From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 00:08:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA13840 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:08:40 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA13814 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:08:16 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA26747; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:07:28 +0800 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:07:27 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Joerg Wunsch Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <199508190957.LAA03274@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, J Wunsch wrote: > > It's been just a ten-liner or so to convince the system dedicating 36 > out of 64 MB for the file system buffer cache (after getting some > hints from David). The remaining RAM still proves sufficient for two > concurrent compilations of large and bloated C++/X11 applications, > btw. :-) > > I have no idea if similar tricks would be possible under FreeBSD 2. What are the tricks involved? I would be interested in putting together a fast 486 PCI box with 48 megs of RAM and seeing just how well it can handle NFS requests from 120+ simultaneous users spread out over about 20 gigs of disk. What kind of performance are you getting out of your 1.1.5.1 machine? -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 00:17:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA14196 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:17:19 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA14153 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:16:49 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA26772; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:16:12 +0800 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:16:12 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Terry Lambert cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <9508191751.AA19996@cs.weber.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > You can turn on async writes in the BSD NFS server. I tried that out with some dramatic results: (with untweaked kernel) MB reclen bytes/sec written bytes/sec read 1 512 116914 298925 1 1024 150806 234236 1 2048 159973 395922 1 4096 134756 591267 1 8192 124853 630130 2 512 137942 643730 2 1024 127462 514244 2 2048 134486 518215 2 4096 130371 544493 2 8192 130816 522247 [...] (with tweaked kernel) MB reclen bytes/sec written bytes/sec read 1 512 860370 621378 1 1024 798915 729444 1 2048 877240 762600 1 4096 762600 430185 1 8192 854889 710146 2 512 820903 731431 2 1024 801299 619943 2 2048 762600 600526 2 4096 789516 674460 2 8192 836247 719666 [...] > Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too, this is a cache > coherency violation and can result in Bad Things Happening [...] I think it was Garrett who remarked that the whole idea of stateless NFS was a gross violation of filesystem consistency. ;-) > One alternative is to use NFSv3 on both the client and the server. > This means going all BSD or including OSF/1, Does this include BSD/OS 2.0 as well? -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 00:24:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA14625 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:24:38 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA14611 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:24:32 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA26794; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:23:50 +0800 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:23:48 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Dmitry Khrustalev cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, Terry Lambert Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Dmitry Khrustalev wrote: > > Wrong, Sun had never included a method for enabling async writes in their os. > ( other than adb, anyway). Ditto SVR4. SGI ships their boxes with async > writes turned on by default, their reasoning is that every server is > protected by UPS. Blah. :( An interesting side note, comparing async NFS servers on a 486 and an R8000-based SGI server: (FreeBSD) MB reclen bytes/sec written bytes/sec read 1 512 780335 729444 1 1024 838860 745654 1 2048 871543 758292 1 4096 766958 771366 1 8192 849479 749819 2 512 852176 628654 2 1024 794187 754032 2 2048 865920 693631 2 4096 780335 762600 2 8192 808540 754032 4 512 798915 586103 4 1024 772476 572967 4 2048 808540 725501 4 4096 822160 568719 4 8192 797727 603904 8 512 639512 659951 8 1024 836899 708272 8 2048 843473 584508 8 4096 851500 681308 8 8192 838860 643344 16 512 862789 642574 16 1024 833650 672981 16 2048 836573 549509 16 4096 839188 693407 16 8192 822790 701792 (PowerChallenge M) MB reclen bytes/sec written bytes/sec read 1 512 729444 276737 1 1024 512281 322638 1 2048 571139 358870 1 4096 459649 358870 1 8192 695428 358870 2 512 686535 334290 2 1024 573580 256630 2 2048 618514 340654 2 4096 656321 361772 2 8192 684784 359833 4 512 631612 346815 4 1024 601199 357199 4 2048 608007 321095 4 4096 608697 345032 4 8192 562168 293532 8 512 580714 244811 8 1024 588029 351815 8 2048 641039 330382 8 4096 558077 335020 8 8192 559240 310061 16 512 590942 340870 16 1024 539840 320328 16 2048 563348 383205 16 4096 461526 392377 16 8192 534731 389530 In both cases, the CPU was running the same 100x100x20 cellular automaton code, with ~2% idle time. NFS on the SGI slows down to a crawl, especially on directory lookups, but the FreeBSD box putters along at roughly the same speed, but at the expense of the simulation execution speed. Does FreeBSD just happen to give disk-bound processes higher scheduling priority than IRIX 6.01, and is this a tunable paramter? -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 00:26:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA14756 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:26:19 -0700 Received: from sunny.bog.msu.su (sunny.bog.msu.su [158.250.20.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA14748 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:26:14 -0700 Received: (from dima@localhost) by sunny.bog.msu.su (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA00806; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:23:00 +0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:22:59 +0400 (????) From: Dmitry Khrustalev To: David Greenman cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <199508200552.WAA00268@corbin.Root.COM> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, David Greenman wrote: > >> > >> > What can I do to improve NFS writes to a FreeBSD server? The > >> > machine was idle at the time, with four nfsd's running. Should I be > >> > using UDP or TCP (I turned both on)? > >> > > > >Assuming you are running 2.1 branch: current (2.2) code includes support > >for write gathering, which can improve large write performance. > >Be warned: 2.2 kernel is incompatible with 2.1 user space utilities. > > If there is interest, I'll implement an NFS_ASYNC kernel option for both > FreeBSD 2.1 and 2.2. Kernel option or per filesystem option? Switching it on for all filesystems at once is evil. And if nfs3 data corruption problems are resolved, this option will not have any real value. -Dima > > -DG > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 00:42:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA15454 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:42:03 -0700 Received: from mail.infinet.com (ns.infinet.com [198.30.154.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA15448 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:42:00 -0700 Received: by mail.infinet.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #9) id m0sk4xR-000JjGC; Sun, 20 Aug 95 03:38 EDT Message-Id: From: macgyver@infinet.com (Wilson Liaw) Subject: IDE/EIDE bug affect FreeBSD?? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 03:38:13 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 359 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Can someone verify if the so called "IDE/EIDE bug" in fact affect FreeBSD or not? for more info on this thing, look at http://www.powerquest.com under the PCI hardware problem. I realize that FreeBSD only has IDE driver, but I do not understand the nature of the bug well enough to know if the bug will affect a OS which access a PCI EIDE card in IDE mode. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 00:43:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA15530 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:43:20 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA15514 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:43:12 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA26885; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:43:04 +0800 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:43:03 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: FREEBSD-HACKERS-L Subject: Page fault caused by... Pine? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I had a strange kernel panic today... the boss was just reading her mail in Pine 3.91 in an xterm when the machine simply locked up and rebooted itself. Pine has worked flawlessly on all other machines and on her particular one up until the panic, so I'm lead to believe it was caused by a hardware problem. The case on that computer was opened up today to install a new DX4 chip, but the motherboard can't take one, so no changes were made. It is still running its original DX2/66 CPU. I didn't see any obvious signs of damage or loose bits on the motherboard, but I swapped her machine for one of our other DX4/100's in the meantime. The DX2/66 hasn't behaved strangely since then. Any ideas? Or should I chalk this one up to a stray cosmic ray? Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode fault virtual address = 0x38 fault code = supervisor read, page not present instruction pointer = 0x8:0xf012aad1 code segment = base 0x0, limit 0xfffff, type 0x1b = DPL 0, pres 1, def32 1, gran 1 processor eflags = interrupt enabled, resume, IOPL = 0 current process = 207 (pine) interrupt mask = panic: page fault syncing disks... 3 3 done Automatic reboot in 15 seconds - press a key on the console to abort Rebooting... -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 00:49:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA15707 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:49:43 -0700 Received: from mail.infinet.com (ns.infinet.com [198.30.154.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA15700 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:49:41 -0700 Received: by mail.infinet.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #9) id m0sk54s-000JizC; Sun, 20 Aug 95 03:45 EDT Message-Id: From: macgyver@infinet.com (Wilson Liaw) Subject: Re: FBSD image To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 03:45:53 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <29262.808805918@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 18, 95 09:18:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 589 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Hey, you'd be surprised. Even though Walnut Creek CDROM will no > longer be using him on future CDs or in advertising (they don't like > using a logo owned by someone else [Kirk] and I can't say I blame > them; they're a business with tangible investments in such imagery), > he is VERY popular in Japan! For some reason, cute things with bulgy > eyes just hit a serious chort in the Japanese psyche and Chuck (the > daemon) seems to fill the bill nicely. hmmm... will Walnut Creek CDROM continue to do the demon T-shirt even thought the demon will no longer be used in advertising? From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 00:56:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA15937 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:56:48 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA15931 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 00:56:45 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA17373; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:56:20 -0600 Message-Id: <199508200756.BAA17373@rover.village.org> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: Your message of Fri, 18 Aug 1995 16:50:31 PDT Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:56:19 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk : "I need some help with the PR here!" One thing I've noticed is that Linux people put out lots of press releases. I've not seen the same for FreeBSD. Maybe I've missed them. Maybe someone associated with FreeBSD needs to do this same? Just my two cents. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 01:06:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA16580 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:06:54 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA16572 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:06:49 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id BAA00634; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:05:21 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id BAA00373; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:07:33 -0700 Message-Id: <199508200807.BAA00373@corbin.Root.COM> To: Brian Tao cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Joerg Wunsch Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 95 15:07:27 +0800." From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:07:31 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, J Wunsch wrote: >> >> It's been just a ten-liner or so to convince the system dedicating 36 >> out of 64 MB for the file system buffer cache (after getting some >> hints from David). The remaining RAM still proves sufficient for two >> concurrent compilations of large and bloated C++/X11 applications, >> btw. :-) >> >> I have no idea if similar tricks would be possible under FreeBSD 2. > > What are the tricks involved? I would be interested in putting >together a fast 486 PCI box with 48 megs of RAM and seeing just how >well it can handle NFS requests from 120+ simultaneous users spread >out over about 20 gigs of disk. What kind of performance are you >getting out of your 1.1.5.1 machine? FreeBSD 2.0.5 and beyond will automatically use all free memory for file caching...no hacks are needed. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 01:23:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA17234 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:23:04 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA17228 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:23:00 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id BAA00651; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:21:41 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id BAA00409; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:23:53 -0700 Message-Id: <199508200823.BAA00409@corbin.Root.COM> To: Dmitry Khrustalev cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 95 11:22:59 +0400." From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:23:52 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, David Greenman wrote: > >> >> >> >> > What can I do to improve NFS writes to a FreeBSD server? The >> >> > machine was idle at the time, with four nfsd's running. Should I be >> >> > using UDP or TCP (I turned both on)? >> >> >> > >> >Assuming you are running 2.1 branch: current (2.2) code includes support >> >for write gathering, which can improve large write performance. >> >Be warned: 2.2 kernel is incompatible with 2.1 user space utilities. >> >> If there is interest, I'll implement an NFS_ASYNC kernel option for both >> FreeBSD 2.1 and 2.2. > >Kernel option or per filesystem option? Switching it on for all >filesystems at once is evil. And if nfs3 data corruption problems are >resolved, this option will not have any real value. Initially I was planning on just a kernel option that would enable it for all NFS exports. I could make it per-export by adding an option to /etc/exports, modifying mountd to grok it, passing it to the kernel, etc, but this is starting to become a real project. Regarding NFSv3: v3 is only an option if you have clients that support it. This is actually quite rare and would limit it's use to modern FreeBSD boxes. ...and of course, FreeBSD 2.1 doesn't have v3 and I don't intend to add it before the release. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 01:24:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA17282 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:24:42 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA17276 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:24:39 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id BAA00655; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:23:19 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id BAA00426; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:25:31 -0700 Message-Id: <199508200825.BAA00426@corbin.Root.COM> To: Brian Tao cc: FREEBSD-HACKERS-L Subject: Re: Page fault caused by... Pine? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 95 15:43:03 +0800." From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:25:31 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Fatal trap 12: page fault while in kernel mode >fault virtual address = 0x38 >fault code = supervisor read, page not present >instruction pointer = 0x8:0xf012aad1 I'm going to need a list of the kernel routines around the above address before I can help... nm /kernel | sort. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 01:25:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA17334 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:25:26 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA17328 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:25:24 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA02514; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:24:49 -0700 Message-Id: <199508200824.BAA02514@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Brian Tao cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:16:12 +0800." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:24:48 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Brian , Curious what are the actual numbers for your disk in the system running the NFS server? Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 01:37:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA17761 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:37:00 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA17755 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:36:54 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA02637; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:36:31 -0700 Message-Id: <199508200836.BAA02637@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Warner Losh cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:56:19 MDT." <199508200756.BAA17373@rover.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:36:30 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>> Warner Losh said: > : "I need some help with the PR here!" > > One thing I've noticed is that Linux people put out lots of press > releases. I've not seen the same for FreeBSD. Maybe I've missed > them. > > Maybe someone associated with FreeBSD needs to do this same? > Write a key program for the Web and make sure that is identify by a cool FreeBSD sign One day, I will write my DOS box you click on it expands and contracts and it cries like a baby. Or window which goes to sleep and snorls 8) Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 01:46:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA18097 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:46:23 -0700 Received: from sunny.bog.msu.su (sunny.bog.msu.su [158.250.20.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA18091 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:46:17 -0700 Received: (from dima@localhost) by sunny.bog.msu.su (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA00910; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:43:03 +0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:43:02 +0400 (????) From: Dmitry Khrustalev To: David Greenman cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <199508200823.BAA00409@corbin.Root.COM> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, David Greenman wrote: > > > >On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, David Greenman wrote: > > > >> >> > >> >> > What can I do to improve NFS writes to a FreeBSD server? The > >> >> > machine was idle at the time, with four nfsd's running. Should I be > >> >> > using UDP or TCP (I turned both on)? > >> >> > >> > > >> >Assuming you are running 2.1 branch: current (2.2) code includes support > >> >for write gathering, which can improve large write performance. > >> >Be warned: 2.2 kernel is incompatible with 2.1 user space utilities. > >> > >> If there is interest, I'll implement an NFS_ASYNC kernel option for both > >> FreeBSD 2.1 and 2.2. > > > >Kernel option or per filesystem option? Switching it on for all > >filesystems at once is evil. And if nfs3 data corruption problems are > >resolved, this option will not have any real value. > > Initially I was planning on just a kernel option that would enable it > for all NFS exports. I could make it per-export by adding an option to > /etc/exports, modifying mountd to grok it, passing it to the kernel, etc, > but this is starting to become a real project. This is how SGI does it: they have wsync option in /etc/exports. Of course having it off by default is *bad*. > Regarding NFSv3: v3 is only an option if you have clients that support it. > This is actually quite rare and would limit it's use to modern FreeBSD boxes. It will be quite common when Sun ships SunOS 5.5, and it is supposed to ship this year. Dec and Sgi already support it. > ...and of course, FreeBSD 2.1 doesn't have v3 and I don't intend to add it > before the release. Speaking of different nfs versions in 2.1 and 2.2: is it possible to add kernel interface version identifier? It will be much better if userspace programs fail gracefully on version mismatch instead of current behavior. -Dima From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 01:57:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA18490 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:57:47 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA18480 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:57:38 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA25392; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:57:35 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA09028 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:57:34 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA27131 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:21:33 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508200821.KAA27131@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: whereis whereis? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:21:31 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 874 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Can anybody comment on this? WHEREIS(1) UNIX Reference Manual WHEREIS(1) NAME whereis - locate programs ... COMPATIBILITY The historic flags and arguments for the whereis utility are no longer available in this version. ... So whereis(1) now finally degraded to which(1) (sort of). I always appreciated the ability of those ``historic flags and arguments'' to locate the source and/or man page: j@uriah 378% whereis ls /bin/ls j@uriah 379% head -3 /cd/RELNOTES.TXT RELEASE NOTES FreeBSD Release 1.1 j@uriah 380% /cd/filesys/usr/bin/whereis ls ls: /usr/src/bin/ls /bin/ls -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 02:12:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA20376 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 02:12:56 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id CAA20367 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 02:12:48 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA25638; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:11:12 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id LAA09142; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:11:11 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA27466; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:03:44 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508200903.LAA27466@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: davidg@root.com Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:03:43 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de In-Reply-To: <199508200807.BAA00373@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Aug 20, 95 01:07:31 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 430 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk (Sorry, i'm not yet back on -hackers, so i'm going to miss pieces.) > FreeBSD 2.0.5 and beyond will automatically use all free memory for file > caching...no hacks are needed. The idea was not to use the _free_ memory, but _dedicate_ a large amount of memory for the buffer cache. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 04:20:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA24792 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:20:13 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA24784 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:20:09 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA01114 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Sun, 20 Aug 1995 06:17:50 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA10221; 20 Aug 95 06:09:21 CDT (Sun) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA10218; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 06:09:20 -0500 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 06:09:20 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508201109.GAA10218@bonkers.taronga.com> To: dima@bog.msu.su Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers References: <199508200304.UAA27630@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Be warned: 2.2 kernel is incompatible with 2.1 user space utilities. I assume this is a temporary situation. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 04:29:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA25143 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:29:58 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA25137 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:29:56 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id EAA00831; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:28:36 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id EAA00548; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:30:48 -0700 Message-Id: <199508201130.EAA00548@corbin.Root.COM> To: Peter da Silva cc: dima@bog.msu.su, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 95 06:09:20 CDT." <199508201109.GAA10218@bonkers.taronga.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:30:48 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>Be warned: 2.2 kernel is incompatible with 2.1 user space utilities. > >I assume this is a temporary situation. He means certain system utilities. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 04:59:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA26120 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:59:00 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA26109 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:58:55 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id EAA00196 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:58:06 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id EAA00626 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:59:47 -0700 Message-Id: <199508201159.EAA00626@corbin.Root.COM> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NFS_ASYNC patch (for 2.1) From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 04:59:47 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk For those that would like to try async NFS, attached is the patch for the 2.1-stable branch. Add 'options NFS_ASYNC' to your kernel config file to enable. -DG Index: nfs_serv.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/nfs/nfs_serv.c,v retrieving revision 1.15 diff -c -r1.15 nfs_serv.c *** 1.15 1995/06/11 19:31:45 --- nfs_serv.c 1995/08/20 11:36:12 *************** *** 86,91 **** --- 86,97 ---- nfstype nfs_type[9] = { NFNON, NFREG, NFDIR, NFBLK, NFCHR, NFLNK, NFNON, NFCHR, NFNON }; + #ifdef NFS_ASYNC + int nfs_async = 1; + #else + int nfs_async; + #endif + /* * nqnfs access service */ *************** *** 575,581 **** register long t1; caddr_t bpos; int error = 0, rdonly, cache, siz, len, xfer; ! int ioflags = IO_SYNC | IO_NODELOCKED; char *cp2; struct mbuf *mb, *mb2, *mreq; struct vnode *vp; --- 581,587 ---- register long t1; caddr_t bpos; int error = 0, rdonly, cache, siz, len, xfer; ! int ioflags; char *cp2; struct mbuf *mb, *mb2, *mreq; struct vnode *vp; *************** *** 584,589 **** --- 590,600 ---- struct uio io, *uiop = &io; off_t off; u_quad_t frev; + + if (nfs_async) + ioflags = IO_NODELOCKED; + else + ioflags = IO_SYNC | IO_NODELOCKED; fhp = &nfh.fh_generic; nfsm_srvmtofh(fhp); From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 05:01:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA26376 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:01:29 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA26364 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:01:26 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id FAA00200 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:00:36 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id FAA00642 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:02:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199508201202.FAA00642@corbin.Root.COM> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NFS_ASYNC patch (for -current) From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:02:17 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk This is the equivilent patch for 2.2-current. Again, add 'options NFS_ASYNC' to your kernel config file to enable. -DG Index: nfs_serv.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/nfs/nfs_serv.c,v retrieving revision 1.22 diff -c -r1.22 nfs_serv.c *** 1.22 1995/08/06 11:55:25 --- nfs_serv.c 1995/08/20 05:40:34 *************** *** 92,97 **** --- 92,103 ---- NFFIFO, NFNON }; int nfsrvw_procrastinate = NFS_GATHERDELAY * 1000; + #ifdef NFS_ASYNC + int nfs_async = 1; + #else + int nfs_async; + #endif + /* * nfs v3 access service */ *************** *** 1060,1066 **** error = nfsrv_access(vp, VWRITE, cred, rdonly, procp); } ! if (nfsd->nd_stable == NFSV3WRITE_UNSTABLE) ioflags = IO_NODELOCKED; else if (nfsd->nd_stable == NFSV3WRITE_DATASYNC) ioflags = (IO_SYNC | IO_NODELOCKED); --- 1066,1072 ---- error = nfsrv_access(vp, VWRITE, cred, rdonly, procp); } ! if (nfs_async || nfsd->nd_stable == NFSV3WRITE_UNSTABLE) ioflags = IO_NODELOCKED; else if (nfsd->nd_stable == NFSV3WRITE_DATASYNC) ioflags = (IO_SYNC | IO_NODELOCKED); From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 05:09:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA26748 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:09:42 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA26742 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:09:37 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id FAA00217; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:08:47 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id FAA00686; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:10:29 -0700 Message-Id: <199508201210.FAA00686@corbin.Root.COM> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) cc: taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 95 11:03:43 +0200." <199508200903.LAA27466@uriah.heep.sax.de> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:10:23 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >(Sorry, i'm not yet back on -hackers, so i'm going to miss pieces.) > >> FreeBSD 2.0.5 and beyond will automatically use all free memory for file >> caching...no hacks are needed. > >The idea was not to use the _free_ memory, but _dedicate_ a large >amount of memory for the buffer cache. In the scheme of things it is escentially the same thing. As long as the server doesn't have other things happening on it, eventually nearly all of the memory will become a huge file cache. If the server is also a general purpose development machine or does other memory intensive things, the situation will be different of course...but I don't think that's what we're talking about here. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 05:56:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA27893 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:56:54 -0700 Received: from strider.ibenet.it ([194.179.130.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA27887 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 05:56:47 -0700 Received: (from piero@localhost) by strider.ibenet.it (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA00391; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:54:52 +0200 From: Piero Serini Message-Id: <199508201254.OAA00391@strider.ibenet.it> Subject: Re: FreeBSD(tm) Trademark To: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com (Rodney W. Grimes) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:54:51 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: asami@cs.berkeley.edu, jkh@time.cdrom.com, Piero@strider.ibenet.it, Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199508200348.UAA01024@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> from "Rodney W. Grimes" at Aug 19, 95 08:48:34 pm Reply-To: Piero@strider.ibenet.it Operating-System: FreeBSD 1.1.5.1 X-Phone-Number: +39 (2) 58113562 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1782 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hello. Quoting from Rodney W. Grimes (Sun Aug 20 05:48:34 1995): ... > ready to handle. We can not just allow any one to run around sticking > the word FreeBSD on things, it must be marked ``TM'', and they must > have licensed it. This is yet another detail we must work out, and > we need to start to thinking about it. My lawyers can handle an international registration on behalf of any legal entity you indicate, with fair good discounts on the normal rates. They are 42 lawyers here in Italy, devoted to 'trademarking', they can directly handle any registration in both western and eastern Europe, the United States, China, Honk Kong and they are associated with the major firms in the rest of the world. I have very good prices, and I was very stisfied each time I used their services. I'm not related to them, I'm just a *really* sat- isfied customer. I can directly ask them to perform a reserch on the trademark, but they obviously need a letter from the company (or associa- tion) to actually register the name. Since I think this discussion an get very techincal about trade- marking international law, I think we can save traffic on -hack- ers list by using something like "FreeBSD-tm@free.it", a list I can setup immediately. Moreover, even if I'm not lawyer, I'm pretty educated about these problems, and anyway I can get advice from them for free, so I think it's worth using this resource. All those interested in forming (and joning) the FreeBSD- tm@free.it list, send an e-mail to piero@free.it. Bye, -- # $Id: .signature,v 1.12 1995/08/14 12:10:54 piero Exp $ Piero Serini Via Giambologna, 1 I 20136 Milano - ITALY From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 07:49:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA02206 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 07:49:19 -0700 Received: from spooky.rwwa.com (rwwa.com [198.115.177.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA02200 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 07:49:12 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spooky.rwwa.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA05217 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:57:53 -0400 Message-Id: <199508201457.KAA05217@spooky.rwwa.com> X-Authentication-Warning: spooky.rwwa.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.5.3 12/28/94 To: Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FBSD image Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:57:53 -0400 From: Robert Withrow Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Folks, the decision is already made - please! Let's save the debate. No debate. But I hope the new image is at least as snappy. I like to see who has the FreeBSD disks for sale, and you'd be surprised how often I get this: Me: Do you sell the FreeBSD CDrom? Droid: Huh? I don't know. The cdroms are over there. Go look. Me: Well, do you sell the ``devil disk''? Droid: Oh yeah. I'll show you where it is... ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Withrow, Tel: +1 617 598 4480, Fax: +1 617 598 4430 Net: witr@rwwa.COM R.W. Withrow Associates, 319 Lynnway Suite 201, Lynn MA 01901 USA From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 08:02:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA02555 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:02:16 -0700 Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA02548 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:02:08 -0700 Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA01118 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:02:04 -0400 From: Charles Henrich Message-Id: <199508201502.LAA01118@crh.cl.msu.edu> Subject: How do I save panic messages?! To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:02:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 514 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk This is getting tedious, Im attempting to work on significant port of kernel level code, but if Im not sitting on virtual console 0, whenever the system panics, Im screwed. I cant switch out of X, or kill the screen blanker, or switch to the virtual console to see what the hell went wrong, nor is any information logged anywhere :(. Any help is most gratefully appreciated. -Crh Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 08:16:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA03519 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:16:22 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA03500 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:16:16 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id BAA21013; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:21:02 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508201551.BAA21013@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: How do I save panic messages?! To: henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu (Charles Henrich) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:21:02 +0930 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201502.LAA01118@crh.cl.msu.edu> from "Charles Henrich" at Aug 20, 95 11:02:04 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 906 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Charles Henrich stands accused of saying: > This is getting tedious, Im attempting to work on significant port of kernel > level code, but if Im not sitting on virtual console 0, whenever the system > panics, Im screwed. I cant switch out of X, or kill the screen blanker, or > switch to the virtual console to see what the hell went wrong, nor is any > information logged anywhere :(. Any help is most gratefully appreciated. Serial console? > Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 08:34:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA04133 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:34:41 -0700 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA04127 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:34:34 -0700 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id KAA14027; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:33:30 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199508201533.KAA14027@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:33:30 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508191528.LAA15902@mail.htp.com> from "dennis" at Aug 19, 95 11:28:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >There is certainly a case to be made that FreeBSD excels at these things, > >and I agree that at least *part* of the focus must target this market! > >[much good stuff deleted] > > You don't have to sell me on FreeBSD, Joe. I like it. I'm using it as my > platform for our router/server product. I'm putting one up next week (NYNEX > willing) as our main Web/FTP server. Ok, good, glad to hear it :-) ;-) > >FreeBSD has done a lot to make that easy should I choose to use their > >package-ized or port-ed versions - so I feel that the FreeBSD team has > >an answer for an ISP who does not want to roll his/her own system. > >(I nearly sh***ed bricks when a friend told me he installed CERN httpd on his > >system by doing little more than typing "make; make install" and installing > >his home page) > > Yes, you're right. But the problem is that NOBODY knows about these things, > and it very difficult to find out that these things are available unless > someone in the inner circle feels like telling you about it. THATs the > problem. And you can't count on anyone to tell you anything. The only time > anyone ever responds to me is when I say something inflamatory....so I have > to word my questions in a way thats going to piss someone off in order to > get an answer. It's a helluva way to do business. I thought all this stuff could actually be done right off the boot floppy? Again, I guess I haven't tried, but it seems to me from what I've heard from others that people DO know about these things, and they are very actively using them. I guess that's only a real small sampling based on the discussions that I have had with others, but I am having some trouble seeing the picture you are painting - even just a casual look around the FTP site reveals references to ports in README.TXT, not to mention the ports and packages directories (and I didn't look too hard). It could be possible that it is not documented well enough, I suppose. But that's an issue that does not have to be dealt with by changing the focus of the whole group... > >And with the number of people I've seen here in the Milwaukee area using > >FreeBSD, I would have to say that there's a much larger market out there for > >a damn good desktop UNIX. And - FreeBSD is it! Or - Linux is it (and the > >local Linux population is rather larger). Given the assertion that I would > >make (which is: "The ISP's _already_ use FreeBSD and are quite happy"), > >what's the next logical market to chase after? > > They're not ready to chase after the next market. They need market exposure, > and the best way to get exposure is by focusing on their strengths. They > can't compete with Macs or Windows, at least not yet. And if they try to > market by bashing accepted platforms they're just going to shoot themselves > in the foot. Hey, come on, it's cool to do it. I mean, look at OS/2, Windows NT, Solaris, SCO, etc. Everybody bashes on DOS and Doze because even most of the people who DO accept them do so largely out of necessity. THAT's a damn shame. :-/ I'd rather see WINE up and running... then some of that goes away. > It's like the old UNIX guy who arrogantly says "DOS is not an > Operating System, and neither is WINDOWS". Truth is truth. And generally it's not just the UNIX folks - it's every serious CS person who has ever worked on a real operating system of any type. However, the market doesn't necessarily care. I watched what happened with VHS and Beta. Myself, I still like 3/4" tape. > And the "Linux is a Toy". I've > yet to encounter 1 Linux user who wasn't thrilled beyond comprehension with > it. You need to meet a few who have had problems then. ;-) I've seen both. Then again I've seen both when you substitute FreeBSD for Linux too. Typically it seems like end users who do not try to port software and/or use the system to write software for other platforms are definitely tickled pink with Linux. > As for DOS and WINDOWs, well its on 95% of all of the machines in the > world. You can't sell by saying that something that works doesn't work. > People aren't that stupid. People are INCREDIBLY stupid, what are you talking about. I spent a number of years as an assistant manager at a grocery store and I will attest to the fact that you certainly CAN sell whatever you want however you want to 90% of the population - if you market it right. How's that go, "I can sell dead fish to the Board of Health, given an appropriate budget and a free hand"... > I've got a book on my shelf call "UNIX System Administration" by 4 supposed > UNIX gurus. There's a section in there on WAN communications, in which they > bash virtually every type of serial network every created. They even bash > RS-232. Being my specialty, Its obvious that they have no experience or > understanding of the subject matter. Or perhaps all too much experience and not enough understanding under UNIX, more likely. UNIX has traditionally suffered lots of damage in the serial comms dep't, caused by an incredible "variety" of both hardware and software implementations, none of which quite work the same way.... I think breakout boxes were designed because of UNIX sometimes. Think of it... dial in/out implementations are a prime example. Because UNIX has traditionally supported modems in funny ways (uugetty, no kernel support for bidir, often no kernel or hardware support for some or all of the hardware handshaking lines, etc etc) serial ports under UNIX have a deservedly shitty reputation. Myself, coming from a background where I was writing 1200 baud modem chipset drivers a decade ago, and other fun stuff, I have a very clear notion of how I expect a serial port implementation to work (and boy do I enjoy AT command set modems!). FreeBSD comes very close, with SunOS in second place. However that does not do much to improve the reputation of UNIX in general. Face it - it often does smell like rotten fish :-( and you just have to pray and hope that you can make it work somehow because the mfr decided a 3 line interface was sufficient. If serial comms under UNIX scares me, I can just imagine what the average UNIX hack thinks of it. Although since I have switched to 95% FreeBSD for all of my serial comms stuff, I have been sleeping better. ;-) > In fact, they make fools of themselves > with some of their statements. Now word is thats its a pretty good book. But > how can I accept their views on any subject when I know for a fact that they > are so arrogant and ignorant about another? Because we all have our strong points. Yet sometimes the requirements of the real world force us to extend into other areas where we only have a minimal understanding of the true issues. I am very mechanically inclined, yet since I don't have any automotive training or experience I generally let the local shop fix my car. Actually the same is true within CS - while I can write graphical programs or small end user applications, I generally don't, because there are others who DO do it better. However I tend to have a good background in systems type stuff and people who watch me hacking on a problem have been known to claim that I make them dizzy. Yet if I were to have to write a book about UNIX, I might have to write about things that are not in my area of specialty. I am not saying that they should be excused - but I always read books while keeping salt handy. And WAN communications is something of a black art.... maybe something that can be made easier, given FreeBSD and things like your product. ;-) I see a lot of potential in your product... ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 08:38:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA04346 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:38:42 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA04339 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:38:35 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id LAA01432; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:38:57 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:38:57 -0400 Message-Id: <199508201538.LAA01432@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: "Don's FList drop" From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >On Fri, 18 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > >> May I suggest that a small team get together to hash out whatever it >> takes to get the "Internet Out Of The Box " edition of FreeBSD out >> the door? >> >> Lets see apache compiles pretty much out of the box. We have a nice >> installation package facility which can make the job of installing >> apache a lot easier . >> >> We could mention that Netscape's BSDI server works with FreeBSD . > >Given that Netscape's financial future depends on their server, perhaps >we could arrange something more agressive than that. We've got someone >here (Rod?) who sells boxes with FreeBSD installed - he could sell >Netscape Commerce Server Ready To Go boxes just as easily. I'm sure >Netscape points people at Sun dealers if they want to get a ready-to-run >box with the Sun logo on it, they can point to FreeBSD vendors just as >easily. > There's a market thats 20 times the size of the internet server market for ISPs, and thats the market they sell private lines to, the corporate router market. We'll be marketing a product based on FreeBSD which combines the router/Web Server/Name server function as a base system with 1 Ethernet and 1 WAN interface capable of 56k to T1 and Frame Relay. Its easy to market initially...you try to get ISPs to sell it to their customers instead of selling them Ciscos. The selling point is 3 times the horsepower of a Cisco 2501 (with a DX2-80 and Serial Line Co-proc) and future expandability for less money. Even if you can't make a tremendous amount on the system itself (you should be able to make a few hundred depending on how much you throw the ISP), there should be decent setup/consulting/ongoing support revenue. We'll make complete OEM (ready-to-tune) boxes available (we already have a supplier and prototypes), or discounted WAN cards and CSU/DSUs if you want to roll your own. We'll be doing press releases next month and starting a moderate magazine advertising campaign in the 4th Qtr. dennis From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 09:13:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA06477 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:13:58 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA06471 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:13:51 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id MAA01700; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:13:09 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:13:09 -0400 Message-Id: <199508201613.MAA01700@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Joe Greco From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: FreeBSD in a Windows World Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> >FreeBSD has done a lot to make that easy should I choose to use their >> >package-ized or port-ed versions - so I feel that the FreeBSD team has >> >an answer for an ISP who does not want to roll his/her own system. >> >(I nearly sh***ed bricks when a friend told me he installed CERN httpd on his >> >system by doing little more than typing "make; make install" and installing >> >his home page) >> >> Yes, you're right. But the problem is that NOBODY knows about these things, >> and it very difficult to find out that these things are available unless >> someone in the inner circle feels like telling you about it. THATs the >> problem. And you can't count on anyone to tell you anything. The only time >> anyone ever responds to me is when I say something inflamatory....so I have >> to word my questions in a way thats going to piss someone off in order to >> get an answer. It's a helluva way to do business. > >I thought all this stuff could actually be done right off the boot floppy? >Again, I guess I haven't tried, but it seems to me from what I've heard from >others that people DO know about these things, and they are very actively >using them. I guess that's only a real small sampling based on the >discussions that I have had with others, but I am having some trouble seeing >the picture you are painting - even just a casual look around the FTP site >reveals references to ports in README.TXT, not to mention the ports and >packages directories (and I didn't look too hard). >> They're not ready to chase after the next market. They need market exposure, >> and the best way to get exposure is by focusing on their strengths. They >> can't compete with Macs or Windows, at least not yet. And if they try to >> market by bashing accepted platforms they're just going to shoot themselves >> in the foot. > >Hey, come on, it's cool to do it. I mean, look at OS/2, Windows NT, >Solaris, SCO, etc. Everybody bashes on DOS and Doze because even most of >the people who DO accept them do so largely out of necessity. THAT's a >damn shame. :-/ I'd rather see WINE up and running... then some of that >goes away. >> It's like the old UNIX guy who arrogantly says "DOS is not an >> Operating System, and neither is WINDOWS". > >Truth is truth. And generally it's not just the UNIX folks - it's every >serious CS person who has ever worked on a real operating system of any >type. However, the market doesn't necessarily care. I watched what >happened with VHS and Beta. Myself, I still like 3/4" tape. > A real operating system is one that provides a computer with usable services, which both DOS and WINDOS (as it should be called) do. Academically, it may be the truth, but the point is that its irrelevant. The market is driven by functinality, and UNIX is light years behind Windows and likely will stay that way for the foreseeable future. I don't care how cool unix is, but you're not going to get me to switch my DTP system with PageMaker, PhotoShop, 3D rendering, support for every printer conceived, etc. to XWINDOWs or WINE. Ever. Not in my lifetime. And I know Unix. People who don't know UNIX just can't deal with it. Its still way to difficult. Ever since BSDI started advertising their Internet server as a plug-and-play product that you can run "even if you don't know unix"....I've had more returned boards in the last few months...I think I had 2 in 7 years before. Its people who buy it and realize it "ain't that easy"...that they're in way over their heads. It unrealistic to think that people who don't know unix are going to use it as a general purpose operating system. The market today is convertees (from other Un*x type OSs) and simple canned functionality (like routers). You've also got new ISPs who WANT to learn it...now that BSDIs prices are out of sight there's a chance to get them with decent support channels. But they're still afraid that it doesn't work. The goal should be to change that thinking. Dennis From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 09:15:50 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA06547 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:15:50 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA06540 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:15:46 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id MAA01725; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:16:20 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:16:20 -0400 Message-Id: <199508201616.MAA01725@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: "Ron G. Minnich" From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >guys, this list says hackers. I was hoping for, like, hacking type stuff. >I get too many messages a day to have time to read meta-discussions, even >important ones. Is there a list that's just about technical details of >freebsd and hacking thereof? or can you take this private? > >thanks in advance and please, no offense intended. You're right, Ron. But there's no use building a great bomb if theres no war. We need a war. dennis From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 09:30:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA06910 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:30:34 -0700 Received: from kithrup.com (kithrup.com [140.174.23.40]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA06904 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:30:32 -0700 Received: (from sef@localhost) by kithrup.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) id JAA00511 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:30:31 -0700 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:30:31 -0700 From: Sean Eric Fagan Message-Id: <199508201630.JAA00511@kithrup.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD in the paper! Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Well, in an advertisement, anyway. Today's NCA ad in the San Jose Mercury News has, inbetween some hard drives and some CD-ROM drives, "Walnut Creek CD-ROM FREE BSD 2.0.5," for $14.99. It is the only software advertised in the full-page ad. It (the ad) even uses "UNIX" without a "(R)" or "TM" ;). Sean. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 09:31:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA06942 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:31:20 -0700 Received: from strider.ibenet.it ([194.179.130.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA06935 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:31:16 -0700 Received: (from piero@localhost) by strider.ibenet.it (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA00924; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:34:07 +0200 From: Piero Serini Message-Id: <199508201634.SAA00924@strider.ibenet.it> Subject: Take this PRIVATE! To: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:34:07 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' List) In-Reply-To: <199508201616.MAA01725@mail.htp.com> from "dennis" at Aug 20, 95 12:16:20 pm Reply-To: Piero@strider.ibenet.it Operating-System: FreeBSD 1.1.5.1 X-Phone-Number: +39 (2) 58113562 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 692 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hello. Quoting from dennis (Sun Aug 20 18:16:20 1995): > You're right, Ron. But there's no use building a great bomb if theres no war. > We need a war. No. As requested *many times* by *several people* you need to take this private. I think everybody on this list knows DOS, Win- dows, UNIX (more than one flavour of), MacOS, etc. Since this list is *not* devoted to this kind of discussion, you're simply using the wrong mailing list. End of discussion. Bye, -- # $Id: .signature,v 1.12 1995/08/14 12:10:54 piero Exp $ Piero Serini Via Giambologna, 1 I 20136 Milano - ITALY From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 09:45:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA07547 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:45:45 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA07540 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:45:40 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA00835 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:44:17 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:44:17 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508201244.IAA00835@healer.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Internet In A Box Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >On Fri, 18 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > >> May I suggest that a small team get together to hash out whatever it >> takes to get the "Internet Out Of The Box " edition of FreeBSD out >> the door? >> We just decided to start doing this here in New England. 486's running FreeBSD as gateways/ppp machines with mail and web servers set up. The one thing that seems to be needed (from what we've found clients want) is packet filtering in the kernel, which can be provided by something called "screend". I've got the kernel patches ported to FreeBSD 2.0.5 and am trying to get the author to let it be part of the BSD distribution as a package. -coranth ------------------------------------------+------------------------+ Coranth Gryphon | "Faith Manages." | | - Satai Delenn | Phone: 603-598-3440 Fax: 603-598-3430 +------------------------+ USMail: 11 Carver St, Nashua, NH 03060 Disclaimer: All these words are yours, except Europa... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 09:49:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA07641 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:49:59 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA07635 ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:49:55 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id MAA07217; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:36:59 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:36:57 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: Why Linux? To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: "Amancio Hasty Jr." , hackers@freebsd.org, www@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <27764.808789242@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 18 Aug 1995, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > On Thu, 17 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > > > > Now where all those cool gifs about freebsd? > > > > ftp://kryten.atinc.com/pub/FreeBSD/Gifs > > Maybe we can advertise these on the web page for people wishing to > stick the little guy on their FreeBSD pages? I think we'd get a LOT go fro it! a .ine on the web pages ro even pointers to each piecei ofart work would do well. the linux page has 'linux art' availbale and i am envious.....this is all that i have ben able to collect to date. the most recent one called 'bumper-sticker' really shoudl be made into commerical bumper stickers. i got hre image from biran tao and he got the daemon from mr. hosakawa (sp) derived from marshall of course > of such secondary advertising if folks just knew that the images were > easily available for pasting into their own pages! > > Jordan > Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 09:51:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA07692 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:51:01 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA07684 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:50:55 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA01176 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:49:32 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:49:32 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508201249.IAA01176@healer.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >From owner-freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Sun Aug 20 08:35:21 1995 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:30:31 -0700 From: Sean Eric Fagan < To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD in the paper! Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Seth Fagan wrote: > Well, in an advertisement, anyway. Today's NCA ad in the San Jose It was also in an issue of Network Computing. They were comparing WinNT NFS Servers, and used FreeBSD as the baseline to compare against Unix. -coranth ------------------------------------------+------------------------+ Coranth Gryphon | "Faith Manages." | | - Satai Delenn | Phone: 603-598-3440 Fax: 603-598-3430 +------------------------+ USMail: 11 Carver St, Nashua, NH 03060 Disclaimer: All these words are yours, except Europa... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 09:53:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA07822 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:53:35 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA07816 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:53:31 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id MAA07237; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:40:37 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:40:34 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: The LightFoot Project: Mean, Lean and Fast To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508190002.RAA07086@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 18 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > Perhaps is time to start a freebsd sub-branch that is for artists, > musicians, multimedia and web related topics. may i suggest teh freebsd-multimedia mailing list ;) > > The art from such a project or group could be used to promote > FreeBSD or just to have a fun time. > > The group could tap support from the different technical areas: > os, networking, video, mpeg, sound, graphics, etc... > > I am afraid that hackers is not the place to assemble such a group > > What do you think? > Amancio > > Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:01:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA08119 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:01:13 -0700 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA08112 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:01:02 -0700 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id TAA12803 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:01:01 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199508201701.TAA12803@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:01:00 +0200 (MET DST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 822 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk How (within a device driver) do I abort a DMA transfer which has been started but has not completed yet ? I am having this problem in the driver for a hand-scanner (the scanner does some read ahead; meanwhile, a user might close the device and we want to abort the transfer and free the buffer). I am surprised I haven't seen (or understood!) anything like this in existing drivers, not even in the floppy driver! Thanks Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:05:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA08302 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:05:55 -0700 Received: from palmer.demon.co.uk (palmer.demon.co.uk [158.152.50.150]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA08296 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:05:48 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by palmer.demon.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id SAA01654 ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:04:08 +0100 X-Message: This is a dial-up site. Quick responses to e-mails should not be relied upon. Thanks! To: Coranth Gryphon cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Internet In A Box In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:44:17 EDT." <199508201244.IAA00835@healer.com> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:04:06 +0100 Message-ID: <1652.808938246@palmer.demon.co.uk> From: Gary Palmer Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508201244.IAA00835@healer.com>, Coranth Gryphon writes: >The one thing that seems to be needed (from what we've found clients want) >is packet filtering in the kernel, which can be provided by something called >"screend". I've got the kernel patches ported to FreeBSD 2.0.5 and am trying >to get the author to let it be part of the BSD distribution as a package. screend is one option. There is, however, a packet filter supplied with FreeBSD. See man ipfw for details. Our ipfw implimentation doesn't do everything I'd like it to, but that's another matter :-) I hope to be patching in some new stuff soon. Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:11:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA08554 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:11:15 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA08548 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:11:11 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA00223 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:09:47 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 09:09:47 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508201309.JAA00223@healer.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: known rogue? Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi. What does the phrase st0: Archive Viper 150 is a known rogue actually mean? It seems to mean that the tape is not really supported. -coranth ------------------------------------------+------------------------+ Coranth Gryphon | "Faith Manages." | | - Satai Delenn | Phone: 603-598-3440 Fax: 603-598-3430 +------------------------+ USMail: 11 Carver St, Nashua, NH 03060 Disclaimer: All these words are yours, except Europa... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:18:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA08857 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:18:30 -0700 Received: from fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (Fieber-John.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA08849 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:18:28 -0700 Received: (from jfieber@localhost) by fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA01441; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:18:12 -0500 From: John Fieber Message-Id: <199508201718.MAA01441@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu> Subject: Re: known rogue? To: gryphon@healer.com (Coranth Gryphon) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:18:12 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201309.JAA00223@healer.com> from "Coranth Gryphon" at Aug 20, 95 09:09:47 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 410 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Coranth Gryphon writes: > Hi. What does the phrase > > st0: Archive Viper 150 is a known rogue > > actually mean? It means that FreeBSD knows about the quirks of this tape drive and how to work around them. I've never actually researched what the quirks are, but I can tell you that the tape drive in question works fine. -john === jfieber@cs.smith.edu ========== Come up and be a kite! --K. Bush === From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:22:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA09050 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:22:58 -0700 Received: from DATAPLEX.NET (SHARK.DATAPLEX.NET [199.183.109.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA09044 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:22:56 -0700 Received: from [199.183.109.242] by DATAPLEX.NET with SMTP (MailShare 1.0fc5); Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:22:29 -0600 X-Sender: rkw@shark.dataplex.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:22:29 -0500 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: rkw@dataplex.net (Richard Wackerbarth) Subject: Some thoughts on diskless systems, etc. Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I have been thinking about the problems associated with maintaining a group of machines that should all be basically the same. If we divide the filespace into a few chunks, they appear to fall into a few categories. 1) Shared alterable eg: /home, /usr/home, or whatever.. 2) Shared readonly eg: /usr/share 3) Local alterable eg: /var 4) Local readonly eg: /stand Looking at the /usr directory, most of it should really be readonly. The same is true on /bin. If done properly, /etc would be readonly, but each machine might need its own version. Things in there that need to change can be linked to /var/etc, for example. So here are my questions. 1) Why does "/" need to be r/w? 2) What do you think of the following: PROPOSAL: Modify "/sbin/init" to use a file in "/" (eg: "/rc") rather than "/etc/rc" as its initial file. IMPACTS: That way I could start by "mount"ing my own private "/etc". The default could simply be a one-liner ". /etc/rc". Diskless systems (of the same type) would all get the same "/" from their server. Their "/rc" would then do something to mount the workstation's very small "/etc" filesystem, and continue with common structure. If I am doing backups, much of the base system is now on ronly media. I need only back up my custom "/etc" files to be able to rebuild a system. My working backups might also include "/var" or portions thereof, as well as the home directories, etc. Comments? Questions? Suggestions? ---- Richard Wackerbarth rkw@dataplex.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:27:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA09185 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:27:13 -0700 Received: from dream.demos.su (dream.demos.su [194.87.1.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA09179 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:27:08 -0700 Received: by dream.demos.su id VAA00269; (8.6.8/D) Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:27:02 +0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: Organization: Demos, Moscow, Russia Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:27:02 +0400 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.22 FreeBSD] From: apg@demos.net (Paul Antonov) X-NCC-RegID: su.demos Subject: illegal instruction ?? Lines: 10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 211 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On a 486sx machine running freebsd-current (actually compaq laptop) "ps aux" says math_emulate: instruction d9f1 not implemented Just wonder what it is ... (of course MATH_EMULATE enabled in kernel) -- Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:28:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA09242 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:28:23 -0700 Received: from dream.demos.su (dream.demos.su [194.87.1.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA09236 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:28:20 -0700 Received: by dream.demos.su id VAA00278; (8.6.8/D) Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:28:19 +0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: Organization: Demos, Moscow, Russia Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:28:19 +0400 X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.22 FreeBSD] From: apg@demos.net (Paul Antonov) X-NCC-RegID: su.demos Subject: pcmcia Lines: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 66 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Does anybody here playing with PCMCIA stuff for FreeBSD? -- Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:28:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA09278 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:28:45 -0700 Received: from asstdc.scgt.oz.au (asstdc.scgt.oz.au [202.14.234.65]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA09271 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:28:40 -0700 Received: (from imb@localhost) by asstdc.scgt.oz.au (8.6.12/BSD4.4) id DAA20024; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:28:03 +1000 From: michael butler Message-Id: <199508201728.DAA20024@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> Subject: Re: Internet In A Box To: gryphon@healer.com (Coranth Gryphon) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:28:02 +1000 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201244.IAA00835@healer.com> from "Coranth Gryphon" at Aug 20, 95 08:44:17 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24beta] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 428 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Coranth Gryphon writes: > The one thing that seems to be needed (from what we've found clients want) > is packet filtering in the kernel, which can be provided by something called > "screend". I've got the kernel patches ported to FreeBSD 2.0.5 and am trying > to get the author to let it be part of the BSD distribution as a package. This begs the question .. why ? ipfw does equivalent things but in kernel space, michael From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:35:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA09712 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:35:56 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA09705 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:35:51 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA04529; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:35:48 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA13914 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:35:48 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA00847 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:16:01 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508201716.TAA00847@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: How do I save panic messages?! To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:16:01 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201502.LAA01118@crh.cl.msu.edu> from "Charles Henrich" at Aug 20, 95 11:02:04 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 885 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Charles Henrich wrote: > > This is getting tedious, Im attempting to work on significant port of kernel > level code, but if Im not sitting on virtual console 0, whenever the system > panics, Im screwed. I cant switch out of X, or kill the screen blanker, or > switch to the virtual console to see what the hell went wrong, nor is any > information logged anywhere :(. Any help is most gratefully appreciated. Running X when doing major kernel hacking is not the best way to go. In theory, there's an interface in the kernel that could be used to prevent jumping into DDB when X is up, practically it's only used by pcvt, and i didn't even get it right there. :-( For all other questions, please refer to the kernel-debug.FAQ first. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:36:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA09743 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:36:13 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA09730 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:36:04 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA04537; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:35:56 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA13919 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:35:55 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA00909 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:33:34 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508201733.TAA00909@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: FreeBSD in a Windows World To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:33:33 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201613.MAA01700@mail.htp.com> from "dennis" at Aug 20, 95 12:13:09 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1009 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As dennis wrote: > > >> It's like the old UNIX guy who arrogantly says "DOS is not an > >> Operating System, and neither is WINDOWS". > >Truth is truth. > A real operating system is one that provides a computer with usable > services, which both DOS and WINDOS (as it should be called) do. They do not. What do you think why every ``better'' DOS program does direct screen access, deals with hardware (COM port speed comes to mind) registers directly, installs its own handler intercepting keystrokes etc. pp. In other words, almost every `operating system' service is preferably bypassed instead of being used, for the one reason or the other. Very simple: the services DOS is providing are unusable. The only DOS service that's actually being used is the file system. It's ugly, but suffices to load a program from it, and handle some small data files. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:37:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA09806 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:37:19 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA09785 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:37:11 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA04525; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:35:37 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA13902 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:35:37 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA00765 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:59:13 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508201659.SAA00765@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:59:12 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199508201210.FAA00686@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Aug 20, 95 05:10:23 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1209 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As David Greenman wrote: > > >The idea was not to use the _free_ memory, but _dedicate_ a large > >amount of memory for the buffer cache. > In the scheme of things it is escentially the same thing. As long > as the server doesn't have other things happening on it, eventually > nearly all of the memory will become a huge file cache. If the > server is also a general purpose development machine or does other > memory intensive things, the situation will be different of > course...but I don't think that's what we're talking about here. At least for my case, this is what we are actually using. The machine serves as a company's main NFS server, as well as being used by a couple of users as their default environment (mainly because they have been too annoyed by the broken or inconsistent or slow development environment offered by the commercial systems around). The latter included even compiling _heavy_ C++/X11 jobs (resulting image including symbol table ~ 30 MB), and the FreeBSD 1.1.5.1 system proved to cope with all those requests *very* well. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:39:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA09939 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:39:15 -0700 Received: from quake.xnet.com (quake.xnet.com [198.147.221.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA09929 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:39:11 -0700 Received: from simon.chi.il.us by quake.xnet.com (8.6.11/XNet-1.2R) with SMTP id MAA03256; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:39:05 -0500 Received: by simon.chi.il.us (Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0skEFY-0006IJC; Sun, 20 Aug 95 12:33 CDT Message-Id: Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 12:33 CDT From: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) To: taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) > Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server > To: taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw (Brian Tao) > Date: Sat, 19 Aug 95 11:51:13 MDT > > > What can I do to improve NFS writes to a FreeBSD server? The > > machine was idle at the time, with four nfsd's running. Should I be > > using UDP or TCP (I turned both on)? > > The SGI, being SVR4 based, is doing async writes on the server by > default. The BSD box is waiting for the write to be comitted to > the server disk before continuing. > > You can turn on async writes in the BSD NFS server. > > Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too, this is a cache > coherency violation and can result in Bad Things Happening in case > of a server power failure or other failure that results in the > server going down, then coming back up while the app on a client > is still running. This is because the client will think the data > was written and may depend on being able to retrieve it later > (ie: a database index). Terry, Do you bother checking your references before you make blanket statements or do you like to just wing it? Do you bother checking them after someone points out your errors? > > One alternative is to use NFSv3 on both the client and the server. > This means going all BSD or including OSF/1, since the code is not > distributed for other platforms (Sun has promised "soon" on several > occasions). NFSv3 implements a distributed cache coherency > protocol that allows async writes with less chance of failure (you > can't eliminate the possibility entirely without using sync writes -- > what BSD does now). > > Since I *don't* want everyone going of and tweaking their systems > for async NFS writes unless they are *deadly* serious, you can dig > the information out of the docs and sources yourself. > > > Terry Lambert > terry@cs.weber.edu > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:39:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA09995 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:39:42 -0700 Received: from quake.xnet.com (quake.xnet.com [198.147.221.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA09987 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:39:40 -0700 Received: from simon.chi.il.us by quake.xnet.com (8.6.11/XNet-1.2R) with SMTP id MAA03273; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:39:11 -0500 Received: by simon.chi.il.us (Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0skEHs-0006ILC; Sun, 20 Aug 95 12:35 CDT Message-Id: Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 12:35 CDT From: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) To: dima@bog.msu.su, davidg@Root.COM Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > To: Dmitry Khrustalev > cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org > Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server > From: David Greenman > Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM > Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 01:23:52 -0700 > > Regarding NFSv3: v3 is only an option if you have clients that support it. > This is actually quite rare and would limit it's use to modern FreeBSD boxes. > ...and of course, FreeBSD 2.1 doesn't have v3 and I don't intend to add it > before the release. > > -DG > Darn, I saw all this traffic on NFSv3 in the past so I went out and installed Solaris 2.5 Beta to test it against. I guess I should have read the mail a lot closer. Oh well. Getting 2.5 to run on a SS1+ was interesting in it's own right. Steve From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 10:50:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA10608 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:50:30 -0700 Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (sri.MT.net [204.94.231.129]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA10602 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 10:50:27 -0700 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA21651; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:52:18 -0600 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:52:18 -0600 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199508201752.LAA21651@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: Coranth Gryphon Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: known rogue? In-Reply-To: <199508201309.JAA00223@healer.com> References: <199508201309.JAA00223@healer.com> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Hi. What does the phrase > > st0: Archive Viper 150 is a known rogue > > actually mean? It means that the tape doesn't work quite like the SPEC says it should. > It seems to mean that the tape is not really supported. Nope, the tape is supported. However, depending on which version of the tape firmware is on board, you may/may not need to remove the rogue entry out of the kernel. My 150 didn't work correctly with the rogue entry, so I commented it out and all was well. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 11:01:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA10849 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:01:29 -0700 Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (sri.MT.net [204.94.231.129]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA10843 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:01:26 -0700 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA21666; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:02:14 -0600 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:02:14 -0600 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199508201802.MAA21666@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: References: Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Steven E. Piette writes: [ Speeding up NFS writes ] Terry > You can turn on async writes in the BSD NFS server. Terry> Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too, this is a cache Terry> coherency violation and can result in Bad Things Happening in case Terry> of a server power failure or other failure that results in the Terry> server going down, then coming back up while the app on a client Terry> is still running. This is because the client will think the data Terry> was written and may depend on being able to retrieve it later Terry> (ie: a database index). > Steve> Terry, Do you bother checking your references before you make blanket Steve> statements or do you like to just wing it? Do you bother checking them Steve> after someone points out your errors? Huh? What Terry said above is correct. With async writes, the server effectively tells the client is that the data has been written (when in fact it really hasn't been). In the case of a power failure that occurs after the server has informed the client, but *before* the data has actually been written you have big problems. The problems are even bigger IF the server reboots and comes back online and the client application is still running (it hung waitig on disk access or something). The client assumes the data is written since it doesn't have reason to assume otherwise, so it depends on that data being there, which it isn't. The problem can be avoided by hardware solutions such as 'PrestoServe', which is basically a hardware NFS-cache. In the event of a system failure, the data is kept in RAM until the machine reboots, at which point the data is flushed out to disk. With prestoserve, you get the advantage of ASYNC writes *and* data validity. This, of course relies on the fact that NFS traffic is 'bursty' and not continious or else you wouldn't be able to cache up all of the data coming in. What Terry described is something I've experienced when messing around with NFS and async. writes. Note, I was purposefully crashing the machine to see the results, but in the real power failures are something you need to worry about. However, if I had a good UPS on the NFS server box I'd go for async. writes though. :) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 11:16:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA11248 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:16:17 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA11242 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:16:15 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA08364; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:15:58 -0700 Message-Id: <199508201815.LAA08364@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Coranth Gryphon cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Internet In A Box In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 08:44:17 EDT." <199508201244.IAA00835@healer.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:15:58 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Coranth Gryphon said: > > > > > >On Fri, 18 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > > >> May I suggest that a small team get together to hash out whatever it > >> takes to get the "Internet Out Of The Box " edition of FreeBSD out > >> the door? > >> > > We just decided to start doing this here in New England. 