi, a mixer and a mixer1. Experimenting a bit shows that the only devices I can get to work are dsp1 and audio - everything else results in strange screechy noises from the speakers (very GUS-like screeches, when it plays back random data in its memory). In any case, any idea on how to get things working? I remember a conversation a while back about incorrect init of the GUS with these drivers - is that the situation here? Thanks all... Second question - I have found that with the following device in my kernel: device lpt0 at isa? port "IO_LPT1" tty irq7 vector lptintr I can only print in polled mode - if I switch to interrupt driven mode (lptcontrol -i) the printer takes hours to print even one small line. Polled mode, however seems to work OK. Then I noticed a conversation in which someone stated that we sould not be using irqs for printing at all. So what should I do - what is the "correct" way to set up my printer? Thanks -------------------------------------___--------------------------------- | Al Dhir, Programmer Analyst /___\ UMCP Ag-Engineering Dept | | Internet: adhir@bigdipper.umd.edu (o o) (301) 405-1197 | ---------------------------------ooO-(_)-Ooo----------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:29:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA23190 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:29:53 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA23181 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:29:51 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id AAA20912 ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 00:45:46 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA04617; Tue, 17 Jan 95 00:45:48 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501162345.AA04617@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: UUCP in 1.1.5.1 versus the G protocol. To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 00:45:48 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501152353.RAA11330@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Jan 15, 95 05:53:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 612 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I've put "protocol izvg" into port, sys, and the sys entry, and we still > send them Pge on startup. One of the site I call is a SVR4 with a broken serial driver (so the protocol G ends up at 100 cps on a 9600 bps connection) so I limit UUCP at the g prot. like that in my sys entry and it is working system itesec protocol g call-login * call-password * > The other side gets a bad checksum on INITA. No problem whatsoever on my side, weird problem on yours. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #0: Thu Jan 12 00:41:32 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:41:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA24208 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:41:19 -0800 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA24199 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:41:14 -0800 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id SAA02269; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:39:45 -0800 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199501170239.SAA02269@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes To: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (Wankle Rotary Engine) Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:39:44 -0800 (PST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501162114.QAA00387@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> from "Wankle Rotary Engine" at Jan 16, 95 04:14:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2584 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > They say this J Wunsch person was kidding when he wrote: > > > > As Wankle Rotary Engine wrote: > > | > > | - Merged biosboot and serialboot -- the keyboard i/o routines and the > > | serial port i/o routines are contained in the same boot block: putchar() > > | writes to both the serial port and the standard graphics display, and > > | getchar() can be told to read either from the serial port of the > > | PC's keyboard. > > > > Two problems i'm seeing here: i had already a hard job to even fit the > > serial boot stuff w/o VGA/kbd BIOS into the existing boot blocks. > > Having both there would bloat them again, and space is really a scarce > > resource. > > Yes, I know. I had to cheat a bit to actually make all of my most recent > changes fit. First, I had to compile with -O2, and second I had to yank > out what appeared to me to be an archaic section of code from boot.c: > > /* if(addr < ouraddr) ... > } */ > > It seems to me that since the kernel is now always loaded into high > memory that the condition that this code tests for can never happen: > 'addr' can never be less than 'ouraddr' unless things are compiled > differently, so what's the point. The point is to be able to load something other than the kernel below the 1MB mark so that it can load the kernel above 1MB. This applies to both a 3 stage boot loader, and to very special kernel debuggers. > > Second: assume sio0 is connected to a modem. Since the bootblocks > > would then echo all their neat garbage to the modem, too, the modem > > might get confused. Consider the case the user on the keyboard hits > > ``?'' to see the file list, and on of the files has the nifty name > > ``atd2345''... :-) > > Okay, I've taken care of this. I have managed to find a way to probe > for a keyboard: syscons does it by trying to reset the keyboard hardware, > so I yanked the snippet of code that does this and created a small > probe routine. What happens now is this: > ... > > - Whether we default to serial mode or not, the serial port is still > probed for characters along with the PC's keyboard. This has the failure mode if my slip line is on serial port 0 (and it IS!), an incoming packet during boot could cause the system to boot with a serial console. > When combined with the stuff I mentioned in my previous message, this > allows for the following functionality: It's getting better!!! :-). -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Custom computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:43:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA24455 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:43:25 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA24438 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:43:22 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA04805 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Mon, 16 Jan 1995 21:20:34 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Mon, 16 Jan 95 21:20:33 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id VAA00731; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 21:13:56 +0300 To: Terry Lambert Cc: dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, phk@ref.tfs.com, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr References: <9501161740.AA23380@cs.weber.edu> In-Reply-To: <9501161740.AA23380@cs.weber.edu>; from Terry Lambert at Mon, 16 Jan 95 10:40:44 MST Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 21:13:56 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: CVS stuff Lines: 18 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 771 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <9501161740.AA23380@cs.weber.edu> Terry Lambert writes: >> 0xff is valid russian letter and I already do basic things >> in source tree to handle it correctly. If you know any code >> confused, please tell me. >Any code that uses a signed character as an lvalue for a getch/getc, and >then checks for -1. >Presumably, the response will be "that code is broken". I know about this thing, of course. Do you know any particular FreeBSD program which use this thing? -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:45:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA24618 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:45:00 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA24586 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:44:49 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA27208; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 17:01:03 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id RAA00285 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 17:08:41 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id QAA02863; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 16:34:51 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501161534.QAA02863@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes To: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (Wankle Rotary Engine) Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 16:34:51 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501160626.BAA03730@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> from "Wankle Rotary Engine" at Jan 16, 95 01:26:09 am X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 2072 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Wankle Rotary Engine wrote: | | - Merged biosboot and serialboot -- the keyboard i/o routines and the | serial port i/o routines are contained in the same boot block: putchar() | writes to both the serial port and the standard graphics display, and | getchar() can be told to read either from the serial port of the | PC's keyboard. Two problems i'm seeing here: i had already a hard job to even fit the serial boot stuff w/o VGA/kbd BIOS into the existing boot blocks. Having both there would bloat them again, and space is really a scarce resource. Second: assume sio0 is connected to a modem. Since the bootblocks would then echo all their neat garbage to the modem, too, the modem might get confused. Consider the case the user on the keyboard hits ``?'' to see the file list, and on of the files has the nifty name ``atd2345''... :-) The above aside: i like the idea. ... | What I need to know is this: | | - Is there a way to read the 'keyboard installed/not installed' flag | from the CMOS configuration, or is there some probe routine in the | BIOS that would allow you to reliably detect the presence or absence | of the keyboard? In general: no. But if you intend to have a keyboard connected only sometimes, simply tell your BIOS ``keyboard not installed'' (how do you do this? arrrg, you certainly need a keyboard for this:-). This flag simply means: ``Hey BIOS!, don't care if there's no keyboard at all!''. If you nevertheless happen to have a keyboard connected, it will be initialized as usual. I'm not sure if there's BIOS support to probe for the existance of a keyboard, at least, the keyboard controller can tell you if you ask it. Btw., most BIOSses will not allow you to run without a graphics board installed (AMI the only exception i know of), so you always have to waste a slot for this bugger. -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 18:59:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA25163 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:59:16 -0800 Received: from uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu (uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu [128.174.57.133]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA25157 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:59:15 -0800 Received: by uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu id AA27722 (5.67b/IDA-1.3.4 for terry); Mon, 16 Jan 1995 16:06:11 -0600 Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 16:06:11 -0600 From: Terry Lee Message-Id: <199501162206.AA27722@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Faster tape throughput Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've been experimenting with "buffer"; it is similar to "dd" but enables my wt tape drive to actually stream. There is also "ddd", though I haven't tested it on FreeBSD yet. I imagine either would be useful for st tape drives, too. It would be great if we could get either author's permission to put their program on the cpio.flp floppy. This would speed up tape installation of FreeBSD. Are others interested in this? Both program requires shared memory and semaphores. Would enabling them in the GENERIC kernel be a problem for 4MB configurations? The author of "buffer" is Lee McLoughlin (L.McLoughlin@doc.ic.ac.uk). The author of "ddd" (comp.sources.unix v15i084) is Tapani Lindgren (nispa@cs.hut.fi). Terry Lee terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:01:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA25295 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:01:52 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA25268 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:01:36 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA22404; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 13:59:39 +1100 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 13:59:39 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501170259.NAA22404@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com, rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Subject: Re: Soundcards and interruptless drivers and lost characters, oh my! Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Jordan said: >> > I'll bet you your parallel port card is still sharing IRQ 7 though. >> > I'm not surprised. Don't do this - it's evil! >Yep, it was still using IRQ7. >Rod says: >> If your card has a jumper on it to select IRQ5 or IRQ7, simple remove >> the jumper and this should eliminate the driving conflict. The IRQ shouldn't be connected unless the printer driver sets LPA_ENA. The printer driver doesn't set LPA_ENA unless it is interrupt-driven mode. >OK, I traced wires and removed this jumper, and even hacked the lpa driver >back in and I'm still losing characters with either lpa0 or lpt0/interruptless. This confirms that the problem has nothing to do with IRQs. >Is this really soggy and hard to light in 1.1.5.1, or do I need to get a new >serial/parallel card? The problem is unlikely to be in the parallel card. Your printer probably has unusual timing and the driver probably has timing bugs. The printer needs to remain ready or clear LPS_NBUSY or LPS_NACK within about 1 usec of the output strobe for the driver to work. Interrupt mode can work better because there will not be another interrupt until LPS_NACK is cleared (or later, if the interrupt is missed) and LPS_NBUSY is guaranteed to be valid when LPS_NACK is cleared. It's interesting that the driver (at least in 2.0) doesn't attempt to output multiple bytes per interrupt. If it did so, then it would have to worry about the same problem, and busy-waiting for too long. Now it should worry about the hardware design error that the IRQ is connected to NACK so it may occur before the printer is ready. >Tomorrow I'm going to start tracing wires and trying to figure out how to >disable COM2 (my Amiga) and put the sound card on IRQ3. I was hoping to get >this done before my wife got back from her convention. She doesn't like me >rebooting from underneath her.... For standard hardware, COM2 can be disabled by leaving out sio1 from the configuration. This depends on the same IRQ detaching feature as for lpt and on a kludge in sio (it detaches the IRQs for the standard COM1-4 whether or not the devices are configured, in case the previously running O/S attached them). Garrett's new config scheme with allow handling this better. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:10:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA25777 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:10:42 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA25764 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:10:24 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA22547; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:09:03 +1100 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:09:03 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501170309.OAA22547@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de Subject: Re: after snap kernel build blues Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Now I tried to build a new kernel (which was overdue for long but >always failed for obscure reasons: seg faults 10 and 11 and such during >gcc passes) and I get the following error: >Script started on Mon Jan 16 19:44:10 1995 >blues# make >cpp -DLOCORE -I. -I../.. -I../../sys -DJAZZ -DI486_CPU -DBOUNCE_BUFFERS -DNCONS= >8 -DSCSI_DELAY=15 -DFAT_CURSOR -DUCONSOLE -DCOMPAT_43 -DPROCFS -DCD9660 -DMSDOSF >S -DNFS -DFFS -DINET -DKERNEL -Di386 -DLOAD_ADDRESS=0xF0100000 ../../i386/i386/l >ocore.s | as -o locore.o >../../i386/i386/locore.s: Assembler messages: >../../i386/i386/locore.s:786: Error: Unimplemented segment type 6 in parse_operand >*** Error code 1 Your is out of date. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:15:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA25988 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:15:06 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA25968 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:14:58 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23812; Mon, 16 Jan 95 13:34:10 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501162034.AA23812@cs.weber.edu> Subject: DHCP and diskless support To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Mon, 16 Jan 95 13:34:09 MST X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm on the Samba mailing list, and I just saw this very interesting bootp patch: > To: samba@cscgpo.anu.edu.au > Subject: DHCP > Message-ID: <199501152331.KAA06622@arvidsjaur.anu.edu.au> > > DHCP (could it be Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol?) is a way for > large groups of WfWg and NT boxes to get their net setup from a > central location. > > Jeanette Pauline Middelink has > written a patch to bootp which allows a unix box to be a DHCP server. > > I haven't tried the patch, but I've put an e-mail from him containing > the patch on nimbus.anu.edu.au in pub/tridge/samba/contributed/DHCP.patch > > It contains some instructions. > > Andrew This is Microsoft Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol. Or for anyone who hacks this as a client in the diskless code after adding the bootp patch, it's a way to dynamically assign IP addresses for a lab full of *BSD boxes. Anyone up for committing the patch to bootp (minus the Makefile stuff)? Someone probably needs to contact the author to ensure copyright OK. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:15:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA25995 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:15:15 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA25973 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:15:01 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23787; Mon, 16 Jan 95 13:22:26 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501162022.AA23787@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: ache@astral.msk.su (Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage) Date: Mon, 16 Jan 95 13:22:25 MST Cc: dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, phk@ref.tfs.com, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr In-Reply-To: from "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" at Jan 16, 95 09:13:56 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >> 0xff is valid russian letter and I already do basic things > >> in source tree to handle it correctly. If you know any code > >> confused, please tell me. > > >Any code that uses a signed character as an lvalue for a getch/getc, and > >then checks for -1. > > >Presumably, the response will be "that code is broken". > > I know about this thing, of course. Do you know any particular > FreeBSD program which use this thing? No, or it would be fixed, I'd think -- or at least complained about. Maybe the question to be asked is "do I know of any code that is used on FreeBSD, but isn't maintained by FreeBSD, which uses this thing". The answer to that question is "Yes. Lots of code is available which is not yet internationalized, but which is 8-bit clean except for 0x00 and 0xff". Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:15:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA26012 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:15:48 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA25997 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:15:10 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23380; Mon, 16 Jan 95 10:40:44 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501161740.AA23380@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: ache@astral.msk.su (Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage) Date: Mon, 16 Jan 95 10:40:44 MST Cc: phk@ref.tfs.com, dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr In-Reply-To: from "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" at Jan 15, 95 11:48:50 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > 0xff is valid russian letter and I already do basic things > in source tree to handle it correctly. If you know any code > confused, please tell me. Any code that uses a signed character as an lvalue for a getch/getc, and then checks for -1. Presumably, the response will be "that code is broken". I make the same claim for any code using '\0' as a string terminator, since it assumes a particular encoding, and I make the same claim for any code written not using wchar_t instead of char for strings. I also make it for copyinstr/copyoutstr (which Linux doesn't have, BTW), since it assumes NULL termination by single character of a string. The problem is the distinction between process and storage encoding, and the use of storage encoding in crossing the user/kernel boundry and in internal processing. I have yet to see alternate message catalogs for, for instance, ash, csh, and bash... even though I think unshared catalogs are a mistake in any case, and thus the XPG3/XPG4 code is probably the wrong way to go in trying to do internationalization, unless you like per program catalog bloat. Most code is, by definition, poorly equipped for localization. It's a question of where you draw your line in the sand. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:24:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA26278 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:24:45 -0800 Received: from europa.com (root@thetics.europa.com [199.2.194.14]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA26270 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:24:37 -0800 Received: by europa.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.15) id ; Mon, 16 Jan 95 19:22 GMT Message-Id: Date: Mon, 16 Jan 95 19:24 GMT From: timb@europa.com (Tim Bach) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Can't remove some files. Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Some how i got some files with schg flag on it when i do a ls -lo. How do i get rid of it. I thought it only workd when kernel.seclevel was higher then -1. But my security level is -1. Trying to remove the files get's operation not permited. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:30:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA26407 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:30:35 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA26398 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:30:23 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA23004; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:29:37 +1100 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:29:37 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501170329.OAA23004@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, j@uriah.sax.de Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >| Next, make sure the device is configured into your kernel. By default >| it is disabled because it apparently causes problems with some peoples' >| systems. You will need to build a new kernel. Your config should have: >| >| disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 >| disk fd1 at fdc0 drive 1 >| tape ft0 at fdc0 drive 2 >| >| make sure this last line isn't commented out. >As far as i know, the fdc line in the config file does also need a >``flags 0x1'' clause (right after the `bio' keyword), otherwise the ft >probe will be skipped. History: ft0 was added to generic in case someone wants to install from ft0. This broke some systems without ft0. The correct way to fix this is to disable ft0 at (static) config time. However, there is no way to statically configure the device enable flag (it isn't in `flags' and config always sets it to 1). The 0x1 flag was hacked on instead. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:36:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA26638 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:36:34 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA26630 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:36:31 -0800 Received: by brasil.moneng.mei.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA05502; Mon, 16 Jan 95 14:59:38 CST From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <9501162059.AA05502@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: About readonly root partition To: root@rz-wb.fh-sw.de (Michael Reifenberger) Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 14:59:38 -0600 (CST) Cc: martin@innovus.com, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Michael Reifenberger" at Jan 15, 95 08:44:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4beta PL9] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1044 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Fri, 13 Jan 1995, Martin Renters wrote: > ... > > I do agree that it would be a good idea to do something to allow selective > > mounting at system startup time. Perhaps init could tell that it is running > > diskless and run some sort of shared '/etc/diskless.rc' script which could > > mount the correct /etc, /tmp and /var filesystems based on some system > > administrator defined scheme. > > Istn't amd supposed to do this sorts of things. > > Bye! > .... > Michael Reifenberger amd is sorta useless until a reasonable portion of the system has been brought up. In particular, one needs to arrange to get the maps and hostnames from somewhere... it would be just as easy to devise a cleaner solution. However, amd is a sysadmin's dream come true for day to day NFS mounts. :-) ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - The Data Capture Fellow (and UNIX/Network Hacker) 414/362-3617 Marquette Electronics, Inc. - Milwaukee, WI jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:49:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA26967 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:49:05 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA26959 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:49:01 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA23671; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:48:53 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:48:53 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501170348.AA23671@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: DHCP and diskless support In-Reply-To: <9501162034.AA23812@cs.weber.edu> References: <9501162034.AA23812@cs.weber.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < This is Microsoft Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol. Actually, it is the Internet Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol, a compatible extension of BootP. Search the RFC index for `DHC' and `BOOTP'. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:53:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA27181 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:53:10 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA27175 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:53:08 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA23687; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:53:01 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:53:01 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501170353.AA23687@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: CVS stuff In-Reply-To: <9501161740.AA23380@cs.weber.edu> References: <9501161740.AA23380@cs.weber.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < I have yet to see alternate message catalogs for, for instance, ash, csh, > and bash... Perhaps because no-one cares? Printing messages in a different language other than the standard one is generally counterproductive, unless you want to go the idiotic IBM way (or the bozotic DEC way) and cite each message by number in addition to name. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 19:56:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA27311 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:56:42 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA27305 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 19:56:40 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA23713; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:56:34 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:56:34 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501170356.AA23713@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: timb@europa.com (Tim Bach) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Can't remove some files. In-Reply-To: References: Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < Some how i got some files with schg flag on it when i do a ls -lo. > How do i get rid of it. > I thought it only workd when kernel.seclevel was higher then -1. > But my security level is -1. > Trying to remove the files get's operation not permited. # chflags noschg name-of-the-file /This/ is the operation that only works when kern.securelevel is 1 or greater. Please read init(8) for more details. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 20:12:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA27784 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:12:32 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA27771 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:12:27 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA23021 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Mon, 16 Jan 1995 21:57:44 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA08328; 16 Jan 95 21:43:42 CST (Mon) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id VAA08325; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 21:43:42 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199501170343.VAA08325@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: UUCP in 1.1.5.1 versus the G protocol. To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 21:43:42 -0600 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501162345.AA04617@blaise.ibp.fr> from "Ollivier ROBERT" at Jan 17, 95 00:45:48 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 173 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > system itesec > protocol g > call-login * > call-password * That works fine on dialout. It's on dialin that it sends Pge no matter what I set and what files I set it in. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 20:20:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA28099 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:20:43 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA28085 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:20:35 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA24143; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:18:58 +1100 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:18:58 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501170418.PAA24143@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, timb@europa.com Subject: Re: Can't remove some files. Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Some how i got some files with schg flag on it when i do a ls -lo. >How do i get rid of it. See `man chflags'. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 20:21:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA28127 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:21:10 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA28110 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:20:58 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA24105; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:17:13 +1100 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:17:13 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501170417.PAA24105@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de, wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> | - Merged biosboot and serialboot -- the keyboard i/o routines and the >> | serial port i/o routines are contained in the same boot block: putchar() >> | writes to both the serial port and the standard graphics display, and >> | getchar() can be told to read either from the serial port of the >> | PC's keyboard. My debugger uses this method (of broadcasting to all attached devices). It also merges reads from all attached devices. I think this would be good for both the bootstrap and for the console device. However, space is short in the boostrap, and there are complications in the console driver (it already messes up multiplexing between 3 devices: logical console, physical console and virtual (TIOCCONS) console) as well as the configuration of the physical console). >> Two problems i'm seeing here: i had already a hard job to even fit the >> serial boot stuff w/o VGA/kbd BIOS into the existing boot blocks. >> Having both there would bloat them again, and space is really a scarce >> resource. I rewrote the bootstrap serial console i/o routines in C. This takes only about 32 bytes more, but 32 is too many for Joerg :-). >Yes, I know. I had to cheat a bit to actually make all of my most recent >changes fit. First, I had to compile with -O2, and second I had to yank >out what appeared to me to be an archaic section of code from boot.c: >/* if(addr < ouraddr) You can have that :-). I've already made precisely these changes, plus replacing the twiddle() code with putchar('.'), in order to enable my debugging code (-DBDE_DEBUGGER) and the code to load the symbol table. >It seems to me that since the kernel is now always loaded into high >memory that the condition that this code tests for can never happen: >'addr' can never be less than 'ouraddr' unless things are compiled >differently, so what's the point. It would be nice if the old capabilities of the boot code weren't lost. The load address is defined in the Makefile (BOOTSEG). Nothing forces it to be low except the fact that the boot won't actually work if the kernel expects to be loaded low. I'd like the position- independentness of the boot code to be preserved and for boot.c to check that it doesn't overwrite itself, or write to nonexistent memory... >- If the keyboard is not present, we do the opposite: the banner message > goes to the serial port (along with an extra 'No keyboard found' message) > but we still probe for characters on both the serial port and the > keyboard (in case the user plugs the keyboard back in). Have you considered the case of keyboard without a screen? :-). This isn't completely unreasonable. Screens worth using are large and expensive compared with keyboards worth using, and after the system has booted, the screen might be in the wrong (X) mode. >- In either case, 'options COMCONSOLE' becomes a thing of the past and > booting from a serial port is now possible without any special > modifications, like God intended it to be. :) We also don't need a > seperate 'serialboot' boot block. The bootstrap should pass a list of console device names, not magic boot flags or device numbers. >The cost of this extra functionality: an added 224 bytes: And more unmaintaiable assembler code? >Again, this is with -O2. This is quite a bit bigger than before, but it >it's still within the limit (I think the upper limit is 7168). The limit is 15 sectors = 7680 bytes for the text+data of `boot'. There is room for one more sector below the filesystem, but start.S can only handle 15 sectors, at least on 15-sector disks. Expansion possibilities include - a multi-stage boot (no fancy stuff in the first stage). - honor d_bbsize in labels and make it larger. It is currently sometimes blown away by BBSIZE = 8192. Space for bootblocks is reserved on all file systems so making d_bbsize and/or BBSIZE much large would be wasteful. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 20:49:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA28926 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:49:01 -0800 Received: from netcom8.netcom.com (bakul@netcom8.netcom.com [192.100.81.117]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA28920 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:49:00 -0800 Received: from localhost by netcom8.netcom.com (8.6.9/Netcom) id UAA26775; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:48:06 -0800 Message-Id: <199501170448.UAA26775@netcom8.netcom.com> To: Terry Lee cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Faster tape throughput In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 16 Jan 95 16:06:11 CST." <199501162206.AA27722@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu> Date: Mon, 16 Jan 95 20:48:04 -0800 From: Bakul Shah Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I've been experimenting with "buffer"; it is similar to "dd" but > enables my wt tape drive to actually stream. There is also "ddd", though I > haven't tested it on FreeBSD yet. ... > Both program require > shared memory and semaphores. Then there is `team' by Piercarlo Grandi (see Vol 27, Issue 195, comp.source.unix), which relies Unix V7 features only (and hence runs on pretty much every Unix system). A `team' of prcesses share a common input file descriptor and and a common output file descriptor and take turns reading and writing (and synchronize by using a ring of pipes). For example: tar cf - . | team 64k > /dev/rst0 # blocksize 64k, write to tape team 64k < /dev/rst0 | tar tvf - # blocksize 64, read from tape tar cf - . | team -o 1200k 15k > /dev/rfd0a # volume size 1200k Definitely recommended (especially for streamer tapes). Bakul PS: ddd does not require shared mem or system provided semaphores. In fact, it uses the same mechanism as team's. I don't use ddd because a) it is not an exact superset of dd, and b) it only uses two processes, while team will use as many processes as you want (default 4) and it will also allow you specify the volume size. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 21:04:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA29005 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 21:04:03 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA28999 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 21:03:54 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA23785 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Mon, 16 Jan 1995 23:00:22 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA10315; 16 Jan 95 22:58:53 CST (Mon) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id WAA10312; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:58:52 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199501170458.WAA10312@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:58:52 -0600 (CST) Cc: ache@astral.msk.su, phk@ref.tfs.com, dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr In-Reply-To: <9501161740.AA23380@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Jan 16, 95 10:40:44 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 764 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Any code that uses a signed character as an lvalue for a getch/getc, and > then checks for -1. That code is broken whether or not you're considering localization, simply from portability reasons. There are compilers that accept most legal ANSI C code but do not support the "signed" keyword (or even silently ignore it!). (see, deansi.c) Yes, these compilers are broken... but they exist. Writing code that breaks as badly as this will (can you say infinite loop on EOF) when it's so easy to do it right and the correct type for getchar() has been so heavily advertised is just plain stupid. > Most code is, by definition, poorly equipped for localization. It's a > question of where you draw your line in the sand. I draw my line on the portability front. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 21:17:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA23573 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:34:30 -0800 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA23521 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:34:01 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA04678; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 17:17:10 -0700 Message-Id: <199501170017.RAA04678@rover.village.org> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: Porting cyclades driver; sigh Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert), hsu@cs.hut.fi, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-reply-to: Your message of Sun, 08 Jan 1995 16:21:10 PST Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 17:16:54 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk : Speaking of which, has anyone looked at BSDI's "mslip" stuff? : When you live in the same CO as your service provider, buying multiple : voice lines and 28.8K modems isn't a bad way of ramping all the way : up to 128k (assuming perfect scalability for 4 lines, which we all know : ain't the case). ISDN incurs per-minute costs which are untenable for : dedicated service. A local call into your CO costs nothing! :) Am I correct in assuming that your service provider would also have to grok the mslip stuff, or is it transparent somehow by doing multi-homing? Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 21:33:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA23637 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:34:53 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA23623 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 18:34:48 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA06736 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Tue, 17 Jan 1995 01:23:22 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Tue, 17 Jan 95 01:23:21 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id BAA00988; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 01:20:58 +0300 To: Terry Lambert Cc: dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, phk@ref.tfs.com, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr References: <9501162022.AA23787@cs.weber.edu> In-Reply-To: <9501162022.AA23787@cs.weber.edu>; from Terry Lambert at Mon, 16 Jan 95 13:22:25 MST Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 01:20:58 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: CVS stuff Lines: 31 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1470 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <9501162022.AA23787@cs.weber.edu> Terry Lambert writes: >> >> 0xff is valid russian letter and I already do basic things >> >> in source tree to handle it correctly. If you know any code >> >> confused, please tell me. >> >> >Any code that uses a signed character as an lvalue for a getch/getc, and >> >then checks for -1. >> >> >Presumably, the response will be "that code is broken". >> >> I know about this thing, of course. Do you know any particular >> FreeBSD program which use this thing? >No, or it would be fixed, I'd think -- or at least complained about. >Maybe the question to be asked is "do I know of any code that is used on >FreeBSD, but isn't maintained by FreeBSD, which uses this thing". The >answer to that question is "Yes. Lots of code is available which is not >yet internationalized, but which is 8-bit clean except for 0x00 and 0xff". Terry, please, can you answer more detail then simple "Lots of code"? Please send me program names list (used in FreeBSD, base & ports areas) and I'll try to fix them. Currently I don't bother about 0x00, because koi8-r and iso8859-* have ascii-compatible lower half, so I bother only about 0xff. -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 22:16:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id WAA29860 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:16:36 -0800 Received: from uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu (uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu [128.174.57.133]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA29854 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:16:35 -0800 Received: by uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu id AA01149 (5.67b/IDA-1.3.4 for hackers@freebsd.org); Tue, 17 Jan 1995 00:16:30 -0600 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 00:16:30 -0600 From: Terry Lee Message-Id: <199501170616.AA01149@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Faster tape throughput Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> I've been experimenting with "buffer"; it is similar to "dd" but >> enables my wt tape drive to actually stream. There is also "ddd", though I >> haven't tested it on FreeBSD yet. > ... >Then there is `team' by Piercarlo Grandi (see Vol 27, Issue >195, comp.source.unix), which relies Unix V7 features only >(and hence runs on pretty much every Unix system). A `team' ... >Bakul Thanks, Bakul! I just tried "team", and its works great! During my informal test on our SPARCstation 10/30, team kept the tape streaming better than both buffer and ddd. If we can get team on the cpio.flp floppy, that would be great! Boy could I have used this back when I was running Bell Tech. SVR3! :-) Terry Lee terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 22:50:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id WAA00232 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:50:03 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA00226 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:50:02 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA25689; Mon, 16 Jan 95 23:44:09 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501170644.AA25689@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: DHCP and diskless support To: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Date: Mon, 16 Jan 95 23:44:09 MST Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501170348.AA23671@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> from "Garrett Wollman" at Jan 16, 95 10:48:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > This is Microsoft Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol. > > Actually, it is the Internet Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol, a > compatible extension of BootP. Search the RFC index for `DHC' and > `BOOTP'. Is this a "yes, it will be integrated"? "compatible" seems to imply a yes answer. If that's the case, then now all we need is DHCP query code for the diskless clients -- any takers? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Jan 16 22:55:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id WAA00307 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:55:10 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA00301 for ; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 22:55:09 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA25712; Mon, 16 Jan 95 23:49:20 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501170649.AA25712@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Date: Mon, 16 Jan 95 23:49:20 MST Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <9501170353.AA23687@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> from "Garrett Wollman" at Jan 16, 95 10:53:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > < > > I have yet to see alternate message catalogs for, for instance, ash, csh, > > and bash... > > Perhaps because no-one cares? > > Printing messages in a different language other than the standard one > is generally counterproductive, unless you want to go the idiotic IBM > way (or the bozotic DEC way) and cite each message by number in > addition to name. What does siting message by number have to do with not citing message by English Message Text? !a => b? That's a logical fallacy. The idea is to *not* cite by English ("the standard language") and *not* cite by numeric message, but *instead* look up the message to present in a catalog and present the one for the current user selected locale. The problem peing pointed to is the lack of respect for the locale exhibited by, among other basic components, the shells. It makes no sense to be able to display Russian, for instance, if none of the data on the system is Russian text! The idea that "no one cares" (to do the work, yet) is probably a lot closer to the real mark, than is the paragraph following it. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 00:48:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA02939 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 00:48:14 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA02917; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 00:46:19 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id TAA30076; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:43:11 +1100 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:43:11 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501170843.TAA30076@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: adhir@bigdipper.umd.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org, questions@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: GUS question and LPT question Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Second question - I have found that with the following device in my kernel: >device lpt0 at isa? port "IO_LPT1" tty irq7 vector lptintr >I can only print in polled mode - if I switch to interrupt driven mode >(lptcontrol -i) the printer takes hours to print even one small line. >Polled mode, however seems to work OK. Then I noticed a conversation in >which someone stated that we sould not be using irqs for printing at >all. So what should I do - what is the "correct" way to set up my printer? IRQs should be used for printing iff they work. I would like to see the specs for printers that take hours to print a line or page. This is called by the printer acknowledging output more than a few microseconds or nanoseconds before it is ready. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 01:51:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id BAA03999 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 01:51:04 -0800 Received: from titan.np.ac.sg (lsys@titan.np.ac.sg [153.20.24.72]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA03993 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 01:50:58 -0800 Message-Id: <199501170950.BAA03993@freefall.cdrom.com> Subject: Re: Filesystem(?) preformance - 1.x and 2.0 To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:49:14 +0800 (SST) From: SysAdmin - Ng Pheng Siong Cc: lsys@np.ac.sg (SysAdmin) In-Reply-To: <199501111752.SAA01305@knobel.gun.de> from "Andreas Klemm" at Jan 11, 95 06:52:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 1698 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Andreas wrote: > My comment: "Check cables and connectors" ;-) Checked. Well, I've just discovered the '-l' option to 'time'. ;) Here are 2 consecutive runs of `time -l cat web2 > /dev/null' on the 1.x: /home/ngps/perf:$ time -l cat web2 >/dev/null 5.07 real 0.02 user 0.56 sys 160 maximum resident set size 34 average shared memory size 19 average unshared data size 128 average unshared stack size 204 page reclaims 0 page faults 0 swaps 306 block input operations 0 block output operations 0 messages sent 0 messages received 0 signals received 305 voluntary context switches 6 involuntary context switches /home/ngps/perf:$ time -l cat web2 >/dev/null 0.36 real 0.02 user 0.34 sys 152 maximum resident set size 34 average shared memory size 18 average unshared data size 128 average unshared stack size 48 page reclaims 0 page faults 0 swaps 0 block input operations 0 block output operations 0 messages sent 0 messages received 0 signals received 0 voluntary context switches 4 involuntary context switches The 2nd time around, no block input operation! On the 2.0 system, each of 2 consecutive runs causes block input ops. Can someone kindly provide a pointer as to what's happening, please? - PS -- Ng Pheng Siong * lsys@np.ac.sg * ngps@np.ac.sg Computer Centre, Ngee Ann Polytechnic, Singapore From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 03:30:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA05037 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 03:30:48 -0800 Received: from gatekeeper.us.oracle.com (gatekeeper.us.oracle.com [192.216.243.3]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA05031 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 03:30:47 -0800 Received: from iesun1.ie.oracle.com by gatekeeper.us.oracle.com with SMTP (8.6.7/37.7) id DAA28006; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 03:31:13 -0800 Received: by iesun1.ie.oracle.com (4.1/37.3.TJL.1.84) id AA11969; Tue, 17 Jan 95 11:30:59 GMT Message-Id: <9501171130.AA11969@iesun1.ie.oracle.com> Date: Tue, 17 Jan 95 11:30:59 GMT From: "Henry Chung " To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: IRQs List Original-To: IEUNIX:hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk After reading a few mails about the Interrupt conflict between printer and sound card etc.. I don't know is there a faq list that gives an official recommendation of which IRQ is used for which device? I think such list might ease the installation of new hardware devices. Regards, -- Henry Hyen-Vui Chung ================================================================================ ICL Product Line Developer Oracle Europe Manufacturing Ltd. e-mail: hchung@ie.oracle.com Maretimo Court, Temple Road Tel : 353 12834700 ext 220 Blackrock, Co. Dublin Fax : 353 12834732 Republic of Ireland. -----------------------------------oOo------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 04:52:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id EAA06913 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 04:52:29 -0800 Received: from wcarchive.cdrom.com (wcarchive.cdrom.com [192.216.191.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA06907 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 04:52:28 -0800 Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by wcarchive.cdrom.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA01503 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 04:52:21 -0800 Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R2.01/dg-rtp-v02) id AA27288; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:51:48 -0500 Received: (rivers@localhost) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.9/8.6.5) id UAA19381; Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:53:32 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Jan 1995 20:53:32 -0500 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199501170153.UAA19381@ponds.UUCP> To: freebsd-bugs@wcarchive.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@wcarchive.cdrom.com Subject: Probable bug in /bin/sh (backslash processing again.) Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I just tried to post from my FreeBSD 2.0R machine, using the inews shell script supplied with my ancient version of cnews. Apparently, the newer "sed" acts differently than the older one, which causes inews to not find any newsgroups from /usr/lib/news/active. The offending line in inews looks like: egreppat="^(` sed -e 's/[.+*()|[]/\\\\&/g' -e 's/,/|/g' <$nglist `) " If you set nglist to /tmp/t1, and have a single line in /tmp/t1 which looks like this (no leading space): rec.collecting And then execute the following: egreppat="^(` sed -e 's/[.+*()|[]/\\\\&/g' -e 's/,/|/g' ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 05:36:28 -0800 Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA08195; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 13:36:34 GMT Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 13:36:32 +0000 (GMT) From: Doug Rabson To: Terry Lambert cc: Garrett Wollman , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: DHCP and diskless support In-Reply-To: <9501170644.AA25689@cs.weber.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 16 Jan 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > This is Microsoft Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol. > > > > Actually, it is the Internet Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol, a > > compatible extension of BootP. Search the RFC index for `DHC' and > > `BOOTP'. > > Is this a "yes, it will be integrated"? > > "compatible" seems to imply a yes answer. > > If that's the case, then now all we need is DHCP query code for the > diskless clients -- any takers? > I just looked at the DHCP patch and it does not support dynamic address allocation. All it does is include DHCP options in the reply packets supporting the DHCP DISCOVER->OFFER->REQUEST->ACK process. The addresses come from /etc/bootptab as before. -- Doug Rabson, RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 71 251 4411 FAX: +44 71 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 06:11:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA08053 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 06:11:10 -0800 Received: from sedhps01.mdc.com (SEDHPC01.MDC.COM [130.38.110.6]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA08047 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 06:11:04 -0800 Message-Id: <199501171411.GAA08047@freefall.cdrom.com> Received: by sedhps01.mdc.com ($Revision: 1.37.109.9 $/16.2) id AA1270253146; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 08:09:31 -0600 From: Jim Babb Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 95 8:09:29 CST Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, j@uriah.sax.de In-Reply-To: <199501170329.OAA23004@godzilla.zeta.org.au>; from "Bruce Evans" at Jan 17, 95 2:29 pm Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >As far as i know, the fdc line in the config file does also need a > >``flags 0x1'' clause (right after the `bio' keyword), otherwise the ft > >probe will be skipped. > > History: ft0 was added to generic in case someone wants to install from > ft0. This broke some systems without ft0. The correct way to fix this > is to disable ft0 at (static) config time. However, there is no way to > statically configure the device enable flag (it isn't in `flags' and > config always sets it to 1). The 0x1 flag was hacked on instead. > I think some of the problems that were blamed on the ft driver were actually the spurious interrupts from certain controller chips (which has now been fixed). The only way for the ft probe to screw up a floppy drive (by stepping it too far) is for that drive to be broken and ignore the drive select signal. I would like to work with anyone that has a machine that the ft probe breaks to try and fix the driver (if possible). I think the number of people with working tape drives far outnumber the number of people with broken floppy drives, so the logic of the flag should be inverted, such that you set the flag to *disable* the probe. Jim From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 07:08:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA08638 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:08:36 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA08632 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:08:32 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id HAA22875; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:08:05 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Jim Babb cc: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, j@uriah.sax.de Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 17 Jan 95 08:09:29 CST." <199501171411.GAA08047@freefall.cdrom.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:08:03 -0800 Message-ID: <22874.790355283@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I suggested this just a couple of days ago and got no comments back.. Unless somebody pipes up soon, I will indeed do this for 2.1 Jordan > > >As far as i know, the fdc line in the config file does also need a > > >``flags 0x1'' clause (right after the `bio' keyword), otherwise the ft > > >probe will be skipped. > > > > History: ft0 was added to generic in case someone wants to install from > > ft0. This broke some systems without ft0. The correct way to fix this > > is to disable ft0 at (static) config time. However, there is no way to > > statically configure the device enable flag (it isn't in `flags' and > > config always sets it to 1). The 0x1 flag was hacked on instead. > > > I think some of the problems that were blamed on the ft driver were actually > the spurious interrupts from certain controller chips (which has now been > fixed). The only way for the ft probe to screw up a floppy drive > (by stepping it too far) is for that drive to be broken and ignore the > drive select signal. I would like to work with anyone that has a machine > that the ft probe breaks to try and fix the driver (if possible). > > I think the number of people with working tape drives far outnumber the > number of people with broken floppy drives, so the logic of the flag > should be inverted, such that you set the flag to *disable* the probe. > > Jim From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 07:11:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA08692 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:11:16 -0800 Received: from wcarchive.cdrom.com (wcarchive.cdrom.com [192.216.191.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA08686 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:11:12 -0800 Received: (from jkh@localhost) by wcarchive.cdrom.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id HAA19909 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:11:04 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:11:04 -0800 From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Message-Id: <199501171511.HAA19909@wcarchive.cdrom.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: wcarchive xfer logs - FYI. Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk jkh@wcarchive-> zcat xferlog.gz |awk -f report-FreeBSD.awk Day Category Total xfers Total Size --- -------- ----------- ---------- Jan 14 2.0R 3196 files 1228 MB Jan 15 2.0R 4072 files 1308 MB Jan 16 2.0R 4527 files 1618 MB Jan 17 2.0R 131 files 26 MB Jan 14 2.0C-ports 975 files 14 MB Jan 15 2.0C-ports 663 files 25 MB Jan 16 2.0C-ports 3049 files 344 MB Jan 17 2.0C-ports 9 files 2 MB Jan 14 2.0C-src 6604 files 76 MB Jan 15 2.0C-src 12423 files 106 MB Jan 16 2.0C-src 10881 files 93 MB Jan 17 2.0C-src 543 files 3 MB Jan 14 950112-SNAP 4229 files 1149 MB Jan 15 950112-SNAP 4324 files 1010 MB Jan 16 950112-SNAP 3377 files 929 MB Jan 17 950112-SNAP 172 files 58 MB The Jan 17th figures are bogus as the logs were rolled in the morning of the 17th. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 07:52:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA09372 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:52:45 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA09366 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 07:52:43 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA26396; Tue, 17 Jan 95 08:46:39 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501171546.AA26396@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: ache@astral.msk.su (Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 95 8:46:39 MST Cc: dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, phk@ref.tfs.com, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr In-Reply-To: from "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" at Jan 17, 95 01:20:58 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >Maybe the question to be asked is "do I know of any code that is used on > >FreeBSD, but isn't maintained by FreeBSD, which uses this thing". The > >answer to that question is "Yes. Lots of code is available which is not > >yet internationalized, but which is 8-bit clean except for 0x00 and 0xff". > > Terry, please, can you answer more detail then simple "Lots of code"? > Please send me program names list (used in FreeBSD, base & ports areas) > and I'll try to fix them. > Currently I don't bother about 0x00, because koi8-r and iso8859-* have > ascii-compatible lower half, so I bother only about 0xff. Well, "used on FreeBSD" doesn't necessarily imply "in ports". How about Samba? Xterm? Screen? (That last one's a trick -- it can either correctly emulate a VT100 *or* it can be internationalized, but not both, and FF is special to VT100's). The point is that as far as localization goes, our own house is far from in order, really. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 08:23:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA09699 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 08:23:38 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA09693 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 08:23:35 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA26668; Tue, 17 Jan 95 09:15:34 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501171615.AA26668@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: DHCP and diskless support To: dfr@render.com (Doug Rabson) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 95 9:15:33 MST Cc: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Doug Rabson" at Jan 17, 95 01:36:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > This is Microsoft Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol. > > > > > > Actually, it is the Internet Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol, a > > > compatible extension of BootP. Search the RFC index for `DHC' and > > > `BOOTP'. > > > > Is this a "yes, it will be integrated"? > > > > "compatible" seems to imply a yes answer. > > > > If that's the case, then now all we need is DHCP query code for the > > diskless clients -- any takers? > > > > I just looked at the DHCP patch and it does not support dynamic address > allocation. All it does is include DHCP options in the reply packets > supporting the DHCP DISCOVER->OFFER->REQUEST->ACK process. The addresses > come from /etc/bootptab as before. OK, so it's still suitable for WfWG 3.1, Windows 95, and NT clients, making it Microsoft Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol. And it's a step in the right direction for Internet Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol. Now that we've arrived at what it looks like... 8^)... Does it get committed? What does the author say about distributability? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 09:16:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA10511 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:16:28 -0800 Received: from snoopy.mv.com (snoopy.mv.com [199.125.64.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA10500 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:16:18 -0800 Received: (from pw@localhost) by snoopy.mv.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA07055; Sun, 15 Jan 1995 14:45:11 -0500 Date: Sun, 15 Jan 1995 14:45:11 -0500 From: "Paul F. Werkowski" Message-Id: <199501151945.OAA07055@snoopy.mv.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: old vfprintf bug back again in 2.x Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk A bug that was lurking in lib/libc/stdio/vfprintf.c prior to FreeBSD 1.1 is now again hiding in the 2.0 and -current source. The bug is demonstrated by this code: int main() { int FPRC = 16; double d = 0; printf( "%*.*e\n",FPRC+7,FPRC,d); } which results in 0e+00 instead of the correct 0.0000000000000000e+00 This breaks the AKCL (now GCL) compile/load feature. I looked at the considerable differences between the 1.1 and 2.0 versions of vfprintf and think I have reproduced the previous fixes. At least the modified version passes the GCL test. Perhaps some official bug fixer can look at this and commit to current /usr/src/lib/libc/stdio/? Paul *** vfprintf.c.dist Fri May 27 00:57:31 1994 --- vfprintf.c Sun Jan 15 14:38:03 1995 *************** *** 502,521 **** base = 10; goto number; #ifdef FLOATING_POINT ! case 'e': /* anomalous precision */ case 'E': ! prec = (prec == -1) ? ! DEFPREC + 1 : prec + 1; ! /* FALLTHROUGH */ ! goto fp_begin; ! case 'f': /* always print trailing zeroes */ ! if (prec != 0) ! flags |= ALT; case 'g': case 'G': ! if (prec == -1) prec = DEFPREC; ! fp_begin: _double = va_arg(ap, double); /* do this before tricky precision changes */ if (isinf(_double)) { if (_double < 0) --- 502,524 ---- base = 10; goto number; #ifdef FLOATING_POINT ! case 'e': case 'E': ! case 'f': case 'g': case 'G': ! if (prec == -1) { prec = DEFPREC; ! } else if ((ch == 'g' || ch == 'G') && prec == 0) { ! prec = 1; ! } ! ! if (flags & LONGDBL) { ! _double = (double) va_arg(ap, long double); ! } else { ! _double = va_arg(ap, double); ! } ! /* do this before tricky precision changes */ if (isinf(_double)) { if (_double < 0) *************** *** 802,808 **** if (ch == 'f') mode = 3; else { ! mode = 2; } if (value < 0) { value = -value; --- 805,818 ---- if (ch == 'f') mode = 3; else { ! /* To obtain ndigits after the decimal point for the 'e' ! * and 'E' formats, round to ndigits + 1 significant ! * figures. ! */ ! if (ch == 'e' || ch == 'E') { ! ndigits++; ! } ! mode = 2; /* ndigits significant digits */ } if (value < 0) { value = -value; *************** *** 810,816 **** } else *sign = '\000'; digits = __dtoa(value, mode, ndigits, decpt, &dsgn, &rve); ! if (flags & ALT) { /* Print trailing zeros */ bp = digits + ndigits; if (ch == 'f') { if (*digits == '0' && value) --- 820,826 ---- } else *sign = '\000'; digits = __dtoa(value, mode, ndigits, decpt, &dsgn, &rve); ! if ((ch != 'g' && ch != 'G') || flags & ALT) { /* Print trailing zeros */ bp = digits + ndigits; if (ch == 'f') { if (*digits == '0' && value) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 09:18:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA10533 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:18:11 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA10527 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:18:10 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA26694; Tue, 17 Jan 95 09:19:43 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501171619.AA26694@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 95 9:19:42 MST Cc: babb@sedhps01.mdc.com, bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, j@uriah.sax.de In-Reply-To: <22874.790355283@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jan 17, 95 07:08:03 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I think the number of people with working tape drives far outnumber the > > number of people with broken floppy drives, so the logic of the flag > > should be inverted, such that you set the flag to *disable* the probe. [ ... ] > I suggested this just a couple of days ago and got no comments back.. > Unless somebody pipes up soon, I will indeed do this for 2.1 I haven't heard the results since the floppy tape was moved to ft2; do people still get hangs? Which is more important for install, a guaranteed working floppy, or a conveniently already working floppy tape? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 09:18:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA10543 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:18:51 -0800 Received: from sedhps01.mdc.com (SEDHPC01.MDC.COM [130.38.110.6]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA10537 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:18:46 -0800 Message-Id: <199501171718.JAA10537@freefall.cdrom.com> Received: by sedhps01.mdc.com ($Revision: 1.37.109.9 $/16.2) id AA1300864292; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 11:15:16 -0600 From: Jim Babb Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) (Terry Lambert) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 95 11:15:15 CST Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, babb@sedhps01.mdc.com, bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, j@uriah.sax.de In-Reply-To: <9501171619.AA26694@cs.weber.edu>; from "Terry Lambert" at Jan 17, 95 9:19 am Mailer: Elm [revision: 70.85] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > I think the number of people with working tape drives far outnumber the > > > number of people with broken floppy drives, so the logic of the flag > > > should be inverted, such that you set the flag to *disable* the probe. > > [ ... ] > > > I suggested this just a couple of days ago and got no comments back.. > > Unless somebody pipes up soon, I will indeed do this for 2.1 > > I haven't heard the results since the floppy tape was moved to ft2; do > people still get hangs? The floppy tape has always been on drive 2 (even though it is device ft0) (I should know - I put it there). The hangs were most likely caused by the extra interrupt generated by some controller chips during the write protect check (which is now fixed). > > Which is more important for install, a guaranteed working floppy, or a > conveniently already working floppy tape? You can have both (and we do) - it's just a matter of which one to make the default. In the case of a broken drive that gets upset by the tape probe, boot with -c and set the fdc flag so the tape probe gets skipped. The benefit - no more questions: "Why doesn't my tape work any more?". Jim From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 09:27:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA10626 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:27:17 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA10620 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:27:15 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA26952; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:24:21 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: babb@sedhps01.mdc.com, bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, j@uriah.sax.de Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 17 Jan 95 09:19:42 MST." <9501171619.AA26694@cs.weber.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:24:20 -0800 Message-ID: <26951.790363460@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I haven't heard the results since the floppy tape was moved to ft2; do > people still get hangs? I haven't heard of any. > Which is more important for install, a guaranteed working floppy, or a > conveniently already working floppy tape? I don't think I even need to answer this question.. :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 09:52:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA11110 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:52:45 -0800 Received: from vortex.sdf.luth.se (vortex.sdf.luth.se [130.239.144.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA11103 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 09:52:39 -0800 Received: from alkinoos.sdf.luth.se by vortex.sdf.luth.se (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA03444 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:43:29 +0100 Received: by alkinoos.sdf.luth.se (8.6.9/8.6.9) id SAA29815 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:51:46 +0100 From: Mattias Karlsson Message-Id: <199501171751.SAA29815@alkinoos.sdf.luth.se> Subject: Bug!? To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:51:45 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 448 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello! I have earlier mailed and asked why ranlib failed when making the current-version of FreeBSD. I found out today that the problem was that I had nfs mounted the source tree of an NFS server and root was mapped as nobody.. then when I runned make world and came to ranlib the first library and then it failed with: ranlib: libdialog.a: Inappropriate file type or format What have gone wrong ???? /Mattias Karlsson (matte@sdf.luth.se) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 10:15:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA11513 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 10:15:15 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA11507 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 10:15:07 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA25839; Tue, 17 Jan 95 19:14:57 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (UAA11167); Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:20:36 +0100 Message-Id: <199501171920.UAA11167@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: sup sites To: jhs@regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:20:35 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com (user alias) In-Reply-To: <199501170127.CAA02417@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> from "Julian Howard Stacey" at Jan 17, 95 02:27:11 am From: Christoph Kukulies Reply-To: Christoph Kukulies X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1243 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I'm rather envious of NetBSD, > they have a sup site nearby to me at wipux2.wifo.uni-mannheim.de, > very nice when sunlamp is overloaded :-) I'm carrying netbsd-current as well on gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de > > perhaps now my internet access is miles better (thanks to an initial > firm shove from jkh :-) > perhaps I should recontact kuku @ aachen , so we could slave his spare box > of freefall, as a standby/fallback/summat-or-other ? what say kuku ? I wouldn't mind. Could you be more specific what you are thinking about? I don't have gigs of scsi drives like wcarchive has, though. > > --- > PS anyone who feels i've ignored some list mail ... > I read none since before xmas, while I was config'ing sendmail > then experimenting with slip, & sup, > so I've now got a backlog to read: du -s -k shows: > 1920 freebsd-current > 3143 freebsd-hackers > you folk are prolific ! > > --- > Julian Stacey , > ( is an intermittent phone link ) > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD 2.0.1-Development #0: Wed Nov 2 23:00:17 1994 root@mvx1b1:/usr/src/sys/compile/JAZZ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 10:43:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA14426 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 10:43:42 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA14309 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 10:43:18 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA27659; Tue, 17 Jan 95 19:43:14 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (UAA11280); Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:48:53 +0100 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:48:53 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199501171948.UAA11280@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: white board software, audio, video Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I remember running wb (white board) some time ago - a binary that was compiled for BSDI running also under FreeBSD (1.1.5 at that time). Are there packages available for FreeBSD-current allowing for multi media applications like the above? It would be sufficient to have white paper and audio for the first. --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD 2.0.1-Development #0: Wed Nov 2 23:00:17 1994 root@mvx1b1:/usr/src/sys/compile/JAZZ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 11:10:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA15766 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 11:10:52 -0800 Received: from wcarchive.cdrom.com (wcarchive.cdrom.com [192.216.191.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA15669; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 11:09:20 -0800 Received: from isl.cf.ac.uk (isl-gate.elsy.cf.ac.uk [131.251.22.1]) by wcarchive.cdrom.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA08258; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 11:09:08 -0800 Received: (from paul@localhost) by isl.cf.ac.uk (8.6.9/8.6.9) id TAA03340; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:09:19 GMT From: Paul Richards Message-Id: <199501171909.TAA03340@isl.cf.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Probable bug in /bin/sh (backslash processing again.) To: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:09:19 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-bugs@wcarchive.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@wcarchive.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501170153.UAA19381@ponds.UUCP> from "Thomas David Rivers" at Jan 16, 95 08:53:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 540 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Thomas David Rivers who said > This is most likely a bug in /bin/sh backslash processing within quotes. > I've fixed this in current. With the current sh, isl:~% sh $ egreppat="^(` sed -e 's/[.+*()|[]/\\\\&/g' -e 's/,/|/g' ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 13:06:49 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA24916; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:06:39 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:06:39 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501172106.AA24916@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: DHCP and diskless support In-Reply-To: <9501170644.AA25689@cs.weber.edu> References: <9501170348.AA23671@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> <9501170644.AA25689@cs.weber.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < Is this a "yes, it will be integrated"? No, this is a ``no, it is not a Microsoft invention.'' -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 13:09:21 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id NAA24800 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 13:09:21 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA24792 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 13:09:18 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA24927; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:09:09 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:09:09 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501172109.AA24927@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Cc: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman), freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: CVS stuff In-Reply-To: <9501170649.AA25712@cs.weber.edu> References: <9501170353.AA23687@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> <9501170649.AA25712@cs.weber.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < What does siting message by number have to do with not citing message > by English Message Text? !a => b? That's a logical fallacy. Because if you're trying to figure out what the !@#$%^ is wrong when somebody complains, you need to know what the REAL message is. You can either put the messages in English, so that everybody understands, or you can stick on message numbers. > It makes no sense to be able to display Russian, for instance, if none > of the data on the system is Russian text! If you want some Russian text, you go into your editor and generate it. I'm certain that Andrew has lots of Russian text. This does not mean that it is a good idea to have system programs printing out messages in languages which are not understood by the program maintainers. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 13:50:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id NAA26027 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 13:50:52 -0800 Received: from csugrad.cs.vt.edu (jaitken@csugrad.cs.vt.edu [128.173.41.74]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA26021 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 13:50:50 -0800 Received: (jaitken@localhost) by csugrad.cs.vt.edu (8.6.9/8.6.4) id QAA02372 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:50:40 -0500 From: Jeff Aitken Message-Id: <199501172150.QAA02372@csugrad.cs.vt.edu> Subject: adaptec 294x question To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:50:40 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1848 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm trying to install 2.0-950112-SNAP on an IBM PC with an Adaptec 2940 PCI card. I grabbed the boot floppy images from 2.0-950112-SNAP/newer, but I need to rebuild the kernel. Unfortunately, after doing a 'config MACHINE', make depend reports something like: don't know how to make aic7xxx_seq.h This error isn't fatal to make depend, but it is fatal to make. I looked at /sys/gnu/misc/aic7xxx/aic7xxx.seq, but that wasn't it (I don't think). Anyway, someone obviously got this to compile to make the boot floppy image; is it just thatall the source files (namely aic7xxx_seq.h) haven't been committed yet? If so, could someone (Mr Gibbs, perhaps, if you've got the time) mail me the file and where exactly it's supposed to go? So far as I can tell, it is being included by /sys/i386/scsi/aic7xxx.c. Thanks! P.S. This is as good a place as any to ask: I work for the CS department here at Virginia Tech and it's been decided that the department will require incoming students to purchase PC's (running some flavor of UNIX) instead of workstations. I've been actively promoting FreeBSD, which is why I'm trying to install it on this IBM machine (which is a loaner/demo model to see if it would work). We expect to get another PC from DEC, and perhaps other vendors. If I can demonstrate that it (a) works well, and (b) is installed easily, I may be able to convince my boss to recommend FreeBSD over, say, Linux, Solaris x86, NextStep, etc... What are some recommended configurations that are "name" brands? The reason I say that is that the department *must* have some sort of service contract that they can count on. In the past, ponly people like IBM, DEC, and so on have been able to provide that kind of support. Thanks for the help; I'll post a summary if I get many informational replies. -- Jeff Aitken jaitken@vt.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 14:14:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA26658 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:14:13 -0800 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA26649 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:14:10 -0800 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA14462 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 01:08:28 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Wed, 18 Jan 95 01:08:27 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id WAA01149; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 22:24:52 +0300 To: Terry Lambert Cc: dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, phk@ref.tfs.com, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr References: <9501171546.AA26396@cs.weber.edu> In-Reply-To: <9501171546.AA26396@cs.weber.edu>; from Terry Lambert at Tue, 17 Jan 95 8:46:39 MST Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 22:24:51 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: CVS stuff Lines: 30 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1450 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <9501171546.AA26396@cs.weber.edu> Terry Lambert writes: >> >Maybe the question to be asked is "do I know of any code that is used on >> >FreeBSD, but isn't maintained by FreeBSD, which uses this thing". The >> >answer to that question is "Yes. Lots of code is available which is not >> >yet internationalized, but which is 8-bit clean except for 0x00 and 0xff". >> >> Terry, please, can you answer more detail then simple "Lots of code"? >> Please send me program names list (used in FreeBSD, base & ports areas) >> and I'll try to fix them. >> Currently I don't bother about 0x00, because koi8-r and iso8859-* have >> ascii-compatible lower half, so I bother only about 0xff. >Well, "used on FreeBSD" doesn't necessarily imply "in ports". >How about Samba? Xterm? Screen? (That last one's a trick -- it can >either correctly emulate a VT100 *or* it can be internationalized, but >not both, and FF is special to VT100's). Screen is 8-bit clean (by my contacts with author). I have VT320 at work, and it process FF correctly (as visible letter from font). Can't say anything about X-stuff, but I see Xterm working in russian at my work. -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 14:32:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA26867 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:32:42 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA26859; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:32:29 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id XAA05502 ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 23:33:21 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA09887; Tue, 17 Jan 95 23:33:23 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501172233.AA09887@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: I'm afraid we broke something in emacs... To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 23:33:22 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501170123.MAA20083@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Jan 17, 95 12:23:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 305 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I hope I fixed this a few minutes ago. Try again with a > sys/i386/i386/machdep.c dated later than > `Tue Jan 17 01:21:47 GMT 1995'. It is indeed. Thanks. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #0: Thu Jan 12 00:41:32 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 14:36:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA26917 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:36:25 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA26910 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:36:21 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA28575; Tue, 17 Jan 95 15:30:29 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501172230.AA28575@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 95 15:30:28 MST Cc: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <9501172109.AA24927@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> from "Garrett Wollman" at Jan 17, 95 04:09:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > What does siting message by number have to do with not citing message > > by English Message Text? !a => b? That's a logical fallacy. > > Because if you're trying to figure out what the !@#$%^ is wrong when > somebody complains, you need to know what the REAL message is. You > can either put the messages in English, so that everybody understands, > or you can stick on message numbers. Maybe I can put it in all caps, with spaces between the letters, because E V E R Y O N E U N D E R S T A N D S E N G L I S H I F I T I S S P O K E N L O U D L Y A N D S L O W L Y E N O U G H. Personally, I don't have any intrinsic objection to message numbers, if they are accompanied by text, if the intent is to index a catalog for a program maintainer. I'm probably in a minority here, even though this is exactly what exit codes are. > > It makes no sense to be able to display Russian, for instance, if none > > of the data on the system is Russian text! > > If you want some Russian text, you go into your editor and generate > it. I'm certain that Andrew has lots of Russian text. This does not > mean that it is a good idea to have system programs printing out > messages in languages which are not understood by the program > maintainers. It's no skin off my nose, but, I just want to be perfectly clear on what's being said here, so that I don't misunderstand. There are several implied assumptions in your statements: 1) The people having the problems will not be able to diagnose the problem from the error messages, even if they are in the user's native language (pretty shitty error messages, if you ask me). 2) The people having the problems have some way of contacting and communicating with the authors about the problems they are having (Stahlman's "everyone will be on the net", a demonstration of the failure of modern academia to live in the real world, where software is distributed on CDROM to people who don't even own modems). Now, these have several correlaries: 1) If Pierro, for instance, takes over maintenance of csh, then it is acceptable for an English spekear to type the command moose at a prompt, and instead of getting back the message moose: Command not found. he or she should get back the Italian equivalent, since it is more important that Pierro be able to resolve the problem for the person instead of the person being able to resolve the problem themselves. Same thing for: moose: bus error, core dumped. 2) If Andrew or some other Russian language speaker takes over maintenance of getty, then it's OK to see a KOI-8 version of: Login incorrect When most users are probably running ISO8859-1 fonts anyway, since as the maintainer he should be able to understand when a user is providing an invalid login/password so he can tell them, and KOI-8 encoded Russian "login failure" messages in their system log files. It seems to me that this embedding of translation facilities in the program maintainers is wrong. If the maintainer can't understand the error, then the maintainer should ask the person reporting the error to use a particular locale and cause the error to occur again. Or even better, put "Notice! use the C locale to generate error messages" in the same place you put the maintainer's email address. The whole point of an error message is to provide sufficient information to the user that they don't *have* to contact the maintainer, IMO. An error message is a mechanism for reporting a condition over which the user has control but the program does not. An error like: Error: PI is 3.1415926 Is useless, since what the hell is the user supposed to be able to do about that? If the "Lingua Franca" of BSD is to be English, fine, but don't cloud the air with BS and hand-waving instead of just stating the decision, and if that *is* the decision, be prepared to back it. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 14:51:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA27076 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:51:33 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA27070 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 14:51:32 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA25223; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:51:22 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:51:22 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501172251.AA25223@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Cc: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman), freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: CVS stuff In-Reply-To: <9501172230.AA28575@cs.weber.edu> References: <9501172109.AA24927@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> <9501172230.AA28575@cs.weber.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < 1) If Pierro, for instance, takes over maintenance of csh, BZZZZT! Individuals don't maintain programs, the FreeBSD community at large does. > It seems to me that this embedding of translation facilities in the > program maintainers is wrong. If the maintainer can't understand the > error, then the maintainer should ask the person reporting the error > to use a particular locale and cause the error to occur again. Or > even better, put "Notice! use the C locale to generate error messages" > in the same place you put the maintainer's email address. That doesn't work. It's hard enough to diagnose hard-to-reproduce problems now, I don't want to make it any harder than it already is. > The whole point of an error message is to provide sufficient information > to the user that they don't *have* to contact the maintainer, IMO. I don't seem to be getting through to you, Terry, and I can't seem to understand what is so difficult about the idea that, in a distributed community of users dispersed throughout the world, it is more important to be able to communicate with other people about your problems than to have those problems reported in fifteen different languages. While we're at it: this is a volunteer effort. Who is going to sit down and perform the tedious (and, I believe, counterproductive) task of translating five gazillion error messages, in both user and kernel code, into some language or other, and then constantly watching for program changes to keep them up-to-date? I think the answer is `nobody'. There are /far/ more important things to do (like improving the existing documentation and fixing bugs), and---most significantly---there are /far/ more interesting things to do. > An > error message is a mechanism for reporting a condition over which the > user has control but the program does not. An error like: > Error: PI is 3.1415926 > Is useless, since what the hell is the user supposed to be able to do > about that? This is a phony straw-man. Try again, with a real example from a current program. > If the "Lingua Franca" of BSD is to be English, fine, but don't cloud > the air with BS and hand-waving instead of just stating the decision, > and if that *is* the decision, be prepared to back it. There isn't any ``decision'' to be made; that is the situation now, and any change would be counterproductive and unlikely in the extreme. You should be the one to talk about BS and hand-waving, Terry. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 15:40:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA28860 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:40:13 -0800 Received: from estienne.cs.berkeley.edu (estienne.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.42.147]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA28854 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:40:10 -0800 Received: (from gibbs@localhost) by estienne.cs.berkeley.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA03975; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:39:58 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Message-Id: <199501172339.PAA03975@estienne.cs.berkeley.edu> Subject: Re: adaptec 294x question To: jaitken@csugrad.cs.vt.edu (Jeff Aitken) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:39:58 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501172150.QAA02372@csugrad.cs.vt.edu> from "Jeff Aitken" at Jan 17, 95 04:50:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2912 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I'm trying to install 2.0-950112-SNAP on an IBM PC with an Adaptec 2940 > PCI card. I grabbed the boot floppy images from 2.0-950112-SNAP/newer, > but I need to rebuild the kernel. Unfortunately, after doing a 'config > MACHINE', make depend reports something like: > > don't know how to make aic7xxx_seq.h Did you replace the dependancies in i386/conf/files.i386? The section should look like this: aic7xxx optional ahc device-driver \ dependancy "$S/gnu/misc/aic7xxx/aic7xxx.c" \ compile-with "${CC} -o $@ $>" \ no-obj no-implicit-rule aic7xxx_seq.h optional ahc device-driver \ dependancy "$S/gnu/misc/aic7xxx/aic7xxx.seq aic7xxx" \ compile-with "./aic7xxx -o $@ $S/gnu/misc/aic7xxx/aic7xxx.seq" \ no-obj no-implicit-rule before-depend i386/scsi/aic7xxx.c optional ahc device-driver \ dependancy "aic7xxx_seq.h" When you use config with these entries, the Makefile will do the right thing to create the header file for you. > > This error isn't fatal to make depend, but it is fatal to make. I > looked at /sys/gnu/misc/aic7xxx/aic7xxx.seq, but that wasn't it (I don't > think). Anyway, someone obviously got this to compile to make the boot > floppy image; is it just thatall the source files (namely aic7xxx_seq.h) > haven't been committed yet? If so, could someone (Mr Gibbs, perhaps, if > you've got the time) mail me the file and where exactly it's supposed to > go? So far as I can tell, it is being included by > /sys/i386/scsi/aic7xxx.c. > > Thanks! > > > P.S. This is as good a place as any to ask: I work for the CS > department here at Virginia Tech and it's been decided that the > department will require incoming students to purchase PC's (running some > flavor of UNIX) instead of workstations. I've been actively promoting > FreeBSD, which is why I'm trying to install it on this IBM machine > (which is a loaner/demo model to see if it would work). We expect to > get another PC from DEC, and perhaps other vendors. If I can > demonstrate that it (a) works well, and (b) is installed easily, I may > be able to convince my boss to recommend FreeBSD over, say, Linux, > Solaris x86, NextStep, etc... What are some recommended configurations > that are "name" brands? The reason I say that is that the department > *must* have some sort of service contract that they can count on. In > the past, ponly people like IBM, DEC, and so on have been able to > provide that kind of support. > > Thanks for the help; I'll post a summary if I get many informational > replies. > -- > Jeff Aitken > jaitken@vt.edu > > -- Justin T. Gibbs ============================================== TCS Instructional Group - Programmer/Analyst 1 Cory | Po | Danube | Volga | Parker | Torus ============================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 15:57:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA29339 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:57:12 -0800 Received: from snoopy.mv.com (snoopy.mv.com [199.125.64.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA29327 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 15:57:08 -0800 Received: (from pw@localhost) by snoopy.mv.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA00485; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:56:45 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:56:45 -0500 From: "Paul F. Werkowski" Message-Id: <199501172356.SAA00485@snoopy.mv.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Greetings, I have now a NEC 4Xi CDROM drive plugged into my FreeBSD 2.0 / Adapetec 1740A system. The problem is that the drive does not show up in the boot probe although everything else on the bus does as usual. I now have SCSI_DELAY=30 in config with no good results. Funny thing is that even the DOS SCSI driver doesn't report this thing - even though it also sees the other SCSI things. Even funnier is that a Corel package scanscsi.exe DOES see the stupid thing at the correct SCSI ID. The cute little diagnostic screen built into the drive things everything is in order. I am certain as can be that termination is correct etc. Does anyone out there have any experience with this NEC drive? Are they inventing yet a new sub/super-set of "standard" SCSI? What happened to the 'scsi' program on 1.1.5.1 that at least attempted to dicker with the devices a bit? Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 16:18:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id QAA00386 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:18:06 -0800 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA00376 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:18:03 -0800 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA19309 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 01:15:57 +0200 Received: by iafnl.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA22887 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:12:44 +0100 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.8/8.6.6) id TAA00467 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:33:27 +0100 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199501171833.TAA00467@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Exabyte on FreeBSD? To: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:33:26 +1596657 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 471 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi there, There is a chance that I might pick up an Exabyte drive for a reasonable price. What I'm wondering is whether it 'll work with FreeBSD? Any happy users out there? _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 16:54:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id QAA01596 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:54:49 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA01590 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:54:48 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA00244; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:54:18 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Wilko Bulte cc: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Subject: Re: Exabyte on FreeBSD? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 17 Jan 95 19:33:26 +1636." <199501171833.TAA00467@yedi.iaf.nl> Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 16:54:17 -0800 Message-ID: <243.790390457@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I use them all the time.. Jordan > Hi there, > > There is a chance that I might pick up an Exabyte drive for a reasonable > price. What I'm wondering is whether it 'll work with FreeBSD? > > Any happy users out there? > _ _______________________________________________________________________ ___ > | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl > |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 17:32:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA02559 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:32:17 -0800 Received: from tfs.com (mailhub.tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA02553 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:32:15 -0800 Received: by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) Message-Id: From: julian@tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? To: pw@snoopy.MV.COM (Paul F. Werkowski) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:31:33 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501172356.SAA00485@snoopy.mv.com> from "Paul F. Werkowski" at Jan 17, 95 06:56:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1500 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Greetings, I have now a NEC 4Xi CDROM drive plugged into my > FreeBSD 2.0 / Adapetec 1740A system. The problem is that the drive > does not show up in the boot probe although everything else on the > bus does as usual. I now have SCSI_DELAY=30 in config with no good > results. Funny thing is that even the DOS SCSI driver doesn't report > this thing - even though it also sees the other SCSI things. Even > funnier is that a Corel package scanscsi.exe DOES see the stupid thing > at the correct SCSI ID. The cute little diagnostic screen built into > the drive things everything is in order. possibly it's not at LUN 0? maybe you need to probe some other LUN.. WHERE does the corel stuff find it? > > I am certain as can be that termination is correct etc. Does anyone > out there have any experience with this NEC drive? Are they inventing > yet a new sub/super-set of "standard" SCSI? they did for their other drives.. why stop now? :) > What happened to the 'scsi' program on 1.1.5.1 that at least attempted > to dicker with the devices a bit? It got left out by mistake.. (as did st(1)) it still compiles if you can get the sources.. I just added it to my source tree (makefile and all) and it works fine. if you can find the ID and LUN of the device, you may be able to use the scsi(1) program to specifically probe it into existence.. The code in the kernel will only probe LUN 0 unless something exists on 0 and indicates there may be other LUNs as well. > > Paul > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 17:32:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA02575 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:32:58 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA02568 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:32:54 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA05795 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:02:36 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA03130; 17 Jan 95 18:52:08 CST (Tue) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA03127; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:52:07 -0600 Message-Id: <199501180052.SAA03127@bonkers.taronga.com> X-Authentication-Warning: bonkers.taronga.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" Cc: Terry Lambert , freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: CVS stuff In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 17 Jan 95 22:24:51 +0300." X-Mailer: exmh version 1.4.1 7/21/94 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:52:05 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Can't say anything about X-stuff, but I see Xterm working in russian > at my work. I just popped up xterm, hit and got . Tk doesn't handle it though. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 17:35:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA02619 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:35:25 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA02607 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:35:10 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.8/8.6.6) id UAA01724; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:29:16 -0500 From: Wankle Rotary Engine Message-Id: <199501180129.UAA01724@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:29:13 -0500 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501170417.PAA24105@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Jan 17, 95 03:17:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 20076 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk They say this Bruce Evans person was kidding when he wrote: > > >> | - Merged biosboot and serialboot -- the keyboard i/o routines and the > >> | serial port i/o routines are contained in the same boot block: putchar() > >> | writes to both the serial port and the standard graphics display, and > >> | getchar() can be told to read either from the serial port of the > >> | PC's keyboard. > > My debugger uses this method (of broadcasting to all attached devices). > It also merges reads from all attached devices. I think this would be > good for both the bootstrap and for the console device. However, space > is short in the boostrap, and there are complications in the console > driver (it already messes up multiplexing between 3 devices: logical > console, physical console and virtual (TIOCCONS) console) as well as > the configuration of the physical console). Actually, I ran into a few problems with the 'poll all devices' method, the least of which being a small objection from Rod Grimes. :) At the moment, I've changed things such that the mode switch (from VGA/keyboard to serial) can't be reversed by pressing a key on the console. (Of course, the switch is triggered by unplugging the keyboard, so there shouldn't be anything wrong with this) I discovered that in the case where the system autoboots from the serial port, some of the messages would be echoed to the VGA display. This was a side effect of how I merged the two sets of i/o routines together. I could have worked around it by recoding gets() and getchar() a little, but I didn't think I'd be able to do that without bloating things more, so I chickened out and took away the 'probe both i/o channels' code instead. > >> Two problems i'm seeing here: i had already a hard job to even fit the > >> serial boot stuff w/o VGA/kbd BIOS into the existing boot blocks. > >> Having both there would bloat them again, and space is really a scarce > >> resource. > > I rewrote the bootstrap serial console i/o routines in C. This takes > only about 32 bytes more, but 32 is too many for Joerg :-). If I could reduce the keyboard probe code to just 32 bytes, I'd be tickled pink. Right now, probe_keyboard() is also written in C, but if anything deserved to be coded in assembly, this is it. Unfortunately, I'm not proficient enough in 386 protected mode assembly language to do it. > >Yes, I know. I had to cheat a bit to actually make all of my most recent > >changes fit. First, I had to compile with -O2, and second I had to yank > >out what appeared to me to be an archaic section of code from boot.c: > > >/* if(addr < ouraddr) > > You can have that :-). I've already made precisely these changes, plus > replacing the twiddle() code with putchar('.'), in order to enable my > debugging code (-DBDE_DEBUGGER) and the code to load the symbol table. I rather like twiddle(), but I replaced the one currently in the boot block with a much simpler and more compact version: static unsigned long tw_chars = 0x5C2D2F7C; /* "\-/|" */ twiddle() { putchar((char)tw_chars); tw_chars = (tw_chars >> 8) | ((tw_chars & 0xFF) << 24); putchar('\b'); } This is ridiculously obfuscated, but it works, and believe it or not, it shaves 144 bytes off the size of the second stage loader. :) If there was such a thing as a 'logical rotate right' operator in C, it might even be smaller. (Oddly enough, when I tried inserting an asm directive to use an 'rolr' instruction, the code got bigger.) Note that I also got rid of reset_twiddle(). Another way I found to save space: rather than calling printf() 4 times to print out what's essentially 4 consecutive lines of banner text, I just call it once and have it print all 4 lines in one shot. This saves another 48 bytes. :) > > >It seems to me that since the kernel is now always loaded into high > >memory that the condition that this code tests for can never happen: > >'addr' can never be less than 'ouraddr' unless things are compiled > >differently, so what's the point. > > It would be nice if the old capabilities of the boot code weren't > lost. The load address is defined in the Makefile (BOOTSEG). Nothing > forces it to be low except the fact that the boot won't actually work > if the kernel expects to be loaded low. I'd like the position- > independentness of the boot code to be preserved and for boot.c to > check that it doesn't overwrite itself, or write to nonexistent > memory... Well, now that I smushed twiddle() down a bit and merged a bunch of printf()s, I can put the other code back. Essentially, I managed to incorporate both the serial console code and the keyboard probe while keeping the second stage boot loader under 7168 bytes. What I did for now was to #ifdef out the '(addr < ouraddr)' stuff, and here's what I get: -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Jan 17 18:48 boot1 -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 6896 Jan 17 18:48 boot2 Without the #ifdefs, I gain another 180 bytes or so: -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 512 Jan 17 18:55 boot1 -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 7072 Jan 17 18:55 boot2 But I'm still under the limit. > >- If the keyboard is not present, we do the opposite: the banner message > > goes to the serial port (along with an extra 'No keyboard found' message) > > but we still probe for characters on both the serial port and the > > keyboard (in case the user plugs the keyboard back in). > > Have you considered the case of keyboard without a screen? :-). This > isn't completely unreasonable. Screens worth using are large and > expensive compared with keyboards worth using, and after the system > has booted, the screen might be in the wrong (X) mode. Well, look: if you have the keyboard plugged in but you don't have a monitor plugged in, there's no way I can tell not to output to the video display (unless you don't have a display adapter plugged in either). I could try probing for a video adapter, but that would take more ugly code. Trying to probe for the lack of a monitor could easily drive me insane. The one thing I'm worried about now is that there might be some mutant machines out there (with well-known brand names on them) that won't let you boot without a keyboard at all. All my machines have AMI BIOSes in them, and they all let me boot with the keyboard unplugged (if I ask them nicely), but I have no clue what something like an IBM PS/whatever might do in the same situation. > >- In either case, 'options COMCONSOLE' becomes a thing of the past and > > booting from a serial port is now possible without any special > > modifications, like God intended it to be. :) We also don't need a > > seperate 'serialboot' boot block. > > The bootstrap should pass a list of console device names, not magic > boot flags or device numbers. Why a list? The kernel is only going to use one physical console device, and the bootblock has to tell it what that device is. We don' need no steenkeen leest. It's not like we're going to switch in mid-stream. Or are we. > >The cost of this extra functionality: an added 224 bytes: > > And more unmaintaiable assembler code? Nope. All my additions and changes are in C (except for the serial port code, which was already provided in assembly). > Expansion possibilities include > > - a multi-stage boot (no fancy stuff in the first stage). This would help in the 'special debugger' case; the debugging stuff could be moved into the 3rd stage boot loader (a /boot program, perhaps), but there's a lot of ugliness in the 2nd stage boot loader than really can't go anywhere else. > Bruce Well, anyway, here's what I have now: - The bootblock probes for the keyboard. If you don't have it plugged in, it defaults over to the serial port. If you _do_ have it plugged in, things proceed from the VGA display and keyboard just as always. - There's a new boot switch (-h) and flag (RB_SERIAL). If the RB_SERIAL bit in the boothowto word is set, the kernel uses COM1 as a console. Otherwise, it uses the VGA display and keyboard as usual. RB_SERIAL will be set by default if no keyboard is detected. - The -h switch toggles the RB_SERIAL flag; if you're on the VGA console and you want to force the kernel to boot with the serial port as a console, specify the -h switch. Likewise, if you're on the serial port and you want to force the kernel to boot with the VGA display as the console, use -h. End result (again :): The bootblock simulates the behavior of the Sun boot PROM, in that you can boot with a serial port as the console just by attaching a terminal to COM1 and unplugging the keyboard. (And you can install the system this way too. :) The only bad part is that there's no way to specify a different serial port on the fly; both the bootblock and the kernel need to be recompiled. I'm thinking about finding a way around this, but for the moment that's just a pipe dream. I'm plenty happy with what I have now. Since this is about as good as I'm likely to get it (unless I come up with a more compact keyboard probe), I may as well give y'all a peek at the diffs. Note that needs to be patched first, then both the kernel and the boot block need to be recompiled. -Bill -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~T~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Møøse Illuminati: ignore it and be confused, or join it and be confusing! ~~~~~~~~ FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #0: Fri Jan 13 22:04:07 EST 1995 ~~~~~~~~~ begin 644 serialboot.tar.gz M'XL(".YC'"\``W-E]K&LN]7^E=,W"8&(T#BQ2\X3HM! MMFDQ^"*HFR?)]1%H,3H6$E<2=FB2__M\/#.[JQ&);6FU.SMO M^]N961&[LK];&GE>6!K97L`OSLT;-K$=5K3LR>2[+_#15'6W6H7O@#[JVE\` M;7=7`ZCMJ7OJKJ;MU;"EIFFU[T#]$I,_]ED$H>D#?.>CZ!_K=S=ES/D:#'W= MS\[.#L0&]WS[.F,L7/C%=-$(4*[4:UJ]5@7MX*#V?:%0B+MF!@LF>NV!ME^O M[=:U?=%K9_5#]U!1M`KP.P#\=]'OG1YER-?PY@?H^1;SP0[@EOE+L&=SSP]- M-P3/A7#*P.@W#7!LE\'$\[$%.\Y][_K[)_S)48;L%Q8-",T1BC`&HEO&>_J+ MMV8PHQMT;OQC>]ABV<$-_@F607$L&#IN=UOM_E$F4UH$?FEFL;%H/.^U]*-, MM5K%R9HGG<8I3I4''"\&Y(\R MHH>AG\H.>/5!#C,&C>:O43-=KPYL__BNV!SVD3<C$.@;UE8Y@RTSI,VHB^[4Z\J^3R$)?R>(H6VG'-&5N]"UZ] M@2-XAVV9K=(-\UWF;.'-!^KU@X7[%.)4=WC>;9SK1B8;V'\P;Y+E`W,E>2>( MY7+$6@%^L",OV;>C(7XQ)MP MV`U@IR0DRR#@9Y$?8NR0&(/GT+TZ;O>,JU.]=RZ:\GD2,I.)C%O<1X5,LENOW1@O?M"Q?H78R;U;-)==:#N=(33`,&$RMK*:8 M.>DZ$'K<6A!8*N!J=^$.+W"',YW`0\LA3C@.LXHXWSHI\YK5X=6K5T^#K(H$ MWSP-WKPJT(^//R;^C/''PI\1_MR^>1.SG+'8;?!*^`<\$ZJ`GQ`;ZU!^HX!P MX/_L0X&[M+'$/94$`?18NT!&I$[J+N7#"0/"-YKDV M0]8HJUE^1[['=^VZ\)+/^[PF(CO00*5%\^(^'X(=DG;)TR:VC^S.<4([M-'C MT(QQD2TB4^0.,[2`3+CV/$N*,$*QD!3:1:Y78:QH`>?S;R*?CI>WF`A;[`ED MDY5^%(-4CCM%&@-6#'^,WEF'R(HL)&]%!\H^BV<0C\0R]>;,]2UA93XC-3]! MFCE$'D)S0F8U'0M^#C(3$$.,PH3!:4!\&#U3B+D:_25=5B`R,M8G@^VC"+L1 M4+D"GZQQF,L)LBD+OS^"_O&5H??;C0X?)XT'!&E=#Z*QN#(7;H0EV.V#1-G_ M"S"]"B%Y6$41O,]S.0:4'>`_UPS"I0*C18BHNH0%HE<5I$OG`H&T&MS9C@.6 M5R1)!(E/V@H^!]97`_%5A2F#^R8`L%[0"CVQ="GQTGR!M9262I?KL M37(YL8=$9OK_A^^?#NS2T3\+9=<8HWO,;?84K586`3'!L%;5>(/$8=2"`MOF M=IXDB.[)B-$U.0HW:&D'?\$.7-KAE"N9H(TAQ`7C*4.`XZJW70HK:0R,,61W M&2;V*"(XY)3A%)LBWQ/$`D^D]2ZB*V;J(5$9>Q:C%>.8_C5#C[9Q&H?=FFY8 MA(&)('%-#N#A`@_,6X;]O#`0U'!P,#?'K,AO:67+^+6OMX;=5J,[$'`[R7(. MGT?,<'QZQR7&9^)AGN])1?,J)-;B.\L,S1R\2$9N5/JNJFB[M932><-N2ND^ M7Z#_88;C#V6$N(ZE]-K>11D9!L*X0 M;!*0DS@IWPTLCP7N-N[*'FX#8+I+L>[P`M&;`4-'9O[#OB)=!=:=!9X]@W4G M(1927I%RJ/GH#^9[O+LB'T,!LBA,3BZMC8H^J"IE-GANH(G!Q?UJR$!6("X@T=.?Y-\P22Y$6UC(")8XQG/0+A'A- MI8\4CLR/+"*;^XE??R*;/S`G8!Q''QJ?2C+_*H$VV:&,_ET^T!*'+Z-A*JJ6 M6LGDWU/O#C>QO>O^X9^CI MX?G[PZ?;]:@Y&O[?Z4#P_N0?Q`5I&=[)1AF5SD/_\$M7^1[^;*C_4='U"U;_ M'CW_J6GEU/E/I4SUO[)6_5;_^QH?6E/LT&\- MFB;&\M#[8[ M=A88YSR?(7NVRTKC^6*R<,?%Z0N^%46/@V50\AFOA.(3,5;6&G^]ZK[*@\LXW2/HA0,RLYYB,@B8#?+D9HK6D]F85.\F=O MA6EI>&=;EL-DQ'TWI8PK.\9A.SC]S`RCY);76"@2WWZZ+5HR\T5(%-&U#KF6 M]FH*I@(/^HVF'2A:>2]5NDX(Q!4%/LL1SO+:Q6EXPH^=LMNO_6V1V?/;,>=6 M)OF84W`JMGLU6DQRPH'+&(]6M%0QYK&Y9.F!&I/RP[-DT\G)`[:K-7[DIK/6 M^B&:X$_0&DM""9V/BK=1M142=W?%`\:RN.!XWKP>L9,='Q$]*K5PP7UI2S(X MJ2%.NZ1B1EPQD?T%"RM%+ZU25;2J&J^-C\Q,*>-#^O@IT@CG#K&J#O+JBW"Z M46>X:+1DU6#0!='II2S\(!F<+&H\!/N%>HAINF,NM5F0S2EVH4`\R;@M\AX[ MX.;*R47"Z1P>RKM,<&>C.;,[8FE&MJ6[`I!Y>:5A,LG%44PZ+D*QZT+K>YCT M[EOEG.CS7@VEHI6,5=;2<]B0K*:$H>A.',^'X6+'V3Y M1N2HHJC!5]O&[4[=5\H5+-;B6J)$3A3Q*-,IB8NA;C,76,Q1#3Y?-O$4<\+#'R$351_J)%,#,=IPAU'@\\29EFX0;VM8N) M$P8]U['J23=O:\URJWRRUSPDZENO"Z7W6W$TNJ?R-0/5;_O=5/K1CW#,XSP7//9D+8@JX6U#\-+!`M,/[E,Q>,\71F6^$#755$6@9] M=LW<,(B.'Y)TD5J:IF/C]N_:IJ@U0L-Q@!,)^!;FWS)+/$G5+J,BN,7H%,$2 MAW*!-PGO3)_Q`H]O(YY3CBOMY!* MF7FX9.VQ2504(/XPVY[9(7&'EKNU+5Z*,T-Q-N-A2GU'J3A*8?%C&UF^IY$S MQ@_U\$XKKC'(U2LYX^J9X6*B$T;3%J\+FB/OEAY)$PDR^'$]W-N8(JJ!XKAL MDIJGAH!S1M0H&FP*[4.&$F1H\L(&\AKQ+'0T'LPS%K7",XT1R#[S5YS/&-Z]TY MS+IF1%DX1F8@WP.UZ$T!62A)Z-+9)7.\.8HQ6MY?C8)$LB259/&0/NTP2!:7 MYP=2Z&H1NN*X@%/DI=/[:]WUDL?<6=>I)3*CJ"-&>N'K%[,,?,I(52C7S`M9 M)-\:`&S6H%R,$,S9F!8B'7?3&O5I";IB,09!;$*),F=M`XS>"29`?1WP^J+? M^ZW=TEMP_)(?"?7U4[T[,*#1;4&SUQWTV\?#0:]OP#_^T3!PP/8V/9*(UGT) M^N\7?=TPH->']OE%IXV4D'2_T1VT=4.!=K?9&;;:W5/4^'``W=X`.NWS]@"[ M#7H*S2A(W1\+O1,XU_O-,[QM'+<[[<%+SM1)>]"E"4]PQ@9<-/J#=G/8:?3A M8MB_Z!F2'DG7:AO-3J-]KK>*@(S@Y*#_AL*!<=;H=%:D15HKPA[KR&;CN".I M\;E0V%:[KS<')%5RU43M(8<=!8P+O=FF"_UW'<5I]%\JDK"A_]<0.^%#0:_5 M.&^AXHM MB:]HVD"7`2[\"#[:&P=,3-NA+15W@"!`=$ZVR+CCU`P0)Y@KR"S1SZQ;'G+&8C#&*8MJXEBWF M7:]E;RQU)P>O<8EFI0P<%V7D"UIY>5B87WU*'+TCKN2''E*)9U]5#U/-LH!; M*-CP@HI?J4?11TQDNZ.L^G:_RF=,G/6=`Z3%YCZW"E2IO59TFP4,B)>3*(^Z/LK\=78H7C M!6*P/LB)93:.)PVXKZC[RF7DC9B$U\U]B-#_D MY"_"2:G%$%F5RJJ"-WFFR0>A-XN3T77!I/:R4C(Z]J`2&UX>#T^N3H:=#B^C MJCE8'[E^_Y"&[BE(RA=I`UE;[?@DUL7@JM7KZK+_FG1<)5&;)IWQ[T[B/N.S M(?^/OICSE;[_IU7*N^4D_R]7Z?M_ZMZW[W]\E0^EX['!-W__3TN=`4==[W]/ MI/*1<^"5?%\[V$\2?K$!;CX1?J`4\/B)<)S3]T5.WU_)Z4'\OHB#<-IG<>-6 M>,:GB.A")!]QML56`_TH,Q&45E,Y*O$RG^&F?>V;+F;3&$7II.F!$/5KIZD_3\WS+=DW,4X',%W;HNSXVV2@7%*K^`_W$8TJD>5=`']NB6$_MJVZ_`:J M<@M:D=LR_!OWM''Y,!]8"KU*8A%BV3WBT?\!1 M2178Q'^7082R"`1MA`$'1_FX6&1-SD!=F-!T3-]4UNJ1&R+@#5@F.CX"8LJC M*$:Q,]4T5B",HE2."@OD.!#6BTH:$\82B*,@;S/(;2BCK:)8(&$,24@@6P6; M%8!\'!N1S..PE`*T=-&(FP<)T#N+HR1C3!?4J`ZT&#GVF*I*.#E5.*D=E9ZN MR"$1F8K&.EXO!2E)%8C7A%9K0?B/QOW'I1N%DU@OQPB6XL)+7'.)JRI)T87#[$I9)4;;J%#S&/@B@7NEDE2E M9*6VT6C2GD!=XRH'#D^J%TIJ\`]+ANHZW M`N1`[Z/HYPU>%MFP,ZS"Q`X8H@Y`0?6(OUF%22CS)R9Z,F;XZ)\L>"#(J2KP MRY:'$'2)">IXFJJ"?`M;_NJP):K&ZM`8#L[(:S\W8$G1^NJQ2@ED0:/(_]N. M+1G`!UMKI:(M^K\9IEN\)WV?X?NUM_?92E7KOB-3,.#P4(`*8/P&N](WJ\`N MR7`G&86N:](K#J[%7VU,**.V6@L6?9F(?W>$BG/HSN.4I2>RKL^_U\67%CJ% MZP%]SRVR+GDTA_(L(CA2X<\H1+/]:-FQMW.*5VYI"M.A<^^0C>F,;$:50_%& M$`O^W=X5[K2-!.'?[E-8/9#@&H+M-"$!M:="H$6EX93F)*K3*7(2!]PZMA4[ M)%3W\#??[-I>)P[07H'>R2NU`GL\WIW97<_,SC=L5Y)PG;!39B.79\Q4FDO+ M+QW-0@]G;\0'$S(?PJ0^(V,(^>X`X"0#(1'IR?.A'479\8*3EERA7F364H;_ M!KZ,>DXS/,)BL8?3`#:R##2&9&!,G!CV*!]3"H20)[N.D-8.PJ1\Z-%J&(9^ M2`N_">`/YBV?>Y*3-T@LL%'N&"N'DM010B;BE%CD^ M0G#HA3(9,LE);O1%Z7[:4MAPC":<15?:IC,(\Z'703Q::+^(U%>9:3MU+HGY% M,*6NV&!$_Q?HH9NJ4NI!?3/='R-'4-]BT.!V)C7)?C@)T:F]$\&?Z-D1:A^? M5:M5[J/O:-8XE0+UOYF2>D&`-&RB/\1)DK7_O2J6.8^9DI-@_%A\+<5Y2J;Q M$#%U9*8ECNITYAR(8^FY&SG)92.=";EI(-[V/1.!E.$M:>/;YL;*M*!/BSHK M-*'0_$SX[5L73S&,7=QCS#A=<[^*)`*Y;I(3'][=ES;9<+@D1X7UCUE.M;S( M^.@[\!*9\9:T`3QL*K;EO48"`]IG;P[5W2KC.W+)]:8/CV?'\,2]8$X>;^RD MW3$M\%8IR<-.I+#R1J')(0]*6^7.X`*%/1Z\*NZ[["U]:+4-ZUY2,&MKI<`? M1+8PZ'OJ`LUN`IH?XK)\D=IKF`^3@M<(N=TNZ%YWM]O[^"P]A/))H&/7)\N9 MWCKV2./"8/#Q@9#[DSB04GOP+S=/:RPW3X9EIMM#)%_(T8?E[7*ZN'V[C*^F M-!1[;M^D>I$/\TMINS0']]KKGCIB_O]J?/[C1O9N],-A?VF["_]7MT3^9Z.V M5S=,Q.VLET:C//]YC,;G/\4`P.:^8>Q;+>7PAQ&`>1*+2&KK3WX*<&E&'GN7 M1]:QOR*`=?D;]"^>W(7%R]]Q@V'LR1L"8*?U>I_:QR='[]YT/S*Z[N+B0N^] MMZI&45_B^`9/%V(L6GN5FI%"PS22#"B2*9!ZKW0AA?['WX^/ MVP<9_:PO&?>=:X3T#R`A\:$1`(`7^MQ!X(?<0.FA$#$Y^B+[D268[^'$_AQ, M#R1,NTD22W&7]Y/8>NET_NB<]@Y^PK$6S9:&T:HTS'HZ6XAZYS59>JY?'?8# MP)?22B6Y6T-Y2XZ!:TJN4GD9`PF+$:5@7NF9S!+84NY!-\_^-&5?W$%)=KZ& MK*BS^M_ZT=GY$4HA80XTC`;)(:MT\OARX$H1V"\$2%_%C#V]B`JG3LNJ-%I- M!8,J=Y'W;]N'":+PR^5HT!\YUQ@KO$Q4JTEF9(5+G&VK<-&"Z2%P9AD?["A8 M$4.;RW4X@]FE'J!R3,Z=$?4;-;'>.HU(\ M._3E+%ZS3K(:H5K.T$@> M#J=(PCSJ]+O''\Y[QZ+^U4G`X))SS*6#\["SG/4A`9L(C&_=1&_3G+8"HU6,2%5N8)(D6A<]IYNY\9\I%,QN(KG0(!7R)"HRI]3,YG]X7KU7G3;G<5AU!>T;:,16W<1-!532M7G@/K_'.X M0L\ISSRU+K^GJ2[TPT1_[E[_>U:V_AMFC>,_M3+^\R@-RS/5_TK^K[5OTL_(XOJPNI-NB%+$>NQ,G7T:)6-'Z/#E]2XQ>"D:N?QU\X=PNMO/' M[N5,I.+)!(;+%0ZR\AN.;`4+KG?(*2QA$`-6B9@\.(YGGHY"N7*OR<8C+!!- M5+4#"WZ]:FC8D6IKZ&I5)9S@XT]OB"0!HN)L-.HH!KT3Q3<>(RN18.//)@.8 KQ($>WX1.Y3^Y#Y6M;&4K6]G*5K:RE:UL92M;V; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:46:04 -0800 Received: by is1.hk.super.net id AA17513 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:45:43 +0800 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:45:43 +0800 (HKT) From: John Beukema To: Terry Lambert Cc: Garrett Wollman , freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: CVS stuff In-Reply-To: <9501172230.AA28575@cs.weber.edu> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 17 Jan 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > What does siting message by number have to do with not citing message > > > by English Message Text? !a => b? That's a logical fallacy. > > > > Because if you're trying to figure out what the !