486's running > FreeBSD as gateways/ppp machines with mail and web servers set up. > > The one thing that seems to be needed (from what we've found clients want) > is packet filtering in the kernel, which can be provided by something called > "screend". I've got the kernel patches ported to FreeBSD 2.0.5 and am trying > to get the author to let it be part of the BSD distribution as a package. > Fantastic!!! Could we have a home page pointer? Tnks! Amacio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 11:18:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA11327 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:18:58 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA11320 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:18:56 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA08396; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:18:40 -0700 Message-Id: <199508201818.LAA08396@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: The LightFoot Project: Mean, Lean and Fast In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:40:34 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:18:39 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>> "Jonathan M. Bresler" said: > On Fri, 18 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > > > > Perhaps is time to start a freebsd sub-branch that is for artists, > > musicians, multimedia and web related topics. > > may i suggest teh freebsd-multimedia mailing list ;) Hmmm... I already may the call for volunteers to my multimedia mailing list.. Don't knock it is our own virtual group.. mail majordomo@star-gate.com subscribe multimedia Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 11:58:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA12355 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:58:06 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA12348 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:58:03 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA05867; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:57:53 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id UAA14816 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:57:53 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA01188 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:13:16 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508201813.UAA01188@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:13:16 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201701.TAA12803@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Aug 20, 95 07:01:00 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1420 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > How (within a device driver) do I abort a DMA transfer which has > been started but has not completed yet ? I am having this problem > in the driver for a hand-scanner (the scanner does some read ahead; > meanwhile, a user might close the device and we want to abort the > transfer and free the buffer). I am surprised I haven't seen (or > understood!) anything like this in existing drivers, not even in > the floppy driver! You are surprised to have not seen this in the floppy driver? This surprises me. :-) Actually, i'd immediately kill the floppy controller if i would abort a transfer in progress. The only means then would raise the reset line of the FDC. I'm not sure if setting some masking bit in one of the DMAC registers will actually _abort_ a transfer. Van Gilluwe does only speak about masking a request. The culprit is that DMA operation is usually IO-controlled (via the TC signal) instead of being software- controlled. Why don't you simply continue the started request, and throw away its results once the DMAC has signalled the command completetion by an interrupt (and the interrupt handler sees that the device is closed now)? I would personally do everything in avoiding even touching such a hot iron like the DMAC. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 11:59:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA12390 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:59:11 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA12384 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 11:59:07 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA05863; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:57:51 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id UAA14814; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:57:50 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA01049; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:38:44 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508201738.TAA01049@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: known rogue? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:38:43 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: gryphon@healer.com Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201718.MAA01441@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu> from "John Fieber" at Aug 20, 95 12:18:12 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 880 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As John Fieber wrote: > > > st0: Archive Viper 150 is a known rogue > It means that FreeBSD knows about the quirks of this tape drive > and how to work around them. I've never actually researched what > the quirks are, but I can tell you that the tape drive in > question works fine. It's actually perhaps one of the best-supported drives... The quirks are things like tape drives that do not like some mode pages, or require the switch to a certain mode page before a particular operation is started etc. What problems do you have with the Viper? I've been using it for years without trouble (and i've only been replacing it since somebody else couldn't use the Tandberg i'm using now, but had a better chance on the Archive). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:12:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA12926 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:12:56 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA12920 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:12:53 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id PAA10747; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:00:05 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:00:03 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: attributions for images To: hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk i have a collection of FreeBSD related images at: ftp://kryten.atinc.com/pub/FreeBSD/Gifs. i dont remember who supplied some of them ;( please claim you work. ;) and/or correct any misattributions. Image Contributor MoonDaemon.gif bsd-nomads.tiff bsddmn.gif Marshall Kirk McKusick bumper-sticker.jpeg Brian Tao daemon.cdrom.gif Tatsumi Hosokawa daemon.cdrom.tif Tatsumi Hosokawa demon43_ps1.gif Marshall Kirk McKusick demon_bsdesign.gif Marshall Kirk McKusick sticker.gif Brian Tao jmb Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:30:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA13323 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:30:00 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA13317 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:29:58 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA22951; Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:30:50 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508201930.AA22951@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: FBSD image To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:30:49 MDT Cc: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com, asami@cs.berkeley.edu, Piero@strider.ibenet.it, Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <1152.808891305@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 19, 95 09:01:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > I know this sour's the water a little, but it is a reality we must be > > ready to handle. We can not just allow any one to run around sticking > > the word FreeBSD on things, it must be marked ``TM'', and they must > > have licensed it. This is yet another detail we must work out, and > > we need to start to thinking about it. > > Well, let's be careful about this. I don't want to alienate people > who really are trying to do their best to promote FreeBSD, no matter > how good our intentions, and whether or not we can realistically > defend the FreeBSD trademark under *any* circumstances is something > which we must keep in mind when contemplating the types of enforcement > we want to be engaging in. Defending it on general principles > certainly sounds reasonable at first analysis, but there's also no > sense in aiming a gun at someone if it's loaded with blanks. Come up with a public license of "acceptable use" that fits the current uses and let it go until someone fails the policy test. That's relatively easy to do. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:31:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA13398 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:31:57 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA13391 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:31:52 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA22963; Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:33:19 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508201933.AA22963@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: FBSD image To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:33:18 MDT Cc: rcarter@geli.com, asami@cs.berkeley.edu, rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com, Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Piero@strider.ibenet.it In-Reply-To: <1306.808893977@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 19, 95 09:46:17 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > It would be free, but this is all WAAAY too premature to discuss now > and I rather wish Rod hadn't brought it up. We don't even have the > rights to it at the moment, so discussions of assignment are really > rather moot. On the contrary. Due dilligence would require that you have license policy in place or that you prevent use until you do. Now is the time to close the window of time between the trademark grant and the time you have to start enforcing acceptable use. Dot it *before* it has been issued, please. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:32:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA13480 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:32:18 -0700 Received: from gvr.win.tue.nl (gvr.win.tue.nl [131.155.210.19]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA13473 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:32:14 -0700 Received: by gvr.win.tue.nl (8.6.10/1.53) id VAA24542; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:31:49 +0200 From: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Message-Id: <199508201931.VAA24542@gvr.win.tue.nl> Subject: Re: VM86 To: bearheart@bearnet.com (BearHeart/Bill Weinman) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:31:48 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508181417.JAA05710@primus.paranoia.com> from "BearHeart/Bill Weinman" at Aug 18, 95 09:17:06 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 333 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk BearHeart/Bill Weinman wrote: > > At 06:39 AM 8/18/95 -0700, Justin T. Gibbs wrote: > >This is not true of OS/2. Almost any DOS game will fail under windows > >running in a dos window, but work just fine in a window under OS/2. > > . . . and Beta is far superior to VHS . . . And V2000 is far superior to Beta. ;-) -Guido From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:39:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA13900 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:39:08 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA13894 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:39:04 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA22999; Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:40:34 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508201940.AA22999@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: dima@bog.msu.su (Dmitry Khrustalev) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:40:33 MDT Cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Dmitry Khrustalev" at Aug 20, 95 09:04:04 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > You can turn on async writes in the BSD NFS server. > > > > Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too, this is a cache > > coherency violation and can result in Bad Things Happening in case > > of a server power failure or other failure that results in the > > server going down, then coming back up while the app on a client > > is still running. This is because the client will think the data > > was written and may depend on being able to retrieve it later > > (ie: a database index). > > Wrong, Sun had never included a method for enabling async writes in their os. > ( other than adb, anyway). Ditto SVR4. SGI ships their boxes with async > writes turned on by default, their reasoning is that every server is > protected by UPS. Green and white NetWork Administration Manual, about bage 128? I remember it was a nice binary page number... It's a debug statement you put in /etc/rc, and it was there by default the last time I looked at the Solaris systems I use. I'm not the only one with root, though, so I could be mistaken. I think it gets added at the same time as the "security fix" to disallow subdir mounts. > No, NFSv3 does not include cache coherency protocol. > > Quoting v3 rfc: > > Neither the NFS version 2 protocol nor the NFS version 3 > protocol provide a means of maintaining strict client-server > consistency (and, by implication, consistency across client > caches). > > What it does is implement is *safe* async writes. Ah, Okie-doke. I thought I remembered it from the Sun draft paper of over a year and a half ago. > > Since I *don't* want everyone going of and tweaking their systems > > for async NFS writes unless they are *deadly* serious, you can dig > > the information out of the docs and sources yourself. Correct my previous post to say "don't enable async writes, ever, it's not worth it (unless you have a UPS on your server). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:46:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA14202 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:46:55 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA14189 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:46:50 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23045; Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:48:17 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508201948.AA23045@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw (Brian Tao) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:48:16 MDT Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Brian Tao" at Aug 20, 95 03:16:12 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too, this is a cache > > coherency violation and can result in Bad Things Happening [...] > > I think it was Garrett who remarked that the whole idea of > stateless NFS was a gross violation of filesystem consistency. ;-) The whole idea of stateful NFS would be a gross violation of municipal power grid consistency. 8-). Unless you are running everything on the same box, it's impossible to provide inter-machine consistency guarantees. That's why NFS is the way it is. > > One alternative is to use NFSv3 on both the client and the server. > > This means going all BSD or including OSF/1, > > Does this include BSD/OS 2.0 as well? I lied (apparently). There are reliable async write guarantees, not coherency guarantees. The NFSv3 is not default with FreeBSD, and it's not there for BSDI at all as far as I know. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:48:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA14415 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:48:57 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA14409 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:48:55 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23079; Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:50:25 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508201950.AA23079@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: dima@bog.msu.su (Dmitry Khrustalev) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 13:50:24 MDT Cc: davidg@Root.COM, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Dmitry Khrustalev" at Aug 20, 95 11:22:59 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > If there is interest, I'll implement an NFS_ASYNC kernel option for both > > FreeBSD 2.1 and 2.2. I'm interested. 8-). > Kernel option or per filesystem option? Switching it on for all > filesystems at once is evil. And if nfs3 data corruption problems are > resolved, this option will not have any real value. Per FS switch. And what about a non-homogenous environment (ie: NFSv2 servers you can't upgrade to v3)? I think it'll stay useful for a long time. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:50:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA14495 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:50:32 -0700 Received: from ns.dknet.dk (ns.dknet.dk [193.88.44.42]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA14476 ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:50:26 -0700 Received: from login.dknet.dk by ns.dknet.dk with SMTP id AA04728 (5.65c8/IDA-1.4.4j); Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:49:53 +0200 Received: by login.dknet.dk (4.1/SMI-4.1DKnet00) id AA01479; Sun, 20 Aug 95 21:45:04 +0200 From: phk@login.dknet.dk (Poul-Henning Kamp) Message-Id: <9508201945.AA01479@login.dknet.dk> Subject: A good 4 port serial card To: hackers@freebsd.org, hardware@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 21:45:03 MET DST X-Charset: ASCII X-Char-Esc: 29 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I know that it comes up at regular intervals what multiport serial cards we support in FreeBSD. Here is one I found. It's a 16bit ISA card, with four ports. Well built, good materials, and high-quality as far as I can tell. Connection is through a 37 pin D-shell connector on the back of the card, they supply an octopus with 20 cm arms and good quality male 25 pin connectors in the other end with the card. There are four sockets, and they can take all the usual chips, including a "16650" chip with 32 bytes fifo's and crtscts and xonxoff in HW. We see that chip as 16550A and run happily on it, though we don't support the advances features (yet :-) Each port has a jumper-bank to select A9-A3 and "enable", and the irq's can be steered to irq 2,3,4,5,7,10,11,12,14 or 15 for each channel. Irqs can be shared, separate, or some mix. Waitstates can be set to <= 8Mhz <= 12Mhz <= 25Mhz > 33Mhz It works out of the box with this spec: device sio4 at isa? port "0x2a0" tty flags 0x705 device sio5 at isa? port "0x2a8" tty flags 0x705 device sio6 at isa? port "0x2b0" tty flags 0x705 device sio7 at isa? port "0x2b8" tty flags 0x705 irq 5 vector siointr As far as I can tell, they also have a version with twice the above on one card, ie. 2 times four ports. I bought mine from a Danish company: Danbit Vaerkstedsvej 39-41 DK-4600 Koege Tel: +45 53 66 20 20 Fax: +45 53 66 20 30 but the manufacturer is, according to their own ideosyncratic specification: Decision Computer International Co., LTD. 4F No. 31 Alley 4, Lane 36, Sec. 5 Min-shen East Road Taipei Taiwan R.O.C Fax: 886-2-7665702 Telex: 16059 DECISION Tel: (02) 766 5753, 7659782 769-5786. Enjoy, Poul-Henning From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:50:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA14498 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:50:33 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA14477 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:50:26 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA03528 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:32:54 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA19705; 20 Aug 95 13:49:23 CDT (Sun) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA19702; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:49:23 -0500 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:49:23 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508201849.NAA19702@bonkers.taronga.com> To: gryphon@healer.com Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! In-Reply-To: <199508201249.IAA01176@healer.com> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <199508201249.IAA01176@healer.com>, Coranth Gryphon wrote: >It was also in an issue of Network Computing. They were comparing WinNT NFS >Servers, and used FreeBSD as the baseline to compare against Unix. Don't leave us hanging... What were the numbers? From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 12:51:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA14599 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:51:15 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA14588 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:51:10 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA03530 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:33:06 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA19987; 20 Aug 95 14:08:08 CDT (Sun) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA19984; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:08:07 -0500 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:08:07 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508201908.OAA19984@bonkers.taronga.com> To: dennis@et.htp.com Subject: Re: FreeBSD in a Windows World In-Reply-To: <199508201613.MAA01700@mail.htp.com> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <199508201613.MAA01700@mail.htp.com>, dennis wrote: >A real operating system is one that provides a computer with usable >services, which both DOS and WINDOS (as it should be called) do. An operating system is that component of the software in a computer that manages system resources. In the case of DOS the operating system is embedded in every application: just about every resource allocation issue is fobbed off on the application writer. All DOS manages is storage and a modicum of device interfaces... and most programs ignore the DOS-provided drivers. Windows is better, though it does leave applications responsible for most scheduling. >Academically, it may be the truth, but the point is that its irrelevant. The >market is driven by functinality, The market is not driven by functionality. It's driven by applications. the market doesn't care what an operating system is so long as it runs their applications. It doesn't even care much how good those applications are so long as they can do what they bought them for. >The market today is convertees (from other Un*x type OSs) and simple >canned functionality (like routers). In other words: applications. The other thing you have to watch out for is, the market has no memory and no foresight. You and I can see that buying a scheduling package that ONLY runs on top of a mail package is short-sighted, and if you buy that scheduling package you're going to be locked into that mail package, but it doesn't care if that package will solve today's problem. Open system solutions don't do that, which means they're worth putting up with a bit of inconvenience. How do you convince the market to do that, though? From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 13:07:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA15534 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:07:49 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA15527 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:07:43 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23179; Sun, 20 Aug 95 14:09:09 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508202009.AA23179@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 14:09:09 MDT Cc: imp@village.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508200836.BAA02637@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Aug 20, 95 01:36:30 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Write a key program for the Web and make sure that is identify by a cool > FreeBSD sign > > One day, I will write my DOS box you click on it expands and contracts and > it cries like a baby. Or window which goes to sleep and snorls 8) This is hardly what I'd call an equivalent to the Linux Publicity Project Web page and real press releases really mailed to real press contacts. It brings up the point that the "Powered by FreeBSD" logo usage should require notification of the URL to the "logo maintainers". Personally, I'd like to see this information used for a "FreeBSD Partners" page, but even if it isn't, the information should be maintained. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 13:09:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA15614 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:09:45 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA15603 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:09:40 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23193; Sun, 20 Aug 95 14:11:08 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508202011.AA23193@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: dima@bog.msu.su (Dmitry Khrustalev) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 14:11:08 MDT Cc: davidg@Root.COM, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Dmitry Khrustalev" at Aug 20, 95 12:43:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > ...and of course, FreeBSD 2.1 doesn't have v3 and I don't intend to add it > > before the release. > > Speaking of different nfs versions in 2.1 and 2.2: is it possible to add > kernel interface version identifier? It will be much better if userspace > programs fail gracefully on version mismatch instead of current behavior. RPC does versioning for you. The issue is one of integrating multiple protocol versions into a single *stable* set of code. Then registering both versions for RPC requests. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 13:17:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA15971 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:17:13 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA15964 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:17:09 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23236; Sun, 20 Aug 95 14:18:45 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508202018.AA23236@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! To: sef@kithrup.com (Sean Eric Fagan) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 14:18:45 MDT Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201630.JAA00511@kithrup.com> from "Sean Eric Fagan" at Aug 20, 95 09:30:31 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Well, in an advertisement, anyway. Today's NCA ad in the San Jose > Mercury News has, inbetween some hard drives and some CD-ROM drives, > "Walnut Creek CD-ROM FREE BSD 2.0.5," for $14.99. It is the only software > advertised in the full-page ad. > > It (the ad) even uses "UNIX" without a "(R)" or "TM" ;). Someone needs to grab this and SCAN THAT BABY IN!!!! Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 13:32:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA16508 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:32:20 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA16499 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:32:16 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA09521; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:32:06 -0700 Message-Id: <199508202032.NAA09521@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:09:09 MDT." <9508202009.AA23179@cs.weber.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:32:05 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>> Terry Lambert said: > > Write a key program for the Web and make sure that is identify by a cool > > FreeBSD sign > > > > One day, I will write my DOS box you click on it expands and contracts and > > it cries like a baby. Or window which goes to sleep and snorls 8) > > This is hardly what I'd call an equivalent to the Linux Publicity Project > Web page and real press releases really mailed to real press contacts. > > It brings up the point that the "Powered by FreeBSD" logo usage should > require notification of the URL to the "logo maintainers". > > Personally, I'd like to see this information used for a "FreeBSD Partners" > page, but even if it isn't, the information should be maintained. > You now there is *room* for ways to reach the different market. Many in the Unix World dislike Windows so why no capitalize on that to spread the dislike word about *FreeBSD* All Roads lead to FreeBSD Use the Web to equalize the playing field Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 13:56:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA18118 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:56:25 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA18112 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 13:56:24 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23361; Sun, 20 Aug 95 14:56:33 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508202056.AA23361@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 14:56:32 MDT Cc: taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Steven E. Piette" at Aug 20, 95 12:33:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > The SGI, being SVR4 based, is doing async writes on the server by > > default. The BSD box is waiting for the write to be comitted to > > the server disk before continuing. > > > > You can turn on async writes in the BSD NFS server. > > > > Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too, this is a cache > > coherency violation and can result in Bad Things Happening in case > > of a server power failure or other failure that results in the > > server going down, then coming back up while the app on a client > > is still running. This is because the client will think the data > > was written and may depend on being able to retrieve it later > > (ie: a database index). > > Terry, Do you bother checking your references before you make blanket > statements or do you like to just wing it? Do you bother checking them > after someone points out your errors? Well, I know the SGI does async writes, and does them by default. I know that SVR4, at least the UnixWare release, which is really the only release there is any more, does async writes -- I was in one of the meetings that decided to do it while I was arguing for optioning it with it "off" by default. I lost. The benchmark optimizers won. So the above is a correct blanket statement. I *did* check the cache coherency claims about NFSv3. And given the exact wording of the RFC (which does not match the Sun White Paper of two years ago), safe async writes are guaranteed, but full cache coherency is not. I'd like to think that the directory search/stat combination and multiple entry transfers came out of some of the attributed file system work we demonstrated for Sun about a year before the Sun NFSv3 paper came out. It's more likely that we just arrived at a similar soloution to similar problems, but as a result, I spent an inordinate amount of time going over the Sun paper. For the purposes of the discussion, cache coherency amounted to async writes being safe, not to dealing correctly with memory mapped files over NFS. It was not my intent to draw that fine a distinction, and so I was wrong on a technicality. That was an omission on my part, and I've already owned up to it, though not in this great gory detail. What is your point? That I don't take the same pains to research email and dot all the "i"'s and cross all the "t"'s, as long as I get the gist across, that I would take were I writing a book? I'll freely admit that... probably I'll keep doing it until someone pays me book rates to do posting. 8-). Regards, Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 14:06:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA19002 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:06:05 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA18993 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:06:02 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA09763; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:04:32 -0700 Message-Id: <199508202104.OAA09763@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette), taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:56:32 MDT." <9508202056.AA23361@cs.weber.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:04:31 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Terry Lambert said: > What is your point? That I don't take the same pains to research > email and dot all the "i"'s and cross all the "t"'s, as long as I > get the gist across, that I would take were I writing a book? I'll > freely admit that... probably I'll keep doing it until someone pays > me book rates to do posting. 8-). Or, when you write that FreeBSD best seller and make tons of money 8) did I hint at a Book on the above statement ?? Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 14:20:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA19996 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:20:38 -0700 Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA19990 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:20:35 -0700 Message-Id: <199508202120.OAA19990@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Clock interrupts during probes? Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:20:34 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk What are the issues involved in allowing clock interrupts during probes? The PCI code already does this so I would think it possible to do it for the others. It would certainly make the job of having the SCSI code perform the proper delays between retries easier. It would also be the first step in getting rid of the ugly DELAY()'s in driver code. __ Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 14:53:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA21525 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:53:16 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA21516 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:53:15 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA23510; Sun, 20 Aug 95 15:53:29 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508202153.AA23510@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 15:53:28 MDT Cc: steve@simon.chi.il.us, taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508202104.OAA09763@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Aug 20, 95 02:04:31 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > What is your point? That I don't take the same pains to research > > email and dot all the "i"'s and cross all the "t"'s, as long as I > > get the gist across, that I would take were I writing a book? I'll > > freely admit that... probably I'll keep doing it until someone pays > > me book rates to do posting. 8-). > > Or, when you write that FreeBSD best seller and make tons of money 8) > > did I hint at a Book on the above statement ?? No book writing in my immediate future. I'm too busy. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 15:04:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA22073 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:04:10 -0700 Received: from server.netcraft.co.uk (server.netcraft.co.uk [194.72.238.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA22054 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 15:04:06 -0700 Received: (from paul@localhost) by server.netcraft.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.9) id XAA25167; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:00:12 +0100 From: Paul Richards Message-Id: <199508202200.XAA25167@server.netcraft.co.uk> Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: rcarter@geli.com (Russell L. Carter) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:00:11 +0100 (BST) Cc: dennis@et.htp.com, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508182322.QAA01236@geli.clusternet> from "Russell L. Carter" at Aug 18, 95 04:22:43 pm Reply-to: paul@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1087 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Russell L. Carter who said > > From Dr. Dobbs Developer Update, September 1995, p.6, quote: > > "In the case of HTTP servers, the survey found that the most popular server > is NCSA (38.6%), followed by MacHTTP (20.8%) and CERN (18.5%), leaving about 10% > for all other servers." > That figure is wrong, by a massive margin. It's more like, NCSA (57%), CERN (19.69%), Apache (3.47%) and MacHTTP (2.83%), with Apache being the fastest growing server I think. I have a good source but it's not publically available yet. If people are interested in this sort of thing I'll announce it here when it's available. > and > > "MacHTTP is the hands-down easiest server software to install and operate, > requiring only a single mouse-click to get you on the air" > > Does this surprise anybody besides me? Evidently, ease of installation > counts for something. Who wrote the article? -- Paul Richards, Bluebird Computer Systems. FreeBSD core team member. Internet: paul@FreeBSD.org, http://www.freebsd.org/~paul Phone: 0370 462071 (Mobile), +44 1222 457651 (home) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 16:03:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA26290 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:03:40 -0700 Received: from blob.best.net (blob.best.net [204.156.128.88]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA26284 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:03:39 -0700 Received: from geli.clusternet (rcarter.vip.best.com [204.156.137.2]) by blob.best.net (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id QAA11710 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:03:53 -0700 Received: (from rcarter@localhost) by geli.clusternet (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA17468 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:00:15 -0700 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:00:15 -0700 From: "Russell L. Carter" Message-Id: <199508202300.QAA17468@geli.clusternet> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: on httpd server usage Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk The data for the type of server used, where MacHTTPd showed surprisingly strong results, is in http://www.cc.gatech.edu/gvu/user_surveys/survey-04-1995/bulleted/info_bullets.html Regards, Russell From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 16:16:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA26904 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:16:56 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA26898 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:16:52 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id HAA28554; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:16:27 +0800 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:16:26 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <199508200824.BAA02514@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > Curious what are the actual numbers for your disk in the system running > the NFS server? Numbers for the disk? You mean like models numbers or performance numbers or what? They are 2-gig 7200 rpm drives of some sort, and I get about 6.5MB/sec read/write to one and about 16MB/sec aggregate read/write to three at once (two controllers in the SGI). -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 16:20:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA27043 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:20:04 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA27034 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:20:01 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id TAA05069; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:19:11 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:19:11 -0400 Message-Id: <199508202319.TAA05069@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Coranth Gryphon From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: Internet In A Box Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > >> >>On Fri, 18 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: >> >>> May I suggest that a small team get together to hash out whatever it >>> takes to get the "Internet Out Of The Box " edition of FreeBSD out >>> the door? >>> > >We just decided to start doing this here in New England. 486's running >FreeBSD as gateways/ppp machines with mail and web servers set up. > >The one thing that seems to be needed (from what we've found clients want) >is packet filtering in the kernel, which can be provided by something called >"screend". I've got the kernel patches ported to FreeBSD 2.0.5 and am trying >to get the author to let it be part of the BSD distribution as a package. > >-coranth > screend sucks. Try something else. db From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 16:23:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA27267 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:23:19 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA27261 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:23:15 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id TAA05087 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:23:49 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:23:49 -0400 Message-Id: <199508202323.TAA05087@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: hackers@freebsd.org From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: FreeBSD in a Windows World Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >As dennis wrote: >> >> >> It's like the old UNIX guy who arrogantly says "DOS is not an >> >> Operating System, and neither is WINDOWS". > >> >Truth is truth. > >> A real operating system is one that provides a computer with usable >> services, which both DOS and WINDOS (as it should be called) do. > >They do not. What do you think why every ``better'' DOS program does >direct screen access, deals with hardware (COM port speed comes to >mind) registers directly, installs its own handler intercepting >keystrokes etc. pp. In other words, almost every `operating system' >service is preferably bypassed instead of being used, for the one >reason or the other. > >Very simple: the services DOS is providing are unusable. The only DOS >service that's actually being used is the file system. It's ugly, but >suffices to load a program from it, and handle some small data files. > However Windows does ADD those services, just as they were added in UNIX. Changing times require changes. db From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 16:27:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA27579 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:27:02 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA27571 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:26:59 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id TAA05120; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:27:26 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:27:26 -0400 Message-Id: <199508202327.TAA05120@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Peter da Silva From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: FreeBSD in a Windows World Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >In article <199508201613.MAA01700@mail.htp.com>, >dennis wrote: >>A real operating system is one that provides a computer with usable >>services, which both DOS and WINDOS (as it should be called) do. > >An operating system is that component of the software in a computer that >manages system resources. In the case of DOS the operating system is embedded >in every application: just about every resource allocation issue is fobbed >off on the application writer. All DOS manages is storage and a modicum of >device interfaces... and most programs ignore the DOS-provided drivers. > >Windows is better, though it does leave applications responsible for most >scheduling. > >>Academically, it may be the truth, but the point is that its irrelevant. The >>market is driven by functinality, > >The market is not driven by functionality. It's driven by applications. the >market doesn't care what an operating system is so long as it runs their >applications. It doesn't even care much how good those applications are so >long as they can do what they bought them for. Application availability define functionality, so we are basically saying the same thing. db From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 16:44:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA28144 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:44:43 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA28138 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:44:37 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA11053; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:44:11 -0700 Message-Id: <199508202344.QAA11053@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Brian Tao cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:16:26 +0800." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 16:44:10 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Brian Tao said: > On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > > > Curious what are the actual numbers for your disk in the system running > > the NFS server? > > Numbers for the disk? You mean like models numbers or performance > numbers or what? They are 2-gig 7200 rpm drives of some sort, and I > get about 6.5MB/sec read/write to one and about 16MB/sec aggregate > read/write to three at once (two controllers in the SGI). Curious then, where is the time being spend in the NFS code? Given that we can drive the ethernet at near capacity and that the disks are very fast . It pretty much leads me to believe that the NFS code or protocol is the bottle neck. Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 18:22:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA00688 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:22:22 -0700 Received: from mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (mail.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.13]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA00680 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:22:19 -0700 Received: from localhost.cs.tu-berlin.de ([130.149.1.124]) by mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id DAA03045; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:12:18 +0200 Received: (from wosch@localhost) by localhost (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA00820; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:39:51 +0200 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:39:51 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider Message-Id: <199508201039.MAA00820@localhost> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: whereis whereis? In-Reply-To: <199508200821.KAA27131@uriah.heep.sax.de> References: <199508200821.KAA27131@uriah.heep.sax.de> Reply-to: Wolfram Schneider MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk J. Wunsch writes: >So whereis(1) now finally degraded to which(1) (sort of). $ whereis ls /bin/ls $ echo $? 255 $ whereis /bin/ls |wc -l 0 It is buggy and not a which(1). Wolfram From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 18:22:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA00711 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:22:28 -0700 Received: from mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (mail.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.13]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA00697 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:22:26 -0700 Received: from localhost.cs.tu-berlin.de ([130.149.1.124]) by mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id DAA03048; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:12:59 +0200 Received: (from wosch@localhost) by localhost (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA00921; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:54:26 +0200 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:54:26 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider Message-Id: <199508201054.MAA00921@localhost> To: Peter da Silva Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? In-Reply-To: <199508200151.UAA00576@bonkers.taronga.com> References: <8186.808549960@time.cdrom.com> <199508191528.RAA01643@localhost> <199508200151.UAA00576@bonkers.taronga.com> Reply-to: Wolfram Schneider MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Peter da Silva writes: >>Why not making a m4 macro package like in sendmail? > >Because it's actually easier and more convenient to do it in tcl. This >sort of custom metalanguage is what tcl is designed for: tcl syntax is silly. The manpages are really bad (compared to perl). tcl is actually a package and not in bindist. Wolfram From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 18:42:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA01172 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:42:18 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA01164 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:42:11 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id LAA22114; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:46:14 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508210216.LAA22114@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? To: wosch@cs.tu-berlin.de Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:46:14 +0930 (CST) Cc: peter@bonkers.taronga.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201054.MAA00921@localhost> from "Wolfram Schneider" at Aug 20, 95 12:54:26 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1129 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Wolfram Schneider stands accused of saying: > Peter da Silva writes: > >>Why not making a m4 macro package like in sendmail? > > > >Because it's actually easier and more convenient to do it in tcl. This > >sort of custom metalanguage is what tcl is designed for: > > tcl syntax is silly. The manpages are really bad (compared to > perl). tcl is actually a package and not in bindist. Perl, OTOH, is slow and bloated, and its syntax is merely incomprehensible. In all sincerity, perl and tcl are both useful tools. For the nominated task, neither is actually appropriate per se, as the aim is to come up with a _simple_ tool for generating kernel configs, not another processed-textfile mangler with a custom syntax and no precedent. > Wolfram -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 18:48:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA01454 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:48:20 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA01446 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:48:17 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA11991; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:48:14 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id DAA17541 for hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:48:14 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA01364 for hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:02:55 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508201902.VAA01364@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:02:55 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Steven E. Piette" at Aug 20, 95 12:35:00 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 622 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Steven E. Piette wrote: > > Darn, I saw all this traffic on NFSv3 in the past so I went out and installed > Solaris 2.5 Beta to test it against. I guess I should have read the mail a > lot closer. Oh well. Getting 2.5 to run on a SS1+ was interesting in it's own > right. As much as i hate to say it (those who have read my experience reports will do know why :), SGI's IRIX 5.3 does also support NFSv3. I have yet to put a FreeBSD-current box there and actually test it. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 18:48:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA01466 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:48:22 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA01448 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:48:19 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA11995; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:48:16 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id DAA17542 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:48:16 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA01379 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:04:38 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508201904.VAA01379@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: known rogue? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:04:37 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201752.LAA21651@rocky.sri.MT.net> from "Nate Williams" at Aug 20, 95 11:52:18 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 597 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Nate Williams wrote: > > > st0: Archive Viper 150 is a known rogue > Nope, the tape is supported. However, depending on which version of the > tape firmware is on board, you may/may not need to remove the rogue > entry out of the kernel. My 150 didn't work correctly with the rogue > entry, so I commented it out and all was well. Perhaps we should start collecting the revision numbers and try making the `known rogue' firmware-rev dependant? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 18:48:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA01545 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:48:41 -0700 Received: (from dyson@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA01536 ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:48:39 -0700 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:48:39 -0700 From: John Dyson Message-Id: <199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org> To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I just did a competitive performance analysis of FreeBSD vs. Linux. I can't say that FreeBSD was the CLEAR winner, but it was much faster in many key areas. The only place that I can see that Linux is architecturally faster is in the async filesystem stuff. Generally, FreeBSD's networking (TCP) is at least 50% faster. FreeBSD's VM stuff is much faster. I cannot see where people say that Linux needs less memory either. I ran some memory loading benchmarks on FreeBSD and Linux, where FreeBSD was a generic kernel and Linux was a "nice" subset V1.3.20. It appears that FreeBSD handles loads much better. Also, when running Linux I noticed an "old-friend" -- the bouncy SVR3 feel. Things generally appear to run a bit slower on Linux, including sequential file I/O. I am sure that Linux can fix up these minor performance nits, but it does seem to run ok. I have results on request -- I just don't want to post them yet. If there is a big demand, I will though.. John dyson@root.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 18:51:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA01845 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:51:18 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA01826 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:51:09 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA28774; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:50:41 +0800 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:50:39 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: dennis cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD in a Windows World In-Reply-To: <199508201613.MAA01700@mail.htp.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, dennis wrote: > > I don't care how cool unix is, but you're not going to get me to > switch my DTP system with PageMaker, PhotoShop, 3D rendering, support > for every printer conceived, etc. to XWINDOWs or WINE. Ever. Not in > my lifetime. FreeBSD and DOS/Windows are about as far away from each other in OS space as you can get, and they currently serve two very different markets. I don't care how many people run Windows, you're not going to get me to switch my ISP services with its robust multitasking, multiuser, integrated network transport layer, zillions of free applications with source, etc. to Windows '95 or or OS/2. Ever. Maybe near the end of my lifetime. ;-) -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 18:54:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA02167 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:54:17 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA02157 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:54:08 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA28786; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:53:34 +0800 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:53:32 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Steve Passe cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? In-Reply-To: <199508150626.AAA26400@clem.systemsix.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 15 Aug 1995, Steve Passe wrote: > > I have been kicking around ideas for use of the dotfile program i > mentioned earlier and came up with the idea of a backend for > generating a kernel config file. It would guide a user thru the > process of describing their machine and create an appropriate config > file. Assuming the user knew what was inside their box, they would > end up with a conflict free kernel! We talked about doing exactly this about a couple months ago on the list. The only problem with the Dotfile Generator is that it depends entirely in Tcl and Tk to sort through dependencies and to draw its pretty interface. I was hoping for something a little more generic, which could be parsed by a Tcl/Tk interface, or a Web/HTTP interface, or a libdialog interface or whatever. -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 18:56:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA02376 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:56:45 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA02349 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:56:27 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA28797; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:55:27 +0800 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:55:27 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: attributions for images In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > > MoonDaemon.gif > bsd-nomads.tiff Both are by Tatsumi, I believe. > bumper-sticker.jpeg Brian Tao Did you scale down the original to 1024 pixels across? I can provide originals at that size, if you want (and if it looks better). I'd rather have the large format one distributed instead, and allow people to scale down if needed, rather than scaling up. > sticker.gif Brian Tao It looks like you lost the transparency feature of the GIF89a format when transferring it over to your site... -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 19:01:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA02694 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:01:30 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA02686 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:01:19 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA28810; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:00:26 +0800 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:00:24 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Terry Lambert cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <9508201948.AA23045@cs.weber.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > The whole idea of stateful NFS would be a gross violation of municipal > power grid consistency. 8-). :) > The NFSv3 is not default with FreeBSD, and it's not there for BSDI at > all as far as I know. I suppose that means async writes + UPS if one wants a fast FreeBSD server then. Has someone made some sort of hardware add-on to PC's like a miniature PrestoServe (say, with a max of 64 megs of cache) with drivers for FreeBSD so it can flush data out to disk after a reboot? That would be nifty. -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 19:05:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA02908 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:05:30 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA02860 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:04:49 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA28822; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:02:35 +0800 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:02:33 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Gasparovski / Daniel (ISE)" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Pentium troubles In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Gasparovski / Daniel (ISE) wrote: > > *Everything* else works just as it did on the 486, only now I can't use > Netscape :(. Could I try a -current kernel? (ie: does the -current > kernel depend on -current binaries?) You got me stumped then... no other ideas from here. :( -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 19:07:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA03088 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:07:11 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA03075 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:07:08 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA07423; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:06:38 -0700 To: Wolfram Schneider cc: Peter da Silva , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:54:26 +0200." <199508201054.MAA00921@localhost> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:06:38 -0700 Message-ID: <7421.808970798@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > tcl syntax is silly. The manpages are really bad (compared to > perl). tcl is actually a package and not in bindist. > > Wolfram *BLAM!* [wakes up] "Huh? Whuzzat!?" *BLAM! BLAM!* "Ah shit! A firefight outside! Again!" *BLAM* BLAM* *BLAM* rat-tat-tat-tat-tat-tat-tat... wheeeeeeeoooooo... BOOM! [Pokes his head out the window] "Hey! HEY!! You guys! Yeah, you down there in the street! Knock it off!! We're trying to sleep up here! Oh yeah? Well your mother wears combat boots TOO, so there! Now cut it out! If you gotta fight, use swords or something quieter to hack eachother to death!" [slam!] "%&**@#!! extension language hackers! Always fighting! Should send them all back to Bosnia where they belong! Grumble.. Gritz.." [goes back to bed] Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 19:11:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA03470 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:11:57 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA03462 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:11:54 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA24188; Sun, 20 Aug 95 20:13:30 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508210213.AA24188@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: dyson@freefall.FreeBSD.org (John Dyson) Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 20:13:29 MDT Cc: hasty@rah.star-gate.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org> from "John Dyson" at Aug 20, 95 06:48:39 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have results on request -- I just don't want to post them yet. If there > is a big demand, I will though.. request++ Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 19:22:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA03827 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:22:15 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA03821 ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:22:10 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA24224; Sun, 20 Aug 95 20:23:50 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508210223.AA24224@cs.weber.edu> Subject: KERNEL PATCHES FOR NFS LOCKING SUPPORT To: current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org, andrew.gordon@net-tel.co.uk Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 20:23:48 MDT X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I have uploaded the kernel pieces necessary for NFS locking support to: freefall.cdrom.com:~terry/RLOCK.tar.gz. This does NOT include the user space daemons, which I've left to Andrew, who claims to have bogus rpc.lockd and rpc.statd code (yeah, Andrew!). This is basically proxy remote lock support identical to that in SunOS implemented via the fcntl() interface. One NFS specific function is missing and depends on the NFS and Andrew as to how it needs to be implemented (it's a trivial function, but the NFS plug-in architecture will affect it). It has to be done right to allow you to still option NFS out of a kernel. The README from the tar file follows. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. ============================================================================== This set of patches is most of the kernel support required for NFS locking support. The only missing piece is the fcntl(2) command F_CNVT, which is used by a lock daemon to convert an NFS file handle into an open fd in the lock daemon, which is then used to assert the locks. This probably wants to be implemented as explicit support in the NFS server code itself and accessed via VOP_IOCTL() or some similar means. The actual cookie format and implementation of the reverse lookup are, of course, specific to the NFS code, which is currently under very active developement, or I'dimplement it myself. This does NOT implement the user space daemons required to support incoming requests -- there is work under way to support this already by Andrew Gordon per a posting in the news groups (last Saturday, 19 Aug 95). The changes for this support are rather trivial. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu ============================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 19:23:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA03953 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:23:08 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA03943 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:23:03 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA00897; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:22:43 -0700 Message-Id: <199508210222.TAA00897@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: John Dyson cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 18:48:39 PDT." <199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:22:42 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In fact, why don't you get someone or you can do it yourself and make an html page. This sort of information has to go out and reach people. My sound bits, Amancio >>> John Dyson said: > I just did a competitive performance analysis of FreeBSD vs. Linux. I > can't say that FreeBSD was the CLEAR winner, but it was much faster > in many key areas. The only place that I can see that Linux is > architecturally faster is in the async filesystem stuff. Generally, > FreeBSD's networking (TCP) is at least 50% faster. FreeBSD's VM > stuff is much faster. I cannot see where people say that Linux needs > less memory either. I ran some memory loading benchmarks on FreeBSD and > Linux, where FreeBSD was a generic kernel and Linux was a "nice" subset > V1.3.20. It appears that FreeBSD handles loads much better. Also, > when running Linux I noticed an "old-friend" -- the bouncy SVR3 feel. > Things generally appear to run a bit slower on Linux, including sequential > file I/O. I am sure that Linux can fix up these minor performance nits, > but it does seem to run ok. > > I have results on request -- I just don't want to post them yet. If there > is a big demand, I will though.. > > John > dyson@root.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 19:35:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA04751 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:35:48 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA04738 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:35:42 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id WAA21857; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:21:39 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:21:38 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: attributions for images To: Brian Tao cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Aug 1995, Brian Tao wrote: > On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > > > > MoonDaemon.gif > > bsd-nomads.tiff > > Both are by Tatsumi, I believe. thank you, i have changed the file to reflect this information > > > bumper-sticker.jpeg Brian Tao > > Did you scale down the original to 1024 pixels across? I can > provide originals at that size, if you want (and if it looks better). no i did not. i would be happy to distribute whatever size you provide. scaling down does look better than trying to enlarge an image ;) > I'd rather have the large format one distributed instead, and allow > people to scale down if needed, rather than scaling up. > > > sticker.gif Brian Tao > > It looks like you lost the transparency feature of the GIF89a > format when transferring it over to your site... hmmm....were these available earlier in the formats that i have? i dont understand how the format could have been changed in the course of the ftp..... ;| Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 19:44:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA05675 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:44:29 -0700 Received: from hk.super.net (hk.super.net [202.14.67.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA05658 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:44:21 -0700 Received: from rssd.hk.olivetti.com by hk.super.net with SMTP id AA13494 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for <@hk.super.net:hackers@freebsd.org>); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:44:05 +0800 Message-Id: <199508210244.AA13494@hk.super.net> Subject: Re: Internet In A Box To: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:35:39 +0800 (HKT) From: "Raju M. Daryanani" Cc: gryphon@healer.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508202319.TAA05069@mail.htp.com> from "dennis" at Aug 20, 95 07:19:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 1808 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk According to dennis: > screend sucks. Try something else. Such as? I'm in the process of setting up a FreeBSD box as a firewall, and at the moment I've got both screend and the ipfirewall facility compiled in. The main problem I have with ipfirewall is that it sorts the firewall rules in ascending order of coverage size. I'd hate to find I've got a big hole because I miscalculated the order in which the rules are going to be evaluated. Also it is all or nothing in deciding which ICMP packets you want to forward, meaning I can't set policy on which ones I want to allow in and which ones I want to reject. The good thing about screend is that it evaluates the rules in the order that you issue them, making it easier to check the correctness. The problem I've got with it is that it doesn't allow you to screen out incoming TCP SYN packets. That will force me to close out some ports on which I would like to allow outgoing connections. It also doesn't allow me to protect the machine it's running on, since it only works on packets that it is gating between networks. As a result I've got to use ipfirewall to protect the FreeBSD router, and that means duplicated rules, which needlessly complicates things and creates two things I need to keep an eye on. Performance is not a problem for me at the moment because the firewall is only guarding a 14.4Kbps net connection, and the 386DX/25 it runs on is idle for 98% of its time. If there's something better that allows more control I'd like to know about it. Raju -- Raju M. Daryanani | Email: raju@rssd.hk.olivetti.com Technical Support Manager | raju@hk.super.net, raju@air.org Products Division | Tel: +852 2979 2450 / Fax: +852 2802 6650 Olivetti (HK) Ltd. | [Finger for PGP key] [MIME understood] From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 19:51:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA06273 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:51:42 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA06264 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:51:38 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA01163; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:51:20 -0700 Message-Id: <199508210251.TAA01163@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: attributions for images In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:21:38 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:51:19 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Sure attribution and licensing issues are all important, but *where* is my MoonDemon T-Shirt. I would like to order two medium size MoomDemo T-Shirts . One for me and the other for Bettina. (Hint: I will be great if someone starts selling MoonDemon T-Shirts) Thank You, Amancio & Bettina From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 20:10:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA07861 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:10:17 -0700 Received: from blob.best.net (blob.best.net [204.156.128.88]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA07851 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:10:14 -0700 Received: from geli.clusternet (rcarter.vip.best.com [204.156.137.2]) by blob.best.net (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id UAA23772; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:10:19 -0700 Received: (from rcarter@localhost) by geli.clusternet (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA17917; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:06:38 -0700 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:06:38 -0700 From: "Russell L. Carter" Message-Id: <199508210306.UAA17917@geli.clusternet> To: dyson@freefall.FreeBSD.org, hasty@rah.star-gate.com Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, terry@cs.weber.edu Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well, I am getting a lot of questions about why FreeBSD over Linux, and because the data was too sparse I have refused to do it, but I would really like to add this information to http://www.geli.com Nothing about what John reports is news to me. Russell Curious though, I deal with low-latency networking types for a (partial) living, and I have had more than one mention the syscall.s in Linux as the model for syscall overhead. Shouldn't this show up somewhere in user land? |In fact, why don't you get someone or you can do it yourself and |make an html page. This sort of information has to go out and |reach people. | | My sound bits, | Amancio | |>>> John Dyson said: | > I just did a competitive performance analysis of FreeBSD vs. Linux. I | > can't say that FreeBSD was the CLEAR winner, but it was much faster | > in many key areas. The only place that I can see that Linux is | > architecturally faster is in the async filesystem stuff. Generally, | > FreeBSD's networking (TCP) is at least 50% faster. FreeBSD's VM | > stuff is much faster. I cannot see where people say that Linux needs | > less memory either. I ran some memory loading benchmarks on FreeBSD and | > Linux, where FreeBSD was a generic kernel and Linux was a "nice" subset | > V1.3.20. It appears that FreeBSD handles loads much better. Also, | > when running Linux I noticed an "old-friend" -- the bouncy SVR3 feel. | > Things generally appear to run a bit slower on Linux, including sequential | > file I/O. I am sure that Linux can fix up these minor performance nits, | > but it does seem to run ok. | > | > I have results on request -- I just don't want to post them yet. If there | > is a big demand, I will though.. | > | > John | > dyson@root.com | | | From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 20:15:31 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA08532 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:15:31 -0700 Received: from distortion.eng.umd.edu (distortion.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.6]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA08520 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:15:26 -0700 Received: from latte.eng.umd.edu (latte.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.15]) by distortion.eng.umd.edu (8.6.10/8.6.4) with ESMTP id XAA03659; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:15:16 -0400 Received: (chuckr@localhost) by latte.eng.umd.edu (8.6.10/8.6.4) id XAA10252; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:15:15 -0400 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:15:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Terry Lambert cc: Sean Eric Fagan , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! In-Reply-To: <9508202018.AA23236@cs.weber.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > Well, in an advertisement, anyway. Today's NCA ad in the San Jose > > Mercury News has, inbetween some hard drives and some CD-ROM drives, > > "Walnut Creek CD-ROM FREE BSD 2.0.5," for $14.99. It is the only software > > advertised in the full-page ad. > > > > It (the ad) even uses "UNIX" without a "(R)" or "TM" ;). > > Someone needs to grab this and SCAN THAT BABY IN!!!! I have a friend with a 600X600 color scanner who's always offering to let me use it, but I'm kind of far away from San Jose. Send it to me, I'd be happy to do it. (The friend is a MACophile with good art software). > > > Terry Lambert > terry@cs.weber.edu > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 9120 Edmonston Ct #302 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 (Freebsd 2.0.5-snap-0726) and (301) 220-2114 | n3lxx (FreeBSD 2.0.5-snap-0622) -- Great! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 20:18:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA08938 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:18:17 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA08905 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:18:05 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA01937; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:15:22 -0600 Message-Id: <199508210315.VAA01937@rover.village.org> To: Michael Smith Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? Cc: wosch@cs.tu-berlin.de, peter@bonkers.taronga.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:46:14 +0930 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:15:21 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : Perl, OTOH, is slow and bloated, and its syntax is merely incomprehensible. I don't think we want to get into a flame war about syntax here. Both can be incomprehensible, and neither are the best syntax for representing a kernel configuration. Personally, I love Perl's syntax and find TCL an utter nightmare, but I know that others differ. Personally, I really like the current config files. Maybe I'm weird, but they are useful, and a lot more "portable" from machine to machine than the way Linux, say, generates kernels (or did in the 1.1.x timeframe). That's not to say that a tool couldn't be written in perl or tcl. However, unless one of these is in bindist, I'd argue loudly and strongly that you don't want to rely on external, non-standard tools to generate something as basic as a kernel. m4 isn't bad, imho. Given what it has done with the sendmail.cf file mess, I think it might be a fruitful path to follow. The syntax might be ugly, true, but it would have the advantage of working on a fairly minimal system. Just my two cents. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 20:23:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA09703 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:23:27 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA09697 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:23:23 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA22463; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:27:33 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508210357.NAA22463@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? To: imp@village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:27:32 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, wosch@cs.tu-berlin.de, peter@bonkers.taronga.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199508210315.VAA01937@rover.village.org> from "Warner Losh" at Aug 20, 95 09:15:21 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 972 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Warner Losh stands accused of saying: > Personally, I really like the current config files. Maybe I'm weird, > but they are useful, and a lot more "portable" from machine to machine > than the way Linux, say, generates kernels (or did in the 1.1.x > timeframe). Likewise, I don't have any problems with the current configfile approach, and that's not the issue here. We're talking (or at least trying to talk) about an interactive tool for generating these files, and the sort of backing database that this hypothetical tool might require. > Just my two cents. Appreciated. > Warner -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 20:25:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA09968 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:25:33 -0700 Received: from blob.best.net (blob.best.net [204.156.128.88]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA09951 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:25:28 -0700 Received: from geli.clusternet (rcarter.vip.best.com [204.156.137.2]) by blob.best.net (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id UAA24634 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:25:35 -0700 Received: (from rcarter@localhost) by geli.clusternet (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA17944 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:21:54 -0700 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:21:54 -0700 From: "Russell L. Carter" Message-Id: <199508210321.UAA17944@geli.clusternet> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: CICA cry for help Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Somebody with the knowledge of what to try ought to send the *single* boot floppy to CICA (emo@cica.cica.indiana.edu) and see if they can't get FreeBSD to do the job. I bet email is just fine. This is called a market opportunity. Cheers, Russell From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 20:36:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA10609 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:36:49 -0700 Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA10600 ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:36:44 -0700 Message-Id: <199508210336.UAA10600@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com didn't use HELO protocol To: "Russell L. Carter" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CICA cry for help In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 95 20:21:54 PDT." <199508210321.UAA17944@geli.clusternet> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:36:44 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Somebody with the knowledge of what to try ought to send the *single* boot >floppy to CICA (emo@cica.cica.indiana.edu) and see if they can't get >FreeBSD to do the job. > >I bet email is just fine. > >This is called a market opportunity. > >Cheers, >Russell I think I'm missing some context here. What's up with CICA? -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 20:58:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA11464 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:58:34 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA11456 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 20:58:31 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA02029; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:55:43 -0600 Message-Id: <199508210355.VAA02029@rover.village.org> To: "Raju M. Daryanani" Subject: Re: Internet In A Box Cc: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis), gryphon@healer.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:35:39 +0800 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:55:42 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : If there's something better that allows more control I'd like to know about : it. We currently use ipfilt. We're quite happy with it. It is basically a replacement for ip_output. We run it on a FreeBSD 1.1.5.1R box that is on a 386DX40. It is one of the two packages that we're aware of that will filter the famous "IP-Fragment-Spoof" problem (where you send an acceptible IP fragment through, then set the offset to be 1 and overwrite the acceptible bits with naught bits). The other is very recent versions of Cisco routers. It does no sorting and has been verified as secure by testing by one of the more paranoid villagers (Dworkin Muller). He looked at screend and ipfirewall that came with FreeBSD and quickly moved on to better ground. Warner P.S. There is a company called "Spry" that sells a product called Internet In A Box for the pcs running windows. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 21:04:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA11932 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:04:49 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA11922 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:04:43 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA03153 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:05:25 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:05:25 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508210405.AAA03153@healer.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Coranth Gryphon wrote: >It was also in an issue of Network Computing. They were comparing WinNT NFS >Servers, and used FreeBSD as the baseline to compare against Unix. Peter da Silva responded: > Don't leave us hanging... > What were the numbers? It was one of those multi-color bar graph things, one line each for reads and writes. The FreeBSD lines were these little colored smudges over on the left edge of the graph, the other systems went about halfway across the page (10 - 20 times slower on average). The did NFSWare, Chameleon, and one other I forget. -coranth ------------------------------------------+------------------------+ Coranth Gryphon | "Faith Manages." | | - Satai Delenn | Phone: 603-598-3440 Fax: 603-598-3430 +------------------------+ USMail: 11 Carver St, Nashua, NH 03060 Disclaimer: All these words are yours, except Europa... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 21:12:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA12383 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:12:47 -0700 Received: from blob.best.net (blob.best.net [204.156.128.88]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA12369 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:12:42 -0700 Received: from geli.clusternet (rcarter.vip.best.com [204.156.137.2]) by blob.best.net (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id VAA27862; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:12:52 -0700 Received: (from rcarter@localhost) by geli.clusternet (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA18033; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:09:10 -0700 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:09:10 -0700 From: "Russell L. Carter" Message-Id: <199508210409.VAA18033@geli.clusternet> To: gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.org, rcarter@geli.com Subject: Re: CICA cry for help Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Here goes: |From POPmail Sun Aug 20 21:07:46 1995 |Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:10:59 -0700 |From: Russell Carter |To: rcarter@geli.com | |>From emo@cica.cica.indiana.edu Sun Aug 20 20:36:46 PDT 1995 |Article: 16936 of comp.os.linux.networking |Path: news1.best.com!news3.net99.net!news.cais.net!ringer.cs.utsa.edu!swrinde!howland.reston.ans.net!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!usenet.ucs.indiana.edu!cica.cica.indiana.edu!not-for-mail |From: emo@cica.cica.indiana.edu (Eric Ost) |Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.networking,comp.os.linux.setup,comp.os.linux.hardware |Subject: using Linux for heavily-accessed network servers |Date: 19 Aug 1995 20:50:40 -0500 |Organization: Center for Innovative Computer Applications, Indiana University |Lines: 100 |Reply-To: emo@cica.cica.indiana.edu |NNTP-Posting-Host: cica.cica.indiana.edu |Summary: heavily-accessed site w/ random hangs on specific port... suggestions? |Xref: news1.best.com comp.os.linux.networking:16936 comp.os.linux.setup:24546 comp.os.linux.hardware:19443 | |Greetings All, | |I've read testimonials from folks who administer active Internet |sites which are using Linux on a PC and I am hoping that a few |of you will read this note and be able to offer some suggestions. |Has anyone else experienced problems similar to the ones described |below and what corrective actions were taken to resolve them? | |Our site hosts one of the world's most active ftp sites: the CICA ftp software |archive. It also runs httpd and gopher servers as well as handling |a normal load of email and system-related work, e.g. compiles, file edits, |etc. | |Here is the current configuration: | |Hardware |----------------------------------------------------------------------------- |Intel Neptune PCI chipset |Micronics motherboard with P5-90 |128MB RAM |6 GB disk (Seagate 2GB Barracuda, Seagate 4GB Hawk) |Buslogic 946C SCSI-2, PCI controller |SMC EtherPower PCI NIC |----------------------------------------------------------------------------- | |Software |----------------------------------------------------------------------------- |Slackware 2.3 |Linux 1.2.10 |xinetd 2.1.4-linux.3 (master server) |wu-ftpd 2.4 (ftp server) |NCSA httpd 1.4.1 (http server) |gn 2.08 (gopher server) |----------------------------------------------------------------------------- | |We have been experiencing strangeness whereby the system "burps" for a, |sometimes extended, period of time, and connections to port 21 are not |possible -- they just timeout. However, we configured an ftp service |for port 1111 and have discovered that during a "burp" on port 21, |connections to wu-ftpd running on port 1111 are just fine. Telnet (login) |to the machine also works speedily. Random delays have occurred with as low |as 90 and as high as 190 simultaneous connections to port 21; the more |connections, the more likelihood of a delay... | |In all of the above instances, xinetd is playing the role of mediator |between the incoming request and invoking the proper server. | |We have noticed that "netstat" reveals a number of tcp connections in state |FIN_WAIT2. We reduced the default and max timeouts for wu-ftpd to 300 and 600 |seconds, respectively, thinking that perhaps the delays were due to a scarcity |of sockets, with needed resources being tied up in FIN_WAIT2. Reducing |the timeout has reduced the number of processes in FIN_WAIT2, but has not |prevented the random delays. | |The question arises: why do ftp connections to port 1111, telnet/login |to port 23, and smtp via port 25 all connect immediately without delay*? |Connections to these ports depend on allocation of sockets just like the ftp |connection requests to port 21. What are the causative differences here? | |Log file data seems to indicate that wu-ftpd is not being forked by |xinetd on port 21 during these burps while wu-ftpd is being forked speedily |in response to port 1111 requests. Thus, the problem does not appear |to be directly caused by wu-ftpd. Nor does it appear to be caused by |xinetd. If wu-ftpd can be initiated on port 1111 by xinetd, why |can't the same executable be forked to communicate with port 21? | |During these random delays existing connections on port 21 do not seem to |be adversely effected. | |Thinking that lightening the load of xinetd might be in order, we are |now running one instance of xinted on ports 21 and 1111 with another |instance on all the other ports. The delays continue at random times on |port 21 while during these periods connections to port 1111 are speedily |answered. | |At one point the kernel parameter NSOCKETS_LINUX in was increased |to 2048, but that did not make any difference either. | |Does anyone have suggestions for further investigation or possibly a |method for resolving this quandary? We have attempted to systematically |narrow the search to focus on the source of the problem. Now we are |wondering if there may be some kind of resource-wait deadlock happening |occasionally somewhere in the system. | |We have been "hanging in there" with Linux for a variety of reasons. |However, we are reaching a point where the problem has become an acute |nuisance and so have been giving serious consideration to switching OS's, |e.g. FreeBSD. | |Any assistance or suggestions folks may lend to resolution of this problem |will be greatly appreciated. The net is a great resource; especially, the |thousands of folks working on developing kernel and application level |code for Linux. | |Any words of wisdom out there? | |Thanks, | |eric | | | | | From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 21:22:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA12720 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:22:13 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA12710 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:22:06 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA14299; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:22:03 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id GAA19063 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:22:03 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id EAA03347 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:26:39 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508210226.EAA03347@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: whereis whereis? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:26:38 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201039.MAA00820@localhost> from "Wolfram Schneider" at Aug 20, 95 12:39:51 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 382 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Wolfram Schneider wrote: > > >So whereis(1) now finally degraded to which(1) (sort of). > > $ whereis ls > /bin/ls > $ echo $? > 255 > $ whereis /bin/ls |wc -l > 0 > > It is buggy and not a which(1). Sort of. A poor clone. :-} -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 21:23:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA12821 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:23:22 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA12809 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:23:04 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA03247 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:23:08 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:23:08 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508210423.AAA03247@healer.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Screend Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk According to dennis: > screend sucks. Try something else. Such as? I didn't like ipfw because it was convoluted to translate the rules (at least the way I look at filtering), you could not simply give it a config file, and it's easy to miss things in the rules. Says "Raju M. Daryanani" : > The problem I've got with it is that [SCREEND] doesn't allow you to screen > out incoming TCP SYN packets. That will force me to close out some ports > on which I would like to allow outgoing connections. Just block "reserved" from foreign hosts, and you're fine. Or if you have an idea how to distinguish these packets easily, we can probaly find a way to patch the source to fix this. > It also doesn't allow > me to protect the machine it's running on, since it only works on packets > that it is gating between networks. As a result I've got to use ipfirewall I have patches ported that screen the local machine, as well as allowing for screeing only the PPP interface on the local machine. -coranth ------------------------------------------+------------------------+ Coranth Gryphon | "Faith Manages." | | - Satai Delenn | Phone: 603-598-3440 Fax: 603-598-3430 +------------------------+ USMail: 11 Carver St, Nashua, NH 03060 Disclaimer: All these words are yours, except Europa... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 21:29:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA13144 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:29:30 -0700 Received: from simon.chi.il.us (simon.chi.il.us [199.245.227.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA13124 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:29:23 -0700 Received: by simon.chi.il.us (Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0skOUl-0006IIC; Sun, 20 Aug 95 23:29 CDT Message-Id: Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 23:29 CDT From: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) To: nate@rocky.sri.MT.net Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > From rocky.sri.MT.net!nate Sun Aug 20 14:58:22 1995 > Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 12:02:14 -0600 > From: Nate Williams > To: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) > Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org > Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server > Content-Length: 2228 > > Steven E. Piette writes: > [ Speeding up NFS writes ] > Terry > You can turn on async writes in the BSD NFS server. > > Terry> Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too, this is a cache > Terry> coherency violation and can result in Bad Things Happening in case > Terry> of a server power failure or other failure that results in the > Terry> server going down, then coming back up while the app on a client > Terry> is still running. This is because the client will think the data > Terry> was written and may depend on being able to retrieve it later > Terry> (ie: a database index). > > > Steve> Terry, Do you bother checking your references before you make blanket > Steve> statements or do you like to just wing it? Do you bother checking them > Steve> after someone points out your errors? > > Huh? What Terry said above is correct. With async writes, the server > effectively tells the client is that the data has been written (when in > fact it really hasn't been). In the case of a power failure that occurs > after the server has informed the client, but *before* the data has > actually been written you have big problems. > > > Nate > Thanks Nate, First, my message slipped out be accident. I was sending a bunch of messages and I sent it instead of deleting my initial thoughts about his mail. My apologies to Terry, for letting my initial reactions become public. I usually start a reply and continue reading mail for additional responses before sending it out. In this case I sent out something I was going to let slide. I know all about Async writes, prestoserve, and UPS's. I have to explain them to customers on almost regular basis. My issue was with Terry's assertion that Async writes was part of the SVID and that Sun's and SVR4 machines do this this by default. Or at least that's what I thought he was saying, because he's said that before, and it's plainly wrong. In all fairness to Terry, what he said was: TL > The SGI, being SVR4 based, is doing async writes on the server by TL > default. The BSD box is waiting for the write to be comitted to TL > the server disk before continuing. TL > TL > You can turn on async writes in the BSD NFS server. TL > TL > Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too, this is a cache TL > coherency violation and can result in Bad Things Happening in case TL > of a server power failure or other failure that results in the TL > server going down, then coming back up while the app on a client TL > is still running. This is because the client will think the data TL > was written and may depend on being able to retrieve it later TL > (ie: a database index). He's correct about the behaviour and the problems it creates. I might have misinterpreting his comment to "Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too" as meaning that they also use Async by default as opposed to meaning that You can turn on async writes in the BSD NFS server and Sun's and SVR4 machines as well. The former is incorrect, the latter is accurate. Since I'm not sure what he was tring to say, I again apologise for biting Terry's head off.... Steve From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 21:34:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA13589 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:34:44 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA13574 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:34:28 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA03316 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:34:09 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:34:09 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508210434.AAA03316@healer.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: IPFW and SCREEND Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi. Some people appear to like IPFW and some appear to like SCREEND. I've just spent time rewriting chunks of screend to run on FreeBSD. Who out there wrote (or is in charge of) IPFW, would like to collaborate to put the best of both into freebsd? Saves two overlapping programs, and saves me having to re-port the screend kernel patches for each new release. -coranth From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 21:49:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA14525 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:49:07 -0700 Received: from ns1.win.net (ns1.win.net [204.215.209.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA14517 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:49:05 -0700 Received: (from bugs@localhost) by ns1.win.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) id AAA07123 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:52:19 -0400 From: Mark Hittinger Message-Id: <199508210452.AAA07123@ns1.win.net> Subject: Re: CICA cry for help (fwd) To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:52:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 631 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > |From: emo@cica.cica.indiana.edu (Eric Ost) > |Subject: using Linux for heavily-accessed network servers > |... > |We have been "hanging in there" with Linux for a variety of reasons. > |However, we are reaching a point where the problem has become an acute > |nuisance and so have been giving serious consideration to switching OS's, > |e.g. FreeBSD. See? It *IS* moving slowly in our direction. This would be a good one to bring over. Sounds more like a locking contention issue to me. Hope they aren't heavy users of NFS like Karl. :-) They are half way between me and Chicago :-) Regards, Mark Hittinger bugs@win.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 21:57:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA15831 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:57:18 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA15808 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:57:10 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA06908 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:38:54 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA28323; 20 Aug 95 21:54:58 CDT (Sun) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA28320; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:54:57 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508210254.VAA28320@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? To: wosch@cs.tu-berlin.de Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:54:57 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201054.MAA00921@localhost> from "Wolfram Schneider" at Aug 20, 95 12:54:26 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 770 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > tcl syntax is silly. It's a reasonable compromise between a user-level command level and a language like Lisp. I wouldn't want to have end-users editing a Perl command file, for example, but the Tcl syntax and rules are so simple and fit well into what users expect of a command file. It's a better fit to config files than just about anything else out there. Speaking of config files, tcl could parse the "config" file format directly. Just define Tcl commands for "option", "device", and so on. > The manpages are really bad (compared to perl). They're man pages. Like, you know, reference documentation? > tcl is actually a package and not in bindist. I ported the bmaked NetBSD version to FreeBSD. It could go in bindist tomorrow. That's a silly objection. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 21:57:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA15943 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:57:58 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA15913 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:57:51 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA06914 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:39:29 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA29765; 20 Aug 95 22:45:50 CDT (Sun) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA29762; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:45:50 -0500 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:45:50 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508210345.WAA29762@bonkers.taronga.com> To: terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <9508201948.AA23045@cs.weber.edu> References: Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <9508201948.AA23045@cs.weber.edu>, Terry Lambert wrote: >Unless you are running everything on the same box, it's impossible to >provide inter-machine consistency guarantees. That's why NFS is the >way it is. Oh, crap. You handle machine failures the same way you handle disk failures. If you can't handle disk failures you shouldn't have a stateful *local* file system. For conventional file I/O you can get pretty much the same recovery semantics both ways (client reloads state), and for non-file I/O you get the choice of no access at all or error returns. I'll take the error returns. I've used stateless and stateful remote file systems, and I'll take stateful any day. I'd much rather type: tar tvfB //xds13/dev/rmt0 Than: rsh xds13 dd if=/dev/rmt0 | tar tvfb - And it's awful nice to be able to set up a getty on //modem1/dev/ttyc4. And being able to get open-count semantics on temp files. And accessing named pipes over the net. And "fsck //hurtsystem/dev/rw0a". And so on... I really miss OpenNET. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 22:24:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA19809 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:24:22 -0700 Received: from hk.super.net (hk.super.net [202.14.67.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA19790 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:24:13 -0700 Received: from rssd.hk.olivetti.com by hk.super.net with SMTP id AA01878 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for <@hk.super.net:hackers@freebsd.org>); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:23:56 +0800 Message-Id: <199508210523.AA01878@hk.super.net> Subject: Re: Internet In A Box To: imp@village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:13:30 +0800 (HKT) From: "Raju M. Daryanani" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508210355.VAA02029@rover.village.org> from "Warner Losh" at Aug 20, 95 09:55:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 392 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk According to Warner Losh: > We currently use ipfilt. We're quite happy with it. Where do I find it? TIA, Raju -- Raju M. Daryanani | Email: raju@rssd.hk.olivetti.com Technical Support Manager | raju@hk.super.net, raju@air.org Products Division | Tel: +852 2979 2450 / Fax: +852 2802 6650 Olivetti (HK) Ltd. | [Finger for PGP key] [MIME understood] From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 22:25:24 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA20042 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:25:24 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA20026 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:25:21 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA08038; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:25:01 -0700 To: Peter da Silva cc: wosch@cs.tu-berlin.de, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 21:54:57 CDT." <199508210254.VAA28320@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:25:01 -0700 Message-ID: <8036.808982701@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I ported the bmaked NetBSD version to FreeBSD. It could go in bindist > tomorrow. That's a silly objection. And maybe someday it will.. For now, a couple of *technical* points: 1. TCL is a fine language for what it does and even the most rank beginner will see after reading a couple of pages of docs that it does things that cannot be done easily in PERL. Yes, it is possible to interface additional libraries to PERL but nowhere nearly as easily as one can with TCL and no big surprise there - extending applications is what TCL was designed for! Fortunately for PERL fans, there are many things that one can do with PERL that aren't easy with TCL and if we didn't feel it to be of fundamental use then you wouldn't see PERL being the standard part of FreeBSD it is today. 2. I also believe that TCL's time to join FreeBSD is not far off, and really the only reason I've been holding off on importing Peter's bmaked sources (which he takes special pains to point me at about every 2 months! :-) is because I've known that a major new release of TCL was in the works and I didn't want to make two import operations out of it. Now that tcl 7.4 is out, perhaps someone will bmake it. Why do I want to see tcl as part of the tree? Well, because I feel that as a scripting language it simply has no peer (and I've used it in LARGE projects as a consultant where I either delivered the goods on time or didn't get paid) and we could all do well to standardise on it in a number of applications where we're using a hodge-podge of dissimilar "scripting languages" all rolled from scratch. TCL is a fine standard for describing behaviors external to a monolithic application and I think we should use it. There are going to be some fine things coming out of Sun on this front, in fact, and I myself can hardly wait to see them. If Ctk didn't represent such an inferior curses interface today, I'd even use it for the install (hint to the Ctk dudes: Tk was the wrong standard to track - it's waaaaay too X-centric! Please start over with an approach that papers over the details of both rather than trying to shove a size 6 foot into a size 12 shoe!). Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 22:31:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA21120 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:31:01 -0700 Received: from hk.super.net (hk.super.net [202.14.67.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA21085 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:30:50 -0700 Received: from rssd.hk.olivetti.com by hk.super.net with SMTP id AA02506 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for <@hk.super.net:hackers@freebsd.org>); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:30:34 +0800 Message-Id: <199508210530.AA02506@hk.super.net> Subject: Re: Screend To: gryphon@healer.com (Coranth Gryphon) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:23:06 +0800 (HKT) From: "Raju M. Daryanani" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508210423.AAA03247@healer.com> from "Coranth Gryphon" at Aug 21, 95 00:23:08 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Length: 1486 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk According to Coranth Gryphon: > Says "Raju M. Daryanani" : > > The problem I've got with it is that [SCREEND] doesn't allow you to screen > > out incoming TCP SYN packets. That will force me to close out some ports > > on which I would like to allow outgoing connections. > Just block "reserved" from foreign hosts, and you're fine. Or if you have > an idea how to distinguish these packets easily, we can probaly find a way > to patch the source to fix this. What I was looking for was a filter that checked the flags in the packet. If only the SYN flag is on, then it is a new connection initiation, and I don't want any of those coming in to certain reserved ports (e.g. NBIOS-TCP). I do want to allow outgoing SYN packets and the corresponding incoming packets so that we can access remote services. ipfw in FreeBSD does appear to support this, but screend seems to work purely on the basis of addresses and ports. ICMP packets are the only ones where it allows further tests on packet types. > I have patches ported that screen the local machine, as well as allowing > for screeing only the PPP interface on the local machine. I'd be interested in those. Raju -- Raju M. Daryanani | Email: raju@rssd.hk.olivetti.com Technical Support Manager | raju@hk.super.net, raju@air.org Products Division | Tel: +852 2979 2450 / Fax: +852 2802 6650 Olivetti (HK) Ltd. | [Finger for PGP key] [MIME understood] From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 22:41:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA23239 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:41:46 -0700 Received: from simon.chi.il.us (simon.chi.il.us [199.245.227.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA23223 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:41:41 -0700 Received: by simon.chi.il.us (Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0skPcC-0006IIC; Mon, 21 Aug 95 00:41 CDT Message-Id: Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 00:41 CDT From: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) To: terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) > Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server > To: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) > Date: Sun, 20 Aug 95 14:56:32 MDT > > > > The SGI, being SVR4 based, is doing async writes on the server by > > > default. The BSD box is waiting for the write to be comitted to > > > the server disk before continuing. > > > > > > You can turn on async writes in the BSD NFS server. > > > > > > Be warned that, though Sun and SVR4 do this too, this is a cache > > > coherency violation and can result in Bad Things Happening in case > > > of a server power failure or other failure that results in the > > > server going down, then coming back up while the app on a client > > > is still running. This is because the client will think the data > > > was written and may depend on being able to retrieve it later > > > (ie: a database index). > > > > Terry, Do you bother checking your references before you make blanket > > statements or do you like to just wing it? Do you bother checking them > > after someone points out your errors? > > Well, I know the SGI does async writes, and does them by default. > > I know that SVR4, at least the UnixWare release, which is really the > only release there is any more, does async writes -- I was in one of > the meetings that decided to do it while I was arguing for optioning > it with it "off" by default. I lost. The benchmark optimizers won. > > So the above is a correct blanket statement. As I said earler, This mail wasn't suppost to be sent. My mistake. I'm sorry. What I was really responding to was a interpretation on my part that you were saying, that Sun's do async writes by default, and what you just did say, that SVR4 (in the generic case) does as well. As others have pointed out Sun does sync writes by default and belives some sort of NVRAM is required to support safe async writes in NFS today. I had put my response aside to refer to both the SVID and the pre V3 NFS spec before commenting and I sure I would have revised my initial response which is more akin to talking to myself that actually directed at you. I've since checked SVID 3 and it says nothing about the expected behaviour of NFS writes, so I say that in SVR4 its an implementation detail. I haven't today checked the V2 NFS spec as to what it says about async writes, so I won't comment further on conformance. > > I *did* check the cache coherency claims about NFSv3. And given the > exact wording of the RFC (which does not match the Sun White Paper > of two years ago), safe async writes are guaranteed, but full cache > coherency is not. I hadn't gotten that far in your message... > > I'd like to think that the directory search/stat combination and > multiple entry transfers came out of some of the attributed file > system work we demonstrated for Sun about a year before the Sun > NFSv3 paper came out. It's more likely that we just arrived at a > similar soloution to similar problems, but as a result, I spent > an inordinate amount of time going over the Sun paper. > > For the purposes of the discussion, cache coherency amounted to async > writes being safe, not to dealing correctly with memory mapped files > over NFS. It was not my intent to draw that fine a distinction, and > so I was wrong on a technicality. > > That was an omission on my part, and I've already owned up to it, though > not in this great gory detail. > > What is your point? That I don't take the same pains to research > email and dot all the "i"'s and cross all the "t"'s, as long as I > get the gist across, that I would take were I writing a book? I'll > freely admit that... probably I'll keep doing it until someone pays > me book rates to do posting. 8-). Think by now you understand I had no point. :-) I was thinking with my fingers and before I'd done what I accused you of, it got sent out with a bunch of other messages I was sending. I even shut down my link and deleted the message from the queue when I realized what that happened but I didn't kill the smail process that was still active trying to deliver the message. The result was that I snapped at you. And for that I apologize. > > > > Regards, > Terry Lambert > terry@cs.weber.edu Steve I got to start drinking more coffee in the mornings before I start reading mail. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 20 23:18:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA28800 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:18:33 -0700 Received: from misery.sdf.com (gw.sdf.com [204.191.196.33]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA28783 for ; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:18:14 -0700 Received: by misery.sdf.com id <1130>; Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:12:19 +0100 Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 23:12:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: Coranth Gryphon cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! In-Reply-To: <199508201249.IAA01176@healer.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Coranth Gryphon wrote: > It was also in an issue of Network Computing. They were comparing WinNT NFS > Servers, and used FreeBSD as the baseline to compare against Unix. Speaking of Windows and NFS, does anyone know of a good NFS client for Windows? I'm aware of BWS and Sunsoft's offerings, but know little about them.... Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 00:02:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA01867 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:02:20 -0700 Received: from hq.icb.chel.su (icb-rich-gw.icb.chel.su [193.125.10.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA01852 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:01:57 -0700 Received: from localhost (babkin@localhost) by hq.icb.chel.su (8.6.5/8.6.5) id MAA02188; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:59:18 +0600 From: "Serge A. Babkin" Message-Id: <199508210659.MAA02188@hq.icb.chel.su> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:59:18 +0600 (GMT+0600) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508200552.WAA00268@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Aug 19, 95 10:52:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 661 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >> > What can I do to improve NFS writes to a FreeBSD server? The > >> > machine was idle at the time, with four nfsd's running. Should I be > >> > using UDP or TCP (I turned both on)? > >> > > > >Assuming you are running 2.1 branch: current (2.2) code includes support > >for write gathering, which can improve large write performance. > >Be warned: 2.2 kernel is incompatible with 2.1 user space utilities. > > If there is interest, I'll implement an NFS_ASYNC kernel option for both > FreeBSD 2.1 and 2.2. Yes, please! Serge Babkin ! (babkin@hq.icb.chel.su) ! Headquarter of Joint Stock Commercial Bank "Chelindbank" ! Chelyabinsk, Russia From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 00:04:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA01935 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:04:03 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA01919 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:04:00 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA02908; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:02:34 -0600 Message-Id: <199508210702.BAA02908@rover.village.org> To: "Raju M. Daryanani" Subject: Re: Internet In A Box Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:13:30 +0800 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:02:33 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk : Where do I find it? I'm not sure. I just looked at the source we have, and I can't seem to find an FTP address in them. However, the tarball they were in is ip_fil2.7.2.tar.gz. Archie on ip_fil says: 01 Host concert.cert.dfn.de Location: /pub/tools/net/packet_screen/ip_fil2.7.1.tar.gz 02 Host ftp.sunet.se Location: /pub/security/tools/net/packet_screen/ip_fil2.7.1.tar.gz 03 Host coombs.anu.edu.au Location: /pub/net/kernel/ip_fil2.7.tar.gz 04 Host ftp.dstc.edu.au Location: /u2/pub/security/firewall/ip_fil/ip_fil2.7.tar.gz 05 Host idea.sec.dsi.unimi.it Location: /.1/security/certs/DFN-CERT/tools/net/packet_screen/ip_fil2.7.1.tar.gz The author's address is darrenr@arbld.unimelb.edu.au. I had a readme that announced the 2.7.2 release, but can't seem to find it now. I don't know which of these are official, if any, but I'd guess 03 or 04 might be good places to start. I know that we had to write our own rule setting program in the 2.4 version, but 2.7.2 supposedly works much better and includes this support. Dworkin Muller (dworkin@village.org) has done a lot of kernel hacking to make 2.4 and 2.7.2 work with FreeBSD 1.1.5.1R. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 00:25:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA03198 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:25:10 -0700 Received: from kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA03191 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:25:07 -0700 Received: from mailbox.mcs.com (Mailbox.mcs.com [192.160.127.87]) by kitten.mcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) with SMTP id CAA08774 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:25:06 -0500 Received: by mailbox.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Mon, 21 Aug 95 02:25 CDT Received: (from karl@localhost) by Jupiter.mcs.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) id CAA00620 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:25:04 -0500 From: Karl Denninger Message-Id: <199508210725.CAA00620@Jupiter.mcs.net> Subject: More than 64M of RAM? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:25:04 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 477 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Does FreeBSD support more than 64MB of RAM? And if so, how do you get it to find the extra? -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | (shell, PPP, SLIP, leased) in Chicagoland Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 7 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's *Three STAR A* Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 00:39:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA03825 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:39:23 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA03819 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:39:21 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id AAA01736; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:38:30 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id AAA00819; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:40:13 -0700 Message-Id: <199508210740.AAA00819@corbin.Root.COM> To: Karl Denninger cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: More than 64M of RAM? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 95 02:25:04 CDT." <199508210725.CAA00620@Jupiter.mcs.net> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 00:40:13 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Does FreeBSD support more than 64MB of RAM? And if so, how do you get it to >find the extra? It currently has to be done with a kernel config option: options "MAXMEM=" for example: options "MAXMEM=131072" ...for 128MB. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 01:19:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA04515 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:19:09 -0700 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA04508 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:19:04 -0700 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id BAA03501; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:17:45 -0700 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199508210817.BAA03501@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND To: gryphon@healer.com (Coranth Gryphon) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:17:44 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508210434.AAA03316@healer.com> from "Coranth Gryphon" at Aug 21, 95 00:34:09 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 793 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Hi. Some people appear to like IPFW and some appear to like SCREEND. > > I've just spent time rewriting chunks of screend to run on FreeBSD. > Who out there wrote (or is in charge of) IPFW, would like to collaborate > to put the best of both into freebsd? Saves two overlapping programs, > and saves me having to re-port the screend kernel patches for each new release. > Send me the screend kernel patches, (should be really small if I recall correctly, just 1 patch in ip_forward). That can become a standard part of FreeBSD. Becareful with that user land code in screend, it has some very strict license issues with it. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 01:31:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA04737 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:31:14 -0700 Received: from pent.vnet.net (pent.vnet.net [166.82.194.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA04731 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:31:10 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pent.vnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id EAA23102 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:31:08 -0400 Message-Id: <199508210831.EAA23102@pent.vnet.net> X-Authentication-Warning: pent.vnet.net: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: libresolve won't compile Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:31:07 -0400 From: "Adam W. Hawks" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk libresolve tries to include non-existant header file . I am using sources from ctm delta 916. Adam W. Hawks root@pent.vnet.net awhawks@vnet.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 01:33:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA04839 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:33:37 -0700 Received: from mail.rwth-aachen.de (mail.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.144.9]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA04833 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:33:28 -0700 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by mail.rwth-aachen.de (PMDF V4.3-10 #7297) id <01HUBYIHEKJK007NML@mail.rwth-aachen.de>; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:33:56 +0100 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.8/8.6.9) id KAA26753; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:47:25 +0200 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:47:25 +0200 (MET DST) From: Christoph Kukulies Subject: Re: IDE CDROM In-reply-to: <199508210616.XAA28627@freefall.FreeBSD.org> from "sos@freebsd.org" at Aug 20, 95 11:16:13 pm To: sos@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (user alias) Reply-to: Christoph Kukulies Message-id: <199508210847.KAA26753@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-type: text Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-length: 1526 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > In reply to Steven Wallace who wrote: > > My ATAPI IDE CDROM is not being recognized. > > > > My config has: > > > > options ATAPI #Enable ATAPI support for IDE bus > > controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 vector wdintr > > disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 > > disk wd1 at wdc0 drive 1 > > device wcd0 #IDE CD-ROM > > > > And during probe all I get is > > wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 on isa > > and that is IT. It just sits there for 10 seconds. > > > > I ONLY have an IDE CDROM drive and that is it. No other IDE drives. > > So the IDE CDROM is configured to be the master. Maybe that is the reason? > > Ahh, thats the clue, the driver currently does not support > "loose" cdrom's, there has to be a disk there also. > I'm looking into this in the next couble of days.. I'm running a Mitsumi FX-400 ATAPI CDROM drive as a sole drive on my ASUS SP3G board w/o problems. Unfortunately due to a disk wipe out (did a CHROOTDIR=/home on a make release :-( ) I lost my config file but I believe it was the same as above. WHen you say 'it just sits there for 10 seconds' what happens after the 10 seconds ? I assume it is trying to find the wd drives. > > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org | sos@login.dknet.dk) FreeBSD Core Team > So much code to hack -- so little time > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 01:44:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA05295 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:44:04 -0700 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA05221 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:41:17 -0700 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id KAA13733 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:41:27 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199508210841.KAA13733@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:41:27 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <199508201813.UAA01188@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 20, 95 08:12:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2535 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > > How (within a device driver) do I abort a DMA transfer which has > > been started but has not completed yet ? I am having this problem > > in the driver for a hand-scanner (the scanner does some read ahead; > > meanwhile, a user might close the device and we want to abort the > > transfer and free the buffer). I am surprised I haven't seen (or > > understood!) anything like this in existing drivers, not even in > > the floppy driver! > > You are surprised to have not seen this in the floppy driver? This > surprises me. :-) > > Actually, i'd immediately kill the floppy controller if i would abort > a transfer in progress. The only means then would raise the reset > line of the FDC. > > I'm not sure if setting some masking bit in one of the DMAC registers > will actually _abort_ a transfer. Van Gilluwe does only speak about > masking a request. The culprit is that DMA operation is usually > IO-controlled (via the TC signal) instead of being software- > controlled. > > Why don't you simply continue the started request, and throw away its > results once the DMAC has signalled the command completetion by an > interrupt (and the interrupt handler sees that the device is closed Consider the following scenario (working with a hand scanner): 1) on open, a buffer is allocated with sufficient room for reading N scanlines (the size of a scanline depends on the resolution, and the number of lines might be in the range 10..100) 2) the device is closed while the DMA is active (which is essentially all the times) *and* there will be no further data coming from the scanner (this is likely: the user knows he wants to close the device, thus he stops scanning and then gives the appropriate commands); 3) a new open is requested, possibly with different parameters, which causes the need for a larger buffer; now I need to abort the previous transfer, free the old memory, and malloc a newer block. > now)? I would personally do everything in avoiding even touching such > a hot iron like the DMAC. I'll see if I can get the data sheets for an 8237. Thanks Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 01:49:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA05435 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:49:22 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA05428 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:49:17 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA00589 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:49:14 -0700 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Netscape and mime.types? Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 01:49:13 -0700 Message-ID: <587.808994953@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Netscape has the annoying property of not dealing with .au files by default, but its default "Helper Applications and Proxies" page simply refers to a file named: /usr/local/lib/netscape/mime.types A file with which it is not distributed. Anyone got any pointers to a sample version of such a file or, failing that, some clue as to what the syntax is? I checked the FAQ (hey, you're famous, Peter!) but it claims that .au files fall into the list of "built in" MIME types. If that's the case, why does it prompt me with a file requestor when I click on a .au sample? The same goes for MPEG videos, anims and pretty much all the other types that the Netscape FAQ claims are simply handled by default. Grrr! Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 02:01:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA05924 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:01:29 -0700 Received: from mail.rwth-aachen.de (mail.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.144.9]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA05918 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:01:22 -0700 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by mail.rwth-aachen.de (PMDF V4.3-10 #7297) id <01HUBZFRVVN4007PK4@mail.rwth-aachen.de>; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:00:46 +0100 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.8/8.6.9) id LAA26826; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:14:14 +0200 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:14:13 +0200 (MET DST) From: Christoph Kukulies Subject: Re: How do I save panic messages?! In-reply-to: <199508201502.LAA01118@crh.cl.msu.edu> from "Charles Henrich" at Aug 20, 95 11:02:04 am To: henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu (Charles Henrich) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-to: Christoph Kukulies Message-id: <199508210914.LAA26826@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-type: text Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-length: 725 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > This is getting tedious, Im attempting to work on significant port of kernel > level code, but if Im not sitting on virtual console 0, whenever the system > panics, Im screwed. I cant switch out of X, or kill the screen blanker, or > switch to the virtual console to see what the hell went wrong, nor is any > information logged anywhere :(. Any help is most gratefully appreciated. You may build a kernel with the COMCONSOLE option and run your system through a terminal window from another box. > > -Crh > > Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu > > http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 02:32:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA06943 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:32:33 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA06937 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:32:23 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id TAA16474; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:28:04 +1000 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:28:04 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508210928.TAA16474@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu, kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de Subject: Re: How do I save panic messages?! Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >You may build a kernel with the COMCONSOLE option >and run your system through a terminal window from another box. This is not the best way. Just boot with -h, or fix the autodetection of no keyboard and reenable it (autodetection was disabled for 2.0.5R and hasn't been reenabled) so that booting with no keyboard gives a serial console. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 02:41:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA07255 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:41:38 -0700 Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA07243 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:41:34 -0700 Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA11902; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:43:28 +0100 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:43:26 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Terry Lambert cc: Brian Tao , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <9508201948.AA23045@cs.weber.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > The NFSv3 is not default with FreeBSD, and it's not there for BSDI at > all as far as I know. It does seem to be in 4.4-lite2 however, so we may see it in a future offering from BSDI someday. -- Doug Rabson, Microsoft RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 171 251 4411 FAX: +44 171 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 02:44:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA07410 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:44:26 -0700 Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA07399 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:44:19 -0700 Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA11913; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:45:50 +0100 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:45:50 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, Joerg Wunsch cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <199508201902.VAA01364@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, J Wunsch wrote: > As Steven E. Piette wrote: > > > > Darn, I saw all this traffic on NFSv3 in the past so I went out and installed > > Solaris 2.5 Beta to test it against. I guess I should have read the mail a > > lot closer. Oh well. Getting 2.5 to run on a SS1+ was interesting in it's own > > right. > > As much as i hate to say it (those who have read my experience reports > will do know why :), SGI's IRIX 5.3 does also support NFSv3. I have > yet to put a FreeBSD-current box there and actually test it. Note that to get it to actually work, you need to install SGI's patch 547 to IRIX 5.3. I have tested it to see if it works but I have no performance figures. This Indy is not very fast anyway :-(. -- Doug Rabson, Microsoft RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 171 251 4411 FAX: +44 171 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 02:47:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA07624 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:47:06 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA07615 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:47:01 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id TAA17187; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:45:40 +1000 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:45:40 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508210945.TAA17187@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@freebsd.org, root@pent.vnet.net Subject: Re: libresolve won't compile Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [Please report current problems only in the current mailing list.] >libresolve tries to include non-existant header file . >I am using sources from ctm delta 916. This can be fixed by adding `-I${.CURDIR}/../libc/net -UDEBUG -DDEBUG=' or something like that to libresolv/Makefile. I committed a different fix. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 02:59:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA08394 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:59:27 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id CAA08380 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 02:58:37 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA13427; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:57:15 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA19873 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:51:17 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA04266 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:43:55 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508210643.IAA04266@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:43:54 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org> from "John Dyson" at Aug 20, 95 06:48:39 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 729 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As John Dyson wrote: > > I just did a competitive performance analysis of FreeBSD vs. Linux. I > can't say that FreeBSD was the CLEAR winner, but it was much faster > in many key areas. ... I cannot see where people say that Linux needs > less memory either. Did you also compare them on a 4 MB box? Would be interesting. Background: i'm running a notebook with 5 MB, and it's really slow. But it worked better with FreeBSD 1.1.5.1 than 2.0.5. (Part of this impression might be the switch from X11R5 to X11R6, along with that infamous omission of -lgnumalloc in XFree86 3.1.1.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 03:14:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA08779 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:14:15 -0700 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA08773 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:14:12 -0700 Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with ESMTP id DAA11938 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:13:56 -0700 Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id LAA11968; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:13:45 +0100 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:13:45 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Objective C in our source tree? In-Reply-To: <199508191034.DAA04213@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > I'm starting to see more Objective C libraries coming out, such > as the ViewKit from the Hungry Programmers (the people doing LessTif). > > I think we've been taking gcc to somewhat reduced bits long enough and > we should be sensitive to the fact that some people do not regard this > loss of functionality in the translation to be a good thing. I remember > that someone here had done the work necessary to bringing back the > lost objective C driver and functionality - who was that? > > I'd like to bring it back. If nothing else, it would make gcc compatible > with its own on-line documentation again. Hang on a minute - ViewKit is C++ (its a clone of an SGI c++ library). I did see some links from their web pages to the GNUStep project which is Objective C. -- Doug Rabson, Microsoft RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 171 251 4411 FAX: +44 171 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 03:23:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA09264 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:23:39 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA09254 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:23:34 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id DAA01177; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:22:55 -0700 To: Doug Rabson cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Objective C in our source tree? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:13:45 BST." Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:22:55 -0700 Message-ID: <1175.809000575@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Hang on a minute - ViewKit is C++ (its a clone of an SGI c++ library). I > did see some links from their web pages to the GNUStep project which is > Objective C. OK, so I lied! :-) Sorry, I must have been confused. I still think we should bring ObjC back though. C'mon, who out there had the diffs for it? We've been approached concerning this before and I know somebody was practically *begging* us to take them, now that I want to do it I can't find them.. :-( Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 03:52:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA11528 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:52:16 -0700 Received: from clem.systemsix.com (clem.systemsix.com [198.99.86.131]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA11488 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 03:52:07 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clem.systemsix.com (8.6.8/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA19189 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:51:58 -0600 Message-Id: <199508211051.EAA19189@clem.systemsix.com> X-Authentication-Warning: clem.systemsix.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol From: Steve Passe To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: xmcd port doesn't work Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:51:56 -0600 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello, I made the port of audio/xmcd on 950726-SNAP and found that it got stuck in a loop of: SCIOCCOMMAND: permission denied so I looked at sys/scsi/scsi_ioctl.c: errval scsi_do_ioctl(dev_t dev, int cmd, caddr_t addr, int flags, struct proc *p, struct scsi_link *sc_link) { errval ret = 0; > /* If we can't write the device we can't permit much: > */ > > if (cmd != SCIOCIDENTIFY && !(flags & FWRITE)) > return EACCES; SC_DEBUG(sc_link,SDEV_DB2,("scsi_do_ioctl(0x%x)\n",cmd)); switch(cmd) { case SCIOCCOMMAND: { so I removed: > if (cmd != SCIOCIDENTIFY && !(flags & FWRITE)) > return EACCES; and rebuilt the kernel. It panics when xmcd starts. can anyone enlighten me about this? (i believe it was: 'biodone: buffer busy') -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 04:12:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA13270 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:12:49 -0700 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA13257 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:12:45 -0700 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id EAA03780; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:11:07 -0700 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199508211111.EAA03780@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: libresolve won't compile To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:11:07 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, root@pent.vnet.net In-Reply-To: <199508210945.TAA17187@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 21, 95 07:45:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 623 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > [Please report current problems only in the current mailing list.] > > >libresolve tries to include non-existant header file . > >I am using sources from ctm delta 916. > > This can be fixed by adding `-I${.CURDIR}/../libc/net -UDEBUG -DDEBUG=' > or something like that to libresolv/Makefile. > > I committed a different fix. Perhaps you should have defered and talked to Peter, who was the one working on all this stuff just 14 hours ago.... -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 04:31:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA14253 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:31:30 -0700 Received: from mail.netvision.net.il (mail.NetVision.net.il [194.90.1.6]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA14247 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:31:27 -0700 Received: from gena@NetVision.net.il (gena@burka.NetVision.net.il [194.90.6.15]) by mail.netvision.net.il (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id OAA23381; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:32:15 +0300 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:32:15 +0300 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 0.3-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <199508211051.EAA19189@clem.systemsix.com> Reply-To: gena@NetVision.net.il X-Face: #v>4HN>#D_"[olq9y`HqTYkLVB89Xy|3')Vs9v58JQ*u-xEJVKY`xa.}E?z0RkLI/P&;BJmi0#u=W0).-Y'J4(dw{"54NhSG|YYZG@[)(`e! >jN#L!~qI5fE-JHS+< Organization: NetVision Ltd. From: Gennady Sorokopud To: Steve Passe Subject: RE: xmcd port doesn't work Cc: Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello! Please try: ftp://burka.netvision.net.il/pub/misc/xmcd-1.4-fb2.0.5R.tar.gz . (I sent patches to the author long time ago, but they will appear only in xmcd-2.0) This xmcd version was updated for 2.0.5. If it does not work please let me know. Best regards. In message <199508211051.EAA19189@clem.systemsix.com> Steve Passe writes: >>Hello, > >I made the port of audio/xmcd on 950726-SNAP and found that it >got stuck in a loop of: > >SCIOCCOMMAND: permission denied > >so I looked at sys/scsi/scsi_ioctl.c: > >errval scsi_do_ioctl(dev_t dev, int cmd, caddr_t addr, int flags, >struct proc *p, struct scsi_link *sc_link) >{ > errval ret = 0; > >> /* If we can't write the device we can't permit much: >> */ >> >> if (cmd != SCIOCIDENTIFY && !(flags & FWRITE)) >> return EACCES; > > SC_DEBUG(sc_link,SDEV_DB2,("scsi_do_ioctl(0x%x)\n",cmd)); > switch(cmd) > { > case SCIOCCOMMAND: > { > >so I removed: > >> if (cmd != SCIOCIDENTIFY && !(flags & FWRITE)) >> return EACCES; > >and rebuilt the kernel. It panics when xmcd starts. can anyone enlighten >me about this? > >(i believe it was: 'biodone: buffer busy') > >-- >Steve Passe | powered by >smp@csn.net | FreeBSD -------- Gennady B. Sorokopud - System programmer at NetVision Israel. E-Mail: Gennady Sorokopud Homepage: http://www.netvision.net.il/~gena This message was sent at 08/21/95 12:28:15 by XF-Mail From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 04:51:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA14911 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:51:19 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA14905 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:51:15 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA08948 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for freebsd.org!hackers); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:34:19 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA08719; 21 Aug 95 06:30:31 CDT (Mon) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA08710 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:30:30 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:30:30 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508211130.GAA08710@bonkers.taronga.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers Path: peter From: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Subject: Re: known rogue? Organization: Taronga Park BBS Message-ID: References: <199508201752.LAA21651@rocky.sri.MT.net> <199508201904.VAA01379@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:30:26 GMT In article <199508201904.VAA01379@uriah.heep.sax.de>, J Wunsch wrote: >Perhaps we should start collecting the revision numbers and try making >the `known rogue' firmware-rev dependant? How about changing the message so it reads something like: activating special case code for Archive 150 there's a few messages like this that are kinda scary and don't need to be. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 04:51:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA14949 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:51:32 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA14941 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:51:27 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA08940 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:33:29 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA08305; 21 Aug 95 06:05:36 CDT (Mon) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA08302; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:05:35 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508211105.GAA08302@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? To: imp@village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:05:34 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508210315.VAA01937@rover.village.org> from "Warner Losh" at Aug 20, 95 09:15:21 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 439 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > m4 isn't bad, imho. Given what it has done with the sendmail.cf file > mess, I think it might be a fruitful path to follow. Please, no. It's taken the sendmail.cf file mess ane made it even *more* confusing. M4 is a useful tool, but the sendmail.cf configuration is a perfect example of extreme macro abuse. The second worst example I know of (the worst being Imake... at least with the sendmail files the language wasn't C-specific). From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 04:51:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA14985 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:51:58 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA14979 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:51:53 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA08962 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:37:21 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA09014; 21 Aug 95 06:36:24 CDT (Mon) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA09011; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:36:23 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:36:23 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508211136.GAA09011@bonkers.taronga.com> To: jkh@time.cdrom.com Subject: Re: Netscape and mime.types? Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <587.808994953@time.cdrom.com> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Jordan... >Netscape has the annoying property of not dealing with .au files >by default, but its default "Helper Applications and Proxies" page >simply refers to a file named: > /usr/local/lib/netscape/mime.types >A file with which it is not distributed. They assume you have a working metamail configuration already, and expect you to point the entry at the existing mime.types file. Metamail is really kind of soggy and hard to light. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 04:52:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA15029 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:52:44 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA15021 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:52:35 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA08942 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:33:40 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA08344; 21 Aug 95 06:12:26 CDT (Mon) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA08341; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:12:25 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508211112.GAA08341@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:12:25 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <8036.808982701@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 20, 95 10:25:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 815 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > If Ctk didn't represent such an inferior curses interface today, I'd > even use it for the install (hint to the Ctk dudes: Tk was the wrong > standard to track - it's waaaaay too X-centric! Ctk doesn't have the PC-character-graphics flash of the install tools, but you can't just take a tk script and expect it to look good on ctk. The idea isn't to be able to run Tk on a terminal, but to run ctk on X. > Please start over > with an approach that papers over the details of both rather than > trying to shove a size 6 foot into a size 12 shoe!). No, the last thing we need is yet another incompatible X extension to Tcl (there only what, four of them now?). What we need is to work on the bindings of ctk (which are obscure at best)... Remember, ctk is at release 0.9. Now is the time to send in your ideas. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 04:53:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA15085 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:53:26 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id EAA15079 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:53:20 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA08944 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:33:54 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA08554; 21 Aug 95 06:27:17 CDT (Mon) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA08551; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:27:16 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:27:16 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508211127.GAA08551@bonkers.taronga.com> To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199508210216.LAA22114@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> References: <199508201054.MAA00921@localhost> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Perl, OTOH, is slow and bloated, and its syntax is merely incomprehensible. I would not call Perl slow. It's quite a snappy little language. The problem here is that in Perl you would have to create a new extension language and parse it, or have the config file itself be a Perl script. That would have all the problems of the m4 solution, plus be an even more confusing environment for the user. OTOH, the config file is already a Tcl script. As are a good many config files out there (I just wrote a program that parses information out of an AMANDA config file by defining some procs and sourcing it, for example). Please, don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to blast Perl. I just want to avoid another double-layer-of-weeds mess like sendmail. Tcl is a great tool for getting rid of weeds. Anyone who thinks they REALLY understand the sendmail.cf mess and wants to help me with a sendmail problem, drop me a line. I've been putting it off for some time because the .mc builder files are just SO badly documented I'd have to grovel through the source to figure out exactly what's I need to do here... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 04:54:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA15242 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:54:58 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA15223 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:54:51 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id EAA07543; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:54:26 -0700 To: Peter da Silva cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape and mime.types? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:36:23 CDT." <199508211136.GAA09011@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 04:54:26 -0700 Message-ID: <7541.809006066@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > They assume you have a working metamail configuration already, and expect > you to point the entry at the existing mime.types file. > > Metamail is really kind of soggy and hard to light. Actually, it's the .mailcap file that finally pulled it off for me! mime.types didn't seem to buy me anything. Thanks to Kurt Olsen for the mailcap file - I've actually sent it to Satoshi for hopeful aggregation with the netscape port that just appeared. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 05:12:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA16246 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:12:11 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA16240 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:12:02 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id WAA23103; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:09:49 +1000 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:09:49 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508211209.WAA23103@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: dyson@freefall.FreeBSD.org, hasty@rah.star-gate.com, rcarter@geli.com Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, terry@cs.weber.edu Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Curious though, I deal with low-latency networking types for a >(partial) living, and I have had more than one mention the >syscall.s in Linux as the model for syscall overhead. Shouldn't >this show up somewhere in user land? Probably not. Not many applications really need to do lots of syscalls. Anyway, Linux currently seems to have about the same syscall overhead as FreeBSD. However, vfs has much more overhead. The "null syscall" benchmark in lmbench for some reason (;-) tests only the speed of a syscall that is fast under Linux. To show that FreeBSD is better, benchmark only gettimeofday(). The FreeBSD one is faster because we needed microtime() to be fast for accurate system timing to be acceptably efficient. The Pentium version is even faster. I measured the following a few minutes ago: Machine System Benchmark Sys Time Load Av --------- ----------------------- --------------- ----- - 486DX2/66 FreeBSD-2.2-current 1e6 getpid()s 5.78 0 " Linux-1.2.13 " 6.91 4 (*) 486DX/33 FreeBSD-2.2-current " 11.16 0 " FreeBSD-2.2-current-prof" 12.93 0 486DX2/66 FreeBSD-2.2-current 1e6 setuid()s 8.03 0 " Linux-1.2.13 " 7.45 6 486DX/33 FreeBSD-2.2-current " 17.69 0 " FreeBSD-2.2-current-prof" 19.58 0 486DX2/66 FreeBSD-2.2-current 1e6 gettimeofday()s 13.18 0 " Linux-1.2.13 " 24.90 2 486DX/33 FreeBSD-2.2-current " 22.10 0 " FreeBSD-2.2-current-prof" 26.40 0 486DX2/66 FreeBSD-2.2-current 1e6 write()s (+)21.20 0 " Linux-1.2.13 " 11.69 2 486DX/33 FreeBSD-2.2-current " 41.13 0 " FreeBSD-2.2-current-prof" 51.05 0 (*) The load average was measured before the test. It shouldn't affect the system time much provided the system time is accurate. The system time is very accurate for FreeBSD but not very accurate for Linux when there are a lot of context switches. (+) The writes were of 1 byte to /dev/null. Linux doesn't actually have syscall.s. In 1.2.8 it has `_lcall7' and `_system_call' in entry.S. These have more avoidable overheads than FreeBSD's corresponding `_Xsyscall' and `_Xlinux_syscall' in exception.s. However, FreeBSD loses by calling relatively inefficent C routines syscall() and linux_syscall() to dispatch the syscall, and it often loses by having to copyin() the syscall args (Linux passes them in registers). The copyin() overhead is enough to make FreeBSD's setuid() slightly slower than Linux's although FreeBSD's getpid() is slightly faster. Profiling shows FreeBSD-2.2-current overheads on a 486DX2/33 to be about: getpid(): _Xsyscall: 2 _syscall: 6 _getpid: 4 _doreti: 3 # end of _Xsyscall Total sys time: 15 usec Total usr time: 4 usec setuid(myid): _Xsyscall: 2 _syscall: 5 _copyin: 5 _setuid: 1 _crcopy: 3 _doreti: 3 Total sys time: 19 usec Total usr time: 5 usec gettimeofday(&tv, (struct timezone *)NULL): _Xsyscall: 2 _syscall: 5 _copyin: 5 _gettimeofday: 1 _microtime: 7 _copyout: 4 _doreti: 3 Total sys time: 27 usec Total usr time: 5 usec write(1, "", 1): _Xsyscall: 2 _syscall: 8 _copyin: 6 _write: 3 _vn_write: 2 _ufsspec_write: 1 _spec_write: 1 _mmrw: 5 # too many layers _ufs_lock: 8 (2 calls) # too slow and called too much _ufs_unlock: 6 (2 calls) # too slow and called too much _doreti: 3 Total sys time: 46 usec Total usr time: 6 usec Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 05:13:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA16304 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:13:56 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA16286 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:13:46 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA07642; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:13:12 -0700 To: Peter da Silva cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:12:25 CDT." <199508211112.GAA08341@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:13:12 -0700 Message-ID: <7640.809007192@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Ctk doesn't have the PC-character-graphics flash of the install tools, > but you can't just take a tk script and expect it to look good on ctk. > The idea isn't to be able to run Tk on a terminal, but to run ctk on X. Yes, I do understand that. The problem is, I don't *want* to run ctk on X! I don't want to run anything with such a convoluted API regardless of how many underlying imaging models it supports. It's just Too Evil(tm). > No, the last thing we need is yet another incompatible X extension to > Tcl (there only what, four of them now?). What we need is to work on > the bindings of ctk (which are obscure at best)... I don't think it's possible to save Ctk. I mean, I hate to sound so opinionated here but I have used toolkits that tried to take a very abstract view of the underlying imaging model, be they DOS graphics to Windows to the Macintosh, and many of them have been quite reasonable in the level of abstraction they provided. That's the key, you see. To provide abstraction above ALL the desired types of imaging models, not to pick one highly specific one and then warp all the others to fit it. What you wind up with then is something that reminds one more of a crippled stork beating one wing than anything else, and it's not much fun to program in. I'm sorry, but everything I've seen with Ctk so far has done little more than make me want to run in the other direction.. Perhaps they'll manage to hit the sweet spot between Tk and curses somehow, but I rather doubt it. Again, they took what was a fundamentally flawed approach, IMHO, and they won't overcome that very easily. I hate to propose Yet Another Standard for TCL, but it's not like Ousterhout ever started Tk with the intention of running it anywhere but under X. Maybe now that he's at Sun he'll focus on evolving something more cross-platform in scope and approach, but I suspect that if he does, it won't look a lot like Tk. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 05:37:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA17265 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:37:44 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA17257 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:37:36 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id WAA24004; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:28:34 +1000 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:28:34 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508211228.WAA24004@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Subject: Re: libresolve won't compile Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, root@pent.vnet.net Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> >libresolve tries to include non-existant header file . >> >I am using sources from ctm delta 916. >> ... >> I committed a different fix. >Perhaps you should have defered and talked to Peter, who was the one >working on all this stuff just 14 hours ago.... That would leave the tree unbuildable for longer and create more work for everyone. BTW, lkm/ip_mroute_mod is still unbuildable. This is handled by leaving ip_mroute_mod out of the subdir list, but unless you are careful then you will have an old binary. We don't handle removing junk very well. nsquery and nstest directories and binaries should have been removed yesterday, but `cvs co -P' failed to remove the directories, because there were obj subdirectories. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 05:45:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA17511 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:45:28 -0700 Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA17501 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:45:24 -0700 Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA07106; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:36:50 -0400 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199508211236.IAA07106@hda.com> Subject: Re: your mail To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:36:49 -0400 (EDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508211130.GAA08710@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Aug 21, 95 06:30:30 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 543 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > >Perhaps we should start collecting the revision numbers and try making > >the `known rogue' firmware-rev dependant? > > How about changing the message so it reads something like: > > activating special case code for Archive 150 > > there's a few messages like this that are kinda scary and don't need to be. > While at it move it to the verbose boot case. Peter -- Peter Dufault Real Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 05:51:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA17793 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:51:47 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA17786 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:51:43 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA23619; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:51:25 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id OAA21481 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:51:25 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA05459 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:40:00 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508211240.OAA05459@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:40:00 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: from "Doug Rabson" at Aug 21, 95 10:45:50 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 999 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Doug Rabson wrote: > > > As much as i hate to say it (those who have read my experience reports > > will do know why :), SGI's IRIX 5.3 does also support NFSv3. I have > > yet to put a FreeBSD-current box there and actually test it. > > Note that to get it to actually work, you need to install SGI's patch 547 > to IRIX 5.3. I have tested it to see if it works but I have no > performance figures. This Indy is not very fast anyway :-(. Nope, they are rather crappy PeeCees. Our is defunct now, since it prefered to panic four times in a row (within 10 minutes) while the ISDN plug has been in there -- and it was intented to be used as an ISDN router... :-/ Btw., we thought our kernel traces with the bogus ``calltrap()'' frame were weird? Wrong, their kernel core traces simply stop at ``VEC_trap()''. Very useful feature, indeed. :-I -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 05:52:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA17856 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:52:14 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA17846 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:52:08 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA23586; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:51:02 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id OAA21447 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:51:01 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA05314 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:28:08 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508211228.OAA05314@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:28:08 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508210841.KAA13733@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Aug 21, 95 10:41:27 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1755 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > Consider the following scenario (working with a hand scanner): > 1) on open, a buffer is allocated with sufficient room for reading N > scanlines (the size of a scanline depends on the resolution, and the > number of lines might be in the range 10..100) > 2) the device is closed while the DMA is active (which is essentially > all the times) *and* there will be no further data coming from the > scanner (this is likely: the user knows he wants to close the > device, thus he stops scanning and then gives the appropriate > commands); > 3) a new open is requested, possibly with different parameters, which > causes the need for a larger buffer; now I need to abort the > previous transfer, free the old memory, and malloc a newer block. Does the scanner not set TC (terminal count, hardware signal) at the completion of its transfer? It's the usual way how the transfer will be ended. The DMAC will issue an interrupt on receipt of this signal. > > now)? I would personally do everything in avoiding even touching such > > a hot iron like the DMAC. > > I'll see if I can get the data sheets for an 8237. It's not the 8237 data sheet. It's rather that weird (to say the least) circuitry that is built around it in an IBM PC. And the fact that it's rather easy to totally choke a computer with misconfigured DMA transfers. (Believe me, i've been playing alot with a DMAC in my CP/M era...) If you really want to dig into this, get the van Dilluwe, at the very least. You will find a detailed description of the DMAC and related hardware registers. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 06:05:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA18434 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:05:03 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA18424 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:05:00 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id XAA23788 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:10:42 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508211340.XAA23788@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:10:41 +0930 (CST) In-Reply-To: <199508211228.OAA05314@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 21, 95 02:28:08 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1617 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch stands accused of saying: > > 3) a new open is requested, possibly with different parameters, which > > causes the need for a larger buffer; now I need to abort the > > previous transfer, free the old memory, and malloc a newer block. > > Does the scanner not set TC (terminal count, hardware signal) at the > completion of its transfer? It's the usual way how the transfer will > be ended. The DMAC will issue an interrupt on receipt of this signal. If the scanner is using the old Omron mechanism, or a compatible, data is only sent to the interface, and thus the DMAC, as the user moves the scanner (clocked via an encoder driven off a roller). If the user stops moving the scanner before the intended number of lines have been read, there's no way for anything on that side to know. Either the driver can time out and cancel the transfer, or it can wait 'till a new one is requested. > If you really want to dig into this, get the van Dilluwe, at the very > least. You will find a detailed description of the DMAC and related > hardware registers. Personally, I'd try to run the card on interrupt (if it generates one) - my general opinion of the PC's DMA implementation is not flattering 8) > cheers, J"org -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 06:09:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA18687 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:09:58 -0700 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA18664 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:09:39 -0700 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA20667 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 17:07:26 +0400 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Mon, 21 Aug 95 17:07:24 +0400 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id QAA00454; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:58:37 +0400 To: jkh@time.cdrom.com, Peter da Silva Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, ports@freebsd.org References: <199508211136.GAA09011@bonkers.taronga.com> In-Reply-To: <199508211136.GAA09011@bonkers.taronga.com>; from Peter da Silva at Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:36:23 -0500 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:58:37 +0400 (MSD) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.40 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Netscape and mime.types? Lines: 25 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 916 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508211136.GAA09011@bonkers.taronga.com> Peter da Silva writes: >Jordan... >>Netscape has the annoying property of not dealing with .au files >>by default, but its default "Helper Applications and Proxies" page >>simply refers to a file named: >> /usr/local/lib/netscape/mime.types >>A file with which it is not distributed. >They assume you have a working metamail configuration already, and expect >you to point the entry at the existing mime.types file. >Metamail is really kind of soggy and hard to light. We already have metamail port. Maybe netscape port should EXEC_DEPEND on metamail port? -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 06:20:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA19299 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:20:23 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA19290 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:20:18 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA09446 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:58:59 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA11062; 21 Aug 95 07:38:17 CDT (Mon) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA11059; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:38:16 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508211238.HAA11059@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:38:15 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <7640.809007192@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 21, 95 05:13:12 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1607 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Yes, I do understand that. The problem is, I don't *want* to run ctk > on X! But I do. So do a lot of people. I have a friend who wrote his own front end for Tk and curses that's switching over to ctk because it frees him from having to maintain an extra component of his package. And if you write the code with ctk in mind you get a reasonable UI both ways. > I don't want to run anything with such a convoluted API > regardless of how many underlying imaging models it supports. It's > just Too Evil(tm). You obviously have experience with a lot more APIs than I, but I don't see the Tk API being that convoluted compared with others that people are apparently entirely happy to use. It's simpler than any other X-based API I've ever used, for example. And it's become a very popular one. It's got momentum, and it's about time we grabbed onto stuff with momentum while we have a chance. For simple displays (and you don't want to use anything but simple screens with a curses interface: you don't have enough bits) Tk is not that hairy. > I hate to propose Yet Another Standard for TCL, but it's not like > Ousterhout ever started Tk with the intention of running it anywhere > but under X. Maybe now that he's at Sun he'll focus on evolving > something more cross-platform in scope and approach, but I suspect > that if he does, it won't look a lot like Tk. SCO started out with the intent of providing something that was suited for both curses and X and, you know what, it ended up looking a lot like Tk. I suspect that ctk is going to be the best thing we're going to get for a long time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 06:48:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA20177 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:48:35 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA20171 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:48:34 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id GAA02478 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:47:41 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id GAA00899 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:49:25 -0700 Message-Id: <199508211349.GAA00899@corbin.Root.COM> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NFS_ASYNC (revisited for 2.2) From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:49:25 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Doug Rabson has pointed out that my NFS_ASYNC patch for 2.2 was inadequate and furthermore should only apply to NFSv2. Attached is a corrected patch. -DG Index: nfs_serv.