@#$%^ is wrong when > > somebody complains, you need to know what the REAL message is. You > > can either put the messages in English, so that everybody understands, > > or you can stick on message numbers. > > Maybe I can put it in all caps, with spaces between the letters, because > E V E R Y O N E U N D E R S T A N D S E N G L I S H I F I T > I S S P O K E N L O U D L Y A N D S L O W L Y E N O U G H. > > Personally, I don't have any intrinsic objection to message numbers, if > they are accompanied by text, if the intent is to index a catalog for > a program maintainer. I'm probably in a minority here, even though this > is exactly what exit codes are. > > > > > It makes no sense to be able to display Russian, for instance, if none > > > of the data on the system is Russian text! > > > > If you want some Russian text, you go into your editor and generate > > it. I'm certain that Andrew has lots of Russian text. This does not > > mean that it is a good idea to have system programs printing out > > messages in languages which are not understood by the program > > maintainers. > > It's no skin off my nose, but, I just want to be perfectly clear on what's > being said here, so that I don't misunderstand. > > > There are several implied assumptions in your statements: > > 1) The people having the problems will not be able to diagnose > the problem from the error messages, even if they are in the > user's native language (pretty shitty error messages, if you > ask me). > > 2) The people having the problems have some way of contacting > and communicating with the authors about the problems they > are having (Stahlman's "everyone will be on the net", a > demonstration of the failure of modern academia to live in > the real world, where software is distributed on CDROM to > people who don't even own modems). > > > Now, these have several correlaries: > > 1) If Pierro, for instance, takes over maintenance of csh, > then it is acceptable for an English spekear to type the > command > > moose > > at a prompt, and instead of getting back the message > > moose: Command not found. > > he or she should get back the Italian equivalent, since it > is more important that Pierro be able to resolve the problem > for the person instead of the person being able to resolve > the problem themselves. Same thing for: > > moose: bus error, core dumped. > > > 2) If Andrew or some other Russian language speaker takes over > maintenance of getty, then it's OK to see a KOI-8 version of: > > Login incorrect > > When most users are probably running ISO8859-1 fonts anyway, > since as the maintainer he should be able to understand when a > user is providing an invalid login/password so he can tell them, > and KOI-8 encoded Russian "login failure" messages in their > system log files. > > > It seems to me that this embedding of translation facilities in the > program maintainers is wrong. If the maintainer can't understand the > error, then the maintainer should ask the person reporting the error > to use a particular locale and cause the error to occur again. Or > even better, put "Notice! use the C locale to generate error messages" > in the same place you put the maintainer's email address. > > > The whole point of an error message is to provide sufficient information > to the user that they don't *have* to contact the maintainer, IMO. An > error message is a mechanism for reporting a condition over which the > user has control but the program does not. An error like: > > Error: PI is 3.1415926 > > Is useless, since what the hell is the user supposed to be able to do > about that? > > > > If the "Lingua Franca" of BSD is to be English, fine, but don't cloud > the air with BS and hand-waving instead of just stating the decision, > and if that *is* the decision, be prepared to back it. > > > Terry Lambert > terry@cs.weber.edu > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > It would make life a great deal easier for those of us overseas if the English string messages could be isolated in a string table. Source code could be commented and/or meaningful int #defines provided for debugging (#define 11 BUSERR_COREDMP. err_msg[11] = "Bus err core dumped") The set of English strings could be translated by anyone wishinbg to internationalize a version just by setting an alternate string table. Messages could be improved (in any language) by updating the string table. jbeukema From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 17:59:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA03757 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:59:23 -0800 Received: from relay1.UU.NET (relay1.UU.NET [192.48.96.5]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA03746 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:59:21 -0800 Received: from news.cs.utexas.edu by relay1.UU.NET with SMTP id QQxzdn15141; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:59:00 -0500 Received: from mail.cs.utexas.edu (root@mail.cs.utexas.edu [128.83.139.10]) by news.cs.utexas.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA00123 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:58:27 -0600 Received: from uudell.us.dell.com (uudell.us.dell.com [143.166.224.6]) by mail.cs.utexas.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA01254; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:58:32 -0600 Received: from obiwan by uudell.us.dell.com (5.67/dns1.3) with UUCP id AA20072; Wed, 18 Jan 95 01:56:10 GMT Received: by obiwan.uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0rUPQp-00030UC; Tue, 17 Jan 95 19:43 CST Message-Id: From: obiwan!bob@uudell.us.dell.com (Bob Willcox) Subject: Re: Exabyte on FreeBSD? To: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl (Wilko Bulte) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 19:43:31 -0600 (CST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501171833.TAA00467@yedi.iaf.nl> from "Wilko Bulte" at Jan 17, 95 07:33:26 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 785 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Wilko Bulte wrote: > > Hi there, > > There is a chance that I might pick up an Exabyte drive for a reasonable > price. What I'm wondering is whether it 'll work with FreeBSD? I have a couple of systems running 1.1.5.1 with Exabyte 8200 (2.3gb) drives on them. They ``mostly'' work :-) They do seem to be rather tempermental. > Any happy users out there? I guess I'm fairly happy. Multi-file restores have been my biggest challenge. The interactive mode of restore with the s (skip) option drives me crazy. I suspect there's something about using it that I just don't get. -- Bob Willcox ...!{rutgers|ames}!cs.utexas.edu!uudell!obiwan!bob Austin, TX or try: @uudell.us.dell.com:obiwan!bob 512-258-4224 (home), 512-838-3914 (work) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 18:04:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA04238 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:04:56 -0800 Received: from is1.hk.super.net (jbeukema@is1.hk.super.net [202.14.67.232]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA04226 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:04:54 -0800 Received: by is1.hk.super.net id AA18894 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers ); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:04:39 +0800 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:04:37 +0800 (HKT) From: John Beukema To: FreeBSD-hackers Subject: String tables Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I meant #define BUS_ERR_COREDMP 11 err_mess(BUS_ERR_COREDMP); In errmsg_eng.h syst_err_msg[BUS_ERR_COREDMP] = "Bus error Core dumped"; This is good coding practice and not much more work than scattering messages throughout the code. It could be adapted to use Unicode or other languages with relatively effort. The master version would of course be in English, the lingua franca. jbeukema From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 18:30:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA05921 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:30:02 -0800 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.atinc.com [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA05907 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:29:52 -0800 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id VAA26256; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:23:29 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:23:27 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: Exabyte on FreeBSD? To: Bob Willcox cc: Wilko Bulte , FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 17 Jan 1995, Bob Willcox wrote: > > I guess I'm fairly happy. Multi-file restores have been my biggest > challenge. The interactive mode of restore with the s (skip) option > drives me crazy. I suspect there's something about using it that > I just don't get. the s (skip option) starts counting from 1 not 0, like the rest of the world. how this slipped in to BSD i dont know. just remember that skip is like goto and goto was the most common structed fortran statement and fortran counts from 1 so the first dump of a multidump tape is 1....and remember to use the nrst device when doing multidump tapes and........argHHHHHH! jmb just type 'sendmail -q -v', watch the mail spool empty out and think quiet little thoughts--we hates bagginses, we do Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 18:33:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA06035 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:33:13 -0800 Received: from amalfi.trl.OZ.AU (amalfi.trl.OZ.AU [137.147.99.99]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA05969; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:31:24 -0800 Received: from orca1.vic.design.telecom.com.au ([145.136.55.131]) by amalfi.trl.OZ.AU (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA17459; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:19:17 +1100 Received: from netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au by orca1.vic.design.telecom.com.au with SMTP (1.36.108.4/16.2) id AA02906; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:27:23 +1100 Received: from netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au (netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au [144.139.63.32]) by netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA26218; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:44:42 +0759 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:44:41 +0800 (WST) From: Terry Dwyer To: Bruce Evans Cc: adhir@bigdipper.umd.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org, questions@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: GUS question and LPT question In-Reply-To: <199501170843.TAA30076@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 17 Jan 1995, Bruce Evans wrote: > IRQs should be used for printing iff they work. > > I would like to see the specs for printers that take hours to print a > line or page. This is called by the printer acknowledging output more > than a few microseconds or nanoseconds before it is ready. I've been following this discussion with interest. I don't know if it's relevent, but Im running 1.1.5.1R with the same printer problems. I don't have anything else but the printer on IRQ 7. I've tried two printers, a brother M-1709 and an epson LX 800. Both exhibit the same slow printing problems. Specs for the LX 800 should be easy enough to obtain. BTW 1.1R had no problems with the same hardware. _-_|\ Terry Dwyer E-Mail: tdwyer@netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au / \ System Administrator Phone: +61 9 491 5161 Fax: +61 9 221 2631 *_.^\_/ Telecom Australia Telstra Corporation MIME capable mailer v Perth WA ( I do not speak for Telstra or Telecom ) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 18:44:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA06443 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:44:12 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA06437 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:44:09 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA20973 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:39:55 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Wed, 18 Jan 95 05:39:55 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id FAA02808; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:26:43 +0300 To: Peter da Silva Cc: dima@demos.su, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, Terry Lambert References: <199501180052.SAA03127@bonkers.taronga.com> In-Reply-To: <199501180052.SAA03127@bonkers.taronga.com>; from Peter da Silva at Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:52:05 -0600 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:26:43 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: CVS stuff Lines: 26 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 998 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199501180052.SAA03127@bonkers.taronga.com> Peter da Silva writes: >> Can't say anything about X-stuff, but I see Xterm working in russian >> at my work. >I just popped up xterm, hit and got . >Tk doesn't handle it though. You need at least setenv ENABLE_STARTUP_LOCALE setenv LANG ru_SU.KOI8-R (or even ISO8859-1, see /etc/rc for example) to load right 8bit ctype and/or? maybe additionly need proper koi8-r X-locale to test this thing. Sorry, I don't use X intensively, so can't provide more info, ask dima@demos.su for details... I don't need to press for 0xFF in xterm, just switch keyboard to Russian register in usual syscons way, then press ']' key. -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 18:56:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA06693 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:56:08 -0800 Received: from amalfi.trl.OZ.AU (amalfi.trl.OZ.AU [137.147.99.99]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA06684 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:55:57 -0800 Received: from orca1.vic.design.telecom.com.au ([145.136.55.131]) by amalfi.trl.OZ.AU (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA18209; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:43:01 +1100 Received: from netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au by orca1.vic.design.telecom.com.au with SMTP (1.36.108.4/16.2) id AA03120; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:51:06 +1100 Received: from netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au (netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au [144.139.63.32]) by netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA26345; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:08:25 +0800 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:08:25 +0800 (WST) From: Terry Dwyer To: Terry Lambert Cc: Doug Rabson , wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: DHCP and diskless support In-Reply-To: <9501171615.AA26668@cs.weber.edu> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I just looked at the DHCP patch and it does not support dynamic address > > allocation. All it does is include DHCP options in the reply packets > > supporting the DHCP DISCOVER->OFFER->REQUEST->ACK process. The addresses > > come from /etc/bootptab as before. For your Information: from the bootp mailing list > From ldonahue@chicagokent.Kentlaw.EDU > Date: Fri, 16 Dec 1994 12:52:43 -0600 (CST) > From: Larry Donahue > To: bootp@andrew.cmu.edu > Subject: Dynamic IP from BOOTP - When you want something... > > You sometimes have to do it yourself. > > I'm thinking really hard about modifying the bootp-2.4.1 code to allow > for dynamic IP allocations. > > Before I jump into this, I wanted to see if I understand all the issues. [ long list of issues deleted for brevity ] If anyone would like it, I can mail the complete message. _-_|\ Terry Dwyer E-Mail: tdwyer@netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au / \ System Administrator Phone: +61 9 491 5161 Fax: +61 9 221 2631 *_.^\_/ Telecom Australia Telstra Corporation MIME capable mailer v Perth WA ( I do not speak for Telstra or Telecom ) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 18:56:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA06722 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:56:44 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA06714 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 18:56:42 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA21672 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:51:18 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Wed, 18 Jan 95 05:51:17 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id FAA02909; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:49:55 +0300 To: FreeBSD-hackers , John Beukema References: In-Reply-To: ; from John Beukema at Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:04:37 +0800 (HKT) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:49:54 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: String tables Lines: 30 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1091 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message John Beukema writes: >I meant >#define BUS_ERR_COREDMP 11 >err_mess(BUS_ERR_COREDMP); >In errmsg_eng.h >syst_err_msg[BUS_ERR_COREDMP] = "Bus error Core dumped"; >This is good coding practice and not much more work than scattering >messages throughout the code. It could be adapted to use Unicode or other >languages with relatively effort. The master version would of course be >in English, the lingua franca. >jbeukema I like even more PGP way to doing that, f.e.: err_mess(MSG("Bus error Core dumped")); MSG() function searches via hash table corresponding translation of this message, or put original variant, if nothing appropriative found. It is more easy to maintain things this way than lot of defines. -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 20:09:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA07901 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:09:38 -0800 Received: from mailbox.syr.edu (mailbox.syr.EDU [128.230.1.5]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA07895 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:09:37 -0800 Received: from kong.syr.edu by mailbox.syr.edu (8.6.9/SUM-V8-1.0) id XAA23625; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 23:11:54 -0500 Received: by kong.syr.edu (4.1/Spike-2.0) id AA18734; Tue, 17 Jan 95 23:12:42 EST Message-Id: <9501180412.AA18734@kong.syr.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: possible bug in manpage for restore(8)? Date: Tue, 17 Jan 95 23:12:41 -0500 From: "Shawn M. Carey" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, I noticed this the other day on a 1.1.5 system: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- BUGS Restore can get confused when doing incremental restores from dump that were made on active file systems. A level zero dump must be done after a full restore. Because restore runs in user code, it has no control over inode allocation; thus a full restore must be done to get a new set of directories reflecting the new ^^^^^^^ inode numbering, even though the contents of the files is unchanged. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Should that last sentence read "...thus a full dump must be done...", or do I have it all wrong? Also, I wouldv'e checked this on a 2.x system with my (former) thud account, but I can no longer get in. I see via finger(1) that I'm still in the passwd file, but no go when it comes time to authenticate. Were accounts disabled intentionally? I really miss having access to a 2.x machine. :( -Shawn From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 20:19:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA07959 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:19:17 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA07953 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:19:15 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA00168; Tue, 17 Jan 95 21:13:22 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501180413.AA00168@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Date: Tue, 17 Jan 95 21:13:22 MST Cc: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <9501172251.AA25223@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> from "Garrett Wollman" at Jan 17, 95 05:51:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > 1) If Pierro, for instance, takes over maintenance of csh, > > BZZZZT! Individuals don't maintain programs, the FreeBSD community at > large does. OK, you are defining the community as English speaking. I personally do not have a problem with this from a usage standpoint (being an English speaker). I have a problem with this architecturally, but am willing to live with it if that's the way it's going continue to be. > > The whole point of an error message is to provide sufficient information > > to the user that they don't *have* to contact the maintainer, IMO. > > I don't seem to be getting through to you, Terry, and I can't seem to > understand what is so difficult about the idea that, in a distributed > community of users dispersed throughout the world, it is more > important to be able to communicate with other people about your > problems than to have those problems reported in fifteen different > languages. This isn't a difficult idea, and I get it. I understand the idea of a common language, like English for air traffic control. On the other hand, I see the problem of multilingual error reporting to a maintainer as a straw man, unless you explicitly limit your audience to English speakers (either native or secondary). The only time you cause a real problem (other than the "I'm sorry, could you repeat that in English, I don't speak Urdlu" traffic) is when you have a non-English speaker reporting the problem to an English-only speaker. And the answer to that is "Sorry, I can't understand a thing you said". In which case the problem is not one that's going to get solved anyway, especially if all you have to go on is a bunch of text in a language you can't read and an error message with multiple potential causes. > While we're at it: this is a volunteer effort. Who is going to sit > down and perform the tedious (and, I believe, counterproductive) task > of translating five gazillion error messages, in both user and kernel > code, into some language or other, and then constantly watching for > program changes to keep them up-to-date? I think the answer is > `nobody'. There are /far/ more important things to do (like improving > the existing documentation and fixing bugs), and---most > significantly---there are /far/ more interesting things to do. I wouldn't suggest kernel code, simply because the kernel has to be up to do an indirect reference to a catalog, and if it's generating errors, it's not up. The "up to date" problem is one based on the message catalog maintenance, and is solved by an update protocol -- a particular procedure used in causing the error catalog to be updated. Simply combining an origin and update time stamp on the catalog with a no-reuse policy for obsoleted messages would resolve the issue entirely. Oh, and I'd be willing to work on the English, Japanese and French, and if no one else wante to, German (and maybe Greek -- I'm very, very rusty). The error messages are part of the documentation, IMO. > > An > > error message is a mechanism for reporting a condition over which the > > user has control but the program does not. An error like: > > > Error: PI is 3.1415926 > > > Is useless, since what the hell is the user supposed to be able to do > > about that? > > This is a phony straw-man. Try again, with a real example from a > current program. Well, I already gave the "Command not found" message being given to an Italian user who doesn't speak English. > > If the "Lingua Franca" of BSD is to be English, fine, but don't cloud > > the air with BS and hand-waving instead of just stating the decision, > > and if that *is* the decision, be prepared to back it. > > There isn't any ``decision'' to be made; that is the situation now, > and any change would be counterproductive and unlikely in the extreme. No, this is just like multiplatform support. "There isn't any ``decision'' to be made; Intel only is the situation now, and any change would be counterproductive and unlikely in the extreme". > You should be the one to talk about BS and hand-waving, Terry. I'll let that slide. I don't want both sides breaking down into ad-hominim attacks. Please address the issues. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 20:50:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA08343 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:50:16 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA08336; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:50:14 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Wankle Rotary Engine cc: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:29:13 EST." <199501180129.UAA01724@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 20:50:14 -0800 Message-ID: <8334.790404614@freefall.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Are you going to start committing your own work? Giving the sheer volume of output you've been pumping out lately (and I've been very impressed, personally!), I don't think that it makes a lot of sense for you to filter everything through the core team, especially if it's already been discussed extensively. Your account on freefall has never even been logged into! :-) If you also need some CVS access before exercising your commit priviledges (which are already set up and ready to go) then I'm sure someone on the core team (myself included) will be happy to oblige. I really like this serial console stuff! Being able to actually install off a terminal should make the process control weenies very happy! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 21:12:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA08624 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:12:02 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA08618; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:11:49 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.8/8.6.6) id AAA02044; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:07:01 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:07:01 -0500 From: Wankle Rotary Engine Message-Id: <199501180507.AAA02044@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> To: jkh@freefall.cdrom.com, wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well, geeze... I didn't even know I *had* an account on freefall. Actually, the problem with this sort of stuff is that it needs to be tested before it gets slammed into the source tree. By tested, I mean on more than a few machines; it may work for me, but that means nothing. The last thing I need is for the townsfolk to come after me in the middle of the night with torches and pitchforks because FreeBSD will no longer boot on half the machines on the planet. I'd prefer it if someone passed this stuff around and tried it before committing it. Besides: I've never used CVS before and I'm deathly afraid I'll screw something up. :) -Bill ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~T~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Møøse Illuminati: ignore it and be confused, or join it and be confusing! ~~~~~~~~ FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #0: Fri Jan 13 22:04:07 EST 1995 ~~~~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 21:13:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA08650 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:13:06 -0800 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA08633 for ; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:12:47 -0800 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin.Root.COM [198.145.90.18]) by Root.COM (8.6.8/8.6.5) with ESMTP id VAA14165; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:12:26 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.9/8.6.5) with SMTP id VAA02654; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:12:26 -0800 Message-Id: <199501180512.VAA02654@corbin.Root.COM> X-Authentication-Warning: corbin.Root.COM: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Andras Olah cc: Garrett Wollman , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Netinet internals (Was: Patching a running kernel) In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 16 Jan 95 13:30:08 +0100." <21232.790259408@utis156> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:12:23 -0800 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >A bit slowly, I'm sorry for it. I haven't had much time since the >status report I forwarded to you before X-mas (I hope you got it). >It seems that I have to dive deeper into tcp_input/tcp_output to >really understand what goes wrong. During the last week, I made >some experiments with the stock 2.0 code and found some problems. I >want to straighten them out before further debugging the T/TCP >extensions. > > /* > * If this is a small packet, then ACK now - with Nagel > * congestion avoidance sender won't send more until > * he gets an ACK. > */ > if ((unsigned)ti->ti_len < tp->t_maxseg) { > tp->t_flags |= TF_ACKNOW; > tcp_output(tp); > } else { > tp->t_flags |= TF_DELACK; > } > >The above code fragment from tcp_input (in the header pred code and >at the end of the `slow' path) has a number of bad effects (1) every >character in telnet sessions is echoed in two packets (immediate ACK >and then the echoed character); (2) in bulk transfer (series of full >sized packets) when options are used: because > > ti_len = maxseg - length of options > >every packet will be acked immediately, and window updates after >application reads will always be in a separate packet. Thus in >short, all the advantages of delayed ACKs are lost. These are obviously both bugs. I didn't notice the echo and the ack occuring seperately when I analyzed the packet stream after making the change...so this is a surprise to me. On the other hand, now that you mention it, it does appear that this is what the code is actually going to do. Hmmm. The second is an oversight and it should certainly account for any options that may reduce the length - provided that the sender takes this into account when deciding whether or not to send. The problem that was originally 'solved' by these changes was one where interactive usage over ether or other high speed network connection was 'choppy' because of the 200ms delays inserted into echo and other short packets (vi was especially bad). >Finally, even if I switch off the do_rfc1323 flag (to assure that >MSS sized packets are sent), I don't quite understand the >implementation of delayed acks. Using ttcp with 16k read/writes on >the loopback interface (MTU set to 1500), I collected traces where >10 segments were sent in a series and then the receiver acked them >in one ACK. Isn't it a violation of RFC-1122 which requires that at >least every second MSS sized segment should be acked? I couldn't >find any code in tcp_input that set ACKNOW or needoutput when two >MSS sized segments were received since the last ACK was sent. Did I >miss something here? Indeed, rfc1122 does say "SHOULD"...which makes this behavior not required. The problem with acking this often is that on high speed, half-duplex networks like ethernet, the collision rate caused by acks this frequently can consume a large amount of the banwidth (measured 10-20%). In the 4.4-lite TCP code, the acks every 2 packets was indirectly caused by limiting the window to 4K. This had exceptionally bad side effects on long, slow, high latency connections that are typical on the internet and usually resulted in connection thrashing (my terminology) - i.e. the connection becomes bursty and unable to stream. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Jan 17 21:12:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA08642 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:12:54 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA08636; Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:12:51 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.8/8.6.6) id AAA02060; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:10:23 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:10:23 -0500 From: Wankle Rotary Engine Message-Id: <199501180510.AAA02060@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> To: jkh@freefall.cdrom.com, wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Oh, and another thing: if I have an account on freefall, what's its password? >:) -Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 00:33:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA10587 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:33:25 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA10581 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:33:20 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA10216 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 02:02:36 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA12351; 18 Jan 95 01:43:46 CST (Wed) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA12347; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 01:43:45 -0600 Message-Id: <199501180743.BAA12347@bonkers.taronga.com> X-Authentication-Warning: bonkers.taronga.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" Cc: dima@demos.su, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, Terry Lambert Subject: Re: CVS stuff In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 18 Jan 95 05:26:43 +0300." X-Mailer: exmh version 1.4.1 7/21/94 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 01:43:41 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >I just popped up xterm, hit and got . Apologies. This was a real live y-with-dieresis (0xFF) when it left here. The extra bit must have been eaten by some mail software somewhere. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 00:56:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA11073 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:56:32 -0800 Received: from mail.rwth-aachen.de (mail.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.144.9]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA11067 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:56:27 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by mail.rwth-aachen.de (PMDF V4.3-10 #7297) id <01HLZKKBBXVK0024NT@mail.rwth-aachen.de>; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:56:54 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (LAA12425); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:00:23 +0100 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:00:22 +0100 (MET) From: Christoph Kukulies Subject: Re: white board software, audio, video In-reply-to: <199501171948.UAA11280@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph P. Kukulies" at Jan 17, 95 08:48:53 pm To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (Christoph P. Kukulies) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com (user alias) Reply-to: Christoph Kukulies Message-id: <199501181000.LAA12425@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-type: text Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-length: 1082 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Following up my own message: > > > I remember running wb (white board) some time ago - a binary that > was compiled for BSDI running also under FreeBSD (1.1.5 at that time). > > Are there packages available for FreeBSD-current allowing for > multi media applications like the above? > > It would be sufficient to have white paper and audio for the first. > A question to the list readers: a couple of days ago I moved from our Ultrix mail machine (due to ultrix sendmail weirdnesses) to gil as my home mail machine, I unsubscribed from majordomo@freefall and subscribed again with kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de. Now when using elm under gil/freebsd-1.1.5.1 I see my own postings in the list (in the From column) as 'To FreeBSD-Hackers' instead coming from 'Christoph Kukulies'. Are you (who are using elm) seeing this the same way? Or is this some elm speciality treating one's own postings differently? --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD 2.0.1-Development #0: Wed Nov 2 23:00:17 1994 root@mvx1b1:/usr/src/sys/compile/JAZZ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 01:00:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id BAA11128 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 01:00:40 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA11084 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 00:57:09 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA05796; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:55:46 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id JAA04956 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:55:46 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id JAA13643; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:20:05 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501180820.JAA13643@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive To: babb@sedhps01.mdc.com (Jim Babb) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:20:05 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199501171411.GAA08047@freefall.cdrom.com> from "Jim Babb" at Jan 17, 95 08:09:29 am X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 2332 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jim Babb wrote: | | I think some of the problems that were blamed on the ft driver were actually | the spurious interrupts from certain controller chips (which has now been | fixed). I doubt. | The only way for the ft probe to screw up a floppy drive | (by stepping it too far) is for that drive to be broken and ignore the | drive select signal. I would like to work with anyone that has a machine | that the ft probe breaks to try and fix the driver (if possible). My drives don't jam due to the step pulses, but they still emit strange noises, indicating they're really being *activated* where they shouldn't. | I think the number of people with working tape drives far outnumber the | number of people with broken floppy drives, so the logic of the flag | should be inverted, such that you set the flag to *disable* the probe. Not yet. The ft driver really needs someone responsible who is willing to maintain it on a regular basis. I cannot do this (for lack of time, material, documentation and experience with floppy tapes). Floppy tape probe still causes my driver to complain with lots of ``Ready for output in input'' error messages, until they finally reach there (currently static) limit of 100 per controller. This is a good indicator that the driver actually still *is* broken: someone attempts to read from the FDC where it doesn't want to emit any byte. The error became obvious after Peter's latest rewritten fdc_{in,out} functions which complain if something is going wrong (the old functions didn't and therefore did hide the problem). There are more points where the ft driver needs maintenance, e.g. it should record any IO activities performed on the DOR in the mirror variable within the fdc_data structure, just to note one here. I doubt that any of the recent changes made to the floppy driver will have ``self-cured'' anything in ft. E.g. the spurious interrupt problem didn't even affect the bad ft probe -- since interrupts are disabled at probe time. If we start enabling ft again as a default i'm afraid we'll have to ship business cards along with the CD's... -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 01:29:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id BAA12228 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 01:29:32 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA12216 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 01:29:26 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id KAA08985 ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:30:11 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA12849; Wed, 18 Jan 95 10:30:12 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501180930.AA12849@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: Exabyte on FreeBSD? To: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl (Wilko Bulte) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:30:12 +0100 (MET) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501171833.TAA00467@yedi.iaf.nl> from "Wilko Bulte" at Jan 17, 95 07:33:26 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 358 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > There is a chance that I might pick up an Exabyte drive for a reasonable > price. What I'm wondering is whether it 'll work with FreeBSD? A friend of mine is very happy with its own. Worked since 386bsd days. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 01:59:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id BAA13797 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 01:59:16 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA13787 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 01:59:12 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA07147; Wed, 18 Jan 95 10:58:49 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (MAA12923); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:04:25 +0100 Message-Id: <199501181104.MAA12923@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: white board software, audio, video To: charnier@lirmm.fr (Philippe Charnier) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:04:24 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com (user alias) In-Reply-To: <199501180923.KAA12995@lirmm.lirmm.fr> from "Philippe Charnier" at Jan 18, 95 10:23:35 am From: Christoph Kukulies Reply-To: Christoph Kukulies X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1102 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Salut, > > In the message Re: white board software, audio, video, > Christoph Kukulies wrote : > > > > >Now when using elm under gil/freebsd-1.1.5.1 I see my own postings > >in the list (in the From column) as 'To FreeBSD-Hackers' instead > >coming from 'Christoph Kukulies'. Are you (who are using elm) seeing > >this the same way? Or is this some elm speciality treating one's > >own postings differently? > > > > I am using Emacs/MH on a SunOS machine, and I have the same behaviour. Then it may be some problem with mail filters on freefall? > > -------- -------- > Philippe Charnier charnier@lirmm.fr > > > LIRMM, 161 rue Ada, 34392 Montpellier cedex 5 -- France > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD 2.0.1-Development #0: Wed Nov 2 23:00:17 1994 root@mvx1b1:/usr/src/sys/compile/JAZZ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 02:17:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id CAA14893 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 02:17:39 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA14883 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 02:17:30 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id LAA09963 ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:18:09 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA13061; Wed, 18 Jan 95 11:18:11 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501181018.AA13061@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: white board software, audio, video To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:18:10 +0100 (MET) Cc: charnier@lirmm.fr, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501181104.MAA12923@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph Kukulies" at Jan 18, 95 12:04:24 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 387 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I am using Emacs/MH on a SunOS machine, and I have the same behaviour. > > Then it may be some problem with mail filters on freefall? I'm using elm + emacs and have always seen it that way. EVen if the message is not from/to freefall. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 03:17:24 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA17549 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 03:17:24 -0800 Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA17532 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 03:17:10 -0800 Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id LAA03972; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:07:00 GMT Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:06:59 +0000 (GMT) From: Doug Rabson To: "Paul F. Werkowski" cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: old vfprintf bug back again in 2.x In-Reply-To: <199501151945.OAA07055@snoopy.mv.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 15 Jan 1995, Paul F. Werkowski wrote: > > > A bug that was lurking in lib/libc/stdio/vfprintf.c prior to FreeBSD 1.1 > is now again hiding in the 2.0 and -current source. The bug is demonstrated > by this code: > > > > int main() > { > int FPRC = 16; > double d = 0; > printf( "%*.*e\n",FPRC+7,FPRC,d); > } > > which results in > 0e+00 > > instead of the correct > 0.0000000000000000e+00 > > This breaks the AKCL (now GCL) compile/load feature. > > I looked at the considerable differences between the 1.1 and 2.0 versions > of vfprintf and think I have reproduced the previous fixes. At least the > modified version passes the GCL test. Perhaps some official bug fixer can > look at this and commit to current /usr/src/lib/libc/stdio/? > > Paul > > [patch deleted] I looked into this and I believe that this patch does the same job: *** /usr/src/lib/libc/stdio/vfprintf.c Fri May 27 05:57:31 1994 --- vfprintf.c Mon Dec 19 16:46:42 1994 *************** *** 507,512 **** --- 507,514 ---- prec = (prec == -1) ? DEFPREC + 1 : prec + 1; /* FALLTHROUGH */ + if (prec != 0) + flags |= ALT; goto fp_begin; case 'f': /* always print trailing zeroes */ if (prec != 0) It certainly helps GCL anyway. Unless you have any objections, I will commit this smaller patch as it seems to be a bit less intrusive. -- Doug Rabson, RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 71 251 4411 FAX: +44 71 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 03:19:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA17671 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 03:19:00 -0800 Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA17651 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 03:18:49 -0800 Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA03925; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:47:19 GMT Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:47:17 +0000 (GMT) From: Doug Rabson To: Terry Lambert cc: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: DHCP and diskless support In-Reply-To: <9501171615.AA26668@cs.weber.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 17 Jan 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > I just looked at the DHCP patch and it does not support dynamic address > > allocation. All it does is include DHCP options in the reply packets > > supporting the DHCP DISCOVER->OFFER->REQUEST->ACK process. The addresses > > come from /etc/bootptab as before. > > OK, so it's still suitable for WfWG 3.1, Windows 95, and NT clients, > making it Microsoft Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol. > > And it's a step in the right direction for Internet Dynamic Host > Configuration Protocol. > > Now that we've arrived at what it looks like... 8^)... > > Does it get committed? What does the author say about distributability? I have a patched tree here which builds. I could commit as soon as I can test it a bit. I even have a couple of NT and WfW boxes to test the DHCP bit. I will try and contact the author about it first though. -- Doug Rabson, RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 71 251 4411 FAX: +44 71 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 05:40:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id FAA26429 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:40:04 -0800 Received: from schizo.coe.montana.edu (schizo.coe.montana.edu [153.90.192.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA26423 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:40:03 -0800 Received: by schizo.coe.montana.edu (5.65/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA25496; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:39:32 -0700 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:39:32 -0700 From: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen) Message-Id: <9501181339.AA25496@schizo.coe.montana.edu> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk A student here is willing to implement NETBEUI for FreeBSD, if I can find docs on the protocol. My understanding is that NetBEUI is rather simplistic, non-routable, but it would be useful in communicating with PC's running wfw that for some reason don't want TCP/IP. Any tips appreciated. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 05:56:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id FAA27842 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:56:32 -0800 Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA27823 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:55:25 -0800 Received: from utis156.cs.utwente.nl by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (5.0/csrelayMX-SVR4_1.0/RB) id AA18736; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:54:30 --100 Received: by utis156.cs.utwente.nl (4.1/RBCS-1.0.1) id AA03910; Wed, 18 Jan 95 14:54:23 +0100 To: davidg@Root.COM Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Netinet internals (Was: Patching a running kernel) In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 17 Jan 1995 21:12:23 PST Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:54:22 +0100 Message-Id: <3909.790437262@utis156.cs.utwente.nl> From: Andras Olah content-length: 4070 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ .. ] > These are obviously both bugs. I didn't notice the echo and the ack > occuring seperately when I analyzed the packet stream after making the > change...so this is a surprise to me. On the other hand, now that you mention > it, it does appear that this is what the code is actually going to do. Hmmm. > The second is an oversight and it should certainly account for any options that > may reduce the length - provided that the sender takes this into account when > deciding whether or not to send. The problem that was originally 'solved' by > these changes was one where interactive usage over ether or other high speed > network connection was 'choppy' because of the 200ms delays inserted into echo > and other short packets (vi was especially bad). IMO, these changes (setting ACKNOW if segment is shorter than MSS) aren't necessary because the echo packets aren't delayed for 200ms. I've compiled out the code in question and hitting a single character generates the following traffic: 09:30:05.610948 localhost.1025 > localhost.telnet: P 1:2(1) ack 2 win 16384 [tos 0x10] 09:30:05.613837 localhost.telnet > localhost.1025: P 2:3(1) ack 2 win 16384 [tos 0x10] 09:30:05.770186 localhost.1025 > localhost.telnet: . ack 3 win 16384 [tos 0x10] The first packet carries the character, the second acks it and carries the echo and the third acks the echo. Only the ack of the echo is triggered by the delack timer which is normal, but that doesn't affect the responsiveness of vi (or anything else). The following fragment from tcp_output assures that the echo isn't delayed: if ((idle || tp->t_flags & TF_NODELAY) && len + off >= so->so_snd.sb_cc) goto send; Therefore, I'd suggest that we change our tcp_input back to the original 4.4 version with respect to delayed acks. [ ... ] > Indeed, rfc1122 does say "SHOULD"...which makes this behavior not required. > The problem with acking this often is that on high speed, half-duplex networks > like ethernet, the collision rate caused by acks this frequently can consume a > large amount of the banwidth (measured 10-20%). That's an interesting point, I'll check it out. I'd appreciate if you have traces or other descriptions of such behavior. > In the 4.4-lite TCP code, the acks every 2 packets was indirectly caused by > limiting the window to 4K. This had exceptionally bad side effects on long, > slow, high latency connections that are typical on the internet and usually > resulted in connection thrashing (my terminology) - i.e. the connection becomes > bursty and unable to stream. I totally agree that small windows kill throughput on long-delay, reasonably fast links, so decreasing window size isn't a way to go. The reason I think delayed acks for more than two segments may be a problem is that it may adversely affect the congestion control algorithms. Slow start increases cwnd by maxseg for each ack in the exponential phase, thus less frequent acks result in slower slow-start. There's something about it in a paper of Lawrence Brakmo (ftp.cs.arizona.edu:xkernel/Papers/tcp_problems.ps). I'll try to make some tests to see exactly what goes on. Anyhow, this seems to be a rare problem because most of the time the application reads data from the socket in a tight loop. In such cases, tcp_input awakes the user process, the PRU_RCVD usrreq call from soreceive will call tcp_output, which assures that every second segment is acked. The acks are only delayed longer than 2 segs when the application does other things between two reads and the windows are large. In that case, acks to in-sequence segments are delayed until the app finally reads the data or the delack timer goes off. I was able to demonstrate this on our network (Sun - router - FBSD) running ttcp with 32K buffers and 50ms delays between the read calls. ACKs were generated sometimes for only every 10th segment. And this is a feature of every BSD implementation (at least SunOS 4.1.1 does the same). > -DG Andras From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 06:19:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA29492 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:19:09 -0800 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.atinc.com [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA29482 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:19:06 -0800 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id JAA03829; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:12:06 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:12:05 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Reply-To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: white board software, audio, video To: Ollivier ROBERT cc: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de, charnier@lirmm.fr, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <9501181018.AA13061@blaise.ibp.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk using pine3.89, the headers are displayed correctly. can you send me the headers from a mail message that gets displayed incorrectly, please. here are the headers from your mail that i am replying to: Received: from freefall.cdrom.com (freefall.cdrom.com [192.216.222.4]) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) with ESMTP id FAA02754; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 05:35:36 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id CAA14893 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 02:17:39 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA14883 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 02:17:30 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id LAA09963 ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:18:09 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA13061; Wed, 18 Jan 95 11:18:11 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501181018.AA13061@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: white board software, audio, video To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:18:10 +0100 (MET) Cc: charnier@lirmm.fr, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501181104.MAA12923@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph Kukulies" at Jan 18, 95 12:04:24 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 387 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 18 Jan 1995, Ollivier ROBERT wrote: > > > I am using Emacs/MH on a SunOS machine, and I have the same behaviour. > > > > Then it may be some problem with mail filters on freefall? > > I'm using elm + emacs and have always seen it that way. EVen if the > message is not from/to freefall. > > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG > FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 > Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 06:21:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA29581 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:21:07 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA29572; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:21:06 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de cc: babb@sedhps01.mdc.com (Jim Babb), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:20:05 +0100." <199501180820.JAA13643@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:21:05 -0800 Message-ID: <29570.790438865@freefall.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ok, would the respective parties involved try to get together on this and provide a fix? I have no problem with disabling this again before 2.1R, but I'd like to do it in a more INFORMED way this time! Whacking features out of the system based on innuendo and hearsay is hardly the proper approach, and some actual proof in concise form (like you seem to have finally provided in your last message) is what I need to settle this. Jim says it works, you say it doesn't, you see how I might not enjoy being stuck in the middle of this! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 06:33:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA00363 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:33:18 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA29851 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:26:03 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id PAA13344 ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:25:56 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA13556; Wed, 18 Jan 95 15:25:57 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501181425.AA13556@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? To: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:25:57 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, terry@cs.weber.edu In-Reply-To: <9501181339.AA25496@schizo.coe.montana.edu> from "Jaye Mathisen" at Jan 18, 95 06:39:32 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 395 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > My understanding is that NetBEUI is rather simplistic, non-routable, but > it would be useful in communicating with PC's running wfw that for some > reason don't want TCP/IP. If you want ot share printers and disks, I'd suggest looking at samba. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 06:33:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA00391 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:33:41 -0800 Received: from lirmm.lirmm.fr (lirmm.lirmm.fr [193.49.104.10]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA00385 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:33:39 -0800 Received: from lirmm.fr (baobab.lirmm.fr [193.49.106.14]) by lirmm.lirmm.fr (8.6.9/8.6.4) with ESMTP id PAA17297 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:34:22 +0100 Message-Id: <199501181434.PAA17297@lirmm.lirmm.fr> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Test: sorry Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:34:14 +0100 From: "Philippe Charnier" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Didn't you read the subject line? ;-) -------- -------- Philippe Charnier charnier@lirmm.fr LIRMM, 161 rue Ada, 34392 Montpellier cedex 5 -- France ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 06:53:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA02591 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:53:34 -0800 Received: from nomad.osmre.gov (nomad.osmre.gov [192.243.129.244]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA02581 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 06:53:30 -0800 Received: (from gfoster@localhost) by nomad.osmre.gov (8.6.8/8.6.6) id JAA15875; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:52:35 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:52:35 -0500 From: Glen Foster Message-Id: <199501181452.JAA15875@nomad.osmre.gov> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: st(1) command, Was: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > From: julian@tfs.com (Julian Elischer) > Date: Tue, 17 Jan 1995 17:31:33 -0800 (PST) > > It got left out by mistake.. (as did st(1)) Is this the case? I thought the st(1) functionality was rolled into the mt(1) command. Someone who knows please correct or confirm my understanding. TIA, Glen Foster From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 07:03:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA03184 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 07:03:09 -0800 Received: from schizo.coe.montana.edu (schizo.coe.montana.edu [153.90.192.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA03170 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 07:03:05 -0800 Received: by schizo.coe.montana.edu (5.65/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA26345; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:02:20 -0700 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:02:20 -0700 From: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen) Message-Id: <9501181502.AA26345@schizo.coe.montana.edu> To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Cc: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen), hackers@FreeBSD.org, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? In-Reply-To: <9501181425.AA13556@blaise.ibp.fr> References: <9501181339.AA25496@schizo.coe.montana.edu> <9501181425.AA13556@blaise.ibp.fr> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Ollivier" == Ollivier ROBERT writes: >> My understanding is that NetBEUI is rather simplistic, >> non-routable, but it would be useful in communicating with PC's >> running wfw that for some reason don't want TCP/IP. Ollivier> If you want ot share printers and disks, I'd suggest (samba). Samba won't solve the problem. Samba is NETBIOS over TCP/IP. I'm talking a whole different protocol, NETBEUI, 'ala WFW/LanManager in it's simplest form. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 07:18:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA04199 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 07:18:08 -0800 Received: from jaitken.async.vt.edu (jaitken@jaitken.async.vt.edu [128.173.18.165]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA04179 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 07:18:03 -0800 Received: (jaitken@localhost) by jaitken.async.vt.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA11341; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:17:41 -0500 From: Jeff Aitken Message-Id: <199501181517.KAA11341@jaitken.async.vt.edu> Subject: Re: possible bug in manpage for restore(8)? To: smcarey@mailbox.syr.edu (Shawn M. Carey) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:17:41 -0500 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <9501180412.AA18734@kong.syr.edu> from "Shawn M. Carey" at Jan 17, 95 11:12:41 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 768 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Also, I wouldv'e checked this on a 2.x > system with my (former) thud account, but I can no longer get in. I > see via finger(1) that I'm still in the passwd file, but no go when it > comes time to authenticate. Were accounts disabled intentionally? I > really miss having access to a 2.x machine. :( As an interesting aside (read: this has nothing to do with your message ;) you may not have an account anymore, despite finger's report, if thud uses GNU fingerd. Some versions of fingerd (maybe only old ones, I don't know) build up potentially *huge* caches and _never flush them_!! We had one instance here where someone's account was deleted and this person was convinced evn a month or so later that he still had an account. -- Jeff Aitken jaitken@vt.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 07:36:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA04887 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 07:36:15 -0800 Received: from nomad.osmre.gov (nomad.osmre.gov [192.243.129.244]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA04878 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 07:36:11 -0800 Received: (from gfoster@localhost) by nomad.osmre.gov (8.6.8/8.6.6) id KAA16064; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:35:17 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:35:17 -0500 From: Glen Foster Message-Id: <199501181535.KAA16064@nomad.osmre.gov> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: <8334.790404614@freefall.cdrom.com> (jkh@freefall.cdrom.com) Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I really like this serial console stuff! Being able to actually > install off a terminal should make the process control weenies very > happy! :-) I haven't had the time to read this entire thread yet but being able to mail two floppies to a friend, with a modem on COM1: and installing FreeBSD for her over the phone would make me REAL happy! (And I am nowhere close to being a "process control weenie" or even a control freak!) Will the serial console + sysinstall support this? Glen Foster From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 07:52:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA05816 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 07:52:39 -0800 Received: from NS.netvision.net.il (root@ns.NetVision.net.il [192.114.201.5]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA05766; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 07:52:18 -0800 Received: from ugen.NetManage.co.il (ugen.netmanage.co.il [192.114.78.165]) by NS.netvision.net.il (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA09294; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:52:02 +0200 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 17:50:38 IST From: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Subject: bug in GCC or in lseek/read??? To: freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-questions@freefall.cdrom.com X-Mailer: Chameleon 4.00-Arm-25, TCP/IP for Windows, NetManage Inc. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Here it comes. I am not sure but it seems like GCC bug in handling quad (long long) types.... Here is the programm.What it tries to do is - to read some buffer from arbitrary file,then lseek back and re-read same place again.Actually i ran into the problemm when really working on very same code. Now look into text and try compiling it,you will see very interesting behaviour. If you'll take a look at assembly code you'll see that -sizeof() replaced in quad_t as 0 and then -size(-5 in this example). on the other hand - is turned into -1 - (-1 -5 here). The cast to (int) makes same result and works.The cast to off_t type which is right does not works. Now: lseek returns same value in all cases-both in those where read fails and works. So probably two things here: bug or at least inconsistency in GCC which makes worng conversions + some strange bug in lseek/read calls which i personally can't still figure out.. or may be i am too dumb????? -------------------------CUT HERE(and look in code)----------------------- #include #include main() { int f; char buf[5],buf1[5]; f=open("/bin/ls",O_RDONLY); /* any file actually we don't care */ printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,100,SEEK_SET)); /* move into the middle somewhere.Actually bug shows without this string */ if (read(f,buf,5)<=0) { printf("First read failed\n"); exit(1); } printf("%d\n",-sizeof(buf)); /* just to show you size of this buffer */ #error ------------ Here choose *ONE* from following 4 strings------- printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,-sizeof(buf),SEEK_CUR)); /* No cast - does not works */ printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,(off_t)-sizeof(buf),SEEK_CUR)); /*right cast-does not works */ printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,(int)-sizeof(buf),SEEK_CUR)); /*wrong cast-works OK*/ printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,-5,SEEK_CUR)); /* number only-works OK*/ if (read(f,buf1,5)<=0) { printf("Second read failed\n"); /* This one will fail BUT!!! 'errno' is set to 0!!! */ exit(1); } if (!strncmp(buf,buf1,5)) /* just to show thet if everything OK, we read same string */ printf("match\n"); } -------------------------------END----------------------------------- -- -=Ugen J.S.Antsilevich=- NetVision - Israeli Commercial Internet | Learning E-mail: ugen@NetVision.net.il | To Fly. [c] Phone : +972-4-550330 | From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 08:12:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA07106 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:12:48 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA07099 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:12:46 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01652; Wed, 18 Jan 95 09:06:29 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501181606.AA01652@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: DHCP and diskless support To: tdwyer@netbsd08.dn.itg.telecom.com.au (Terry Dwyer) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 9:06:28 MST Cc: dfr@render.com, wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Terry Dwyer" at Jan 18, 95 11:08:25 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > For your Information: > > from the bootp mailing list [ ... ] > If anyone would like it, I can mail the complete message. Yes, I'd like to see it and perhaps comment. Please include DHCP in the subject, since that's how I'm processing this topic. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 08:21:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA07378 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:21:30 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA07372 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:21:26 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01711; Wed, 18 Jan 95 09:15:07 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501181615.AA01711@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes To: jkh@freefall.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 9:15:07 MST Cc: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu, bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <8334.790404614@freefall.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jan 17, 95 08:50:14 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I really like this serial console stuff! Being able to actually > install off a terminal should make the process control weenies very > happy! :-) I've been following this discussion (under the topic "headless"). I think the early posting mentioning that this configuration will be impossible to support on some BIOS revisions needs to be noted in the DOC somewhere. Wherever the feature is advertised, actually. In a previos message in this thread, it was noted that the AMI BIOS was the only one *known* to not throw up without a video card. Also, there was a discussion of bypassing the keyboard probe by adjusting a CMOS setting to "uninstalled". The documentation accompanying the changes ought to note this information, as well as noting how the heck one would put the CMOS back to an installed keyboard without an installed keyboard, should it become necessary. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 08:22:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA07432 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:22:33 -0800 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA07420 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:22:30 -0800 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA21030 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:19:37 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Wed, 18 Jan 95 19:19:37 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id TAA00351; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:14:06 +0300 To: Doug Rabson , "Paul F. Werkowski" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com References: In-Reply-To: ; from Doug Rabson at Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:06:59 +0000 (GMT) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:14:05 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: old vfprintf bug back again in 2.x Lines: 31 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1138 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message Doug Rabson writes: >I looked into this and I believe that this patch does the same job: >*** /usr/src/lib/libc/stdio/vfprintf.c Fri May 27 05:57:31 1994 >--- vfprintf.c Mon Dec 19 16:46:42 1994 >*************** >*** 507,512 **** >--- 507,514 ---- > prec = (prec == -1) ? > DEFPREC + 1 : prec + 1; > /* FALLTHROUGH */ >+ if (prec != 0) >+ flags |= ALT; > goto fp_begin; > case 'f': /* always print trailing zeroes */ > if (prec != 0) >It certainly helps GCL anyway. Unless you have any objections, I will >commit this smaller patch as it seems to be a bit less intrusive. I think this patch can be even smaller (only one line affected), just remove "goto fp_begin" after FALLTHROUGH (which really means it without goto fp_begin). -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 08:39:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA08263 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:39:04 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA08253 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:39:02 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01824; Wed, 18 Jan 95 09:32:48 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501181632.AA01824@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: white board software, audio, video To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 9:32:47 MST Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501181000.LAA12425@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph Kukulies" at Jan 18, 95 11:00:22 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > A question to the list readers: a couple of days ago I moved from > our Ultrix mail machine (due to ultrix sendmail weirdnesses) to gil > as my home mail machine, I unsubscribed from majordomo@freefall and > subscribed again with kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de. > > Now when using elm under gil/freebsd-1.1.5.1 I see my own postings > in the list (in the From column) as 'To FreeBSD-Hackers' instead > coming from 'Christoph Kukulies'. Are you (who are using elm) seeing > this the same way? Or is this some elm speciality treating one's > own postings differently? Hit 'o' in elm and check the status of the U)ser level and N)ames only options. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 08:39:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA08296 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:39:16 -0800 Received: from crab.xinside.com (crab.xinside.com [199.120.247.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA08279 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 08:39:12 -0800 Received: (jdc@localhost) by crab.xinside.com (8.6.8/8.6.5) id JAA11096; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:34:32 -0700 From: Jeremy Chatfield Message-Id: <199501181634.JAA11096@crab.xinside.com> Subject: Re: DHCP and diskless support To: dfr@render.com (Doug Rabson) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:34:32 +0000 (MST) Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Doug Rabson" at Jan 18, 95 10:47:17 am Organization: X Inside Inc, P O Box 10774, Golden, CO 80401-0610, USA. Phone: +1(303)470-5302 Reply-To: jdc@crab.xinside.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 503 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I noticed an article about DHCP in the most recent System Admin Journal, quite close to our ad :-) It describes the modes and use of DHCP, for those not wanting to implement, merely use. Cheers, JeremyC. -- Jeremy Chatfield, +1(303)470-5302, FAX:+1(303)470-5513, email:jdc@xinside.com X Inside Inc, P O Box 10774, Golden, CO 80401-0610, USA. Commercial X Server - for more information please try these services http://www.xinside.com info@xinside.com ftp.xinside.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:00:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA08905 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:00:53 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA08899 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:00:51 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA02021; Wed, 18 Jan 95 09:54:55 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501181654.AA02021@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? To: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 9:54:54 MST Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501181339.AA25496@schizo.coe.montana.edu> from "Jaye Mathisen" at Jan 18, 95 06:39:32 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > A student here is willing to implement NETBEUI for FreeBSD, if I can find > docs on the protocol. > > My understanding is that NetBEUI is rather simplistic, non-routable, but > it would be useful in communicating with PC's running wfw that for some > reason don't want TCP/IP. > > Any tips appreciated. I've toyed with this a little... not to the point of running anything, but to the point of looking for the docs. There are ISO documents covering the protocol itself. The biggest mess seems to be the 802.2 LLC state machine, which would be necessary to use it (but which would buy some neat extras at the same time). There is a current project under way on the Samba site. I don't know it's status; you should be able to download their project file. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:16:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA09336 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:16:11 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA09294; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:15:21 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA11238 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:08:22 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Wed, 18 Jan 95 20:08:19 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id TAA00551; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:48:49 +0300 To: freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-questions@freefall.cdrom.com, "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" References: In-Reply-To: ; from "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" at Wed, 18 Jan 95 17:50:38 IST Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:48:48 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: bug in GCC or in lseek/read??? Lines: 12 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 487 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message Ugen J.S.Antsilevich writes: >printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,100,SEEK_SET)); /* move into the middle Here is a bug: must be %lu -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:25:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA09575 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:25:01 -0800 Received: from NS.netvision.net.il (root@ns.NetVision.net.il [192.114.201.5]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA09545; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:23:50 -0800 Received: from ugen.NetManage.co.il (ugen.netmanage.co.il [192.114.78.165]) by NS.netvision.net.il (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA14390; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:23:33 +0200 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 19:27:46 IST From: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Subject: Re: bug in GCC or in lseek/read??? To: freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-questions@freefall.cdrom.com, "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" , "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Mailer: Chameleon 4.00-Arm-25, TCP/IP for Windows, NetManage Inc. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >In message Ugen > J.S.Antsilevich writes: > >>printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,100,SEEK_SET)); /* move into the middle > >Here is a bug: must be %lu This is not the issue! The problemm is that the right cast makes wrong result for lseek and read fails while wrong cast works!!!Taht's the problemm and not how the result seems in printf.I could skip printf but read still will fail. > >-- >Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, >ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - >FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. >RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 > -- -=Ugen J.S.Antsilevich=- NetVision - Israeli Commercial Internet | Learning E-mail: ugen@NetVision.net.il | To Fly. [c] Phone : +972-4-550330 | From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:25:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA09612 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:25:41 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA09591; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:25:28 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id SAA16436 ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:26:00 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA14368; Wed, 18 Jan 95 18:26:01 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501181726.AA14368@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: bug in GCC or in lseek/read??? To: ache@astral.msk.su (Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:26:01 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-questions@freefall.cdrom.com, ugen@netvision.net.il In-Reply-To: from "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" at Jan 18, 95 07:48:48 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 517 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,100,SEEK_SET)); /* move into the middle > > Here is a bug: must be %lu Nay, should be %qu : SYNOPSIS #include off_t lseek(int fildes, off_t offset, int whence) It is an off_t so 64 bits. and I'd recommand to use a cast (off_t) 100 instead of just 100 but that may not be necessary if is included. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:26:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA09658 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:26:33 -0800 Received: from NS.netvision.net.il (root@ns.NetVision.net.il [192.114.201.5]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA09638; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:26:20 -0800 Received: from ugen.NetManage.co.il (ugen.netmanage.co.il [192.114.78.165]) by NS.netvision.net.il (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA14551; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:26:03 +0200 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 19:30:53 IST From: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Subject: Re: bug in GCC or in lseek/read??? To: freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-questions@freefall.cdrom.com, "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" , "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Mailer: Chameleon 4.00-Arm-25, TCP/IP for Windows, NetManage Inc. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >In message Ugen > J.S.Antsilevich writes: > >>printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,100,SEEK_SET)); /* move into the middle > >Here is a bug: must be %lu P.S. BTW i'v checked this suggestion-the output for %lu is the same for all 4 cases....Seems that you didn't tested the source i'v sent... and the bug is still there.. -- -=Ugen J.S.Antsilevich=- NetVision - Israeli Commercial Internet | Learning E-mail: ugen@NetVision.net.il | To Fly. [c] Phone : +972-4-550330 | From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:31:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA09773 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:31:18 -0800 Received: from NS.netvision.net.il (root@ns.NetVision.net.il [192.114.201.5]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA09746; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:30:47 -0800 Received: from ugen.NetManage.co.il (ugen.netmanage.co.il [192.114.78.165]) by NS.netvision.net.il (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA14805; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:29:28 +0200 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 19:34:24 IST From: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Subject: Re: bug in GCC or in lseek/read??? To: ache@astral.msk.su, Ollivier ROBERT Cc: freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-questions@freefall.cdrom.com, ugen@netvision.net.il X-Mailer: Chameleon 4.00-Arm-25, TCP/IP for Windows, NetManage Inc. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> >printf("seek %u\n",lseek(f,100,SEEK_SET)); /* move into the middle >> >> Here is a bug: must be %lu > >Nay, should be %qu : > >SYNOPSIS > #include > > off_t > lseek(int fildes, off_t offset, int whence) > >It is an off_t so 64 bits. > >and I'd recommand to use a cast (off_t) 100 instead of just 100 but that >may not be necessary if is included. That's exactly what's causing second read to fail..!!! And the problemm NOT in how i print this-i don't care about printf. Problemm is in that read fails..:( Guys you missing the point:( >-- >Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG > FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 > -- -=Ugen J.S.Antsilevich=- NetVision - Israeli Commercial Internet | Learning E-mail: ugen@NetVision.net.il | To Fly. [c] Phone : +972-4-550330 | From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:31:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA09799 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:31:51 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA09774 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:31:20 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA25300; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:32:03 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id SAA07473 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:32:02 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id SAA19318; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:29:01 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501181729.SAA19318@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:29:01 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <9501181615.AA01711@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Jan 18, 95 09:15:07 am X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 2156 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: | | > I really like this serial console stuff! Being able to actually | > install off a terminal should make the process control weenies very | > happy! :-) | | In a previos message in this thread, it was noted that the AMI BIOS | was the only one *known* to not throw up without a video card. Also, | there was a discussion of bypassing the keyboard probe by adjusting | a CMOS setting to "uninstalled". Yes, AMI is unfortunately the only BIOS vendor known to ship an option to run without a graphics board. (They used to have a fancy collection of beep codes to inform about POST failures, while other vendors have been too l*zy and only fall back to the screen.) No, the keyboard probe is not *bypassed*, kbd probing & attaching is still done, but the BIOS *does not complain* about the missing keyboard. I will yet have to see a BIOS where you cannot tell this. | The documentation accompanying the changes ought to note this information, | as well as noting how the heck one would put the CMOS back to an installed | keyboard without an installed keyboard, should it become necessary. See my paragraph above, since the probe & attach still happens, you can plug in & use a keyboard should you want it. (Read this: it is always save to tell the BIOS there were no keyboard at all.) I'm currently operating four machines with comconsole and serial boot. Two of them are kinda network servers. One of them runs in a university and provides our private network access. They have a 19"-rack with one VT320 for a dozen of machines. The other server is here in the company and uses kermit on my ``Xterminal'' should i need a true console for it. Another box simply uses serial boot & console since the Sony GDM-1935 monitor is unable to display the VGA picture the S3 board is using at start up, so you won't see very much until X11 is up & running. -- To make it short: all of them run very well. -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:35:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA09920 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:35:56 -0800 Received: from eureka.gdl.iteso.mx (eureka.gdl.iteso.mx [148.201.1.15]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA09912 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:35:54 -0800 Received: (from cacho@localhost) by eureka.gdl.iteso.mx (8.6.8/8.6.6) id LAA07881; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:55:23 -0600 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:55:22 -0600 (CST) From: Hector Gonzalez Jaime Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: Terry Lambert cc: Garrett Wollman , wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <9501180413.AA00168@cs.weber.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Oh, and I'd be willing to work on the English, Japanese and French, and > if no one else wante to, German (and maybe Greek -- I'm very, very rusty). > I'd like to work on the Spanish translation of error messages, i have a lot of users and sysadmin-to-be guys that are unable to read english. Maybe the support problems could be handled by multilingual lists, advertised in multilingual FAQs. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:39:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA09989 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:39:08 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA09983 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:39:06 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA02235; Wed, 18 Jan 95 10:33:06 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501181733.AA02235@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 10:33:05 MST Cc: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <9501180413.AA00168@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Jan 17, 95 09:13:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I don't seem to be getting through to you, Terry, and I can't seem to > > understand what is so difficult about the idea that, in a distributed > > community of users dispersed throughout the world, it is more > > important to be able to communicate with other people about your > > problems than to have those problems reported in fifteen different > > languages. Some late breaking data from the BSD counter: ] There are 915 registered users of free BSD versions ] ] ] PLACES WHERE FREE BSD IS USED ] ========================== ] Self Other Sum %Sum Place ] 564 29 593 64% home ] 247 10 257 27% work ] 123 1 124 13% somewhere ] 58 0 58 6% school ] 7 0 7 0% not used ] -------------------------- ] 885 37 922 100% TOTAL ] ] NOTE: Some people use free BSD in multiple places, so the total is not ] the sum of the columns. ] ] COUNTRIES WHERE FREE BSD IS USED ] ============================= ] Country Self Other Sum MPop Free BSD/M ] --------------------------------------------------------------- ] 1 is Iceland 2 0 2 0.3 7.9 ] 2 no Norway 16 0 16 4.3 3.7 ] 3 fi Finland 17 0 17 5.0 3.4 ] 4 au Australia 52 0 52 17.1 3.0 ] 5 se Sweden 25 0 25 8.6 2.9 ] 6 nl Netherlands 28 0 28 14.9 1.9 ] 7 nz New Zealand 6 0 6 3.4 1.8 ] 8 us USA 395 9 404 249.6 1.6 ] 9 de Germany 103 2 105 79.1 1.3 ] 10 ee Estonia 2 0 2 1.6 1.2 ] 11 ca Canada 33 0 33 26.6 1.2 ] 12 dk Denmark 6 0 6 5.1 1.2 ] 13 ie Ireland 4 0 4 3.5 1.1 ] 14 il Israel 5 0 5 6.3 0.8 ] 15 gb Great Britain 40 0 40 57.2 0.7 ] 16 hk Hong Kong 4 0 4 5.9 0.7 ] 17 za South Africa 16 0 16 30.2 0.5 ] 18 at Austria 4 0 4 7.6 0.5 ] 19 cz Czech Rebublic 5 0 5 10.0 0.5 ] 20 fr France 24 2 26 56.2 0.4 ] 21 sg Singapore 1 0 1 2.7 0.4 ] 22 tw Taiwan 6 0 6 20.3 0.3 ] 23 jp Japan 30 11 41 123.3 0.2 ] 24 gr Greece 2 0 2 10.1 0.2 ] 25 hu Hungary 2 2 4 10.5 0.2 ] 26 ch Switzerland 1 0 1 6.7 0.1 ] 27 su Soviet Union (former) 15 5 20 147.4 0.1 ] 28 br Brazil 10 5 15 158.2 0.1 ] 29 my Malaysia 1 0 1 18.0 0.1 ] 30 pl Poland 2 0 2 38.4 0.1 ] 31 it Italy 3 0 3 57.7 0.1 ] 32 es Spain 2 0 2 39.5 0.1 ] 33 kr Korea (South) 1 0 1 43.1 0.0 ] 34 ua Ukraine 1 0 1 51.9 0.0 ] 35 th Thailand 1 0 1 57.6 0.0 ] 36 in India 3 0 3 844.0 0.0 ] 37 xe Europe (Somewhere in it) 1 0 1 320.0 0.0 ] 38 xx Unknown 6 1 7 5000.0 0.0 ] 39 xw The World (Somewhere in i 3 0 3 5000.0 0.0 I count this as 36 seperate countries. I count au, nz, us, gb as English speaking countries; Canada and Ireland aren't 100%, though I suppose you could debate them. That's sum=502 (or sum=539, if you are debating)... or 54% (58%) of the installed base in English speaking countries. The US is not even a majority (43%), so if we start arguing about the spelling of colour... If we go by installed country (not logical if we are marketeers, granted), the US is 3% of the countries, and English speaking countries are a total of 11% (17%) of the countries. Note that 922 is probably far short of the actual numbers. The following was recently reported for download only (not including CDROM sales and not including download from mirrors): ] jkh@wcarchive-> zcat xferlog.gz |awk -f report-FreeBSD.awk ] Day Category Total xfers Total Size ] --- -------- ----------- ---------- ] Jan 14 2.0R 3196 files 1228 MB ] Jan 15 2.0R 4072 files 1308 MB ] Jan 16 2.0R 4527 files 1618 MB ] Jan 17 2.0R 131 files 26 MB [ ... ] ] The Jan 17th figures are bogus as the logs were rolled in the ] morning of the 17th. And this was for a 3 day period (if we throw out the 17th). Actually, I'd like to see accounting on the kernel boot disk image alone. That would give a better idea of the number of machines, assuming a download == install. If we could get reported it by requesting country network address suffix, that would be nice too. I think an adequate case can be made for internationalization and for providing locale information (including message catalogs). Also note that the counter is biased toward US responses, given the nature of the net in general, anyway, since it can only count responses from those who are net connected and aware of the counter -- and the counter is advertised only via the mailing lists and usenet, both of which have a huge English bias. This can only serve to strengthen the case for internationalization. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:43:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA10094 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:43:18 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA10087 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:43:16 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA02258; Wed, 18 Jan 95 10:37:22 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501181737.AA02258@cs.weber.edu> Subject: GCC question To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 10:37:22 MST Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Will GCC produce code for the PPC? Is there a working GAS/GLD? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 09:59:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA10398 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:59:34 -0800 Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA10392 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 09:59:23 -0800 Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id RAA00607; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:57:56 GMT Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:57:53 +0000 (GMT) From: Doug Rabson To: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" cc: "Paul F. Werkowski" , freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: old vfprintf bug back again in 2.x In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 18 Jan 1995, Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage wrote: > In message > Doug Rabson writes: > > >I looked into this and I believe that this patch does the same job: > > >*** /usr/src/lib/libc/stdio/vfprintf.c Fri May 27 05:57:31 1994 > >--- vfprintf.c Mon Dec 19 16:46:42 1994 > >*************** > >*** 507,512 **** > >--- 507,514 ---- > > prec = (prec == -1) ? > > DEFPREC + 1 : prec + 1; > > /* FALLTHROUGH */ > >+ if (prec != 0) > >+ flags |= ALT; > > goto fp_begin; > > case 'f': /* always print trailing zeroes */ > > if (prec != 0) > > >It certainly helps GCL anyway. Unless you have any objections, I will > >commit this smaller patch as it seems to be a bit less intrusive. > > I think this patch can be even smaller (only one line affected), > just remove "goto fp_begin" > after FALLTHROUGH (which really means it without goto fp_begin). The "goto fp_begin" skips 2 lines of code for the 'g' format which fiddles with the precision. I am not sure whether this is a problem or not, so to be on the safe side I left the goto in. -- Doug Rabson, RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 71 251 4411 FAX: +44 71 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 10:02:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA10459 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:02:09 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA10447 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:01:21 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA26156; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:02:12 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id TAA07772 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:02:11 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id SAA19353; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:30:24 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501181730.SAA19353@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:30:24 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501181535.KAA16064@nomad.osmre.gov> from "Glen Foster" at Jan 18, 95 10:35:17 am X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 444 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Glen Foster wrote: | | Will the serial console + sysinstall support this? Well, did anyone actually try sysinstall? Perhaps we should avoid this stupid ``all the world uses TERM=pc3'' assumption that's currently done. -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 10:13:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA10682 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:13:43 -0800 Received: from lirmm.lirmm.fr (lirmm.lirmm.fr [193.49.104.10]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA10674 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:13:40 -0800 Received: from lirmm.fr (baobab.lirmm.fr [193.49.106.14]) by lirmm.lirmm.fr (8.6.9/8.6.4) with ESMTP id TAA20913; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:14:30 +0100 Message-Id: <199501181814.TAA20913@lirmm.lirmm.fr> To: Hector Gonzalez Jaime cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: CVS stuff In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:55:22 CST." Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:14:22 +0100 From: "Philippe Charnier" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Salut, In the message Re: CVS stuff, Hector Gonzalez Jaime wrote : > >> Oh, and I'd be willing to work on the English, Japanese and French, and >> if no one else wante to, German (and maybe Greek -- I'm very, very rusty). >> > I'd like to work on the Spanish translation of error messages, >i have a lot of users and sysadmin-to-be guys that are unable to read >english. After lot of translations I will be pleased to send to the world the following mail: Something is wrong with my computer, I had the message: << Probleme materiel au demarrage : clavier absent Appuyer sur une touche pour continuer >> Is there a hacker that can 1) speak french 2) help me? NB : the french message says: hardware failure on boot : no keyboard connected press any key to continue -------- -------- Philippe Charnier charnier@lirmm.fr LIRMM, 161 rue Ada, 34392 Montpellier cedex 5 -- France ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 10:25:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA10922 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:25:51 -0800 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA10916 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:25:47 -0800 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA17468 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:18:47 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Wed, 18 Jan 95 21:18:46 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id VAA00335; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:12:23 +0300 To: Doug Rabson Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, "Paul F. Werkowski" References: In-Reply-To: ; from Doug Rabson at Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:57:53 +0000 (GMT) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:12:23 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: old vfprintf bug back again in 2.x Lines: 44 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1652 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message Doug Rabson writes: >On Wed, 18 Jan 1995, Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage wrote: >> In message >> Doug Rabson writes: >> >> >I looked into this and I believe that this patch does the same job: >> >> >*** /usr/src/lib/libc/stdio/vfprintf.c Fri May 27 05:57:31 1994 >> >--- vfprintf.c Mon Dec 19 16:46:42 1994 >> >*************** >> >*** 507,512 **** >> >--- 507,514 ---- >> > prec = (prec == -1) ? >> > DEFPREC + 1 : prec + 1; >> > /* FALLTHROUGH */ >> >+ if (prec != 0) >> >+ flags |= ALT; >> > goto fp_begin; >> > case 'f': /* always print trailing zeroes */ >> > if (prec != 0) >> >> >It certainly helps GCL anyway. Unless you have any objections, I will >> >commit this smaller patch as it seems to be a bit less intrusive. >> >> I think this patch can be even smaller (only one line affected), >> just remove "goto fp_begin" >> after FALLTHROUGH (which really means it without goto fp_begin). >The "goto fp_begin" skips 2 lines of code for the 'g' format which >fiddles with the precision. I am not sure whether this is a problem or >not, so to be on the safe side I left the goto in. This 2 lines of code is inactive, because prec != -1 there (it resetted above if -1). -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 10:31:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA11024 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:31:37 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA11008 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:31:06 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA27058; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:31:56 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id TAA08038 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:31:56 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id TAA19585; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:09:19 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501181809.TAA19585@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:09:18 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <199501180129.UAA01724@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> from "Wankle Rotary Engine" at Jan 17, 95 08:29:13 pm X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 2526 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Wankle Rotary Engine wrote: [Bruce] | > I rewrote the bootstrap serial console i/o routines in C. This takes | > only about 32 bytes more, but 32 is too many for Joerg :-). Hmm, no, not for me. I've only been afraid that even a single byte more for the serial bootblocks compared to the VGA/kbd blocks would have caused troubles since people tend to fill up the latter to the last available byte without even bothering to test the serial blocks, too. But now that our Rotary Engine rotated :-)... | Well, now that I smushed twiddle() down a bit and merged a bunch of | printf()s, I can put the other code back. Essentially, I managed to | incorporate both the serial console code and the keyboard probe while | keeping the second stage boot loader under 7168 bytes. ...all my objections against coding the stuff in C are blown away! | - The bootblock probes for the keyboard. If you don't have it plugged in, | it defaults over to the serial port. If you _do_ have it plugged in, | things proceed from the VGA display and keyboard just as always. I'd like to have some e.g. compile-time option to force it to use the serial boot, though. The reason: old fixed-frequency monitors (large and expensive things) can nicely be recycled for use with FreeBSD if the system boots up on a serial console (kermit, or a spare VT320), while the graphics screen doesn't display anything useful until the system runs mutli-user with xdm enabled. I see that this is not a very common case, but it should be an option (and RB_SERIAL doesn't help me allot since it would require user interaction at boot time which is considered not desired). | End result (again :): The bootblock simulates the behavior of the Sun | boot PROM, in that you can boot with a serial port as the console just | by attaching a terminal to COM1 and unplugging the keyboard. (And you | can install the system this way too. :) Btw., Data General's do it also this way. | The only bad part is that there's no way to specify a different serial | port on the fly; both the bootblock and the kernel need to be recompiled. | I'm thinking about finding a way around this, but for the moment that's | just a pipe dream. I'm plenty happy with what I have now. Not a big deal, since the comconsole stuff is also hard-coded by now. -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 10:32:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA11082 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:32:43 -0800 Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA11072 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:32:30 -0800 Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R2.01/dg-rtp-v02) id AA09670; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:31:47 -0500 Received: (rivers@localhost) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.9/8.6.5) id MAA15855; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:06:23 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:06:23 -0500 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199501181706.MAA15855@ponds.UUCP> To: freebsd-bugs@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Serious problems in drand48(). Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have run the following program on a Pentium and a 386sx-16 with no floating point co-processor. Both times it reported that drand48() incorrectly returned a value greater than 1.0. Of course, you're thinking - I haven't declared drand48() to return a double - but there it is... drand48() should never return a value >= 1.0. - Dave Rivers - ----------- cut here (test case) ---------- double d; #define COUNT 3072 double drand48(); main() { int i; for(i=0;i<(COUNT*2); i++) { d = drand48(); if( d > 1.0 ) { printf("d (%lf) is greater than 1.0\n", d); } } } From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 11:00:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA11797 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:00:19 -0800 Received: from remote1-line1.cis.yale.edu (remote1-line1.cis.yale.edu [130.132.57.21]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA11778; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:00:12 -0800 Received: (from mrami@localhost) by remote1-line1.cis.yale.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA10751; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:42:30 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:42:30 -0500 (EST) From: Marc Ramirez To: Terry Lambert cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu, bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes In-Reply-To: <9501181615.AA01711@cs.weber.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 18 Jan 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > The documentation accompanying the changes ought to note this information, > as well as noting how the heck one would put the CMOS back to an installed > keyboard without an installed keyboard, should it become necessary. I've played around with this. :) For keyboard/video, "Not Installed" means successful probe is not necessary for successful boot. You can still use an "uninstalled" keyboard. Marc. -- DeForrest Gump - "Dammit, Jim! Life is like a box of chocolates!" From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 11:32:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA13178 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:32:34 -0800 Received: from netcom5.netcom.com (root@netcom5.netcom.com [192.100.81.113]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA13172 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:32:33 -0800 Received: from localhost by netcom5.netcom.com (8.6.9/Netcom) id KAA24197; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:57:47 -0800 Message-Id: <199501181857.KAA24197@netcom5.netcom.com> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 18 Jan 95 10:33:05 MST." <9501181733.AA02235@cs.weber.edu> Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 10:57:40 -0800 From: Bakul Shah Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I can't resist sticking my oar in. FYI, I am not a native English speaker and at present in our household we speak six languages so I would dearly love to see internationalization support. However, having system messages reported in other languages is not high on my list at this time. In fact, I prefer to have messages in english that can be understood by people who are likely to help (and who are very likely to know English). I'd rather see support for *inputting* and *displaying* other languages first. Other than `sam' there is hardly anything else in the free Unix world that can be used to this purpose. You wouldn't believe the contortions one has to go through to typeset something in, e.g., Hindi using TeX. IMHO, for internationalization, the highest priority task is Unicode integration. That is a huge enough task without worrying about message catalogs. You speak of English bias of mailing lists and Usenet but the English bias of Unix etc. is much more pervasive. How would one translate `cat', `sh', `uucp' etc. to other languages? Without English language background these words make _no_ sense. But it would be equally nonsensical to translate them using some high faluting or cute or made up words. I tell you, English is the `C' of natural languages. Bakul From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 11:32:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA13204 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:32:45 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA13198 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:32:44 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA27737; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:32:25 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:32:25 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501181932.AA27737@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? In-Reply-To: <9501181502.AA26345@schizo.coe.montana.edu> References: <9501181339.AA25496@schizo.coe.montana.edu> <9501181425.AA13556@blaise.ibp.fr> <9501181502.AA26345@schizo.coe.montana.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < Samba won't solve the problem. Samba is NETBIOS over TCP/IP. I'm talking > a whole different protocol, NETBEUI, 'ala WFW/LanManager in it's simplest > form. LanMan uses a number of different protocols all carrying the same data. It shouldn't be too hard to design a simple socket interface that provides the appropriate services. (Take a look at the output of `tcpdump ether multicast and not arp' on a LAN with an NT machine sometime and you'll see what I mean.) -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 11:36:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA13416 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:36:43 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA13402 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:36:34 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA28852; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:37:32 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id UAA08599 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:37:32 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id TAA19739; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:34:37 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501181834.TAA19739@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:34:37 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <199501181814.TAA20913@lirmm.lirmm.fr> from "Philippe Charnier" at Jan 18, 95 07:14:22 pm X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 504 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Philippe Charnier wrote: | Btw. | NB : the french message says: | hardware failure on boot : no keyboard connected | press any key to continue This is the kind of messages that regularly make me laugh. Hell, how shall i press a key if there's no keyboard connected? :--) -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 11:39:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA13595 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:39:57 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA13570; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:39:45 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA27752; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:39:14 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:39:14 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501181939.AA27752@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Cc: freebsd-current@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-questions@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: DO NOT CROSS-POST TO THESE LISTS! Reply-To: wollman@lcs.mit.edu In-Reply-To: References: Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: Well, it doesn't really matter what he said. The important point is as follows: DO NOT, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, CROSS-POST AMONG THESE THREE LISTS. Their audience is almost completely overlapping, they have different (although hard-to-distinguish) purposes, and dumping three copies of any message into everyone's mailbox is not a way to win friends and influence people. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 11:41:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA13740 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:41:28 -0800 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA13730 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:41:25 -0800 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id LAA06540; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:40:32 -0800 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199501181940.LAA06540@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: white board software, audio, video To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:40:32 -0800 (PST) Cc: charnier@lirmm.fr, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501181104.MAA12923@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph Kukulies" at Jan 18, 95 12:04:24 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 934 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > > Salut, > > > > In the message Re: white board software, audio, video, > > Christoph Kukulies wrote : > > > > > > > >Now when using elm under gil/freebsd-1.1.5.1 I see my own postings > > >in the list (in the From column) as 'To FreeBSD-Hackers' instead > > >coming from 'Christoph Kukulies'. Are you (who are using elm) seeing > > >this the same way? Or is this some elm speciality treating one's > > >own postings differently? > > > > > > > I am using Emacs/MH on a SunOS machine, and I have the same behaviour. > > > Then it may be some problem with mail filters on freefall? No, this is how elm works, if the From: line matches the user sending the mail it displays the message as To blah when looking at mail indexes. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Custom computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 11:48:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA11149 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:35:02 -0800 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA11142 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:34:24 -0800 Received: (from phk@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id KAA04471; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:33:51 -0800 From: Poul-Henning Kamp Message-Id: <199501181833.KAA04471@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:33:51 -0800 (PST) Cc: ache@astral.msk.su, dgy@seagull.rtd.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr In-Reply-To: <9501162022.AA23787@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Jan 16, 95 01:22:25 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 495 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Maybe the question to be asked is "do I know of any code that is used on > FreeBSD, but isn't maintained by FreeBSD, which uses this thing". The > answer to that question is "Yes. Lots of code is available which is not > yet internationalized, but which is 8-bit clean except for 0x00 and 0xff". "Be liberal in input and conservative in output" -- Poul-Henning Kamp TRW Financial Systems, Inc. FreeBSD has, until now, not one single time had an undetected error. :-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 12:03:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA15322 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:03:05 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA15307 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:03:01 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id VAA18146 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:03:55 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA15087; Wed, 18 Jan 95 21:03:57 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.6.9/keltia-uucp-1.21) id UAA04127 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:47:50 +0100 From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199501181947.UAA04127@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: Problem with new groff To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:47:49 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier Robert) X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On a 21-current, there is no /usr/share/tmac/mdoc directory and ``make install'' thus fails. In the troffrc, three have crept in and groff outputs warnings for that. The following patch should fix it. Index: Makefile =================================================================== RCS file: /spare/FreeBSD-current/src/gnu/usr.bin/ngroff/tmac/Makefile,v retrieving revision 1.4 diff -u -r1.4 Makefile --- 1.4 1995/01/17 19:05:12 +++ Makefile 1995/01/18 19:51:54 @@ -37,6 +37,9 @@ for f in ${MDOCFILES}; do \ rm -f temp; \ sed -f ${.CURDIR}/strip.sed ${.CURDIR}/$$f >temp; \ + if [ ! -d ${DESTDIR}${MDOCDIR} ]; then \ + mkdir ${DESTDIR}${MDOCDIR}; \ + fi; \ install -c -o ${TMACOWN} -g ${TMACGRP} -m ${TMACMODE} \ temp ${DESTDIR}${MDOCDIR}/$$f; \ done Index: troffrc =================================================================== RCS file: /spare/FreeBSD-current/src/gnu/usr.bin/ngroff/tmac/troffrc,v retrieving revision 1.3 diff -u -r1.3 troffrc --- 1.3 1995/01/17 20:08:42 +++ troffrc 1995/01/18 19:00:38 @@ -21,9 +21,9 @@ .\" Set the hyphenation language to `us'. .\" Load hyphenation patterns from `hyphen.us' (in the tmac directory). .ie "\*[.T]"koi8-r" \ -.do hla us-ru -.do hpf hyphen.us-ru +.do hla us-ru +.do hpf hyphen.us-ru .el \ -.do hla us -.do hpf hyphen.us +.do hla us +.do hpf hyphen.us .\" Don't let blank lines creep in here. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 12:09:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA15797 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:09:22 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA15789 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:09:17 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA18803; Wed, 18 Jan 95 21:09:06 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (WAA20475); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:14:42 +0100 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:14:42 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199501182114.WAA20475@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: is it hardware? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm having the blues with blues.physik.rwth-aachen.de: 486DX2/66, 32MB, WE32p, 2x Quantum Maverick 540 IDE, running a current kernel did not make it through make world today - I must say that I never succeeded in making a full make world through on this system - from the first day I had it running gcc (cc1) got signals 11,10 and such. Today the make world stopped with a signal 4 caught by cc1. I'm running the X server of Xinside, Inc.. Pretty nice server but while playing with wb (whiteboard) and scrolling a picture the server died and the system was doing a bus error on every cc invocation during making a kernel. I rebooted and the core dumps had disappeared. But I had strange characters in two included files (../../sys/queue.h had a ((ead) instead of (head) in a macro and some other file was in error, st2uct instead of struct. So I wonder when these files got corrupted. During sup? What might be the cause for such instabilities? Memory? ISA bus? VL Bus? --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD blues 2.1.0-Development FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #1: Wed Jan 18 10:42:31 1995 kuku@blues:/usr/src/sys/compile/BLUES i386 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 12:21:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA16997 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:21:26 -0800 Received: from snoopy.mv.com (snoopy.mv.com [199.125.64.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA16985 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:21:22 -0800 Received: (from pw@localhost) by snoopy.mv.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA00921; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:20:20 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:20:20 -0500 From: "Paul F. Werkowski" Message-Id: <199501182020.PAA00921@snoopy.mv.com> To: dfr@render.com CC: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-reply-to: (message from Doug Rabson on Wed, 18 Jan 1995 11:06:59 +0000 (GMT)) Subject: Re: old vfprintf bug back again in 2.x Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Doug" == Doug Rabson writes: Doug> On Sun, 15 Jan 1995, Paul F. Werkowski wrote: >> >> >> A bug that was lurking in lib/libc/stdio/vfprintf.c prior to >> FreeBSD 1.1 is now again hiding in the 2.0 and -current >> source. The bug is demonstrated by this code: >> previous fixes. At least the modified version passes the GCL >> test. Perhaps some official bug fixer can look at this and >> commit to current /usr/src/lib/libc/stdio/? >> >> Paul >> >> [patch deleted] Doug> I looked into this and I believe that this patch does the Doug> same job: Doug> It certainly helps GCL anyway. Unless you have any Doug> objections, I will commit this smaller patch as it seems to Doug> be a bit less intrusive. I have no objections or any claims to the patch I posted. It was the result of diffs with 1.1. Let the best fix go forward! Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 12:22:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA17099 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:22:38 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA17090 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:22:34 -0800 Received: from masi.ibp.fr (root@masi.ibp.fr [132.227.60.23]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id VAA18285 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:23:21 +0100 Received: from hebe.ibp.fr (card@hebe.ibp.fr [132.227.64.34]) by masi.ibp.fr (8.6.9/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id VAA21048 ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:22:25 +0100 From: Remy.Card@masi.ibp.fr (Remy CARD) Received: by hebe.ibp.fr (8.6.9/jtpda-5.0) id VAA11283 ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:19:46 +0100 Message-Id: <199501182019.VAA11283@hebe.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: Problem with new groff To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:19:44 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501181947.UAA04127@keltia.frmug.fr.net> from "Ollivier Robert" at Jan 18, 95 08:47:49 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 383 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > On a 21-current, there is no /usr/share/tmac/mdoc directory and ``make > install'' thus fails. Hmmm, shouldn't etc/mtree/BSD.usr.dist be modified to create this directory instead of modifying Makefiles ? > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net > FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 > Remy From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 12:23:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA17236 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:23:56 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA17225 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:23:52 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id VAA18297 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:24:39 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA15154; Wed, 18 Jan 95 21:24:41 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.6.9/keltia-uucp-1.21) id VAA04723 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:13:58 +0100 From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199501182013.VAA04723@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: Groff Makefile in tmac To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:13:57 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier Robert) X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#288 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 977 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Please ignore my previous patch for the tmac/Makefile in ngroff... It was not the best way to do it and the mail went out before I could correct it. We must test and create /usr/share/tmac/mdoc only once, not in the middle of the loop of course... Index: Makefile =================================================================== RCS file: /spare/FreeBSD-current/src/gnu/usr.bin/ngroff/tmac/Makefile,v retrieving revision 1.4 diff -u -r1.4 Makefile --- 1.4 1995/01/17 19:05:12 +++ Makefile 1995/01/18 20:10:39 @@ -34,6 +34,9 @@ install -c -o ${TMACOWN} -g ${TMACGRP} -m ${TMACMODE} \ temp ${DESTDIR}${TMACDIR}/$$f; \ done + if [ ! -d ${DESTDIR}${MDOCDIR} ]; then \ + mkdir ${DESTDIR}${MDOCDIR}; \ + fi for f in ${MDOCFILES}; do \ rm -f temp; \ sed -f ${.CURDIR}/strip.sed ${.CURDIR}/$$f >temp; \ -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 12:23:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA17237 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:23:56 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA17224 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:23:50 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id VAA18293 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:24:38 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA15151; Wed, 18 Jan 95 21:24:39 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.6.9/keltia-uucp-1.21) id VAA04528 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:07:02 +0100 From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199501182007.VAA04528@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: Groff again To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:07:01 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier Robert) X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 887 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Sigh, Andrew commited something just before my patch :-) Here is the revised patch for the problem. Index: troffrc =================================================================== RCS file: /spare/FreeBSD-current/src/gnu/usr.bin/ngroff/tmac/troffrc,v retrieving revision 1.4 diff -u -r1.4 troffrc --- 1.4 1995/01/17 21:08:33 +++ troffrc 1995/01/18 20:04:07 @@ -21,11 +21,11 @@ .\" Set the hyphenation language to `us'. .\" Load hyphenation patterns from `hyphen.us' (in the tmac directory). .ie "\*[.T]"koi8-r" \{\ -.do hla us-ru -.do hpf hyphen.us-ru +.do hla us-ru +.do hpf hyphen.us-ru . \} .el \{\ -.do hla us -.do hpf hyphen.us +.do hla us +.do hpf hyphen.us . \} .\" Don't let blank lines creep in here. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 12:25:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA17421 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:25:40 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@Seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA17413 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:25:38 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.9/8.6.9.1) id NAA17287 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:25:24 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199501182025.NAA17287@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: ingres in 1.1.5.1R To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:25:24 -0700 (MST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 358 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Greetings! Has anyone built/used ingres under 1.1.5.1R? I'm curious as to why the "gcc 1" prerequisite... Was this to overcome a bug which was introduced in a particular gcc 2 (i.e. should it be interpreted as "DON'T use gcc 2.X.Y") which has/hasn't been "fixed" yet? Or, is it that ingres uses some obsoleted "features" of gcc 1? Thx, --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 12:34:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA18250 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:34:28 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA18226 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:34:19 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA19078; Wed, 18 Jan 95 21:34:05 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (WAA22415); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:39:41 +0100 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:39:41 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199501182139.WAA22415@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: wb - white board software - taste it Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I downloaded today about 12MB of whiteboard software from ee.lbl.gov. These binaries are about 4MB each (unstripped) and I put them together with a short README for the impatient and loaded them up to gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de:/pub/conferencing Look and see what FreeBSD-2.0 can (which Linux can't do ;-) --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD blues 2.1.0-Development FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #1: Wed Jan 18 10:42:31 1995 kuku@blues:/usr/src/sys/compile/BLUES i386 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 12:35:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA18344 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:35:32 -0800 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA18336 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:35:28 -0800 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id MAA06745; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:35:00 -0800 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199501182035.MAA06745@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: Groff Makefile in tmac To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 12:35:00 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501182013.VAA04723@keltia.frmug.fr.net> from "Ollivier Robert" at Jan 18, 95 09:13:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1342 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Please ignore my previous patch for the tmac/Makefile in ngroff... It was > not the best way to do it and the mail went out before I could correct it. > > We must test and create /usr/share/tmac/mdoc only once, not in the middle > of the loop of course... Makefile's in the /usr/src area should *NOT* being doing mkdir's, this is the job of mtree and the files in src/etc/mtree. DO NOT COMMIT THIS PATCH. > Index: Makefile > =================================================================== > RCS file: /spare/FreeBSD-current/src/gnu/usr.bin/ngroff/tmac/Makefile,v > retrieving revision 1.4 > diff -u -r1.4 Makefile > --- 1.4 1995/01/17 19:05:12 > +++ Makefile 1995/01/18 20:10:39 > @@ -34,6 +34,9 @@ > install -c -o ${TMACOWN} -g ${TMACGRP} -m ${TMACMODE} \ > temp ${DESTDIR}${TMACDIR}/$$f; \ > done > + if [ ! -d ${DESTDIR}${MDOCDIR} ]; then \ > + mkdir ${DESTDIR}${MDOCDIR}; \ > + fi > for f in ${MDOCFILES}; do \ > rm -f temp; \ > sed -f ${.CURDIR}/strip.sed ${.CURDIR}/$$f >temp; \ > > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net > FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 > -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Custom computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 13:09:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id NAA21746 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:09:25 -0800 Received: from gvr.win.tue.nl (root@gvr.win.tue.nl [131.155.210.19]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA21725 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:09:15 -0800 Received: by gvr.win.tue.nl (8.6.9/1.53) id WAA08789; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:08:12 +0100 From: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Message-Id: <199501182108.WAA08789@gvr.win.tue.nl> Subject: Re: DHCP and diskless support To: wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (Garrett Wollman) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:08:12 +0100 (MET) Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501172106.AA24916@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> from "Garrett Wollman" at Jan 17, 95 04:06:39 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 119 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Garrett Wollman wrote: > > No, this is a ``no, it is not a Microsoft invention.'' > Thank God > -GAWollman -Guido From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 13:47:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id NAA25422 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:47:14 -0800 Received: from snoopy.mv.com (snoopy.mv.com [199.125.64.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA25393 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 13:47:03 -0800 Received: (from pw@localhost) by snoopy.mv.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA01134; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:32:30 -0500 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:32:30 -0500 From: "Paul F. Werkowski" Message-Id: <199501182032.PAA01134@snoopy.mv.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: (julian@tfs.com) Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Julian" == Julian Elischer writes: >> >> >> Greetings, I have now a NEC 4Xi CDROM drive plugged into my >> FreeBSD 2.0 / Adapetec 1740A system. The problem is that the >> drive does not show up in the boot probe although everything >> else on the bus does as usual. I now have SCSI_DELAY=30 in >> config with no good results. Funny thing is that even the DOS >> SCSI driver doesn't report this thing - even though it also >> sees the other SCSI things. Even funnier is that a Corel >> package scanscsi.exe DOES see the stupid thing at the correct >> SCSI ID. The cute little diagnostic screen built into the drive >> things everything is in order. Julian> possibly it's not at LUN 0? maybe you need to probe some Julian> other LUN.. WHERE does the corel stuff find it? Corel finds it at targ 2 - all luns - that is when it finds it at all. The thing is seen only sometimes under conditions yet to be discovered. Also, the drive wants to swallow/eject a disk only sometimes. Thinking the drive was broken, I have returned same only to find that a new one has the same symptoms. Tying to get somewhere, I enabled SCSIDEBUG on targ 2 and got this result at probe. ... ahb0: reading board settings, int=11 ahb0 at 0x4000-0x4fff irq 11 on eisa ahb0 targ 0 lun 0: type 0(direct) fixed SCSI2 ahb0 targ 0 lun 0: sd0: 1008MB (2065250 total sec), 2372 cyl, 9 head, 96 sec, bytes/sec 512 probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_cmd probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_scsi_cmd probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): command: 0,0,0,0,0,0-[0 bytes] probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_cmd probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_scsi_cmd probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): command: 12,0,0,0,2c,0-[44 bytes] ------------------------------ 000: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 016: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 032: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ------------------------------ probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_scsi_cmd probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): command: 12,0,0,0,2c,0-[44 bytes] ------------------------------ 000: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 016: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 032: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ------------------------------ probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_scsi_cmd probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): command: 12,0,0,0,2c,0-[44 bytes] ------------------------------ 000: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 016: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 032: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ------------------------------ ahb0 targ 4 lun 0: type 1(sequential) removable SCSI1 ahb0 targ 4 lun 0: st0: WangDAT model 1300 is a known rogue st0: density code 0x13, drive empty ahb0 targ 5 lun 0: type 5(readonly) removable SCSI1 ahb0 targ 5 lun 0: cd0(ahb0:5:0): not ready cd0: could not get size cd0: drive empty aha0 not found at 0x330 ... Doing same with targ 5 shows a similar display except the 44 byte message has non-zero data in it. Does this mean the NEC is sending back a zero-filled message? Curiously, the Corel scanscsi program waits a lot longer on the NEC target before giving up than on truly empty slots. It is like there is something there but just not enough. >> What happened to the 'scsi' program on 1.1.5.1 that at least >> attempted to dicker with the devices a bit? Julian> It got left out by mistake.. (as did st(1)) it still Julian> compiles if you can get the sources.. I just added it to Julian> my source tree (makefile and all) and it works fine. if Julian> you can find the ID and LUN of the device, you may be able Julian> to use the scsi(1) program to specifically probe it into Julian> existence.. The code in the kernel will only probe LUN 0 Julian> unless something exists on 0 and indicates there may be Julian> other LUNs as well. I will attempt to revive that code and see what I can find. Thanks for the tip. Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 14:16:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA28660 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:16:28 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA28648 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:16:24 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id XAA19440 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:17:07 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA15687; Wed, 18 Jan 95 23:17:09 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.6.9/keltia-uucp-1.21) id XAA10706 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:03:12 +0100 From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199501182203.XAA10706@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: Patch ab for wu-archive ftp installs manpages as executables... To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:03:10 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier Robert) X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#288 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 3087 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The Makefile patch in patch-ab shows 755 as mode for manpages... Here a remplacement for patch-ab to fix that : We should probably try to compress /usr/local/man manpages... ports/net/wu-ftpd/patches/patch-ab ------------------------------------------------------------ *** Makefile.orig Fri Apr 1 21:03:58 1994 --- Makefile Tue Oct 18 18:45:08 1994 *************** *** 1,25 **** ! BINDIR= /usr/local/bin ! ETCDIR= /usr/local/etc ! MANDIR= /usr/local/man MANEXT= 8 all: @ echo 'Use the "build" command (shell script) to make ftpd.' @ echo 'You can say "build help" for details on how it works.' install: bin/ftpd bin/ftpcount bin/ftpshut -mv -f ${ETCDIR}/ftpd ${ETCDIR}/ftpd-old @echo Installing binaries. ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 bin/ftpd ${ETCDIR}/ftpd ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 bin/ftpshut ${BINDIR}/ftpshut ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 bin/ftpcount ${BINDIR}/ftpcount ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 bin/ftpwho ${BINDIR}/ftpwho @echo Installing manpages. ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 doc/ftpd.8 ${MANDIR}/man8/ftpd.8 ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 doc/ftpcount.1 ${MANDIR}/man1/ftpcount.1 ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 doc/ftpwho.1 ${MANDIR}/man1/ftpwho.1 ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 doc/ftpshut.8 ${MANDIR}/man8/ftpshut.8 ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 doc/ftpaccess.5 ${MANDIR}/man5/ftpaccess.5 ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 doc/ftphosts.5 ${MANDIR}/man5/ftphosts.5 ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 doc/ftpconversions.5 ${MANDIR}/man5/ftpconversions.5 ! install -o bin -g bin -m 755 doc/xferlog.5 ${MANDIR}/man5/xferlog.5 --- 1,26 ---- ! BINDIR= ${PREFIX}/bin ! ETCDIR= ${PREFIX}/etc ! MANDIR= ${PREFIX}/man MANEXT= 8 all: + /bin/sh build fb2 @ echo 'Use the "build" command (shell script) to make ftpd.' @ echo 'You can say "build help" for details on how it works.' install: bin/ftpd bin/ftpcount bin/ftpshut -mv -f ${ETCDIR}/ftpd ${ETCDIR}/ftpd-old @echo Installing binaries. ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 bin/ftpd ${ETCDIR}/ftpd ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 bin/ftpshut ${BINDIR}/ftpshut ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 bin/ftpcount ${BINDIR}/ftpcount ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 bin/ftpwho ${BINDIR}/ftpwho @echo Installing manpages. ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 doc/ftpd.8 ${MANDIR}/man8/ftpd.8 ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 doc/ftpcount.1 ${MANDIR}/man1/ftpcount.1 ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 doc/ftpwho.1 ${MANDIR}/man1/ftpwho.1 ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 doc/ftpshut.8 ${MANDIR}/man8/ftpshut.8 ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 doc/ftpaccess.5 ${MANDIR}/man5/ftpaccess.5 ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 doc/ftphosts.5 ${MANDIR}/man5/ftphosts.5 ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 doc/ftpconversions.5 ${MANDIR}/man5/ftpconversions.5 ! install -c -o bin -g bin -m 644 doc/xferlog.5 ${MANDIR}/man5/xferlog.5 ------------------------------------------------------------ -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 14:27:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA29994 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:27:25 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA29987 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:27:23 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id XAA19539 ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:28:17 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA15885; Wed, 18 Jan 95 23:28:18 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501182228.AA15885@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: Groff Makefile in tmac To: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com (Rodney W. Grimes) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:28:18 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501182035.MAA06745@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> from "Rodney W. Grimes" at Jan 18, 95 12:35:00 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 308 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Makefile's in the /usr/src area should *NOT* being doing mkdir's, this is > the job of mtree and the files in src/etc/mtree. OK. Remy and you are right. Sorry. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 14:40:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA02018 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:40:48 -0800 Received: from plains.NoDak.edu (tinguely@plains.NoDak.edu [134.129.111.64]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA01981 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 14:40:39 -0800 Received: by plains.NoDak.edu; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 16:39:43 -0600 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 16:39:43 -0600 From: Mark Tinguely Message-Id: <199501182239.AA16394@plains.NoDak.edu> To: gfoster@osmre.gov, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: st(1) command, Was: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk #include "hot_air.h" I am surprised that people aren't SCREAMING because st does report file/block information of a tape with "stat" command. --mark. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 15:27:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA06027 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:27:28 -0800 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [192.48.107.36]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA05965 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:25:36 -0800 Received: (from jhs@localhost) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id AAA10750; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:24:35 +0100 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:24:35 +0100 From: Julian Howard Stacey Message-Id: <199501182324.AAA10750@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: CVS stuff Reply-To: jhs@regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > From: John Beukema > It would make life a great deal easier for those of us overseas if the > English string messages could be isolated in a string table. Source code > could be commented and/or meaningful int #defines provided for debugging > (#define 11 BUSERR_COREDMP. err_msg[11] = "Bus err core dumped") > The set of English strings could be translated by anyone wishinbg to > internationalize a version just by setting an alternate string table. > Messages could be improved (in any language) by updating the string table. I spent most of a year in Summer 85 - Summer 86, automating the production of 7 European Languages, 2 machine architectures, & several op system releases, for a major Unix vendor. The `just' in `just by setting an alternate string table' is over-simplification, it's not exactly fun work either, If you (John) want to do this massive, never ending, rather boring job for free, I can only applaud your public spirit :-) If you seriously can devote the hundreds of hours to repetively editing the entire ever changing source tree, & have good internet access to enable you to personally do the tens of thousands of cvs updates splitting every .c into a .c & several .h (that will probably be necessary) Then IF all the above is true, AND if the core team are prepared to allow their OS development to be slowed, by periodic test, recompiles, updates, fixes in various languages ... IF THEN I guess the core team might be well advised to consider making facilities available to you, to enable the effort :-) Further, before one invest too much time worrying about mere Latin alphabet conversions, don't forget Cyrillic & Japanese Kanji, & 16 bit wchars etc :-) Personally I would only do it, IF a firm waved many large denomination $$ at me ! At which point I'd be delighted to, I might add :-) --- Julian Stacey , ( is a dial up ) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 15:50:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA06405 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:50:12 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA06399 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:50:11 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA03975; Wed, 18 Jan 95 16:43:51 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501182343.AA03975@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: charnier@lirmm.fr (Philippe Charnier) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 16:43:50 MST Cc: cacho@eureka.gdl.iteso.mx, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501181814.TAA20913@lirmm.lirmm.fr> from "Philippe Charnier" at Jan 18, 95 07:14:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Salut, Huh?!? What's that mean? 8-). ============================================================================ Hypothetical question an answer(s): ============================================================================ > >> Oh, and I'd be willing to work on the English, Japanese and French, and > >> if no one else wante to, German (and maybe Greek -- I'm very, very rusty). > >> > > I'd like to work on the Spanish translation of error messages, > >i have a lot of users and sysadmin-to-be guys that are unable to read > >english. > > After lot of translations I will be pleased to send to the world the > following mail: > > Something is wrong with my computer, I had the message: > > << Probleme materiel au demarrage : clavier absent > Appuyer sur une touche pour continuer >> > > Is there a hacker that can 1) speak french 2) help me? Since you are apparently an English speaker (since only the error message itself was in French and your complaint was not), could you reset (or unset) your locale so that we can see the English message so we can better help you? > NB : the french message says: > hardware failure on boot : no keyboard connected > press any key to continue PS: I know; that one was an easy read. PPS: That particular message is impossible, since you could not have set your locale information prior to actually booting. PPPS: Please contact your vendor; since your boot code has been localized, it was obviously supplied by someone other than the FreeBSD core team. They will be better equipped to handle problems you encounter using their code. PPPPS: Thank you for using FreeBSD. PPPPPS: If you are going to localize your machine, you should also localize your console and your mail program. For French, you would need an ISO8859-1 transfer encoding, and your console would actually produce left and right Guillemot insetad of '<<' and '>>'. ============================================================================ By the way, this problem already exists in the BIOS generated "no operating system" message. The idea of a translated message prior to getting into a user environment is a straw man. If designing the system all by myself, I'd probably include catalog indices as well... so a message might be: moose: 115: Command not found So any potential "helper" could look in their catalog for the 'moose' program and determine error message 115, if everything else went to hell. A person without the 'moose; catalog isn't a potential helper, since they don't even have the 'moose' program. Of course, your average English only person won't know if you said (translated for the hypothetical omnicient English reader): Help! I'm getting the error moose: 115: Command not found when I didn't expect it! OR Help! I not getting the error moose: 115: Command not found when I should be! Since the only readable portion of the message will continue to be the error, whether it's readable because of the catalog index or because we are lazy and only support error reporting in English. Having the error decipherable -- or straight readable -- doesn't help the reader understand the problem, since the error message is only part of the context. The generic soloution proposed thus far is "make everyone learn English". This probably won't go over well in France. It *doesn't* go over well in a lot of countries. All of this ignores the fact that this hypothetical non-English speaker is not going to be able to read the documentation that says Please send problem reports to questions@freebsd.org So you won't be getting email reporting problems anyway. Maybe if the person with the problem sent a MIME encapsulated message with an audio attachment. I'm told that if you speak French loudly and slowly enough, anyone can understand it. 8-) 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 15:50:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA06425 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:50:59 -0800 Received: from uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu (uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu [128.174.57.133]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA06419 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 15:50:58 -0800 Received: by uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu id AA11404 (5.67b/IDA-1.3.4 for hackers@freebsd.org); Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:50:44 -0600 Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:50:44 -0600 From: Terry Lee Message-Id: <199501182350.AA11404@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: No lost+found? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that FreeBSD doesn't create the lost+found directory for each UFS file system. Is this by design or an omission? It looks a little odd since I'm so used to expecting it. But I don't mind as long as it is harmless. Terry Lee terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 16:33:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id QAA09158 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 16:33:44 -0800 Received: from isl.cf.ac.uk (isl-gate.elsy.cf.ac.uk [131.251.22.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA09134; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 16:33:37 -0800 Received: (from paul@localhost) by isl.cf.ac.uk (8.6.9/8.6.9) id AAA02811; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:33:46 GMT From: Paul Richards Message-Id: <199501190033.AAA02811@isl.cf.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive To: jkh@freefall.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:33:45 +0000 (GMT) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de, babb@sedhps01.mdc.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <29570.790438865@freefall.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jan 18, 95 06:21:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 951 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who said > > Ok, would the respective parties involved try to get together on this > and provide a fix? I have no problem with disabling this again before > 2.1R, but I'd like to do it in a more INFORMED way this time! > Whacking features out of the system based on innuendo and hearsay is > hardly the proper approach, and some actual proof in concise form > (like you seem to have finally provided in your last message) is what > I need to settle this. Jim says it works, you say it doesn't, you > see how I might not enjoy being stuck in the middle of this! :-) Mine doesn't work. I get the same problems with "fdc0: ready for output in input:" errors during probe. -- Paul Richards, FreeBSD core team member. Phone: +44 1222 874000 x6646 (work), +44 1222 457651 (home) Dept. Mechanical Engineering, University of Wales, College Cardiff. Internet: paul@FreeBSD.org, JANET(UK): RICHARDSDP@CARDIFF.AC.UK From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 17:12:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA17650 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:12:59 -0800 Received: from isl.cf.ac.uk (isl-gate.elsy.cf.ac.uk [131.251.22.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA17642 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:12:57 -0800 Received: (from paul@localhost) by isl.cf.ac.uk (8.6.9/8.6.9) id BAA02956; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:11:47 GMT From: Paul Richards Message-Id: <199501190111.BAA02956@isl.cf.ac.uk> Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) To: bakul@netcom.com (Bakul Shah) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:11:47 +0000 (GMT) Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501181857.KAA24197@netcom5.netcom.com> from "Bakul Shah" at Jan 18, 95 10:57:40 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 963 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Bakul Shah who said > > You speak of English bias of mailing lists and Usenet but > the English bias of Unix etc. is much more pervasive. How > would one translate `cat', `sh', `uucp' etc. to other > languages? Without English language background these words > make _no_ sense. But it would be equally nonsensical to Hmm, interesting viewpoint :-) A cat is a small furry animal that has an annoying habit of sleeping on clothes that have just been ironed and you were hoping to wear out that night. `sh` is likely an abbreviation of what you generally say when you find the afore mentioned cat lying on your clothes. `uucp` obviously slipped into unix by mistake since it's clearly not English. -- Paul Richards, FreeBSD core team member. Phone: +44 1222 874000 x6646 (work), +44 1222 457651 (home) Dept. Mechanical Engineering, University of Wales, College Cardiff. Internet: paul@FreeBSD.org, JANET(UK): RICHARDSDP@CARDIFF.AC.UK From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 17:33:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA20348 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:33:33 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA20338 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 17:33:32 -0800 Received: from fedora.x.org by expo.x.org id AA07745; Wed, 18 Jan 95 20:32:49 -0500 Received: by fedora.x.org id AA19622; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:32:47 -0500 Message-Id: <9501190132.AA19622@fedora.x.org> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 18 Jan 1995 10:57:40 PST." <199501181857.KAA24197@netcom5.netcom.com> Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:32:47 EST From: Kaleb Keithley Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I'd rather see support for *inputting* and *displaying* >other languages first. You're using X aren't you? This is all built into X and has been since R5. Well, X still doesn't do bidirectional or vertical text very well. But before you can use what's built into X you need good locale support built into the C runtime and/or OS. I submitted a LATIN-1 LC_CTYPE file a while back. Work needs to be done to add other support for other locales/- languages/charsets. And after that you'll still need an input method. Implementing input-methods for your locale/language/character set is left as an exercise for the reader. Xlib has a built-in input method for the LATIN-1 alphabet, so at least it's not necessary to write one for most european users, which may only be a small consolation. ;-) -- Kaleb KEITHLEY From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 18:43:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA04526 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:43:23 -0800 Received: from is1.hk.super.net (jbeukema@is1.hk.super.net [202.14.67.232]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA04499 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 18:43:16 -0800 Received: by is1.hk.super.net id AA21236 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:42:14 +0800 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:42:13 +0800 (HKT) From: John Beukema To: jhs@regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: CVS stuff In-Reply-To: <199501182324.AAA10750@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 19 Jan 1995, Julian Howard Stacey wrote: > > From: John Beukema > > The `just' in `just by setting an alternate string table' > is over-simplification, it's not exactly fun work either, > > If you (John) want to do this massive, never ending, rather boring job > for free, I can only applaud your public spirit :-) > > > Further, before one invest too much time worrying about mere Latin alphabet > conversions, don't forget Cyrillic & Japanese Kanji, & 16 bit wchars etc :-) > > Personally I would only do it, > IF a firm waved many large denomination $$ at me ! > At which point I'd be delighted to, I might add :-) > > --- > Julian Stacey , > ( is a dial up ) > I think you are missing my point. I do not propose to do any translations of error messages unless I have the need for them. (Chinese would be helpful, however). To isolate the language dependent strings is good coding practice and most newer applications find it efficient in the long run. It is the same as defining constants instead of scatering 'magic numbers' in code. Messages can be changed as required. If someone needs Urdu messages, they can make their own string table and substitute it (or simplified Chinese, for that matter). Incidently, I like the "error 115 : File not found" approach. A customized shell version could bring up a help screen and present a page on error 115, if required. Although I will not volunteer to translate messages into 200 languages, I would be prepared to work on an English string table and move embedded messages from modules (a manageable number) to the string table. This would be a first step. jbeukema From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 19:30:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA10695 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:30:55 -0800 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA10688 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:30:48 -0800 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA03627 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:26:55 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Thu, 19 Jan 95 06:26:55 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id GAA01392; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:22:55 +0300 To: "FreeBSD Hackers' list" , Ollivier Robert References: <199501182013.VAA04723@keltia.frmug.fr.net> In-Reply-To: <199501182013.VAA04723@keltia.frmug.fr.net>; from Ollivier Robert at Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:13:57 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:22:54 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Groff Makefile in tmac Lines: 16 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 709 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199501182013.VAA04723@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Ollivier Robert writes: >Please ignore my previous patch for the tmac/Makefile in ngroff... It was >not the best way to do it and the mail went out before I could correct it. >We must test and create /usr/share/tmac/mdoc only once, not in the middle >of the loop of course... Wrong way, I already fix mtree in usr, mtree it and not make by Makefile. -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 19:31:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA10708 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:31:27 -0800 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA10702 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 19:31:22 -0800 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA03642 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:26:58 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Thu, 19 Jan 95 06:26:57 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id GAA01403; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:24:28 +0300 To: Remy CARD , roberto@blaise.ibp.fr Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org References: <199501182019.VAA11283@hebe.ibp.fr> In-Reply-To: <199501182019.VAA11283@hebe.ibp.fr>; from Remy CARD at Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:19:44 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:24:27 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Problem with new groff Lines: 15 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 625 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199501182019.VAA11283@hebe.ibp.fr> Remy CARD writes: >> >> On a 21-current, there is no /usr/share/tmac/mdoc directory and ``make >> install'' thus fails. > Hmmm, shouldn't etc/mtree/BSD.usr.dist be modified to create this >directory instead of modifying Makefiles ? I already do it yesterday, check supped sources. -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 20:17:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA11193 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:17:48 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA11187 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:17:43 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA14811; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:16:15 +1100 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:16:15 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501190416.PAA14811@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: davidg@Root.COM, olah@cs.utwente.nl Subject: Re: Netinet internals (Was: Patching a running kernel) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, wollman@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Indeed, rfc1122 does say "SHOULD"...which makes this behavior not required. >The problem with acking this often is that on high speed, half-duplex networks >like ethernet, the collision rate caused by acks this frequently can consume a >large amount of the banwidth (measured 10-20%). > In the 4.4-lite TCP code, the acks every 2 packets was indirectly caused by >limiting the window to 4K. This had exceptionally bad side effects on long, >slow, high latency connections that are typical on the internet and usually >resulted in connection thrashing (my terminology) - i.e. the connection becomes >bursty and unable to stream. Perhaps the behaviour should depend more on the type of the interface. Do you remember me old bug report about it not being possible to saturate both directions of a SLIP interface? The two sides take turns in queueing acks behind so many sends that the acks don't get through before the other side stops sending. How is this supposed to work? Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 20:25:31 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA11220 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:25:31 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA11214 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:25:29 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA05756; Wed, 18 Jan 95 21:19:05 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501190419.AA05756@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) To: paul@isl.cf.ac.uk (Paul Richards) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 21:19:04 MST Cc: bakul@netcom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501190111.BAA02956@isl.cf.ac.uk> from "Paul Richards" at Jan 19, 95 01:11:47 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > In reply to Bakul Shah who said > > > > You speak of English bias of mailing lists and Usenet but > > the English bias of Unix etc. is much more pervasive. How > > would one translate `cat', `sh', `uucp' etc. to other > > languages? Without English language background these words > > make _no_ sense. But it would be equally nonsensical to > > Hmm, interesting viewpoint :-) > > A cat is a small furry animal that has an annoying habit of sleeping on > clothes that have just been ironed and you were hoping to wear out that > night. > > `sh` is likely an abbreviation of what you generally say when you find the > afore mentioned cat lying on your clothes. > > `uucp` obviously slipped into unix by mistake since it's clearly not > English. Actually, when I suggest changes to handle this particular problem, I'm generally branded a nut. Mostly they have to do with achieving POSIX compatability in the library, necessitated by the terrible things I plot about doing to the file system name space, open, creat, chdir, stat, lstat, and unlink, etc. to allow utilities that depend on them to keep operating invariant under localization (note: not general rename). Personally, I don't see what's so objectionable about a varargs open. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 20:42:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA11296 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:42:54 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA11289; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:42:48 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA15205; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:39:43 +1100 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:39:43 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501190439.PAA15205@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-bugs@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com Subject: Re: Serious problems in drand48(). Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I have run the following program on a Pentium and a 386sx-16 with >no floating point co-processor. >Both times it reported that drand48() incorrectly returned a value >greater than 1.0. It works on thud and on my system (a 486DX2 with [lib]msun). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 20:48:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA11339 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:48:01 -0800 Received: from SIRIUS.COM (earth.sirius.com [140.174.229.4]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA11333 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:47:59 -0800 Received: from slip220.sirius.com by SIRIUS.COM (NX5.67e/NX3.14M) id AA09530; Wed, 18 Jan 95 20:47:35 -0800 Message-Id: <9501190447.AA09530@SIRIUS.COM> X-Sender: rsoles@sirius.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 20:53:32 -0800 To: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen), roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) From: rsoles@SIRIUS.COM (Roger L Soles) Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? Cc: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen), hackers@FreeBSD.org, terry@cs.weber.edu Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Samba is SMB (Server Message Blocks) over TCP/IP -- and Microsoft will be happy to give you a 32 Bit TCP/IP stack for WFWG -- just ftp it from there site (FTP.MICROSOFT.COM). NetBEUI is a brain dead transport... and since you'd probably use b-mode (simplistic) it'd eat your bandwidth up with it's broadcasts quick... If you want to talk to Unix, use TCP/IP -- WFWG supports it, it's a 0 K foot print for conventional memory, it's free, and it works... BTW: NetBIOS is an API, not a transport, not a file sharing protocol... At 08:02 AM 1/18/95 -0700, Jaye Mathisen wrote: >>>>>> "Ollivier" == Ollivier ROBERT writes: > > >> My understanding is that NetBEUI is rather simplistic, > >> non-routable, but it would be useful in communicating with PC's > >> running wfw that for some reason don't want TCP/IP. > > Ollivier> If you want ot share printers and disks, I'd suggest >(samba). > > >Samba won't solve the problem. Samba is NETBIOS over TCP/IP. I'm talking >a whole different protocol, NETBEUI, 'ala WFW/LanManager in it's simplest >form. > > //---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // Roger L Soles // PO Box 280785 // San Francisco, CA 94124-0785 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 21:16:21 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA11507 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:16:21 -0800 Received: from netcom8.netcom.com (bakul@netcom8.netcom.com [192.100.81.117]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA11501 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:16:20 -0800 Received: from localhost by netcom8.netcom.com (8.6.9/Netcom) id VAA00764; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:14:29 -0800 Message-Id: <199501190514.VAA00764@netcom8.netcom.com> To: Paul Richards cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 19 Jan 95 01:11:47 GMT." <199501190111.BAA02956@isl.cf.ac.uk> Date: Wed, 18 Jan 95 21:14:28 -0800 From: Bakul Shah Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I wrote: > the English bias of Unix etc. is much more pervasive. How > would one translate `cat', `sh', `uucp' etc. to other > languages? Without English language background these words > make _no_ sense. But it would be equally nonsensical to Paul Richard responds: > Hmm, interesting viewpoint :-) > A cat is a small furry animal that has an annoying habit of sleeping on > clothes that have just been ironed and you were hoping to wear out that > night. Just what do you do that wears out your clothes in a night? A date with a file? You English are weirder than I thought :-) But seriously, what I was getting at is that *ideally* one would want a native language interface to unix -- file names, commands, man pages, the whole thing. Except that some things just don't translate. One can have fun with silly translations but they would be much too obscure. Bakul From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 21:16:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA11517 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:16:48 -0800 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA11510 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:16:45 -0800 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id VAA07726; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:16:18 -0800 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199501190516.VAA07726@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: No lost+found? To: terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu (Terry Lee) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:16:18 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501182350.AA11404@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu> from "Terry Lee" at Jan 18, 95 05:50:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 554 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > It seems that FreeBSD doesn't create the lost+found directory for > each UFS file system. Is this by design or an omission? It looks a little > odd since I'm so used to expecting it. But I don't mind as long as it is > harmless. The error here is that newfs does not create lost+found, fsck will create it if it finds that it needs one. > Terry Lee > terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Custom computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 21:55:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA11762 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:55:30 -0800 Received: from crab.xinside.com (crab.xinside.com [199.120.247.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA11756 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 21:55:26 -0800 Received: (jdc@localhost) by crab.xinside.com (8.6.8/8.6.5) id WAA13990; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:51:52 -0700 From: Jeremy Chatfield Message-Id: <199501190551.WAA13990@crab.xinside.com> Subject: Re: is it hardware? To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (Christoph P. Kukulies) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:51:51 +0000 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501182114.WAA20475@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph P. Kukulies" at Jan 18, 95 10:14:42 pm Organization: X Inside Inc, P O Box 10774, Golden, CO 80401-0610, USA. Phone: +1(303)470-5302 Reply-To: jdc@crab.xinside.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2302 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Christoph P. Kukulies writes: ... > I'm running the X server of Xinside, Inc.. Pretty nice server > but while playing with wb (whiteboard) and scrolling a picture > the server died and the system was doing a bus error on every > cc invocation during making a kernel. I rebooted and the > core dumps had disappeared. But I had strange characters > in two included files (../../sys/queue.h had a ((ead) instead > of (head) in a macro and some other file was in error, > st2uct instead of struct. Some of you may be aware that our Server is configured to send email, by default, with a human readable stack trace and the configuration file in use... We have received the email from this event. There is no immediately obvious reason why the Server would fail in the function that died. Our first guess was that the machine might be a 486SX or similar no-FPU system, but that seems to be false. This leaves us with two likely candidates: + Something to do with 'wb' + Hey, it's just one of those strange things, y'know? Of the two, a 'wb' explanation is the preferred, since it is testable. Not, however, by us - until someone mails me the location of the programs. I deleted the email with the locations before I read this mail. > So I wonder when these files got corrupted. During sup? > What might be the cause for such instabilities? Memory? > ISA bus? VL Bus? On the basis of prior experience, we found that the proportion of inexplicable system failures dropped significantly when we switched to using UPS's on all machines. Under the category of "one of those strange things", count very short power supply interruptions. I'm not sure about your power supply company, but in the UK and the US, they don't count interruptions of below a couple of seconds. That is a delay long enough to cause most systems to reboot. If shorter, you may simply get a bad sag. At the other end, could you have received a spike in the voltage - are you near a Physics Lab, for example :-) Cheers, JeremyC. -- Jeremy Chatfield, +1(303)470-5302, FAX:+1(303)470-5513, email:jdc@xinside.com X Inside Inc, P O Box 10774, Golden, CO 80401-0610, USA. Commercial X Server - for more information please try these services http://www.xinside.com info@xinside.com ftp.xinside.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 22:57:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id WAA12160 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:57:04 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA12154 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 22:56:59 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.8/8.6.6) id BAA00363 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:54:52 -0500 From: Wankle Rotary Engine Message-Id: <199501190654.BAA00363@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Subject: More serial console stuff... To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:54:48 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 4218 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Okay, I think I'm almost ready to actually commit the serial console stuff to the boot blocks and kernel. ("Hide the kids! He's going to commit!") But I've got a couple small things I need to ask about before taking the plunge: First, there's one thing I always do to the boot blocks when I do an installation, which is to change the way 'unit' is calculated. Normally it says this: part = unit = 0; This always forces unit 0 to be the default, which screws up autobooting on my system because my root disk is unit 1 (wd1). The change I always make is: part = 0; unit = (drive & 0x7F); This automagically sets the unit to 0 or 1 accordingly. I've seen this bandied about on the newsgroups, but I've often wondered why it never became official. My guess is that this causes other problems that I'm not aware of (which are undoubtedly related to SCSI disks, which I don't have.) I'm tempted to sneak this in while I'm in the neighborhood, but first I want to find out if this hack was already rejected for a reason. Second, there are incidental problems involved with booting with a serial port as a console. For one thing, you have to remember to edit /etc/ttys properly before you bring the system up multi-user for the first time, or you won't get a login prompt. Newbies aren't likely to be able to figure this out, so I want to idiot-proof it for them. What I want to do is change the default /etc/ttys, but I'm not sure exactly how to go about it. I can either add another getty entry for 'ttyd0' or put a getty on 'console'. Each of these options has its own problems. The latter idea means turning off the getty on 'ttyv0,' otherwise there would be two gettys on the same terminal in the case where you boot in VGA console mode. The former costs you another getty process for a terminal device that might not be used at all (the newbie has to figure out how to turn it off too -- serial port questions galore). Putting a getty on 'console' is really the nice way to do it, but there are a few small complications: - the getty on /dev/ttyv0 has to go away. This means that if you boot from the VGA console but force the kernel to use a serial console, ttyv0 winds up missing in action. Fixing it is simple: you just need to edit /etc/ttys to suit your system, but again: newbies ahoy. - the default terminal type can't be 'cons25' and 'vt100' (or whatever) at the same time. Leave it set to cons25, and booting from a VT-100 terminal doesn't work quite right. Make it vt100, and syscons gives you grief. SunOS has the same problem and there really isn't a fix: it's up to the user/admin to edit /etc/ttys (/etc/ttytab in SunOS) to take care of this. All aboard the newbie express. - ps and w get confused (w especially): I don't know how many of you have noticed this, but if you actually edit /etc/ttys and replace 'ttyv0' with 'console' (which should be allowed), ps still says that your tty is 'v0' (it should say 'co'). w gets into trouble too, with the result being that it fails to show the commands being run by the user on the console because it can't match 'co' (which it gets from utmp) with any active terminal devices. I haven't even begun to look into the cause of this. Lobotomizing the kernel seems unavoidable. ("You're on a bus hacking at 50 miles an hour and you're trying to juggle a dozen different system configuration details at once. If you mess one of them up, the newbies start pestering you with questions. What do you do? WHAT DO YOU DO?!" :) Anyway, I'm rambling. Quick summary: why the hardcoded unit number in the boot blocks, and does anyone have any suggestions about how to deal with /etc/ttys? -Bill -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~T~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Møøse Illuminati: ignore it and be confused, or join it and be confusing! ~~~~~~~~ FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #0: Fri Jan 13 22:04:07 EST 1995 ~~~~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 23:11:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id XAA12221 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:11:02 -0800 Received: from vmbb.cts.com (vmbb.cts.com [192.188.72.18]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id XAA12215 for ; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:11:00 -0800 Received: from io.cts.com by vmbb.cts.com with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #9) id m0rUr11-0000PoC; Wed, 18 Jan 95 23:10 PST Received: (from root@localhost) by io.cts.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id XAA17491 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:05:55 -0800 From: Morgan Davis Message-Id: <199501190705.XAA17491@io.cts.com> Subject: Adding Web Browser Components To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:05:55 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1122 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've got Netscape 1.0N running on 2.1d here and it's working fairly well. It's actually quite a bit faster than the Windows and Mac versions. I'm about to present to the Internet Business Conference in San Diego next week and I'm wondering just how feesible it will be to run FreeBSD as a Netscape platform there. The components I'm missing are tools to play sounds and videos. Can anyone point me in the right direction for fortifying my FreeBSD box with the best au format sound player and MPEG video viewer? And, how does one configure those .*cap files in your home directory to point to them? Finally, is there a QuickTime video player the runs under FreeBSD? How about a CU-SeeMe client for X-Windows? (Sorry to be posting this to hackers -- for some reason my requests to be added to freebsd-questions just don't seem to be accepted. JKH: About two weeks ago when the majordomo problems arose, you said resubmit and I'll authorize, but nothing yet. Requested address was local-freebsd-questions@cts.com. Have been trying to get on since December. Got onto hackers and announce with no problems, though). From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Jan 18 23:52:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id XAA12688 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:52:53 -0800 Received: from shrike.cis.co.za (shrike.cis.co.za [196.2.16.14]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA12682; Wed, 18 Jan 1995 23:52:46 -0800 Received: (from justin@localhost) by shrike.cis.co.za (8.6.9/8.6.9) id LAA00252; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:58:49 +0200 From: Justin Benade Message-Id: <199501190958.LAA00252@shrike.cis.co.za> Subject: Help To: questions@FreeBSD.org Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:58:48 +0000 (SAT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 498 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have recently installed FreeBSD 2.0 on one of my machines, now I need to migrate all the users from another FreeBSD box to the new one. The problem is the old box is FreeBSD 1.1.5 and the password file does not work with 2.0. Is there any way of fixing this with out upsetting all the users. I have copied the passwd and master.passwd file accross, but the passwords dont work. Any help would really be appreciatted. Thanking you Justin E-mail: justin@cis.co.za justin@csir.co.za From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 00:31:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA13180 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:31:54 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA13174 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:31:45 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA00238; Thu, 19 Jan 95 09:31:23 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (KAA25561); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:36:59 +0100 Message-Id: <199501190936.KAA25561@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: is it hardware? To: jdc@crab.xinside.com Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:36:58 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com (user alias) In-Reply-To: <199501190551.WAA13990@crab.xinside.com> from "Jeremy Chatfield" at Jan 18, 95 10:51:51 pm From: Christoph Kukulies Reply-To: Christoph Kukulies X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 3243 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Christoph P. Kukulies writes: > ... > > I'm running the X server of Xinside, Inc.. Pretty nice server > > but while playing with wb (whiteboard) and scrolling a picture > > the server died and the system was doing a bus error on every > > cc invocation during making a kernel. I rebooted and the > > core dumps had disappeared. But I had strange characters > > in two included files (../../sys/queue.h had a ((ead) instead > > of (head) in a macro and some other file was in error, > > st2uct instead of struct. Looking at ther errors I got in files r -> 2, h -> ( leads me to this side calculation: OK hex 72 emit r 72 2 base ! . 1110010 hex 32 emit 2 32 2 base ! . 110010 hex 28 emit ( 28 2 base ! . 101000 hex 68 2 base ! . 1101000 bye and to the conclusion that bit 6 was flipped in either case. Cache? I'll try to get my cache changed. > > Some of you may be aware that our Server is configured to send email, > by default, with a human readable stack trace and the configuration > file in use... We have received the email from this event. There is Now I'm aware, too :-) How many mails does Xinside, Inc. receive that way daily? ;-) > no immediately obvious reason why the Server would fail in the > function that died. Our first guess was that the machine might be a > 486SX or similar no-FPU system, but that seems to be false. > > This leaves us with two likely candidates: > > + Something to do with 'wb' > > + Hey, it's just one of those strange things, y'know? > > Of the two, a 'wb' explanation is the preferred, since it is testable. > Not, however, by us - until someone mails me the location of the > programs. I deleted the email with the locations before I read this > mail. > > > So I wonder when these files got corrupted. During sup? > > What might be the cause for such instabilities? Memory? > > ISA bus? VL Bus? > > On the basis of prior experience, we found that the proportion of > inexplicable system failures dropped significantly when we switched > to using UPS's on all machines. Under the category of "one of those > strange things", count very short power supply interruptions. I'm > not sure about your power supply company, but in the UK and the US, > they don't count interruptions of below a couple of seconds. That is > a delay long enough to cause most systems to reboot. If shorter, you > may simply get a bad sag. At the other end, could you have received > a spike in the voltage - are you near a Physics Lab, for example :-) Though I'm in a physics lab our power is very stable (despite of some announced outages once or twice per year) - power is very constant in Europe anyway compared to the US due to the Energie Verbundsystem. > > Cheers, JeremyC. > -- > Jeremy Chatfield, +1(303)470-5302, FAX:+1(303)470-5513, email:jdc@xinside.com > X Inside Inc, P O Box 10774, Golden, CO 80401-0610, USA. > Commercial X Server - for more information please try these services > http://www.xinside.com info@xinside.com ftp.xinside.com > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD blues 2.1.0-Development FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #1: Wed Jan 18 10:42:31 1995 kuku@blues:/usr/src/sys/compile/BLUES i386 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 00:35:24 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA13246 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:35:24 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA13240 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:35:21 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA00263; Thu, 19 Jan 95 09:35:06 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (KAA25571); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:40:43 +0100 Message-Id: <199501190940.KAA25571@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: sup sites To: jhs@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (Julian Howard Stacey) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:40:42 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com (user alias) In-Reply-To: <199501182204.XAA06938@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> from "Julian Howard Stacey" at Jan 18, 95 11:04:57 pm From: Christoph Kukulies Reply-To: Christoph Kukulies X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 599 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > > I'm doing so already for a while (since 2.0 is out). Give me a few hours > > to look into it and make it available publicly. > > Great ! :-) > > Julian Stacey > gil is supping now into /home/FreeBSD-current. supserv is also running since the days of the (SID suffering) cvs-1.x days. :-) I will try a sample supfile today and make that public. --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD blues 2.1.0-Development FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #1: Wed Jan 18 10:42:31 1995 kuku@blues:/usr/src/sys/compile/BLUES i386 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 01:02:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id BAA13666 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:02:07 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA13656 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:01:10 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA06058; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:01:34 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id KAA12677 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:01:34 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id JAA22796; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:30:16 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501190830.JAA22796@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: mail lossage To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:30:15 +0100 (MET) X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 593 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Wondering why i didn't get much mail from -hackers on tuesday, i finally found that one of the mail relays before sax.sax.de decided to segfault their SMTP daemon, causing lotta bounced mail. I've already reconstructed the -hackers' part from freefall's archive, but if anyone out there sent me private mail which bounced, please resend it. sorry for misusing the list... -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 01:07:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id BAA13711 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:07:59 -0800 Received: from crab.xinside.com (crab.xinside.com [199.120.247.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA13704 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:07:49 -0800 Received: (jdc@localhost) by crab.xinside.com (8.6.8/8.6.5) id CAA14730; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:04:02 -0700 From: Jeremy Chatfield Message-Id: <199501190904.CAA14730@crab.xinside.com> Subject: Re: is it hardware? To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:04:02 +0000 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501190936.KAA25561@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph Kukulies" at Jan 19, 95 10:36:58 am Organization: X Inside Inc, P O Box 10774, Golden, CO 80401-0610, USA. Phone: +1(303)470-5302 Reply-To: jdc@crab.xinside.