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/nfs/nfs_serv.c,v retrieving revision 1.22 diff -c -r1.22 nfs_serv.c *** 1.22 1995/08/06 11:55:25 --- nfs_serv.c 1995/08/21 13:46:48 *************** *** 92,97 **** --- 92,103 ---- NFFIFO, NFNON }; int nfsrvw_procrastinate = NFS_GATHERDELAY * 1000; + #ifdef NFS_ASYNC + int nfs_async = 1; + #else + int nfs_async; + #endif + /* * nfs v3 access service */ *************** *** 731,736 **** --- 737,744 ---- nfsm_dissect(tl, u_long *, 4 * NFSX_UNSIGNED); off = (off_t)fxdr_unsigned(u_long, *++tl); tl += 2; + if (nfs_async) + stable = NFSV3WRITE_UNSTABLE; } retlen = len = fxdr_unsigned(long, *tl); cnt = i = 0; *************** *** 930,935 **** --- 938,945 ---- nfsm_dissect(tl, u_long *, 4 * NFSX_UNSIGNED); nfsd->nd_off = (off_t)fxdr_unsigned(u_long, *++tl); tl += 2; + if (nfs_async) + nfsd->nd_stable = NFSV3WRITE_UNSTABLE; } len = fxdr_unsigned(long, *tl); nfsd->nd_len = len; From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 06:49:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA20219 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:49:28 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA20211 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:49:25 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id GAA10938; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:49:11 -0700 To: Peter da Silva cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:38:15 CDT." <199508211238.HAA11059@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:49:11 -0700 Message-ID: <10935.809012951@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > You obviously have experience with a lot more APIs than I, but I don't > see the Tk API being that convoluted compared with others that people > are apparently entirely happy to use. It's simpler than any other X-based > API I've ever used, for example. I think you misunderstood me. I have no particular bone to pick with Tk per-se (though it could no doubt be improved and John himself has said that if he could do it over, he would do many things differently), what I have a problem with is the "Tk philosophy" extended to cover other imaging models! It just wasn't designed with that in mind! Sure, write X apps in Tk to your heart's content - you'll have plenty of good company and freely available add-on frobs to use. But the minute you're forced to support multiple models with one API, then that's the moment it's time to go up a level to something that sits on top of Tk and curses alike. Tell ya what. Let's wait and see. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 07:09:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA20981 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:09:32 -0700 Received: from haywire.DIALix.COM (haywire.DIALix.COM [192.203.228.65]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA20970 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:09:27 -0700 Received: (from news@localhost) by haywire.DIALix.COM (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11/DIALix) id WAA01357 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:09:17 +0800 (WST) Received: from GATEWAY by haywire.DIALix.COM with netnews for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (problems to: usenet@haywire.dialix.com) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 21 Aug 1995 22:09:12 +0800 From: peter@haywire.dialix.com (Peter Wemm) Message-ID: <41a428$1aa$1@haywire.DIALix.COM> Organization: DIALix Services, Perth, Australia. References: <9508201948.AA23045@cs.weber.edu>, <199508210345.WAA29762@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) writes: >In article <9508201948.AA23045@cs.weber.edu>, >Terry Lambert wrote: >>Unless you are running everything on the same box, it's impossible to >>provide inter-machine consistency guarantees. That's why NFS is the >>way it is. >Oh, crap. You handle machine failures the same way you handle disk failures. >If you can't handle disk failures you shouldn't have a stateful *local* file >system. For conventional file I/O you can get pretty much the same recovery >semantics both ways (client reloads state), and for non-file I/O you get the >choice of no access at all or error returns. I'll take the error returns. >I've used stateless and stateful remote file systems, and I'll take stateful >any day. I'd much rather type: > tar tvfB //xds13/dev/rmt0 >Than: > rsh xds13 dd if=/dev/rmt0 | tar tvfb - >And it's awful nice to be able to set up a getty on //modem1/dev/ttyc4. And >being able to get open-count semantics on temp files. And accessing named >pipes over the net. And "fsck //hurtsystem/dev/rw0a". And so on... >I really miss OpenNET. AT&T's RFS did this too.. It's a pity the implementation was so grossly unportable, inherently slow, and the crash recovery was practically useless. Just as a quick summary of the way RFS worked for those who've not had the ...umm... ``experience'' of dealing with it: - The system calls for files on remote machines were intercepted, packaged up and sent to the remote system for execution.. - The data was copied back and forward from the client's user space and the server with remote copyin/copyout. - It *guaranteed* proper unix semantics on the remote fs... none of the kludgey stuff that NFS has to do.. - It was slow.. There was a lot of latency because of the numerous transfers across the network. - It was reliable... it used a connection orientated link, like tcp. The problem with the implementation was that the recovery from a dropped link really sucked.. This was not an inherent flaw of the design however, just bad implementation choices. - You had access to remote devices.. - It was totally un-supportive of non-hetrogenous environments. Since ioctl()'s were interpreted and executed on the remote system, you had to have both systems using the same ioctl numbers..... - Because of the remote access, you could do really cool things like "ps -r remotesystem" or "chroot /remotesystem truss -p processid" - since /proc, /dev/kmem and /unix could be exported. An RFS type design is far more suitable for a cluster of closely coupled systems than NFS is. Like Peter says: "getty vt100 /modemserver/dev/term/A46" and "tar tvf /tapeserver/dev/tape" We have old SVR4 machines here that have RFSv2.. These examples are real.. (we dont use them as we dont have any need, but I used to keep the config handy for showing people.. Alas, I disabled the RFS code last time I rebuilt the kernels) This might be fun to implement one day for a FreeBSD "cluster"... Providing it's done right, of course, and isn't "marketed" as a generic network filesystem like AT&T's droids tried. -Peter From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 07:24:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA22040 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:24:10 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA22034 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:24:06 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id HAA11066; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:23:50 -0700 To: peter@haywire.dialix.com (Peter Wemm) cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "21 Aug 1995 22:09:12 +0800." <41a428$1aa$1@haywire.DIALix.COM> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:23:50 -0700 Message-ID: <11064.809015030@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > - The data was copied back and forward from the client's user space > and the server with remote copyin/copyout. > - It *guaranteed* proper unix semantics on the remote fs... none of > the kludgey stuff that NFS has to do.. There are better ways of doing this, BTW.. A company I used to work for (Periphere Computer Systeme, GmbH) had something they called MUNIX/NET which did all of the above and at very reasonable speeds. Even then, many people praised MUNIX/NET as a superior solution to the whole file sharing problem, even if it did require kernel modification on both the server and client ends. It basically used the "superroot" model for addressing other machines (/../machine/file) and you could talk to everything from files to tape drives remotely - something you can't do with NFS. Since you could also traverse mount points successfully on the local machine, you got around that particular foible of NFS as well. OK, so it wasn't stateless, but I don't seem to recall any big problems caused by this when I used it. There was also a pretty powerful uid mapping system for telling it which uids you wanted mapped straight across, which you wanted translated, etc. It's actually one of those systems who's merits I didn't really appreciate at the time but did in retrospect.. :-( > This might be fun to implement one day for a FreeBSD "cluster"... > Providing it's done right, of course, and isn't "marketed" as a > generic network filesystem like AT&T's droids tried. Some PCSers here talked about resurrecting MUNIX/NET and bringing it back to life on FreeBSD, but I don't think that the legal powers were ever willing to open the doors enough to allow it, so I suspect that MUNIX/NET will die along with BETAMAX and OpenLook. Good solutions shot dead by mediocre solutions with bigger guns.. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 07:51:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA23381 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:51:36 -0700 Received: from plains.nodak.edu (plains.NoDak.edu [134.129.111.64]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA23375 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:51:34 -0700 Received: (from tinguely@localhost) by plains.nodak.edu (8.6.11/8.6.10) id JAA19802; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:51:25 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:51:25 -0500 From: Mark Tinguely Message-Id: <199508211451.JAA19802@plains.nodak.edu> To: hackers@freebsd.org, multimedia@rah.star-gate.com Subject: Matrox Meteor Capture Card Driver Announcement Content-Length: 2070 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk ************* Announcing the Matrox Meteor Video Capture Driver. ************* The Meteor is a reasonably priced capture card for PCI (*see warning below) bus computers. The Meteor is sold directly from Matrox** at: Canada and USA 514-685-2630 or 1-800-361-4903 (voice) 514-685-2853 (fax) UK 0793.614.002 (voice) 0793.614.336 (fax) Asia Pacific 852.877.5387 (voice) 852.556.9104 (fax) France (1) 45 60 62 00 (voice) (1) 45 60 62 05 (fax) ** this information is provided for your general information. we in no way represent the interest of Matrox. The Meteor driver delivers video frames in YUV packed, YUV planer, 16 bit RGB, and 24 bit RGB format. The Meteor driver provides a traditional read(2) interface as well as memory mapped access to data for single frame capture, continuous capture, and synchronous ring buffer capture modes. Using the DB9 interface, the Meteor driver can choose to capture a single video signal from up to four video sources. The Meteor driver also comes with a document of ioctl, a directory of programming examples that create PPM files for each output format, and source code and patches to run the nv conferencing program. The Meteor driver kit can be found at: ftp://joy.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu/pub/matrox.tgz ftp://ftp.cs.uwm.edu/pub/FreeBSD/meteor.1.0.tgz It is also included in FreeBSD 2.2-current. Authors: Jim Lowe (james@miller.cs.uwm.edu) Mark Tinguely (tinguely@plains.NoDak.edu) * Warning: the Meteor does not work with all PCI chipsets. A MERCURY chipset motherboard is almost certain to NOT work with the Meteor. A NEPTUNE chipset motherboard with a PCI video card may hang with heavy Meteor use. So it is wise to use a "SATURN" or "TRITON" chipset motherboard and also limit the number of PCI bus-mastering devices on that bus. We had difficulties getting the Meteor capture card to work with systems that also use the NCR PCI SCSI boards. It is also wise to have 16 or more Megabytes of RAM in the computer. 1.0 Aug 21, 1995: Initial Release From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 07:58:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA23715 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:58:48 -0700 Received: from haywire.DIALix.COM (haywire.DIALix.COM [192.203.228.65]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA23699 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:58:40 -0700 Received: (from news@localhost) by haywire.DIALix.COM (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11/DIALix) id WAA03437 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:58:34 +0800 (WST) Received: from GATEWAY by haywire.DIALix.COM with netnews for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (problems to: usenet@haywire.dialix.com) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 21 Aug 1995 22:58:29 +0800 From: peter@haywire.dialix.com (Peter Wemm) Message-ID: <41a6ul$3b9$1@haywire.DIALix.COM> Organization: DIALix Services, Perth, Australia. References: <199508210434.AAA03316@healer.com>, <199508210817.BAA03501@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com (Rodney W. Grimes) writes: >> Hi. Some people appear to like IPFW and some appear to like SCREEND. >> >> I've just spent time rewriting chunks of screend to run on FreeBSD. >> Who out there wrote (or is in charge of) IPFW, would like to collaborate >> to put the best of both into freebsd? Saves two overlapping programs, >> and saves me having to re-port the screend kernel patches for each new release. >> >Send me the screend kernel patches, (should be really small if I recall >correctly, just 1 patch in ip_forward). That can become a standard part >of FreeBSD. >Becareful with that user land code in screend, it has some very strict >license issues with it. I just *know* I'm going to regret mentioning this, but I have a cute little filter that runs in the kernel on a per-interface basis. It's got a user-land "compiler" that takes a bizare script language, and generates a chunk of microcode-like data which is passed into the kernel. It was inspired by a thing called "ipacl" that somebody wrote for a streams-tcp kernel... I've done something similar but not quite the same (and I "lifted" parts of the compiler, which is just a lex/yacc parser). It has IP and port filtering.. Since it's on a per-interface level, it could be programmed to drop packets coming in that have your source address, in an attempt to get around your security (recent CERT advisory). The bad news, is that I've not ported my version back from a streams implementation, but it shouldn't be hard. It was meant to do other things too, like IP accounting, but that was never quite finished. I suspect this is similar to the capabilities of bpf, but I've never really looked at bpf to see what it can do - but I suspect BPF would do a better job if it could be wired up as a filter on an interface. -Peter (Please dont ask me for copies, I'm not happy to give it away in it's present state, and I'd also need to clear it with my employer.. :-( You can grab ipacl.{tar|shar}.{Z,gz} from the the same ftp site as tcp_wrapper.. ftp.win.tue.nl:/pub/security I think...) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 08:29:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA25395 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:29:42 -0700 Received: from mail1.access.digex.net (mail1.access.digex.net [205.197.247.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA25388 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:29:40 -0700 Received: from ugen (ugen-tr.worldbank.org [138.220.101.58]) by mail1.access.digex.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA23164; for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:29:37 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 11:26:28 PDT From: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Peter Wemm X-Mailer: Chameleon - TCP/IP for Windows by NetManage, Inc. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >>> I've just spent time rewriting chunks of screend to run on FreeBSD. >>> Who out there wrote (or is in charge of) IPFW, would like to collaborate >>> to put the best of both into freebsd? Saves two overlapping programs, >>> and saves me having to re-port the screend kernel patches for each new release. Hi! I am really out of discussion so i didn't noticed who sayd theese words (and i can't get it from the mail body because it's indented twice so i can't figure out who's that). So whoever wrote this could you please email me back on this adress? (The one listed in FreeBSD does not exists anymore). I am trying to get back to the work so i really want to contact... --Ugen From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 08:32:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA25607 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:32:17 -0700 Received: from clark.net (clark.net [168.143.0.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA25601 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:32:15 -0700 Received: (rjw@localhost) by clark.net (8.6.12/8.6.5) id LAA13539; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:31:52 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:31:50 -0400 (EDT) From: Rick Weldon To: Mark Tinguely cc: hackers@freebsd.org, multimedia@rah.star-gate.com Subject: Re: Matrox Meteor Capture Card Driver Announcement In-Reply-To: <199508211451.JAA19802@plains.nodak.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Aug 1995, Mark Tinguely wrote: > ************* > Announcing the Matrox Meteor Video Capture Driver. > ************* > > The Meteor is a reasonably priced capture card for PCI (*see warning below) > bus computers. The Meteor is sold directly from Matrox** at: > > Canada and USA > 514-685-2630 or 1-800-361-4903 (voice) > 514-685-2853 (fax) I just got off of the phone with them. They don't sell direct to the consumer. At least not in the US. If you call them they will tell you where to find the card in your area though. The MSRP for the card is $495 Another thing is that chances are you are going to be dealing with a reseller, and they may or may not take a Visa etc... The reseller I talked to only wants a certified check. Anyone know of anything easier. Of course he also want full MSRP of 495. Yuck! According to him Matrox doesn't do volume sales on this card and they avoid end-user call's like the black plague. Although they were quick to point me at a local reseller. If they get a flood of calls it will be interesting. What is a recommended capture camera for this card? They recommended a camera with SVHS output. Anyone have a recommendation? > * Warning: the Meteor does not work with all PCI chipsets. A MERCURY chipset > wise to use a "SATURN" or "TRITON" chipset motherboard and also limit the > number of PCI bus-mastering devices on that bus. We had difficulties getting > the Meteor capture card to work with systems that also use the NCR PCI SCSI > boards. It is also wise to have 16 or more Megabytes of RAM in the computer. Will this card work with the Supermicro motherboard (P90)? I don't currently have any bus mastering cards in the PCI slots. Rick Weldon From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 08:33:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA25735 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:33:55 -0700 Received: from fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov [137.75.131.171]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA25727 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:33:51 -0700 Received: by fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA19337; Mon, 21 Aug 95 15:33:49 GMT Received: by emu.fsl.noaa.gov (1.38.193.4/SMI-4.1 (1.38.193.4)) id AA08951; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:33:47 -0600 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:33:47 -0600 From: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) Message-Id: <9508211533.AA08951@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> To: rcarter@geli.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508210321.UAA17944@geli.clusternet> (rcarter@geli.com) Subject: Re: CICA cry for help Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Russell" == Russell L Carter writes: Russell> Somebody with the knowledge of what to try ought to send Russell> the *single* boot floppy to CICA Russell> (emo@cica.cica.indiana.edu) and see if they can't get Russell> FreeBSD to do the job. Huh? Russell> I bet email is just fine. Russell> This is called a market opportunity. How about some context? -- Sean Kelly NOAA Forecast Systems Lab, Boulder Colorado USA I wish scientists would come up with a way to make dogs a lot bigger, but with a smaller head. That way, they'd still be good as watchdogs, but they wouldn't eat as much. -- Jack Handey From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 08:57:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA26838 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:57:00 -0700 Received: from plains.nodak.edu (plains.NoDak.edu [134.129.111.64]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA26832 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:56:58 -0700 Received: (from tinguely@localhost) by plains.nodak.edu (8.6.11/8.6.10) id KAA29705; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:56:53 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:56:53 -0500 From: Mark Tinguely Message-Id: <199508211556.KAA29705@plains.nodak.edu> To: rjw@clark.net Subject: Re: Matrox Meteor Capture Card Driver Announcement Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, multimedia@rah.star-gate.com Content-Length: 824 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I just got off of the phone with them. They don't sell direct to the > consumer. At least not in the US. If you call them they will > tell you where to find the card in your area though. The MSRP for the > card is $495 strange, they sold me one in July. maybe they are terrible at geography and thought North Dakota was a providence in Canada :) no, only Americans are that bad at geography. talk to Chantel Tessier at extension 2446. > What is a recommended capture camera for this card? They recommended a > camera with SVHS output. Anyone have a recommendation? most video recording camera have composite outputs. > Will this card work with the Supermicro motherboard (P90)? I don't > currently have any bus mastering cards in the PCI slots. I don't know. I would guess that would be okay. --mark. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 08:58:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA27006 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:58:52 -0700 Received: from pht.com (exodus.pht.com [198.60.59.99]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA26980 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 08:58:49 -0700 Received: by pht.com id AA08919 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freefall.cdrom.com); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:58:09 -0600 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:58:05 -0600 (MDT) From: Brad Midgley To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: gloating about no root disk? Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, Still gloating about not needing a root disk? The latest red hat linux requires TWO root disks! from their beta readme: "You need two root disks now due to the ELF binaries and to perl5's increased size." hmm. For those wondering about our big machine here which was crashing a lot... I decided to make sure terminator power was only applied at the ends of the chain and found that not only was every drive applying terminator power, one drive was jumpered to an undefined term power setting. argh. The machine's now been up 2 days without a hitch. oh, and I couldn't resist. please don't kill my message. ------------------------------ From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Date: Mon 21 Aug 1995 10:40:17 -0700 Subject: I give up! (was why linux) Ok, I'm convinced... linux is better. I bought a plane ticket and I'm headed to helsinki today. Bye everybody and good luck. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 09:13:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA27543 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:13:27 -0700 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA27537 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:13:23 -0700 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA23746; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:12:38 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199508211612.JAA23746@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: How do I save panic messages?! To: henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu (Charles Henrich) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:12:38 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201502.LAA01118@crh.cl.msu.edu> from "Charles Henrich" at Aug 20, 95 11:02:04 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1062 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk The best way is to switch back to an non-X console (CTL-ALT-F1) before testing your change! then you should be able to see what comes up when you do your test.. if it doesn't crash, use ALT-F4 to switch back to X and keep working.. in adition, you can save a corefile of the crash if you've config'd the kernel correctly and dump out the command buffer in it when you've rebooted.. not to mention running gdb on the saved corefile to get a stack-trace and other nice goodies.. (see man savecore, man gdb etc.) julian > > This is getting tedious, Im attempting to work on significant port of kernel > level code, but if Im not sitting on virtual console 0, whenever the system > panics, Im screwed. I cant switch out of X, or kill the screen blanker, or > switch to the virtual console to see what the hell went wrong, nor is any > information logged anywhere :(. Any help is most gratefully appreciated. > > -Crh > > Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu > > http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 09:16:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA27797 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:16:18 -0700 Received: from epsilon.qmw.ac.uk (epsilon.qmw.ac.uk [138.37.6.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA27790 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:16:13 -0700 Received: from canary.dcs.qmw.ac.uk by epsilon.qmw.ac.uk with SMTP-DNS (PP) id <29713-0@epsilon.qmw.ac.uk>; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 17:14:57 +0100 Received: from ruby.dcs.qmw.ac.uk [192.135.231.243] by canary.dcs.qmw.ac.uk (8.6.12/QMW-server-2.4s) with SMTP; poster "Mark Dawson "; id RAA23258; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 17:11:45 +0100 Received: locally by ruby (4.1/QMW-client-3.2b); for "md@dcs.qmw.ac.uk"; poster "md"; id AA05189; Mon, 21 Aug 95 16:17:44 BST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.ruby.cs.qmw.ac.uk.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.ruby.cs.qmw.ac.uk.sun4_41; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:17:43 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:17:43 +0100 (BST) From: Mark Dawson To: Brian Tao Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: References: Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Excerpts from freebsd: Brian Tao@gate.sinica.ed (691*) > Has someone made some sort of hardware add-on to > PC's like a miniature PrestoServe (say, with a max of 64 megs of > cache) with drivers for FreeBSD so it can flush data out to disk after > a reboot? That would be nifty. Take a look at Compaq's Smart SCSI controller (part #142055-001). It has a couple of megs of battery-backed memory, two fast scsi-2 controllers and does various levels of RAID on upto 14 hot-pluggable disks - it screams along at RAID 0 and the nv-ram gives reliable async performance. Switching to RAID 5 makes it really bullet-proof. I have written a FreeBSD driver for this EISA card which is running very happily on a Compaq Proliant 2000 (and hopefully soon a Proliant 1500). Let me know if you're interested! BTW is anyone running FreeBSD on a Proliant 1500 (triflex-pci motherboard)? Mark From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 09:17:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA27911 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:17:43 -0700 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA27905 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:17:38 -0700 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA23757; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:15:39 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199508211615.JAA23757@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:15:39 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508201701.TAA12803@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Aug 20, 95 07:01:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1243 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > How (within a device driver) do I abort a DMA transfer which has > been started but has not completed yet ? I am having this problem > in the driver for a hand-scanner (the scanner does some read ahead; > meanwhile, a user might close the device and we want to abort the > transfer and free the buffer). I am surprised I haven't seen (or > understood!) anything like this in existing drivers, not even in > the floppy driver! most drivers assume that if a DMA starts it will complete.. in fact I know of no mechanism to stop a DMA from completing even if the devices and memory doesn't respond, the DMA will complete, because of the marvelous PC way that DMA is implimented, if something fails to respond with a WAIT-STATE, it's assumed to have completed. So a frozen device is the QUICKEST to respond :( > > Thanks > Luigi > ==================================================================== > Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione > email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa > tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) > fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ > ==================================================================== > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 09:20:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA28126 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:20:39 -0700 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA28120 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:20:37 -0700 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA23776; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:18:21 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199508211618.JAA23776@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:18:20 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508210841.KAA13733@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Aug 21, 95 10:41:27 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1026 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > 2) the device is closed while the DMA is active (which is essentially > all the times) *and* there will be no further data coming from the > scanner (this is likely: the user knows he wants to close the > device, thus he stops scanning and then gives the appropriate > commands); don't allow the close to complete until the DMA has completed.. > 3) a new open is requested, possibly with different parameters, which > causes the need for a larger buffer; now I need to abort the previous transfer, free the old memory, and malloc a newer block. > > > now)? I would personally do everything in avoiding even touching such > > a hot iron like the DMAC. > +----------------------------------+ ______ _ __ | __--_|\ Julian Elischer | \ U \/ / On assignment | / \ julian@ref.tfs.com +------>x USA \ in a very strange | ( OZ ) 300 lakeside Dr. oakland CA. \___ ___ | country ! +- X_.---._/ USA+(510) 645-3137(wk) \_/ \\ v From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 09:40:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA28896 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:40:34 -0700 Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA28890 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:40:30 -0700 Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA03194; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:39:48 -0400 From: Charles Henrich Message-Id: <199508211639.MAA03194@crh.cl.msu.edu> Subject: Re: How do I save panic messages?! To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:39:48 -0400 (EDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508211612.JAA23746@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Aug 21, 95 09:12:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 421 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > The best way is to switch back to an non-X console (CTL-ALT-F1) > before testing your change! Its not my change thats the problem, it runs just spiffy for days and days, then my machine freezes up. Panics, especially those caused by panic() should at least show up in a log file! -Crh Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 09:41:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA28978 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:41:40 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA28972 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:41:38 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA13980; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:41:23 -0700 To: Brad Midgley cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: gloating about no root disk? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:58:05 MDT." Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:41:23 -0700 Message-ID: <13978.809023283@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > oh, and I couldn't resist. please don't kill my message. > > ------------------------------ > > From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" > Date: Mon 21 Aug 1995 10:40:17 -0700 > Subject: I give up! (was why linux) > > Ok, I'm convinced... linux is better. I bought a plane ticket and I'm > headed to helsinki today. Bye everybody and good luck. > > Jordan Geeze, now folks are putting words in my mouth! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 09:42:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA29060 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:42:33 -0700 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA28887 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:40:26 -0700 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id SAA26711 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:40:06 +0200 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id SAA13953 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:40:06 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.7.Beta.11/keltia-uucp-2.4) id SAA18006; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:14:40 +0200 (MET DST) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199508211614.SAA18006@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:14:40 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Reply-To: roberto@Keltia.Freenix.FR (Ollivier Robert) In-Reply-To: <9508181739.AA16372@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 18, 95 11:39:24 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1000 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME7a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Terry Lambert said: > > This is very close to what is needed for a "test drive" version of BSD!!! I'm sure you're aware Linux has this scheme for at least a year, called UMSDOS, made by a French guy... -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.2-CURRENT #15: Sun Aug 13 17:24:47 MET DST 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 09:47:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA29407 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:47:52 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA29398 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:47:47 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id CAA01423; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 02:45:34 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 02:45:34 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508211645.CAA01423@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.org, hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Clock interrupts during probes? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >What are the issues involved in allowing clock interrupts during >probes? The PCI code already does this so I would think it possible >to do it for the others. Actually, the PCI code only allows previously enabled interrupts. Interrupts for previously configured devices are usually enabled at this point, but clock interrupts aren't enabled until quite late in init_main.c (by initclocks()). The PCI code and the EISA code shouldn't be allowing interrupts. Some of the ISA code called by the PCI and EISA code was written under the assumption that interrupts are disabled. E.g., INTREN(). It's not obvious that INTREN() is safe to call at splhigh() like the ISA code does. Perhaps it isn't safe :-[. I don't see many reasons why clock interrupts need to be enabled so late. Perhaps the only reason is that curproc is bogusly initialized to &proc0 before proc0 is initialized. curproc is statically initialized and is reinitalized to the same thing near the start of init_main(). This would cause hardclock() to follow a null pointer if it was called early: if (p) { ... pstats = p->p_stats; ... if (timerrisset(&pstats->p_timer[ITIMER_PROF].it_value) ... } It would be more natural to leave curproc initialized to NULL until quite late, but init_main() says /* * Initialize the current process pointer (curproc) before * any possible traps/probes to simplify trap processing. */ I think the idea is that traps should only occur in process context so trap handlers need not check for (curproc == NULL). However, at least the i386 pagefault handler checks curproc, and all trap handlers should probably check it, if only to panic as early as possible for traps from buggy interrupt handlers. Perhaps all traps that occur before proc0 is initialized should be fatal. >It would certainly make the job of having >the SCSI code perform the proper delays between retries easier. It >would also be the first step in getting rid of the ugly DELAY()'s in >driver code. Not much easier - there would be no process context to sleep on. I think we need something using coroutines to probe and attach all (or large batches of) devices concurrently at boot time. Make the coroutine switch mechanism look like tsleep() and have the same semantics as tsleep() so that the same probe and attach code works correctly after the system is up. DELAY(n) would become csleep(&foo, PRIBIO, "foodelay", (n * hz) / 1000000). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 09:55:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA29752 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:55:51 -0700 Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA29744 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:55:48 -0700 Message-Id: <199508211655.JAA29744@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Bruce Evans cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Clock interrupts during probes? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 95 02:45:34 +1000." <199508211645.CAA01423@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 09:55:48 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>It would certainly make the job of having >>the SCSI code perform the proper delays between retries easier. It >>would also be the first step in getting rid of the ugly DELAY()'s in >>driver code. > >Not much easier - there would be no process context to sleep on. I >think we need something using coroutines to probe and attach all (or >large batches of) devices concurrently at boot time. Make the >coroutine switch mechanism look like tsleep() and have the same >semantics as tsleep() so that the same probe and attach code works >correctly after the system is up. DELAY(n) would become >csleep(&foo, PRIBIO, "foodelay", (n * hz) / 1000000). > >Bruce I need access to timeout(), not tsleep() for the work in the upperlevel SCSI code, so I don't need a process context. Most of the DELAY() calls in the aic7xxx driver stem from that fact that I can't use timeouts during boot and must poll in order to do a timeout. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 10:19:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA00910 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:19:56 -0700 Received: from cs.pdx.edu (cs.pdx.edu [131.252.20.183]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA00904 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:19:55 -0700 Received: from localhost (jrb@localhost.cs.pdx.edu [127.0.0.1]) by cs.pdx.edu (8.6.10/CATastrophe-12/23/94-P) with ESMTP id KAA12938; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:19:10 -0700 for Message-Id: <199508211719.KAA12938@cs.pdx.edu> To: Peter da Silva cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org, jrb@cs.pdx.edu Subject: Re: Netscape and mime.types? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 06:36:23 CDT." <199508211136.GAA09011@bonkers.taronga.com> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:19:08 -0700 From: James Binkley Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Your message <199508211136.GAA09011@bonkers.taronga.com>: >Jordan... >>Netscape has the annoying property of not dealing with .au files >>by default, but its default "Helper Applications and Proxies" page >>simply refers to a file named: > >> /usr/local/lib/netscape/mime.types > >>A file with which it is not distributed. > >They assume you have a working metamail configuration already, and expect >you to point the entry at the existing mime.types file. > >Metamail is really kind of soggy and hard to light. For what it's worth, strings on my freebsd netscape shows up the following: /usr/local/lib/netscape/mime.types /usr/local/lib/netscape/mailcap %.900s/.mime.types %.900s/.mailcap Presumably the latter two indicate that it is checking the ~user/.netscape files too; i.e., user level override on system level settings. regards, Jim Binkley jrb@cs.pdx.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 10:22:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA01155 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:22:33 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA01113 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:22:24 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA03645; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:22:18 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA23873 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:22:18 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA06361 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:10:28 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508211710.TAA06361@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:10:28 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508211340.XAA23788@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Aug 21, 95 11:10:41 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1076 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Michael Smith wrote: > > If the scanner is using the old Omron mechanism, or a compatible, data is > only sent to the interface, and thus the DMAC, as the user moves the scanner > (clocked via an encoder driven off a roller). If the user stops moving the > scanner before the intended number of lines have been read, there's > no way for anything on that side to know. Either the driver can time out > and cancel the transfer, or it can wait 'till a new one is requested. Not an ideal basis for using DMA transfers. > Personally, I'd try to run the card on interrupt (if it generates one) - > my general opinion of the PC's DMA implementation is not flattering 8) It's an ugly crock, and the only reason the floppy driver is stuck with using it is that the hardware design essentially requires to transfer the floppy data via DMA. (PIO is unacceptable, and per-byte interrupts are neither supported nor extremely useful.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 10:27:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA01481 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:27:02 -0700 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA01469 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:26:58 -0700 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id TAA27118 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:26:52 +0200 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id TAA14118 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:26:52 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.7.Beta.11/keltia-uucp-2.4) id TAA18171; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:07:09 +0200 (MET DST) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199508211707.TAA18171@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: Re: state of the union speach To: jdl@chromatic.com Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:07:09 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: gurney_j@efn.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: roberto@Keltia.Freenix.FR (Ollivier Robert) In-Reply-To: <199508192024.PAA12157@chrome.onramp.net> from "Jon Loeliger" at Aug 19, 95 03:24:18 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1000 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME7a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Jon Loeliger said: > Do we post FreeBSD FAQ's to news.answers? Thee FAQ itself doesn't > mention its distribution policy. If not, we might want to. If we do, > we need to ping Tom Fine and have him add it. (I can do this ...) The FAQ is not yet posted on Usenet. I've started looking into it, subscribed to faq-maintainers@mit.EDU, got the proper FAQ off news.answers then the faq-m* list went down for a while. I'll see to it at the beginning of september (I'm going to holidays from 25th to Sep, 2nd in Denmark). -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.2-CURRENT #15: Sun Aug 13 17:24:47 MET DST 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 10:28:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA01620 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:28:51 -0700 Received: from lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (lupine.nsi.nasa.gov [198.116.2.100]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA01606 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:28:47 -0700 Received: (from mnewell@localhost) by lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA10460; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:26:29 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:26:29 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael C. Newell" To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Multicast on PPP devices Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk The ppp devices on 2.0.5 have the multicast bit set. When I run mrouted it dies with the errors: Aug 21 13:14:40 sisyphus mrouted[8195]: warning - can't join group 224.0.0.4 on interface 198.116.75.49: Can't assign requested address Aug 21 13:14:40 sisyphus mrouted[8195]: warning - can't join group 224.0.0.4 on interface 198.116.75.49: Can't assign requested address Aug 21 13:14:40 sisyphus mrouted[8195]: setsockopt IP_MULTICAST_IF 198.116.75.49: Can't assign requested address Aug 21 13:14:40 sisyphus mrouted[8195]: setsockopt IP_MULTICAST_IF 198.116.75.49: Can't assign requested address In this case Sisyphus is our mbone router/ppp server (it's a FreeBSD 2.0.5-Stable system) and 198.116.75.49 is the address of the ppp0 link (see "http://www.eco.nsi.nasa.gov/~mnewell/mc_net.gif" for a diagram of our network.) This is a tad bit of a problem. Of course it would be nice to be able to run the ppp interfaces in native multicast mode to avoid tunnelling overhead. However the situation is worse, since in order to bring up mrouted I have to disable the ppp device via phyint 198.116.75.49 disable in the mrouted.conf file (otherwise I get the above errors.) This is a problem because if you try to start mrouted when ppp0 is down (like when Sisyphus is being rebooted) it gives an error on the phyint statement. Of course, what you'd LIKE to have happen [well, at least what I'D like to have happen] is for mrouted to simply ignore the interface if it can't use it. I guess the real question is: Has anyone successfully got native multicast routing via mrouted running over the ppp link? If so, how did you do it? Thanks, Mike +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ |Mike Newell | The opinions expressed herein are | |NASA Science Internet Network Systems | my own, and do not necessarily | |Sterling Software, Inc. | reflect those of the NSI program, | |MNewell@nsipo.nasa.gov | Sterling Software, NASA, or anyone | |+1-202-434-8954 | else. | +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ | work: http://www.eco.nsi.nasa.gov/~mnewell | | home: http://www.newell.arlington.va.us | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 10:32:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA01860 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:32:13 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA01836 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:32:05 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id DAA02704; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:30:41 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:30:41 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508211730.DAA02704@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Clock interrupts during probes? Cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I need access to timeout(), not tsleep() for the work in the upperlevel >SCSI code, so I don't need a process context. Most of the DELAY() calls >in the aic7xxx driver stem from that fact that I can't use timeouts during >boot and must poll in order to do a timeout. You need tsleep() for the most time-consuming operation, which is DELAY(1000000 * SCSI_DELAY) in scsiconf.c (default 15 seconds). This is very annoying when there are multiple scsi controllers or other slow to start devices that could be started in parallel. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 10:42:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA02380 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:42:57 -0700 Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA02371 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:42:49 -0700 Message-Id: <199508211742.KAA02371@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Bruce Evans cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Clock interrupts during probes? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 95 03:30:41 +1000." <199508211730.DAA02704@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:42:48 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>I need access to timeout(), not tsleep() for the work in the upperlevel >>SCSI code, so I don't need a process context. Most of the DELAY() calls >>in the aic7xxx driver stem from that fact that I can't use timeouts during >>boot and must poll in order to do a timeout. > >You need tsleep() for the most time-consuming operation, which is >DELAY(1000000 * SCSI_DELAY) in scsiconf.c (default 15 seconds). This >is very annoying when there are multiple scsi controllers or other >slow to start devices that could be started in parallel. > >Bruce Timeout could be used there with a little manipulation of the code. But I guess I should be more clear on what I need timeout for. Right now, we don't wait between retries of commands that return "target busy". We should really sleep for a second or so. It would be really easy simply to setup a timeout pointing the retry function, but that solution won't work at boot. It seems just so silly to me to have to special case code for boot like this if, as you said before, we could have clock interrupts with minimal effort. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 10:44:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA02481 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:44:54 -0700 Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA02464 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:44:51 -0700 Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <15342(3)>; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:44:08 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177475>; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:44:01 -0700 To: "Michael C. Newell" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Multicast on PPP devices In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 95 10:26:29 PDT." Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:43:47 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <95Aug21.104401pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message you w rite: >The ppp devices on 2.0.5 have the multicast bit set. When I run mrouted >it dies with the errors: > > Aug 21 13:14:40 sisyphus mrouted[8195]: warning - can't join group > 224.0.0.4 on interface 198.116.75.49: Can't assign requested address > Aug 21 13:14:40 sisyphus mrouted[8195]: warning - can't join group > 224.0.0.4 on interface 198.116.75.49: Can't assign requested address > Aug 21 13:14:40 sisyphus mrouted[8195]: setsockopt IP_MULTICAST_IF > 198.116.75.49: Can't assign requested address > Aug 21 13:14:40 sisyphus mrouted[8195]: setsockopt IP_MULTICAST_IF > 198.116.75.49: Can't assign requested address Well, you appear to have numbered your PPP interfaces the same as your ethernet interface. The BSD multicast routing code requires each interface to be in a different subnet. (There's some chance that the restriction can be relaxed to "have a different IP address", meaning that you could use several addresses out of the same subnet, but each interface definitely needs its own source address.) Barring that, someone seems to have changed the INADDR_TO_IFP macro in netinet/in_var.h to only search destination addresses, rather than local addresses, on point-to-point interfaces. This will cause mrouted no end of grief. I will check out the problem with disabling the phyint when it's down; I would have thought that should work. Unfortunately, unless you want to renumber your ppp interfaces and change netinet/in_var.h, you won't be able to use native multicast over your point-to-point interfaces. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 10:47:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA02651 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:47:34 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA02644 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:47:28 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA26061; Mon, 21 Aug 95 11:48:48 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508211748.AA26061@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 11:48:47 MDT Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508210345.WAA29762@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Aug 20, 95 10:45:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > In article <9508201948.AA23045@cs.weber.edu>, > Terry Lambert wrote: > >Unless you are running everything on the same box, it's impossible to > >provide inter-machine consistency guarantees. That's why NFS is the > >way it is. > > Oh, crap. You handle machine failures the same way you handle disk failures. > If you can't handle disk failures you shouldn't have a stateful *local* file > system. For conventional file I/O you can get pretty much the same recovery > semantics both ways (client reloads state), and for non-file I/O you get the > choice of no access at all or error returns. I'll take the error returns. Write me an NFS fsck. 8-). > I've used stateless and stateful remote file systems, and I'll take stateful > any day. I'd much rather type: > > tar tvfB //xds13/dev/rmt0 > > Than: > > rsh xds13 dd if=/dev/rmt0 | tar tvfb - > > And it's awful nice to be able to set up a getty on //modem1/dev/ttyc4. And > being able to get open-count semantics on temp files. And accessing named > pipes over the net. And "fsck //hurtsystem/dev/rw0a". And so on... > > I really miss OpenNET. Yeah, this isn't really a result of the statefulness or statelessness of the transport. It's that fact that NFS doesn't implement an ISO layer 5 or 6. OpenNet didn't implement a layer 5, but since you were going between homogeneous machine types for this type of I/O, that wasn't a problem (the manifest constants for B9600 for sgtty() were guaranteed to be the same). In point of fact, the partial open hack didn't work with modems over OpenNet, so you had to open without O_NDELAY and hope that you didn't lose carrier and that O_EXCL wasn't set on the port by a previous instance of getty (standard practice for uugetty). That's because you couldn't unset the O_NDELAY... they didn't have an fcntl() that would allow you to unset it. Since NFS uses the major/minor on a cdev or bdev locally rather than remotely, the devices don't transport. Of course, this is what enables NFS to support diskless systems, so you can't complain too loudly. Assuming a devfs that can be exported *not* as cdev/bdev nodes, the one issue is devices that are stateful based on open. Like rewind tape devices. To combat that, you maintain the open instance -- by asserting an NFS lock, which causes the lockd to convert the handle into an open fd in the lockd processes address space -- an open instance held for the duration of the lock on the remote system. The next biggie is to change devices into normal files using the devfs do that references are exported but device nodes instance are not locally used on the mounting machine. Problem solved. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 10:52:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA02960 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:52:10 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA02954 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 10:52:06 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id DAA03262; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:47:25 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:47:25 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508211747.DAA03262@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I'm sure you're aware Linux has this scheme for at least a year, called >UMSDOS, made by a French guy... UMSDOS is apparently a mixed blessing. It is much slower than ext2fs, and people tend to keep using it and wonder why Linux is so slow. We could do demos using a big file mapped by the vn driver to a virtual disk containing slices and partitions, but the file systems would be very slow (even if the DOS file is contiguous, msdosfs doesn't support clustering so it would do i/o's in too-small sizes). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 11:13:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA03745 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:13:48 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA03739 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:13:41 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA26143; Mon, 21 Aug 95 12:14:58 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508211814.AA26143@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 12:14:58 MDT Cc: peter@haywire.dialix.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <11064.809015030@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 21, 95 07:23:50 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > There are better ways of doing this, BTW.. A company I used to work > for (Periphere Computer Systeme, GmbH) had something they called > MUNIX/NET which did all of the above and at very reasonable speeds. > Even then, many people praised MUNIX/NET as a superior solution to the > whole file sharing problem, even if it did require kernel modification > on both the server and client ends. It basically used the "superroot" > model for addressing other machines (/../machine/file) and you could > talk to everything from files to tape drives remotely - something you > can't do with NFS. Since you could also traverse mount points > successfully on the local machine, you got around that particular > foible of NFS as well. I'd prefer OpenNet's POSIX-allowed '//' semantics to a "superroot" if we are voting, which we aren't. 8-). There is actually a lot to be said for *avoiding* a "superroot" or really any type of unified namespace. The main issue is that of mobile computining. At least, if there is a "superroot", it's best that the mappings be transitory and not state-ful. This allows for mobile computing and replication. For instance, installing WordPerfect to //WordPerfect and then using whatever WordPerfect export that happens to be floating around at my current location, independent of me being at an East coast or West coast office. Or replicating an install onto local media (permanently consuming a license for my box) and using it on a plane. The "best of both worlds" is actually multiple mountable "roots", those with a much larger namespace than the DOS 26 drive letter namespace. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 11:18:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA04036 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:18:14 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA04030 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:18:12 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id LAA02999; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:17:15 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id LAA00148; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:18:59 -0700 Message-Id: <199508211818.LAA00148@corbin.Root.COM> To: Bill Fenner cc: "Michael C. Newell" , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Multicast on PPP devices In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 95 10:43:47 PDT." <95Aug21.104401pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:18:54 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Barring that, someone seems to have changed the INADDR_TO_IFP macro in >netinet/in_var.h to only search destination addresses, rather than local >addresses, on point-to-point interfaces. This will cause mrouted no end >of grief. It was changed to allow the local IPaddr of a point-to-point interface to be shared, thus routing has to be based on the destination. Do you have a suggestion on how to keep this functionality and not break multicasts over point-to-point links? -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 11:25:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA04408 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:25:41 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA04402 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:25:38 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA26197; Mon, 21 Aug 95 12:25:58 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508211825.AA26197@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 12:25:56 MDT Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Steven E. Piette" at Aug 21, 95 00:41:00 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > As I said earler, This mail wasn't suppost to be sent. My mistake. I'm > sorry. What I was really responding to was a interpretation on my part that > you were saying, that Sun's do async writes by default, and what you just > did say, that SVR4 (in the generic case) does as well. As others have > pointed out Sun does sync writes by default and belives some sort of > NVRAM is required to support safe async writes in NFS today. No problem. I made the response last night, before your other post, so we're kind of interleaved on I/O ourselves. 8-). > I had put my response aside to refer to both the SVID and the pre V3 NFS spec > before commenting and I sure I would have revised my initial response > which is more akin to talking to myself that actually directed at you. In all fairness, I have to make the claim that SVID III is worse than useless. AT&T/USL/Novell UNIX has failed SVID III compliance for a long time now (though not failed compliance testing) mostly because of the getitimer/setitimer/gettimeofday. It's the main reason that their select() implementation sucks out. I tried for a year to get this corrected, going so far as to totally rewrite the UnixWare timer code and write a working QIC-40/QIC-80 tape driver that used the modified code to try and get them to accept it into their source tree. No dice. > I've since checked SVID 3 and it says nothing about the expected behaviour > of NFS writes, so I say that in SVR4 its an implementation detail. I haven't > today checked the V2 NFS spec as to what it says about async writes, so I > won't comment further on conformance. I agree that it's an implementation detail. I have my NFSv3 here, but my NFSv2 is at home right now, so I really can't comment authoritatively on compliance with v2 either. My memory tells me that async writes are non-compliant. > The result was that I snapped at you. And for that I apologize. Like I said, no problem. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 11:30:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA04704 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:30:58 -0700 Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA04698 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:30:56 -0700 Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <16700(3)>; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:30:13 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177475>; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:30:05 -0700 X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.1 5/23/95 To: davidg@root.com cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Multicast on PPP devices In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 95 11:18:54 PDT." <199508211818.LAA00148@corbin.Root.COM> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:29:51 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <95Aug21.113005pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508211818.LAA00148@corbin.Root.COM> you write: > It was changed to allow the local IPaddr of a point-to-point interface to >be shared, thus routing has to be based on the destination. Do you have a >suggestion on how to keep this functionality and not break multicasts over >point-to-point links? The problem is that multicasts are forwarded based on source address. There is a table mapping (Source, Group) -> (iif, oiflist) where iif is the expected incoming interface, and the oiflist is the list of outgoing interfaces. If this is changed to (S, G, iif) -> (oiflist), with the current architecture of the code, you can easily create forwarding loops. The key to the problem is that the multicast forwarding code treats input packets and output packets the same; in fact, if you are a member of a group on an interface, and you output a packet on that interface, that packet is looped around to the IP input queue, and forwarded from the ip_input() side. In any case, this problem is fermenting in the back of my mind, but I certainly don't have an immediate solution. I'm afraid that the solution is changing the architecture, which I'm certainly not up to at the moment. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 11:32:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA04814 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:32:26 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA04804 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:32:20 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id EAA04385; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:31:02 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:31:02 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508211831.EAA04385@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: apg@demos.net, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: illegal instruction ?? Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >On a 486sx machine running freebsd-current (actually compaq laptop) >"ps aux" says >math_emulate: instruction d9f1 not implemented >Just wonder what it is ... fyl2x according to the comments in the source. >(of course MATH_EMULATE enabled in kernel) The default emulator is very limited and buggy. Try the GPL emulator. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 11:32:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA04942 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:32:59 -0700 Received: from uuneo.neosoft.com (uuneo.NeoSoft.COM [198.64.84.252]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA04936 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:32:57 -0700 Received: from ris1.UUCP (ficc@localhost) by uuneo.neosoft.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with UUCP id NAA00226 for freebsd.org!hackers; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:18:46 -0500 Received: by ris1.nmti.com (smail2.5) id AA04928; 21 Aug 95 12:21:03 CDT (Mon) Received: by sonic.nmti.com; id AA17428; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:46:12 -0500 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:46:12 -0500 From: peter@nmti.com (Peter da Silva) Message-Id: <9508211746.AA17428@sonic.nmti.com.nmti.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Marketing opportunity... Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Newsgroups: comp.newprod Subject: Re: CD Net for Windows NT Announcement Message-ID: <9508180421.aa12753@redtail.cruzio.com> Keywords: Meridian Data, Inc.; CD Net for Windows NT; CD ROM, Windows NT, TCP/IP, NetBEUI, IPX, Networking, software In article <9508180421.aa12753@redtail.cruzio.com>, wrote: > Available August 18, 1995, CD Net for Windows NT software has a suggested > list price (U.S.) of $1,995 for an unlimited-user server license. For $1,995 I can buy a PC, install FreeBSD and SAMBA on it, and add CD-ROM drives as required (7 per SCSI card). I will be able to put up to an unlimited number of CDROM drives under a single drive letter. > Windows NT is also available integrated with Meridian's CD ROM network > servers. The CD Net 914 network system, configured with seven CD ROM drives, > has a starting suggested list price of $12,795; For $12,795... let's see, for $300 per drive, plus $100 per cabinet for each group of 7 drives, plus $300 for a good SCSI card... $2000 FreeBSD server, 1 CD, Pentium, 16 MB. $2000 $2600 7 CD cabinet, x4 $10400 Total $12400 For $12400 I get 29 CDROMS, under one drive letter. Not bad... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 11:37:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA05240 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:37:16 -0700 Received: from eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (eikon.regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.42.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA05227 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:37:11 -0700 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.142.36]) by eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA24015; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:36:56 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA08725; Tue, 1 Aug 1995 01:14:43 +0200 Message-Id: <199507312314.BAA08725@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 14:09:09 MDT." <9508202009.AA23179@cs.weber.edu> Date: Tue, 01 Aug 1995 01:14:40 +0200 From: "Julian Stacey " Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Personally, I'd like to see this information used for a "FreeBSD Partners" > page, Seems a good idea, (a "FreeBSD Partners" page), A web page of hypertext links could promote both FreeBSD & the individuals & companies who work commercially in the FreeBSD area :-) An upmarket Web version of the gcc SERVICES file concept :-) Another idea I'd like to see (& would be prepared to edit up initially) is a `mug shot list'. with a page of freebsd names & faces (nothing else, in alphabetical order), with maybe 3 URLs per line: face, email, web home page, & not just for core people, but to include other well known FreeBSD people. We've got a FreeBSD meeting coming up soon in Aachen Germany (2nd & 3rd Sept) if we had a web page of faces, I'd take it with me on the train, to recognise folk with (final destination is out of town, I may be able to offer lifts, as I'll have use of a car in Aachen. Julian --- Julian H. Stacey Email: jhs@freebsd.org Web: www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 12:00:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA06048 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:00:13 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA06035 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:00:10 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA02123; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:59:53 -0700 Message-Id: <199508211859.LAA02123@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: peter@nmti.com (Peter da Silva) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Marketing opportunity... In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:46:12 CDT." <9508211746.AA17428@sonic.nmti.com.nmti.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:59:52 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Would love to post this on comp.sys.intel with a subject heading: Why FreeBSD? If people start questioning the net performance we can slam them with the Network Computing review of FreeBSD NFS server vs NT's NFS server. Can I do that ? Amancio >>> Peter da Silva said: > Newsgroups: comp.newprod > Subject: Re: CD Net for Windows NT Announcement > Message-ID: <9508180421.aa12753@redtail.cruzio.com> > Keywords: Meridian Data, Inc.; CD Net for Windows NT; CD ROM, Windows NT, TC P/IP, NetBEUI, IPX, Networking, software > > In article <9508180421.aa12753@redtail.cruzio.com>, > wrote: > > Available August 18, 1995, CD Net for Windows NT software has a suggested > > list price (U.S.) of $1,995 for an unlimited-user server license. > > For $1,995 I can buy a PC, install FreeBSD and SAMBA on it, and add CD-ROM > drives as required (7 per SCSI card). I will be able to put up to an unlimit ed > number of CDROM drives under a single drive letter. > > > Windows NT is also available integrated with Meridian's CD ROM network > > servers. The CD Net 914 network system, configured with seven CD ROM driv es, > > has a starting suggested list price of $12,795; > > For $12,795... let's see, for $300 per drive, plus $100 per cabinet for each > group of 7 drives, plus $300 for a good SCSI card... > > $2000 FreeBSD server, 1 CD, Pentium, 16 MB. $2000 > $2600 7 CD cabinet, x4 $10400 > Total $12400 > > For $12400 I get 29 CDROMS, under one drive letter. Not bad... > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 12:41:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA07520 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:41:47 -0700 Received: from blob.best.net (blob.best.net [204.156.128.88]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA07501 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:41:43 -0700 Received: from mall.net (mall.net [204.156.129.99]) by blob.best.net (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id MAA20889; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:42:02 -0700 Message-Id: <199508211942.MAA20889@blob.best.net> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 12:33:45 -0700 From: Terry Lee Organization: Internet Design Group http://www.mall.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.1N (X11; I; BSD/386 uname failed) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Hacker's Choice for Hardware X-URL: news:comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I'm compiling a list of hardware recommended for FreeBSD. FreeBSD supports a wide variety of hardware. This is great for those who want to install FreeBSD on thier existing systems, but it's overwhelming for those who are shopping for new hardware specifically for a FreeBSD system. I'd like to compile a list of the top 1-4 recommendations for each category of hardware. This way, buyers can look into a handful of possibilities rather than the long list of supported hardware. If you are an avid FreeBSD user and have installed, used, and/or tested various hardware products, please e-mail me your submissions with comments to terryl@cs.stanford.edu. I will compile a list and post the results. I will also submit the results for inclusion in the FreeBSD Web site. I suggest the following criteria for evaluation and comments: Compatibility - should be rock solid with the least amount of installation issues e.g. 3c509 card is out Performance - please provide any specs you have or tests you may have performed, are performance features supported Price - please provide a street price and source Reliability - does it break down, is there good service and waranty Features - any special features or functionality Current submissions (just the beginning of course): Motherboards/CPUs: ASUS motherboards (which ones?): PCI/I-486SP3G - 486 motherboard w/ on board NCR 53C810 PCI SCSI Controller Street Price? Pentium Boards? ISA Ethernet: SMC Elite Ultra $95 (the clear choice?) PCI Ethernet: SMC, Compex or DEC DC21040 based ethernet Specific models? Prices? Details PCI Video: #9 GXE 64Pro PCI SCSI controllers: Adaptec 2940 More categories: ISA Video ISA SCSI controllers CD-ROMS Sound Cards I/O Cards SCSI Hard Drives IDE Hard Drives Mouse Hardware what else? Perhaps a list of what to avoid is in order also. I've had lost of troubles with HP Vectras, specifically the VL2 (IDE problems) and the XP/60 (S3 video problems). Hope to hear from you all, Terry -- I N T E R N E T Terry Lee, Technical Director D E S I G N 745 Stanford Avenue, Palo Alto, California 94306 G R O U P 415 424 0747 voice 415 424 0751 fax http://www.mall.net terryl@cs.stanford.edu http://www.mall.net/terry From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 12:54:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA08055 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:54:42 -0700 Received: from hemi.com (hemi.com [204.132.158.10]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA08049 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:54:39 -0700 Received: (from mbarkah@localhost) by hemi.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA07189 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:57:58 -0600 From: Ade Barkah Message-Id: <199508211957.NAA07189@hemi.com> Subject: rlogin on illegal port To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:57:58 -0600 (MDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 726 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello, One of our FreeBSD 2.0.5 machines showed the following within the console messages: (date) (time) (hostname) rlogin [3643]: usage rlogind [-aln] (date) (time) (hostname) rlogin [3643]: Connection from 128.x.x.x on illegal port What exactly does it mean and do we need to be concerned about this ? Seems like someone ran a probe on us or something. Thanks in advance, -Ade ps. incidently, the machine which initiated the connection looks like another FreeBSD machine. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Inet: mbarkah@hemi.com - HEMISPHERE ONLINE - www: -------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 13:18:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA08988 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:18:15 -0700 Received: from chrome.onramp.net (chrome.onramp.net [199.1.166.202]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA08980 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:18:12 -0700 Received: from localhost.jdl.com (localhost.jdl.com [127.0.0.1]) by chrome.onramp.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA03194; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:17:15 -0500 Message-Id: <199508212017.PAA03194@chrome.onramp.net> X-Authentication-Warning: chrome.onramp.net: Host localhost.jdl.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Ade Barkah cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:57:58 MDT." <199508211957.NAA07189@hemi.com> Reply-To: jdl@chromatic.com Clarity-Index: null Threat-Level: none Software-Engineering-Dead-Seriousness: There's no excuse for unreadable code. Net-thought: If you meet the Buddha on the net, put him in your Kill file. Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:17:15 -0500 From: Jon Loeliger Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Apparently, Ade Barkah scribbled: > Hello, > > One of our FreeBSD 2.0.5 machines showed the following within > the console messages: > > (date) (time) (hostname) rlogin [3643]: usage rlogind [-aln] > (date) (time) (hostname) rlogin [3643]: Connection from 128.x.x.x > on illegal port > > What exactly does it mean and do we need to be concerned about > this ? Seems like someone ran a probe on us or something. > > Thanks in advance, > > -Ade > ps. incidently, the machine which initiated the connection looks > like another FreeBSD machine. OK, I'll ponder this one with you as I got this message the other day in /var/log/messages: Aug 14 18:57:52 chrome named[65]: Lame delegation to 'hemi.com' from [128.x.x.x] (server for 'hemi.com'?) on query on name 'hemi.com' Notice that this involves hemi.com and I too have bleeped the from addr. I haven't got a clue in the world what this means. To be fair, I could easily have a *bad* DNS configuration here. I'm working on that. There were several such entries from different hosts. It was during a time period when a non-FreeBSD mailing list I'm on was experiencing some majorly flakey problems. I chalked it up to that. Could this also be due to the FreeBSD mail-list flake the other day? jdl From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 13:32:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA09687 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:32:51 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA09679 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:32:46 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA00592 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:33:00 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:33:00 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508212033.QAA00592@healer.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: router reset Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi. This is a shot in the dark, since it is actually BSDI and not FreeBSD that is giving me the problem. Every time the BSDI machine comes up, and DNS starts, we get a reset fault on our router. I was reminded of similar problem people were having with FreeBSD and terminal servers and remeber seeing something about a "sysctl". Any ideas? Thanx. -coranth ------------------------------------------+------------------------+ Coranth Gryphon | "Faith Manages." | | - Satai Delenn | Phone: 603-598-3440 Fax: 603-598-3430 +------------------------+ USMail: 11 Carver St, Nashua, NH 03060 Disclaimer: All these words are yours, except Europa... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 13:41:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA10183 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:41:57 -0700 Received: from phoenix.csie.nctu.edu.tw (phoenix.csie.nctu.edu.tw [140.113.17.171]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA10170 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:41:48 -0700 Received: from ccsun2.csie.nctu.edu.tw (jdli@ccsun2.csie.nctu.edu.tw [140.113.17.156]) by phoenix.csie.nctu.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.4) with SMTP id EAA01661 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:41:45 +0800 From: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw (Chien-Ta Lee) Message-Id: <199508212041.EAA01661@phoenix.csie.nctu.edu.tw> Subject: How to get network traffic ? To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:40:56 +0800 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1382 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hi : Question One : I am writing a system monitor - xsysinfo, may anyone tell me how to get my subnet's network traffic ( ?? k/s ) ? Currently I use this code to get packets come in and out of my host, how can I get the total load (K/s) about my subnet ?! getkval(nl[N_IFNET].n_value, (int *) &ifnetaddr, sizeof(ifnetaddr), "_ifnet"); old_packets = packets; packets.in_out = packets.collisions = 0; while (ifnetaddr) { kvm_read(kd, ifnetaddr, &ifnet, sizeof ifnet ); packets.in_out += ((ifnet.if_ipackets + ifnet.if_opackets) >> 2); packets.collisions += ifnet.if_collisions; ifnetaddr = (u_long) ifnet.if_next; } pkt_in_out = packets.in_out - old_packets.in_out; collisions = packets.collisions - old_packets.collisions; (code from xprform++) Question Two : What are Active, Inactive, Wired memory displayed by top ? How to get Total Memory, Used Memory, and Shared Memory ?! Currently I suspect that TotalMem = Act + Inact + Wired + Cache + Free UsedMem = Act + Inact SharedMem = Wired Is that correct ? ps. xsysinfo-0.1 is available at ftp.cdrom.com/pub/FreeBSD/incoming Thanks a lot. -- €£ªŸŠó®É, FreeBSD ®š®šªº·È¶i€F§Ú¥i·Rªº€p¹qž£.. §õ «Ø ¹F (Adonis) ¥æ€jžê€u ííŠa¥Í®Ú€F€UšÓ, Åý§Ú€ß·RªºPC³œÅDÂœš­ÅÜŠšÀs.. Mail: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 13:53:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA11114 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:53:32 -0700 Received: from palmer.demon.co.uk (palmer.demon.co.uk [158.152.50.150]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA11105 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:53:23 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by palmer.demon.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id VAA05024 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:52:37 +0100 X-Message: This is a dial-up site. Quick responses to e-mails should not be relied upon. Thanks! To: jdl@chromatic.com cc: Ade Barkah , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:17:15 CDT." <199508212017.PAA03194@chrome.onramp.net> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:52:36 +0100 Message-ID: <5022.809038356@palmer.demon.co.uk> From: Gary Palmer Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508212017.PAA03194@chrome.onramp.net>, Jon Loeliger writes: >OK, I'll ponder this one with you as I got this message the other day >in /var/log/messages: > Aug 14 18:57:52 chrome named[65]: Lame delegation to 'hemi.com' > from [128.x.x.x] (server for 'hemi.com'?) on query on name 'hemi.com' >Notice that this involves hemi.com and I too have bleeped the from addr. >I haven't got a clue in the world what this means. To be fair, I >could easily have a *bad* DNS configuration here. I'm working on that. OK. This is one I can answer. It means that the server said it gave a non-authorative answer, but it lists itself as being able to give an authorative answer. Something like: nslookup -qtyp=any hemi.com Server: foo.bar.org Address: 128.x.x.x Non-authoritative answer: hemi.com internet address = 204.132.158.10 Authoratitive answers can be found from: hemi.com nameserver = foo.bar.org hemi.com nameserver = NS.hemi.com foo.bar.org internet address = 128.x.x.x NS.hemi.com internet address = 204.132.158.10 (actually, I just looked at your DNS entries, and I can see which host you bleeped :-) ) There can be a lot of reasons for this to happen. Best way is to either contact the admin of the server in question and get him to fix his config, or if he's not meant to be a secondary server, stop listing it as an authoritative server. >There were several such entries from different hosts. It was during >a time period when a non-FreeBSD mailing list I'm on was experiencing >some majorly flakey problems. I chalked it up to that. Could this also >be due to the FreeBSD mail-list flake the other day? It's likely the mail lists, as sendmail verifies the address on the To: and From: lines I think, which causes quite a bit of DNS activity. who.cdrom.com (the nameserver that freefall.FreeBSD.ORG uses) logs a lot of lame delegations as a result of the mail traffic through freefall... Hope this helps Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 14:05:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA11509 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:05:01 -0700 Received: from hemi.com (hemi.com [204.132.158.10]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA11502 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:04:58 -0700 Received: (from mbarkah@localhost) by hemi.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA07633; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:07:49 -0600 From: Ade Barkah Message-Id: <199508212107.PAA07633@hemi.com> Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port To: gary@palmer.demon.co.uk (Gary Palmer) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:07:49 -0600 (MDT) Cc: jdl@chromatic.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <5022.809038356@palmer.demon.co.uk> from "Gary Palmer" at Aug 21, 95 09:52:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1041 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Jon Loeliger writes: > > > Aug 14 18:57:52 chrome named[65]: Lame delegation to 'hemi.com' > > from [128.x.x.x] (server for 'hemi.com'?) on query on name 'hemi.com' > > >I haven't got a clue in the world what this means. To be fair, I > >could easily have a *bad* DNS configuration here. I'm working on that. > > OK. This is one I can answer. It means that the server said it gave a > non-authorative answer, but it lists itself as being able to give an > authorative answer. Yes, looking at it, it appears that there is a configuration error in one of our secondary name servers. That is, we have "foo.bar.org" as a legal secondary server, but a clone machine there called "foo1" tried to answer and confused itself. I'll work with the DNS people there to get this fixed, thanks for the help. Regards, -Ade Barkah -------------------------------------------------------------------- Inet: mbarkah@hemi.com - HEMISPHERE ONLINE - www: -------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 14:15:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA12197 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:15:32 -0700 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA12175 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:15:24 -0700 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id XAA28361 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:15:15 +0200 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id XAA15026 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:15:14 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.7.Beta.11/keltia-uucp-2.4) id UAA18390; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:06:19 +0200 (MET DST) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199508211806.UAA18390@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:06:18 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Reply-To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) In-Reply-To: <199508211747.DAA03262@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 03:47:25 am X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1000 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME7a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Bruce Evans said: > UMSDOS is apparently a mixed blessing. It is much slower than ext2fs, and > people tend to keep using it and wonder why Linux is so slow. That's a newbie problem, not a technical one :-) > We could do demos using a big file mapped by the vn driver to a virtual > disk containing slices and partitions, but the file systems would be > very slow (even if the DOS file is contiguous, msdosfs doesn't support > clustering so it would do i/o's in too-small sizes). DOS file system's speed is something we cannot do much about, remember the goal of an UMSDOS clone... It is not to have it as a primary FS, just showing Linuxers they're not the only one with it :-) I'm sure it would appeal to many people. If they stay with it after the "trial" period, noone can do much about it except keep on saying they shouldn't... Education and knowledge is the primary problem with newbies, whether they run Linux or FreeBSD. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.2-CURRENT #15: Sun Aug 13 17:24:47 MET DST 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 14:37:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA13108 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:37:17 -0700 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA13096 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 14:37:11 -0700 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id XAA28551 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:37:01 +0200 Received: from (roberto@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) id XAA15184 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:37:00 +0200 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier Robert) Message-Id: <199508212137.XAA15184@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port To: jdl@chromatic.com Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:37:00 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: mbarkah@hemi.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508212017.PAA03194@chrome.onramp.net> from "Jon Loeliger" at Aug 21, 95 03:17:15 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#880 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 692 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > in /var/log/messages: > > Aug 14 18:57:52 chrome named[65]: Lame delegation to 'hemi.com' > from [128.x.x.x] (server for 'hemi.com'?) on query on name 'hemi.com' > > Notice that this involves hemi.com and I too have bleeped the from addr. > > I haven't got a clue in the world what this means. To be fair, I > could easily have a *bad* DNS configuration here. I'm working on that. It is a DNS misconfiguration. It means that someone decided that 128.x.x.x was secondary for hemi.com where it apparently hasn't been configured as such. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT #5: Fri Jul 14 12:28:04 MET DST 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 15:06:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA14509 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:06:58 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA14503 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:06:53 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA26967; Mon, 21 Aug 95 16:08:01 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508212208.AA26967@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Clock interrupts during probes? To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 16:08:00 MDT Cc: gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.org, hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508211645.CAA01423@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 02:45:34 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Actually, the PCI code only allows previously enabled interrupts. > Interrupts for previously configured devices are usually enabled at > this point, but clock interrupts aren't enabled until quite late in > init_main.c (by initclocks()). > > The PCI code and the EISA code shouldn't be allowing interrupts. > Some of the ISA code called by the PCI and EISA code was written > under the assumption that interrupts are disabled. E.g., INTREN(). > It's not obvious that INTREN() is safe to call at splhigh() like the > ISA code does. Perhaps it isn't safe :-[. > > I don't see many reasons why clock interrupts need to be enabled so > late. Perhaps the only reason is that curproc is bogusly initialized to > &proc0 before proc0 is initialized. curproc is statically initialized > and is reinitalized to the same thing near the start of init_main(). > This would cause hardclock() to follow a null pointer if it was called > early: > > if (p) { > ... > pstats = p->p_stats; > ... > if (timerrisset(&pstats->p_timer[ITIMER_PROF].it_value) ... > } This is critically bogus. There is no reason for the timer code to need to have knowledge of the process -- ESPECIALLY the initialization code. > It would be more natural to leave curproc initialized to NULL until quite > late, but init_main() says > > /* > * Initialize the current process pointer (curproc) before > * any possible traps/probes to simplify trap processing. > */ > > I think the idea is that traps should only occur in process context > so trap handlers need not check for (curproc == NULL). However, at > least the i386 pagefault handler checks curproc, and all trap handlers > should probably check it, if only to panic as early as possible for > traps from buggy interrupt handlers. Perhaps all traps that occur > before proc0 is initialized should be fatal. A trap can result in a wakeup, done on the process address. This is actually also a bogus assumption, since it neglects both SMP and the fact that the scheduler isn't running yet. Interrupts to the devices prior to the scheduler/processor startup should be ignored in all cases. The only "benefit" to aking them is that you get an extra I/O when it's possible to process them. This is the same order of bogosity that causes the init process 1 startup to return to the main() caller to kick the machine alive rather than a call down from additional assembly code. Someone was a bit lazy in locore.s. It's amusing to note that the other "kernel thread" type processes are started up *after* init in any case -- there is a great deal of room for potentially bogus behaviour as a result of interrupt reentrancy, if it happened precisely as the scheduler was starting. In the issue of SPL's, the spl0 is set in the forked processes prior to them going into their tight loop. I can see no reasonable benefit from this, specificall in vmdaemon(). Also in the neighborhood of the SPL's: the s = splimp() / stuff / splx(s) trap around the car interfaces and domain initialization is all rather silly, since it implies interrupts are enables prior to the cards being active. Most likely, the probe routines should shutdown the interrupts once it has been probed true, and the interrupts should be restarted as part of the attach, which should take place after domain initialization. This would cause the drivers to be architected in such a way as to allow them to be loaded and unloaded, since an attach/detach registration mechanism (instead of a silly loop in if.c) would be used to install the drivers as they came online. One installed, interrupt processing could be allowed, no problem. The initialization order in the current code with regard to the domain registration is the sticking point. > Not much easier - there would be no process context to sleep on. I > think we need something using coroutines to probe and attach all (or > large batches of) devices concurrently at boot time. Make the > coroutine switch mechanism look like tsleep() and have the same > semantics as tsleep() so that the same probe and attach code works > correctly after the system is up. DELAY(n) would become > csleep(&foo, PRIBIO, "foodelay", (n * hz) / 1000000). As you point out, no sleep context, which implies no sleepers, which implies the idea of wakeup is bogus. I've made a healthy start at the modularization and a rewrite of the system initialization code, per the discussion of initialization and ordering of events, including a rewrite of the init_main.c code. The patches are in my account on FreeFall (SYSINIT.tar.gz). Note the mountroot() stuff in the README, if you plan on playing with any of this. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 15:46:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA15708 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:46:03 -0700 Received: from crash.ops.neosoft.com (crash.ops.NeoSoft.COM [198.64.212.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA15701 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:46:01 -0700 Received: (from smace@localhost) by crash.ops.neosoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.10) id RAA01391 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 17:43:57 -0500 From: Scott Mace Message-Id: <199508212243.RAA01391@crash.ops.neosoft.com> Subject: equal cost ip forwarding To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 17:43:57 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 81 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Anyone working on or have patches for equal cost ip forwarding? Thanks, Scott From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 15:59:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA16251 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:59:43 -0700 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA16245 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:59:41 -0700 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA24882; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:58:52 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199508212258.PAA24882@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: equal cost ip forwarding To: smace@crash.ops.neosoft.com (Scott Mace) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 15:58:52 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508212243.RAA01391@crash.ops.neosoft.com> from "Scott Mace" at Aug 21, 95 05:43:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 151 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Anyone working on or have patches for equal cost ip forwarding? what's that? One packet here, one packet there? etc? > > Thanks, > Scott > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 16:13:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA17364 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:13:34 -0700 Received: from crash.ops.neosoft.com (crash.ops.NeoSoft.COM [198.64.212.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA17356 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:13:32 -0700 Received: (from smace@localhost) by crash.ops.neosoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.10) id SAA01446; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:11:12 -0500 From: Scott Mace Message-Id: <199508212311.SAA01446@crash.ops.neosoft.com> Subject: Re: equal cost ip forwarding To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:11:11 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508212258.PAA24882@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Aug 21, 95 03:58:52 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 278 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > > > Anyone working on or have patches for equal cost ip forwarding? > > what's that? > One packet here, one packet there? etc? Yah, say you have 2 p2p links, and you want the bandwidth spread across the 2. I got the idea from digging through cornell gated... Scott From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 16:15:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA17601 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:15:34 -0700 Received: from web.azstarnet.com (azstarnet.com [169.197.1.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA17575 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:15:27 -0700 Received: from sprite23.azstarnet.com (sprite23.azstarnet.com [169.197.3.23]) by web.azstarnet.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with SMTP id QAA29757; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:13:20 -0700 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:13:20 -0700 Message-Id: <199508212313.QAA29757@web.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: maher@azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: majordomo@braae.ru.ac.za, questions@FreeBSD.org, ports@FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-FAQ@freefall.FreeBSD.org From: maher@azstarnet.com (maher katbah) Subject: internet host Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi: can any body tell me where can I get the addresses or the phone number for the internet service provider . and how much the cost for those differant connections and what is the best way to go with, if I want to be an ISP for 200 users thank you From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 16:25:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA18210 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:25:59 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA18204 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:25:56 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id JAA25059; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:31:22 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508220001.JAA25059@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:31:21 +0930 (CST) Cc: roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net, terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508211747.DAA03262@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 03:47:25 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1510 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > > >I'm sure you're aware Linux has this scheme for at least a year, called > >UMSDOS, made by a French guy... > > UMSDOS is apparently a mixed blessing. It is much slower than ext2fs, and > people tend to keep using it and wonder why Linux is so slow. > > We could do demos using a big file mapped by the vn driver to a virtual > disk containing slices and partitions, but the file systems would be > very slow (even if the DOS file is contiguous, msdosfs doesn't support > clustering so it would do i/o's in too-small sizes). Oddly, I haven't had any bites on my last post about this, so I'll ask again : I have code that creates a large contiguous slab of sectors in an MSDOS filesystem, and hides them under a file. I've explored what I can of the diskslice code and the like, but I'm at a loss as to how to redirect a slice to point at this slab, short of rewriting the partition table (which would be Bad) or writing a variant on the vnode driver (which would defeat the whole purpose). This is basically a ready-to-go partition, it just needs water, so to speak. > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 16:49:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA19073 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:49:18 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA19063 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:49:15 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id TAA09533; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:44:06 -0400 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:44:04 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: equal cost ip forwarding To: Scott Mace cc: Julian Elischer , hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508212311.SAA01446@crash.ops.neosoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Aug 1995, Scott Mace wrote: > > what's that? > > One packet here, one packet there? etc? > > Yah, say you have 2 p2p links, and you want the bandwidth spread > across the 2. I got the idea from digging through cornell gated... i grabbed something off the net called bsd-mslip.tar.gz, a multi-line slip thingie. i have not used it myself, havent needed it yet. the 'ads' file is at the bottom. Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 ================================================================ This is modified SLIP (serial line IP) driver for BSDI / 386 1.1. Main features and differences from standart SLIP driver: 1) Multiline SLIP protocol are realised. It allow you to use few lines for the same SLIP connection, all this lines would work in parallel. 2) Keepalive protocol are realised. It checks if any packets are received from this line, and drop connection (and reestablish it) if no this packets was received during defined time. In addition, driver can be configured to wait few packets from the line before interface would be turned on. Driver can send dummy _keep alive_ packets every N seconds to keep line _alive_ even if no routing / icmp packets are transmitted between systems. 3) Driver fixes interface numbers for every line, to prevent routing problems (most routers dislike if some interface change it's addresses fast). 4) Driver can turn off BPF protocol on per-port basis. 5) Somwe bugs fixed. 6) interface accounting was added. There is utilities to work via leased, dial-in and dial-out lines. This programs allow to receive dialin connections, install dialout or leased lines connections (both with and withouth modem's control), allow to install leased line connections with dialout back-up, and so on. ================================================================= This driver is used in PC-Based routers - we work with 24 slip lines via digiboard plates, under heavy load. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 17:26:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA20342 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 17:26:57 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA20336 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 17:26:56 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA27824; Mon, 21 Aug 95 18:25:08 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508220025.AA27824@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 18:25:08 MDT Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508220001.JAA25059@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Aug 22, 95 09:31:21 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Oddly, I haven't had any bites on my last post about this, so I'll ask > again : I have code that creates a large contiguous slab of sectors in > an MSDOS filesystem, and hides them under a file. I've explored > what I can of the diskslice code and the like, but I'm at a loss as to > how to redirect a slice to point at this slab, short of rewriting > the partition table (which would be Bad) or writing a variant on the > vnode driver (which would defeat the whole purpose). > > This is basically a ready-to-go partition, it just needs water, so to speak. I'm interested in seeing this code; where do I go to get it? I have several issues which aren't addressed right now, so I was reluctant to be the first to respond. The main one I have is that my DOS partition on the machine I could do any testing on has been running Win95 for several months. The defragger un DOS 6.x and above is the Norton defragger, and I haven't been too anxious to find out how they mark the clusters in the Windows swap file on Win95 so that the defragger doesn't try to relocate them. Probably the same way Windows 3.11 and the Norton code works. As it is, I have blocks that can't be modes all over the disk, and without some type of knowledge here, I couldn't defrag the disk and get a large contiguous area, which seems to be needed. The vnode pager is not really what we want to deal with. Windows 95 actually got this (mostly) right, though they screwed up when they put knowledge of partition types into the TSD's (type specific drivers: they have specific knowledge of the FS when they should only have specific knowledge of the partition ID's). What they do is provide a physical device and logical devices which point to a physical device and have a "partition bias". They screwed up again here, since the MS supplied TSD's don't return the partition bias field filled out. What we are interested in is a sector offset and length on the physical device being exported as a device to the /dev namespace. This is different from the vnconfig stuff (which is also useful) in that it means you don't go through a file system to get at the device, so you don't suffer the problems that a UMSDOS partition would face in terms of block size, etc. This actually strikes at the heart of what I think is wrong with the current disklabel code. The PowerPC under a PReP/OpenFirmware implementation assumes a DOS partitioning scheme, but uses the sector offset field rather than the C/H/S field -- 4GB worth of 512 byte sectors, or 2TB of disk. They look for the AA55 signature, and if it isn't present, they assume that the physical device constitutes a single partition. This is their way around the need for a DOS partition on all devices, though PPC AIX puts one on their boot floppies anyway (IBM PPC 40P + AIX). I think the logical drive allocation by type specific driver to get a logical physical device per partition, then further take logical physical drives into pure logical drives by either disklabel or by logical drive implemented on logical physical drives is the correct general soloution to this problem. It means the ability to translate a physical device into one or more logical physical devices, which are then translated into pure logical devices and mounted by a file system based on their identification of the drive as one they want (for UFS, this is by the UFS magic number in the superblock). This is actually what Win95 does with a stacked drive: It uses the physical device, runs a TSD to decode the partitions if it sees a partition table, and take the logical drives after that. It then mounts the logical drive under VFAT, and the stacker FSD (file system driver) looks on drives for the stacker file and exports that as a logical device of type "stacker", which it then mounts. What we want is a logical device of type "FreeBSD". I don't know who currently "owns" the diskslice code, but since this would mean another set of revisions if we wanted to access the contiguously allocated sectors in any file system as a device (rather than translating the address into file block offsets and eating the performance hit that would result), I think it bears more than casual scrutiny before any changes can be made. As things currently sit, I wouldn't want to go off half-cocked on yet another diskslice code revision to get "slab" device support, and I wouldn't want any design to neglect the current diskslice and install issues that haven't been addressed (logical DOS partitions, immutable bit so Windows doesn't "defrag" the file", verifying contiguity, etc.). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 17:56:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA22292 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 17:56:44 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA22270 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 17:56:41 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA27891; Mon, 21 Aug 95 18:58:21 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508220058.AA27891@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Changing DEV_BSIZE To: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 18:58:20 MDT X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 18:07:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA22918 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:07:20 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA22912 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:07:19 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA27924; Mon, 21 Aug 95 19:08:59 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508220108.AA27924@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Changing DEV_BSIZE To: hackers@freebsd.org, curent@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 19:08:58 MDT X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Oops! Sent that one without a message body! 8-). I want to up the size of DIRBLKSIZE in ufs/ufs/dir.h to play around with some things I was playing around with before the VM changes. The dir.h code says that the DIR_BLKSIZ needs to be DEV_BSIZE to make any atomicity guarantees... this wasn't the case in the previous code. I'd like to know if making the DIRBLKSIZ 1204 (ie: DEV_BSIZE * 2) will result in problems. It seems to me that the disks are accessed in terms of pages in any case, and the comment in dir.h that says: * A directory consists of some number of blocks of DIRBLKSIZ * bytes, where DIRBLKSIZ is chosen such that it can be transferred * to disk in a single atomic operation (e.g. 512 bytes on most machines). Is in fact outdated and incorrect -- even on older pre-VM changes code, I'd think... Does anyone see a problem with this? Note that I'm not proposing this change for the generic case of everyone's UFS... just mine. If there *is* a 512 byte limit in effect here, can I up DEV_BSIZE to get around it? Is this just artificial crap to deal with frags? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 18:18:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA23428 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:18:27 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA23415 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:18:23 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA16798 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:18:20 -0700 Prev-Resent: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:18:20 -0700 Prev-Resent: "hackers@freebsd.org " Received: from mozart.american.com (mozart.american.com [204.253.96.2]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA16551 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 16:47:24 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mozart.american.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA04094 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:46:50 -0400 Message-Id: <199508212346.TAA04094@mozart.american.com> X-Authentication-Warning: mozart.american.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.5.3 12/28/94 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: IDE CDROM driver support now part of FreeBSD-current In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 19 Aug 1995 16:21:38 PDT." <5055.808874498@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:46:46 -0400 From: Josh Littlefield Resent-To: hackers@freebsd.org Resent-Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:18:20 -0700 Resent-Message-ID: <16796.809054300@time.cdrom.com> Resent-From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I've recently brought Serge Vakulenko's IDE CDROM driver into > -current, and it can be easily enabled by dropping the following into > your kernel configuration file: > Please help Serge and us test this driver with your IDE CDROM drives! I don't expect you to take this very far (you'll see why below), but I thought I should report what I found. Feel free to flog me of this is stupid or irrelevant. I've been wanting this ATAPI support for a while, so I decided to grab it. But I was not in a position to install FreeBSD-current. So I decided to stuff it into 2.0.5-RELEASE. Seemed like it should work for just getting to a CD-ROM. Anyway, I probably never get to this code because the device discovery never detects my IDE controller (wdcX). It never has, but I never cared before. You see, I have a pretty stupid, somewhat atypical setup. My primary disk is SCSI, and my only IDE device is a Sony ATAPI CD-ROM. The CD-ROM is the primary device at the second controller configuration (I/O 170, IRQ 15). wdc0 and wdc1 are never discovered. I tried reversing the I/O and IRQ of wdc0 and wdc1 in the config file so it probes the second one first, but got the same result. The only reason I bother sending this (since if I was in your shoes I'd be inclined to disregard someone working with a home-spun release), is on the chance that this is a problem others might see in the 2.1 code. That is, is there some assumption that there will be a real disk on the IDE controller which pre-empts noticing a cdrom there? For what its worth, I grabbed wd.c, wcd.c, atapi.c, and atapi.h. I stuffed the wcd entries into bdevsw and cdevsw, at 19 and 69 respectively, modified files.i386, devices.i386, MAKEDEV, etc. As far as I can tell none of this matters until the wdc controller is recognized. -josh From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 18:58:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA24580 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:58:22 -0700 Received: from pain.csrv.uidaho.edu (pain.csrv.uidaho.edu [129.101.114.109]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA24574 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:58:19 -0700 Received: from pain.csrv.uidaho.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pain.csrv.uidaho.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA16492 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:58:10 -0700 Message-Id: <199508220158.SAA16492@pain.csrv.uidaho.edu> Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:58:08 -0700 From: Faried Nawaz Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port Apparently-To: Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk ------- Blind-Carbon-Copy To: Ade Barkah Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Aug 1995 13:57:58 MDT." X-Web: <"http://www.cs.uidaho.edu:8000/"> X-OS: 4.4BSD derivatives Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 18:58:08 -0700 From: Faried Nawaz Ade Barkah wrote... Hello, What exactly does it mean and do we need to be concerned about this ? Seems like someone ran a probe on us or something. they're probably running kerbIV. this message is probably generated by a connection to the klogin (or eklogin) port. ------- End of Blind-Carbon-Copy From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 19:26:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA25539 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:26:37 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA25526 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:26:23 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA16576 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:56:23 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA25348; 21 Aug 95 20:09:09 CDT (Mon) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA25345; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:09:09 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508220109.UAA25345@bonkers.taronga.com> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:09:09 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9508211748.AA26061@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 21, 95 11:48:47 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1560 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Oh, crap. You handle machine failures the same way you handle disk failures. > > If you can't handle disk failures you shouldn't have a stateful *local* file > > system. For conventional file I/O you can get pretty much the same recovery > > semantics both ways (client reloads state), and for non-file I/O you get the > > choice of no access at all or error returns. I'll take the error returns. > Write me an NFS fsck. 8-). You do the fsck on the server. I've fone fscks over opennet. > Yeah, this isn't really a result of the statefulness or statelessness of > the transport. It's that fact that NFS doesn't implement an ISO layer > 5 or 6. Devices are inherently stateful. You can't resend a missing block to a remote tape drive, because you can't seek it. > OpenNet didn't implement a layer 5, but since you were going > between homogeneous machine types for this type of I/O, that wasn't a > problem (the manifest constants for B9600 for sgtty() were guaranteed to > be the same). I opened devices and named pipes from DOS. Of course that didn't support ioctls. > Of course, this is what enables NFS to support diskless systems, so you > can't complain too loudly. That's what devfs is for. > To combat that, you maintain the open instance -- by asserting an NFS > lock, which causes the lockd to convert the handle into an open fd in > the lockd processes address space -- an open instance held for the > duration of the lock on the remote system. In which case you now have a stateful interface. And what do you do about named pipes? From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 19:37:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA25954 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:37:35 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA25945 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:37:22 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA19187; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:33:06 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:33:06 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508220233.MAA19187@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net, terry@cs.weber.edu Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Oddly, I haven't had any bites on my last post about this, so I'll ask >again : I have code that creates a large contiguous slab of sectors in >an MSDOS filesystem, and hides them under a file. I've explored I'm not too keen on this, because of coherency issues (what happens if the file is deleted while it is in use as a partition or after pointers to it are set up) and lack of generality (it would be better to optimize the vn driver for contiguous files; it should be possible to avoid going through the file system except for initialization). >what I can of the diskslice code and the like, but I'm at a loss as to >how to redirect a slice to point at this slab, short of rewriting >the partition table (which would be Bad) or writing a variant on the >vnode driver (which would defeat the whole purpose). To test it you could create a slice inside the DOS slice containing the file. I think fdisk allows bogus things like that. Not recommended. >This is basically a ready-to-go partition, it just needs water, so to speak. The vn driver method already has water :-). Try your file that hides the sectors as a vn device. It can't hurt to have the sectors contiguous and performance might be reasonable. I don't think it would be - msdosfs performance is abysmal and revision 1.16 of vn.c seems to have introduced doing read/write through the file system except for paging. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 19:57:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA26898 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:57:53 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA26888 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:57:47 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA28223; Mon, 21 Aug 95 20:59:18 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508220259.AA28223@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 20:59:17 MDT Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508220109.UAA25345@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Aug 21, 95 08:09:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Write me an NFS fsck. 8-). > > You do the fsck on the server. > > I've fone fscks over opennet. I'm talking about "client/server connection crash recovery" to recover the state after a failure of a stateful protocol. The problem is, of course, that one must maintain all idempotent state on both the client and the server -- that is any state that can't be derived from other state. an "NFS fsck" would recover the state, including causing any open files and locks to be asserted as they were asserted before the crash. Since I could have two clients, and the server crashed, then the state has to be reinstantiated by both clients. Consider that if I have client 1 with a lock outstanding and client 2 with a lock request outstanding and blocked on client 1's lock, if client 2 begins crash recovery prior to client 1, it will assert its outstanding lock request -- which the server will grant, not having client 1's context to use as a wakeup address. Basically, "the machine" becomes the network, and as a result MTBF goes way, way down. That was my point in the "Write me an NFS fsck" statement. > > Yeah, this isn't really a result of the statefulness or statelessness of > > the transport. It's that fact that NFS doesn't implement an ISO layer > > 5 or 6. > > Devices are inherently stateful. You can't resend a missing block to a > remote tape drive, because you can't seek it. This is an unrecoverable failure -- an EIO will be returned to the caller in this case by the server when the server comes back up. Lock state recovery is never guaranteed in any case. In the hypotheitcal case of devies exported as ordinary files by a stateless NFS, the server will verify the existance of a file lock on the device before permitting I/O. After recovery, a lock will not exist. The momentary state of the device post-recovery is irrelevent. This type of NFS extension is simple in the extreme if one has a lock daemon and the ability to query lock state from the server. It's even transparent, as long as you don't need the device files locally -- ie: a remotely mounted /dev directory. But as you say, this is what devfs is for: so a diskless client will carry its own device instances not necessarily exported as device nodes into the file system name space, but rather as files without delete permission and directories without create permission. > > To combat that, you maintain the open instance -- by asserting an NFS > > lock, which causes the lockd to convert the handle into an open fd in > > the lockd processes address space -- an open instance held for the > > duration of the lock on the remote system. > > In which case you now have a stateful interface. Yes, you do, although we can afford to lose the state for the vast majority of the items exported. It's amazingly funny that the state of a device on a remote machine is linked to the physical state of the device... 8-). By your argument, NFS itself is stateful, so you have no room to complain about it by calling it "stateless". A correct implementation supports locking, which is stateful. > And what do you do about named pipes? Is that if you are the reader, or if you are the writer, or if you are both and choose to do both over the network interface? The correct implementation of named pipes probably does not involve using the open hang to implement semaphoring of one of the processes using the pipe to communicate. You can approximate this by using an O_NDELAY open and compensate for the O_NDELAY open by using a protocol on the data pushed through the pipe. In reality, one should use sockets instead of named pipes in any case. But, yes, there exists a possibility for data loss when a machine crashes. The directory containing the named pipe could have been in the process of compaction or renaming an entry in the block containing the names pipe name on your OpenNet system. What do you do when the pipe ends up in Lost+Found? For that matter, how do you implement a recoverey mechanism for a named pipe in any case? I don't think this is a valid argument for implementing a fully stateful protocol. However, don't let me stand in your way if you want to implement one. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 20:14:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA27700 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:14:33 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA27693 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:14:16 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA20592; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:09:36 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:09:36 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508220309.NAA20592@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >What we are interested in is a sector offset and length on the physical >device being exported as a device to the /dev namespace. This is different I.e., a slice. >This actually strikes at the heart of what I think is wrong with the >current disklabel code. You mean the current slice code. Disklabels are layered under slices so they are irrelevant to this discussion. I think labels should go away eventually. The current slice code is too closely tied to a particular initialization routine (the only one implemented). >The PowerPC under a PReP/OpenFirmware implementation assumes a DOS >partitioning scheme, but uses the sector offset field rather than the >C/H/S field -- 4GB worth of 512 byte sectors, or 2TB of disk. So does FreeBSD. >They look for the AA55 signature, and if it isn't present, they assume >that the physical device constitutes a single partition. This is their So does FreeBSD. This doesn't work too well in practice, since some BIOSes require AA55 for booting, so the default bootblock has to have it, so you get an unwanted signature when you write the bootblock. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 20:20:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA28065 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:20:45 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA28059 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:20:43 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA28296; Mon, 21 Aug 95 21:20:04 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508220320.AA28296@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 21:20:03 MDT Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net In-Reply-To: <199508220233.MAA19187@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 12:33:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >Oddly, I haven't had any bites on my last post about this, so I'll ask > >again : I have code that creates a large contiguous slab of sectors in > >an MSDOS filesystem, and hides them under a file. I've explored > > I'm not too keen on this, because of coherency issues (what happens if > the file is deleted while it is in use as a partition or after pointers > to it are set up) and lack of generality (it would be better to optimize > the vn driver for contiguous files; it should be possible to avoid going > through the file system except for initialization). Clearly, file locking should be implemented at the vncalls layer above the VFS, only calling the VOP_ADVLOCK() to notify the lower level file system in case it wants to impose its own semantics over and above those enforced by default advisory locking, or if it wants to package up the requests and send them remote. Secondly, there needs to be the concept of mandatory file locking at the same level -- not smeared through each of the VFS FS implementations. This is a design error in the current implementation of advisory locking in the UFS nad other file system modules, and in the kernel code in the file kern/vfs_syscalls.c. 8-). That way, no matter what the underlying file system, you can assure the slab consumer that no hybrid access will take place. The definition of "hybrid" in this case refers to the fact that such a file exists on a hosted basis. There are two consumers of the file system services: the device driver making the file appear as a device, and the normal file system users using the file system itself as a mountd file system instance. A similar situation would be a Samba server exporting a file system to DOS users, a DOS user asserting a mandatory byte range lock on a file, and a UNIX user going in and manipulating the file without honoring the mandatory lock. This is "promiscuous" behaviour, since the interfaces are not identical, The UNIX user fails to honor the DOS locking semantics because he does not access the file system through an interface capable of enforcement. > >what I can of the diskslice code and the like, but I'm at a loss as to > >how to redirect a slice to point at this slab, short of rewriting > >the partition table (which would be Bad) or writing a variant on the > >vnode driver (which would defeat the whole purpose). > > To test it you could create a slice inside the DOS slice containing the > file. I think fdisk allows bogus things like that. Not recommended. I agree. This is totally bogus. The way to handle it is to provide a device to BSD using another mechanism, rather than trying to twist the existing partition mechanism that BSD already knows about into doing the work for you. See my other post. > >This is basically a ready-to-go partition, it just needs water, so to speak. > > The vn driver method already has water :-). Try your file that hides > the sectors as a vn device. It can't hurt to have the sectors contiguous > and performance might be reasonable. I don't think it would be - msdosfs > performance is abysmal and revision 1.16 of vn.c seems to have introduced > doing read/write through the file system except for paging. Yes; unless you divorce the file system from the area of disk it manages and manage it as just another logical device, you are going to have terrible performance penalties. Probably your pseudo-device needs to: 1) Look up the file 2) Assert a mandatory file lock 3) Verify that the file is in fact contiguous 4) Export as device node that is an alias for the device node the file system is actually on, with the addition of a sector bias and a length (both derived from the underlying file system). This could probably be rolled into vnconfig, but implies a logical to physical address translation is possible (you might have to add one as a file system specific ioctl()), and a contiguity check is also possible (perhaps by traversing the block offsets linearly by using an additional "offset" argument to the ioctl() above, or with the addition of another ioctl()). Then you'd flag the vnconfig'ed device for physical rather than logical I/O. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 20:22:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA28175 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:22:18 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA28169 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:22:14 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA08363; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:21:48 -0600 Message-Id: <199508220321.VAA08363@rover.village.org> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? Cc: Peter da Silva , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 21 Aug 1995 05:13:12 PDT Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:21:47 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : something more cross-platform in scope and approach, but I suspect : that if he does, it won't look a lot like Tk. Believe me. It is *MUCH* harder than it looks to do lots of different look and feels with lots of different underlying models. We looked into doing this with OI, and it had chosen poorly its abstraction and let too much X shine through. It was hard enough to come up with a design for NT, but curses was right out. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 20:25:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA28450 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:25:48 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA28440 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:25:39 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA08377; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:24:34 -0600 Message-Id: <199508220324.VAA08377@rover.village.org> To: Peter da Silva Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 21 Aug 1995 07:38:15 CDT Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:24:33 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : It's simpler than any other X-based : API I've ever used, for example. Not to start a flame war here, but Tk is horribly convoluted compared to OI. I'm completely biased, mind you, but OI seemed much simpler and saner to me. And it did get a lot of things right (and a few wrong, alas). Tk is much easier and simpler than Xm or Xt, which probably explains its popularity. My big beef with Tk is that it has never been extremely Motif compliant (close, yes, but not compliant in a multitude of details). Tk never struck me as a good abstraction for taking things down to the character level, but maybe I'm wrong. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 20:30:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA28765 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:30:05 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA28751 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:30:00 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA08415; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:28:10 -0600 Message-Id: <199508220328.VAA08415@rover.village.org> To: peter@haywire.dialix.com (Peter Wemm) Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of 21 Aug 1995 22:58:29 +0800 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:28:10 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : It has IP and port filtering.. Since it's on a per-interface level, it : could be programmed to drop packets coming in that have your source : address, in an attempt to get around your security (recent CERT advisory). But does it have the ability to drop IP framgent that would overwrite the IP and TCP headers and thus allow traffic through that would otherwise be denied? A popluar recent attack is to have an acceptible IP packet fragment go through the firewall, then to send an IP fragment that had an offset of 1 or 4 and overwrite the "OK" header with "Evil" headers that would otherwise be blocked. ip_fil does do that, and as far as the author and our local security expert know, is the only one to do so other than recent Cisco releases. Not to say that screend is bad, or anything like that. Just curious as to what is the state of the art. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 20:42:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA29281 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:42:17 -0700 Received: from fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov [137.75.131.171]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA29275 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:42:14 -0700 Received: by fslg8.fsl.noaa.gov (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA26461; Tue, 22 Aug 95 03:40:49 GMT Received: by emu.fsl.noaa.gov (1.38.193.4/SMI-4.1 (1.38.193.4)) id AA16401; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:40:38 -0600 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:40:38 -0600 From: kelly@fsl.noaa.gov (Sean Kelly) Message-Id: <9508220340.AA16401@emu.fsl.noaa.gov> To: imp@village.org Cc: peter@bonkers.taronga.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508220324.VAA08377@rover.village.org> (message from Warner Losh on Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:24:33 -0600) Subject: Re: Any reason we can't enable the bus mouse by default? Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Warner" == Warner Losh writes: Warner> Tk is much easier and simpler than Xm or Xt, which Warner> probably explains its popularity. My big beef with Tk is Warner> that it has never been extremely Motif compliant (close, Warner> yes, but not compliant in a multitude of details). Well, Tk 4.0 is much more Motifish than any of its predecessors. But I don't consider Motif compliance a worthwhile metric anyway (I hate Motif). But I do admit that Tk's Motif-like widgets somehow look, operate, and feel better than Motif itself. Then again, I like the way OI's Motif ``feels'' as well, for what it's worth. -- Sean Kelly NOAA Forecast Systems Lab, Boulder Colorado USA To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started, and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad. -- Jack Handey From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 20:52:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA29727 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:52:01 -0700 Received: from misery.sdf.com (gw.sdf.com [204.191.196.33]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA29685 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:51:30 -0700 Received: by misery.sdf.com id <1080>; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:46:26 +0100 Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:46:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: Scott Mace cc: Julian Elischer , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: equal cost ip forwarding In-Reply-To: <199508212311.SAA01446@crash.ops.neosoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Aug 1995, Scott Mace wrote: > > > Anyone working on or have patches for equal cost ip forwarding? > > > > what's that? > > One packet here, one packet there? etc? > > Yah, say you have 2 p2p links, and you want the bandwidth spread > across the 2. I got the idea from digging through cornell gated... Everyone else calls this load-balancing or bonding. Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 20:56:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA00314 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:56:57 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA00307 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 20:56:55 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA28423; Mon, 21 Aug 95 21:58:05 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508220358.AA28423@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 21:58:04 MDT Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net In-Reply-To: <199508220309.NAA20592@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 01:09:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >What we are interested in is a sector offset and length on the physical > >device being exported as a device to the /dev namespace. This is different > > I.e., a slice. > > >This actually strikes at the heart of what I think is wrong with the > >current disklabel code. > > You mean the current slice code. Disklabels are layered under slices > so they are irrelevant to this discussion. I think labels should go > away eventually. I agree on the label's wanting to "go away". But I think that since the disklabel is on a logical physical device, it's important; that's because the disklabel is the critter that exports the terminal device that is represented as a logical array of disk blocks and that's where the file systems go. This is exactly what he wants to do, it's just that a filesystem goes on the logical physical device and gets mountes as well. Whole disk: [][ ][ ] ^ ^ ^ | | | | `-- DOS partition(3) `-- BSD partition(2) `-- DOS boot + partition table(1) BSD partition: [][ ][ ][ ][ ] ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ | | | | | | `-- slice a(3) `-- slice b(3) `-- slice c(3) `-- slice d(3) `-- disklabel DOS partition: [ { } ] ^ ^ | | | `-- contiguous area(4) `-- partition start (1) physical device file (2) logical physical device (3) mountable device (4) area reexported as a mountable device In effect, the FAT and the DOS directory lookup is replacing the BSD disklabel in terms of how the area is made known to the system. > The current slice code is too closely tied to a particular > initialization routine (the only one implemented). 8-). > >The PowerPC under a PReP/OpenFirmware implementation assumes a DOS > >partitioning scheme, but uses the sector offset field rather than the > >C/H/S field -- 4GB worth of 512 byte sectors, or 2TB of disk. > > So does FreeBSD. > > >They look for the AA55 signature, and if it isn't present, they assume > >that the physical device constitutes a single partition. This is their > > So does FreeBSD. This doesn't work too well in practice, since some > BIOSes require AA55 for booting, so the default bootblock has to have > it, so you get an unwanted signature when you write the bootblock. The first sector (512 bytes) is what PReP refers to as "the compatability block" of the disk. They stuff a partition ID of 0x41 in there to indicate OpenFirmware, and allocate the patition in a DOS partition entry. But the boot process pretty much ignores it from that point on. The next 512 bytes (the first 512 of the 0x41 partition) are used to dictate load image, etc to the firmware. Clearly, this is where the BSD specific boot code goes for BSD, but for OpenFirmware, it's where the information for loading the remainder of the image resides. This is actaully a very clean implementation. The point I was making, though is that they assume this on *every* disk, even floppies. If it has the signature, it has a partition table on it, wierd as it may seem to have a floppy with a partition table. The reason for this is uniform treatment of devices. Which is what I'm advocating. On PC hardware, probably we want to always have two boot blocks: the BSD boot block and the system boot block with the partition table in it to make the BIOS happy. I know that the curent code is set up to handle the case of *just* a BSD boot block -- what I'm saying is that this probably isn't a good idea. It *is* a good idea for non-PC hardware -- or rather, whatever is native to the platform is a good idea. The intial boot is dependent on the native firmware for the BOX. For a PC, this is the MBR with the DOS partition table in it. In general, it's necessary to abstract the difference between terminal devices, which are allowed to have file systems on them, top level devices, which are there to make the firmware happy, and intermediate devices which implose a "slicing" or "partitioning" scheme, or which can export a subsection of a terminal device as a terminal device or as additional intermediate devices. This approach has the advantage of working for the existing partition and slice handling, the vnconfig device, AND the exportation of a contiguous chunk of disk as a device AND extended partitions, all without ruining the distintions in the kernel that cause some of the current install problems (ie: WD1007). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 21:07:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA00742 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:07:44 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA00734 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:07:36 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA22174; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:57:48 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:57:48 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508220357.NAA22174@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Clock interrupts during probes? Cc: gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.org, hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> if (p) { >> ... >> pstats = p->p_stats; >> ... >> if (timerrisset(&pstats->p_timer[ITIMER_PROF].it_value) ... >> } >This is critically bogus. There is no reason for the timer code to need >to have knowledge of the process -- ESPECIALLY the initialization code. Er, the timer code needs to gather statistics for the current process. Most statistics is gathered in statclock() which has slower than necessary code to allow for p->pstats being NULL. >> traps from buggy interrupt handlers. Perhaps all traps that occur >> before proc0 is initialized should be fatal. >A trap can result in a wakeup, done on the process address. >This is actually also a bogus assumption, since it neglects both SMP >and the fact that the scheduler isn't running yet. Interrupts to the The kernel isn't paged, so I don't think any traps should normally occur before init is started. Software bugs can cause division by zero and hardware bugs can cause NMI (NMI is unsafely handled as a trap. It should be handled as an interrupt). >devices prior to the scheduler/processor startup should be ignored >in all cases. The only "benefit" to aking them is that you get an >extra I/O when it's possible to process them. Interrupts during device probing would be useful. >In the issue of SPL's, the spl0 is set in the forked processes prior to >them going into their tight loop. I can see no reasonable benefit from >this, specificall in vmdaemon(). I think it is a no-op. >Also in the neighborhood of the SPL's: the s = splimp() / stuff / splx(s) >trap around the car interfaces and domain initialization is all rather >silly, since it implies interrupts are enables prior to the cards being >active. Most likely, the probe routines should shutdown the interrupts >once it has been probed true, and the interrupts should be restarted as >part of the attach, which should take place after domain initialization. Attach takes place very early, so interrupts for all configured devices are enabled very early. >> Not much easier - there would be no process context to sleep on. I >> think we need something using coroutines to probe and attach all (or >> large batches of) devices concurrently at boot time. Make the >> coroutine switch mechanism look like tsleep() and have the same >> semantics as tsleep() so that the same probe and attach code works >> correctly after the system is up. DELAY(n) would become >> csleep(&foo, PRIBIO, "foodelay", (n * hz) / 1000000). >As you point out, no sleep context, which implies no sleepers, which implies >the idea of wakeup is bogus. Each coroutine instance would provide a sleeper. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 21:31:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA01652 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:31:04 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA01646 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:31:03 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA28561; Mon, 21 Aug 95 22:32:27 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508220432.AA28561@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Clock interrupts during probes? To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 95 22:32:26 MDT Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.org, hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508220357.NAA22174@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 01:57:48 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > >> if (p) { > >> ... > >> pstats = p->p_stats; > >> ... > >> if (timerrisset(&pstats->p_timer[ITIMER_PROF].it_value) ... > >> } > > >This is critically bogus. There is no reason for the timer code to need > >to have knowledge of the process -- ESPECIALLY the initialization code. > > Er, the timer code needs to gather statistics for the current process. > Most statistics is gathered in statclock() which has slower than necessary > code to allow for p->pstats being NULL. 0 isn't a real process. The 'if (p) {' code implies that a NULL process is possible -- any place other than boot where this would be the case? > The kernel isn't paged, so I don't think any traps should normally occur > before init is started. Software bugs can cause division by zero and > hardware bugs can cause NMI (NMI is unsafely handled as a trap. It > should be handled as an interrupt). AGREE! > >devices prior to the scheduler/processor startup should be ignored > >in all cases. The only "benefit" to aking them is that you get an > >extra I/O when it's possible to process them. > > Interrupts during device probing would be useful. Yes. But then again, that's a special case, where they can be enabled during the probe but disable again until they are subsequently attached. I think this might be the issue with the ft driver hanging on boot, actually. It doesn't affect the fact that they are disabled at once after the probe and thus don't cause traps. The question is then whether you trap them all to you when you enable them, or whether on probe succes, ownership is assumed by a NULL handler and the interrupt-with-no-handler case is the probe coming true. I'd actually vote for the second: The PCI case of shared interrupts argues for not trapping ownership. That would let ISA nad EISA non shared instances assume ownership. This implies the probe-true state is kept seperately, not derived from the fact that it has an interrupt hooked (which is better than every device having their own null routine anyway). In the case of interrupts occurring on a device that has been probed but not attached (and therefore shouldn't be generating them in the first place) during a subsequent probe, well, the NULL handler grabs them before the fall into the interrupt-with-no-handler case and cause a false "probe true". This is already partially handled in to non "allow conflicts" case, but that doesn't help serial or other devices that are going to spit no matter what. > >In the issue of SPL's, the spl0 is set in the forked processes prior to > >them going into their tight loop. I can see no reasonable benefit from > >this, specificall in vmdaemon(). > > I think it is a no-op. Yeah, me too. I wanted an opinion from the author, though. > >Also in the neighborhood of the SPL's: the s = splimp() / stuff / splx(s) > >trap around the car interfaces and domain initialization is all rather > >silly, since it implies interrupts are enables prior to the cards being > >active. Most likely, the probe routines should shutdown the interrupts > >once it has been probed true, and the interrupts should be restarted as > >part of the attach, which should take place after domain initialization. > > Attach takes place very early, so interrupts for all configured devices > are enabled very early. Probably I should have stated this as "attach should take place later". The problem here, of course, if NFS mount of root. > >As you point out, no sleep context, which implies no sleepers, which implies > >the idea of wakeup is bogus. > > Each coroutine instance would provide a sleeper. Hmmm. This complicates the probe a bit, but not unreasonably so. It would actually help in the case of where you are trying to get the interrupts up early and probe the clock first. It's probably the right way to clean it up. It buys you simultaneous attach for long delay devices, if the interrupt stuff is handled correctly. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 21:52:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA02269 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:52:53 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA02263 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 21:52:47 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA23697; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:51:55 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:51:55 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508220451.OAA23697@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I agree on the label's wanting to "go away". But I think that since >the disklabel is on a logical physical device, it's important; that's >because the disklabel is the critter that exports the terminal device that >is represented as a logical array of disk blocks and that's where the >file systems go. >This is exactly what he wants to do, it's just that a filesystem goes >on the logical physical device and gets mountes as well. There should be an ioctl to set the in-core slice table. This would be easy to implement. >> >The PowerPC under a PReP/OpenFirmware implementation assumes a DOS >> >partitioning scheme, but uses the sector offset field rather than the >> >C/H/S field -- 4GB worth of 512 byte sectors, or 2TB of disk. >... >This is actaully a very clean implementation. >The point I was making, though is that they assume this on *every* disk, >even floppies. If it has the signature, it has a partition table on >it, wierd as it may seem to have a floppy with a partition table. The So does FreeBSD :-). Oops, I never committed the changes for slices on the floppy driver because everyone would have to change their floppy device minor numbers to the standard scheme used for hard disks. Anyway, it's inconvenient to have sliced floppies. >In general, it's necessary to abstract the difference between terminal >devices, which are allowed to have file systems on them, top level >... >This approach has the advantage of working for the existing partition >and slice handling, the vnconfig device, AND the exportation of a >contiguous chunk of disk as a device AND extended partitions, all OTOH, uniformity requires the platform-dependent intermediate devices (slices) to be available on all real devices although the platform may only require them on some real devices. >without ruining the distintions in the kernel that cause some of the >current install problems (ie: WD1007). These problems are only indirectly related to slices. Given 4 different wrong ways of obtaining the geometry: 1) from the device 2) from the BIOS geometry in the boot info (this way is wrong mainly because we don't have a robust way of mapping BIOS drive numbers to device names) 3) from the DOS partition table 4) from the label, I decided to standardize on 1), but 1) doesn't work for the WD1007. Previously the driver used all of 1), 3) and 4) and finished up using 4). The geometries given by 1), 3) and 4) may all be different. This was confusing. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 22:22:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA03309 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:22:07 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA03283 ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:22:01 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA24531; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:20:31 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:20:31 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508220520.PAA24531@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Clock interrupts during probes? Cc: gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.org, hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> >> if (p) { >> >> ... >> >> pstats = p->p_stats; >> >> ... >> >> if (timerrisset(&pstats->p_timer[ITIMER_PROF].it_value) ... >> >> } >> ... >0 isn't a real process. The 'if (p) {' code implies that a NULL process >is possible -- any place other than boot where this would be the case? Not in the boot code, which carefully and bogusly sets curproc to non-NULL. A NULL process is normal while the system is idle. The clock code handles that case fine, although I would write it differently so that there is always a process state to scribble on - this saves time when the system isn't idle. [Interrupts] >The question is then whether you trap them all to you when you enable >them, or whether on probe succes, ownership is assumed by a NULL >handler and the interrupt-with-no-handler case is the probe coming true. I meant `traps' to mean only synchronous traps, not interrupts. >I'd actually vote for the second: The PCI case of shared interrupts >argues for not trapping ownership. That would let ISA nad EISA non >shared instances assume ownership. This implies the probe-true state >is kept seperately, not derived from the fact that it has an interrupt >hooked (which is better than every device having their own null routine >anyway). Something like that. Autoconfig of shared interrupts is going to be even harder when devices are probed at modload time. Another device may be using the interrupt that you're trying to detect. >> >In the issue of SPL's, the spl0 is set in the forked processes prior to >> >them going into their tight loop. I can see no reasonable benefit from >> >this, specificall in vmdaemon(). >> >> I think it is a no-op. >Yeah, me too. I wanted an opinion from the author, though. I think he doesn't read the hackers list, having no time to read too-long discussions like this :-). >> Each coroutine instance would provide a sleeper. >Hmmm. This complicates the probe a bit, but not unreasonably so. It would >actually help in the case of where you are trying to get the interrupts >up early and probe the clock first. It's probably the right way to clean >it up. It buys you simultaneous attach for long delay devices, if the >interrupt stuff is handled correctly. 8-). Yes, and interrupt the interrupt stuff needs to be handled correctly for probe/attach to work at modload time. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 22:29:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA03738 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:29:04 -0700 Received: from hutcs.cs.hut.fi (hutcs.cs.hut.fi [130.233.192.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA03732 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:29:00 -0700 Received: from shadows.cs.hut.fi by hutcs.cs.hut.fi with SMTP id AA05419 (5.65c8/HUTCS-S 1.4 for ); Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:17:50 +0300 Received: (hsu@localhost) by shadows.cs.hut.fi (8.6.10/8.6.10) id IAA01893; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:17:53 +0300 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:17:53 +0300 Message-Id: <199508220517.IAA01893@shadows.cs.hut.fi> From: Heikki Suonsivu To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: terry@cs.weber.edu's message of 20 Aug 1995 22:43:41 +0300 Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Otaniemi, Finland Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Correct my previous post to say "don't enable async writes, ever, it's not worth it (unless you have a UPS on your server). It still could be fixed (-o async does not seem to do anything now). It is somewhat annoying to, say, copy a news file system to another disk. I couldn't care less if I would have to newfs the whole target in case of panic or power hick-up during the copy. -- Heikki Suonsivu, T{ysikuu 10 C 83/02210 Espoo/FINLAND, hsu@cs.hut.fi home +358-0-8031121 work -4513377 fax -4555276 riippu SN From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 22:32:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA03975 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:32:37 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA03964 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:32:20 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA24762; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:27:28 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:27:28 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508220527.PAA24762@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, terry@cs.weber.edu Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> very slow (even if the DOS file is contiguous, msdosfs doesn't support >> clustering so it would do i/o's in too-small sizes). >DOS file system's speed is something we cannot do much about, remember the >goal of an UMSDOS clone... It is not to have it as a primary FS, just I meant that the msdsofs implementation doesn't support clustering. This is because it was implemented before clustering existed and hasn't been maintained very well. It can probably be speeded up by another large factor using better caching. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 23:12:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA05871 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:12:39 -0700 Received: from genesis (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA05862 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:12:33 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA25888; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:17:45 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508220647.QAA25888@genesis> Subject: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:16:29 +0930 (CST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9508220025.AA27824@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 21, 95 06:25:08 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2556 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert stands accused of saying: > > This is basically a ready-to-go partition, it just needs water, so to speak. > > I'm interested in seeing this code; where do I go to get it? ftp://genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au/incoming/mkslab.c > The main one I have is that my DOS partition on the machine I could do > any testing on has been running Win95 for several months. The defragger > un DOS 6.x and above is the Norton defragger, and I haven't been too > anxious to find out how they mark the clusters in the Windows swap file > on Win95 so that the defragger doesn't try to relocate them. Probably > the same way Windows 3.11 and the Norton code works. AFAIK, the file is marked system/readonly/hidden, and thus won't be touched by most defraggers. I used the same approach with the FREEBSD.IMG file. > As it is, I have blocks that can't be modes all over the disk, and > without some type of knowledge here, I couldn't defrag the disk and get > a large contiguous area, which seems to be needed. For testing, 1M is all you need to verify that it works. > The vnode pager is not really what we want to deal with. Capiche; I should have been clearer - I meant vn driver, a la vn0... > What we are interested in is a sector offset and length on the physical > device being exported as a device to the /dev namespace. This is different > from the vnconfig stuff (which is also useful) in that it means you don't > go through a file system to get at the device, so you don't suffer the > problems that a UMSDOS partition would face in terms of block size, etc. This is spot on; however for it to be useful, it has to happen in the kernel at startup, rather than later on in a userspace utility. > As things currently sit, I wouldn't want to go off half-cocked on yet > another diskslice code revision to get "slab" device support, and I > wouldn't want any design to neglect the current diskslice and install > issues that haven't been addressed (logical DOS partitions, immutable > bit so Windows doesn't "defrag" the file", verifying contiguity, etc.). Relevant, relevant, relevant. Any comments on "safety" issues are most welcome. > Terry Lambert -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 23:14:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA05994 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:14:38 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA05982 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:14:34 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA25904; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:20:31 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508220650.QAA25904@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:20:30 +0930 (CST) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net, terry@cs.weber.edu In-Reply-To: <199508220233.MAA19187@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 12:33:06 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1934 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > > >Oddly, I haven't had any bites on my last post about this, so I'll ask > >again : I have code that creates a large contiguous slab of sectors in > >an MSDOS filesystem, and hides them under a file. I've explored > > I'm not too keen on this, because of coherency issues (what happens if > the file is deleted while it is in use as a partition or after pointers This is obviously a risk - I'd be inclined to modify the MSDOSFS to make it impossible to remove the file. > to it are set up) and lack of generality (it would be better to optimize > the vn driver for contiguous files; it should be possible to avoid going > through the file system except for initialization). The vn driver is a no-go if we want to boot from this, which is the whole idea. Remember, the aim here is to provide a safer way to plonk a FreeBSD filesystem onto a disk covered in a FAT filesystem. > To test it you could create a slice inside the DOS slice containing the > file. I think fdisk allows bogus things like that. Not recommended. Understood. > The vn driver method already has water :-). Try your file that hides > the sectors as a vn device. It can't hurt to have the sectors contiguous > and performance might be reasonable. I don't think it would be - msdosfs > performance is abysmal and revision 1.16 of vn.c seems to have introduced > doing read/write through the file system except for paging. Will do - as far as I understand, I can't disklabel a vn device, so it's not the final answer... > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 23:21:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA06352 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:21:11 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA06341 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:21:06 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA25934; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:26:25 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508220656.QAA25934@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:26:25 +0930 (CST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9508220320.AA28296@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 21, 95 09:20:03 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1743 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert stands accused of saying: > Probably your pseudo-device needs to: > > 1) Look up the file > 2) Assert a mandatory file lock Instructions on this one would be needed 8) > 3) Verify that the file is in fact contiguous > 4) Export as device node that is an alias for the device node > the file system is actually on, with the addition of a sector > bias and a length (both derived from the underlying file system). > > This could probably be rolled into vnconfig, but implies a logical to Not for the desired purpose, see my recent posts on this thread. > physical address translation is possible (you might have to add one > as a file system specific ioctl()), and a contiguity check is also > possible (perhaps by traversing the block offsets linearly by using > an additional "offset" argument to the ioctl() above, or with the > addition of another ioctl()). Then you'd flag the vnconfig'ed device > for physical rather than logical I/O. Checking for contiguity is relatively trivial given the nature of the FAT filesystem; all this sort of 'health checking' can be easily included in the "do we accept this slab" tests. The issues that I can't resolve at this point are : 1) Keeping everyone else's grubby mitts off the file. 2) Exporting a device/devices that represent the filesystem(s) inside the slab. > Terry Lambert -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 23:27:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA06821 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:27:09 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA06801 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:27:02 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA26175; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:23:11 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:23:11 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508220623.QAA26175@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hsu@cs.hut.fi, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Correct my previous post to say "don't enable async writes, ever, it's > not worth it (unless you have a UPS on your server). >It still could be fixed (-o async does not seem to do anything now). It is -o async works better in -current. The fix was very small. >somewhat annoying to, say, copy a news file system to another disk. I >couldn't care less if I would have to newfs the whole target in case of >panic or power hick-up during the copy. File creation and removal are still quite slow due to synchronous writes for directories. For creating and removing 1000 files I saw the following times: Machine System Load Disk fs op time --------- --------------- ---- ------ ---------- ------ ----------------------- 486DX2/66 Linux-1.2.13 1 slow ext2fs creat 6.98r 0.07u 5.98s " FreeBSD-2.2-cur 0 5MB/s ufs(async) " 12.31r 0.03u 3.09s " FreeBSD-2.2-cur 0 " ufs " 27.39r 0.08u 3.26s 486DX/33 FreeBSD-2.2-cur 0 1MB/s ufs(async) " 22.55r 0.12u 6.14s " FreeBSD-2.2-cur 0 " ufs " 58.22r 0.10u 6.73s 486DX2/66 Linux-1.2.13 1 slow ext2fs unlink 0.99r 0.07u 0.69s " FreeBSD-2.2-cur 0 5MB/s ufs(async) " 8.72r 0.06u 0.80s " FreeBSD-2.2-cur 0 " ufs " 24.34r 0.02u 0.92s 486DX/33 FreeBSD-2.2-cur 0 1MB/s ufs(async) " 17.34r 0.03u 1.41s " FreeBSD-2.2-cur 0 " ufs " 42.34r 0.12u 1.69s Summary: creat() seems to be about twice as fast for ufs as for ext2fs (I think this is because ext2fs is slow for large directories). However, not-quite-async writes make it twice as slow, and sync writes make it 4 times as slow. unlink() seems to be about the same speed in ufs as in ext2fs. However, not-quite-async writes make it 9 times slower and sync writes make it 24 times slower. A fast disk can't compensate for the slowness of synchronous writes. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 23:27:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA06837 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:27:11 -0700 Received: from alaska.net (calvino.alaska.net [204.17.139.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id XAA06816 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:27:08 -0700 Received: from cyb (cyb.alaska.net) by alaska.net (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA24115; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 22:26:17 -0800 Received: by cyb (Smail3.1.29.1 #9) id m0skQe4-0007gXC; Sun, 20 Aug 95 22:47 AKDT Message-Id: From: loodvrij@gridpoint.com (Bruce J. Keeler) Subject: PPP / Tunnel problems To: hackers@Freebsd.org Date: Sun, 20 Aug 1995 22:47:40 -0800 (AKDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: hackers-owner@Freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi. I have a problem with IJPPP and the tunnel drivers. What happens is that the connection seems to die when transmitting a lot of data. I can receive lots of data with no problem, but when I try and ftp out, it just dies on me. After it dies, I don't even get ping response from the other end. I've traced things a little, and packets go out OK, and packets come back through the modem OK, the ppp process receives them and writes them to the tunnel, but then they get lost. Any idea what is going on? Please help, this is very frustrating. System Details: FreeBSD 2.0.5-RELEASE 486 100MHz, 16M RAM, Adaptec SCSI, 16550 serial board, Microcom DeskPorte modem. My ISP is running Morning-Star PPP under Solaris if that helps. Mind you I've tried this against a different provider with the same results. The exact same hardware worked just fine with the same provider under Linux. Would any other info be useful? Here's my config file for what it matters: ----------------------- # # GENERIC -- Generic machine with WD/AHx/NCR/BTx family disks # # GENERIC,v 1.45.2.3 1995/06/05 21:50:41 jkh Exp # machine "i386" cpu "I486_CPU" ident CYB maxusers 10 options INET #InterNETworking options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem options NFS #Network Filesystem options MFS options DDB options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem options PROCFS #Process filesystem options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 options "SCSI_DELAY=15" #Be pessimistic about Joe SCSI device options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console options USER_LDT options SYSVSHM options SYSVSEM options SYSVMSG options GATEWAY options TUNDEBUG config kernel root on wd0 controller isa0 #controller pci0 controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 vector fdintr disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 disk fd1 at fdc0 drive 1 #tape ft0 at fdc0 drive 2 #controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 vector wdintr #disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 #disk wd1 at wdc0 drive 1 #controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 vector wdintr #disk wd2 at wdc1 drive 0 #disk wd3 at wdc1 drive 1 #controller ncr0 #controller ahc0 #controller bt0 at isa? port "IO_BT0" bio irq ? vector btintr #controller uha0 at isa? port "IO_UHA0" bio irq ? drq 5 vector uhaintr #controller ahc1 at isa? bio irq ? vector ahcintr #controller ahb0 at isa? bio irq ? vector ahbintr controller aha0 at isa? port "IO_AHA0" bio irq ? drq 5 vector ahaintr #controller aic0 at isa? port 0x340 bio irq 11 vector aicintr #controller nca0 at isa? port 0x1f88 bio irq 10 vector ncaintr #controller nca1 at isa? port 0x350 bio irq 5 vector ncaintr #controller sea0 at isa? bio irq 5 iomem 0xc8000 iosiz 0x2000 vector seaintr controller scbus0 device sd0 device st0 device cd0 #Only need one of these, the code dynamically grows #device ch0 #device wt0 at isa? port 0x300 bio irq 5 drq 1 vector wtintr #device mcd0 at isa? port 0x300 bio irq 10 vector mcdintr #device mcd1 at isa? port 0x340 bio irq 11 vector mcdintr #controller matcd0 at isa? port ? bio #device scd0 at isa? port 0x230 bio # syscons is the default console driver, resembling an SCO console device sc0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector scintr # Enable this and PCVT_FREEBSD for pcvt vt220 compatible console driver #device vt0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector pcrint #options "PCVT_FREEBSD=210" # pcvt running on FreeBSD 2.1 #options XSERVER # include code for XFree86 device npx0 at isa? port "IO_NPX" irq 13 vector npxintr device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" tty irq 4 vector siointr device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr device sio2 at isa? port "IO_COM3" tty irq 5 vector siointr device sio3 at isa? port "IO_COM4" tty irq 9 vector siointr device lpt0 at isa? port? tty irq 7 vector lptintr #device lpt1 at isa? port? tty #device lpt2 at isa? port? tty # Order is important here due to intrusive probes, do *not* alphabetize # this list of network interfaces until the probes have been fixed. # Right now it appears that the ie0 must be probed before ep0. See # revision 1.20 of this file. #device de0 device ed0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr #device ed1 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr #device ie0 at isa? port 0x360 net irq 7 iomem 0xd0000 vector ieintr #device ep0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 vector epintr device ix0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 iosiz 32768 vector ixintr #device le0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd0000 vector le_intr #device lnc0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 10 drq 0 vector lncintr #device lnc1 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 drq 0 vector lncintr #device ze0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector zeintr #device zp0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 vector zpintr controller snd0 device gus0 at isa? port 0x220 irq 15 drq 1 vector gusintr pseudo-device loop pseudo-device snp 3 pseudo-device ether pseudo-device log pseudo-device sl 1 pseudo-device bpfilter 10 #Berkeley packet filter # ijppp uses tun instead of ppp device pseudo-device ppp 2 pseudo-device tun 2 pseudo-device pty 16 pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 23:47:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA07679 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:47:27 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA07673 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:47:20 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA26716; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:45:06 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:45:06 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508220645.QAA26716@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net, terry@cs.weber.edu Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >The vn driver is a no-go if we want to boot from this, which is the >whole idea. Remember, the aim here is to provide a safer way to plonk >a FreeBSD filesystem onto a disk covered in a FAT filesystem. You would need to have the vn device and various tools on the boot device. This is acceptable for demos and installations, but not so good for use. >> To test it you could create a slice inside the DOS slice containing the >> file. I think fdisk allows bogus things like that. Not recommended. >Understood. Committing the bogus slice to the partition table looks better than ever. It allows booting from a normal slice. Anything else has large bootstrapping problems. >> The vn driver method already has water :-). Try your file that hides >> the sectors as a vn device. It can't hurt to have the sectors contiguous >Will do - as far as I understand, I can't disklabel a vn device, so it's >not the final answer... vn devices can be both sliced and labeled. They just can't be booted from. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 21 23:59:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA08777 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:59:28 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA08747 for ; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 23:59:18 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id RAA26084; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:05:10 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508220735.RAA26084@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:05:10 +0930 (CST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508220645.QAA26716@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 04:45:06 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1908 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > > >The vn driver is a no-go if we want to boot from this, which is the > >whole idea. Remember, the aim here is to provide a safer way to plonk > >a FreeBSD filesystem onto a disk covered in a FAT filesystem. > > You would need to have the vn device and various tools on the boot > device. This is acceptable for demos and installations, but not so > good for use. But if the slab _is_ the boot device, how do we read the tools from it? > Committing the bogus slice to the partition table looks better than > ever. It allows booting from a normal slice. Anything else has large > bootstrapping problems. Hmm. I'd have hoped that the partition table could be patched after it was read by the kernel, to avoid having to rewrite the MBR every time you booted. (Or at least checking and stuffing the bogus slice back in if something 'smart' had tried to remove it.) I see this scheme falling foul of disk tools, other operating systems and 'smart' virus prevention tools. I can also see it saving the sanity of several kernel hackers. 8) Thinking it through, there's not really a lot that would have to be added in terms of kernel code to support this - a DOS version of the slab-creation code would be needed, and some minor mods to the fbsdboot tool to check the bootslab and stuff the MBR. Anything else? > vn devices can be both sliced and labeled. They just can't be booted from. Ahu - how do you get slices of a vn device? I presume it's just minor-magic? > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 00:32:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA09869 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 00:32:41 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA09863 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 00:32:34 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id RAA28551; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:29:12 +1000 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:29:12 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508220729.RAA28551@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> You would need to have the vn device and various tools on the boot >> device. This is acceptable for demos and installations, but not so >> good for use. >But if the slab _is_ the boot device, how do we read the tools from it? With difficulty. Don't boot from it. >Hmm. I'd have hoped that the partition table could be patched after it >was read by the kernel, to avoid having to rewrite the MBR every time >you booted. (Or at least checking and stuffing the bogus slice back >in if something 'smart' had tried to remove it.) It would be relatively easy to check the partition once you have located it. You might be able to boot from the DOS file system, run some utilities, mount an mfs root and create vn devices on it, mount the vn file, and chroot() to a nicer file system. I don't want the utilities for this in the kernel. >Ahu - how do you get slices of a vn device? I presume it's just >minor-magic? First use the undocumented "labels" option to vnconfig to enable slices and labels. Then run fdisk to create slices and disklabel to create labels as usual. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 00:41:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA10509 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 00:41:07 -0700 Received: from puli.cisco.com (puli.cisco.com [171.69.1.174]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA10503 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 00:41:06 -0700 Received: (pst@localhost) by puli.cisco.com (8.6.8+c/8.6.5) id AAA08211; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 00:40:26 -0700 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 00:40:26 -0700 From: Paul Traina Message-Id: <199508220740.AAA08211@puli.cisco.com> To: tom@misery.sdf.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: asami@cs.berkeley.edu's message of 10 Aug 1995 17:58:41 PST Subject: Re: FreeBSD port of netatalk Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk * > If it's an add-on program, then yes, we can add it to our ports * > collection. Please send the patch (or the location where it can be * > ftp'd from) to "ports@freebsd.org", and someone will pick it up. * * Last I saw it was kernel code... I see. Never mind then, somebody who's a kernel guru should pick it up.... Send it to me, I've been thinking about doing a kernel port workup, and this is actually something useful for me, so it might just get done. Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 01:08:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA12416 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 01:08:45 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA12406 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 01:08:42 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id SAA26301; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:14:45 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508220844.SAA26301@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:14:45 +0930 (CST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508220729.RAA28551@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 05:29:12 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1211 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > >But if the slab _is_ the boot device, how do we read the tools from it? > > With difficulty. Don't boot from it. That more or less rules that approach out completely. We're trying to do an ersatz partition that can do everything a "real" partition does. That's going to have to include booting. > It would be relatively easy to check the partition once you have located > it. You might be able to boot from the DOS file system, run some > utilities, mount an mfs root and create vn devices on it, mount the vn > file, and chroot() to a nicer file system. I don't want the utilities > for this in the kernel. I can understand that. How would you feel about being able to recognise one of these ersatz partitions if the info were passed in to the kernel at bootstrap time? > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 02:39:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA16686 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 02:39:52 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA16676 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 02:39:47 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA01496; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:39:09 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:39:09 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Russell L. Carter" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CICA cry for help In-Reply-To: <199508210409.VAA18033@geli.clusternet> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Russell L. Carter wrote: > > |We have been "hanging in there" with Linux for a variety of reasons. > |However, we are reaching a point where the problem has become an acute > |nuisance and so have been giving serious consideration to switching OS's, > |e.g. FreeBSD. Muahahahahahaha..... Okay, everyone subscribe to comp.os.linux.networking and see what's up. :) I've replied to Eric in e-mail, inviting him to join -hackers if he needs to bounce some ideas around. Now would be a great time for all those admins of large FreeBSD sites to speak up! -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 02:42:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA16862 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 02:42:22 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA16852 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 02:41:57 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA01508; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:41:07 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:41:07 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Tom Samplonius cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Tom Samplonius wrote: > > Speaking of Windows and NFS, does anyone know of a good NFS client for > Windows? "Hey, huh uh uh... Beavis... huhuh, he said 'good' and 'Windows' in the same sentence, huhuhuh..." ;-) -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 02:53:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA17426 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 02:53:15 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA17420 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 02:53:10 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA01523; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:51:39 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:51:38 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Marketing opportunity... In-Reply-To: <199508211859.LAA02123@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > Would love to post this on comp.sys.intel with a subject heading: > Why FreeBSD? > > If people start questioning the net performance we can slam them > with the Network Computing review of FreeBSD NFS server vs NT's NFS server. > > Can I do that ? Go for it... I still have my numbers from NFS benchmarking and someone should try to quote hard numbers from the NC review. Let me know when you've reposted it so I can watch for it. Oh, maybe just crosspost to *.freebsd.misc then. Heck, maybe even to comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy if you want a juicy thread. ;-) -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 03:01:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA17828 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:01:47 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA17817 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:01:39 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA01546; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:01:10 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:01:09 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Terry Lambert cc: "Amancio Hasty Jr." , imp@village.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-Reply-To: <9508202009.AA23179@cs.weber.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > This is hardly what I'd call an equivalent to the Linux Publicity Project > Web page and real press releases really mailed to real press contacts. I think a good start would be to mail manufacturers of FreeBSD- supported hardware, telling them that their product works (and works well) on FreeBSD-based servers. > It brings up the point that the "Powered by FreeBSD" logo usage should > require notification of the URL to the "logo maintainers". I make that request on my Web page, but it's unenforceable. -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 03:02:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA17892 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:02:38 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA17876 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:02:09 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA01534; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:59:29 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:59:29 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , "Amancio Hasty Jr." , hackers@freebsd.org, www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > > go fro it! a .ine on the web pages ro even pointers to each > piecei ofart work would do well. the linux page has 'linux art' > availbale and i am envious.....this is all that i have ben able to > collect to date. Man, you either need to get your keyboard or your fingers fixed, Jon. ;-) I'm not a terribly artistic person (just know what buttons to push in PhotoShop :)), but Marshall was very receptive to my "bumper sticker" and my Web server badge when I mailed him the URL's for his inspection. As long as the appropriate credit is given, and the copyright stated, he won't have a problem with it. > the most recent one called 'bumper-sticker' really shoudl be made > into commerical bumper stickers. i got hre image from biran tao and he > got the daemon from mr. hosakawa (sp) derived from marshall of course I'm sure we could work something out, but I'm no legal expert on matters involving copyright art and derivative works... -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 03:08:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA18273 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:08:55 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA18267 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:08:47 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA01562; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:08:18 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:08:16 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Distributing Mosaic (and Motif)... In-Reply-To: <5033.808874065@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 19 Aug 1995, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > Opinions? It would be nice to ship with such functionality by default! Heck, if it's legal, there shouldn't be any doubts: include Mosaic on the CD-ROM! :) BTW, any news on Walnut Creek offering a bundled FreeBSD+Motif CD-ROM set? I remember you posted something about LaserMoon UK selling FreeBSD 2.0.5/2.1.0-compatible Motif, but you still have to buy that separately. -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 03:17:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA18919 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:17:03 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA18912 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:16:54 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA01577; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:16:29 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:16:28 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <199508202344.QAA11053@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > Curious then, where is the time being spend in the NFS code? > > Given that we can drive the ethernet at near capacity and that the > disks are very fast . It pretty much leads me to believe that > the NFS code or protocol is the bottle neck. Are you talking about the case of synchronous writes to a FreeBSD NFS server? I don't expect the bandwidth in the other cases to climb any higher (already in the 800K/sec to 900K/sec range over 10Mbps Ethernet). -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 03:34:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA19452 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:34:04 -0700 Received: from mail.rwth-aachen.de (mail.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.144.9]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA19446 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:33:57 -0700 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by mail.rwth-aachen.de (PMDF V4.3-10 #7297) id <01HUDGZLDT74007VSJ@mail.rwth-aachen.de>; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:33:55 +0100 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.8/8.6.9) id MAA29701 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:47:20 +0200 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:47:20 +0200 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Subject: anyone using Xinside server 1.2? To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Message-id: <199508221047.MAA29701@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm having a weird problem with Xinsides (excellent product BTW) server on a DX4/100 ASUS SP3G w/ an Elsa Winner 1000pro/PCI card. The server blocks somewhere and if I don't type anything at the keyboard it never shows up, i.e. leaves the screen black. When I type something it takes about 4 minutes to get into graphics mode and sometimes it takes another couple of minutes until it accepts mouse movement. Yes, it sounds strange. I tested the same board type (ELSA Winner 1000pro/PCI) in a ASUS P90 PCI (SiS) board and that server without problems. No problem with XFree86-3.1.2 OTOH, so far. I have the vague guess that it might be something with select(), syscons and/or pcibus. Anyone out there having the same hardware and could try this out? I would check with Xinside (Jeremy, are you listening) to send you a server for testing. --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 03:42:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA19659 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:42:14 -0700 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA19651 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:42:04 -0700 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id MAA15224 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:37:41 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199508221037.MAA15224@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:37:41 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <199508201813.UAA01188@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 20, 95 08:12:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1718 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Actually, i'd immediately kill the floppy controller if i would abort > a transfer in progress. The only means then would raise the reset > line of the FDC. It seems to me that it is the FDC controller the one who suffers from incomplete operations, not the DMA controller. > I'm not sure if setting some masking bit in one of the DMAC registers > will actually _abort_ a transfer. Van Gilluwe does only speak about > masking a request. The culprit is that DMA operation is usually > IO-controlled (via the TC signal) instead of being software- > controlled. Got a copy of "The Undocumented PC" (Van Gilluwe). The sample code on pg.855 does the following: 1) sets the mask bit for the channel; this disable servicing requests; 2) clears the LSB ff 3) writes into the mode register for the channel 4) programs the addr, count, etc. 5) clears the mask bit for the channel Step 1) should stop new requests to the DMA from being serviced; after step 4), any request will have go to the newly specified addresses (there must be no storage inside the DMA controller to hold the old address). I have no idea what use of the TC signal is made by my scanner's controller, but given that I do reset & reprogram it on close, the above sequence looks like what I wanted. Thanks everybody for their comments. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 03:54:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA20096 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:54:01 -0700 Received: from mail.rwth-aachen.de (mail.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.144.9]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA20090 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 03:53:58 -0700 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by mail.rwth-aachen.de (PMDF V4.3-10 #7297) id <01HUDHOOTRGG007U4S@mail.rwth-aachen.de>; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:54:09 +0100 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.8/8.6.9) id NAA29744 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:07:33 +0200 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:07:33 +0200 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Subject: nfs problem (UCX/VMS) To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Message-id: <199508221107.NAA29744@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm mounting a VMS system via UCX/NFS (ok, this always had been troublesome). mount castor:/2_dua3/export /u/vax I'm superuser at this moment, of course. I do a cd /u/vax vi somefile and get: vnode_pager_input: I/O read error vm_fault: pager input (probably hardware) error, PID 1791 failure pid 1791: vi: uid 0: exited on signal 11 then I do su someotheruser (which has the uid/gid set to the owner/group identical to that on the VMS side - this technique is a convenient method to solve potential access rights problems) and 'vi somefile' there is no problem. Even if the VMS/NFS product is not known to be one of the stablest at least on the FreeBSD side there shouldn't occur no core dump. --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 04:27:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA21177 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:27:32 -0700 Received: (from phk@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA21168 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:27:31 -0700 From: Poul-Henning Kamp Message-Id: <199508221127.EAA21168@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw (Brian Tao) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:27:31 -0700 (PDT) Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, hasty@rah.star-gate.com, imp@village.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Brian Tao" at Aug 22, 95 06:01:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 868 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > This is hardly what I'd call an equivalent to the Linux Publicity Project > > Web page and real press releases really mailed to real press contacts. > > I think a good start would be to mail manufacturers of FreeBSD- > supported hardware, telling them that their product works (and works > well) on FreeBSD-based servers. Including en the email, a URL for, and the permission to use a postscript file saying "The Daemon says OK" or something similar :-) Seriously, we should make a "Works with FreeBSD" logo people can put on their boxes. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Just that: dried leaves in boiling water ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 04:54:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA21797 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:54:46 -0700 Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.64.181]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA21791 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:54:43 -0700 Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.11/8.6.9) id EAA20365; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:54:19 -0700 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:54:19 -0700 Message-Id: <199508221154.EAA20365@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: ache@astral.msk.su CC: jkh@time.cdrom.com, peter@bonkers.taronga.com, hackers@freebsd.org, ports@freebsd.org In-reply-to: (ache@astral.msk.su) Subject: Re: Netscape and mime.types? From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk * >They assume you have a working metamail configuration already, and expect * >you to point the entry at the existing mime.types file. * * >Metamail is really kind of soggy and hard to light. * * We already have metamail port. Maybe netscape port should * EXEC_DEPEND on metamail port? Uhh, if it's only one file, I don't want to add a dependency. At any rate, the mailcap is now part of netscape, so I think it's ok.... Satoshi From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 05:16:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA22412 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:16:16 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA22406 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:16:12 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA01786; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:15:51 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:15:49 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, hasty@rah.star-gate.com, imp@village.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-Reply-To: <199508221127.EAA21168@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > Including en the email, a URL for, and the permission to use a > postscript file saying "The Daemon says OK" or something similar :-) Of course, we need this in GIF format too, for Web-savvy vendors on the net to place beside their product listings. > Seriously, we should make a "Works with FreeBSD" logo people can put > on their boxes. A shot of the daemon from the front with right arm on hip, left arm raised with fingers with an "OK" or thumbs-up signal and winking at the user. Encircle with the words "FreeBSD Ready!". :) -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 05:19:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA22573 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:19:10 -0700 Received: from mail.barrnet.net (mail.barrnet.net [131.119.246.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA22563 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:19:07 -0700 Received: from nietzsche (annex1s17.urc.tue.nl [131.155.12.27]) by mail.barrnet.net (8.6.10/MAIL-RELAY-LEN) with ESMTP id FAA02037 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:18:36 -0700 Received: from localhost (ns1.surfnet.nl [127.0.0.1]) by nietzsche (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA13390 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:14:01 +0200 Message-Id: <199508221214.OAA13390@nietzsche> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.1 5/23/95 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Can't connect to FreeBSD hosts Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:13:55 +0200 From: Marc van Kempen Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I have noticed something awkward. I can't connect to FreeBSD machines on the net. I have no problems reaching other hosts (via ppp), but all connections to FreeBSD machines seem to succeed, only to hang after the initial contact. telnet freebsd.first.gmd.de Trying 192.35.153.200... Connected to freebsd.first.gmd.de. Escape character is '^]'. and then it hangs until the other side times out the connection. http://www.freebsd.org Contacting host .... Host contacted, waiting for reply ... and then it hangs until ..... the same for ftp/telnet to rah.star-gate.com which I suspect is also a FreeBSD machine. It does succeed to wcarchive.cdrom.com and does not succeed to thud.freebsd.org Is there some known interaction between FreeBSD 2.0.5 (my machine) and other FreeBSD hosts? Presumably more current FreeBSD hosts? freebsd.first.gmd.de is 2.2-current, and I don't know about www.freebsd.org. Here's some info: netstat -r: nietzsche:/usr2/home/marc>netstat -r Routing tables Internet: Destination Gateway Flags Refs Use Netif Expire default annex1.urc.tue.nl UGc 4 0 tun0 localhost localhost UH 0 93 lo0 annex1.urc.tue.n annex1s17.urc.tue. UH 5 0 tun0 192.168.1 link#1 UC 0 0 nietzsche 0:0:c0:40:9c:56 UHLW 1 155 lo0 zola link#1 UHLW 2 2432 224 link#1 UCS 0 0 netstat -i: nietzsche:/usr2/home/marc>netstat -i Name Mtu Network Address Ipkts Ierrs Opkts Oerrs Coll ed0 1500 00.00.c0.40.9c.56 2474 1 3081 0 0 ed0 1500 192.168.1 nietzsche 2474 1 3081 0 0 lp0* 1500 0 0 0 0 0 lo0 16384 270 0 270 0 0 lo0 16384 your-net localhost 270 0 270 0 0 sl0* 552 0 0 0 0 0 tun0 1500 18154 0 20887 0 0 tun0 1500 131.155 annex1s17.urc.t 18154 0 20887 0 0 ifconfig tun0: nietzsche:/usr2/home/marc>/sbin/ifconfig tun0 tun0: flags=51 mtu 1500 inet 131.155.12.27 --> 131.155.12.10 netmask 0xffff0000 Does anyone have any hints for a solution to this anoying problem. Regards, Marc. ---------------------------------------------------- Marc van Kempen wmbfmk@urc.tue.nl He's dead Jim ..., kick him if you don't believe me. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 05:26:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA22847 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:26:38 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA22841 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:26:37 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id FAA04217; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:25:42 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id EAA00186; Fri, 12 Jan 1996 04:27:30 -0800 Message-Id: <199601121227.EAA00186@corbin.Root.COM> To: Marc van Kempen cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Can't connect to FreeBSD hosts In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:13:55 +0200." <199508221214.OAA13390@nietzsche> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 04:27:29 -0800 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >I have noticed something awkward. I can't connect to FreeBSD machines >on the net. I have no problems reaching other hosts (via ppp), but all >connections to FreeBSD machines seem to succeed, only to hang after >the initial contact. Try turning off tcp extensions. Look for the tcp_extensions variable in /etc/sysconfig and set it to "NO". -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 05:40:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA23303 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:40:44 -0700 Received: from haywire.DIALix.COM (haywire.DIALix.COM [192.203.228.65]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA23295 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:40:39 -0700 Received: (from news@localhost) by haywire.DIALix.COM (8.7.Beta.11/8.7.Beta.11/DIALix) id UAA02244 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:40:29 +0800 (WST) Received: from GATEWAY by haywire.DIALix.COM with netnews for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (problems to: usenet@haywire.dialix.com) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 22 Aug 1995 20:40:24 +0800 From: peter@haywire.dialix.com (Peter Wemm) Message-ID: <41cj7p$260$1@haywire.DIALix.COM> Organization: DIALix Services, Perth, Australia. References: <199508220158.SAA16492@pain.csrv.uidaho.edu> Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk fn@pain.csrv.uidaho.edu (Faried Nawaz) writes: >Ade Barkah wrote... > Hello, > > What exactly does it mean and do we need to be concerned about > this ? Seems like someone ran a probe on us or something. >they're probably running kerbIV. this message is probably generated >by a connection to the klogin (or eklogin) port. Doing a satan scan on a host causes this too... I think that's the most likely - somebody's probed you... -Peter From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 06:00:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA23968 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 06:00:20 -0700 Received: from eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (eikon.regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.42.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA23936 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 05:59:56 -0700 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.142.36]) by eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA09778; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:59:14 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA00437; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:36:27 +0200 Message-Id: <199508220936.LAA00437@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: "Michael C. Newell" , Brian Tao , Marty Leisner , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 17 Aug 1995 22:59:29 PDT." <23254.808725569@time.cdrom.com> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:36:27 +0200 From: "Julian Stacey " Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Kudos to Michael Reifenberger, by the way, who did exactly that and > got a multi-page article about FreeBSD 2.0 published in Germany's UNIX > Magazin. Which month Jordan or Michael ? I'll then grab a photocopy from friends who get this mag. (useful for when locals say to me their language equivalent of `So what's FreeBSD then' ) Julian --- Julian H. Stacey Email: jhs@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 06:04:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA24205 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 06:04:36 -0700 Received: from eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (eikon.regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.42.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA24144 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 06:03:57 -0700 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.142.36]) by eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA09752; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:57:58 +0200 Received: (from jhs@localhost) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA04772; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:53:52 +0200 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:53:52 +0200 From: Julian Howard Stacey Message-Id: <199508221253.OAA04772@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> To: hackers@freebsd.org cc: jhs@freebsd.org reply-to: jhs@freebsd.org Subject: Proposal to split hackers@ into 10 lists to reduce traffic. Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk There is far too much unsorted volume in the hackers@ mail list. I ask core to consider splitting up hackers@ into at least 5 to 10 interest groups. I suggest choosing a high enough number so that each hackers@ subscriber will readily be able to identify a few lists that do not interest him/her. That way each subscriber would get perhaps 20/30% less traffic, & freefall would send less traffic, & mail list latency would benefit. We could retain hackers as an aggregate read only list, for die hard ominivores who want to read everything. Articles posted would go to one of the 10 sub lists, not to the remnant pseudo hackers list itself. Suggestions for what Majordomo could list: code@ This list is to discuss CODE. Anyone posting here without exactly quoting at least one line of appropriate code from the latest release or snap, (or current in unusual circumstances) will be flamed to hell ! Exception will be allowed for bald statements like: `I have ftp'd foobar.tgz to freebsd.org:/pub/incoming' install@ discussion about the install mechanisms of releases etc, release engineering tools etc release@ discussion about release strategies, timing etc law@ Concerning copyrights, Licensing, Patents, FSF copy left viruses, USA crypt export bans etc. linux@ For all Linux Versus FreeBSD chat, hype, flames etc. advocacy@ For all the chat about how to promote FreeBSD, magazine articles, web sites, plush daemon toys, stickers etc, calls for volunteer effort to promote, etc. vendors@ Low traffic, for few subscribers. Not an advertisers soap box, but where those actually trying (or suceeding) to make a living selling FreeBSD related products, can exchange ideas. For CD-ROM manufacturers, Hardware vendors, & consultants trying to sell the FreeBSD system into new customers sites. People with `neat ideas' but no money or time to dedicate to implementing them, should Not post here (but can subscribe in read-only `lurker' mode). user-groups@ Appeals to start new geographic local user groups, etc. volunteers@ For all those seeking volunteers & offering to help on things. users@ the remnant of hackers traffic that doesnt fit above to be vigorously prunned into further lists as soon as hight traffic areas become apparent. hackers@ Aggregate read only list subscribed to all of above. Leave my CC on the header pleas: it's the last hackers@ thread I can afford time to follow; I'd only been off the net 24 hours, & had to load 1M of mail ! so I've just done echo "unsubscribe jhs hackers" | mail majordomo@freebsd.org If/when Core like approve & implement the idea of sub dividing hackers, I'll look forward to a rash of new lists on announce@freebsd.org, & will gladly subscribe some. If not, I'll miss some good hackers@ articles, but will read less & hope to be more productive :-) PS I have no intention of unsubscribing current@, ports@, [commiters], hardware, security, etc, it's just `hackers' I hope to see core prune. Julian --- Julian H. Stacey Email: jhs@freebsd.org Web: www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 06:56:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA26137 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 06:56:23 -0700 Received: from eldorado.net-tel.co.uk (eldorado.net-tel.co.uk [193.122.171.253]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA26124 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 06:56:05 -0700 From: FreeBSD@net-tel.co.uk Received: (from root@localhost) by eldorado.net-tel.co.uk (8.6.12/8.6.10) id OAA16135; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:55:11 +0100 X400-Received: by mta "eldorado" in "/PRMD=net-tel/ADMD=gold 400/C=gb/"; Relayed; Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:54:38 +0100 X400-Received: by mta "net-tel cambridge" in "/PRMD=net-tel/ADMD=gold 400/C=gb/"; Relayed; Tue, 22 Aug 95 13:54:36 +0000 X400-Received: by "/PRMD=Net-Tel/ADMD=Gold 400/C=GB/"; Relayed; Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:53:38 +0100 X400-MTS-Identifier: ["/PRMD=Net-Tel/ADMD=Gold 400/C=GB/";hst:24317-950822135338-5F1D] X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2) X400-Originator: FreeBSD@net-tel.co.uk Original-Encoded-Information-Types: IA5-Text X400-Recipients: non-disclosure:; Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:53:38 +0100 Content-Identifier: Re: Making a Fre Message-Id: <"hst:24317-950822135338-5F1D*/S=FreeBSD/O=NET-TEL Computer Systems Ltd/PRMD=Net-Tel/ADMD=Gold 400/C=GB/"@MHS> To: (Terry Lambert) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Reply-To: Andrew.Gordon@net-tel.co.uk Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Since I could have two clients, and the server crashed, then the state > has to be reinstantiated by both clients. > > Consider that if I have client 1 with a lock outstanding and client 2 > with a lock request outstanding and blocked on client 1's lock, if > client 2 begins crash recovery prior to client 1, it will assert its > outstanding lock request -- which the server will grant, not having > client 1's context to use as a wakeup address. Actually, the existing NFS lock protocol can handle this, provided that the implementor of the client lockd has thought about this combination. New lock requests are refused during the grace period immediately following reboot, allowing the clients notified by statd to get their old locks back in before any new locks are granted. To get it right in your example, client 2 has to regard the ountstanding-but-not-yet-granted lock as a different category from established locks - it does need to be reclaimed in response to the crash notification from the server, but should be retried as an ordinary lock request rather than a reclaim (and so will be bounced until the end of the grace period). From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 06:59:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA26304 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 06:59:02 -0700 Received: from mailhost.tue.nl (mailhost.tue.nl [131.155.2.5]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA26298 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 06:59:00 -0700 Received: from asterix.urc.tue.nl [131.155.5.10] by mailhost.tue.nl (8.6.10) id PAA15010 (SMTP). Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:57:50 +0200 Received: from wmbfmk@localhost by asterix.urc.tue.nl (950511.SGI.8.6.12.PATCH526) id NAA02239. Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:57:49 GMT From: Marc van Kempen Message-Id: <199508221357.NAA02239@asterix.urc.tue.nl> Subject: Re: Can't connect to FreeBSD hosts To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:57:48 +0200 (MDT) Cc: wmbfmk@urc.tue.nl, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199601121227.EAA00186@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Jan 12, 96 04:27:29 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 632 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > >I have noticed something awkward. I can't connect to FreeBSD machines > >on the net. I have no problems reaching other hosts (via ppp), but all > >connections to FreeBSD machines seem to succeed, only to hang after > >the initial contact. > > Try turning off tcp extensions. Look for the tcp_extensions variable in > /etc/sysconfig and set it to "NO". > Yes this works! ..... # # Some broken implementations can't handle the RFC 1323 and RFC 1644 # TCP options. If TCP connections randomly hang, try disabling this, # and bug the vendor of the losing equipment. # tcp_extensions=NO Now who should I bug?? :) Marc. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 07:15:24 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA27083 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 07:15:24 -0700 Received: from eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (eikon.regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.42.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA26891 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 07:09:59 -0700 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.142.36]) by eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA10710; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:06:40 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA07740; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:06:45 +0200 Message-Id: <199508221406.QAA07740@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD in a Windows World In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 20 Aug 1995 19:23:49 EDT." <199508202323.TAA05087@mail.htp.com> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:06:45 +0200 From: "Julian Stacey " Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > However Windows does ADD those services, just as they were added in UNIX. > Changing times require changes. not freebsd , suggest you find a newsgroup Julian S From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 07:39:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA28068 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 07:39:59 -0700 Received: from asstdc.scgt.oz.au (asstdc.scgt.oz.au [202.14.234.65]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA28059 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 07:39:47 -0700 Received: (from imb@localhost) by asstdc.scgt.oz.au (8.6.12/BSD4.4) id AAA21168; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:38:10 +1000 From: michael butler Message-Id: <199508221438.AAA21168@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:38:09 +1000 (EST) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net In-Reply-To: <9508220358.AA28423@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 21, 95 09:58:04 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24beta] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 473 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert writes: > This approach has the advantage of working for the existing partition > and slice handling, the vnconfig device, AND the exportation of a > contiguous chunk of disk as a device AND extended partitions, all > without ruining the distintions in the kernel that cause some of the > current install problems (ie: WD1007). Is there any mechanism by which it is possible to get FreeBSD (-current or otherwise) onto a WD1007 controlled drive ? michael From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 07:51:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA28684 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 07:51:38 -0700 Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA28674 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 07:51:34 -0700 Message-Id: <199508221451.HAA28674@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Marc van Kempen cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Can't connect to FreeBSD hosts In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:13:55 +0200." <199508221214.OAA13390@nietzsche> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 07:51:14 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >Hi, > >I have noticed something awkward. I can't connect to FreeBSD machines >on the net. I have no problems reaching other hosts (via ppp), but all >connections to FreeBSD machines seem to succeed, only to hang after >the initial contact. > Disable RFC1644 and RFC1323 negotiation. The pppd of your service provider can't handle it. From /etc/netstart: if [ -n "$tcp_extensions" -a "x$tcp_extensions" = "xNO" ] ; then sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.rfc1323=0 sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.rfc1644=0 fi You can just set the tcp_extensions sysconfig variable appropriately. > >Regards, > >Marc. >---------------------------------------------------- >Marc van Kempen wmbfmk@urc.tue.nl > >He's dead Jim ..., kick him if you don't believe me. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 07:57:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA29130 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 07:57:45 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA29095 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 07:57:28 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id KAA23168; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:57:46 -0400 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:57:46 -0400 Message-Id: <199508221457.KAA23168@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Brian Tao From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: >> >> This is hardly what I'd call an equivalent to the Linux Publicity Project >> Web page and real press releases really mailed to real press contacts. > > I think a good start would be to mail manufacturers of FreeBSD- >supported hardware, telling them that their product works (and works >well) on FreeBSD-based servers. > >> It brings up the point that the "Powered by FreeBSD" logo usage should >> require notification of the URL to the "logo maintainers". > > I make that request on my Web page, but it's unenforceable. "Powered by FreeBSD" does not imply approval, nor should it. You're talking about restricting "free" advertising. Its like saying that only skinny girls can where your tee shirts. The idea is to encourage expansion, not make it more work. Dennis From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 08:02:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA29447 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:02:44 -0700 Received: from Wit401402.student.utwente.nl (Wit401402.student.utwente.nl [130.89.236.162]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA29400 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:02:19 -0700 Received: (from alain@localhost) by Wit401402.student.utwente.nl (8.6.12/8.6.9) id RAA25949; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:01:29 +0200 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:01:29 +0200 (MET DST) From: Alain Kalker Reply-To: A.C.P.M.Kalker@student.utwente.nl To: Bruce Evans cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech In-Reply-To: <199508220451.OAA23697@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Bruce Evans wrote: > Anyway, it's inconvenient to have sliced floppies. Except when they keep pestering you with bad sectors... :-) Just joking... couldn't keep it in... Alain From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 08:03:24 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA29561 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:03:24 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA29521 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:03:08 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id KAA05794; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:57:30 -0400 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:57:28 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: dennis cc: Brian Tao , hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221457.KAA23168@mail.htp.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, dennis wrote: > > I make that request on my Web page, but it's unenforceable. > > "Powered by FreeBSD" does not imply approval, nor should it. You're talking > about restricting "free" advertising. Its like saying that only skinny girls > can where your tee shirts. The idea is to encourage expansion, not make it > more work. was there a discrimination against the Hooters restaraunt chain recently ?? Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 08:19:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA00583 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:19:15 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA00573 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:19:00 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id BAA13595; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:16:15 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:16:15 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508221516.BAA13595@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, jdli@linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >: -o async works better in -current. The fix was very small. > Do you mean the ASYNC_NFS_patch (newer patch, only patch v2 nfs) > on this mailing list ? No, I mean the fix for ufs in -current. > Since it only make v2 nfs async, how about v3 nfs ? > I can't do "mount -t nfs -o async" on my 2.2-current machine.... The fix that was sent to the mailing list isn't in -current. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 08:27:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA01045 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:27:43 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA01033 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:27:30 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id BAA13856; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:26:05 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:26:05 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508221526.BAA13856@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> >But if the slab _is_ the boot device, how do we read the tools from it? >> >> With difficulty. Don't boot from it. >That more or less rules that approach out completely. We're trying to >do an ersatz partition that can do everything a "real" partition does. >That's going to have to include booting. The standard boot loader isn't going to work on it unless it is partition (within another partition :-(). >> It would be relatively easy to check the partition once you have located >> it. You might be able to boot from the DOS file system, run some >I can understand that. How would you feel about being able to recognise >one of these ersatz partitions if the info were passed in to the kernel >at bootstrap time? The mount of root would probably fail if the partition was invalid. I guess you could put the partition boundaries in the data for the program replaces the standard boot loader. How are you going to select where to boot from? Standard boot managers should be able to handle the partition within a partition method (:-(). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 08:36:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA01428 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:36:55 -0700 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA01422 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:36:53 -0700 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA27053; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:35:37 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199508221535.IAA27053@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:35:36 -0700 (PDT) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221526.BAA13856@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 01:26:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1328 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > >> >But if the slab _is_ the boot device, how do we read the tools from it? > >> > >> With difficulty. Don't boot from it. > > >That more or less rules that approach out completely. We're trying to > >do an ersatz partition that can do everything a "real" partition does. > >That's going to have to include booting. > > The standard boot loader isn't going to work on it unless it is partition > (within another partition :-(). for a demo that doesn't matter because you would be booting from DOS anyhow.... just have a kernel that uses the dosfs code to find it's partition, instead of using the disklable code to do the same thing. > > >> It would be relatively easy to check the partition once you have located > >> it. You might be able to boot from the DOS file system, run some > > >I can understand that. How would you feel about being able to recognise > >one of these ersatz partitions if the info were passed in to the kernel > >at bootstrap time? > > The mount of root would probably fail if the partition was invalid. I > guess you could put the partition boundaries in the data for the program > replaces the standard boot loader. How are you going to select where > to boot from? Standard boot managers should be able to handle the > partition within a partition method (:-(). > > Bruce > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 08:38:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA01520 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:38:14 -0700 Received: from w8hd2.w8hd.org (w8hd2.w8hd.org [198.252.159.25]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA01514 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:38:12 -0700 Received: from moonpie.w8hd.org (moonpie.w8hd.org [198.252.159.11]) by w8hd2.w8hd.org (8.6.12/w8hd2) with SMTP id LAA00338 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:37:16 -0400 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:37:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Kim Culhan To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: dennis , Brian Tao , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > > "Powered by FreeBSD" does not imply approval, nor should it. You're talking > > about restricting "free" advertising. Its like saying that only skinny girls > > can where your tee shirts. The idea is to encourage expansion, not make it > > more work. > > was there a discrimination against the Hooters restaraunt chain > recently ?? Yeh and I think Hooters won.. kim -- kimc@w8hd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 08:46:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA01853 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:46:11 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA01846 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:46:03 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id LAA07065; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:40:31 -0400 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:40:28 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" To: hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk information week, a glossy management droid magazine, has an article entitled "Is Freeware Worth It?" in the august 14th issue. no mention of FreeBSD, but rather 4 variants of Linux. here are a couple qoutes (without my personal comments--great restaint exercised here) to give you all an idea of how these people think: [begin] [snip] "You get what you pay for," warns Scott Winkler, VP of operating systems with Gartner Group Inc., and information technology advisory firm in Stamford, Conn. Winkler call the freeware market "nerd central" and warns IS managers to proceed with caution. "That's not to say there isn't good stuff out there," he adds. "But the quality of the code is not the whole story. There are many software management approaches users can take to reduce costs. Going to freeware should not be one of them." [snip] ....What's more, patches and fixes generally can be found--sometimes in minutes--on Internet discussion groups that specialize in specific freeware programs. Says Campbell, "I can probably fix the problem much faster than if I were dealing with Microsoft, Borland, or Novell." [snip] ....Last year, when the Santa Cruz Operation raised the price of SCO Unix, the move caused barely a stir among the company's users. The reason: Because SCO's products were significantly cheaper than Novell's and Hewlett-Packard's, some technology managers had a hard time convincing management that the SCO products were on a par with those of other vendors. But at a higher price, SCO's product gained respect. [snip] [end] perhaps this is the attitude that dennis and others have been referring to--if i dont pay a lot, i dont get squat. (can we sell these people "Fresh Air" ?? ). without a high dollar price tag and an acceptable name, the just cant deal with it. so maybe FreeBSD needs a commercial variant--Elitix--for the elite business people who just have to have the pricy version. (and they let these people run companies and make decisions involving other people and large sums of money--bloody hell) we really need a FreeBSD-Venting mailing list. whos the damn postmaster anyway ? jmb Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 08:58:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA02734 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:58:55 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA02721 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:58:46 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA16785; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:58:32 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id RAA06016 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:58:31 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA11331 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:56:56 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508221556.RAA11331@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:56:55 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508220517.IAA01893@shadows.cs.hut.fi> from "Heikki Suonsivu" at Aug 22, 95 08:17:53 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 271 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Heikki Suonsivu wrote: > > It still could be fixed (-o async does not seem to do anything now). ``Fixed in -current.'' :) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 09:14:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA03289 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:14:13 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA03281 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:14:10 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id CAA27263; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:19:14 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508221649.CAA27263@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:18:07 +0930 (CST) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221526.BAA13856@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 01:26:05 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1618 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > >That more or less rules that approach out completely. We're trying to > >do an ersatz partition that can do everything a "real" partition does. > >That's going to have to include booting. > > The standard boot loader isn't going to work on it unless it is partition > (within another partition :-(). Fair enough. Under the circumstances, that shouldn't be too hard to manage. > >I can understand that. How would you feel about being able to recognise > >one of these ersatz partitions if the info were passed in to the kernel > >at bootstrap time? > > The mount of root would probably fail if the partition was invalid. I > guess you could put the partition boundaries in the data for the program > replaces the standard boot loader. How are you going to select where > to boot from? Standard boot managers should be able to handle the > partition within a partition method (:-(). I'm not sure I can parse that 8) The idea was to have some way of avoiding jamming a bogus partition entry into the partition table every time you wanted to boot. (due to issues with virus tools and the like.) Booting would probably be accomplished with fbsdboot under these circumstances. > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 09:43:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA03815 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:43:51 -0700 Received: from linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw (linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw [140.113.235.252]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA03808 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:43:46 -0700 Received: (from jdli@localhost) by linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw (8.6.9/8.6.9) id AAA26780; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:42:43 +0800 From: Chien-Ta Lee Message-Id: <199508221642.AAA26780@linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:42:42 +0800 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199508221516.BAA13595@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 01:16:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 447 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > >: -o async works better in -current. The fix was very small. > > > Do you mean the ASYNC_NFS_patch (newer patch, only patch v2 nfs) > > on this mailing list ? > > No, I mean the fix for ufs in -current. > Do you mean that "-o async" in current is really async now ? Thanks. -- §õ «Ø ¹F (Adonis) ¥æ€jžê€u Mail: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 09:48:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA03984 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:48:06 -0700 Received: from elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (elf.kendall.mdcc.edu [147.70.150.122]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA03978 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:48:04 -0700 Received: (from freelist@localhost) by elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA25918; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:39:23 -0400 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:39:21 -0400 (EDT) From: "Don's FList drop" To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: your mail In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Yep, saw this Inf.Week article and was thinking of commenting, glad you beat me to it. I think a letter needs to go to them, perferably from someone from the "steering team" commenting about the existance of FreeBSD, the concept of paying for software vs. support, the existance of consultants, what support you _actually_ get from Sun/Next/etc if you buy their unix, etc, etc. On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > information week, a glossy management droid magazine, has an article > entitled "Is Freeware Worth It?" in the august 14th issue. [snip snip] > "You get what you pay for," warns Scott Winkler, VP of operating > systems with Gartner Group Inc., and information technology advisory firm > in Stamford, Conn. This, to me, just illustrates that people who OUGHT to know better are unable to differentiate between what they pay for in a product as far as product vs. product-bundled-support. It's the reason why WordPerfect shrinkwrapped at CompUSA costs more than a bundle of 10 which costs more than the educational no-support pack you can buy - you're not buying just a disk and a manual, you're also buying some support as well, and there's no reason why you can't factor that cost into the cost of "freeware" as well. > so maybe FreeBSD needs a commercial variant--Elitix--for the > elite business people who just have to have the pricy version. (and > they let these people run companies and make decisions involving other > people and large sums of money--bloody hell) No, we need a few value-added resellers who provide support and coordination that the organizations can't do for themselves, similar to the Caldera option. Or at least a more visible inclusion of "People You Can Pay For Help With FreeBSD" with the distributions. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 09:57:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA04256 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:57:15 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA04245 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:56:55 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA18778; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:56:12 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id SAA07010 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:56:12 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA11728 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:42:02 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508221642.SAA11728@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:42:02 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221037.MAA15224@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Aug 22, 95 12:37:41 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1711 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > Actually, i'd immediately kill the floppy controller if i would abort > > a transfer in progress. The only means then would raise the reset > > line of the FDC. > > It seems to me that it is the FDC controller the one who suffers > from incomplete operations, not the DMA controller. Yes, but that's why i didn't even have to think about aborting the DMA xfer. > Got a copy of "The Undocumented PC" (Van Gilluwe). The sample code on > pg.855 does the following: > > 1) sets the mask bit for the channel; this disable servicing requests; > 2) clears the LSB ff > 3) writes into the mode register for the channel > 4) programs the addr, count, etc. > 5) clears the mask bit for the channel ... > I have no idea what use of the TC signal is made by my scanner's > controller, but given that I do reset & reprogram it on close, the > above sequence looks like what I wanted. The mode byte in his example was: ``single mode, increment, no autoinit, read, channel 5''. Yes, as long as `single mode' is appropriate for you, there's no need to worry about TC. TC is intented for continuous mode. Well, i've just noticed that the PC DMAC cannot even generate an interrupt when ready... hmm, go figure, the Z80 DMAC did it. :) And yes, for `single mode', the masking trick will do it. The peripheral device will issue a DRQ signal for each transfered byte/word, and masking would prevent the DMAC from accepting new DRQs for this channel. Aborting a continuous mode transfer would not be so easy (or even impossible at all). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 09:57:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA04294 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:57:26 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA04246 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 09:56:55 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA18782; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:56:13 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id SAA07011 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:56:13 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA11889 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:53:02 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508221653.SAA11889@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Why Linux? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:53:02 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508220936.LAA00437@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> from "Julian Stacey" at Aug 22, 95 11:36:27 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 425 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Julian Stacey wrote: > > > > Kudos to Michael Reifenberger, by the way, who did exactly that and > > got a multi-page article about FreeBSD 2.0 published in Germany's UNIX > > Magazin. > > Which month Jordan or Michael ? A while ago. I think at the beginning of the year. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 10:05:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA04603 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:05:46 -0700 Received: from elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (elf.kendall.mdcc.edu [147.70.150.122]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA04596 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:05:43 -0700 Received: (from freelist@localhost) by elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA25997; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:57:06 -0400 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:57:04 -0400 (EDT) From: "Don's FList drop" To: Charles Henrich cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netsite communications server works Great In-Reply-To: <199508161618.MAA04213@crh.cl.msu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 16 Aug 1995, Charles Henrich wrote: > FYI: I just installed the BSDI version of the netscape communications server, > works straight out of the box. So does commerce server, by the way. Bang, it went up and ran, no problems. And on an 8M machine with several other memory hogs going as well, no less. Haven't put some large content pages up and tested multiple concurrents yet, though - dunno how bad the throughput will be. (Irrelevant anyways, the 8M is just till the bad simm is replaced in a week or so...) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 10:08:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA04756 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:08:37 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA04749 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:08:32 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA19296; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:08:16 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA07637 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:08:16 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA12157 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:06:33 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508221706.TAA12157@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: your mail To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:06:32 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Don's FList drop" at Aug 22, 95 12:39:21 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 660 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Don's FList drop wrote: > > > I think a letter needs to go to them, perferably from someone from the > "steering team" commenting about the existance of FreeBSD, the concept of > paying for software vs. support, the existance of consultants, what > support you _actually_ get from Sun/Next/etc if you buy their unix, etc, etc. I could easily contribute a horror-story for Silicon Graphics. >:-) I would grant them the ``Fastest time to produce a kernel core dump'' award... 4 cores within ten minutes. :-> -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 10:11:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA04921 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:11:30 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA04911 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:11:20 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA19365; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:11:05 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA07681 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:11:05 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA12211 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:08:00 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508221708.TAA12211@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:07:59 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199508221642.AAA26780@linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw> from "Chien-Ta Lee" at Aug 23, 95 00:42:42 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 410 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk As Chien-Ta Lee wrote: > > Do you mean that "-o async" in current is really async now ? davidg 95/08/16 06:17:01 Modified: sys/ufs/ffs ffs_inode.c Log: Honor -async mount option when doing the inode update. Obtained from: 4.4BSD-Lite2 -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 10:22:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA05272 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:22:37 -0700 Received: from server.netcraft.co.uk (server.netcraft.co.uk [194.72.238.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA05266 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:22:35 -0700 Received: (from paul@localhost) by server.netcraft.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA09758; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:20:45 +0100 From: Paul Richards Message-Id: <199508221720.SAA09758@server.netcraft.co.uk> Subject: Re: your mail To: jmb@kryten.Atinc.COM (Jonathan M. Bresler) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:20:45 +0100 (BST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Aug 22, 95 11:40:28 am Reply-to: paul@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1040 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In reply to Jonathan M. Bresler who said > > [snip] > > ....Last year, when the Santa Cruz Operation raised the price of SCO > Unix, the move caused barely a stir among the company's users. The > reason: Because SCO's products were significantly cheaper than Novell's > and Hewlett-Packard's, some technology managers had a hard time > convincing management that the SCO products were on a par with those of > other vendors. But at a higher price, SCO's product gained respect. > > [snip] > [end] > > > perhaps this is the attitude that dennis and others have been > referring to--if i dont pay a lot, i dont get squat. (can we sell these > people "Fresh Air" ?? ). without a high dollar price tag and an > acceptable name, the just cant deal with it. > BSDI used exactly the same argument when they bumped their prices recently. -- Paul Richards, Bluebird Computer Systems. FreeBSD core team member. Internet: paul@FreeBSD.org, http://www.freebsd.org/~paul Phone: 0370 462071 (Mobile), +44 1222 457651 (home) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 10:36:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA05834 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:36:07 -0700 Received: from miller.cs.uwm.edu (miller.cs.uwm.edu [129.89.35.13]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA05824 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:36:04 -0700 Received: (from james@localhost) by miller.cs.uwm.edu (8.6.10/8.6.10) id MAA18144 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:36:03 -0500 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:36:03 -0500 From: Jim Lowe Message-Id: <199508221736.MAA18144@miller.cs.uwm.edu> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Samba Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Has anyone ported Samba to FreeBSD yet? For more information the URL is: http://lake.canberra.edu.au/pub/samba/samba.html -Jim From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 10:40:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA06091 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:40:26 -0700 Received: from strider.ibenet.it ([194.179.130.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA06039 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:39:56 -0700 Received: (from piero@localhost) by strider.ibenet.it (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA06947; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:42:58 +0200 From: Piero Serini Message-Id: <199508221742.TAA06947@strider.ibenet.it> Subject: Re: Proposal to split hackers@ into 10 lists to reduce traffic. To: jhs@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:42:58 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221253.OAA04772@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> from "Julian Howard Stacey" at Aug 22, 95 02:53:52 pm Reply-To: Piero@strider.ibenet.it Operating-System: FreeBSD 1.1.5.1 X-Phone-Number: +39 (2) 58113562 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 529 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello. Quoting from Julian Howard Stacey (Tue Aug 22 14:53:52 1995): > There is far too much unsorted volume in the hackers@ mail list. Definetely. > I ask core to consider splitting up hackers@ into at least 5 to 10 interest > groups. ... > Suggestions for what Majordomo could list: ... PLEASE, DO! Bye, -- # $Id: .signature,v 1.12 1995/08/14 12:10:54 piero Exp $ Piero Serini Via Giambologna, 1 I 20136 Milano - ITALY From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 10:42:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA06189 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:42:52 -0700 Received: from palmer.demon.co.uk (palmer.demon.co.uk [158.152.50.150]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA06183 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:42:48 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by palmer.demon.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id SAA07756 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:42:37 +0100 X-Message: This is a dial-up site. Quick responses to e-mails should not be relied upon. Thanks! To: hackers@freebsd.org, Joerg Wunsch Subject: Re: Why Linux? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:53:02 +0200." <199508221653.SAA11889@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:42:36 +0100 Message-ID: <7754.809113356@palmer.demon.co.uk> From: Gary Palmer Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508221653.SAA11889@uriah.heep.sax.de>, J Wunsch writes: >As Julian Stacey wrote: >> Which month Jordan or Michael ? >A while ago. I think at the beginning of the year. It came out at the start of CEBIT, so that makes it March time I think? Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 10:50:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA06489 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:50:56 -0700 Received: from palmer.demon.co.uk (palmer.demon.co.uk [158.152.50.150]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA06460 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:50:15 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by palmer.demon.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id SAA07786 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:49:37 +0100 X-Message: This is a dial-up site. Quick responses to e-mails should not be relied upon. Thanks! To: Jim Lowe cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Samba In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:36:03 CDT." <199508221736.MAA18144@miller.cs.uwm.edu> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:49:36 +0100 Message-ID: <7784.809113776@palmer.demon.co.uk> From: Gary Palmer Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508221736.MAA18144@miller.cs.uwm.edu>, Jim Lowe writes: >Has anyone ported Samba to FreeBSD yet? For more information the >URL is: > http://lake.canberra.edu.au/pub/samba/samba.html AGES ago :-) Acording to the makefile, I did it in February! ftp://ftp.FreeBSD.ORG/pub/FreeBSD/ports/net/samba.tar.gz ... Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 10:59:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA06873 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:59:30 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA06863 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:59:26 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA20753; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:59:18 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA08243; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:59:18 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA12751; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:58:46 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508221758.TAA12751@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Samba To: james@miller.cs.uwm.edu (Jim Lowe) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:58:46 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221736.MAA18144@miller.cs.uwm.edu> from "Jim Lowe" at Aug 22, 95 12:36:03 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 345 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Jim Lowe wrote: > > > Has anyone ported Samba to FreeBSD yet? For more information the > URL is: > http://lake.canberra.edu.au/pub/samba/samba.html Does the version in ports not work for you? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 11:05:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA07301 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:05:41 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA07295 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:05:40 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA00928; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:05:04 -0700 Message-Id: <199508221805.LAA00928@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Brian Tao cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:16:28 +0800." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:05:04 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Brian Tao said: > On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > > > Curious then, where is the time being spend in the NFS code? > > > > Given that we can drive the ethernet at near capacity and that the > > disks are very fast . It pretty much leads me to believe that > > the NFS code or protocol is the bottle neck. > > Are you talking about the case of synchronous writes to a FreeBSD > NFS server? I don't expect the bandwidth in the other cases to climb > any higher (already in the 800K/sec to 900K/sec range over 10Mbps > Ethernet). Should be interesting to find out the NFS performance numbers with your configuration using fast ethernet. If they are very high, I suggest sending the performance figures to Networking Computing 8) Cheers, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 11:15:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA07753 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:15:18 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA07747 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:15:16 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id OAA24749; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:15:41 -0400 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:15:41 -0400 Message-Id: <199508221815.OAA24749@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Kim Culhan From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > >> > "Powered by FreeBSD" does not imply approval, nor should it. You're talking >> > about restricting "free" advertising. Its like saying that only skinny girls >> > can where your tee shirts. The idea is to encourage expansion, not make it >> > more work. >> >> was there a discrimination against the Hooters restaraunt chain >> recently ?? > >Yeh and I think Hooters won.. > This is different, because you have a finite number of people working in your restaurant, and you can argue that it "marketing", just like the "ladies night" issue a few years ago. But requiring authorization to use something that is designed to increase visibility will only lead to fewer people using it, and therefore less visibility. db From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 11:15:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA07805 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:15:56 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA07796 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:15:44 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA00955; Tue, 22 Aug 95 12:15:55 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508221815.AA00955@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: hsu@cs.hut.fi (Heikki Suonsivu) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 12:15:54 MDT Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508220517.IAA01893@shadows.cs.hut.fi> from "Heikki Suonsivu" at Aug 22, 95 08:17:53 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Correct my previous post to say "don't enable async writes, ever, it's > not worth it (unless you have a UPS on your server). > > It still could be fixed (-o async does not seem to do anything now). It is > somewhat annoying to, say, copy a news file system to another disk. I > couldn't care less if I would have to newfs the whole target in case of > panic or power hick-up during the copy. Different "async". The "-o async" makes metadata writes occur asynchronously instead of in compliance with POSIX semantics. The NFS async option, if implemented on a per FS basis, causes the server to return "write complete" to the client so that the top level caller's 'write(2)' call returns sooner. Even though in doing that, it risks data integrity. Or more simply: -o async Risk referential integrity NFS_ASYNC Risk data integrity To fix this, I think you'd need to implement VOP_SYNC in an NFS using the NFS_ASYNC to go out to the server and ensure pending writes have all completed. Since it's impossible for the writes to have *not* completed in a strictly conforming implementation, this is a near impossibility. That doesn't mean that it wouldn't be useful in copying large volumes of data -- we are talking 6-7 times the write speed. Just you'd need to then go to the local system that's exporting the volume and do your sync there. The same effect can be had by writing the file using a 'team' or 'ddd' multiple writer approach, without using async. The point, after all, is to interleave the I/O. NFS_ASYNC just does the interleaving in the NFS implementation rather than user space. Really, a threaded libc would have exactly the same effect on ALL I/O instead of just NFS I/O. Spawn a thread per write request up to some limit on thread-count, and do itc (inter thread communication) ala team or ddd to order the writes, and voila. One thread environment for implementing this would be the Sun LWP environment -- which is implemented using async I/O. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 11:17:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA07910 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:17:32 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA07903 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:17:28 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id EAA18331; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 04:14:01 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 04:14:01 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508221814.EAA18331@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: imb@scgt.oz.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Is there any mechanism by which it is possible to get FreeBSD (-current or >otherwise) onto a WD1007 controlled drive ? It should work to just enable translation in the controller. There are certainly some jumper settings that work. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 11:19:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA08027 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:19:00 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA08013 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:18:57 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA00971; Tue, 22 Aug 95 12:20:15 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508221820.AA00971@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 12:20:15 MDT Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508220527.PAA24762@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 03:27:28 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >> very slow (even if the DOS file is contiguous, msdosfs doesn't support > >> clustering so it would do i/o's in too-small sizes). > > >DOS file system's speed is something we cannot do much about, remember the > >goal of an UMSDOS clone... It is not to have it as a primary FS, just > > I meant that the msdsofs implementation doesn't support clustering. This > is because it was implemented before clustering existed and hasn't been > maintained very well. It can probably be speeded up by another large > factor using better caching. And another by write-through caching the entire FAT (it's not that big). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 11:34:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA08897 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:34:19 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA08891 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:34:18 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01041; Tue, 22 Aug 95 12:32:39 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508221832.AA01041@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 12:32:38 MDT Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508220729.RAA28551@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 22, 95 05:29:12 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >Hmm. I'd have hoped that the partition table could be patched after it > >was read by the kernel, to avoid having to rewrite the MBR every time > >you booted. (Or at least checking and stuffing the bogus slice back > >in if something 'smart' had tried to remove it.) > > It would be relatively easy to check the partition once you have located > it. You might be able to boot from the DOS file system, run some > utilities, mount an mfs root and create vn devices on it, mount the vn > file, and chroot() to a nicer file system. I don't want the utilities > for this in the kernel. Why not just modify a DOS runnable boot program to know how to look there? The problem is that the partition offset would have to be passed to the kernel, or some of the other changes we've been talking about done to the kernel device code, plus an additional intermediate driver to find the slab as a logical physical device. Adding that to the default kernel would probably not be worth it unless you were very clever about implementation, but for a "testdrive" kernel it would be no big deal. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 11:40:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA09241 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:40:11 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA09235 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:40:09 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01109; Tue, 22 Aug 95 12:38:49 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508221838.AA01109@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 12:38:48 MDT Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508220656.QAA25934@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Aug 22, 95 04:26:25 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Terry Lambert stands accused of saying: > > Probably your pseudo-device needs to: > > > > 1) Look up the file > > 2) Assert a mandatory file lock > > Instructions on this one would be needed 8) Open it O_EXCL in the device node exporting code. > > 3) Verify that the file is in fact contiguous > > 4) Export as device node that is an alias for the device node > > the file system is actually on, with the addition of a sector > > bias and a length (both derived from the underlying file system). > > > > This could probably be rolled into vnconfig, but implies a logical to > > Not for the desired purpose, see my recent posts on this thread. It still could. You'd have to boot to an MFS first, which would up by 3M the kernel size, but you could do it. > > physical address translation is possible (you might have to add one > > as a file system specific ioctl()), and a contiguity check is also > > possible (perhaps by traversing the block offsets linearly by using > > an additional "offset" argument to the ioctl() above, or with the > > addition of another ioctl()). Then you'd flag the vnconfig'ed device > > for physical rather than logical I/O. > > Checking for contiguity is relatively trivial given the nature of the > FAT filesystem; all this sort of 'health checking' can be easily > included in the "do we accept this slab" tests. I think you missed my point: There needs to be a file system independent way of checking contiguity in order to make the same shortcut possible on HPFS and NTFS (to name two). Or ext2fs, to name three. 8-). > The issues that I can't resolve at this point are : > > 1) Keeping everyone else's grubby mitts off the file. > 2) Exporting a device/devices that represent the filesystem(s) inside > the slab. Ah. The device exporting code is the rub. We need a generic device registration mechanism. Though I keep yelling "devfs", which would imply that some mechanism like that existed, really the mechanism can exist before the devfs to export the device nodes from the exported devices list (cdevsw/bdevsw) into a file system namespace. Though I think that's the most trivial part of a devfs to implement. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 11:40:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA09294 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:40:46 -0700 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA09288 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:40:45 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with ESMTP id LAA19005 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:40:27 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id OAA24912; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:39:57 -0400 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:39:57 -0400 Message-Id: <199508221839.OAA24912@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: paul@FreeBSD.ORG From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: SCO and high prices Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >In reply to Jonathan M. Bresler who said >> >> [snip] >> >> ....Last year, when the Santa Cruz Operation raised the price of SCO >> Unix, the move caused barely a stir among the company's users. The >> reason: Because SCO's products were significantly cheaper than Novell's >> and Hewlett-Packard's, some technology managers had a hard time >> convincing management that the SCO products were on a par with those of >> other vendors. But at a higher price, SCO's product gained respect. >> >> [snip] >> [end] >> >> >> perhaps this is the attitude that dennis and others have been >> referring to--if i dont pay a lot, i dont get squat. (can we sell these >> people "Fresh Air" ?? ). without a high dollar price tag and an >> acceptable name, the just cant deal with it. >> > First of all, this is NOT the attitude of Dennis. Dennis has to earn a living. Dennis is just doing his job. Often you get what you pay for, but it USUALLY true that you get more when you pay something. I think that your analysis of the above, as well as the author's, is clearly wrong. SCOs customers didn't wince when they raised their prices because most of their BIG customer are under contract and the rest of them are so rich it doesn't matter. SCO doesn't participate in the low end market, so you can't compare them to FreeBSD or anything similar. Most large corps don't like freeware because they can't get anything in writing regarding continuity or ownership. When I was at NYNEX the auditors would come in and ask us for receipts. Anything we didn't have receipts for, they'd say to delete it. "But I'm a Programmer", I'd tell them, "I wrote this stuff". The auditors, or course, would have none of it. >BSDI used exactly the same argument when they bumped their prices >recently. > BSDI's problem is that they're trying to set up distribution, and distributors want deep discounts so they can make a profit. And as they say, 50% of nothing is nothing. Frankly I think they're making a mistake because they don't have a general purpose product. Dennis From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 11:52:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA09773 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:52:27 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA09767 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:52:23 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id EAA19165; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 04:51:24 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 04:51:24 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508221851.EAA19165@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> The mount of root would probably fail if the partition was invalid. I >> guess you could put the partition boundaries in the data for the program >> replaces the standard boot loader. How are you going to select where >> to boot from? Standard boot managers should be able to handle the >> partition within a partition method (:-(). >I'm not sure I can parse that 8) The idea was to have some way of >avoiding jamming a bogus partition entry into the partition table >every time you wanted to boot. (due to issues with virus tools and the >like.) >Booting would probably be accomplished with fbsdboot under these >circumstances. If you are booting with fbsdboot then you must be running DOS so you can run utilities under DOS to find where the image file is and write the offset and size somewhere. You could even write them to the partition table after checking that this is safe. Restoring the original partition table is harder. It could be done by running fdisk after booting FreeBSD. If you don't write to the partition table then you will have to pass the offset and size through fbsdboot to the kernel and modify the kernel to add an entry to the slice table. But this seems harder than using my previous suggestion: 1. Boot with an msdosfs, cd9660 or ufs-on-cdrom root. 2. Create the necessary device files if they can't already exist. It is probably best to wait for devfs to give device files with an msdosfs root. 3. Run utilities to find image offset and size; use new ioctl to put this in slice table. 4. Mount the slice and chroot() to make it the root file syste, Does fbsdboot run under Win95? Under OS/2? Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:02:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA10060 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:02:18 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA10054 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:02:14 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id FAA19377; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:01:59 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:01:59 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508221901.FAA19377@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, jdli@linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >> No, I mean the fix for ufs in -current. >> > Do you mean that "-o async" in current is really async now ? The commit mail said exactly what was fixed: "Honor -async mount option when doing the inode update." The -async mount option still isn't honored for directory updates. For creat() there used to be 2 sync writes, one for the inode and one for the directory. Now there is one sync write for the directory, so creat() is about twice as fast with "-o async" as before. The other times in my benchmarks show that it is still about 4 times slower under FreeBSD-2.2-current than it would be if all writes were asynchronous. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:06:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA10384 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:06:22 -0700 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA10375 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:06:21 -0700 Received: from gvr.win.tue.nl (gvr.win.tue.nl [131.155.210.19]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA19128 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:05:56 -0700 Received: by gvr.win.tue.nl (8.6.10/1.53) id VAA00693; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:03:50 +0200 From: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Message-Id: <199508221903.VAA00693@gvr.win.tue.nl> Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND To: imp@village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:03:49 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: peter@haywire.dialix.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199508220328.VAA08415@rover.village.org> from "Warner Losh" at Aug 21, 95 09:28:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 779 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > But does it have the ability to drop IP framgent that would overwrite > the IP and TCP headers and thus allow traffic through that would > otherwise be denied? A popluar recent attack is to have an acceptible > IP packet fragment go through the firewall, then to send an IP > fragment that had an offset of 1 or 4 and overwrite the "OK" header > with "Evil" headers that would otherwise be blocked. ip_fil does do > that, and as far as the author and our local security expert know, is > the only one to do so other than recent Cisco releases. > > Not to say that screend is bad, or anything like that. Just curious > as to what is the state of the art. Just throw away *every* fragment that has as its start byte a byte in the TCP/IP header. (so smaller then 40) -Guido From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:07:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA10498 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:07:48 -0700 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA10490 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:07:41 -0700 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA12093 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:06:39 +0400 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Tue, 22 Aug 95 23:06:38 +0400 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id WAA00163; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:54:05 +0400 To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" , Scott Mace Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, Julian Elischer References: In-Reply-To: ; from "Jonathan M. Bresler" at Mon, 21 Aug 1995 19:44:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:54:04 +0400 (MSD) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.40 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: equal cost ip forwarding Lines: 24 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1036 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message Jonathan M. Bresler writes: >2) Keepalive protocol are realised. It checks if any packets are received >from this line, and drop connection (and reestablish it) if no this packets >was received during defined time. In addition, driver can be configured >to wait few packets from the line before interface would be turned on. >Driver can send dummy _keep alive_ packets every N seconds to >keep line _alive_ even if no routing / icmp packets are transmitted >between systems. We already have that. >3) Driver fixes interface numbers for every line, to prevent >routing problems (most routers dislike if some interface change it's >addresses fast). We already have that. -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:11:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA10933 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:11:33 -0700 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA10783 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:10:19 -0700 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA12098 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:06:41 +0400 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Tue, 22 Aug 95 23:06:39 +0400 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id WAA00147; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:48:44 +0400 To: Satoshi Asami Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, peter@bonkers.taronga.com, ports@freebsd.org References: <199508221154.EAA20365@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> In-Reply-To: <199508221154.EAA20365@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU>; from Satoshi Asami at Tue, 22 Aug 1995 04:54:19 -0700 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:48:44 +0400 (MSD) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.40 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Netscape and mime.types? Lines: 23 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 965 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508221154.EAA20365@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> Satoshi Asami writes: > * >They assume you have a working metamail configuration already, and expect > * >you to point the entry at the existing mime.types file. > * > * >Metamail is really kind of soggy and hard to light. > * > * We already have metamail port. Maybe netscape port should > * EXEC_DEPEND on metamail port? >Uhh, if it's only one file, I don't want to add a dependency. At any >rate, the mailcap is now part of netscape, so I think it's ok.... BTW, I saw _two_ files in somebody mail: mime.types and mailcap. I saw commit addition of only _one_ file (mailcap?). Maybe I miss something? -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:15:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA11166 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:15:39 -0700 Received: from crash.ops.neosoft.com (crash.ops.NeoSoft.COM [198.64.212.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA11160 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:15:37 -0700 Received: (from smace@localhost) by crash.ops.neosoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.10) id OAA03700; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:12:58 -0500 From: Scott Mace Message-Id: <199508221912.OAA03700@crash.ops.neosoft.com> Subject: Re: equal cost ip forwarding To: ache@astral.msk.su (=?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?=) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:12:57 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "=?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?=" at Aug 22, 95 10:54:04 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 289 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk What I'm talking about is something like this: you have two "interfaces ethernet, fddi or whatever" and they both go to the same place, and you want to load balanced over the 2. This is supported by cornell's gated (RT_N_MULTIPATH) depending on what routing protocol you use. Scott From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:18:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA11431 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:18:14 -0700 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA11425 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:18:13 -0700 Received: from gvr.win.tue.nl (gvr.win.tue.nl [131.155.210.19]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA19215 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:17:53 -0700 Received: by gvr.win.tue.nl (8.6.10/1.53) id VAA00780; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:16:26 +0200 From: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Message-Id: <199508221916.VAA00780@gvr.win.tue.nl> Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port To: mbarkah@hemi.com (Ade Barkah) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:16:25 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508211957.NAA07189@hemi.com> from "Ade Barkah" at Aug 21, 95 01:57:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 683 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Ade Barkah wrote: > > Hello, > > One of our FreeBSD 2.0.5 machines showed the following within > the console messages: > > (date) (time) (hostname) rlogin [3643]: usage rlogind [-aln] > (date) (time) (hostname) rlogin [3643]: Connection from 128.x.x.x > on illegal port > > What exactly does it mean and do we need to be concerned about > this ? Seems like someone ran a probe on us or something. rlogin connections should come from privileged ports. This connection came from an unpriv'ed one.. So I guess someone probed you. The first message probably means your entry for rlogind in etc/inetd.conf conatins an invalid switch. -Guido From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:19:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA11550 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:19:48 -0700 Received: from palmer.demon.co.uk (palmer.demon.co.uk [158.152.50.150]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA11541 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:19:36 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by palmer.demon.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id UAA08298 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:17:00 +0100 X-Message: This is a dial-up site. Quick responses to e-mails should not be relied upon. Thanks! To: Guido van Rooij cc: Warner Losh , peter@haywire.dialix.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:03:49 +0200." <199508221903.VAA00693@gvr.win.tue.nl> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:16:58 +0100 Message-ID: <8296.809119018@palmer.demon.co.uk> From: Gary Palmer Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508221903.VAA00693@gvr.win.tue.nl>, Guido van Rooij writes: >Just throw away *every* fragment that has as its start byte a byte in >the TCP/IP header. (so smaller then 40) That'd be my opinion as well. Is there any DOCUMENTED & VALID reason for having a fragment start with a byte offset into the header? Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:19:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA11571 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:19:51 -0700 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA11544 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:19:47 -0700 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA07320; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:18:11 -0700 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199508221918.MAA07320@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: Can't connect to FreeBSD hosts To: gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.org (Justin T. Gibbs) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:18:10 -0700 (PDT) Cc: wmbfmk@urc.tue.nl, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221451.HAA28674@freefall.FreeBSD.org> from "Justin T. Gibbs" at Aug 22, 95 07:51:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 987 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > > >Hi, > > > >I have noticed something awkward. I can't connect to FreeBSD machines > >on the net. I have no problems reaching other hosts (via ppp), but all > >connections to FreeBSD machines seem to succeed, only to hang after > >the initial contact. > > > > Disable RFC1644 and RFC1323 negotiation. The pppd of your service > provider can't handle it. From /etc/netstart: > > if [ -n "$tcp_extensions" -a "x$tcp_extensions" = "xNO" ] ; then > sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.rfc1323=0 > sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.rfc1644=0 > fi > > You can just set the tcp_extensions sysconfig variable appropriately. Well, this has become the FAQ of the week for too many weeks, I think we need to change the default on tcp_extentions to ``NO'' in /etc/sysconfig as shipped. Those who want these can turn them on. Opinions? -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:25:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA12128 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:25:46 -0700 Received: from gvr.win.tue.nl (gvr.win.tue.nl [131.155.210.19]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA12122 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:25:35 -0700 Received: by gvr.win.tue.nl (8.6.10/1.53) id VAA00855; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:23:56 +0200 From: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Message-Id: <199508221923.VAA00855@gvr.win.tue.nl> Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND To: gary@palmer.demon.co.uk (Gary Palmer) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:23:56 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: imp@village.org, peter@haywire.dialix.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <8296.809119018@palmer.demon.co.uk> from "Gary Palmer" at Aug 22, 95 08:16:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 491 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Gary Palmer wrote: > > In message <199508221903.VAA00693@gvr.win.tue.nl>, Guido van Rooij writes: > >Just throw away *every* fragment that has as its start byte a byte in > >the TCP/IP header. (so smaller then 40) > > That'd be my opinion as well. Is there any DOCUMENTED & VALID reason > for having a fragment start with a byte offset into the header? Do you care? I think it is valid to happen. I dont think it is going to happen during normal traffic.. So I'll just block it. -Guido From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:27:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA12215 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:27:09 -0700 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA12209 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:27:08 -0700 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id OAA17415; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:25:52 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199508221925.OAA17415@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: equal cost ip forwarding To: smace@crash.ops.neosoft.com (Scott Mace) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:25:52 -0500 (CDT) Cc: ache@astral.msk.su, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221912.OAA03700@crash.ops.neosoft.com> from "Scott Mace" at Aug 22, 95 02:12:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > What I'm talking about is something like this: > > you have two "interfaces ethernet, fddi or whatever" and they both go to > the same place, and you want to load balanced over the 2. This is supported > by cornell's gated (RT_N_MULTIPATH) depending on what routing protocol you > use. Yes, this has been hashed through before, although usually in the guise of a serial connection of some sort (i.e. references to PPP or BSDI's mslip, which I started to port about half a year ago and didn't get finished). My understanding is that the routing code isn't designed for it, the interface code (which tends to use IP addresses and interface names somewhat interchangably at some points) isn't up to it, and so the solutions proposed have always been lower level stuff so as to avoid higher level issues. I for one would love to see this capability in FreeBSD... ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:28:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA12362 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:28:22 -0700 Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA12222 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:27:10 -0700 Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA15517 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:26:31 +0400 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Tue, 22 Aug 95 23:26:30 +0400 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id XAA00680; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:23:05 +0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org, jhs@freebsd.org References: <199508221253.OAA04772@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> In-Reply-To: <199508221253.OAA04772@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de>; from Julian Howard Stacey at Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:53:52 +0200 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:23:04 +0400 (MSD) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.40 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Proposal to split hackers@ into 10 lists to reduce traffic. Lines: 17 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 848 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508221253.OAA04772@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> Julian Howard Stacey writes: >I ask core to consider splitting up hackers@ into at least 5 to 10 interest >groups. I suggest choosing a high enough number so that each hackers@ >subscriber will readily be able to identify a few lists that do not interest >him/her. That way each subscriber would get perhaps 20/30% less traffic, >& freefall would send less traffic, & mail list latency would benefit. I definitely agree, I am really tired of unwanted topics, please do! -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:29:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA12492 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:29:28 -0700 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA12484 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:29:24 -0700 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA07396; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:27:05 -0700 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199508221927.MAA07396@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: your mail To: freelist@elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (Don's FList drop) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:27:05 -0700 (PDT) Cc: jmb@kryten.atinc.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Don's FList drop" at Aug 22, 95 12:39:21 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1084 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk ... > > so maybe FreeBSD needs a commercial variant--Elitix--for the > > elite business people who just have to have the pricy version. (and > > they let these people run companies and make decisions involving other > > people and large sums of money--bloody hell) > > No, we need a few value-added resellers who provide support and > coordination that the organizations can't do for themselves, similar to > the Caldera option. Or at least a more visible inclusion of "People You > Can Pay For Help With FreeBSD" with the distributions. And if folks don't think this is a real need, and that there is real money to be made in doing just that, you've uniformed. Due to my work load, and the growth of FreeBSD I can no longer meet the ``demand'' for technical support contracts I am getting. I have had to turn 3 down in the last 2 weeks. The time is getting very ripe for a ``commercial'' venture in this area :-). -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:31:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA12628 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:31:05 -0700 Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA12618 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:31:01 -0700 Message-Id: <199508221931.MAA12618@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com didn't use HELO protocol To: "Rodney W. Grimes" cc: wmbfmk@urc.tue.nl, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Can't connect to FreeBSD hosts In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 95 12:18:10 PDT." <199508221918.MAA07320@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:30:56 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Well, this has become the FAQ of the week for too many weeks, I think >we need to change the default on tcp_extentions to ``NO'' in /etc/sysconfig >as shipped. > >Those who want these can turn them on. > >Opinions? >-- >Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com >Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD This was my opinion on the matter when I first mentioned it as it affected my system early on. If anything, it should be disabled during install (maybe it is already?), but I would prefer having it off and have it become a setting in the "post install config" section of sysinstall. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:37:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA12985 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:37:05 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA12977 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:36:59 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id PAA12941; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:28:07 -0400 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:28:05 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: SCO and high prices To: dennis cc: paul@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199508221839.OAA24912@mail.htp.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk i have added chat to the cc: list. lets take all follow ups there rather than continue in hackers. what i tried and failed is to use these quotes from the article to highlight the thinking of some managers....a manager here pointed this article out to me. (guess he missed the part about celestial software selling servers for $15-$30 K to large corporations....servers made from free software....add some nicely printed docs, training, telephone support, and suits....viola.) On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, dennis wrote: > >In reply to Jonathan M. Bresler who said > >> > >> [snip] > >> > >> ....Last year, when the Santa Cruz Operation raised the price of SCO > >> Unix, the move caused barely a stir among the company's users. The > >> reason: Because SCO's products were significantly cheaper than Novell's > >> and Hewlett-Packard's, some technology managers had a hard time > >> convincing management that the SCO products were on a par with those of > >> other vendors. But at a higher price, SCO's product gained respect. > >> > >> [snip] > >> [end] > >> > >> > >> perhaps this is the attitude that dennis and others have been > >> referring to--if i dont pay a lot, i dont get squat. (can we sell these > >> people "Fresh Air" ?? ). without a high dollar price tag and an > >> acceptable name, the just cant deal with it. > >> > > > First of all, this is NOT the attitude of Dennis. Dennis has to earn a > living. Dennis is just doing his job. Often you get what you pay for, but it > USUALLY true that you get more when you pay something. pardon me. your attitude??? who's talking about your attitude?? we have recently discussed payware vs freeware in hackers (wrong mailing list) and then i see this article in information week. so i copied some paragraphs verbatim into my mail message. dennis, a LOT of us have jobs that are NOT hacking FreeBSD....just ask around. some of us even have 2 jobs that are not hacking FreeBSD. > I think that your analysis of the above, as well as the author's, is clearly > wrong. SCOs customers didn't wince when they raised their prices because > most of their BIG customer are under contract and the rest of them are so > rich it doesn't matter. SCO doesn't participate in the low end market, so you could be right. i wouldn't know. > you can't compare them to FreeBSD or anything similar. Most large corps > don't like freeware because they can't get anything in writing regarding > continuity or ownership. When I was at NYNEX the auditors would come in and > ask us for receipts. Anything we didn't have receipts for, they'd say to > delete it. > > "But I'm a Programmer", I'd tell them, "I wrote this stuff". The auditors, > or course, would have none of it. you just made my day. this is exactly the type of behavior that i find remarkable. boss pays me to write code. auditor makes me delete it. Sisyphean? > >BSDI used exactly the same argument when they bumped their prices > >recently. > > > > BSDI's problem is that they're trying to set up distribution, and > distributors want deep discounts so they can make a profit. And as they say, > 50% of nothing is nothing. Frankly I think they're making a mistake because > they don't have a general purpose product. > > BSD/386 is not a general purpose product. ?? please, lets continue in chat, if we continue at all. Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 12:51:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA13732 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:51:51 -0700 Received: from haywire.DIALix.COM (haywire.DIALix.COM [192.203.228.65]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA13726 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:51:48 -0700 Received: (from peter@localhost) by haywire.DIALix.COM (sendmail) id DAA04694; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:50:45 +0800 (WST) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:50:44 +0800 (WST) From: Peter Wemm To: Gary Palmer cc: Guido van Rooij , Warner Losh , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND In-Reply-To: <8296.809119018@palmer.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Gary Palmer wrote: > In message <199508221903.VAA00693@gvr.win.tue.nl>, Guido van Rooij writes: > >Just throw away *every* fragment that has as its start byte a byte in > >the TCP/IP header. (so smaller then 40) > > That'd be my opinion as well. Is there any DOCUMENTED & VALID reason > for having a fragment start with a byte offset into the header? > > Gary Dont forget the IP options that may come before the tcp header... You could put (say) 30 "NOP" options in the header, which would make the tcp header start at offset "50" rather than "20", and could use a fragment overlay starting above the "safe" cutoff of 40 bytes. In order to be safe, you could not allow a fragment to start anywhere less than "sizeof(IP header) + sizeof(MAX IP options) + sizeof(TCP header)" I presume Cisco handle that one too... So, how big can an IP header be? ip_hl = 4 bits.. What were the units again? 4 bytes? If so, then the IP part of the header could be up to 16 * 4 = 64 bytes long... You'd mainly need to protect your TCP port numbers (preventing a user from overlaying a "smtp" port header with "telnet"), so you'd need to toss *at least* anything with an offset of < 68... -Peter From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 13:12:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA14860 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:12:28 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA14846 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:12:23 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id GAA21010; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 06:11:26 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 06:11:26 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508222011.GAA21010@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> > 1) Look up the file >> > 2) Assert a mandatory file lock >> >> Instructions on this one would be needed 8) >Open it O_EXCL in the device node exporting code. In FreeBSD, unlike in Terryx :-), O_EXCL is only implemented for regular files. The semantics of O_EXCL are specified by POSIX (only) for regular files. They don't give mandatory locking. Everything that opens the file would have to use O_EXCL to give advisory locking. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 13:24:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA15371 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:24:04 -0700 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA15365 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:24:00 -0700 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA06359 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:49:16 +0200 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA00383 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:21:37 +0100 Received: by iafnl.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA19591 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:37:59 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.8/8.6.6) id TAA00818 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:25:46 +0200 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199508221725.TAA00818@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: do we need a freebsd-advocacy mailing list?! To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:25:45 +0200 (MET DST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 656 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Gents, ladies, I start to get the impression that we need some sort of advocacy list. -hackers seems to get flooded with all sorts of Linux nitpicking, marketing stuff and whatnot. Speaking strictly for myself, I can _really_ do without this, still acknowledging the fact that the discussions themselves can be really useful. What about this idea? Wilko _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 13:27:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA15646 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:27:58 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA15634 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:27:55 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01757; Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:29:00 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508222029.AA01757@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: nfs problem (UCX/VMS) To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (Christoph P. Kukulies) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:28:59 MDT Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508221107.NAA29744@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph P. Kukulies" at Aug 22, 95 01:07:33 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > then I do > > su someotheruser (which has the uid/gid set to the owner/group identical > to that on the VMS side - this technique is a convenient method to solve > potential access rights problems) > > and 'vi somefile' there is no problem. > > Even if the VMS/NFS product is not known to be one of the stablest > at least on the FreeBSD side there shouldn't occur no core dump. UID 0 mapping is failing on UCX -- unexpectedly. The UID *must* map to some value, and that value MUST be valid for VMS. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 13:45:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA16388 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:45:40 -0700 Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (sri.MT.net [204.94.231.129]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA16373 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:45:33 -0700 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA29029; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:47:18 -0600 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:47:18 -0600 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199508222047.OAA29029@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Cc: dennis , paul@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SCO and high prices In-Reply-To: References: <199508221839.OAA24912@mail.htp.com> Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > wrong. SCOs customers didn't wince when they raised their prices because > > most of their BIG customer are under contract and the rest of them are so > > rich it doesn't matter. SCO doesn't participate in the low end market, so > > you could be right. i wouldn't know. I disagree with Dennis. Most of SCO's business is in POS systems and similar other products. All of the Nissan dealerships have a SCO system (whether they realize it or not), and many GM dealership body shops also have SCO systems. These are typically the type of systems SCO sells to, and also the biggest reason *why* it doesn't matter that they are running 10 year old technology software. (SvsV3.2) Because these systems are sold in complete systems AND the integrators are the ones paying the price, the price increase of the OS isn't seen by the end user. The integrator just adds more money to the system and sells it. The integrator doesn't much care, since they are already making a killing on the application software AND hardware they sell to the end user, and SCO is already giving them a big price break as it is. The only people it's hurting is the end user, and SCO doesn't care much abou them anymore. They simply can't compete in that market due partly to the influx of the free unix clones. The type of client SCO is looking for is *not* the same kind of client FreeBSD is looking for. SCO can impress their client base with big $$, because those kind of people implicate high $$ with great software, and unfortunately don't take the time to find out the facts. FreeBSD can't break into that market because of that very reason. Note the type of responses in the article Jonathan quoted. Those who are anti-freeware will continue to be so unless they have to be big $$ for software which may/may not be any better/supported than freeware. When you are overworked, it's alot easier to assume $$ == support than to do your homework and find out the facts. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 13:47:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA16531 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:47:19 -0700 Received: from mail.rwth-aachen.de (mail.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.144.9]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA16511 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:47:13 -0700 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by mail.rwth-aachen.de (PMDF V4.3-10 #7297) id <01HUE2CR5228007Y9Z@mail.rwth-aachen.de>; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:45:26 +0100 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.8/8.6.9) id WAA01017; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:58:45 +0200 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:58:45 +0200 (MET DST) From: Christoph Kukulies Subject: Re: Why Linux? In-reply-to: <7754.809113356@palmer.demon.co.uk> from "Gary Palmer" at Aug 22, 95 06:42:36 pm To: gary@palmer.demon.co.uk (Gary Palmer) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Reply-to: Christoph Kukulies Message-id: <199508222058.WAA01017@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-type: text Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-length: 393 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > In message <199508221653.SAA11889@uriah.heep.sax.de>, J Wunsch writes: > >As Julian Stacey wrote: > >> Which month Jordan or Michael ? > > >A while ago. I think at the beginning of the year. > > It came out at the start of CEBIT, so that makes it March time I > think? iX magazine, April 95 issue, pp. 60 > > Gary > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 13:47:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA16554 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:47:28 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA16541 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 13:47:22 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01818; Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:46:39 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508222046.AA01818@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: imb@scgt.oz.au (michael butler) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:46:38 MDT Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net In-Reply-To: <199508221438.AAA21168@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> from "michael butler" at Aug 23, 95 00:38:09 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > This approach has the advantage of working for the existing partition > > and slice handling, the vnconfig device, AND the exportation of a > > contiguous chunk of disk as a device AND extended partitions, all > > without ruining the distintions in the kernel that cause some of the > > current install problems (ie: WD1007). > > Is there any mechanism by which it is possible to get FreeBSD (-current or > otherwise) onto a WD1007 controlled drive ? Yes. It involves jumpers W8 and W14 away from the factory defaults, downloading a format utility from ftp.wdc.com, and low level formatting the drive (reinstalling everything later). Mikem@cs.weber.edu was going to use the departmental scanner to scan in the WD1007 we got working back at the start of July. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 14:06:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA17361 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:06:40 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA17352 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:06:37 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01896; Tue, 22 Aug 95 15:07:59 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508222107.AA01896@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 15:07:59 MDT Cc: imb@scgt.oz.au, bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net In-Reply-To: <199508221814.EAA18331@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 04:14:01 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >Is there any mechanism by which it is possible to get FreeBSD (-current or > >otherwise) onto a WD1007 controlled drive ? > > It should work to just enable translation in the controller. There are > certainly some jumper settings that work. DISABLE perfect media, DISABLE translation, relow-loevel-format. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 14:36:50 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA18510 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:36:50 -0700 Received: from pelican.com (pelican.com [134.24.4.62]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA18503 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:36:44 -0700 Received: from puffin.pelican.com by pelican.com with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #5) id m0sl0zo-000K2mC; Tue, 22 Aug 95 14:36 WET DST Received: (from pete@localhost) by puffin.pelican.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id OAA04016; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:36:32 -0700 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:36:32 -0700 From: Pete Carah Message-Id: <199508222136.OAA04016@puffin.pelican.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: VM86 In-Reply-To: <199508201931.VAA24542@gvr.win.tue.nl> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <199508201931.VAA24542@gvr.win.tue.nl> you write: ... >BearHeart/Bill Weinman wrote: ..... >> . . . and Beta is far superior to VHS . . . > >And V2000 is far superior to Beta. And D2 to that, and D1 to *that*, etc etc. (and all those others...) >;-) ;-) ;-) -- Pete From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 14:39:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA18668 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:39:15 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA18662 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:39:13 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA01980; Tue, 22 Aug 95 15:40:35 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508222140.AA01980@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 15:40:34 MDT Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508222011.GAA21010@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 06:11:26 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >> > 1) Look up the file > >> > 2) Assert a mandatory file lock > >> > >> Instructions on this one would be needed 8) > > >Open it O_EXCL in the device node exporting code. > > In FreeBSD, unlike in Terryx :-), O_EXCL is only implemented for regular > files. The semantics of O_EXCL are specified by POSIX (only) for > regular files. They don't give mandatory locking. Everything that > opens the file would have to use O_EXCL to give advisory locking. Why from the FAT perspective isn't a contiguous slab of blocks considered a regular file? We are asserting the lock against potential FAT users, not against root clobbering himself. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 15:27:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA20579 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:27:10 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA20564 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 15:27:00 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA11084; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:26:01 -0600 Message-Id: <199508222226.QAA11084@rover.village.org> To: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND Cc: peter@haywire.dialix.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:03:49 +0200 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:26:00 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : Just throw away *every* fragment that has as its start byte a byte in : the TCP/IP header. (so smaller then 40) That's the fix, but it isn't implemented yet in most Firewalls. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 16:12:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA24786 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:12:32 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA24780 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:12:25 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id JAA25937; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:10:39 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:10:39 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508222310.JAA25937@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: imb@scgt.oz.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Is there any mechanism by which it is possible to get FreeBSD (-current or >> otherwise) onto a WD1007 controlled drive ? >Yes. It involves jumpers W8 and W14 away from the factory defaults, Are there different jumpers on different WD1007's? For the WD1007V-SE*, W8 controls the BIOS address and W14 doesn't exist, and I think the key settings are W1:J5-6 unjumpered (enable translation: factory default) and possibly W1:J11-12 unjumpered (no alternate sector: factory default) and possibly required but probably irrelevant W1:J9-10 jumpered (force 35 sectors/track for 10Mb/sec drives: NOT factory default). >downloading a format utility from ftp.wdc.com, and low level formatting >the drive (reinstalling everything later). For the WD1007V-SE*, there is a formatting utility in the BIOS ROM, and it works better than the format utility. Low level reformatting should only be necessary if you change the hardware number of sectors/track. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 16:37:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA25698 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:37:42 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA25692 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:37:30 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id JAA26750; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:35:53 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:35:53 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508222335.JAA26750@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, imb@scgt.oz.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> >Is there any mechanism by which it is possible to get FreeBSD (-current or >> >otherwise) onto a WD1007 controlled drive ? >> >> It should work to just enable translation in the controller. There are >> certainly some jumper settings that work. >DISABLE perfect media, DISABLE translation, relow-loevel-format. This sounds like a trial and error solution to me, and a lot of work. Simply disabling alternate sectors (is perfect media the opposite of that?) should work provided you get everything to agree about the new geometry, but it should be tried last because it creates work. Enabling translation must work if translation works (it certainly works for the WD1007V-SE*) and is supported by all drivers, by the definition of translation. The FreeBSD wd driver supports it by issuing a "set parameters" command. This should override the bogus default translation iff translation is enabled (*). All wd drivers that I've looked at issue a "set parameters" command. It's part of the ATA ([E]IDE) spec. (*) Translated mode will have too many cylinders. Be careful not to use the nonexistent cylinders. Use whatever geometry worked in old versions of FreeBSD with the same jumper settings. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 17:02:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA26321 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:02:48 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA26309 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:02:42 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id KAA27459; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:00:24 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:00:24 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508230000.KAA27459@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> In FreeBSD, unlike in Terryx :-), O_EXCL is only implemented for regular >> files. The semantics of O_EXCL are specified by POSIX (only) for >> regular files. They don't give mandatory locking. Everything that >> opens the file would have to use O_EXCL to give advisory locking. >Why from the FAT perspective isn't a contiguous slab of blocks considered >a regular file? It is, but POSIX conformance guarantees that O_EXCL is no use for implementing mandatory locking in that case. >We are asserting the lock against potential FAT users, not against >root clobbering himself. The FAT users are unlikely to use O_EXCL, although root could be more careful. Normal protecion methods are probably good enough. Either don't mount the file system containing the slab, or mount it ro, or don't allow non-root to change the slab. Root has to be careful not to clobber the slab. I noticed the expected strange behaviour when I clobber the file underlying a vn device. The cache lacks coherency because the same block can be in two buffers at once (once for the file vnode and once for the device vnode), so various things worked better after sync than before. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 17:21:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA26994 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:21:54 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA26988 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:21:52 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA02565; Tue, 22 Aug 95 18:22:00 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508230022.AA02565@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 18:21:59 MDT Cc: imb@scgt.oz.au, bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net In-Reply-To: <199508222310.JAA25937@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 09:10:39 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >downloading a format utility from ftp.wdc.com, and low level formatting > >the drive (reinstalling everything later). > > For the WD1007V-SE*, there is a formatting utility in the BIOS ROM, and > it works better than the format utility. Low level reformatting should > only be necessary if you change the hardware number of sectors/track. You do. You get rid of the !@#$$! sector sparing. The whole problem is the sector sparing. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 17:41:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA27425 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:41:43 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA27415 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:41:39 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA02605; Tue, 22 Aug 95 18:43:00 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508230043.AA02605@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 18:42:59 MDT Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, imb@scgt.oz.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net In-Reply-To: <199508222335.JAA26750@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 09:35:53 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >DISABLE perfect media, DISABLE translation, relow-loevel-format. > > This sounds like a trial and error solution to me, and a lot of work. > Simply disabling alternate sectors (is perfect media the opposite of > that?) should work provided you get everything to agree about the new > geometry, but it should be tried last because it creates work. Enabling > translation must work if translation works (it certainly works for the > WD1007V-SE*) and is supported by all drivers, by the definition of > translation. The FreeBSD wd driver supports it by issuing a "set > parameters" command. This should override the bogus default translation > iff translation is enabled (*). All wd drivers that I've looked at > issue a "set parameters" command. It's part of the ATA ([E]IDE) spec. > > (*) Translated mode will have too many cylinders. Be careful not to use > the nonexistent cylinders. Use whatever geometry worked in old versions > of FreeBSD with the same jumper settings. There is translation and then there is translation. By default, the WD1007 does both. The first kind of translation is the C/H/S geometry translation to make the BIOS happy about big drives. THe second translation is sector sparing. Sector sparing is a non-linear translation mechanism. Say that I have s=36; now say I have sparing enabled, which steals the 36th and leaves me with an equivalent of s=35 + 1 spare. The problem in this scenario is that the drive geometry query is going to return 36, but the hardware will enforce 35. But the actual will be 36. So I can't get at the 36th sector from a non-BIOS driver, like in BSD because the format on the drive won't permit it. To accomodate this, I have to have the software know that every 36th sector is inaccessable. You can see this when "scanning" the drive for bad144, since every 36th sector will fail the scan. So effectively, you have a non-BIOS disk access which must access the disk, pretending every 36th sector does not exist. Well, even thoguh this is one of the newfs options, it isn't one of the disklabel options. So what you do instead is turn off the sparing. This requires that you reformat your drive. The sparing doesn't actually go off unless you also disable translation. So in any case, you will be two jumpers (whatever they end up being) and a low level format away from accessing the device. The AT&T SVR4.0.2 wd driver understands ESDI and sector sparing, so it will work; however, because of the non-linear translation, you can not install both the AT&T UNIX and DOS on the same drive unless translation is off because of the way the sparing causes a loss of one sector in 36, so for n sectors, n> 36, you mistake the partition start by n/36 in the boot code. The 386BSD code would work correctly to boot this device because the 386BSD code was not BIOS-based -- the AT&T code isn't BIOS based either, so it will also work. The NetBSD code would work for NetBSD releases 0.8 and 0.9. This is because they had wierd geometry enforcement code. More recent NetBSD or FreeBSD requires a low level format, period. UnixWare, which now uses a BIOS based boot, in part because of my nagging them about it, also requires a low level format. What's really needed is ESDI knowledge in the wd driver, only a portion of what's actually necessary being in the AT&T code, mostly because all they needed was enough to make the 6368 WGA, 6386E WGS, and StarServer ESDI drives shipped with the default hardware happy. Going to a VM86() based "fallback" driver would work because the BIOS would enforce the C/H/S sector offset translations to physical sectors to always skip the spare sectors and thus avoif the error. This isn't really a good option, though I'd like to have it anyway so that BSD would run on all 386 and above hardware DOS runs on. Even with that, the best you could do is disassembling the wdc.com format code and see how it identifieds the sparing and jumper settings, or you'd still have to install the software by itself on the drive with not other partitions present. In theory, if the sector offsets were translated using the disklabel C/H/S vs the hardware C/H/S, and you set the disklabel values to skip sector 36, well then, everything would work -- this is the NetBSD 0.x bogosity that allowed it to operate. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 17:42:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA27485 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:42:29 -0700 Received: from web.azstarnet.com (azstarnet.com [169.197.1.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA27468 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:42:26 -0700 Received: from dialup98.azstarnet.com (dialup97.azstarnet.com [169.197.2.97]) by web.azstarnet.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with SMTP id RAA00157; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:40:22 -0700 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:40:22 -0700 Message-Id: <199508230040.RAA00157@web.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: maher@azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: majordomo@braae.ru.ac.za, questions@FreeBSD.org, ports@FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-FAQ@freefall.FreeBSD.org From: maher@azstarnet.com (maher katbah) Subject: internet host Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi everybody I am trying to setup an internet server in tucson Arizona , and I am looking for internet host who can lease T1 line, I need some help from those who know the answer.Please let me know if there is a newsgroup for ISP. Thank you maher From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 17:47:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA27893 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:47:00 -0700 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA27887 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:46:58 -0700 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id CAA16124 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:46:54 +0200 Received: from (roberto@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) id CAA19551 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:46:53 +0200 From: roberto@blaise.ibp.fr (Ollivier Robert) Message-Id: <199508230046.CAA19551@blaise.ibp.fr> Subject: Re: Can't connect to FreeBSD hosts To: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com (Rodney W. Grimes) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:46:53 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.org, wmbfmk@urc.tue.nl, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221918.MAA07320@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> from "Rodney W. Grimes" at Aug 22, 95 12:18:10 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#880 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 486 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Well, this has become the FAQ of the week for too many weeks, I think > we need to change the default on tcp_extentions to ``NO'' in /etc/sysconfig > as shipped. > > Those who want these can turn them on. > > Opinions? Agreed. It doesn't buy much for many people anyway as far as I see or is there an awfully good reason to keep them on ? -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT #5: Fri Jul 14 12:28:04 MET DST 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 17:52:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA28090 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:52:10 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA28079 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:51:58 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA02864; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:50:26 +0800 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:50:25 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NFS via loopback (was Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server) In-Reply-To: <199508221805.LAA00928@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > Should be interesting to find out the NFS performance numbers with > your configuration using fast ethernet. I got the idea to mount an NFS-exported filesystem to the localhost via loopback, but I couldn't get mountd to recognize any combination of /etc/exports that contains "aries" or "localhost" (aries is the name of my machine). I would get errors like this: Aug 23 07:25:50 aries mountd[2630]: Gethostbyname failed Aug 23 07:25:50 aries mountd[2630]: Bad exports list line /scratch aries,localhost Aug 23 07:26:55 aries mountd[2631]: Gethostbyname failed Aug 23 07:26:55 aries mountd[2631]: Bad exports list line /scratch -alldirs aries,localhost Aug 23 07:28:17 aries mountd[2631]: Gethostbyname failed Aug 23 07:28:17 aries mountd[2631]: Bad exports list line /scratch -alldirs aries,127.0.0.1 Shouldn't I be able to mount over the loopback interface? > If they are very high, I suggest sending the performance figures to > Networking Computing 8) Most definitely. -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 17:59:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA28558 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:59:53 -0700 Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA28551 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:59:50 -0700 Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA11425; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:51:53 -0400 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199508230051.UAA11425@hda.com> Subject: Re: do we need a freebsd-advocacy mailing list?! To: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl (Wilko Bulte) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:51:52 -0400 (EDT) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221725.TAA00818@yedi.iaf.nl> from "Wilko Bulte" at Aug 22, 95 07:25:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 716 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Gents, ladies, > > I start to get the impression that we need some sort of advocacy list. > -hackers seems to get flooded with all sorts of Linux nitpicking, > marketing stuff and whatnot. > > Speaking strictly for myself, I can _really_ do without this, still > acknowledging the fact that the discussions themselves can be > really useful. > I'll again suggest freebsd-policy. Anything not hacking related can be shunted over there and then the policy wonks can argue what needs to be moved into yet additional mailing lists. Peter -- Peter Dufault Real Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 18:38:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA29739 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:38:04 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA29731 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:38:00 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id LAA30106; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:36:26 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:36:26 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508230136.LAA30106@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, imb@scgt.oz.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> it works better than the format utility. Low level reformatting should >> only be necessary if you change the hardware number of sectors/track. >You do. You get rid of the !@#$$! sector sparing. >The whole problem is the sector sparing. If it's not enabled then disabling it is a no-op. Of course, people who already have it disabled probably don't have the bug. It is disabled by default for the WD1007V-SE* so perhaps not having the bug is usual. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 19:08:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA00865 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:08:58 -0700 Received: from gateway.airmail.net ([204.178.72.51]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA00858 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:08:53 -0700 Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by gateway.airmail.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA01722 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:08:52 -0500 From: Jim Bryant Message-Id: <199508230208.VAA01722@gateway.airmail.net> Subject: magneto-optical drives To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:08:51 -0500 (CDT) Content-Type: text Content-Length: 2293 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Is anyone working on drivers for magneto-optical drives? Is there an existing driver that will work with magneto-optical drives? If neither, then I will probably end up writing one. I've had bad luck with tapes lately, nothing to do with FreeBSD, just simple aging, tape degradation, etc... I recently bought an IBM MTA-3230 3.5" 230M magneto optical drive at Computer City for like $499... Given that the cartridges store more, are random access, and signifigantly faster than worms, cd-roms, or floppy-tape, as well as data-retention time in excess of 50 years [i'll believe that when i see it!], I think that paying around twice as much as for tapes can be justified by some [ME!].... Jordan, if nobody is doing a driver or has a driver, mind if I do it? Supposedly the 171 page manual for this drive is on the way from IBM... BTW: this drive is also packaged in a decent SCSI case, is easily removed for internal mounting, comes with one formatted cartridge with the apple [ARGH!] drivers on it. The OEM for the drive is NuDesign and is in the apple section of the stores... I am not plugging NuDesign here, as a matter of fact, they have the most unhelpful and unfriendly technical department I have ever had the displeasure to work with. When I finally asked for the IBM support number for the drive, they didn't just give the wrong number, but they were off by several states... They do have the reference manual for the drive, but refuse to even photocopy it for someone writing a driver. After spending over an hour on the phone, I finally tracked down the proper IBM phone number and department, which happens to be just down the road from NuDesign. IBM was much more helpful. The IBM drive is decent though, and even has a faster sequential transfer rate than my 4x cd-rom. My recommendation is to call IBM for the names of other OEMs for this drive other than NuDesign... The IBM name for the drive is the ImageStar 230 [model #: MTA-3230]. Jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" jbryant@gateway.airmail.net, System administrator, Internet America From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 19:18:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA01221 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:18:00 -0700 Received: from rocinha.nce.ufrj.br (rocinha.nce.ufrj.br [146.164.8.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA01202 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:17:47 -0700 Received: by rocinha.nce.ufrj.br (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA01188; Tue, 22 Aug 95 23:17:05 EST Date: Tue, 22 Aug 95 23:17:05 EST From: pedrosal@nce.ufrj.br (Pedro Salenbauch) Message-Id: <9508230217.AA01188@rocinha.nce.ufrj.br> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Changing root and PANIC! Cc: bugs@FreeBSD.org, pedrosal@nce.ufrj.br, questions@FreeBSD.org Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Dear Mrs/Sirs: I tried several times to install BSD 2.0.5, but always had the same problem: I am using the fourth "slice" of my SCSI hard disk, "sd0s4" for BSD, but when I boot it, comes the message "changing root device to sd2a" and PANIC! The SCSI id of the disk is 0 and the id of the CD-ROM is 2. So, what does mean "sd2a" mean? Is it the second slice of the disk or the CD-ROM? Can you help me? Thank you, Pedro Salenbauch (pedrosal@nce.ufrj.br) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 19:30:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA01701 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:30:37 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA01694 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:30:33 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA02559; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:29:51 -0700 To: Brian Tao cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Distributing Mosaic (and Motif)... In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 18:08:16 +0800." Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:29:50 -0700 Message-ID: <2557.809144990@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Heck, if it's legal, there shouldn't be any doubts: include Mosaic > on the CD-ROM! :) BTW, any news on Walnut Creek offering a bundled Well, it sure looks legal. I got mail from some folks saying that _they_ wouldn't do it, but I've read that NCSA license agreement several times and it looks no worse than the GPL where redistribution is concerned. I honestly don't understand the worry. > FreeBSD+Motif CD-ROM set? I remember you posted something about > LaserMoon UK selling FreeBSD 2.0.5/2.1.0-compatible Motif, but you > still have to buy that separately. Well, the OSF wanted too much money so I'm going to leave that to Lasermoon. I don't know what their current status is, but I suppose it's time to ping them. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 19:37:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA02022 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:37:29 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA02011 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:37:17 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA31690; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:34:27 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:34:27 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508230234.MAA31690@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, imb@scgt.oz.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >THe second translation is sector sparing. Sector sparing is a non-linear >translation mechanism. >Say that I have s=36; now say I have sparing enabled, which steals the >36th and leaves me with an equivalent of s=35 + 1 spare. >The problem in this scenario is that the drive geometry query is going >to return 36, but the hardware will enforce 35. >But the actual will be 36. Physically it is 36 but the controller should report 35...unless this form of translation is regarded as a bug fix for the option base 1 sector numbers :-). What happens if translation is enabled and the set parameters command tells the drive that there are 36 sectors/ track? Translation has to slip a sector for each track if translation is to work. I guess the spare sectors should be inaccessible in translated mode (you could specify sector 0, but the accumulated slippages stops that from being related to a physical sector 0). >The sparing doesn't actually go off unless you also disable translation. Yes it does. Of course you have to add 1 to the number of sectors in the BIOS geometry and in disk labels to use the extra sectors. >The AT&T SVR4.0.2 wd driver understands ESDI and sector sparing, so it >will work; however, because of the non-linear translation, you can not >install both the AT&T UNIX and DOS on the same drive unless translation >is off because of the way the sparing causes a loss of one sector in 36, >so for n sectors, n> 36, you mistake the partition start by n/36 in the >boot code. This can be handled by using adjusting the geometry in the smart driver. Use a drive table entry with 35 sectors since 35 is all the BIOS can normally see. Use 36 sectors in the smart driver. Other OS's will have problems reading file systems written by the smart driver. >In theory, if the sector offsets were translated using the disklabel >C/H/S vs the hardware C/H/S, and you set the disklabel values to >skip sector 36, well then, everything would work -- this is the NetBSD >0.x bogosity that allowed it to operate. I think all the BSDs used the disklabel values until I "improved" the FreeBSD driver in 2.0.5. This is what the disklabel was for - for specifying the final values to be used in case the hardware or BIOS values are unavailable or wrong. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 19:38:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA02128 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:38:34 -0700 Received: from netcom14.netcom.com (netcom14.netcom.com [192.100.81.126]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA02114 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:38:31 -0700 Received: by netcom14.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id TAA25763; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:36:14 -0700 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:36:14 -0700 From: hasty@netcom.com (Amancio Hasty Jr) Message-Id: <199508230236.TAA25763@netcom14.netcom.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Intercept :) Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Well, the linux people have a long thread on comp.sys.intel advocating linux: What Linux needs to gain popularity? Dream OS = Linux Would be nice if a few freebsd folks jump in there and change the subject heading of the threads to include also FreeBSD. Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 20:02:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA03341 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:02:53 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA03289 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:02:36 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA32514; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:57:35 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:57:35 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508230257.MAA32514@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@freebsd.org, pedrosal@nce.ufrj.br Subject: Re: Changing root and PANIC! Cc: bugs@freebsd.org, questions@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >I tried several times to install BSD 2.0.5, but always had the >same problem: I am using the fourth "slice" of my SCSI hard >disk, "sd0s4" for BSD, but when I boot it, comes the message >"changing root device to sd2a" and PANIC! >The SCSI id of the disk is 0 and the id of the CD-ROM is 2. >So, what does mean "sd2a" mean? Is it the second slice of >the disk or the CD-ROM? It is the first BSD slice of the third SCSI disk. The `2' is probably for BIOS drive number 0x82 (the 3rd BIOS drive = the first SCSI drive when there are 2 drives before it in the BIOS drive numbering scheme). Try booting from hd(1,a)/kernel like the prompt says. This only works for the first SCSI drive. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 20:24:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA04472 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:24:43 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA04456 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:24:41 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA02747; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:24:32 -0700 To: Marc van Kempen cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Can't connect to FreeBSD hosts In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 14:13:55 +0200." <199508221214.OAA13390@nietzsche> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:24:32 -0700 Message-ID: <2745.809148272@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I have noticed something awkward. I can't connect to FreeBSD machines > on the net. I have no problems reaching other hosts (via ppp), but all > connections to FreeBSD machines seem to succeed, only to hang after > the initial contact. Did you try typing anything at it, like a ^J? I dunno, but it works for me without having to type anything at all: jkh@time-> telnet freebsd.first.gmd.de Trying 192.35.153.200... Connected to freebsd.first.gmd.de. Escape character is '^]'. FreeBSD (freebsd) (ttyp6) login: Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 20:37:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA05981 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:37:14 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA05970 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:37:11 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA02772; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:29:00 -0700 To: "Julian Stacey " cc: "Michael C. Newell" , Brian Tao , Marty Leisner , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 11:36:27 +0200." <199508220936.LAA00437@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:29:00 -0700 Message-ID: <2770.809148540@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Which month Jordan or Michael ? > > I'll then grab a photocopy from friends who get this mag. > (useful for when locals say to me their language equivalent of > `So what's FreeBSD then' ) I believe it was the September issue. I have a few issues here. Met the chief editor (`chefredaktur') at CeBIT, BTW, and he was very nice. He indicated that he was VERY interested in more such articles and proceded to show me that he had the FreeBSD web page near the very top of his bookmark list in Netscape.. :-) [They had an ISDN line at the show and were busily browsing the FreeBSD pages as we spoke] Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 20:55:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA06882 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:55:20 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA06875 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:55:05 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA12204; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:53:00 -0600 Message-Id: <199508230353.VAA12204@rover.village.org> To: Brian Tao Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! Cc: Tom Samplonius , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Tue, 22 Aug 1995 17:41:07 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:52:59 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : > Speaking of Windows and NFS, does anyone know of a good NFS client for : > Windows? Make sure that you check to make sure that the NFS in question can handle large directories (say 1000 files of 20 chars each). NetManage's product doesn't, even with the patches that supposedly fix the problem. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 21:04:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA07235 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:04:03 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA07225 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:03:57 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA12435; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:03:12 -0600 Message-Id: <199508230403.WAA12435@rover.village.org> To: Peter Wemm Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND Cc: Gary Palmer , Guido van Rooij , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:50:44 +0800 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:03:11 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : "telnet"), so you'd need to toss *at least* anything with an offset of < 68... Does that work with ATM IP implementations? Last I heard the data size per packet was rather small. None the less, I think it is likely to be valid, since most fragments are multiples of the smallest MTU between here and there, and those start in the 200 range. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 21:11:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA07469 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:11:56 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA07462 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:11:52 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA02947; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:11:32 -0700 To: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) cc: Brian Tao , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:57:46 EDT." <199508221457.KAA23168@mail.htp.com> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:11:31 -0700 Message-ID: <2945.809151091@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > "Powered by FreeBSD" does not imply approval, nor should it. You're talking > about restricting "free" advertising. Its like saying that only skinny girls > can where your tee shirts. The idea is to encourage expansion, not make it > more work. I'm inclined to agree. If people can't even say "I run FreeBSD!" in public then we've somehow lost the original concept in our race to make sure that potential for abuse is curbed. For my perspective, I intend to take the same tack that Kirk McKusick takes with Chuck, the BSD daemon. If people use him reasonably and perhaps pay Kirk the minor courtesy of mentioning it, there's no problem. Kirk doesn't demand that a notarized document come through his mail slot in the next 24 hours or anything. If someone uses the Daemon to grace their porno site, on the other hand (I wish I could say that this were only a hypothetical example :( ) the Kirk gets pretty upset and he asks them to stop. AFAIK, even then that's about as far as it goes. I don't think that Kirk has ever sued anyone over such misappropriation, and I think that simply making it plain when such misuse is happening is about the most of us will ever be able to do. We don't have the resources to do much else. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 21:15:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA07627 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:15:39 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA07621 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:15:37 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA02973; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:14:24 -0700 To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: dennis , Brian Tao , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 10:57:28 EDT." Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:14:24 -0700 Message-ID: <2971.809151264@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > was there a discrimination against the Hooters restaraunt chain > recently ?? God, that's an amazing idea, Jon! I could go to hooters and offer them all free FreeBSD T-shirts if they'd only wear them! And, and, I could deduct the money I spent in there on my taxes as "legitimate field research!" I see some real marketing opportunities here.. "Got the devil in ya? Well then put him on your chest!" Jordan P.S. If *course* I'm just kidding! From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 21:41:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA09194 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:41:26 -0700 Received: from skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (skynet.ctr.columbia.edu [128.59.64.70]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA09176 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 21:41:22 -0700 Received: (from wpaul@localhost) by skynet.ctr.columbia.