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 4804 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Christoph Kukulies writes: > > Some of you may be aware that our Server is configured to send email, > > by default, with a human readable stack trace and the configuration > > file in use... We have received the email from this event. There is > > Now I'm aware, too :-) How many mails does Xinside, Inc. receive that > way daily? ;-) The quantity varies, significantly. BSDI have a contract with us to supply the X Server for BSD/OS. BSD/OS 1.1 was missing some kernel support for the X Server. Fail to install the patch that we supplied, and the X Server will die at OSsvc+0x01ee (or somewhere round there). Now start the Server from xdm. We had 680 messages from one site in a matter of hours, before the system administrator noticed that the Server was not starting up properly... Normally, we see problems where the user has misconfigured the Server (e.g. ignoring our Xsetup tool and manually editing the file, specifying that you want 1024x768 on a monitor that can only do 640x480). About once a week, we see a problem that we have not already diagnosed and fixed (we send messages to people that have a problem that we have fixed, telling them where we have the patch, or what to alter in config files to avoid the problem). We try to follow up each of these oddball problems, though many are irreproducible. In 1.2Beta/2, we could not reproduce a problem involving a particular Server failure in a font handling function. We realised the cause when we asked a second user that developed the problem and from then on, rapidly traced the cause to something in xmcd. This and a few other instances would have been impossible to find using normal reporting methods. > > On the basis of prior experience, we found that the proportion of > > inexplicable system failures dropped significantly when we switched > > to using UPS's on all machines. Under the category of "one of those > > strange things", count very short power supply interruptions. I'm > > not sure about your power supply company, but in the UK and the US, > > they don't count interruptions of below a couple of seconds. That is > > a delay long enough to cause most systems to reboot. If shorter, you > > may simply get a bad sag. At the other end, could you have received > > a spike in the voltage - are you near a Physics Lab, for example :-) > > Though I'm in a physics lab our power is very stable (despite of some > announced outages once or twice per year) - power is very constant > in Europe anyway compared to the US due to the Energie Verbundsystem. Last time I checked, the UK was still reasonably close to Europe. I was, at one time, a University Lecturer (equivalent to a Professor, to you Yankees). I did a study on control systems in the electricity supply industry. The UK voltage was nominally 240VAC. The Central Electricity Generating Board normally maintained 250VAC, with excursions up to 253VAC permitted... Most American hardware companies produce power supplies that are 110/220VAC. Most power supplies have about 10% tolerance. 220VAC+10% ~= 242VAC, which would mean that a true 240VAC supply would be safe. A 250VAC main supply exceeds tolerances and cause shortened power supply life and often results in power supply variations being propogated. Later, working as a troubleshooter for a computer company, I found that one Banks' computers were crashing overnight, almost every night. The local electricity company denied any power outage. A line monitor revealed that every night, between 2am and 3am, there was a 2 second power supply interruption. This was eventually traced to an operating procedure at the local electricity provider; the customer bought a UPS and was much happier. Further investigation revealed that very short outages, that would not significantly affect a fridge or fan, are considered normal practice in the electricity industry, in the UK and the US at least, and are not counted as an outage. Then, working in Switzerland, porting an application to a bank of machines, I had similar unpredictable power supply variations... So Germany may be ahead of the Swiss in this technology... or the nearby factory with it's heavy welding equipment my have been responsible. So, before you claim a nice power supply, make sure that you don't have people striking arcs on welding torches, and so on. It's amazing what they do to a power supply. You might not get an outage, but you'll get dreadful sag and a lot of spiky noise. Cheers, JeremyC. -- Jeremy Chatfield, +1(303)470-5302, FAX:+1(303)470-5513, email:jdc@xinside.com X Inside Inc, P O Box 10774, Golden, CO 80401-0610, USA. Commercial X Server - for more information please try these services http://www.xinside.com info@xinside.com ftp.xinside.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 01:12:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id BAA13785 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:12:33 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA13778 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 01:12:22 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id KAA22531 ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:13:12 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA17551; Thu, 19 Jan 95 10:13:14 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501190913.AA17551@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: No lost+found? To: terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu (Terry Lee) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:13:13 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501182350.AA11404@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu> from "Terry Lee" at Jan 18, 95 05:50:44 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 485 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > It seems that FreeBSD doesn't create the lost+found directory for > each UFS file system. Is this by design or an omission? It looks a little > odd since I'm so used to expecting it. But I don't mind as long as it is > harmless. When you'll have a crash, fsck will create the lost+found directory itself and expand it as necessary. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 02:01:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id CAA15100 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:01:15 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA15090 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:01:13 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id LAA23261 ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:02:05 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA17818; Thu, 19 Jan 95 11:02:06 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501191002.AA17818@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components To: root@io.cts.com (Morgan Davis) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:02:06 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501190705.XAA17491@io.cts.com> from "Morgan Davis" at Jan 18, 95 11:05:55 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 396 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk For .au files, you'll need to configure Netscape to cat the file to /dev/audio. > Finally, is there a QuickTime video player the runs under FreeBSD? > How about a CU-SeeMe client for X-Windows? For QT files, you have xanim in ports/graphics/xanim. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 02:11:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id CAA15303 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:11:39 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA15288; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:10:41 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id LAA23392 ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:11:12 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA17841; Thu, 19 Jan 95 11:11:13 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501191011.AA17841@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: Help To: justin@shrike.cis.co.za (Justin Benade) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:11:13 +0100 (MET) Cc: questions@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501190958.LAA00252@shrike.cis.co.za> from "Justin Benade" at Jan 19, 95 11:58:48 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 459 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > file does not work with 2.0. Is there any way of fixing this > with out upsetting all the users. I have copied the passwd and > master.passwd file accross, but the passwords dont work. After copying the master.passwd file, just do a pwd_mkdb -p /etc/master.passwd with a 2.0 binary of pwd_mkdb of course. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 02:33:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id CAA15512 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:33:52 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id CAA15501 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:33:35 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA26606 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:11:13 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA13454; 19 Jan 95 04:09:34 CST (Thu) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id EAA13451; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:09:34 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199501191009.EAA13451@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) To: kaleb@x.org (Kaleb Keithley) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:09:33 -0600 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <9501190132.AA19622@fedora.x.org> from "Kaleb Keithley" at Jan 18, 95 08:32:47 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 156 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Has "vi" been updated to the point where it will display y with dieresis instead of 0xff When you enter "y in Xterm? It doesn't in 1.1.5.1. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 02:34:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id CAA15529 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:34:22 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id CAA15519 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:34:08 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA26690 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:19:56 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA13762; 19 Jan 95 04:18:52 CST (Thu) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id EAA13759; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:18:51 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199501191018.EAA13759@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components To: root@io.cts.com (Morgan Davis) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:18:50 -0600 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501190705.XAA17491@io.cts.com> from "Morgan Davis" at Jan 18, 95 11:05:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 710 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The components I'm missing are tools to play sounds and videos. Can > anyone point me in the right direction for fortifying my FreeBSD box > with the best au format sound player and MPEG video viewer? And, how > does one configure those .*cap files in your home directory to point > to them? Netscape and Mosaic both look for "mpeg_play" to play mpegs already. Mosaic will play .au files directly if you have a /dev/audio. I don't know about Netscape. > Finally, is there a QuickTime video player the runs under FreeBSD? *supposedly* the latest Xanim will handle this. See the Xanim home page http://www.portal.com/~podlipec/home.html for more info. I haven't had time to build up the new Xanim yet. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 02:46:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id CAA15852 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:46:05 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA15845 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 02:45:57 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id LAA23754 ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:46:44 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA17955; Thu, 19 Jan 95 11:46:45 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501191046.AA17955@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:46:45 +0100 (MET) Cc: root@io.cts.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501191018.EAA13759@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Jan 19, 95 04:18:50 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 275 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > for more info. I haven't had time to build up the new Xanim yet. I did build it but I've no QT animations to test it with :-) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 03:17:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA16449 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 03:17:53 -0800 Received: from shrike.cis.co.za (shrike.cis.co.za [196.2.16.14]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA16441; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 03:17:46 -0800 Received: (from justin@localhost) by shrike.cis.co.za (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA01219; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:23:56 +0200 From: Justin Benade Message-Id: <199501191323.PAA01219@shrike.cis.co.za> Subject: Help - password files To: questions@FreeBSD.org Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:23:56 +0000 (SAT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 504 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Is there a way of copying the password file accross from a FreeBSD 1.1.5 system to a 2.0 system, and fixing the problem I installed 2.0 on one of my systems and now wnat to migrate all the users over to it from the 1.1.5 system. The problem is that 2.0 does not recognise the passwords when entered. Is there a way of fixing this, with out having to change the password of every single user. This could really irritate them. Thanking you. Justin E-mail: justin@cis.co.za or justin@csir.co.za From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 04:00:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id EAA17891 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:00:29 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA17883 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:00:27 -0800 Received: from fedora.x.org by expo.x.org id AA18754; Thu, 19 Jan 95 06:59:41 -0500 Received: by fedora.x.org id AA20024; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:59:40 -0500 Message-Id: <9501191159.AA20024@fedora.x.org> To: Peter da Silva Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:09:33 CST." <199501191009.EAA13451@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:59:40 EST From: Kaleb Keithley Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Has "vi" been updated to the point where it will display > > y with dieresis > >instead of > > 0xff > >When you enter "y in Xterm? > >It doesn't in 1.1.5.1. I don't know how you get vi to even display 0xff when you enter compose"y, If I have a ydiaeresis key on my keyboard, which I can get by using xmodmap, e.g. 'xmodmap -e "keysym F6 = ydiaeresis"', then I have no trouble at all with vi. Ironically I don't even seem to need cs8 on the tty, which I would've thought I'd have needed, but you definitely need -istrip. But adding keys with xmodmap is far from ideal, in fact it's pretty ugly. It might be tolerable for writing exclusively in German, Spanish, or Italian, which only have a few extra characters, but it's out of the question for French and maybe the Scandinavian languages. What's even uglier is that xterm hasn't been internationalized yet, so it will pass compose sequences straight through, although I think it silently swallows the compose key. If xterm were internationalized then I'm confident that compose sequences would work fine, because xterm would intercept the compose sequence and send the composed character through to the application. It's not that hard to add i18n to xterm, several people have done it, and there are a couple of variants like hterm and kterm that might suffice, if nothing else as models for adding i18n to xterm. Note that for you'll also need ISO8859-1 locale support for X i18n to work, which neither 1.1.5.1 nor 2.0 have, unless you used the LC_CTYPE file I posted here a while ago, or got it from -current. -- Kaleb KEITHLEY From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 04:07:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id EAA18195 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:07:26 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA18180 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:07:20 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA27279 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 05:47:08 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA14936; 19 Jan 95 05:41:26 CST (Thu) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA14933; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 05:41:24 -0600 Message-Id: <199501191141.FAA14933@bonkers.taronga.com> X-Authentication-Warning: bonkers.taronga.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Morgan Davis Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 19 Jan 95 02:55:58 PST." <199501191055.CAA18304@io.cts.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.4.1 7/21/94 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 05:41:21 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Morgan Davis asked where to get mpeg_play... /usr/local/src on bonkers.taronga.com? OK, I'll copy it over to freefall in /a/pds/mpeg_play.tar.gz. I don't know where the original is from. I don't think it took any porting. > > Mosaic will play .au files directly if you have a /dev/audio. I don't > > know about Netscape. > In fact, if you save a .au file to /dev/audio, it tries to stream it > to your sound card in real-time. That's a bug in Netscape, then, if it tries to write it as it's coming in. Mosaic buffers the whole thing first. If the xanim in ports/graphics is the same one that was in 1.1 it's pretty damn old. Robert Ollivier adds: > I did build it but I've no QT animations to test it with :-) http://bvp.wdp.com/BVPM/PressRoom/LionKing/LionKing.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 04:33:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id EAA18450 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:33:28 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA18441 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:33:24 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA27499 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:15:34 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA15372; 19 Jan 95 06:14:25 CST (Thu) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA15369; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:14:24 -0600 Message-Id: <199501191214.GAA15369@bonkers.taronga.com> X-Authentication-Warning: bonkers.taronga.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Kaleb Keithley Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 19 Jan 95 06:59:40 EST." <9501191159.AA20024@fedora.x.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.4.1 7/21/94 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:14:08 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm using the X11R5 server, not X11R6 (which I understand is somewhat harder to light when it comes to I18N though supposedly it'll be a lot more functional when it's all done). Xterm in X11R5 handles compose just fine, or else the server's hiding compose from Xterm. I have RightCtl set to Compose in Xconfig. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 05:10:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id FAA19244 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 05:10:02 -0800 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA19238 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 05:10:01 -0800 Received: from fedora.x.org by expo.x.org id AA19162; Thu, 19 Jan 95 08:09:15 -0500 Received: by fedora.x.org id AA20072; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:09:13 -0500 Message-Id: <9501191309.AA20072@fedora.x.org> To: Peter da Silva Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:14:08 CST." <199501191214.GAA15369@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:09:13 EST From: Kaleb Keithley Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I'm using the X11R5 server, not X11R6 (which I understand is somewhat harder >to light when it comes to I18N though supposedly it'll be a lot more functional >when it's all done). Xterm in X11R5 handles compose just fine, or else the >server's hiding compose from Xterm. Oh. XFree86 2.x had a hack in Xlib to do compose processing. The hack buried the real i18n support built in to R5. XFree86 2.x compose processing should look to xterm and vi just like a single keystroke, just like my xmodmap example. I dunno, on 1.1.5.1 I get 'ydiaeresis' in vi, not "0xff". There must be something else at work here. -- Kaleb KEITHLEY From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 06:32:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA21474 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:32:17 -0800 Received: from styx.ibmoto.com (styx.ibmoto.com [129.38.252.14]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA21468 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:32:11 -0800 Received: from bartling.ibmoto.com (bartling.ibmoto.com [129.38.33.7]) by styx.ibmoto.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA03667; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:31:19 -0600 From: Steve Bartling Received: (bartling@localhost) by bartling.ibmoto.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id IAA22856; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:31:18 -0600 Message-Id: <199501191431.IAA22856@bartling.ibmoto.com> Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:31:17 -0600 (CST) Cc: root@io.cts.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501191141.FAA14933@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Jan 19, 95 05:41:21 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1073 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I attempted to access /a/pds/mpeg_play.tar.tgz on freefall..... I get 550 /a: No such file or directory Could you put it where we can get it by anonymous ftp ? Thanks, Steve Bartling P.S. Or could someone point me to another source ? > > Morgan Davis asked where to get mpeg_play... > > /usr/local/src on bonkers.taronga.com? > > OK, I'll copy it over to freefall in /a/pds/mpeg_play.tar.gz. I don't know > where the original is from. I don't think it took any porting. > > > > Mosaic will play .au files directly if you have a /dev/audio. I don't > > > know about Netscape. > > > In fact, if you save a .au file to /dev/audio, it tries to stream it > > to your sound card in real-time. > > That's a bug in Netscape, then, if it tries to write it as it's coming in. > Mosaic buffers the whole thing first. > > If the xanim in ports/graphics is the same one that was in 1.1 it's pretty > damn old. > > Robert Ollivier adds: > > I did build it but I've no QT animations to test it with :-) > > http://bvp.wdp.com/BVPM/PressRoom/LionKing/LionKing.html > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 06:32:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA21484 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:32:54 -0800 Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA21478 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:32:47 -0800 Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA04223; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 14:31:06 GMT Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 14:31:04 +0000 (GMT) From: Doug Rabson To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: VM/buffer problems Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk After seeing the VM/buffer stuff go in and not having rebuilt my kernel since Dec 4, I decided it was about time for an upgrade, so I duly supped myself up to date and made world before building a new kernel. All was fine, it seemed until I tried to run X. X ran up fine and I started a copy of lucid emacs and started trying to do some work, running a compile. Unfortunately, the machine froze solid about 30secs later. I have no idea what happened and the kernel didn't dump a core. I have DDB in the kernel, so it may have been stopped in DDB but since the graphics card wasn't in text mode at the time, I wouldn't have seen it. Before running X, I had been doing a bit of I/O intensive stuff (make clean). and after, there would have been quite a bit of NFS traffic. I am a bit stumped now. I have gone back to my old kernel so that I can get some work done but I suppose I might be able to catch something by starting a build under X and quickly swapping back to another console to see if DDB says anything. -- Doug Rabson, RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 71 251 4411 FAX: +44 71 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 06:52:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA21689 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:52:43 -0800 Received: from sbstark.cs.sunysb.edu (sbstark.cs.sunysb.edu [130.245.1.47]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA21683 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 06:52:42 -0800 Received: from starkhome.UUCP (root@localhost) by sbstark.cs.sunysb.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with UUCP id JAA00226 for FreeBSD.org!freebsd-hackers; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:22:32 -0500 Received: by starkhome.cs.sunysb.edu (8.6.9/1.34) id IAA03406; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:24:11 -0500 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:24:11 -0500 From: starkhome!gene@sbstark.cs.sunysb.edu (Gene Stark) Message-Id: <199501191324.IAA03406@starkhome.cs.sunysb.edu> To: Paul Richards In-reply-to: Paul Richards's message of Thu, 19 Jan 1995 00:33:45 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: Colorado 250 Tape Drive Cc: freefall.cdrom.com!jkh@sbstark.cs.sunysb.edu (Jordan K. Hubbard), uriah.sax.de!joerg_wunsch@sbstark.cs.sunysb.edu, sedhps01.mdc.com!babb@sbstark.cs.sunysb.edu, FreeBSD.org!freebsd-hackers@sbstark.cs.sunysb.edu Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Mine doesn't work. I get the same problems with "fdc0: ready for >output in input:" errors during probe. I get the same errors during probe. I use both the floppies and the tape drive anyway (and happily, I might add). - Gene From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 07:32:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA22275 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 07:32:33 -0800 Received: from plains.NoDak.edu (tinguely@plains.NoDak.edu [134.129.111.64]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA22267 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 07:32:28 -0800 Received: by plains.NoDak.edu; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:32:05 -0600 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:32:05 -0600 From: Mark Tinguely Message-Id: <199501191532.AA17284@plains.NoDak.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: FYI Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Since some/most of you would never lower yourself to reading the "rag" Jan 16, InfoWorld (page 104), I want to inform you of the half page article on Linix titled: "Linix Unix can't really be called commerical; let's brand it underware" The train of thought of the article never goes anywhere (other than bringing in underware, wedgie comments). It does have hints of what goes on during installation when done by non-geeks. One comment was the million questions asked during the installation of Slackware (a personal peeve of Slackware), another comment was on the poor/nonexistance documentation (hmmmm, that sounds familar, did FreeBSD ever fill the DocMaster position yet?). Though the article does not say too much, it is good feedback from a non-believer that can help us too. And besides Pammy didn't do much exciting this week -- oh, neither did Robert Cringely. --mark. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 07:45:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA22588 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 07:45:41 -0800 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA22582 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 07:45:38 -0800 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA12912 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:38:49 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Thu, 19 Jan 95 18:38:47 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id SAA01408; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:33:27 +0300 To: Kaleb Keithley , Peter da Silva Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com References: <199501191009.EAA13451@bonkers.taronga.com> In-Reply-To: <199501191009.EAA13451@bonkers.taronga.com>; from Peter da Silva at Thu, 19 Jan 1995 04:09:33 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:33:27 +0300 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.31 FreeBSD] From: "Andrew A. Chernov, Black Mage" X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) Lines: 23 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 669 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199501191009.EAA13451@bonkers.taronga.com> Peter da Silva writes: >Has "vi" been updated to the point where it will display > y with dieresis >instead of > 0xff >When you enter "y in Xterm? You needs: setenv ENABLE_STARTUP_LOCALE setenv LANG .ISO8859-1 For look in /etc/rc, after it vi must display it properly. -- Andrew A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 08:09:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA23639 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:09:08 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA23488 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:03:09 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA26553; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:02:10 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id RAA14719 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:02:09 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id QAA27743; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:53:07 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501191553.QAA27743@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: serial consoles and keyboard probes To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:53:07 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <199501190105.BAA02928@isl.cf.ac.uk> from "Paul Richards" at Jan 19, 95 01:05:03 am X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 812 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Paul Richards wrote: | | Well, sysinstall hopes all the world's a cons25 :-) | | I suspect it will work ok since it uses ncurses, it just might not look | very pretty. Someone will have to try it though to be sure. That's what i would like to point out. The install stuff now needs to deal properly with different terminal types. The current single user shell doesn't -- it always bites me since most of my machines run pcvt which is vt100-compatible. Hmm, sysinstall runs standalone, i.e. it doesn't even invoke a single-user shell. Hell, where does it get its TERM variable from? -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 08:16:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA24999 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:16:39 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA24986 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:16:33 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA07240; Thu, 19 Jan 95 09:10:17 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501191610.AA07240@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? To: rsoles@SIRIUS.COM (Roger L Soles) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 9:10:17 MST Cc: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501190447.AA09530@SIRIUS.COM> from "Roger L Soles" at Jan 18, 95 08:53:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > NetBEUI is a brain dead transport... and since you'd probably use > b-mode (simplistic) it'd eat your bandwidth up with it's broadcasts > quick... > > If you want to talk to Unix, use TCP/IP -- WFWG supports it, it's a > 0 K foot print for conventional memory, it's free, and it works... And if you already have a network of 500 machines and 5 servers, all using the NETBEUI transport, then you will probably want to put it on your machine instead of reconfiguring the 500 clients and wasting yet more of their limited 640k of memory (TCP/IP is fatter -- one thing brain-dead buys you is skinny). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 08:34:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA25720 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:34:01 -0800 Received: from bigdipper.umd.edu (bigdipper.umd.edu [128.8.220.139]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA25714 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:33:59 -0800 Received: (from adhir@localhost) by bigdipper.umd.edu (8.6.8/8.6.6) id LAA11474; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:33:31 -0500 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:33:31 -0500 (EST) From: "Alok K. Dhir" To: Ollivier ROBERT cc: Morgan Davis , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components In-Reply-To: <9501191002.AA17818@blaise.ibp.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 19 Jan 1995, Ollivier ROBERT wrote: > For QT files, you have xanim in ports/graphics/xanim. Speaking of ports/graphics, what happened to it!? -------------------------------------___--------------------------------- | Al Dhir, Programmer Analyst /___\ UMCP Ag-Engineering Dept | | Internet: adhir@bigdipper.umd.edu (o o) (301) 405-1197 | ---------------------------------ooO-(_)-Ooo----------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 08:46:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA25910 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:46:17 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA25904 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 08:46:16 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA07299; Thu, 19 Jan 95 09:40:03 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501191640.AA07299@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... To: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (Wankle Rotary Engine) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 9:40:02 MST Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501190654.BAA00363@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> from "Wankle Rotary Engine" at Jan 19, 95 01:54:48 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > First, there's one thing I always do to the boot blocks when I do an > installation, which is to change the way 'unit' is calculated. Normally > it says this: > > part = unit = 0; > > This always forces unit 0 to be the default, which screws up autobooting > on my system because my root disk is unit 1 (wd1). The change I always > make is: > > part = 0; > unit = (drive & 0x7F); > > This automagically sets the unit to 0 or 1 accordingly. I've seen this > bandied about on the newsgroups, but I've often wondered why it never > became official. My guess is that this causes other problems that I'm > not aware of (which are undoubtedly related to SCSI disks, which I don't > have.) I'm tempted to sneak this in while I'm in the neighborhood, but > first I want to find out if this hack was already rejected for a reason. Actually, I've wondered about this very change. The other thing is that you can grab the part as well, although you have to hack 3 places for it. The size change is small (about +18 bytes). I'd also like to see the drive info for 0x80 and 0x81 passed from the bios. This is basically two function calls and stack pushes for each to do the deed in the second stage boot. This should be well under the size limitations, although it will interfere with MACH or NetBSD booting unless you hack it a little differently. To pass the extra data another way is, I think, 8 more bytes on top of that. Note that the function to be called already exists, you just need to do the anding later instead of sooner. Since it isn't already called many places, this shouldn't be an issue. The under 640k area, I am unsure about. In point of fact, you could obtain this information from the BIOS data area, if you had established a mapping. It's tempting to keep the lower 640k unadulterated for at least the first boot, until it can be copied off for use by a kernel based DOS emulator and a VM86() interface. You would want a copy in any case because of the possibility of crashing the emulator by a badly behaved program going off in the weeds, and the need to reset it. Another compelling reason is the ability to run multiple emulators and ultiple VM86() interfaces by putting them in seperate logical address spaces. The space is not actually wasted, since it's added back into the memory pool post-load. This does, however, push up the minimum boot size to 2M (I used to boot a stripped 386BSD kernel with no net in 640k just to point at it to annoy the UnixWare people who wouldn't let me do radical surgery on SVR4 to reduce it's memory requirements). There is some question as to whether or not you'd want to boot a kernel into the lower 640k if you could. Having a large portion of the kernel in loadable modules makes it more likely that you would want to do this, since it greatly increases the possibility of an initial image size of less than 640k. The load above 1M is a result of the initial contiguity requirements on the kernel image that spanned the 640k boundry. > Second, there are incidental problems involved with booting with a serial > port as a console. For one thing, you have to remember to edit /etc/ttys > properly before you bring the system up multi-user for the first time, or > you won't get a login prompt. Newbies aren't likely to be able to > figure this out, so I want to idiot-proof it for them. What I want to do > is change the default /etc/ttys, but I'm not sure exactly how to go > about it. I can either add another getty entry for 'ttyd0' or put a getty > on 'console'. Each of these options has its own problems. With a headless system, I think it makes sense to redirect the ttyv0 major/minor accesses to the serial port driver (and cause virtual consoles with getty's on them to be redirected to a hnging open that is interruptable with a signal, as if DCD were not present on a device the was configured for modem control). This neatly auto-enables the logins on the console and simultaneously takes care of the respwaning issues of a getty on a null device. I wouldn't mess with the console driver itself, in that case, since it is now unnecessary (it defaults to ttyv0 which points to your serial port). The console could still be redirected to an X console program on someone's X terminal. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 09:02:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA26074 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:02:46 -0800 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA26067 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:02:35 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA28354; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:00:54 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.9/8.6.9-s1) with UUCP id SAA14981 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:00:54 +0100 Received: by bonnie.tcd-dresden.de (8.6.8/8.6.6) id RAA28150; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:40:54 +0100 From: j@uriah.sax.de (J Wunsch) Message-Id: <199501191640.RAA28150@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:40:53 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <199501190654.BAA00363@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> from "Wankle Rotary Engine" at Jan 19, 95 01:54:48 am X-Phone: +49-351-8141 137 Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1019 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Wankle Rotary Engine wrote: | | | Second, there are incidental problems involved with booting with a serial | port as a console. For one thing, you have to remember to edit /etc/ttys | properly before you bring the system up multi-user for the first time, or | you won't get a login prompt. ... | Putting a getty on 'console' is really the nice way to do it, but | there are a few small complications: It is said that it's not a good idea to enable a getty on /dev/console. We would need some install-time or /etc/rc-time automagic that auto-enables the getty on tty00 in /etc/ttys if the systems happens to run a serial console. Perhaps cons.c should emit some string that identifies on which console the system is running; this could be later looked up with dmesg and a bit of sed magic. -- cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 09:04:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA26144 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:04:55 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA26138 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:04:53 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id SAA29070 ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:05:27 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA19257; Thu, 19 Jan 95 18:05:28 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501191705.AA19257@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components To: adhir@bigdipper.umd.edu (Alok K. Dhir) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:05:28 +0100 (MET) Cc: root@io.cts.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Alok K. Dhir" at Jan 19, 95 11:33:31 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 367 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > For QT files, you have xanim in ports/graphics/xanim. > > Speaking of ports/graphics, what happened to it!? SUP ports or ports-graphics again, there have been a major reorganization in the port collection last week. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 09:23:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA26409 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:23:39 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA26403 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:23:38 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA07426; Thu, 19 Jan 95 10:17:31 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501191717.AA07426@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: No lost+found? To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 10:17:30 MST Cc: terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501190913.AA17551@blaise.ibp.fr> from "Ollivier ROBERT" at Jan 19, 95 10:13:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > When you'll have a crash, fsck will create the lost+found directory > itself and expand it as necessary. One of the points of the lost+found directory being there in the first place is that it must have a particular inode number (root is inode 2, lost+found is inode 3). Another point of having it precreated is that it comes preinitialized to 8k (16k in the file system I recently worked on for USL, since the directory entry blocks were twice the size), is that there *will* be room to put the entries to recover it. In other words, you don't *want* fsck to have to allocate a potentially non-existant free inode, make a directory entry in / (potentitally allocating a non-existant free free block to add the name to the end of the / directory contents), and allocate more potentially non-existant free blocks to extend the lost+found directory as files are recovered. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 09:33:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA26491 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:33:09 -0800 Received: from grendel.csc.smith.edu (grendel.csc.smith.edu [131.229.64.23]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA26485 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 09:33:08 -0800 Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by grendel.csc.smith.edu (8.6.5/8.6.5) id MAA10834; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:32:58 -0500 From: jfieber@cs.smith.edu (John Fieber) Message-Id: <199501191732.MAA10834@grendel.csc.smith.edu> Subject: Re: sup getting sig 10's? To: pete@pelican.pelican.com (Pete Carah) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:32:57 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Pete Carah" at Jan 19, 95 09:03:40 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 586 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Pete Carah writes: > Is freefall's sup server getting sig 10's (or worse?)? I'm getting > very consistent partial sup responses this morning: Don't know about sup, but the web server (httpd) recently started dumping core, logfiles report death by SIGBUS. Its now running under inetd because it wouldn't stay up reliably as a standalone. Maybe freefall is a little ill? I gather sendmail went off into la-la-land recently too. -john === jfieber@cs.smith.edu ================================================ =================================== Come up and be a kite! --K. Bush === From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 10:01:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA26719 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:01:44 -0800 Received: from SIRIUS.COM (earth.sirius.com [140.174.229.4]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA26707 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:01:42 -0800 Received: from slip208.sirius.com by SIRIUS.COM (NX5.67e/NX3.14M) id AA17322; Thu, 19 Jan 95 10:01:13 -0800 Message-Id: <9501191801.AA17322@SIRIUS.COM> X-Sender: rsoles@sirius.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:07:07 -0800 To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) From: rsoles@SIRIUS.COM (Roger L Soles) Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? Cc: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Perhaps NetBEUI is smaller is total size, but it bites your low memory -- TCP/IP can be run on windows machines as VXD without impacting low memory. Also, if you've got 500 machines running b-mode NetBEUI (the most likely for people who know not what they're doing) you've got problems... At 09:10 AM 1/19/95 MST, Terry Lambert wrote: >> NetBEUI is a brain dead transport... and since you'd probably use >> b-mode (simplistic) it'd eat your bandwidth up with it's broadcasts >> quick... >> >> If you want to talk to Unix, use TCP/IP -- WFWG supports it, it's a >> 0 K foot print for conventional memory, it's free, and it works... > >And if you already have a network of 500 machines and 5 servers, all >using the NETBEUI transport, then you will probably want to put it on >your machine instead of reconfiguring the 500 clients and wasting yet >more of their limited 640k of memory (TCP/IP is fatter -- one thing >brain-dead buys you is skinny). > > > Terry Lambert > terry@cs.weber.edu >--- >Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present >or previous employers. > > //---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // Roger L Soles // PO Box 280785 // San Francisco, CA 94124-0785 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 10:20:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA26907 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:20:46 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA26901 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:20:44 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id TAA29955 ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:21:30 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA19507; Thu, 19 Jan 95 19:21:31 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501191821.AA19507@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: No lost+found? To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:21:30 +0100 (MET) Cc: terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501191717.AA07426@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Jan 19, 95 10:17:30 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#287 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 421 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > One of the points of the lost+found directory being there in the first > place is that it must have a particular inode number (root is inode 2, > lost+found is inode 3). I know that but I suppose that fsck takes 3 as inode for lost+found (haven't looked at the code yet). -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 10:43:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA27257 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:43:23 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA27251 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:43:14 -0800 Received: from masi.ibp.fr (root@masi.ibp.fr [132.227.60.23]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id TAA00450 ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:43:54 +0100 Received: from hebe.ibp.fr (card@hebe.ibp.fr [132.227.64.34]) by masi.ibp.fr (8.6.9/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id TAA01455 ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:42:55 +0100 From: Remy.Card@masi.ibp.fr (Remy CARD) Received: by hebe.ibp.fr (8.6.9/jtpda-5.0) id TAA14163 ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:40:15 +0100 Message-Id: <199501191840.TAA14163@hebe.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: No lost+found? To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:40:14 +0100 (MET) Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501191821.AA19507@blaise.ibp.fr> from "Ollivier ROBERT" at Jan 19, 95 07:21:30 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 630 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > One of the points of the lost+found directory being there in the first > > place is that it must have a particular inode number (root is inode 2, > > lost+found is inode 3). > > I know that but I suppose that fsck takes 3 as inode for lost+found (haven't > looked at the code yet). Well, on my system, inode #3 on / is allocated to /stand and inode #3 on /usr is allocated to /usr/mdec. So, I suppose that fsck cannot re-use these numbers for /lost+found. > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG > FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 > Remy From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 11:50:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA28025 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:50:11 -0800 Received: from uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu (uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu [128.174.57.133]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA28019 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:50:09 -0800 Received: by uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu id AA02726 (5.67b/IDA-1.3.4 for hackers@freebsd.org); Thu, 19 Jan 1995 13:49:52 -0600 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 13:49:52 -0600 From: Terry Lee Message-Id: <199501191949.AA02726@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: 2.0 disk anomalies Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've noticed that occasionally, the final disk sync during shutdown will fail ("gives up"). This happens whether I was using wd or sd disks. Has anyone else noticed this? Also, when fsck is performed during boot (because the system was not properly shut down before), the system does not reboot itself even if the root partition had fsck errors. Is this by design? Thanks. Terry Lee terry@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 12:03:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA28100 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:03:12 -0800 Received: from indigo.csci.csusb.edu (indigo.csci.csusb.edu [139.182.38.28]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA28094 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:03:09 -0800 Received: by indigo.csci.csusb.edu (931110.SGI/930416.SGI) for hackers@freebsd.org id AA13393; Thu, 19 Jan 95 11:19:34 -0800 From: nwestfal@indigo.csci.csusb.edu (Neal Westfall) Message-Id: <9501191919.AA13393@indigo.csci.csusb.edu> Subject: fdformat bug To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:19:34 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 825 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I seem to have a problem with fdformat. Every time it formats and verifies a track I get an error message that says "biodone: buffer already done". This is with the Jan. 15 snapshot and a -current kernel from Jan. 17. Disklabeling it is no problem, but when I newfs the floppy it reports that there is no MBR on the disk. However it still works and I can mount and use the floppy. Typically what I do is the following: fdformat fd0.1440 disklabel -w -r /dev/fd0a fd1440 newfs fd0a mount /dev/fd0a /mnt -- # $Id: dot.signature,v 1.0 1995/01/16 12:08:35 nwestfal Exp $ Neal Westfall nwestfal@csci.csusb.edu FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #1: Mon Jan 16 11:57:24 1995 root@darkside.csci.csusb.edu:/usr/src/sys/compile/DARKSIDE CPU: i486DX (486-class CPU) Id = 0x435 Origin = "GenuineIntel" From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 12:45:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA28491 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:45:59 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA28485 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:45:58 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA29581; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:45:32 -0500 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:45:32 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501192045.AA29581@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: Terry Lee Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: 2.0 disk anomalies In-Reply-To: <199501191949.AA02726@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu> References: <199501191949.AA02726@uivlsi.csl.uiuc.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > Also, when fsck is performed during boot (because the system was not > properly shut down before), the system does not reboot itself even if > the root partition had fsck errors. Is this by design? Thanks. Yes. It doesn't need to. (It didn't need to before, either, but now this has been designed into the system. Took long enough.) -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 12:53:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA28643 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:53:35 -0800 Received: from rz-wb.fh-sw.de (rz-wb.fh-sw.de [192.129.23.111]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA28624 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:50:41 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by rz-wb.fh-sw.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id VAA01973; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:46:01 +0100 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:46:01 +0100 (MET) From: Michael Reifenberger To: Neal Westfall cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: fdformat bug In-Reply-To: <9501191919.AA13393@indigo.csci.csusb.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 19 Jan 1995, Neal Westfall wrote: > I seem to have a problem with fdformat. Every time it formats and verifies > a track I get an error message that says "biodone: buffer already done". > This is with the Jan. 15 snapshot and a -current kernel from Jan. 17. Besides the biodone messages seems fdformat not to work for 1.72MB floppies. > > Disklabeling it is no problem, but when I newfs the floppy it reports that > there is no MBR on the disk. However it still works and I can mount and > use the floppy. Typically what I do is the following: To make newfs silent you have to do: disklabel -w -B /dev/rfd0.1440 fd1440 ^^To write the MBR. Bye! .... Michael Reifenberger From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 12:56:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA28686 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:56:41 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA28680 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:56:40 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA04126; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:55:59 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) cc: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen), hackers@FreeBSD.org, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 18 Jan 95 15:25:57 +0100." <9501181425.AA13556@blaise.ibp.fr> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 12:55:58 -0800 Message-ID: <4125.790548958@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk My problem with SAMBA is that it's not a DOS solution, just a Windows solution. I need both. Any suggestions? :) Jordan > > My understanding is that NetBEUI is rather simplistic, non-routable, but > > it would be useful in communicating with PC's running wfw that for some > > reason don't want TCP/IP. > > If you want ot share printers and disks, I'd suggest looking at > samba. > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG > FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 15:02:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA02626 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:02:20 -0800 Received: from inet-gw-3.pa.dec.com (inet-gw-3.pa.dec.com [16.1.0.33]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA02620 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:02:18 -0800 Received: from muggsy.lkg.dec.com by inet-gw-3.pa.dec.com (5.65/10Aug94) id AA29801; Thu, 19 Jan 95 14:56:48 -0800 Received: from whydos.lkg.dec.com by muggsy.lkg.dec.com (5.65/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) with SMTP id AA23275; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:52:28 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by whydos.lkg.dec.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA01673 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:57:29 GMT Message-Id: <199501191857.SAA01673@whydos.lkg.dec.com> X-Authentication-Warning: whydos.lkg.dec.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 19 Jan 1995 10:07:07 PST." <9501191801.AA17322@SIRIUS.COM> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.5omega 10/6/94 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:57:28 +0000 From: Matt Thomas Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Perhaps NetBEUI is smaller is total size, but it bites your low > memory -- TCP/IP can be run on windows machines as VXD without > impacting low memory. As does NETBEUI in Workgroup for Windows. Most of the support for NETBEUI already exists in FreeBSD in the netccitt directory. NETBEUI is little more than LLC2 (ISO 8802.2 Class 2) with SMB running over it. LLC2 is really LAPB slightly hacked to works over LANs. netccitt already has the LAPB engine, someone needs to add in the LAN support (as well as getting the right hooks in ethersubr). However, you could implement LLC2 in user space using the Berkeley packet filter and then steal lots of Samba's code. Even better would be separate out the "transport" specific elements of Samba so you can plug in either the RFC1001/RFC1002 TCP support or the LLC2/NETBEUI support. Matt Thomas Internet: matt@lkg.dec.com U*X Networking WWW URL: http://ftp.dec.com/%7Ethomas/ Digital Equipment Corporation Disclaimer: This message reflects my Littleton, MA own warped views, etc. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 15:16:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA03203 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:16:53 -0800 Received: from tfs.com (mailhub.tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA03196 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 15:16:52 -0800 Received: by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 15:16 PST From: julian@tfs.com (Julian Elischer) To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: ddd Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk someone recently mentionned a program similar to ddd anyone have pointers? (ftp sites etc.) also looking for one for ddd to.. (gotta work out how to use archie one of these days!) julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 16:07:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id QAA00874 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:07:56 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA00868 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:07:55 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA04385 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:07:56 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: New kernel now running on freefall Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:07:55 -0800 Message-ID: <4384.790560475@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This should fix some of the sig 10's and 11's that were occuring (Bruce's fix). This includes the web server.. Please let me know if you have any troubles.. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 16:09:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id QAA00927 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:09:36 -0800 Received: from snoopy.mv.com (snoopy.mv.com [199.125.64.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA00907 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:09:24 -0800 Received: (from pw@localhost) by snoopy.mv.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA01416; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:31:37 -0500 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:31:37 -0500 From: "Paul F. Werkowski" Message-Id: <199501192331.SAA01416@snoopy.mv.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Q. How can you recognize a pioneer? A. He's one with the arrows sticking out of his a^H but. It may be true that the NEC 4Xi is the first SCSI device to hit FreeBSD-land that actually returns XS_BUSY status to the Inquire command. The immediate problem is that this gets into a code branch in scsi_base.c that looks like this: case XS_BUSY: /*should somehow arange for a 1 sec delay here (how?) */ /* XXX tsleep(&localvar, priority, "foo", hz); that's how! */ case XS_TIMEOUT: /* * If we can, resubmit it to the adapter. */ if (xs->retries--) { xs->error = XS_NOERROR; xs->flags &= ~ITSDONE; goto retry; This seems to result in rapidly depleting the retry count (2) on probe and not finding the drive. Questions: 1. What the hell to do to correctly process the BUSY status. The SCSI-II draft spec says try again later but maybe some device specific thing has to happend to un-busy the thing. 2. Does tsleep work during probe conditions? I tried it and it seemed to have no effect. DELAY did seem to slow things down a bit although it never got a non-busy status in 3 attempts with 10 second delays. 3. Does the re-probe feature work? (eg scsi -f /dev/sd0d -r -t2 -l0) On this system I see an eventual response to the inquire command but the 1740A board seems confused by the time it gets it. Any SCSI experts make sense of this? probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_cmd I think this is test_unit_ready probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_scsi_cmd adapter gets called probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_done adapter finished probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_done 'done' processing gets called probe0(ahb0:2:0): command: 0,0,0,0,0,0-[0 bytes] <= result < long wait > ahb0: board not responding <= from ahb_poll ahb0: board not responding <= ditto abort failed in wait probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_cmd I think this is inquiry probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_scsi_cmd probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_done probe0(ahb0:2:0): command: 12,0,0,0,2c,0-[44 bytes] ------------------------------ 000: 05 80 02 02 1f 00 00 00 4e 45 43 20 20 20 20 20 <=== looks like ok data 016: 43 44 2d 52 4f 4d 20 44 52 49 56 45 3a 35 30 31 <=== 032: 32 2e 32 20 32 20 32 20 32 20 32 20 <=== ------------------------------ < long wait > ahb0: board not responding cmd fail ahb0: board not responding abort failed in wait # Any enlightened observations would be more than welcome. Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 16:09:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id QAA00950 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:09:58 -0800 Received: from netcom4.netcom.com (bakul@netcom4.netcom.com [192.100.81.107]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA00940 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:09:56 -0800 Received: from localhost by netcom4.netcom.com (8.6.9/Netcom) id QAA11575; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 16:08:52 -0800 Message-Id: <199501200008.QAA11575@netcom4.netcom.com> To: julian@tfs.com (Julian Elischer) cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: ddd In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 19 Jan 95 15:16:00 PST." Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 16:08:51 -0800 From: Bakul Shah Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > someone recently mentionned a program similar to ddd It is called team. > anyone have pointers? (ftp sites etc.) > also looking for one for ddd to.. ddd: comp.sources.unix: volume 15, Issue 84 team: comp.sources.unix: volume 27, Issue 195 On gatekeeper.dec.com:pub/usenet/comp.sources.unix/volume15/ddd.Z volume27/team/part01 ftp.uu.net als has these archives. There may be others. > (gotta work out how to use archie one of these days!) Type just `archie' to see available options. It can take a while retrieving matches so you will need to be patient. xarchie is easier to use (it will also allow you ftp by clicking on retrieved filenames but unlike ncftp it does not maintain file creation dates). Bakul From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 17:19:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA07506 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:19:35 -0800 Received: from relay2.UU.NET (relay2.UU.NET [192.48.96.7]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA07497 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:19:33 -0800 Received: from news.cs.utexas.edu by relay2.UU.NET with SMTP id QQxzkv15273; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:19:21 -0500 Received: from mail.cs.utexas.edu (root@mail.cs.utexas.edu [128.83.139.10]) by news.cs.utexas.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA04981; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:18:39 -0600 Received: from uudell.us.dell.com (uudell.us.dell.com [143.166.224.6]) by mail.cs.utexas.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA16758; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:18:31 -0600 Received: from obiwan by uudell.us.dell.com (5.67/dns1.3) with UUCP id AA11292; Fri, 20 Jan 95 01:15:33 GMT Received: by obiwan.uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0rV7Yi-00030WC; Thu, 19 Jan 95 18:50 CST Message-Id: From: obiwan!bob@uudell.us.dell.com (Bob Willcox) Subject: Re: ddd To: julian@tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 18:50:36 -0600 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Julian Elischer" at Jan 19, 95 03:16:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 558 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Julian Elischer wrote: > > someone recently mentionned a program similar to ddd > > anyone have pointers? (ftp sites etc.) > also looking for one for ddd to.. > (gotta work out how to use archie one of these days!) I have used a program called team. Works similar to ddd but is more flexible. The version I have came from comp.unix.sources volume27. -- Bob Willcox ...!{rutgers|ames}!cs.utexas.edu!uudell!obiwan!bob Austin, TX or try: @uudell.us.dell.com:obiwan!bob 512-258-4224 (home), 512-838-3914 (work) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 17:21:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA07873 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:21:14 -0800 Received: from SIRIUS.COM (earth.sirius.com [140.174.229.4]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA07856 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:21:11 -0800 Received: from slip221.sirius.com by SIRIUS.COM (NX5.67e/NX3.14M) id AA01356; Thu, 19 Jan 95 17:19:51 -0800 Message-Id: <9501200119.AA01356@SIRIUS.COM> X-Sender: rsoles@sirius.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:25:47 -0800 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) From: rsoles@SIRIUS.COM (Roger L Soles) Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? Cc: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen), hackers@FreeBSD.org, terry@cs.weber.edu Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk SAMBA is a Unix solution. It implements SMB file sharing protocol on top of TCP/IP transport for a Unix server (SMB is the standard which MS LAN Manager, IBM LAN Server, MS Net, Xenix Net, etc use). If you have the LAN Manager client for DOS (free download from Microsoft), and a DOS TCP/IP stack with NetBIOS interface (all DOS stacks I know of implement a NetBIOS interface) it will work just fine... For Windows, the complete solution is free, since Microsoft also has a free TCP/IP stack for Windows. If you could find a NetBEUI transport for Unix (never heard of one), and you wanted to munge SAMBA to talk to the transport (SAMBA uses BSD Sockets, and is wed to TCP/IP) you could make it work using NetBEUI on your DOS/Windows machine. At 12:55 PM 1/19/95 -0800, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: >My problem with SAMBA is that it's not a DOS solution, just a Windows >solution. I need both. Any suggestions? :) > > Jordan > >> > My understanding is that NetBEUI is rather simplistic, non-routable, but >> > it would be useful in communicating with PC's running wfw that for some >> > reason don't want TCP/IP. >> >> If you want ot share printers and disks, I'd suggest looking at >> samba. >> -- >> Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG >> FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 > > > //---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // Roger L Soles // PO Box 280785 // San Francisco, CA 94124-0785 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 17:41:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA11058 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:41:49 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA11031 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:41:38 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA00248; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:35:35 -0500 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:35:35 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501200135.AA00248@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: Matt Thomas Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? In-Reply-To: <199501191857.SAA01673@whydos.lkg.dec.com> References: <9501191801.AA17322@SIRIUS.COM> <199501191857.SAA01673@whydos.lkg.dec.com> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < said: > As does NETBEUI in Workgroup for Windows. Most of the support for NETBEUI > already exists in FreeBSD in the netccitt directory. NETBEUI is little more > than LLC2 (ISO 8802.2 Class 2) with SMB running over it. LLC2 is really LAPB > slightly hacked to works over LANs. netccitt already has the LAPB > engine, someone needs to add in the LAN support (as well as getting the > right hooks in ethersubr). You mean like: wollman@khavrinen(753)$ pwd /usr/src/sys/netccitt wollman@khavrinen(754)$ ls llc* llc_input.c llc_output.c llc_subr.c~ llc_var.h llc_input.c~ llc_subr.c llc_timer.c ? Or is there something more? (I suspect so, since the existing LLC2 code only talks to the X.25 code.) -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 17:42:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA11110 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:42:39 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA11088 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:42:26 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA15283; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 12:39:58 +1100 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 12:39:58 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501200139.MAA15283@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, j@uriah.sax.de Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >| Second, there are incidental problems involved with booting with a serial >| port as a console. For one thing, you have to remember to edit /etc/ttys >| properly before you bring the system up multi-user for the first time, or >| you won't get a login prompt. ... You do? /dev/ttyd0 should work together with a serial /dev/console almost as well as /dev/ttyv0 works with a screen+keyboard console. The main difficulty is that the kernel part of the serial console is unaffected by stty's on /dev/ttyd0 (or equivalently, on the serial /dec/console). >It is said that it's not a good idea to enable a getty on /dev/console. There is no reason to (/dev/console is equivalent to the physical console as far as children of login can tell) and there are reasons not to (bugs). >We would need some install-time or /etc/rc-time automagic that >auto-enables the getty on tty00 in /etc/ttys if the systems happens to >run a serial console. Perhaps cons.c should emit some string that For syscons the opposite might be preferable, especially now that consoles are allocated on demand and have scrollback: keep /dev/ttyv0 for single user shells, console messages and debugging, and never run a getty on it. This would cost a little memory, especially with a large scrollback buffer, but scrollback is more valuable if console messages are not mixed up with normal output. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 17:44:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA11325 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:44:58 -0800 Received: from netcom4.netcom.com (bakul@netcom4.netcom.com [192.100.81.107]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA11313 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:44:55 -0800 Received: from localhost by netcom4.netcom.com (8.6.9/Netcom) id RAA23680; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 17:43:55 -0800 Message-Id: <199501200143.RAA23680@netcom4.netcom.com> To: Kaleb Keithley cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: Internationalization (was Re: CVS stuff) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 18 Jan 95 20:32:47 EST." <9501190132.AA19622@fedora.x.org> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 17:43:53 -0800 From: Bakul Shah Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >I'd rather see support for *inputting* and *displaying* > >other languages first. > You're using X aren't you? This is all built into X and has been since > R5. Well, X still doesn't do bidirectional or vertical text very well. I am using X but, as you later point out, it does not provide complete support. Also, IMHO this should be available outside of X (perhaps limited to displaying fixed width glyphs). Input/output methods support needs to be factored out so that one doesn't have to drag around all of X. > But before you can use what's built into X you need good locale support > built into the C runtime and/or OS. To my inexpert eyes what is done in Plan 9 in this area seems like a perfectly reasonable way to extend the libraries/OS. Plan 9 uses UTF-8 (invented(?) by Ken Thompson). It is an 8-bit encoding of UNICODE which is ASCII compatible. Non-ASCII chars use multi-byte sequences. It may be easier to extend tools like grep/sed/perl etc. to understand UTF-8. (Also, by definition, all ASCII data is UTF-8 compatible!). What you lose in UTF is random-access: if A is an array of chars, A[i] is not the nth UNICODE char due to the multibyte encoding. If this is a real problem, one can use a decode UTF8 to UTF16 or UNICODE and use short/long for incore representation of each char. I also think that in a text processing app. one will typically have some higher level structure for indexing so this is not a great problem. To repeat, I am not an expert -- there may be better solutions. It is just that UTF-8 would satisfy my needs. I am sure Terry Lambert can say a lot more about this internationalization issue :-) (and I actually agree with him for the most part). Bakul From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 19:54:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id TAA25575 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:54:48 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA25569 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:54:47 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA04770 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:54:47 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: "Billy Brackenridge; DIV7": Audio I/O suitable for Internet Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 19:54:46 -0800 Message-ID: <4769.790574086@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Does anyone know what this is about? ------- Forwarded Message Return-Path: billy@ISI.EDU Received: from zephyr.isi.edu (zephyr.isi.edu [128.9.160.160]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA27517 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:04:08 -0800 Received: by zephyr.isi.edu (5.65c/5.61+local-17) id ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 11:01:35 -0800 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 11:01:35 PST From: "Billy Brackenridge; DIV7" Reply-To: billy@ISI.EDU To: Announcement.List:; Subject: Audio I/O suitable for Internet Message-Id: The source code for programming the ECHO PSS that I posted in October, is available for anonymous FTP on the host coyote.rain.org login and cd to pub/echo the file is audiosfd.zip decompress it preserving the directory structures with pkunzip. The file hasn't changes since I released it. Has anybody gotten the PSS design working under any flavor of Unix? I just thought I'd send out this note to see what if any progress has been made. ------- End of Forwarded Message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 20:10:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA27173 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:10:43 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA27164 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:10:37 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA10028; Thu, 19 Jan 95 21:04:44 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501200404.AA10028@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? To: rsoles@SIRIUS.COM (Roger L Soles) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 21:04:44 MST Cc: osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu, roberto@blaise.ibp.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501191801.AA17322@SIRIUS.COM> from "Roger L Soles" at Jan 19, 95 10:07:07 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Perhaps NetBEUI is smaller is total size, but it bites your low > memory -- TCP/IP can be run on windows machines as VXD without > impacting low memory. 80% of all DOS machines don't run windows. > Also, if you've got 500 machines running b-mode NetBEUI (the most > likely for people who know not what they're doing) you've got problems... Davis County. You rest your case. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 20:18:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA28046 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:18:44 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA28035 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:18:38 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA10071; Thu, 19 Jan 95 21:12:45 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501200412.AA10071@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 95 21:12:44 MST Cc: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr, osyjm@schizo.coe.montana.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <4125.790548958@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jan 19, 95 12:55:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > My problem with SAMBA is that it's not a DOS solution, just a Windows > solution. I need both. Any suggestions? :) LANMAN under DOS using a TCP/IP transport can use Samba. As can the Artisoft Lantastic DOS client, which can talk SMB. AT&T LanManager also does this, as does DEC's PathWorks products. The default protocol for both of the former is NetBEUI. The default for both of the latter is proprietary (AT&T StarLan and DECNet Phase IV, respectively). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 20:37:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA00264 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:37:46 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA00256 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:37:44 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA05155; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:36:45 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) cc: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva), root@io.cts.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 19 Jan 95 11:46:45 +0100." <9501191046.AA17955@blaise.ibp.fr> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:36:44 -0800 Message-ID: <5154.790576604@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Look in freefall:~ftp/pub/incoming/freebsd.flc :-) > > for more info. I haven't had time to build up the new Xanim yet. > > I did build it but I've no QT animations to test it with :-) > > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG > FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 21:07:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA02554 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:07:10 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA02548 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:07:08 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA05454; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:06:17 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: charnier@lirmm.fr (Philippe Charnier), cacho@eureka.gdl.iteso.mx, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: CVS stuff In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 18 Jan 95 16:43:50 MST." <9501182343.AA03975@cs.weber.edu> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:06:17 -0800 Message-ID: <5452.790578377@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I think it's simply easier for everyone to learn english. I can recommend a number of good books.. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 21:27:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA03053 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:27:55 -0800 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.223.46]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA03047; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:27:53 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA18836; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:27:16 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: time.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Justin Benade cc: questions@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Help In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 19 Jan 95 11:58:48 GMT." <199501190958.LAA00252@shrike.cis.co.za> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 21:27:15 -0800 Message-ID: <18829.790579635@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Were you using DES passwords on the old box? > I have recently installed FreeBSD 2.0 on one of my machines, now I > need to migrate all the users from another FreeBSD box to the new > one. The problem is the old box is FreeBSD 1.1.5 and the password > file does not work with 2.0. Is there any way of fixing this From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 23:25:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id XAA04092 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 23:25:33 -0800 Received: from pyromania.apana.org.au (pyromania.apana.org.au [202.12.87.123]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA03995 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 23:17:42 -0800 Received: (from john@localhost) by pyromania.apana.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id SAA12508 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 18:17:21 +1100 From: John Herks Message-Id: <199501200717.SAA12508@pyromania.apana.org.au> Subject: Syquest drives with FreeBSD 2.0 ? To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 18:17:21 +1100 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 648 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Does FreeBSD 2.0 support the use of Syquest removable SCSI drives ? > > -- > > > > \|/ > (@ @) > ----------------------------oOO--(_)--OOo----------------------------------- > ``` ''' > John Herks Communications Engineer > Pyromania Unix Melbourne john@pyromania.apana.org.au > Phone:+613-220-4757 > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Jan 19 23:41:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id XAA04265 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 23:41:25 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id XAA04259 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 1995 23:41:24 -0800 Received: by brasil.moneng.mei.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA10014; Fri, 20 Jan 95 01:39:09 CST From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <9501200739.AA10014@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Less is more? To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 01:39:08 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4beta PL9] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 292 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've been putting off installing "less" on my FreeBSD 2.0 systems. I had noticed a while back that the current "more" appears to be based on "less", but seems to be a somewhat stripped down version. Can anyone comment on what version of "less" our "more" was derived from (etc)?... ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 00:20:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA04905 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 00:20:54 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA04899 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 00:20:49 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA20910; Fri, 20 Jan 95 09:20:40 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (KAA06157); Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:26:14 +0100 Message-Id: <199501200926.KAA06157@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com (user alias) Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:26:13 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <4125.790548958@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jan 19, 95 12:55:58 pm From: Christoph Kukulies Reply-To: Christoph Kukulies X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1029 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan wrote: > > My problem with SAMBA is that it's not a DOS solution, just a Windows > solution. I need both. Any suggestions? :) > > Jordan It's a DOS solution as well. Get the DOS Lanmanager client from MS (also free) (ftp.microsoft.com), install it under DOS (it's 4 diskettes I believe). Do a C:\net start C:\net use k: \\freebsd\public K: K:\dir etc.. etc.. > > > > My understanding is that NetBEUI is rather simplistic, non-routable, but > > > it would be useful in communicating with PC's running wfw that for some > > > reason don't want TCP/IP. > > > > If you want ot share printers and disks, I'd suggest looking at > > samba. > > -- > > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG > > FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 > > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD blues 2.1.0-Development FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #1: Wed Jan 18 10:42:31 1995 kuku@blues:/usr/src/sys/compile/BLUES i386 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 00:40:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA05175 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 00:40:05 -0800 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA05157 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 00:40:00 -0800 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.8/8.6.6) id DAA02262 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 03:38:00 -0500 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 03:38:00 -0500 From: Wankle Rotary Engine Message-Id: <199501200838.DAA02262@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Don't say I didn't warn you Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Be advised that I just committed the 'serial console' changes to the boot blocks (and the sio driver), so if anyone has trouble booting that makes me the guy to blame. Some quick notes: - 'options COMCONSOLE' still works, for those who need it. Joerg made a good argument for keeping it, and in UNIX old functionality never dies anyway: it just isn't documented as well as it once was. - The final byte count for the second stage loader: 6864. This is smaller that the existing one. I decided to stick with the assembler serial port code even after seeing Bruce's C version. With the C code, the new boot block is (if I remember right) exactly the same size as the current one. - I put #ifdefs around the code that depends on (addr < ouraddr) and left those bits turned off. In normal operation they don't do any good, and any one who wants then can #define them back in again. For my next trick, I'm going to figure out why the kernel panics in putc() if you enable getty on /dev/console, log in on /dev/console, and run the X server. ("What do you *mean* there aren't any cblocks reserved?!") Bah. -Bill ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~T~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Møøse Illuminati: ignore it and be confused, or join it and be confusing! ~~~~~~~~ FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #0: Fri Jan 13 22:04:07 EST 1995 ~~~~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 01:53:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id BAA06341 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 01:53:03 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA06309; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 01:52:45 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id KAA06439 ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:53:12 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA22097; Fri, 20 Jan 95 10:53:12 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501200953.AA22097@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/usr.sbin/tcpdump/tcpdump - Imported sources To: jkh@freefall.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:53:12 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org (Hackers' list FreeBSD) In-Reply-To: <199501200422.UAA28461@freefall.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jan 19, 95 08:22:53 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#292 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 506 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > jkh 95/01/19 20:22:50 > > Log: > Bring in the latest version of tcpdump (3.0) from Michael Reifenberger. > Submitted by: mr I have a patch to output captured packets in ASCII instead of Hex and Francis Dupond has made some patches to TCPDUMP to decode ISO/CLNT packets and some others. I'll put libpcap-0.0+ and tcpdump-3.0+ on freefall. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 03:14:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id DAA08156 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 03:14:36 -0800 Received: from rz-wb.fh-sw.de (rz-wb.fh-sw.de [192.129.23.111]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA08120; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 03:14:06 -0800 Received: (from root@localhost) by rz-wb.fh-sw.de (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA17892; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 12:12:24 +0100 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 12:12:24 +0100 (MET) From: Michael Reifenberger To: Ollivier ROBERT cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , "Hackers' list FreeBSD" Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/usr.sbin/tcpdump/tcpdump - Imported sources In-Reply-To: <9501200953.AA22097@blaise.ibp.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 20 Jan 1995, Ollivier ROBERT wrote: > > Log: > > Bring in the latest version of tcpdump (3.0) from Michael Reifenberger. > > Submitted by: mr > > I have a patch to output captured packets in ASCII instead of Hex and > Francis Dupond has made some patches to TCPDUMP to decode ISO/CLNT > packets and some others. > > I'll put libpcap-0.0+ and tcpdump-3.0+ on freefall. The ASCII output patch is included in this version. Also was patch1 from ftp.ee.lbl.gov (If I remember right). If you want to commit it please remove tcpslice from the top Makefile for now until it gets synced with tcpdump. (A shorttime sollution is to copy savefile.* from tcpdump.old over. But I doubt the compatibility.) Bye! .... Michael Reifenberger From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 04:42:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id EAA09276 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 04:42:32 -0800 Received: from galactica.galactica.it (galactica.galactica.it [192.106.152.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA09270 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 04:42:08 -0800 Received: from galactic.UUCP (uucp@localhost) by galactica.galactica.it (8.3/8.3) with UUCP id NAA00873; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 13:24:16 -0800 To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: News USENET From: davide.tome'@galactica.it (DAVIDE TOME') Message-ID: <8A1F2FB.0001005E68.uuout@galactica.it> Date: Fri, 20 Jan 95 12:43:00 +0100 Organization: GALACTICA PROFESSIONAL COMMUNICATION - ++39-2-29.00.61.50 Reply-To: davide.tome'@galactica.it (DAVIDE TOME') X-Mailreader: PCBoard Version 15.21 X-Mailer: PCBoard/UUOUT Version 1.10 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, We got the Walnut Creek CDROM with FreeBSD 2.0 and the cover said tha it comes with full USENET news ... but after installation no news services was installed. How can I install news services ?????? Ciao & Thanks Davide Dott. Davide Tome' ------------------------------------------------- Internet .....: davide.tome'@galactica.it Fido..........: 2:331/358 davide tome' Galactica BBS.: +39-2-29006058 (24H 24 lines r.a) Voce..........: +39-2-29006150 Fax...........: +39-2-29006153 ------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 05:33:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id FAA10020 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 05:33:44 -0800 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (root@UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA10014 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 05:33:37 -0800 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA12703 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for freebsd.org!hackers); Fri, 20 Jan 1995 07:06:30 -0600 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA16901; 20 Jan 95 07:05:52 CST (Fri) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA16898 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 07:05:52 -0600 Message-Id: <199501201305.HAA16898@bonkers.taronga.com> X-Authentication-Warning: bonkers.taronga.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: uftp X-Mailer: exmh version 1.4.1 7/21/94 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 07:05:50 -0600 From: Peter da Silva Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The recently posted libftp software might be the solution to the problem of getting a reasonable FTP environment for installing. I understand the disks currently use ncftp but its error handling sucks. This is way better and quite clean. Author of uftp and libftp Oleg Orel Department of Electronics and automatisation. Institute for High Energy Physics Protvino, Russia E-mail: orel@oea.ihep.su, orel@dxcern.cern.ch Here's an example of a "dumb copy" program using libftp. /* Include standard libftp's header */ #include main(int argc, char *argv[]) { FILE *input,*output; int c; if (argc<3) exit(fprintf(stderr,"Usage: %s input-file output-file\n",argv[0])); FtplibDebug(yes); if ((input=Ftpfopen(argv[1],"r"))==NULL) { perror(argv[1]); exit(1); } if ((output=Ftpfopen(argv[2],"w"))==NULL) { perror(argv[2]); exit(1); } while ( (c=getc(input)) != EOF && (putc(c,output)!=EOF) ); if (ferror(input)) { perror(argv[1]); exit(1); } if (ferror(output)) { perror(argv[1]); exit(1); } Ftpfclose(input); Ftpfclose(output); exit(0); } From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 05:58:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id FAA10163 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 05:58:13 -0800 Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA10157 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 05:58:09 -0800 Received: (dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.9/8.3) id IAA00792; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 08:20:14 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199501201320.IAA00792@hda.com> Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? To: pw@snoopy.MV.COM (Paul F. Werkowski) Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 08:20:13 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501192331.SAA01416@snoopy.mv.com> from "Paul F. Werkowski" at Jan 19, 95 06:31:37 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 3057 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Paul F. Werkowski writes: > > > It may be true that the NEC 4Xi is the first SCSI device to > hit FreeBSD-land that actually returns XS_BUSY status to > the Inquire command. The immediate problem is that this gets > into a code branch in scsi_base.c that looks like this: > > case XS_BUSY: > /*should somehow arange for a 1 sec delay here (how?) */ > /* XXX tsleep(&localvar, priority, "foo", hz); > that's how! */ > case XS_TIMEOUT: > /* > * If we can, resubmit it to the adapter. > */ > if (xs->retries--) { > xs->error = XS_NOERROR; > xs->flags &= ~ITSDONE; > goto retry; > > This seems to result in rapidly depleting the retry count (2) on > probe and not finding the drive. > > Questions: > > 1. What the hell to do to correctly process the > BUSY status. The SCSI-II draft spec says try again later but > maybe some device specific thing has to happend to un-busy > the thing. > > 2. Does tsleep work during probe conditions? I tried it and it > seemed to have no effect. DELAY did seem to slow things down a > bit although it never got a non-busy status in 3 attempts with > 10 second delays. > > 3. Does the re-probe feature work? (eg scsi -f /dev/sd0d -r -t2 -l0) > On this system I see an eventual response to the inquire command but > the 1740A board seems confused by the time it gets it. Any SCSI > experts make sense of this? Yes, it works OK. > probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_cmd I think this is test_unit_ready > probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_scsi_cmd adapter gets called > probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_done adapter finished > probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_done 'done' processing gets called > probe0(ahb0:2:0): command: 0,0,0,0,0,0-[0 bytes] <= result > < long wait > > ahb0: board not responding <= from ahb_poll > ahb0: board not responding <= ditto > abort failed in wait > probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_cmd I think this is inquiry > probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_scsi_cmd > probe0(ahb0:2:0): ahb_done > probe0(ahb0:2:0): scsi_done > probe0(ahb0:2:0): command: 12,0,0,0,2c,0-[44 bytes] > ------------------------------ > 000: 05 80 02 02 1f 00 00 00 4e 45 43 20 20 20 20 20 <=== looks like ok data > 016: 43 44 2d 52 4f 4d 20 44 52 49 56 45 3a 35 30 31 <=== > 032: 32 2e 32 20 32 20 32 20 32 20 32 20 <=== > ------------------------------ > < long wait > > ahb0: board not responding > cmd fail > ahb0: board not responding > abort failed in wait An interesting thing about this is that the data is coming back OK (you see the inquiry data that came back, "NEC CD-ROM DRIVE") At least in this case it seems you want to treat BUSY like DONE. I have a feeling (and you've verified it) that lengthening timeouts aren't going to help. You probably said this earlier, but: This unit works OK under DOS? Does it work the same with and without a disk installed? Peter -- Peter Dufault Real Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 -- Formerly hd@world.std.com. E-mail problems? Tell hdslip@iii.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 06:20:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA10498 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 06:20:40 -0800 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.atinc.com [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA10491 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 06:20:21 -0800 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id JAA29307; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:08:57 -0500 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:08:56 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: Syquest drives with FreeBSD 2.0 ? To: John Herks cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501200717.SAA12508@pyromania.apana.org.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 20 Jan 1995, John Herks wrote: > > Does FreeBSD 2.0 support the use of Syquest removable SCSI drives ? > > 1.1.5.1 does. cant see why a later version of the sd driver would not. you can get a system on a 88mb with a little space left. for the 44mb disk, you have to aggressively remove programs that you dont or wont use. (done that, not fun, but it is doable) jmb Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 06:55:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA11400 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 06:55:47 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA11295 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 06:54:41 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA02886; Fri, 20 Jan 95 15:53:36 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (QAA06939); Fri, 20 Jan 1995 16:59:09 +0100 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 16:59:09 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199501201559.QAA06939@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: instability problems solved Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The problems I had with my 2.x-current system all the time with cc1 getting various signals (4 10 11), a recent X server crash (which Xinside has been notified of by it's fabulous built-into-the-server-by-default send a stack trace by mail to the factory feature), corrupt files during kernel builds seem all to be gone since I swapped the motherboard today. I was claiming the cache chips responsible but my local computer store found it easier to swap the board right away. --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD blues 2.1.0-Development FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #1: Wed Jan 18 10:42:31 1995 kuku@blues:/usr/src/sys/compile/BLUES i386 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 06:57:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id GAA11458 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 06:57:10 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA11452 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 06:56:58 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id PAA11183 ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 15:54:46 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA22988; Fri, 20 Jan 95 15:54:46 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501201454.AA22988@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 15:54:46 +0100 (MET) Cc: peter@bonkers.taronga.com, root@io.cts.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <5154.790576604@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jan 19, 95 08:36:44 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#292 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 215 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Look in freefall:~ftp/pub/incoming/freebsd.flc :-) Very nice. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 07:31:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA12202 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 07:31:26 -0800 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA12054 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 07:28:34 -0800 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id QAA07101 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 16:26:25 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199501201526.QAA07101@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: sio.c... To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 16:26:25 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2363 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Two questions about sio.c on FreeBSD 1.1.5 The first is easy, and deals with avoding the problem with processes which are not able to exit in case of hardware problems. In sioclose(), on 2.0R the call to the line_close routine is surrounded by a timeout/untimeout pair: timeout(wakeup, TSA_OCOMPLETE(tp), 60 * hz); (*linesw[tp->t_line].l_close)(tp, flag); untimeout(wakeup, TSA_OCOMPLETE(tp)); while 1.1.5R has only the call to l_close. Would it be possible to add the calls to timeout/untimeout on 1.1.5, or there are other changes needed ? [I know there are comments which say that the solution is far from being optimal; however, it would at least save me rebooting the system every time!] --- second question--- On the same 1.1.5 system here, I found out that a process here keeps blocking with WCHAN="siotx" (this happens with mgetty, when a particolar user drops the session, probably not in the most appropriate way). "siotx" seems to be present only in sio.c, function comparam(tp, t), in the following section of code, which is exactly the same as in 2.0R (I have no current sources handy): disable_intr(); retry: com->state &= ~CS_TTGO; enable_intr(); while ((inb(com->line_status_port) & (LSR_TSRE | LSR_TXRDY)) != (LSR_TSRE | LSR_TXRDY)) { error = ttysleep(tp, TSA_OCOMPLETE(tp), TTIPRI | PCATCH, "siotx", hz / 100); if (error != 0 && error != EAGAIN) { if (!(tp->t_state & TS_TTSTOP)) { disable_intr(); com->state |= CS_TTGO; enable_intr(); } splx(s); return (error); } } from which it appears that there is no timeout or other way out in case the modem is not responding properly. Wouldn't it be better to add an emergemcy exit after a proper timeout ? Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 07:55:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA12627 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 07:55:00 -0800 Received: from jaitken.async.vt.edu (jaitken@jaitken.async.vt.edu [128.173.18.165]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA12621 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 07:54:57 -0800 Received: (jaitken@localhost) by jaitken.async.vt.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA15672; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:54:25 -0500 From: Jeff Aitken Message-Id: <199501201554.KAA15672@jaitken.async.vt.edu> Subject: Re: Adding Web Browser Components To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:54:25 -0500 (EST) Cc: root@io.cts.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501191141.FAA14933@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Jan 19, 95 05:41:21 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 358 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Morgan Davis asked where to get mpeg_play... > > /usr/local/src on bonkers.taronga.com? > > OK, I'll copy it over to freefall in /a/pds/mpeg_play.tar.gz. I don't know > where the original is from. I don't think it took any porting. I think mpeg source is distributed from s2k-ftp.CS.Berkeley.EDU, in /pub/multimedia/mpeg -- Jeff Aitken jaitken@vt.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 08:08:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA13097 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 08:08:48 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA13088 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 08:08:45 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA12037; Fri, 20 Jan 95 09:01:41 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501201601.AA12037@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de Date: Fri, 20 Jan 95 9:01:40 MST Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501200926.KAA06157@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph Kukulies" at Jan 20, 95 10:26:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > My problem with SAMBA is that it's not a DOS solution, just a Windows > > solution. I need both. Any suggestions? :) > > It's a DOS solution as well. Get the DOS Lanmanager client from MS (also free) > (ftp.microsoft.com), install it under DOS (it's 4 diskettes I believe). And from the SAMBA mailing list: ] Date: Thu, 19 Jan 1995 07:55:18 +0000 (CST) ] From: labash@lcjones.aclib.siue.edu ( Louis J. LaBash Jr.) ] To: samba@cscgpo.anu.edu.au ] Subject: MS Workgroup Connection 1.0 for DOS? ] Message-ID: ] ] Hi, ] ] Surplus Software is offering Microsoft Workgroup Connection 1.0 for DOS. ] Is this just MS Client for DOS? ] ] Their price is $19.95 US. ] --- ] Louis-ljl-{LaBash@eniac.ac.siue.edu | lou@minuet.siue.edu} Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 08:14:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA13290 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 08:14:38 -0800 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.atinc.com [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA13280 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 08:14:32 -0800 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id LAA00376; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 11:07:21 -0500 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 11:07:20 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: pci chipset to part number mapping To: hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk what is the mapping of pci chipset names to manufacturer and part number? neptune saturn saturn II plato and to so on? the intel 82420ex pciset databook indicates that the input clock can be either 50 or 66 mhz which is then / 2 to produce the pci bus clocks. what about an 80 mhz cpu? does one of the two reserved options produce 40 mhz pci bus clocks? ref: 82420EX PCIset, order number 290488-002, section 4.15, page 125, table 22 Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 09:36:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA15661 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:36:38 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA15654; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:36:36 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: davide.tome'@galactica.it (DAVIDE TOME') cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: News USENET In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 20 Jan 1995 12:43:00 +0100." <8A1F2FB.0001005E68.uuout@galactica.it> Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:36:35 -0800 Message-ID: <15652.790623395@freefall.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > We got the Walnut Creek CDROM with FreeBSD 2.0 and the cover said tha > it comes with full USENET news ... but after installation no news > services was installed. > > How can I install news services ?????? mkdir -p /usr/ports /cdrom mount /dev/cd0a /cdrom cd /usr/ports lndir /cdrom/ports . cd news/cnews make all install Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 09:38:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA15740 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:38:09 -0800 Received: from inet-gw-3.pa.dec.com (inet-gw-3.pa.dec.com [16.1.0.33]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA15734 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:38:04 -0800 Received: from muggsy.lkg.dec.com by inet-gw-3.pa.dec.com (5.65/10Aug94) id AA26197; Fri, 20 Jan 95 09:34:41 -0800 Received: from whydos.lkg.dec.com by muggsy.lkg.dec.com (5.65/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) with SMTP id AA24719; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 12:30:19 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by whydos.lkg.dec.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA04311; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 13:35:39 GMT Message-Id: <199501201335.NAA04311@whydos.lkg.dec.com> X-Authentication-Warning: whydos.lkg.dec.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Garrett Wollman Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 19 Jan 1995 20:35:35 EST." <9501200135.AA00248@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.5omega 10/6/94 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 13:35:37 +0000 From: Matt Thomas Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > < said: > > > As does NETBEUI in Workgroup for Windows. Most of the support for NETBEUI > > already exists in FreeBSD in the netccitt directory. NETBEUI is little more > > than LLC2 (ISO 8802.2 Class 2) with SMB running over it. LLC2 is really LAPB > > slightly hacked to works over LANs. netccitt already has the LAPB > > engine, someone needs to add in the LAN support (as well as getting the > > right hooks in ethersubr). > > You mean like: > > wollman@khavrinen(753)$ pwd > /usr/src/sys/netccitt > wollman@khavrinen(754)$ ls llc* > llc_input.c llc_output.c llc_subr.c~ llc_var.h > llc_input.c~ llc_subr.c llc_timer.c > > ? Or is there something more? (I suspect so, since the existing LLC2 > code only talks to the X.25 code.) The llc code looks like it should work for doing the LLC2 work. There are a few datagrams that need to dealt with for name discovery but those should not be hard to add. Adding a socket interface to the llc routines (look at the X.25 interface to see what needs to added on the bottom) should suffice. If I were doing it, I'd make the interface a generic LLC2 interface with bind/listen/accept /connect etc suppport. (The UI packets would be delivered to the listener to deal with -- the listener would also transmit). The reason for that is so other LLC2 protocols could be added (such as RPL) without additional kernel hacking. Matt Thomas Internet: matt@lkg.dec.com U*X Networking WWW URL: http://ftp.dec.com/%7Ethomas/ Digital Equipment Corporation Disclaimer: This message reflects my Littleton, MA own warped views, etc. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 09:38:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id JAA15768 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:38:55 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA15761; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:38:51 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.cdrom.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Peter da Silva cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: uftp In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 20 Jan 1995 07:05:50 CST." <199501201305.HAA16898@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 09:38:50 -0800 Message-ID: <15759.790623530@freefall.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The recently posted libftp software might be the solution to the problem > of getting a reasonable FTP environment for installing. I understand the > disks currently use ncftp but its error handling sucks. This is way better > and quite clean. I am very, very interested (I actually remember this now, but forgot it again in the stress of my schedule). Would you consider bmaking it and sending it to me? Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 10:08:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA17208 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:08:17 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA17189 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:08:07 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id FAA00443; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 05:06:19 +1100 Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 05:06:19 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501201806.FAA00443@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: terry@cs.weber.edu, wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> part = 0; >> unit = (drive & 0x7F); I always make this change too. >> This automagically sets the unit to 0 or 1 accordingly. I've seen this >> bandied about on the newsgroups, but I've often wondered why it never >> became official. My guess is that this causes other problems that I'm >> not aware of (which are undoubtedly related to SCSI disks, which I don't I think there is no problem except inertia. If you can somehow boot from a second disk, then the loader has already used a nonzero drive bit to load itself, so it shouldn't hurt to keep using it. >The other thing is that you can grab the part as well, although you have >to hack 3 places for it. The size change is small (about +18 bytes). The (DOS) part (aka slice) is already grabbed in -current. >I'd also like to see the drive info for 0x80 and 0x81 passed from the >bios. This is basically two function calls and stack pushes for each >to do the deed in the second stage boot. This should be well under This is already done in -current (except the data is passed in `struct bootinfo' and not on the stack). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 10:23:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id KAA17623 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:23:00 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA17605 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 10:22:39 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id FAA00598; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 05:18:00 +1100 Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 05:18:00 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501201818.FAA00598@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >- ps and w get confused (w especially): I don't know how many of you > have noticed this, but if you actually edit /etc/ttys and replace > 'ttyv0' with 'console' (which should be allowed), ps still says that It isn't really allowed. > your tty is 'v0' (it should say 'co'). w gets into trouble too, with ps looks at the t_dev entry in struct tty. sio and the current syscons make no distintion between the console device and the minor-0 device. They store the minor-0 device in t_dev. ps has no chance of converting this back to `co'. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 12:51:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA19991 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 12:51:48 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA19985 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 12:51:44 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA01709; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 15:51:36 -0500 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 15:51:36 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501202051.AA01709@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NETBEUI for FreeBSD? Any docs? In-Reply-To: <9501200412.AA10071@cs.weber.edu> References: <4125.790548958@time.cdrom.com> <9501200412.AA10071@cs.weber.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < The default protocol for both of the former is NetBEUI. The default for > both of the latter is proprietary (AT&T StarLan and DECNet Phase IV, > respectively). Actually, the AT&T product runs over ISO CLNP. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 14:44:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA22445 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 14:44:20 -0800 Received: from tfs.com (mailhub.tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA22435 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 14:43:51 -0800 Received: by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) Message-Id: From: julian@tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 14:43:03 -0800 (PST) Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501201806.FAA00443@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Jan 21, 95 05:06:19 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 679 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > >> part = 0; > >> unit = (drive & 0x7F); > > I always make this change too. > > >> This automagically sets the unit to 0 or 1 accordingly. I've seen this > >> bandied about on the newsgroups, but I've often wondered why it never > >> became official. My guess is that this causes other problems that I'm > >> not aware of (which are undoubtedly related to SCSI disks, which I don't I haven't actually looked, but the one that may fail is the case of hd(1,a) when a SCSI disk is co-configured with an IDE disk. in this case it needs to pass a 1 to the bios to boot, but a 0 to the kernel (it's sd0 after all isn't it). If that still works, then sure.. make the change.. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 17:10:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA27950 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 17:10:19 -0800 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA27943; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 17:10:13 -0800 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.8/jtpda-5.0) with SMTP id CAA18137 ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 02:11:06 +0100 Received: by blaise.ibp.fr (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA01351; Sat, 21 Jan 95 02:11:06 +0100 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Message-Id: <9501210111.AA01351@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: News USENET To: jkh@freefall.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 02:11:05 +0100 (MET) Cc: davide.tome'@galactica.it, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <15652.790623395@freefall.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jan 20, 95 09:36:35 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development ctm#292 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23beta2] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 279 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > cd news/cnews > make all install INN is much better than Cnews... Maybe a little more difficult to configure but easier to manage. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD keltia 2.1.0-Development #9: Tue Jan 17 21:12:14 MET 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 17:55:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA03981 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 17:55:05 -0800 Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA03969 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 17:55:02 -0800 Received: (dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.9/8.3) id UAA00530; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 20:53:58 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199501210153.UAA00530@hda.com> Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? To: pw@snoopy.MV.COM (Paul F. Werkowski) Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 20:53:57 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501192331.SAA01416@snoopy.mv.com> from "Paul F. Werkowski" at Jan 19, 95 06:31:37 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 964 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Paul F. Werkowski writes: > > > Q. How can you recognize a pioneer? > A. He's one with the arrows sticking out of his a^H but. > > It may be true that the NEC 4Xi is the first SCSI device to > hit FreeBSD-land that actually returns XS_BUSY status to > the Inquire command. The immediate problem is that this gets > into a code branch in scsi_base.c that looks like this: As I mentioned to Paul, I found a NEC 4Xi for $299.00 tonight so I bought it. I can read the NEC demo disk on an Adaptec 1542C (can't do much, no Windows). Is anyone out there using any NEC CDROM on a 174x without any trouble? Does anyone know where I can find the full spec for the NEC command set on the net? ftp.nec.com is useless. Peter -- Peter Dufault Real Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 -- Formerly hd@world.std.com. E-mail problems? Tell hdslip@iii.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 18:24:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id SAA08529 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 18:24:14 -0800 Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA08503 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 18:24:08 -0800 Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R2.01/dg-rtp-v02) id AA16651; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 21:23:25 -0500 Received: (rivers@localhost) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.9/8.6.5) id PAA18470; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 15:58:39 -0500 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 15:58:39 -0500 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199501202058.PAA18470@ponds.UUCP> To: bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-bugs@freefall.cdrom.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com Subject: Re: Serious problems in drand48(). Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > >I have run the following program on a Pentium and a 386sx-16 with > >no floating point co-processor. > > >Both times it reported that drand48() incorrectly returned a value > >greater than 1.0. > > It works on thud and on my system (a 486DX2 with [lib]msun). > > Bruce > As was pointed out - I neglected to mention this was in 2.0R. Also, I'm not linking with -lmsun, just the standard C library. - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 20:23:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id UAA16857 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 20:23:03 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA16849 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 20:22:50 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA10155; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:20:23 +1100 Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:20:23 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501210420.PAA10155@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it Subject: Re: sio.c... Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >The first is easy, and deals with avoding the problem with processes >which are not able to exit in case of hardware problems. >In sioclose(), on 2.0R the call to the line_close routine is surrounded >by a timeout/untimeout pair: > timeout(wakeup, TSA_OCOMPLETE(tp), 60 * hz); > (*linesw[tp->t_line].l_close)(tp, flag); > untimeout(wakeup, TSA_OCOMPLETE(tp)); >while 1.1.5R has only the call to l_close. Would it be possible to add >the calls to timeout/untimeout on 1.1.5, or there are other changes >needed ? The timeouts are actually in a version later than 2.0R, and don't work (wakeup() doesn't cause the tsleep() in ttywait() to return EWOULDBLOCK). -current has a better fix for the problem. The tsleep() in ttywait() uses a timeout (tp->t_timeout, default 0) and you can change the timeout using comcontrol. This involves Simple changes to , kern/tty.c and comcontrol.[c8]. >On the same 1.1.5 system here, I found out that a process here keeps >blocking with WCHAN="siotx" (this happens with mgetty, when a >particolar user drops the session, probably not in the most >appropriate way). "siotx" seems to be present only in sio.c, function >comparam(tp, t), in the following section of code, which is exactly the >same as in 2.0R (I have no current sources handy): > disable_intr(); >retry: > com->state &= ~CS_TTGO; > enable_intr(); > while ((inb(com->line_status_port) & (LSR_TSRE | LSR_TXRDY)) > != (LSR_TSRE | LSR_TXRDY)) { > error = ttysleep(tp, TSA_OCOMPLETE(tp), TTIPRI | PCATCH, > "siotx", hz / 100); >... >from which it appears that there is no timeout or other way out in case >the modem is not responding properly. Wouldn't it be better to add an >emergemcy exit after a proper timeout ? Perhaps. The LSR_TSRE and LSR_TXRDY bits are guaranteed to go on in a short time ((transmit_fifo_size + 1) * time_to_transmit_one_char) if the hardware and software are working. It's not practical to check for all h/w bugs. I'll check that there are no races in the s/w. (There used to be a bug involving not fully stopping transmission (something turned CS_TTGO back on). For transmission to continue "forever", something must supply new output "forever". The ttysleep() probably allows other processes to supply output. Echoing of input creates output.). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 21:42:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA17973 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 21:42:00 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA17967 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 21:41:58 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA14456; Fri, 20 Jan 95 22:32:45 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501210532.AA14456@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... To: julian@tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Fri, 20 Jan 95 22:32:44 MST Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Julian Elischer" at Jan 20, 95 02:43:03 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > >> part = 0; > > >> unit = (drive & 0x7F); [ ... ] > I haven't actually looked, but the one that may fail is the case of hd(1,a) > when a SCSI disk is co-configured with an IDE disk. > in this case it needs to pass a 1 to the bios to boot, but a 0 to the > kernel (it's sd0 after all isn't it). > If that still works, then sure.. make the change.. How can the SCSI disk be accessed, unless it has installed its bios, in which case the IDE disk BIOS is not active? The one scenario I can see this failing is on a boot to a device that DOS thinks is device 0 but BSD thinks is device 1 because it probes both controllers regardless of which BIOS is active. This is actually the opposite of the case you made. THis setup would require the user to explicitly go into the SCSI setup and tell it whether or not to hook the INT 13 vectors on POST. For an Adaptec controller, this is equivalent to explicitly enabling and disabling the SCSI BIOS between boots. If this is the case, I thoght that it had been taken care of already by causing the SCSI controller to probe prior to the WD controller? One might also see it happening when you have multiple SCSI, one without BIOS -- say a normal controller and a sound card. Which do you mean? Seems like a probe order problem. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Jan 20 23:16:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id XAA21487 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 23:16:54 -0800 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA21479 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 23:16:46 -0800 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id XAA02826; Fri, 20 Jan 1995 23:16:27 -0800 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199501210716.XAA02826@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Fri, 20 Jan 1995 23:16:27 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501210532.AA14456@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Jan 20, 95 10:32:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 3045 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [CC list trimmed back to hackers] > > > >> part = 0; > > > >> unit = (drive & 0x7F); > > [ ... ] > > > I haven't actually looked, but the one that may fail is the case of hd(1,a) > > when a SCSI disk is co-configured with an IDE disk. > > in this case it needs to pass a 1 to the bios to boot, but a 0 to the > > kernel (it's sd0 after all isn't it). > > If that still works, then sure.. make the change.. > > How can the SCSI disk be accessed, unless it has installed its bios, in > which case the IDE disk BIOS is not active? IDE disks do not require any special BIOS support. We can not boot from a disk that has not had BIOS support installed via int 13 hooking. > The one scenario I can see this failing is on a boot to a device that > DOS thinks is device 0 but BSD thinks is device 1 because it probes > both controllers regardless of which BIOS is active. Take a system with 1 IDE drive and n SCSI drives. DOS drive BSD drive BSD unit rootdev(maj,min) 0x80 wd0 0 0,0 0x81 sd0 0 4,0 0x82 sd1 1 4,1 ... Now make it more complicated, 2 IDE drives, n SCSI drives: 0x80 wd0 0 0,0 0x81 wd1 1 0,1 0x82 sd0 0 4,0 0x83 sd1 1 4,1 The current code can handle booting from either wd0 or sd0 in the first case. It can only boot from wd0 or wd1 in the second case. The current code is broken in some respects, and the above change also breaks some things. The special nomenclature hd(N,p) was meant to fix some of this, but falls short. > This is actually the opposite of the case you made. > > THis setup would require the user to explicitly go into the SCSI setup > and tell it whether or not to hook the INT 13 vectors on POST. For > an Adaptec controller, this is equivalent to explicitly enabling and > disabling the SCSI BIOS between boots. We can only boot from INT 13 devices, that should remain the same, otherwise you have to start putting drivers into the boot blocks and that gets ugly in a hurry. > If this is the case, I thoght that it had been taken care of already > by causing the SCSI controller to probe prior to the WD controller? It is not a matter of probe order, it is a matter of what value gets passed to locore.s as the bootdev. > One might also see it happening when you have multiple SCSI, one without > BIOS -- say a normal controller and a sound card. Multiple scsi controllers gets even more complicated. > Which do you mean? > Seems like a probe order problem. The real crux of the problem is how to map BIOS unit numbers to rootdev/bootdev devices numbers for the kernel. The current code does not work quite right, nor does the above proposed hack really fix the problem. I think we can fix this by making the way hd(X,y) works slightly different, and using something like the above change. The hd(X,y) device should be biased by 2 on the unit number for units >=2. > Terry Lambert > terry@cs.weber.edu -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Custom computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 00:15:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id AAA22526 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 00:15:19 -0800 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA22520 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 00:15:18 -0800 Received: by brasil.moneng.mei.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA10865; Sat, 21 Jan 95 02:11:56 CST From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <9501210811.AA10865@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: News USENET To: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier ROBERT) Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 02:11:55 -0600 (CST) Cc: jkh@freefall.cdrom.com, davide.tome'@galactica.it@blaise.ibp.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501210111.AA01351@blaise.ibp.fr> from "Ollivier ROBERT" at Jan 21, 95 02:11:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4beta PL9] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 463 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > INN is much better than Cnews... Maybe a little more difficult > to configure but easier to manage. Yes, if you want something that's continually running, hogging the system... C-news is still better for some things (although I myself worship INN). ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 05:09:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id FAA15382 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 05:09:03 -0800 Received: from snoopy.mv.com (snoopy.mv.com [199.125.64.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA15376 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 05:08:56 -0800 Received: (from pw@localhost) by snoopy.mv.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA00646; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:08:08 -0500 Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:08:08 -0500 From: "Paul F. Werkowski" Message-Id: <199501211308.IAA00646@snoopy.mv.com> To: dufault@hda.com CC: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: <199501210153.UAA00530@hda.com> (message from Peter Dufault on Fri, 20 Jan 1995 20:53:57 -0500 (EST)) Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Peter" == Peter Dufault writes: Peter> Paul F. Werkowski writes: >> >> >> Q. How can you recognize a pioneer? A. He's one with the >> arrows sticking out of his a^H but. >> >> It may be true that the NEC 4Xi is the first SCSI device to hit >> FreeBSD-land that actually returns XS_BUSY status to the >> Inquire command. The immediate problem is that this gets into a >> code branch in scsi_base.c that looks like this: Peter> As I mentioned to Paul, I found a NEC 4Xi for $299.00 Peter> tonight so I bought it. I can read the NEC demo disk on an Peter> Adaptec 1542C (can't do much, no Windows). Is anyone out Peter> there using any NEC CDROM on a 174x without any trouble? I hacked on the ahb_poll() code in aha1742.c a bit and managed to get the driver behave a bit better resulting in being able to successfully reprobe the cdrom. I even got the sucker mounted and looked at a few directories so I guess the hardware works. Still don't know why it doesn't get found on boot probe - maybe I will experiment with yet longer wait times. Also, there seems to be some magic involved in getting the drive to swallow/eject a disk. If whomever claims ownership of aha1742.c will contact me I will explain why ahb_poll() can't work after boot is complete. Peter> Does anyone know where I can find the full spec for the NEC Peter> command set on the net? ftp.nec.com is useless. I looked there also and agree. I think they are just getting onto the WWW bandwagon. Two years ago (already?) I was looking at an earlier version of a NEC CDROM drive and found tech support eager to send me a copy of "CDROM Drive OEM Documentation" which detailed the SCSI command set, timing issues and how each of the listed drives supported the various commands. Of course the doc did not include the thing I was looking at - maybe they just wanted to get rid of some old paper and shut me up at the same time :-) I have made several attempts to call tech support this week. What do you all think of an answering machine that says something like: "Do to the overwhelming success of our CDROM program you may experience exceptionally long delays waiting for a line to become free..." I gave up after 30-mins of tape-loops and crummy muzak. Regards, Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 05:23:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id FAA15428 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 05:23:29 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA15422 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 05:23:17 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id AAA18979; Sun, 22 Jan 1995 00:20:18 +1100 Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 00:20:18 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501211320.AAA18979@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> > > >> part = 0; >> > > >> unit = (drive & 0x7F); >> [ ... ] >The current code is broken in some respects, and the above change >also breaks some things. >The special nomenclature hd(N,p) was meant to fix some of this, >but falls short. >... >The real crux of the problem is how to map BIOS unit numbers to >rootdev/bootdev devices numbers for the kernel. The current code does >not work quite right, nor does the above proposed hack really fix the >problem. >I think we can fix this by making the way hd(X,y) works slightly >different, and using something like the above change. The hd(X,y) >device should be biased by 2 on the unit number for units >=2. The `hd' method only works for interactive boots. Changing the bias doesn't work because the BIOS uses a bias equal to the number of wd devices (it should have used something like bit 0x40 as a SCSI drive flag). For interactive boots I think the loader should ask for the BIOS drive number and the FreeBSD device name and not try to encode both in one hd number. For non-interactive boots the problem is slightly simpler (provided the unit number is not blown away) because the BIOS drive number must be assumed to be the one that was used to load the bootstrap. The loader could pass the problem of deciding the device name to the kernel by constructing an almost-unique signature for each drive supported by the BIOS. The C/H/S values would be unique in many cases. Unique data areas on the drives could probably be found for other cases. This scheme also requires the kernel to know about all drives known to the BIOS and for extra drives not to match the signatures. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 07:54:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA16857 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 07:54:28 -0800 Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu (PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU [128.2.10.105]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA16850; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 07:54:27 -0800 Received: (from postman@localhost) by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA03729; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:54:16 -0500 Received: via switchmail; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:54:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from pcs25.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:53:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from pcs25.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:53:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mms.4.60.Nov..4.1993.10.47.44.sun4c.411.EzMail.Phred.2.0.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.pcs25.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.pcs25.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4c_411; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:53:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:53:53 -0500 (EST) From: "Alex R.N. Wetmore" To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501210153.UAA00530@hda.com> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Excerpts from internet.computing.freebsd-hackers: 20-Jan-95 Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? by Peter Dufault@hda.com > As I mentioned to Paul, I found a NEC 4Xi for $299.00 tonight so > I bought it. I can read the NEC demo disk on an Adaptec 1542C > (can't do much, no Windows). Is anyone out there using any NEC > CDROM on a 174x without any trouble? Does anyone know where I can > find the full spec for the NEC command set on the net? ftp.nec.com > is useless. NEC doesn't put them on the Net. Supposedly you can find them via their fastfax service (I forget the # but if you call 800 Information and ask their tech support and call there they will have it on their voice mail). Otherwise support@nectech.com will mail you command sets as well. BTW, as a related NEC thing, does anyone out there have a NEC CDR-200 or NEC CDR-210 (I think the first is also called the 2Vi, the second is the OEM model) that works with audio cd player commands? As far as I can tell NEC doesn't use the SCSI-2 spec for audio cd player commands, because the only O/S that can play audio CDs with this drive for me is MSDOS/Windows using the Adaptec ASPI stuff. Windows NT, NetBSD, and FreeBSD all barf on it. alex From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 07:59:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id HAA16954 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 07:59:23 -0800 Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu (PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU [128.2.10.105]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA16948; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 07:59:22 -0800 Received: (from postman@localhost) by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA03845; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:59:12 -0500 Received: via switchmail; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:59:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from pcs25.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:57:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from pcs25.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:57:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mms.4.60.Nov..4.1993.10.47.44.sun4c.411.EzMail.Phred.2.0.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.pcs25.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.pcs25.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4c_411; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:57:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8j8Gvei00iV_M1g4h0@andrew.cmu.edu> Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 10:57:30 -0500 (EST) From: "Alex R.N. Wetmore" To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9501210532.AA14456@cs.weber.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Excerpts from internet.computing.freebsd-hackers: 20-Jan-95 Re: More serial console stu.. by Terry Lambert@cs.weber.e > How can the SCSI disk be accessed, unless it has installed its bios, in > which case the IDE disk BIOS is not active? Both BIOSs can be active (on my machine at least). I have one IDE disk and one SCSI disk hanging off of a 1542C. I can access the SCSI disk and IDE disk through straight BIOS calls (ie, no ASPI is active) at the same time (and in fact need to do this to boot Windows NT, which has its boot blocks on the SCSI disk). Anyway, according to DOS the IDE is C:, the SCSI is D:, but both are BIOS devices. alex From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 08:12:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA17204 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:12:49 -0800 Received: from snoopy.mv.com (snoopy.mv.com [199.125.64.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA17198 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:12:45 -0800 Received: (from pw@localhost) by snoopy.mv.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA00624; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 11:12:06 -0500 Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 11:12:06 -0500 From: "Paul F. Werkowski" Message-Id: <199501211612.LAA00624@snoopy.mv.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: <199501211308.IAA00646@snoopy.mv.com> (pw@snoopy.MV.COM) Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Paul" == me writes: Paul> I hacked on the ahb_poll() code in aha1742.c a bit and Paul> managed to get the driver behave a bit better resulting in Paul> being able to successfully reprobe the cdrom. I even got the Paul> sucker mounted and looked at a few directories so I guess Paul> the hardware works. Still don't know why it doesn't get Paul> found on boot probe - maybe I will experiment with yet The problem seems to start with the aha1742 driver finding an unexpected ecb ha_status code of 0x13 on the initial "test unit ready" SCSI message to this drive, resulting in XS_DRIVER_STUFFUP error returned. Subsequent pings on the drive result in XS_BUSY. Could someone with hardware documentation for this card please let me know what ha_status 0x13 means? Thanks Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 08:16:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA17311 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:16:49 -0800 Received: from estienne.cs.berkeley.edu (estienne.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.42.147]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA17305 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:16:48 -0800 Received: (from gibbs@localhost) by estienne.cs.berkeley.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id IAA28395; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:15:24 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Message-Id: <199501211615.IAA28395@estienne.cs.berkeley.edu> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:15:24 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501181834.TAA19739@bonnie.tcd-dresden.de> from "J Wunsch" at Jan 18, 95 07:34:37 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 902 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > As Philippe Charnier wrote: > | > Btw. > > | NB : the french message says: > | hardware failure on boot : no keyboard connected > | press any key to continue > > This is the kind of messages that regularly make me laugh. Hell, how > shall i press a key if there's no keyboard connected? :--) Since you cannot boot without the keyboard, the intention is for you to hit the key once you've re-installed the keyboard or checked the connection. > > -- > cheers, J"org work: --- no longer --- > private: joerg_wunsch@uriah.sax.de > > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > -- Justin T. Gibbs ============================================== TCS Instructional Group - Programmer/Analyst 1 Cory | Po | Danube | Volga | Parker | Torus ============================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 08:30:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA17482 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:30:33 -0800 Received: from grunt.grondar.za (grunt.grondar.za [196.7.18.129]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA17474 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:30:15 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by grunt.grondar.za (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA01669; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:29:37 +0200 Message-Id: <199501211629.SAA01669@grunt.grondar.za> X-Authentication-Warning: grunt.grondar.za: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Alex R.N. Wetmore" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:29:36 +0200 From: Mark Murray Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > BTW, as a related NEC thing, does anyone out there have a NEC CDR-200 or > NEC CDR-210 (I think the first is also called the 2Vi, the second is > the OEM model) that works with audio cd player commands? As far as I > can tell NEC doesn't use the SCSI-2 spec for audio cd player commands, > because the only O/S that can play audio CDs with this drive for me is > MSDOS/Windows using the Adaptec ASPI stuff. Windows NT, NetBSD, and > FreeBSD all barf on it. I have a nec210, and I have the same hassle as you. EZ-SCSI from adaptec will play music with no problem; so will windoze (if I remember correctly). I get all sorts of barf if I try it with FreeBSD-current. I have a bug report in for this... M -- Mark Murray 46 Harvey Rd, Claremont, Cape Town 7700, South Africa +27 21 61-3768 GMT+0200 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 08:50:31 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA17625 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:50:31 -0800 Received: from phred.ws.cc.cmu.edu (PHRED.WS.CC.CMU.EDU [128.2.74.228]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA17619 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:50:26 -0800 Received: (from alex@localhost) by phred.ws.cc.cmu.edu (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA10126; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 11:49:35 -0500 From: alex wetmore Message-Id: <199501211649.LAA10126@phred.org> Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? To: mark@grondar.za (Mark Murray) Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 11:49:34 -0500 (EST) Cc: aw2t+@andrew.cmu.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501211629.SAA01669@grunt.grondar.za> from "Mark Murray" at Jan 21, 95 06:29:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 586 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have a nec210, and I have the same hassle as you. EZ-SCSI from adaptec > will play music with no problem; so will windoze (if I remember correctly). > > I get all sorts of barf if I try it with FreeBSD-current. > I have a bug report in for this... The worst part about it is that NEC just pretends that the cdr210 doesn't exist (since it is a OEM model), so I can't get the commands for audio cd usage on the drive. I'm not 100% sure that the cdr200 is the same drive (or that a cdr200 even really exists), but my next trick was going to be asking for the commands for it. alex From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 08:57:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id IAA17662 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:57:49 -0800 Received: from grunt.grondar.za (grunt.grondar.za [196.7.18.129]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA17656 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 08:57:30 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by grunt.grondar.za (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA02723; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:56:29 +0200 Message-Id: <199501211656.SAA02723@grunt.grondar.za> X-Authentication-Warning: grunt.grondar.za: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: alex wetmore cc: aw2t+@andrew.cmu.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:56:28 +0200 From: Mark Murray Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The worst part about it is that NEC just pretends that the cdr210 doesn't > exist (since it is a OEM model), so I can't get the commands for audio > cd usage on the drive. I'm not 100% sure that the cdr200 is the same > drive (or that a cdr200 even really exists), but my next trick was going > to be asking for the commands for it. No wonder I got the bugger so cheaply! Please let me know of any developments... M -- Mark Murray 46 Harvey Rd, Claremont, Cape Town 7700, South Africa +27 21 61-3768 GMT+0200 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 11:51:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id LAA19616 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 11:51:43 -0800 Received: from campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA19610 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 11:51:40 -0800 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by campino.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (4.1/campino-6) id AA11894; Sat, 21 Jan 95 20:51:21 +0100 Received: by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (VAA19641); Sat, 21 Jan 1995 21:57:45 +0100 Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 21:57:45 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199501212057.VAA19641@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Subject: ncr53c810 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I got a PCI/I-486SP3G board today with a DX4 CPU and wanted to change a FreeBSD-1.1.5 installation into a 2.0-SNAP one. I did not expect that FreeBSD-1.1.5 ran right away on that board but I was hoping that 2.0-SNAP did. Unfortunately I get the following right in the moment when /dev nodes are being built: (typed off screen) ncr0 targ 0?: Error (81:10:67) (8/3) @(32594:0) ncr0: restart fatal error. sd0(ncr0:0:0): COMMAND FAILED (9 ff) @ f0559400 ncr0: reset by timeout sd0(ncr0:0:0): FAST SCSI-2 100ns (10MB/sec) offset 8. sd0(ncr0:0:0): UNIT ATTENTION asc:29 frn:01, retries:3 fatal trap 12 and a panic screen (I couldn't read my own handwriting any more so there may be some typos in the above). Anyway, it's looking like something is still instable with the ncr53c810 driver. Anyone else running this board successfully? --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de FreeBSD blues 2.1.0-Development FreeBSD 2.1.0-Development #1: Wed Jan 18 10:42:31 1995 kuku@blues:/usr/src/sys/compile/BLUES i386 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 12:03:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA19646 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 12:03:03 -0800 Received: from snoopy.mv.com (snoopy.mv.com [199.125.64.182]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA19640 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 12:02:56 -0800 Received: (from pw@localhost) by snoopy.mv.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA00553; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:02:15 -0500 Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:02:15 -0500 From: "Paul F. Werkowski" Message-Id: <199501212002.PAA00553@snoopy.mv.com> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: <199501211629.SAA01669@grunt.grondar.za> (message from Mark Murray on Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:29:36 +0200) Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Mark" == Mark Murray writes: >> BTW, as a related NEC thing, does anyone out there have a NEC >> CDR-200 or NEC CDR-210 (I think the first is also called the >> 2Vi, the second is the OEM model) that works with audio cd >> player commands? As far as I can tell NEC doesn't use the >> SCSI-2 spec for audio cd player commands, because the only O/S >> that can play audio CDs with this drive for me is MSDOS/Windows >> using the Adaptec ASPI stuff. Windows NT, NetBSD, and FreeBSD >> all barf on it. Once I manage to get the 4Xi probed it seems to work ok. I tried xcdplayer and even that worked - except maybe for volume control. This drive sure does like to send BUSY status back to the software though, especially when the disk get ejected! Xcdplayer could be more sane in how it handles error returns from ioctls rather than filling the screen with perror complaints. Looks like I've got a lot to learn about CDROM drives. Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 12:26:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA19859 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 12:26:53 -0800 Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@Seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA19853 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 12:26:48 -0800 Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.9/8.6.9.1) id NAA22481; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:26:31 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199501212026.NAA22481@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: CVS stuff To: gibbs@estienne.CS.Berkeley.EDU (Justin T. Gibbs) Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:26:31 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199501211615.IAA28395@estienne.cs.berkeley.edu> from "Justin T. Gibbs" at Jan 21, 95 08:15:24 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 623 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > As Philippe Charnier wrote: > > | > > Btw. > > > > | NB : the french message says: > > | hardware failure on boot : no keyboard connected > > | press any key to continue > > > > This is the kind of messages that regularly make me laugh. Hell, how > > shall i press a key if there's no keyboard connected? :--) > > Since you cannot boot without the keyboard, the intention is for you to > hit the key once you've re-installed the keyboard or checked the connection. Actually, I've seen some (industrial) PC's that toast the keyboard if you plug/unplug hot (blows the picofuse)... > > -- > Justin T. Gibbs From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 12:41:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id MAA19955 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 12:41:23 -0800 Received: from prosun.first.gmd.de (prosun.first.gmd.de [192.35.150.136]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA19949 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 12:41:19 -0800 Received: from g386bsd.first.gmd.de by prosun.first.gmd.de (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA00127; Sat, 21 Jan 95 21:39:29 +0100 Received: by g386bsd.first.gmd.de (VAA14775); Sat, 21 Jan 1995 21:42:26 +0100 From: Andreas Schulz Message-Id: <199501212042.VAA14775@g386bsd.first.gmd.de> Subject: Re: ncr53c810 To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (Christoph P. Kukulies) Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 21:42:26 +0059 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199501212057.VAA19641@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph P. Kukulies" at Jan 21, 95 09:57:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1252 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I got a PCI/I-486SP3G board today with a DX4 CPU and wanted to change > a FreeBSD-1.1.5 installation into a 2.0-SNAP one. I did not expect that > FreeBSD-1.1.5 ran right away on that board but I was hoping that 2.0-SNAP > did. Unfortunately I get the following right in the moment when /dev nodes > are being built: (typed off screen) > > ncr0 targ 0?: Error (81:10:67) (8/3) @(32594:0) > ncr0: restart fatal error. > sd0(ncr0:0:0): COMMAND FAILED (9 ff) @ f0559400 > ncr0: reset by timeout > sd0(ncr0:0:0): FAST SCSI-2 100ns (10MB/sec) offset 8. > sd0(ncr0:0:0): UNIT ATTENTION asc:29 frn:01, retries:3 > > fatal trap 12 > > and a panic screen > > (I couldn't read my own handwriting any more so there may be some typos in > the above). > > Anyway, it's looking like something is still instable with the ncr53c810 > driver. Anyone else running this board successfully? Yes, i am running a ncr53c810 as my second SCSI Adapter with 5 disks on them without problem. But i have stopped with the kernels before the last VM-Changes in current. ATS ( ats@first.gmd.de or ats@cs.tu-berlin.de ) Andreas Schulz GMD-FIRST 12489 Berlin-Adlershof Rudower Chaussee 5 Gebaeude 13.7 Tel: +49-30-6392-1856/+49-177-2134745 Germany/Europe From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 13:08:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id NAA20220 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:08:30 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA20209 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:08:21 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01638; Mon, 9 Jan 95 08:55:40 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501091555.AA01638@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: guest account: Yggdrasil information To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 9 Jan 95 8:55:39 MST Cc: mcw@hpato.aus.hp.com, cg@FIMP01.fim.uni-linz.ac.at, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <3082.789611216@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Jan 8, 95 04:26:56 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Seriously speaking, FreeBSD core team has always had increasing number >> of volunteers, but seems to be mainly in kernel hacking as this is the >> prime and highest priority activity anyway. But with FreeBSD approaching >> a stable and EXCELLENT status, I believe much attention from various >> volunteers is needed BADLY for building up an environment that is both >> powerful and easy to use. This is particularly true for new users, and >> for presenting FreeBSD image to prospective (commercial) software >> developers who consider software ports. > > Well, folks, at least ONE person agrees with me! :-) > Gee, I actually took this as a call for support for Sean and Soren's ABI compatability work. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 13:13:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id NAA20354 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:13:08 -0800 Received: from epiwrl.entropic.com (root@epiwrl.entropic.com [192.86.164.14]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA20348 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:13:02 -0800 Received: from client.entropic.com (kenh@epiwrl.entropic.com [192.86.164.14]) by epiwrl.entropic.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA10608; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:12:21 -0500 Message-Id: <199501212112.QAA10608@epiwrl.entropic.com> X-Notice: The site "wrl.epi.com" is now known as "entropic.com" To: Mark Murray cc: "Alex R.N. Wetmore" , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:29:36 +0200." <199501211629.SAA01669@grunt.grondar.za> X-Face: "Evs"_GpJ]],xS)b$T2#V&{KfP_i2`TlPrY$Iv9+TQ!6+`~+l)#7I)0xr1>4hfd{#0B4 WIn3jU;bql;{2Uq%zw5bF4?%F&&j8@KaT?#vBGk}u07<+6/`.F-3_GA@6Bq5gN9\+s;_d gD\SW #]iN_U0 KUmOR.P<|um5yPkEpSD@*e` Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:12:19 -0500 From: Ken Hornstein Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> BTW, as a related NEC thing, does anyone out there have a NEC CDR-200 or >> NEC CDR-210 (I think the first is also called the 2Vi, the second is >> the OEM model) that works with audio cd player commands? As far as I >> can tell NEC doesn't use the SCSI-2 spec for audio cd player commands, >> because the only O/S that can play audio CDs with this drive for me is >> MSDOS/Windows using the Adaptec ASPI stuff. Windows NT, NetBSD, and >> FreeBSD all barf on it. > >I have a nec210, and I have the same hassle as you. EZ-SCSI from adaptec >will play music with no problem; so will windoze (if I remember correctly). > >I get all sorts of barf if I try it with FreeBSD-current. >I have a bug report in for this... I recently bought a NEC 3Xi CD-ROM, and I've played with the audio commands on it with a bit. This is what I discovered: - There are two types of audio CD play commands in the SCSI spec. One says "play audio starting at track n, ending at track n". The other says "play audio starting at this minute, second, ending at this minute, second". NEC CD-ROM drives apparantly do NOT support the "play track" command (at least the two I had access to did not). However, I believe someone (Alastair, perhaps?) had ported versionof of xcdplayer that used the minute/ second play commands, and that worked under NetBSD for me. --Ken From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 13:21:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id NAA20432 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:21:47 -0800 Received: from grunt.grondar.za (grunt.grondar.za [196.7.18.129]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA20425 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:21:28 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by grunt.grondar.za (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA01366; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 23:20:25 +0200 Message-Id: <199501212120.XAA01366@grunt.grondar.za> X-Authentication-Warning: grunt.grondar.za: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Ken Hornstein cc: "Alex R.N. Wetmore" , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: NEC 4xi CDROM - what now? Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 23:20:25 +0200 From: Mark Murray Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > - There are two types of audio CD play commands in the SCSI spec. One says > "play audio starting at track n, ending at track n". The other says "play > audio starting at this minute, second, ending at this minute, second". > NEC CD-ROM drives apparantly do NOT support the "play track" command (at > least the two I had access to did not). However, I believe someone > (Alastair, perhaps?) had ported versionof of xcdplayer that used the > minute/second play commands, and that worked under NetBSD for me. Hmmm. There is a cute CDplayer utiliity that runs under MS-DOG that runs _this_ CD player (a nec 210) in both (time/track) modes, so I suspect that this drive has both types. (Unless the table of contents has time info...). I can't remember the name of the utility, but it is part of the Adaptec EZ-SCSI kit. M -- Mark Murray 46 Harvey Rd, Claremont, Cape Town 7700, South Africa +27 21 61-3768 GMT+0200 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 13:31:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id NAA20542 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:31:28 -0800 Received: from inet-gw-3.pa.dec.com (inet-gw-3.pa.dec.com [16.1.0.33]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA20536 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 13:31:16 -0800 Received: from tartufo.pcs.dec.com by inet-gw-3.pa.dec.com (5.65/10Aug94) id AA12389; Sat, 21 Jan 95 13:27:33 -0800 Received: by tartufo.pcs.dec.com (/\=-/\ Smail3.1.16.1 #16.39) id ; Sat, 21 Jan 95 22:27 MET Message-Id: Date: Sat, 21 Jan 95 22:27 MET From: me@tartufo.pcs.dec.com (Michael Elbel) To: ats@g386bsd.first.gmd.de Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: ncr53c810 Newsgroups: pcs.freebsd.hackers References: <199501212057.VAA19641@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> <199501212042.VAA14775@g386bsd.first.gmd.de> Reply-To: me%dude.pcs.dec.com@inet-gw-2.pa.dec.com Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In pcs.freebsd.hackers you write: >> did. Unfortunately I get the following right in the moment when /dev nodes >> are being built: (typed off screen) >> >> ncr0 targ 0?: Error (81:10:67) (8/3) @(32594:0) >> ncr0: restart fatal error. >> sd0(ncr0:0:0): COMMAND FAILED (9 ff) @ f0559400 >> ncr0: reset by timeout >> sd0(ncr0:0:0): FAST SCSI-2 100ns (10MB/sec) offset 8. >> sd0(ncr0:0:0): UNIT ATTENTION asc:29 frn:01, retries:3 >> >> fatal trap 12 >> >> and a panic screen >> >> (I couldn't read my own handwriting any more so there may be some typos in >> the above). >> >> Anyway, it's looking like something is still instable with the ncr53c810 >> driver. Anyone else running this board successfully? >Yes, i am running a ncr53c810 as my second SCSI Adapter with 5 disks >on them without problem. But i have stopped with the kernels before >the last VM-Changes in current. Hmm, a coworker got something similar with a ASUS board with DX2/66, onboard ncr under 2.0-BETA and 2.0-REL with a single fast IBM 1GIG drive. We verified that it must have been the drive/controller combo since a much slower 80MB drive worked well. I'm pretty sure it was some sort of timeouts, it consistently appeared when the cpio floppy was extracted, i.e. the first time larger writes appeared. Since he then successfully installed Linux and took the machine home, I haven't had a chance to investigate that setup further and thus didn't send a bug report. *Could* it be that some sort of race condition can happen when using a fast disk drive with a builtin NCR controller? Michael -- Michael Elbel, Digital-PCS GmbH, Muenchen, Germany - me@FreeBSD.org Fermentation fault (coors dumped) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 14:33:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id OAA21521 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 14:33:27 -0800 Received: from alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (wraith@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.8.202]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA21511 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 14:33:23 -0800 Received: (wraith@localhost) by alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (8.6.9/8.6.8) id QAA19049; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:32:52 -0600 From: Robert Michael Gorichanaz Message-Id: <199501212232.QAA19049@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu> Subject: NE2100 16-bit ethernet card ?'s To: pirzyk@fa.disney.com Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:32:51 -0600 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "pirzyk@fa.disney.com" at Jan 21, 95 03:39:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha3] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 791 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quick question: Is the NE2100 16-bit busmastering ethernet card a supported card? I've been fiddling around with one for over 2 hours now, and cannot seem to get the OS to even see the card. I'm using: device ed1 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 3 iomem 0xc8000 vector edintr The default OS configuration of port 0x300 and IOMEM 0xD8000 are not possible with this card. I'm using the 1/12/95 SNAP of the OS. This is a generic 386dx40 system with a mono video card and simple IDE controller - 1 serial port. -W- -- / /| \ O For all you ORIGIN needs, | \`o.O' | Ack! Thptptptpt! -+- the Avatar is IN. | =(___)= | | \ U / wraith@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu Games, hardware, and comments. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 15:27:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA22321 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:27:12 -0800 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA22303 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:27:08 -0800 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA00703; Sat, 21 Jan 95 16:21:05 MST From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9501212321.AA00703@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... To: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com (Rodney W. Grimes) Date: Sat, 21 Jan 95 16:21:05 MST Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501210716.XAA02826@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> from "Rodney W. Grimes" at Jan 20, 95 11:16:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > How can the SCSI disk be accessed, unless it has installed its bios, in > > which case the IDE disk BIOS is not active? > > IDE disks do not require any special BIOS support. We can not boot from > a disk that has not had BIOS support installed via int 13 hooking. This is not true. There *must* be code to actually *do* something when you do an int-13 call. Even if this is the *default* code, the int-13 vector is hooked in order to instantiate the code. That you can only have one hook or the other is the whole crux of the problem. > > The one scenario I can see this failing is on a boot to a device that > > DOS thinks is device 0 but BSD thinks is device 1 because it probes > > both controllers regardless of which BIOS is active. > > Take a system with 1 IDE drive and n SCSI drives. > DOS drive BSD drive BSD unit rootdev(maj,min) > 0x80 wd0 0 0,0 > 0x81 sd0 0 4,0 > 0x82 sd1 1 4,1 > ... > > Now make it more complicated, 2 IDE drives, n SCSI drives: > 0x80 wd0 0 0,0 > 0x81 wd1 1 0,1 > 0x82 sd0 0 4,0 > 0x83 sd1 1 4,1 > > The current code can handle booting from either wd0 or sd0 in > the first case. It can only boot from wd0 or wd1 in the second > case. OK, I definitely agree with most of this, only your first example is flawed... 1) The BIOS does the boot by making INT 13 calls following the POST. 2) The INT 13 hook active is *either* the wd0/1 hook *or* the sd0/1 hook. 3) In the first case, you can *only* boot from the wd controller *or* the sd controller. Both BIOS hooks to INT 13 can *not* be active simultaneously. 4) Your DOS drive numbering is invalid, unless the post-boot OS hacks the INT 13 vector with something more than simple BIOS code -- specifically, an INT 13 redirector that does DOS drive number translation before calling the previous-to-load POST initialized INT 13 vector, if the drive number is less than or equal to 0x80 OR'ed with the number of drives (option base 0). Admittedly, the Adaptec supplied drivers for use in the config.sys file will do this, but they require that you disable the Adaptec BIOS and load DOS first from the wd controller. > The current code is broken in some respects, and the above change > also breaks some things. I think the break is a result of device probe precedence. The issue is determining which controller is the one that had the INT 13 that loaded the boot code hooked. If you look at the pfdisk code, the day to do this is to probably ask for the actual drive geometry instead of the translated geometry, and then start comparing geometries post kernel load (in the kernel code itself) to determine which if the controllers that probed as present was in fact the controller that acted as the boot device. The failure mode introduced by this is when you have multiple SCSI controllers, only one with BIOS enabled, with identical drives in the drive position order of the boot device on one of the controllers. This is a failure to identify the boot device, and once again becomes an issue of probe order (although that issue is then a soft-probe issue and has more to do with which controller line is first in the kernel configuration. The controller with the BIOS enabled should be probed first. A potential outside possibility also exists that you will configure the DOS drive numbers 0x80 and 0x81 to other than the sequentially first and second devices on a particular SCSI controller. I suppose you could argue that one might want to do this to get around the BIOS drive limits to cause more than two possible boot devices. One would think, in that case, that the boot device disklabel would encode its own SCSI ID to help guard against the possiblity, and to allow for user modification of the data, if all else fails. Most of the above consist of fallback options for a user who is hell bent on confusing the code and will go to any lengths to achieve that goal. 8-). > > If this is the case, I thoght that it had been taken care of already > > by causing the SCSI controller to probe prior to the WD controller? > > It is not a matter of probe order, it is a matter of what value gets > passed to locore.s as the bootdev. Well, I think probe order has something to do with which device the kernel gets when it dereferences the drive table using that device ID. 8-). > > Which do you mean? > > Seems like a probe order problem. > > The real crux of the problem is how to map BIOS unit numbers to > rootdev/bootdev devices numbers for the kernel. The current code does > not work quite right, nor does the above proposed hack really fix the > problem. I can agree with this statement, and would probably go further and say that there *will* be some cases that are impossible to resove, simply because the user has out clevered themself. To do this, they will have had to overcome the safeties by understanding them and actively subverting them, or by trying to pack too much complexity into their system configuration, resulting in more portential boot devices and a more complex kernel configuration than is even possible without using custom kernels (in which case it was their responsibility to deal with the problem in their kernel config). Now if we could only replace the hardware boot loader... 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 15:31:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA22484 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:31:10 -0800 Received: from alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (wraith@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.8.202]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA22478 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:31:00 -0800 Received: (wraith@localhost) by alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (8.6.9/8.6.8) id RAA16045; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 17:30:48 -0600 From: Robert Michael Gorichanaz Message-Id: <199501212330.RAA16045@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu> Subject: NE2100 questions To: questions@freebsd-org Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 17:30:48 -0600 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha3] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 752 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm not sure if my last post got mangled, so.... I'm trying to get my FreeBSD box to recognize a Novel NE2100 ethernet card (its the 16bit busmaster). I've tried the ed and ep drivers, with just about every combination of irq/port/iomem I can think of, but cannot get these cards to be seen by the operating system on boot-up. Are they even supported? I know the NE2000 is, but what about the 2100's? Am I just doing something wrong? FYI: Using 950112-SNAP of the OS. -- / /| \ O For all you ORIGIN needs, | \`o.O' | Ack! Thptptptpt! -+- the Avatar is IN. | =(___)= | | \ U / wraith@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu Games, hardware, and comments. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 15:32:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id PAA22533 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:32:44 -0800 Received: from alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (wraith@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.8.202]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA22527; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 15:32:40 -0800 Received: (wraith@localhost) by alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (8.6.9/8.6.8) id RAA20898; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 17:32:24 -0600 From: Robert Michael Gorichanaz Message-Id: <199501212332.RAA20898@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu> Subject: Re: Returned mail: Host unknown (Name server: freebsd-org: host not found) To: MAILER-DAEMON@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (Mail Delivery Subsystem) Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 17:32:22 -0600 (CST) Cc: questions@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501212330.RAA25130@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu> from "Mail Delivery Subsystem" at Jan 21, 95 05:30:56 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha3] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 753 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm not sure if my last post got mangled, so.... I'm trying to get my FreeBSD box to recognize a Novel NE2100 ethernet card (its the 16bit busmaster). I've tried the ed and ep drivers, with just about every combination of irq/port/iomem I can think of, but cannot get these cards to be seen by the operating system on boot-up. Are they even supported? I know the NE2000 is, but what about the 2100's? Am I just doing something wrong? FYI: Using 950112-SNAP of the OS. -- / /| \ O For all you ORIGIN needs, | \`o.O' | Ack! Thptptptpt! -+- the Avatar is IN. | =(___)= | | \ U / wraith@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu Games, hardware, and comments. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 16:16:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id QAA23022 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:16:01 -0800 Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA23016 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:16:00 -0800 Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; id AA03123; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 19:15:47 -0500 Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 19:15:47 -0500 From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <9501220015.AA03123@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: SCSI BIOS (was Re: More serial console stuff...) In-Reply-To: <9501212321.AA00703@cs.weber.edu> References: <199501210716.XAA02826@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> <9501212321.AA00703@cs.weber.edu> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk < This is not true. There *must* be code to actually *do* something when > you do an int-13 call. Even if this is the *default* code, the int-13 > vector is hooked in order to instantiate the code. It's not ``hooked'', it's always there. No PC since the XT has ever come with a BIOS that did not have built-in INT 13 support for these sorts of controllers. > That you can only have one hook or the other is the whole crux of the > problem. Wrong on both counts. > 2) The INT 13 hook active is *either* the wd0/1 hook *or* the > sd0/1 hook. > 3) In the first case, you can *only* boot from the wd controller > *or* the sd controller. Both BIOS hooks to INT 13 can *not* > be active simultaneously. Of course they can! cmpb %al, (some address) jnb scsi_bios jmp (address of previous INT 13 entry point) -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 16:20:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id QAA23334 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:20:17 -0800 Received: from alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (wraith@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.8.202]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA23328 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:20:15 -0800 Received: (wraith@localhost) by alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (8.6.9/8.6.8) id SAA27729; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:20:04 -0600 From: Robert Michael Gorichanaz Message-Id: <199501220020.SAA27729@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu> Subject: NE2100 ethernet q's To: wraith@csd.uwm.edu (Robert Michael Gorichanaz) Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 18:20:02 -0600 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501212332.RAA20898@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu> from "Robert Michael Gorichanaz" at Jan 21, 95 05:32:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha3] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 752 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm not sure if my last post got mangled, so.... I'm trying to get my FreeBSD box to recognize a Novel NE2100 ethernet card (its the 16bit busmaster). I've tried the ed and ep drivers, with just about every combination of irq/port/iomem I can think of, but cannot get these cards to be seen by the operating system on boot-up. Are they even supported? I know the NE2000 is, but what about the 2100's? Am I just doing something wrong? FYI: Using 950112-SNAP of the OS. --- / /| \ O For all you ORIGIN needs, | \`o.O' | Ack! Thptptptpt! -+- the Avatar is IN. | =(___)= | | \ U / wraith@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu Games, hardware, and comments. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 16:36:50 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id QAA24501 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:36:50 -0800 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA24477 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 16:36:43 -0800 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA02096 for ; Sun, 22 Jan 1995 01:37:08 +0100 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA04964 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Sun, 22 Jan 1995 01:34:54 +0200 Received: by iafnl.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA04736 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Sat, 21 Jan 1995 22:30:03 +0100 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.8/8.6.6) id WAA00143 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 22:19:08 +0100 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199501212119.WAA00143@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: 2.0R cpio flop problem To: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 22:19:08 +1596657 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 724 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Maybe I didn't pay attention or so, and missed something... Problem: hard errors while unpacking cpio flop on 2.0R install. All stuff comes from the 2.0 CDrom. Tried various floppys, floppies are perfectly readable on my main machine, but give trouble when installing them on the testbox. Testbox: 386/25 (Intel mainboard), WD1007 ESDI controller (also for the floppy). This system ran 1.1.5 quite happily. Suggestions? _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 17:19:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id RAA27101 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 17:19:55 -0800 Received: from prosun.first.gmd.de (prosun.first.gmd.de [192.35.150.136]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA27093 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 17:19:42 -0800 Received: from g386bsd.first.gmd.de by prosun.first.gmd.de (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA00440; Sun, 22 Jan 95 01:53:11 +0100 Received: by g386bsd.first.gmd.de (BAA26662); Sun, 22 Jan 1995 01:56:09 +0100 From: Andreas Schulz Message-Id: <199501220056.BAA26662@g386bsd.first.gmd.de> Subject: Re: NE2100 ethernet q's To: wraith@csd.uwm.edu (Robert Michael Gorichanaz) Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 01:56:09 +0059 (MET) Cc: wraith@csd.uwm.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199501220020.SAA27729@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu> from "Robert Michael Gorichanaz" at Jan 21, 95 06:20:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 772 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I'm trying to get my FreeBSD box to recognize a Novel NE2100 ethernet card > (its the 16bit busmaster). I've tried the ed and ep drivers, with just about > every combination of irq/port/iomem I can think of, but cannot get these > cards to be seen by the operating system on boot-up. > Are they even supported? I know the NE2000 is, but what about the 2100's? > Am I just doing something wrong? > FYI: Using 950112-SNAP of the OS. You are using the wrong drivers :-). Try out the is0 driver, or if you are generating a kernel out of the sources, the new lnc driver. ATS ( ats@first.gmd.de or ats@cs.tu-berlin.de ) Andreas Schulz GMD-FIRST 12489 Berlin-Adlershof Rudower Chaussee 5 Gebaeude 13.7 Tel: +49-30-6392-1856/+49-177-2134745 Germany/Europe From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Jan 21 21:55:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) id VAA29402 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 21:55:35 -0800 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.9/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA29396 for ; Sat, 21 Jan 1995 21:55:21 -0800 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA31999; Sun, 22 Jan 1995 16:47:34 +1100 Date: Sun, 22 Jan 1995 16:47:34 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199501220547.QAA31999@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: More serial console stuff... Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> IDE disks do not require any special BIOS support. We can not boot from >> a disk that has not had BIOS support installed via int 13 hooking. >This is not true. There *must* be code to actually *do* something when >you do an int-13 call. Even if this is the *default* code, the int-13 >vector is hooked in order to instantiate the code. All BIOS's have code to support IDE disks. >That you can only have one hook or the other is the whole crux of the >problem. No, hooks form a chain. You can have as many as will fit in memory. >> Take a system with 1 IDE drive and n SCSI drives. >> DOS drive BSD drive BSD unit rootdev(maj,min) >> 0x80 wd0 0 0,0 >> 0x81 sd0 0 4,0 >> 0x82 sd1 1 4,1 >OK, I definitely agree with most of this, only your first example is >flawed... >1) The BIOS does the boot by making INT 13 calls following the > POST. >2) The INT 13 hook active is *either* the wd0/1 hook *or* the > sd0/1 hook. >3) In the first case, you can *only* boot from the wd controller > *or* the sd controller. Both BIOS hooks to INT 13 can *not* > be active simultaneously. I thought the example was a real one. It's easy for the sd driver to make it work, e.g.: unit = drive & 0x7f; if (unit > max_sd_unit) /* max_sd_unit = min_sd_unit * + nr_sd_units - 1 */ return ERROR; if (unit < min_sd_unit) /* min_sd_unit = number of drives * at the time we hooked */ jumpto(saved_vector); /* restore regs and continue with * the driver that owned INT 0x13 * at the time we hooked */ unit -= min_sd_unit; /* actual SCSI unit number */ Whether the bootstrap can determine all the mappings done by all the hooked drivers is another question. >4) Your DOS drive numbering is invalid, unless the post-boot OS > hacks the INT 13 vector with something more than simple BIOS > code -- specifically, an INT 13 redirector that does DOS > drive number translation before calling the previous-to-load > POST initialized INT 13 vector, if the drive number is less > than or equal to 0x80 OR'ed with the number of drives (option DOS is not involved, except for the special version of the bootstrap that boots from DOS. Complicated redirections are just more likely if DOS has been used to load special drivers. Bruce