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id AAA20414 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:40:18 -0400 From: A boy and his worm gear Message-Id: <199508230440.AAA20414@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Subject: Small FreeBSD mention in InfoWorld To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:40:13 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1397 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk The August 21st InfoWorld (Vol. 17, Issue 30) landed in my mailbox today, and hidden among the countless Windoze 95 articles was a passing mention of FreeBSD (well, and Linux too). On page 72, there's an article called "Witty, technical Win95 comebacks" that lists the Top 10 Reasons _Not_ to Migrate to Windows 95. Reason #7 says: "Win95 and Windows for Workgroups have a major TCP/IP bug that allows anyone running Linux or FreeBSD with Samba to access the entire drive of any machine that is sharing a directory. Even firewalled networks seem to have some susceptibility. This bug was posted to the 'Bugtraq' list." -Jim Dennis, system administrator, McAfee Associates Inc. Not exactly a major coup, but every little but helps, I guess. (As an aside, Reason #8 says: "Because InfoWorld says only lemmings upgrade, and I always do what InfoWorld tells me." :) -Bill -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~T~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -Bill Paul (212) 854-6020 | System Manager Work: wpaul@ctr.columbia.edu | Center for Telecommunications Research Home: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu | Columbia University, New York City ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Møøse Illuminati: ignore it and be confused, or join it and be confusing! ~~~~~~ "Welcome to All Things BSDish! If it's not BSDish, it's crap!" ~~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 22:24:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA10435 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:24:52 -0700 Received: (from dyson@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA10428 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:24:50 -0700 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:24:50 -0700 From: John Dyson Message-Id: <199508230524.WAA10428@freefall.FreeBSD.org> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Here are my benchmark results, so far Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I hesitate to post this to the mailing list, but I don't have time to refine these numbers. Permission is granted to use this information in any way that you see fit. Note that I don't warrantee this information at all. However, I have tried to be as fair and complete as I could be. Caveat Emptor.... Here goes!!!! Note that unless otherwise stated, all of these runs were done on the FreeBSD stable tree as of about 20 Aug 95. The Linux runs were done with the Slackware 2.3 binaries and the Linux 1.3.20 kernel. It appears that the performance of 1.3.20 is roughly the same as the 1.2.8 kernel. The Multi-block I/O mode was not enabled on the FreeBSD-stable kernel, and the kernel built was the standard GENERIC. The Linux kernel was stripped down to that which would run on my machine (no extra drivers, but the hard-disk driver was the IDE one.) These results are not cooked in any way and quite raw. The runs on the FreeBSD-V2.1 stable kernel were done with a kernel as directly checked out of CVS and the kernel was not hacked on. Any modifications to the tests have been outlined below, and every attempt has been made to make sure that the results are presented fairly. In some cases the results are in error, and instead of trying to present "corrected" info, the actual results with annotation are given. Some results with more current or differently tuned FreeBSD kernels have been provided for comparison purposes. Note that Linux was compiled with: "-O2 -fomit-frame-pointer -fno-strength-reduce -m486" And unless otherwise noted FreeBSD was compiled with: "-O" MACHINE: 486/66 DX2 Micronics ISA MB 20MB -- stock, no mods. IDE drives: WD540H (128K cache version), IDE interface is a cheap paddleboard. --------------------------------------------------------- The following benchmarks measure the page fault performance of a UNIX-like OS. The performance measured includes the fault code itself and the paging-in code. Checking fault performance on FreeBSD (gaussian) Memory is now initialized, starting test 100 mmaps, 512 pages, 2560 pages touched per mmap REAL TIME: paging in time: 1695.8500 ms average time: 49.4660 us average time exc. paging in time: 16.5090 us SYSTEM & USER TIME: system time: 581.3000 ms user time: 175.4230 ms Checking fault performance on Linux (gaussian) Memory is now initialized, starting test 100 mmaps, 512 pages, 2560 pages touched per mmap REAL TIME: paging in time: 8192.3850 ms average time: 381.9265 us average time exc. paging in time: 224.1606 us SYSTEM & USER TIME: system time: 9610.0000 ms user time: 250.0000 ms Checking fault performance on FreeBSD (backwards) Memory is now initialized, starting test 100 mmaps, 512 pages, 2560 pages touched per mmap REAL TIME: paging in time: 2381.1970 ms average time: 60.2987 us average time exc. paging in time: 13.9302 us SYSTEM & USER TIME: system time: 614.2340 ms user time: 210.0920 ms Checking fault performance on Linux (gaussian) Memory is now initialized, starting test 100 mmaps, 512 pages, 2560 pages touched per mmap REAL TIME: paging in time: 8192.3850 ms average time: 381.9265 us average time exc. paging in time: 224.1606 us SYSTEM & USER TIME: system time: 9610.0000 ms user time: 250.0000 ms Note that Linux has much slower paging and also much slower page faulting than FreeBSD. --------------------------------------------------------------- The following is the well-known IOZONE benchmark, with fsync enabled: FREEBSD V2.1-stable (no MULTI-BLOCK, normal config and build): IOZONE: Performance Test of Sequential File I/O -- V2.01 (10/21/94) By Bill Norcott Operating System: POSIX 1003.1-1990 -- using fsync() IOZONE: auto-test mode MB reclen bytes/sec written bytes/sec read 1 512 1220161 6100805 1 1024 1508064 8388608 1 2048 1560671 11184810 1 4096 1290555 12201611 1 8192 1597830 13421772 2 512 1348921 5965232 2 1024 1626881 8659208 2 2048 1698958 10324440 2 4096 1731841 12201611 2 8192 1698958 13421772 4 512 1332185 5478274 4 1024 1516584 7354396 4 2048 1593088 8801162 4 4096 1579032 9942053 4 8192 1612224 10956549 8 512 1319093 5506368 8 1024 1569797 7405116 8 2048 1619520 8947848 8 4096 1612224 9942053 8 8192 1593088 10956549 16 512 1372194 1626881 16 1024 1544952 1607397 16 2048 1654455 1770390 16 4096 1668596 1837026 16 8192 1653182 1824540 Completed series of tests FreeBSD V2.2-experimental compiled with "-O2 -fomit-frame-pointer -fno-strength-reduce -m486, and MULTI-BLOCK" (This is similar to the way Linux 1.3.20 is compiled) IOZONE: Performance Test of Sequential File I/O -- V2.01 (10/21/94) By Bill Norcott Operating System: POSIX 1003.1-1990 -- using fsync() IOZONE: auto-test mode MB reclen bytes/sec written bytes/sec read 1 512 1458888 5592405 1 1024 1720740 6391320 1 2048 1890390 12201611 1 4096 2033601 14913080 1 8192 2033601 16777216 2 512 1533916 5835553 2 1024 1864135 8947848 2 2048 2130440 12201611 2 4096 2218474 14913080 2 8192 2255760 17895697 4 512 1529546 5263440 4 1024 1877171 7780737 4 2048 2122019 10129639 4 4096 2265278 12201611 4 8192 2462710 13421772 8 512 1529546 5289368 8 1024 1731841 7780737 8 2048 1992099 10129639 8 4096 2060924 11930464 8 8192 2134675 13256071 16 512 1495462 1870630 16 1024 1846503 2078880 16 2048 2062904 2184622 16 4096 2191309 2246321 16 8192 2138927 2282129 Completed series of tests Linux 1.3.20: IOZONE: Performance Test of Sequential File I/O -- V2.01 (10/21/94) By Bill Norcott Operating System: POSIX 1003.1-1990 -- using fsync() IOZONE: auto-test mode MB reclen bytes/sec written bytes/sec read 1 512 1565038 4559026 1 1024 1777247 6990506 1 2048 1691251 7489828 1 4096 1718977 8065969 1 8192 1718977 8065969 2 512 1436405 4462025 2 1024 1407484 6765006 2 2048 1487341 7231558 2 4096 1446311 7767229 2 8192 1487341 8065969 4 512 1536375 4369066 4 1024 1651300 6657625 4 2048 1600879 7358428 4 4096 1594792 7626007 4 8192 1644825 7767229 8 512 1613193 4279902 8 1024 1607013 6657625 8 2048 1553445 7294441 8 4096 1594792 7626007 8 8192 1701543 7839820 16 512 1585748 922839 16 1024 1556328 1179003 16 2048 1614746 1290555 16 4096 1662756 1305619 16 8192 1638400 1246449 Completed series of tests Linux 1.3.20 with MULTI-BLOCK 16 enabled: IOZONE: Performance Test of Sequential File I/O -- V2.01 (10/21/94) By Bill Norcott Operating System: POSIX 1003.1-1990 -- using fsync() IOZONE: auto-test mode MB reclen bytes/sec written bytes/sec read 1 512 1691251 4559026 1 1024 1807889 6990506 1 2048 1872457 7489828 1 4096 1839607 7489828 1 8192 1807889 8065969 2 512 1664406 4369066 2 1024 1855886 6553600 2 2048 1855886 7489828 2 4096 1664406 7767229 2 8192 1889326 8065969 4 512 1607013 4324024 4 1024 1565038 6765006 4 2048 1588751 7358428 4 4096 1607013 7767229 4 8192 1542023 7108989 8 512 1628855 4324024 8 1024 1740375 6657625 8 2048 1784810 7358428 8 4096 1804001 7626007 8 8192 1788615 7839820 16 512 1747626 954335 16 1024 1760463 985156 16 2048 1798201 1040770 16 4096 1777247 1213103 16 8192 1798201 1493964 Completed series of tests NOTE: Linux appears to have less overhead on write system calls, but significantly higher overhead in reading buffer cache data. Note also, that when Linux actually has to read from the disk drive, the performance suffers significantly. Note also, that MULTI-BLOCK I/O doesn't appear to help the performance of the Linux disk I/O quite as much as it helps FreeBSD. ------------------------------------------------------------ Below are the Bonnie results: FreeBSD V2.1 - stable File './Bonnie.4152', size: 20971520 Writing with putc()...done Rewriting...done Writing intelligently...done Reading with getc()...done Reading intelligently...done Seeker 1...Seeker 2...Seeker 3...start 'em...done...done...done... -------Sequential Output-------- ---Sequential Input-- --Random-- -Per Char- --Block--- -Rewrite-- -Per Char- --Block--- --Seeks--- Machine MB K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU /sec %CPU 20 949 63.0 1711 16.6 819 14.5 946 61.5 1833 15.4 111.8 10.5 FreeBSD V2.2 - experimental running on J. Dyson's machine, with MULTI-BLOCK enabled "-O2 -fno-strength-reduce": File './Bonnie.417', size: 20971520 Writing with putc()...done Rewriting...done Writing intelligently...done Reading with getc()...done Reading intelligently...done Seeker 1...Seeker 2...Seeker 3...start 'em...done...done...done... -------Sequential Output-------- ---Sequential Input-- --Random-- -Per Char- --Block--- -Rewrite-- -Per Char- --Block--- --Seeks--- Machine MB K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU /sec %CPU 20 1035 71.3 2221 18.9 1050 14.7 1023 63.8 2233 16.9 59.9 6.9 Linux 1.3.20: File './Bonnie.7210', size: 20971520 Writing with putc()...done Rewriting...done Writing intelligently...done Reading with getc()...done Reading intelligently...done Seeker 3...Seeker 2...Seeker 1...start 'em...done...done...done... -------Sequential Output-------- ---Sequential Input-- --Random-- -Per Char- --Block--- -Rewrite-- -Per Char- --Block--- --Seeks--- Machine MB K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU K/sec %CPU /sec %CPU 20 1055 89.5 2066 64.8 695 43.6 626 65.1 1326 68.7 235.1 47.1 NOTE: The very high random seeks and the sequential output perf are probably due to the asynchronous writes that Linux uses. Note also that Linux appears to use much more CPU for I/O operations. (It is probable, however, that the FreeBSD version of bonnie does not properly measure the overhead of IDE PIO operations.) If MULTI-BLOCK I/O is enabled, FreeBSD can easily surpass the write performance of the Linux results above, but the MULTI-BLOCK I/O mode has not been enabled for this Linux test. ------------------------------------------------------------------ FreeBSD Linux Null syscall: 20 8 usecs ^^ Really a write system call to /dev/null, not really null. Getpid syscall: 7.99 5.57 usecs Pipe latency: 284 79 usecs UDP latency: 613 643 usecs TCP latency: 689 1353 usecs RPC/udp latency: 1117 1088 usecs RPC/tcp latency: 1181 1967 usecs TCP/IP connection: 1108 1550 usecs Socket using localhost: 5.11 2.08 MB/sec (A minor mod needed to be made to the socket using localhost benchmark for FreeBSD to run the test correctly.) USING STATIC PROGRAMS: Process fork+exit: 3249 4380 usecs Process fork+execve: 6838 9365 usecs Process fork+/bin/sh -c: 27156 44115 usecs USING STATIC PROGRAMS, FreeBSD compiled with -fomit-frame-pointer: Process fork+exit: 2821 usecs Process fork+execve: 5917 usecs Process fork+/bin/sh -c: 25382 usecs LINKED WITH SUNOS STYLE SHARED LIBS: FreeBSD Linux Process fork+exit: 6162 usecs ----- Process fork+execve: 27716 usecs ----- Process fork+/bin/sh -c: 49842 usecs ----- FreeBSD Compiled with -fomit-frame-pointer Process fork+exit: 5716 usecs ----- Process fork+execve: 26356 usecs ----- Process fork+/bin/sh -c: 48124 usecs ----- LINKED WITH OLD-STYLE JUMP-TABLE SHARED LIBS FreeBSD Linux Process fork+exit: ------ 6629 usecs Process fork+execve: ------ 19877 usecs Process fork+/bin/sh -c: ------ 58735 usecs Pipe bandwidth: 6.82 12.33 MB/sec ^^^^ Pipe buffer size being increased in V2.2, this result will be close to 8-9MB. File bandwidth: 1730 1734 KB/sec Pagefaults on /tmp/XXX: 67 228 usecs It appears that compiling FreeBSD with -fomit-frame-pointer doesn't help much, but people in very time critical applications might want to compile the kernel with this flag. However, by supplying this flag, kernel tracebacks are frustrating. --------------------------------------------------- mmap times in microseconds: FreeBSD Linux 0.01 132 78 0.25 536 78 0.50 749 77 1.00 1092 77 2.00 1845 78 ^^^^ Freebsd doesn't preload segments > 2MB (most shared libs are smaller than that.) 3.00 117 75 4.00 114 77 5.00 125 79 6.00 147 79 7.00 117 80 8.00 133 79 Mmap times are not that critical, and the future pagefault times are spead up signficantly by the methods used in FreeBSD. ------------------------------------------------------------- File read bandwidth FreeBSD Linux 0.02 2.35 2.25 0.03 5.09 4.58 0.06 9.93 9.35 0.12 12.37 10.18 0.19 7.96 10.12 ^^^^^ GLITCH 0.25 13.33 9.80 0.38 12.68 8.95 0.50 10.27 8.61 0.75 10.60 8.29 1.00 13.91 8.15 1.50 13.85 8.06 2.00 12.59 8.03 2.50 13.04 8.03 3.00 10.02 7.96 3.50 10.36 7.94 4.00 11.16 7.94 5.00 11.18 7.91 6.00 10.38 7.95 7.00 11.34 7.95 8.00 11.25 7.94 Mmap read bandwidth: FreeBSD Linux 0.02 26.66 7.88 0.03 27.70 8.44 0.06 26.65 7.91 0.12 27.04 7.58 0.19 25.34 7.38 0.25 24.64 7.07 0.38 21.48 6.64 0.50 21.42 6.48 0.75 21.66 6.35 1.00 22.74 6.31 1.50 22.61 6.63 2.00 22.23 6.60 2.50 15.43 6.82 3.00 15.43 6.69 3.50 15.61 6.59 4.00 15.64 6.75 5.00 15.40 6.11 6.00 15.94 6.07 7.00 15.36 5.85 8.00 15.59 5.58 Libc bcopy aligned FreeBSD Linux 0.0625 28.05 19.33 0.1250 21.36 24.10 0.5000 16.17 16.57 1.0000 15.27 15.41 2.0000 15.17 15.45 4.0000 15.25 15.49 8.0000 2.57 0.17 Libc bcopy unaligned FreeBSD Linux 0.0625 27.26 24.32 0.1250 23.61 21.08 0.5000 16.97 17.57 1.0000 16.37 16.64 2.0000 16.33 16.64 4.0000 16.33 16.50 8.0000 2.84 0.18 Unrolled bcopy aligned FreeBSD Linux 0.0625 11.93 26.68 0.1250 11.83 21.33 0.5000 11.54 16.78 ^^^^^ DATA PROBLEM, PROBABLY SOME DAEMON DECIDED TO DO SOMETHING ADDITIONAL MEASUREMENTS HAVEN'T SHOWN THIS PROBLEM. 1.0000 15.41 15.58 2.0000 15.37 15.58 4.0000 14.78 15.56 8.0000 1.34 0.18 Unrolled bcopy unaligned FreeBSD Linux 0.0625 25.48 7.34 0.1250 21.44 7.46 0.5000 16.50 6.61 1.0000 15.41 6.53 2.0000 15.13 6.50 4.0000 14.73 6.51 ^^^^ REALLY ODD... I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THESE NUMBERS..., SHOULD BE ABOUT 15MB/sec. Subsequent runs verify that these measurements are wrong. 8.0000 1.29 0.18 Note that Linux does not appear to be able to run as nicely when memory starved. The 8MB cp results show the effects of paging (thrashing.) FreeBSD can manifest similar behaviour, but usually at a higher memory load. ----------------------------------------------------------- File system latency FreeBSD: 0k 1000 39 90 1k 1000 35 36 4k 1000 34 36 10k 1000 27 36 FreeBSD-2.2-experimental with async meta-writes turned on, much safer than pure async in Linux case below: 0k 1000 219 228 1k 1000 133 86 4k 1000 99 186 10k 1000 59 161 Linux: 0k 1000 243 2065 1k 1000 197 2265 4k 1000 163 2025 10k 1000 117 1637 Note that the ASYNC METADATA and FILE I/O REALLY SHOWS UP HERE!!!! From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 22:24:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA10448 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:24:54 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA10426 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:24:50 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA28982; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:31:16 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508230601.PAA28982@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:31:15 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9508221838.AA01109@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 22, 95 12:38:48 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1540 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert stands accused of saying: > It still could. You'd have to boot to an MFS first, which would up > by 3M the kernel size, but you could do it. That's a fairly shaky 'could' for demo purposes. > > Checking for contiguity is relatively trivial given the nature of the > > FAT filesystem; all this sort of 'health checking' can be easily > > included in the "do we accept this slab" tests. > > I think you missed my point: There needs to be a file system independent > way of checking contiguity in order to make the same shortcut possible on > HPFS and NTFS (to name two). Or ext2fs, to name three. 8-). Making a contiguous slab on either of those three would be nontrivial, and certainly falls outside the scope of what I was trying to achieve 8) > Ah. The device exporting code is the rub. It's not _necessary_ here. All that's needed is another 'mutant' slice like the 'compatability' slice that can be bent around to match the size and position on the disk of the slab. I've turned my brain to mush trying to comprehend the boot-time disk exploration code from a standing start, but that's not helping 8( > Terry Lambert -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 22:31:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA10943 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:31:12 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA10935 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:31:10 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA29009; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:37:39 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508230607.PAA29009@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:37:39 +0930 (CST) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221851.EAA19165@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 04:51:24 am Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1952 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > >Booting would probably be accomplished with fbsdboot under these > >circumstances. > > If you are booting with fbsdboot then you must be running DOS so you can > run utilities under DOS to find where the image file is and write the > offset and size somewhere. You could even write them to the partition > table after checking that this is safe. Restoring the original > partition table is harder. It could be done by running fdisk after > booting FreeBSD. If you don't write to the partition table then you > will have to pass the offset and size through fbsdboot to the kernel and > modify the kernel to add an entry to the slice table. That's what I was trying to get at - stuffing the bogus partition into the partition table would be less than fun; passing it in to the kernel for adoption as a 'mutant' slice would be tidy and ideal. Can this be done? What needs to be done to make it happen? > But this seems harder than using my previous suggestion: > 1. Boot with an msdosfs, cd9660 or ufs-on-cdrom root. This is Very Bad. Imagine telling a user that they had to create \etc, \bin, \dev etc directories just to testdrive. This loses bigtime. I'd much prefer being able to pass extra slice entries (note the plural) in to the kernel. Can we do this? > Does fbsdboot run under Win95? Under OS/2? Probably no, and definitely no. If you have OS/2 and a FAT filesystem, you can dual boot & run fbsdboot, and I suspect that under W95 you can drop down into 'doom mode' and run fbsdboot from there. > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 22:51:39 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA12506 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:51:39 -0700 Received: from web.azstarnet.com (azstarnet.com [169.197.1.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA12491 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:51:37 -0700 Received: from dialup98.azstarnet.com (dialup64.azstarnet.com [169.197.2.64]) by web.azstarnet.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with SMTP id WAA01965; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:49:58 -0700 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:49:58 -0700 Message-Id: <199508230549.WAA01965@web.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: maher@azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: majordomo@braae.ru.ac.za, questions@FreeBSD.org, ports@FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-FAQ@freefall.FreeBSD.org From: maher@azstarnet.com (maher katbah) Subject: Boca multiport card Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Does anybody know if Boca 16 ports card would work with freebsd 2.0.5 ? and can you use two of them? instad of terminal server, please include a hint how to configuer the server and the modems with them Is there any software needs to be run on the top of the FreeBSD2.0.5 to run Web server and what is the name of it? thank you From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 23:13:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA13406 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:13:41 -0700 Received: (from dyson@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA13394 ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:13:39 -0700 From: John Dyson Message-Id: <199508230613.XAA13394@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: Here are my benchmark results, so far To: dyson@freefall.FreeBSD.org.cdrom.com (John Dyson) Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:13:38 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508230524.WAA10428@freefall.FreeBSD.org> from "John Dyson" at Aug 22, 95 10:24:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1558 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > I hesitate to post this to the mailing list, but I don't have time > to refine these numbers. Permission is granted to use this information > in any way that you see fit. Note that I don't warrantee this information > at all. However, I have tried to be as fair and complete as I could be. > Caveat Emptor.... Here goes!!!! > Please apply the following fix (via patch) to the benchmarks that I emailed to you all. I made an error in cutting and pasting some of the results. The corrected results show that the paging perf of Linux is slower than the original posting. Sorry for the error... *** benches Tue Aug 22 22:23:59 1995 --- benches2 Tue Aug 22 23:07:15 1995 *************** *** 79,92 **** ! Checking fault performance on Linux (gaussian) Memory is now initialized, starting test 100 mmaps, 512 pages, 2560 pages touched per mmap REAL TIME: ! paging in time: 8192.3850 ms ! average time: 381.9265 us ! average time exc. paging in time: 224.1606 us SYSTEM & USER TIME: ! system time: 9610.0000 ms ! user time: 250.0000 ms Note that Linux has much slower paging and also --- 79,92 ---- ! Checking fault performance on Linux (backwards) Memory is now initialized, starting test 100 mmaps, 512 pages, 2560 pages touched per mmap REAL TIME: ! paging in time: 12461.3480 ms ! average time: 468.5169 us ! average time exc. paging in time: 227.4052 us SYSTEM & USER TIME: ! system time: 11120.0000 ms ! user time: 230.0000 ms Note that Linux has much slower paging and also From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 23:40:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA14087 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:40:19 -0700 Received: from hemi.com (hemi.com [204.132.158.10]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA14081 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:40:17 -0700 Received: (from mbarkah@localhost) by hemi.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id AAA13389; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:41:18 -0600 From: Ade Barkah Message-Id: <199508230641.AAA13389@hemi.com> Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port To: peter@haywire.dialix.com (Peter Wemm) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:41:17 -0600 (MDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <41cj7p$260$1@haywire.DIALix.COM> from "Peter Wemm" at Aug 22, 95 08:40:24 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1056 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > fn@pain.csrv.uidaho.edu (Faried Nawaz) writes: > >Ade Barkah wrote... > > > Hello, > > > > What exactly does it mean and do we need to be concerned about > > this ? Seems like someone ran a probe on us or something. > > >they're probably running kerbIV. this message is probably generated > >by a connection to the klogin (or eklogin) port. > > Doing a satan scan on a host causes this too... I think that's the > most likely - somebody's probed you... Yes, in fact my first thought was someone ran Satan on me (I don't have, er, courtney to detect it.) However, in this case I was able to trace the user and it appears that it was a kerberos login. Is there a better forum to discuss security issues for FreeBSD ? We are an internet provider and would like to keep up to date on possible problems. Thanks for all the help, -Ade -------------------------------------------------------------------- Inet: mbarkah@hemi.com - HEMISPHERE ONLINE - www: -------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 23:51:24 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA14629 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:51:24 -0700 Received: from netcom14.netcom.com (netcom14.netcom.com [192.100.81.126]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA14623 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:51:23 -0700 Received: by netcom14.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id XAA20289; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:49:04 -0700 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:49:04 -0700 From: hasty@netcom.com (Amancio Hasty Jr) Message-Id: <199508230649.XAA20289@netcom14.netcom.com> To: dennis@et.htp.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Sorry guys , can someone change the subject . I really do see enough of linux on Net . Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 22 23:54:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA14745 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:54:20 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA14739 for ; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:54:17 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA03473; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:54:11 -0700 To: Jim Lowe cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Samba In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:36:03 CDT." <199508221736.MAA18144@miller.cs.uwm.edu> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:54:11 -0700 Message-ID: <3470.809160851@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Has anyone ported Samba to FreeBSD yet? For more information the > URL is: > http://lake.canberra.edu.au/pub/samba/samba.html > > -Jim Sahib! /usr/ports/INDEX is your friend! :-) jkh@time-> grep samba /usr/ports/INDEX samba-1.9.13|/usr/ports/net/samba/samba-1.9.13|/usr/local|A LanManager(R)-compatible server suite for Unix|/usr/ports/net/samba/pkg/DESCR|gpalmer@FreeBSD.ORG|networking|networking Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 00:07:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA15126 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:07:43 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA15103 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:07:38 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id AAA03521; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:04:39 -0700 To: ache@astral.msk.su cc: Satoshi Asami , hackers@freebsd.org, peter@bonkers.taronga.com, ports@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape and mime.types? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:48:44 +0400." Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:04:39 -0700 Message-ID: <3519.809161479@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > BTW, I saw _two_ files in somebody mail: mime.types and mailcap. > I saw commit addition of only _one_ file (mailcap?). > Maybe I miss something? I think that mime.types is actually the "built in" part that Netscape aludes to in their FAQ. The mailcap file was the key missing component for me, and once I added it netscape did the right thing and did it rather well. It even asks me if I want to play the MPEG audio files directly or save them first to disk (to a temp file which it deletes) first. This makes it work well with both high-bandwidth and low-bandwidth links and you don't have to manage the temp files yourself for things you just want to listen to once and throw away. [If you do want to save it outright, you can always hold the shift key down as usual]. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 00:18:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA16060 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:18:48 -0700 Received: (from phk@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA16049 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:18:45 -0700 From: Poul-Henning Kamp Message-Id: <199508230718.AAA16049@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND To: imp@village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:18:44 -0700 (PDT) Cc: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl, peter@haywire.dialix.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199508222226.QAA11084@rover.village.org> from "Warner Losh" at Aug 22, 95 04:26:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 606 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > : Just throw away *every* fragment that has as its start byte a byte in > : the TCP/IP header. (so smaller then 40) > > That's the fix, but it isn't implemented yet in most Firewalls. Actually, since all IP-nets SHALL transfer a minimum MTU of 576 (or thereabout), there is no reason to receive a fragment with an offset of less. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Just that: dried leaves in boiling water ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 00:22:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA16291 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:22:33 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA16251 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:22:21 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id RAA08698; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 17:18:15 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 17:18:15 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508230718.RAA08698@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: curent@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >If there *is* a 512 byte limit in effect here, can I up DEV_BSIZE >to get around it? Lots of drivers assume that DEV_BSIZE is 512. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 00:34:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA16724 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:34:11 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA16718 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:34:08 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id AAA03655; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:33:46 -0700 To: "Rodney W. Grimes" cc: freelist@elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (Don's FList drop), jmb@kryten.atinc.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: your mail In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 12:27:05 PDT." <199508221927.MAA07396@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:33:46 -0700 Message-ID: <3652.809163226@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Due to my work load, and the growth of FreeBSD I can no longer meet the > ``demand'' for technical support contracts I am getting. I have had to > turn 3 down in the last 2 weeks. The time is getting very ripe for a > ``commercial'' venture in this area :-). "Jordan screams and runs away.. Not THIS again!" :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 00:34:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA16741 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:34:15 -0700 Received: from sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (sivka.carrier.kiev.ua [193.125.68.130]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA16577 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:30:56 -0700 Received: from elvisti.kiev.ua (uucp@localhost) by sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (Sendmail 8.who.cares/5) with UUCP id KAA07629 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:27:21 +0300 Received: from office.elvisti.kiev.ua (office.elvisti.kiev.ua [193.125.28.33]) by spider2.elvisti.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA20150 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:12:48 +0300 Received: (from stesin@localhost) by office.elvisti.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.6.9) id KAA07470; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:12:47 +0300 From: "Andrew V. Stesin" Message-Id: <199508230712.KAA07470@office.elvisti.kiev.ua> Subject: Re: do we need a freebsd-advocacy mailing list?! To: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl (Wilko Bulte) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:12:47 +0300 (EET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508221725.TAA00818@yedi.iaf.nl> from "Wilko Bulte" at Aug 22, 95 07:25:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha5] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 854 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello, # Gents, ladies, # # I start to get the impression that we need some sort of advocacy list. # -hackers seems to get flooded with all sorts of Linux nitpicking, I think that a polite request to move such a discussion to a newsgroup like comp.unix.advocacy or c.u.bsd.freebsd.misc together with corresponding Linux newsgroup (if you wish more noisy and fruitfull discussion) will be the best deal. btw this way FreeBSD will get much more attention. :-) # Wilko # _ __________________________________________________________________________ # | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl # |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands # -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- # -- With best wishes -- Andrew Stesin, Elvisti.Kiev.UA sysadmin. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 00:39:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA17046 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:39:35 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA17037 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:39:24 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA22998; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:36:10 -0600 Message-Id: <199508230736.BAA22998@rover.village.org> To: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND Cc: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl, peter@haywire.dialix.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:18:44 PDT Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:36:09 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : Actually, since all IP-nets SHALL transfer a minimum MTU of 576 (or : thereabout), there is no reason to receive a fragment with an offset of less. The MTU on many SLIP links is set to 296. In violation or not, that seems to work. However, I'm not sure how well things like DNS work in that case. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 01:08:21 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA17874 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:08:21 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA17868 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:08:13 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id SAA10195; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:06:55 +1000 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:06:55 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508230806.SAA10195@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: dyson@freefall.FreeBSD.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Here are my benchmark results, so far Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >NOTE: The very high random seeks and the sequential output perf are probably >due to the asynchronous writes that Linux uses. Note also that Linux appears >to use much more CPU for I/O operations. (It is probable, however, that the >FreeBSD version of bonnie does not properly measure the overhead of IDE PIO >operations.) If MULTI-BLOCK I/O is enabled, FreeBSD can easily surpass >the write performance of the Linux results above, but >the MULTI-BLOCK I/O mode has not been enabled for this Linux test. Bonnie's estimates of the CPU overheads are bogus for almost all systems. They are especially bogus for FreeBSD because the interrupt overhead is carefully separated from the interrupt overhead so it that it doesn't add to the (average) system time even for interrupts that happen to occur during syscalls. IDE PIO overhead for FreeBSD can be estimated very accurately by running benchmarks on unloaded systems systems and watching the output from `systat -vmstat'. The interrupt overhead gives the PIO overhead and the user+sys overhead gives the other overhead. There is no application interface for reading the interrupt overhead. Busmastering SCSI overhead is harder to measure. It slows down everything but there is no way of seeing the slowdown while the system is idle. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 01:24:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA18290 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:24:10 -0700 Received: from mail2.digital.com (mail2.digital.com [204.123.2.56]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA18284 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:24:07 -0700 Received: from tartufo.pcs.dec.com by mail2.digital.com; (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA16942; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:19:58 -0700 Received: by tartufo.pcs.dec.com (/\=-/\ Smail3.1.16.1 #16.39) id ; Wed, 23 Aug 95 10:19 MSZ Message-Id: Date: Wed, 23 Aug 95 10:19 MSZ From: me@tartufo.pcs.dec.com (Michael Elbel) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Newsgroups: pcs.freebsd.hackers References: <41a428$1aa$1@haywire.DIALix.COM> <11064.809015030@time.cdrom.com> Reply-To: me@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In pcs.freebsd.hackers you write: >There are better ways of doing this, BTW.. A company I used to work >for (Periphere Computer Systeme, GmbH) had something they called >MUNIX/NET which did all of the above and at very reasonable speeds. >Even then, many people praised MUNIX/NET as a superior solution to the >whole file sharing problem, even if it did require kernel modification >on both the server and client ends. It basically used the "superroot" >model for addressing other machines (/../machine/file) and you could >talk to everything from files to tape drives remotely - something you >can't do with NFS. Since you could also traverse mount points >successfully on the local machine, you got around that particular >foible of NFS as well. [...] >Some PCSers here talked about resurrecting MUNIX/NET and bringing it >back to life on FreeBSD, but I don't think that the legal powers were >ever willing to open the doors enough to allow it, so I suspect that >MUNIX/NET will die along with BETAMAX and OpenLook. Good solutions >shot dead by mediocre solutions with bigger guns.. :-) Unfortunately getting MUNIX/NET wouldn't be easy. I probably *could* get permission to rerelease the MUNIX/NET code under a BSD copyright. It's just that one can't simply give it away like it is. Especially the filesystem stuff is highly integrated into the SysV 3.2 filesystem code. You might say, it was hacked in at various places instead of trying to create a clean layer, which might even have been impossible, what with SysV R3 not having a vfs layer. This means, one would have to generate a whole new set of interfaces to use FreeBSD's vfs stuff. To do this, it would be necessary to closely look at the current code, which wouldn't be possible for anybody without a SysV source license :-( So, anybody with the knowledge to rip the SysV implementation apart and the license to look at it out there who is willing to do the job? Michael -- Michael Elbel, PCS GmbH, Muenchen, Germany - me@FreeBSD.org Fermentation fault (coors dumped) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 01:56:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA20373 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:56:13 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA20346 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:56:00 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA00318 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:35:06 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA01220; 22 Aug 95 20:39:15 CDT (Tue) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA01217; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:39:14 -0500 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:39:14 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508230139.UAA01217@bonkers.taronga.com> To: imb@scgt.oz.au Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199508221438.AAA21168@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> References: <9508220358.AA28423@cs.weber.edu> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <199508221438.AAA21168@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> you write: >Terry Lambert writes: >> without ruining the distintions in the kernel that cause some of the >> current install problems (ie: WD1007). >Is there any mechanism by which it is possible to get FreeBSD (-current or >otherwise) onto a WD1007 controlled drive ? Problems with WD1007? What problems with the 1007? (looks at 1007 he was going to use for a beater system) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 01:56:50 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA20467 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:56:50 -0700 Received: from pancake.remcomp.fr (pancake.remcomp.fr [194.51.30.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA20440 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:56:41 -0700 Received: from zapata.omnix.fr.org (zapata.omnix.fr.org [128.127.10.1]) by zapata.omnix.fr.org (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA00924 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:43:43 +0200 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:43:43 +0200 (MET DST) From: Didier Derny To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 2.05 --> stable --> current Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi I absolutely need to use a AHA2940W controller. which version of FreeBSD support this controller. Thanks for your help +---------------------+ | Didier Derny | | didier@omnix.fr.org | +---------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 01:56:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA20497 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:56:54 -0700 Received: from pancake.remcomp.fr (pancake.remcomp.fr [194.51.30.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA20441 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:56:41 -0700 Received: from zapata.omnix.fr.org (zapata.omnix.fr.org [128.127.10.1]) by zapata.omnix.fr.org (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA00933 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:47:14 +0200 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:47:14 +0200 (MET DST) From: Didier Derny To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 2.05 --> stable --> current Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Is it possibe to upgrade from 2.05 to stable or current without having to reinstall everything ? Is it possible to use sup to go from stable to current ? what are the main differences between 2.05R, stable and current. I current reliable enough to install it on a large server our should I only take the AHA2940W driver ? Thanks for your help +---------------------+ | Didier Derny | | didier@omnix.fr.org | +---------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 01:57:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA20566 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:57:14 -0700 Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA20537 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:57:08 -0700 Received: (uucp@localhost) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.11/PHILMAIL-1.11) with UUCP id BAA20961 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:48:32 -0700 Received: from merde.dis.org by merde.dis.org (8.6.11/MERDE-940323) id BAA11009; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:43:48 -0700 Message-Id: <199508230843.BAA11009@merde.dis.org> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: suggested (minor) change to /etc/rc X-Phone: (510) 849-2230 X-Snail-address: 2560 Bancroft way #51;Berkeley CA 94704-1700 X-Geek: GCS d--(-), p, c+++, l-, u+, e+, m* s++/+, n- h++ f+ g+ w+ t+ r y++ MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/x-pgp; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <11004.809167426.1@merde.dis.org> Content-Description: Pgp signed cleartext Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:43:47 -0700 From: Pete Shipley Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- I just setup a laptop with FreeBSD-current and i swap the sysconfig file around to change the identity of the system based on where I am. eg: /etc/sysconfig-home /etc/sysconfig-work gets copied to /etc/sysconfig [yea yea, no shit, I know... everyone does this :-] at Home I want to NFS mount my home-servers disk but on the road I do not want to use NFS. instead of also editing or swaping the /etc/fstab file I just changed the line in /etc/rc from: mount -a -t nfs >/dev/null 2>&1 to = if [ "X${nfs_client}" =3D X"YES" ]; then mount -a -t nfs >/dev/null 2>&1 fi thus if nfs_client=3DNO (from /etc/sysconfig) I do not even try to NFS mou= nt. -Pete PS: Next is to add a prompter to the /etc/rc script to prompt me on that sysconfig to use :-) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6 iQBVAwUBMDrqP3ynuL1gkffFAQErSgH+MAAYT07Tl1SHEjuOYJd+pD53Lj6z6pLs ipDYdSqQboeXNv936R1ibZ8RTKjtKl06/8kGTdNkMniLK4K7JKpDCA=3D=3D =3DjR8Q -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 02:00:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA21055 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:00:05 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA20980 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 01:59:42 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA00323 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:35:08 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA01301; 22 Aug 95 20:41:29 CDT (Tue) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA01298; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:41:29 -0500 Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 20:41:29 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508230141.UAA01298@bonkers.taronga.com> To: bde@zeta.org.au Subject: Re: Using space in a DOS filesystem Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199508221526.BAA13856@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <199508221526.BAA13856@godzilla.zeta.org.au>, Bruce Evans wrote: >The mount of root would probably fail if the partition was invalid. I >guess you could put the partition boundaries in the data for the program >replaces the standard boot loader. How are you going to select where >to boot from? Standard boot managers should be able to handle the >partition within a partition method (:-(). Who cares? In this environment you can boot from a DOS program, since you're guaranteed a DOS partition. Pass the bounds to the kernel any way you want... you're not constrained to the boot block environment any more. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 02:30:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA23761 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:30:00 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA23725 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:29:51 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id CAA04223; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:29:32 -0700 To: pedrosal@nce.ufrj.br (Pedro Salenbauch) cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, bugs@FreeBSD.org, questions@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Changing root and PANIC! In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 23:17:05 EST." <9508230217.AA01188@rocinha.nce.ufrj.br> Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:29:32 -0700 Message-ID: <4221.809170172@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [Please, just ONE group in the future - we don't need 3 copies of the same message!] > I tried several times to install BSD 2.0.5, but always had the > same problem: I am using the fourth "slice" of my SCSI hard > disk, "sd0s4" for BSD, but when I boot it, comes the message > "changing root device to sd2a" and PANIC! Yow! Why is it trying to boot from your CDROM, I wonder? It should be trying to change the root device to sd0a, not sd2a! Are you doing anything especially creative in the installation? I really don't see how this could happen unless you're typing something weird at the boot prompt. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 02:40:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA24286 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:40:55 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA24280 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:40:52 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id CAA04257; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:40:44 -0700 To: hasty@netcom.com (Amancio Hasty Jr) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Intercept :) In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:36:14 PDT." <199508230236.TAA25763@netcom14.netcom.com> Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:40:43 -0700 Message-ID: <4254.809170843@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Well, the linux people have a long thread on comp.sys.intel advocating linux: > What Linux needs to gain popularity? > Dream OS = Linux > > Would be nice if a few freebsd folks jump in there and change the subject hea ding > of the threads to include also FreeBSD. Can we CUT IT OUT with the petty Linux bashing in this group, PLEASE? Not only is the signal-to-noise ratio in -hackers gone to hell lately because of it, but I'm just genuinely tired of this general sentiment that in order to make FreeBSD more popular we somehow need to do so at the expense of Linux. There may be real merit to the point that going head-to-head with Linux would gain us some users, but I for one do not care to gain users that way. The end does not always justify the means! If people want to jump into comp.sys.intel and make legitimate points about FreeBSD as entirely separate threads then that's fine, but let's stop with the endless comparisons and backbiting, OK? On another point, I think that -hackers has become a cesspool again and unless people are willing to stop with all the -advocacy here then we're going to be forced to split into two groups. In either case, advocacy does NOT belong on -hackers! Please curb your enthusiasms or redirect to -chat where technical meat is not a required component of any discussion. I will even cease to drop my occasionally amusing one-liners in here since the problem has reached crisis proportions in -hackers and everybody from myself on down is going to need to work at bringing it back to an acceptable level. Thank you! Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 03:02:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA25817 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:02:07 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA25809 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:02:05 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA03401; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:01:56 -0700 Message-Id: <199508231001.DAA03401@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Intercept :) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 1995 02:40:43 PDT." <4254.809170843@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:01:51 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> "Jordan K. Hubbard" said: > > Well, the linux people have a long thread on comp.sys.intel advocating lin ux: > > What Linux needs to gain popularity? > > Dream OS = Linux > > > > Would be nice if a few freebsd folks jump in there and change the subject hea > ding > > of the threads to include also FreeBSD. > > Can we CUT IT OUT with the petty Linux bashing in this group, PLEASE? You know I will very very happy to leave FreeBSD not because is a good OS or a bad OS rather because of the lack of exposing FreeBSD. In my case the lack of exposing FreeBSD translates to more work for *all* of us. Later , Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 03:14:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA26380 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:14:33 -0700 Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id DAA26336 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:14:12 -0700 Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA02169 (5.65.kiae-1 ); Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:06:53 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Wed, 23 Aug 95 13:06:53 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by astral.msk.su (8.6.8/8.6.6) id OAA00904; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:01:35 +0400 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Satoshi Asami , hackers@freebsd.org, peter@bonkers.taronga.com, ports@freebsd.org References: <3519.809161479@time.cdrom.com> In-Reply-To: <3519.809161479@time.cdrom.com>; from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:04:39 -0700 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:01:35 +0400 (MSD) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.40 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Netscape and mime.types? Lines: 21 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1003 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <3519.809161479@time.cdrom.com> Jordan K. Hubbard writes: >> BTW, I saw _two_ files in somebody mail: mime.types and mailcap. >> I saw commit addition of only _one_ file (mailcap?). >> Maybe I miss something? >I think that mime.types is actually the "built in" part that Netscape >aludes to in their FAQ. The mailcap file was the key missing mime.types is needed for format extensions: i.e. when I want to handle in my browser VRML (Virtual Reality Markup Language) [.vrm] or RealAudio [.ra], I need to add those types to make them known. I can't check right now, does U*IX Netscape have ability interactively add extensions and viewers? If not, we need to add mime.types too for this purpose. -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - FidoNet: 2:5020/230.3 : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 03:34:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA27417 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:34:48 -0700 Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA27411 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 03:34:45 -0700 Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id GAA12780; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 06:27:04 -0400 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199508231027.GAA12780@hda.com> Subject: Re: magneto-optical drives To: jbryant@airmail.net (Jim Bryant) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 06:27:03 -0400 (EDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508230208.VAA01722@gateway.airmail.net> from "Jim Bryant" at Aug 22, 95 09:08:51 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 769 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Is anyone working on drivers for magneto-optical drives? > > Is there an existing driver that will work with magneto-optical drives? It is difficult to know without seeing how the drive comes on line. Joerg has done some work with MO drives. If it comes on line as a type 0 (direct: regular disk drive) you may be up and running right away. If it comes on line as "optical memory" you'll have some work to do, though I'll be sending Joerg a patch to allow you to bring an optical memory on line as a disk at the end of this week. In any case you'll probably have some tweeking to do. Peter -- Peter Dufault Real Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 05:11:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA29814 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:11:12 -0700 Received: from palmer.demon.co.uk (palmer.demon.co.uk [158.152.50.150]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA29804 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:11:06 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by palmer.demon.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id KAA10106 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:54:27 +0100 X-Message: This is a dial-up site. Quick responses to e-mails should not be relied upon. Thanks! To: Ade Barkah cc: Peter Wemm , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: rlogin on illegal port In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 1995 00:41:17 MDT." <199508230641.AAA13389@hemi.com> Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:54:26 +0100 Message-ID: <10104.809171666@palmer.demon.co.uk> From: Gary Palmer Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508230641.AAA13389@hemi.com>, Ade Barkah writes: >Is there a better forum to discuss security issues for FreeBSD ? security@freebsd.org? Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 05:23:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA00373 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:23:07 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA00344 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:21:16 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA17407; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:20:47 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id OAA16862; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:20:47 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA15702; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:17:27 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508231117.NAA15702@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: magneto-optical drives To: jbryant@airmail.net (Jim Bryant) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:17:26 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508230208.VAA01722@gateway.airmail.net> from "Jim Bryant" at Aug 22, 95 09:08:51 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 758 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Jim Bryant wrote: > > Is anyone working on drivers for magneto-optical drives? > > Is there an existing driver that will work with magneto-optical drives? Yes and yes (and partially yes :). You can jumper your drive to identify itself as drive type 0 (T_DIRECT), and use the sd driver. There's an `od' driver that has recently posted to a Japanese newsgroup. I'm currently in the process of integrating it into the regular kernel source. If you're impatient, i can send you what i've got by now, though there will be some additional changes required (currently being discussed on the freebsd-scsi list). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 05:23:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA00417 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:23:33 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id FAA00367 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:22:58 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA17477; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:21:54 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id OAA16920 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:21:53 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA16036 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:51:14 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508231151.NAA16036@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: NFS via loopback (was Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:51:13 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Brian Tao" at Aug 23, 95 08:50:25 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 393 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Brian Tao wrote: > > Aug 23 07:25:50 aries mountd[2630]: Gethostbyname failed > Aug 23 07:25:50 aries mountd[2630]: Bad exports list line /scratch aries,localhost Change the line in /etc/exports to not contain commas between the hostnames. ;-) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 05:39:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA01256 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:39:34 -0700 Received: from lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (lupine.nsi.nasa.gov [198.116.2.100]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA01250 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 05:39:32 -0700 Received: (from mnewell@localhost) by lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA14608; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:37:11 -0400 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:37:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael C. Newell" To: Bill Fenner cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Multicast on PPP devices In-Reply-To: <95Aug21.104401pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Aug 1995, Bill Fenner wrote: > Well, you appear to have numbered your PPP interfaces the same as your > ethernet interface. The BSD multicast routing code requires each > interface to be in a different subnet. (There's some chance that the > restriction can be relaxed to "have a different IP address", meaning > that you could use several addresses out of the same subnet, but each > interface definitely needs its own source address.) Actually ppp0 is 198.116.75.49 netmask 0xfffffff0, and the ethernet interface is 198.116.2.4 netmask 0xffffff00. Likewise the other end has ppp0 and ed0 in different subnets of 198.116.75.0. > Barring that, someone seems to have changed the INADDR_TO_IFP macro in > netinet/in_var.h to only search destination addresses, rather than local > addresses, on point-to-point interfaces. This will cause mrouted no end > of grief. Hmmmmm... I guess that was done so that ppp links can share IP addresses with Ethernet links? That may be the general case, but there are many cases (such as mine :-) were that is NOT desired. > I will check out the problem with disabling the phyint when it's down; > I would have thought that should work. Unfortunately, unless you want > to renumber your ppp interfaces and change netinet/in_var.h, you won't > be able to use native multicast over your point-to-point interfaces. Per your advice I added the line phyint ppp0 disable to the mrouted startup. Mrouted still failed, this time with an "invalid interface ppp0" error. Bummer... Thanks, Mike +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ |Mike Newell | The opinions expressed herein are | |NASA Science Internet Network Systems | my own, and do not necessarily | |Sterling Software, Inc. | reflect those of the NSI program, | |MNewell@nsipo.nasa.gov | Sterling Software, NASA, or anyone | |+1-202-434-8954 | else. | +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ | work: http://www.eco.nsi.nasa.gov/~mnewell | | home: http://www.newell.arlington.va.us | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 07:13:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA04381 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:13:41 -0700 Received: from dorite1.iquest.net (dorite1.iquest.net [198.70.36.70]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA04372 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:13:31 -0700 Received: from ts01-ind-24.iquest.net by dorite1.iquest.net with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #16) id m0slGYZ-001eNCC; Wed, 23 Aug 95 09:13 EST Message-Id: Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "David Taylor" Organization: Multi-Tech Computing To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:08:01 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: ODBC Support on Free BSD Reply-to: davidt@iquest.net X-Confirm-Reading-To: davidt@iquest.net X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I just ( finally ) got FreeBSD up and running. I love it!!! The problem has been one of hardware allocation, not problems with FreeBSD, by the way. Anyway, I am a full-time Systems developer and part-time consultant on the side, developing on MicroSofty Windows / NT in C/C++. Part of my full-time work includes accessing an MS SQL Server. ODBC Support on FreeBSD has actually 3 parts : 1) Currently anyone working on such a package ? 2) If so, Where can I get info / involved. 3) If not, I would be interested in investigating it myself. Where is there a good place or is it even possible to get the specification for ODBC's Protocol over the net. I believe that ODBC suppot would provide a window to adding a whole new demention into uses of FreeBSD as a Server / Systems Engine for intense processing that usually then requires a database. Since most business require a comercial database, and ODBC is being supported by a number of databases, I believe this makes since to pursue. David Taylor Multi-Tech Computing Indianapolis, IN John 10:10 The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full. John 10:11 "I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep. David Taylor davidt@iquest.com Multi-Tech Computing From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 07:18:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA04703 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:18:40 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA04682 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:18:25 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id WAA04102; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:17:59 +0800 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:17:56 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: attributions for images In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > On Mon, 21 Aug 1995, Brian Tao wrote: > > > Did you scale down the original to 1024 pixels across? I can > > provide originals at that size, if you want (and if it looks better). > > no i did not. i would be happy to distribute whatever size you provide. > scaling down does look better than trying to enlarge an image ;) The original as I designed it is 1500x660 (Tatsumi provided me with a 2700x2700 Daemon to work with!!!), which at 133 or 150 lpi should produce a banner that will just fit on an A4 sheet of paper (it'll be a bit tight on US letter at 133 lpi). > > hmmm....were these available earlier in the formats that i have? > i dont understand how the format could have been changed in the course of > the ftp..... ;| It looks like you may have saved it from Netscape or viewed/saved in a util that write GIF87 format. In any case, I've uploaded that part of my home to http://www.io.org/~taob/, which will be *much* faster for anyone outside of Taiwan. Both the large JPEG banner and the small GIF badge are available there. The Apache badge is there too, if you use that HTTP server. -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 07:26:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA05154 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:26:37 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA05143 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:26:28 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA02109 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:27:21 -0400 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:27:21 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508231427.KAA02109@healer.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: changes to rc files Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > swap the sysconfig file around to change the identity of the system > based on where I am. While were on the subject of reorganizing /etc , what do people think of changin the names of all the startup files so that they start with "rc". Something like: rc rc.daemon rc.i386 rc.local rc.netstart rc.ppp rc.serial rc.sysconfig The great benefit this gives is that I can just "grep foo rc*" to search for something related to startup... Also, in reorganizing /etc, I made an "/etc/inet" directory, where I put all networking specific information. Thus: All the /etc/rc files use these for the "set foo = `cat /etc/inet/fooish` " domain, fullname, def_route, ipaddr.ed0, sysname These have symbolic links in /etc for the things that look there: named.boot, resolv.conf, hosts, networks, screend.conf Everything else is told to find their files there: root.cache, hosts.namedb, rev.namedb, local.namedb, smb.conf This is really helpful since when I change to a different network, all I have to do is edit (or swap out for multiple configs) the files in this one directory (and maybe /etc/ppp) and I'm all set. Really crucial when you are cranking out FreeBSD network servers, so everything is in one place. -coranth ------------------------------------------+------------------------+ Coranth Gryphon | "Faith Manages." | | - Satai Delenn | Phone: 603-598-3440 Fax: 603-598-3430 +------------------------+ USMail: 11 Carver St, Nashua, NH 03060 Disclaimer: All these words are yours, except Europa... From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 07:28:11 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA05294 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:28:11 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA05286 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:28:03 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id WAA04125; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:25:03 +0800 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:25:03 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Mark Dawson cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 21 Aug 1995, Mark Dawson wrote: > > It has a couple of megs of battery-backed memory, two fast scsi-2 > controllers and does various levels of RAID on upto 14 hot-pluggable > disks - it screams along at RAID 0 and the nv-ram gives reliable async > performance. Switching to RAID 5 makes it really bullet-proof. Nice... what is the status of your RAID support in FreeBSD? I imagine you need some software to control the striping, placement of ECC slices, etc. (does RAID-5 include all that?) I'd *love* to try out one of these in a RAID config on a news server. :) > I have written a FreeBSD driver for this EISA card which is running very > happily on a Compaq Proliant 2000 (and hopefully soon a Proliant 1500). > Let me know if you're interested! Hrm... does it come in PCI flavour? Sounds like an interesting product that we should promote for FreeBSD. Perhaps your driver can go in the experimental branch for others to try. -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 07:49:50 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA06688 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:49:50 -0700 Received: from mailbox.syr.edu (mailbox.syr.EDU [128.230.1.5]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA06680 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:49:48 -0700 Received: from rodan.syr.edu (cmsedore@rodan.syr.EDU [128.230.1.55]) by mailbox.syr.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA20288; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:53:06 -0400 Received: by rodan.syr.edu (4.1/Spike-2.0) id AA18175; Wed, 23 Aug 95 10:49:12 EDT Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:49:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Sedore X-Sender: cmsedore@rodan.syr.edu To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: <199508221805.LAA00928@rah.star-gate.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk The Network Computing article test were done over FDDI. I got ~3MB/sec write and ~2MB/sec read while doing the tests. Note that the ~2MB/sec read was from a disk which only yielded ~2MB/sec when using IOZone locally, so a 7200 rpm drive may make the number go up. As I understand some of the NFS protocol issues, you probably won't see more than ~2MB/sec read from a single process anyway, so you'd have to use multiple IOZones or whatever other benchmark you use to break that barrier. These tests were sequential (though I did others for the article), and don't really represent a full picture of NFS. Results for operations other than long sequential reads or writes were less impressive (as discussed in other posts). The other issue to watch carefully with regard to FreeBSD NFS vs NT NFS is that NTFS journals filesystem metadata. I can hit reset on my NT box anytime and have my filesystems come back without trouble. I can't say this for *BSD. This journalling costs something, perhaps more than sync updates for metadata in ufs. What bothered me most about the NFS products is the rather poor design decisions that appeared to be made for some products-this reflects poorly on NFS implementors rather than NT. If you really want to do an NT vs FreeBSD comparison, build equivalent boxes with NT and FreeBSD+Samba, this will better compare NT vs FreeBSD. (I've actually got this setup in my lab, but haven't had the time to run benchmarks. I am using Samba on FreeBSD to serve video files to client workstations, because I could get the video to play w/out skips more reliably from FreeBSD/Samba than NT, using the same hardware). I will say that for high performance multithreaded programming, NT is a wonderful place to develop. I wish that I could say the same for FreeBSD, since I'd much rather make a home for my projects there. -Chris On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > >>> Brian Tao said: > > On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > > > > > Curious then, where is the time being spend in the NFS code? > > > > > > Given that we can drive the ethernet at near capacity and that the > > > disks are very fast . It pretty much leads me to believe that > > > the NFS code or protocol is the bottle neck. > > > > Are you talking about the case of synchronous writes to a FreeBSD > > NFS server? I don't expect the bandwidth in the other cases to climb > > any higher (already in the 800K/sec to 900K/sec range over 10Mbps > > Ethernet). > > > Should be interesting to find out the NFS performance numbers with > your configuration using fast ethernet. > > If they are very high, I suggest sending the performance figures to > Networking Computing 8) > > Cheers, > Amancio > > > > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 07:51:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA06912 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:51:51 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA06887 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:51:39 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA02545 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:24:15 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA16523; 23 Aug 95 07:58:09 CDT (Wed) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA16520; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:58:08 -0500 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:58:08 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508231258.HAA16520@bonkers.taronga.com> To: wpaul@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu Subject: Re: Small FreeBSD mention in InfoWorld Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199508230440.AAA20414@skynet.ctr.columbia.edu> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Technical correction: >"Win95 and Windows for Workgroups have a major TCP/IP bug that allows >anyone running Linux or FreeBSD [or any other UNIX system] with Samba >to access the entire drive of any machine that is sharing a directory. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 07:53:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA07177 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:53:49 -0700 Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA07167 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:53:46 -0700 Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14577(5)>; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:52:58 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177475>; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:52:52 -0700 To: "Michael C. Newell" cc: Bill Fenner , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Multicast on PPP devices In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 95 05:37:11 PDT." Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:52:51 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <95Aug23.075252pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message you w rite: >> Barring that, someone seems to have changed the INADDR_TO_IFP macro in >> netinet/in_var.h to only search destination addresses, rather than local >> addresses, on point-to-point interfaces. This will cause mrouted no end >> of grief. > >Hmmmmm... I guess that was done so that ppp links can share IP addresses >with Ethernet links? That may be the general case, but there are many >cases (such as mine :-) were that is NOT desired. Right. In fact, since multicast routing can't handle the shared addresses, I'm not sure what the point of doing it is. In any case, apply this patch to netinet/in_var.h; it restores the original behavior after doing the special pointtopoint behavior. Bill *** in_var.h Wed Aug 23 07:48:55 1995 --- in_var.h.new Wed Aug 23 07:48:12 1995 *************** *** 94,99 **** --- 94,101 ---- /* * Macro for finding the interface (ifnet structure) corresponding to one * of our IP addresses. + * + * Check destination addresses of P<>P addresses first, then look again. */ #define INADDR_TO_IFP(addr, ifp) \ /* struct in_addr addr; */ \ *************** *** 106,111 **** --- 108,118 ---- IA_DSTSIN(ia):IA_SIN(ia))->sin_addr.s_addr != (addr).s_addr; \ ia = ia->ia_next) \ continue; \ + if (ia == NULL) \ + for (ia = in_ifaddr; \ + ia != NULL && IA_SIN(ia)->sin_addr.s_addr != (addr).s_addr; \ + ia = ia->ia_next) \ + continue; \ (ifp) = (ia == NULL) ? NULL : ia->ia_ifp; \ } From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 07:59:17 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA07597 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:59:17 -0700 Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA07584 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:59:12 -0700 Message-Id: <199508231459.HAA07584@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Didier Derny cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.05 --> stable --> current In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 95 10:43:43 +0200." Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 07:59:10 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >Hi > >I absolutely need to use a AHA2940W controller. > >which version of FreeBSD support this controller. > >Thanks for your help > >+---------------------+ >| Didier Derny | >| didier@omnix.fr.org | >+---------------------+ > You should be able to install using FreeBSD 2.0.5, but the driver in -stable is much more "stable". :-) -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 08:38:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA09327 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:38:01 -0700 Received: from epsilon.qmw.ac.uk (epsilon.qmw.ac.uk [138.37.6.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA09314 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:37:48 -0700 Received: from canary.dcs.qmw.ac.uk by epsilon.qmw.ac.uk with SMTP-DNS (PP) id <07887-0@epsilon.qmw.ac.uk>; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:36:01 +0100 Received: from ruby.dcs.qmw.ac.uk [192.135.231.243] by canary.dcs.qmw.ac.uk (8.6.12/QMW-server-2.4s) with SMTP; poster "Mark Dawson "; id QAA14599; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:32:45 +0100 Received: locally by ruby (4.1/QMW-client-3.2b); for "md@dcs.qmw.ac.uk"; poster "md"; id AA26685; Wed, 23 Aug 95 15:38:32 BST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.ruby.cs.qmw.ac.uk.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.ruby.cs.qmw.ac.uk.sun4_41; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:38:32 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:38:32 +0100 (BST) From: Mark Dawson To: Brian Tao Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: References: Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [Resending this because it didn't show up in freebsd-hackers. Mark] Excerpts from freebsd: Brian Tao@gate.sinica.ed (691*) > Has someone made some sort of hardware add-on to > PC's like a miniature PrestoServe (say, with a max of 64 megs of > cache) with drivers for FreeBSD so it can flush data out to disk after > a reboot? That would be nifty. Take a look at Compaq's Smart SCSI controller (part #142055-001). It has a couple of megs of battery-backed memory, two fast scsi-2 controllers and does various levels of RAID on upto 14 hot-pluggable disks - it screams along at RAID 0 and the nv-ram gives reliable async-like performance. Switching to RAID 5 makes it really bullet-proof. I have written a FreeBSD driver for this EISA card which is running very happily on a Compaq Proliant 2000 (and hopefully soon a Proliant 1500). Let me know if you're interested! BTW is anyone running FreeBSD on a Proliant 1500 (triflex-pci motherboard)? Mark From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 08:48:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA10111 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:48:28 -0700 Received: from pancake.remcomp.fr (pancake.remcomp.fr [194.51.30.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA10028 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:47:59 -0700 Received: from zapata.omnix.fr.org (zapata.omnix.fr.org [128.127.10.1]) by zapata.omnix.fr.org (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA01717; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 17:43:25 +0200 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 17:43:25 +0200 (MET DST) From: Didier Derny To: "Justin T. Gibbs" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.05 --> stable --> current In-Reply-To: <199508231459.HAA07584@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk is it possible to get the driver from -stable and to insert it in the sys source tree from the cdrom ? It would be better if I could use the cdrom to install everything an then to install the new driver in the existing source code for /usr/src/sys. Thanks for your help +---------------------+ | Didier Derny | | didier@omnix.fr.org | +---------------------+ On Wed, 23 Aug 1995, Justin T. Gibbs wrote: > > > >Hi > > > >I absolutely need to use a AHA2940W controller. > > > >which version of FreeBSD support this controller. > > > >Thanks for your help > > > >+---------------------+ > >| Didier Derny | > >| didier@omnix.fr.org | > >+---------------------+ > > > > You should be able to install using FreeBSD 2.0.5, but the driver in > -stable is much more "stable". :-) > > -- > Justin T. Gibbs > =========================================== > Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM > FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations > =========================================== > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 08:59:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA10603 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:59:19 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA10597 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:59:16 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA08059; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:56:28 -0700 To: Mark Dawson cc: Brian Tao , freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:38:32 BST." Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 08:56:27 -0700 Message-ID: <8057.809193387@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have written a FreeBSD driver for this EISA card which is running very > happily on a Compaq Proliant 2000 (and hopefully soon a Proliant 1500). > Let me know if you're interested! We are, of course, quite interested! How much work would this to be to fold back into the system? Would you be allowed to do so by your employer? Thanks! Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 09:15:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA11177 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:15:12 -0700 Received: from eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (eikon.regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.42.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA11169 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:15:01 -0700 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.142.36]) by eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA07424; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:14:15 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA13528; Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:34:59 +0200 Message-Id: <199508221734.TAA13528@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol cc: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis), hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD in a Windows World In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 16:06:45 +0200." <199508221406.QAA07740@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> Date: Tue, 22 Aug 1995 19:34:58 +0200 From: "Julian Stacey " Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Re my > not freebsd , > suggest you find a newsgroup The cc hackers was accidental, was supposed to be private mail, I hit wrong exmh key. Julian S From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 09:37:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA12135 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:37:42 -0700 Received: from uclink.berkeley.edu (uclink.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.155.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA12129 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:37:40 -0700 Received: by uclink.berkeley.edu (8.6.10/1.33(web)-OV4) id JAA05138; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:37:26 -0700 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:37:25 -0700 (PDT) From: David Michael Holloway Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: Brian Tao cc: Terry Lambert , "Amancio Hasty Jr." , imp@village.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I am just checking but, so correct me if I am wrong, but aren't Diamond Stealth cards mostly incompatible with XFree86? because I saw an add in Computer Currents about a Linux system, that came with a Diamond Stealth. On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Brian Tao wrote: > On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > This is hardly what I'd call an equivalent to the Linux Publicity Project > > Web page and real press releases really mailed to real press contacts. > > I think a good start would be to mail manufacturers of FreeBSD- > supported hardware, telling them that their product works (and works > well) on FreeBSD-based servers. > > > It brings up the point that the "Powered by FreeBSD" logo usage should > > require notification of the URL to the "logo maintainers". > > I make that request on my Web page, but it's unenforceable. > -- > Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao > taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 09:59:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA12976 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:59:29 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA12939 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 09:58:01 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA26567; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:57:55 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id SAA19730 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:57:52 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA18128 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:57:27 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508231657.SAA18128@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:57:26 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "David Michael Holloway" at Aug 23, 95 09:37:25 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 646 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As David Michael Holloway wrote: > > I am just checking but, so correct me if I am wrong, > but aren't Diamond Stealth cards mostly incompatible > with XFree86? because I saw an add in Computer Currents > about a Linux system, that came with a Diamond Stealth. Only the old Diamonds. The newer (S3-based) are occasionally supported, depending on the chipset, RAMDAC and clockchip. Diamond has the habit of totally revamping the hardware base of their boards without bothering to change the name... -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 10:42:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA14192 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:42:23 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA14186 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:42:21 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA04656; Wed, 23 Aug 95 11:43:44 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508231743.AA04656@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 95 11:43:43 MDT Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, imb@scgt.oz.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net In-Reply-To: <199508230234.MAA31690@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 12:34:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Physically it is 36 but the controller should report 35...unless this > form of translation is regarded as a bug fix for the option base 1 > sector numbers :-). What happens if translation is enabled and the set > parameters command tells the drive that there are 36 sectors/ track? > Translation has to slip a sector for each track if translation is to > work. I guess the spare sectors should be inaccessible in translated > mode (you could specify sector 0, but the accumulated slippages stops > that from being related to a physical sector 0). The spare sectors are inaccessable in translated mode. They are also inaccessable (give an error) in non-translated mode IF the drive was not low level formated not in translated mode. > >The sparing doesn't actually go off unless you also disable translation. > > Yes it does. Of course you have to add 1 to the number of sectors in > the BIOS geometry and in disk labels to use the extra sectors. Think about this for a second. The BSD driver uses "LBA" -- or what the rest of the world has called absolute sector addressing before the DOS weenies started to pollute the world with their own vocabulary. Basically, that means that as I linearly traverse the drive space, every 36th sector is just... not there. > This can be handled by using adjusting the geometry in the smart driver. > Use a drive table entry with 35 sectors since 35 is all the BIOS can > normally see. Use 36 sectors in the smart driver. Other OS's will have > problems reading file systems written by the smart driver. The smart driver has to use geometry itself to translate logical absolute sectors to physical absolute sectors -- skipping the missing "36th" sector for each set of sectors. This is more information that a driver really want to have to know, and it may actually be impossible to provide. > I think all the BSDs used the disklabel values until I "improved" the > FreeBSD driver in 2.0.5. This is what the disklabel was for - for > specifying the final values to be used in case the hardware or BIOS > values are unavailable or wrong. The hardware values are wrong, and no matter what disklabel values you specify, they'll be wrong too, since as soon as I try to read the sector at offset 35 (option base 0) using the BSD driver, I'm going to get an error unless the driver (not the controller) translates this into a request for the physical sector at offset 36 (option base 0) and reduces the overall apparent drive size by 1/36th. The question now is how to make the driver do this. I don't think it's possible without a lot more crap than we want (or can fit) in the boot code. The answer is to reset the jumpers and reformat the drive, so it isn't necessary. Or only use BIOS calls, which isn't currently an option. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 10:43:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA14273 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:43:48 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA14262 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:43:47 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA04672; Wed, 23 Aug 95 11:45:05 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508231745.AA04672@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Intercept :) To: hasty@netcom.com (Amancio Hasty Jr) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 95 11:45:05 MDT Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508230236.TAA25763@netcom14.netcom.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr" at Aug 22, 95 07:36:14 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Well, the linux people have a long thread on comp.sys.intel advocating linux: > What Linux needs to gain popularity? > Dream OS = Linux > > Would be nice if a few freebsd folks jump in there and change the subject heading > of the threads to include also FreeBSD. It's a cross-posted flame-fest originating in comp.sys.powerpc. I'd leave it alone. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 10:47:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA14538 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:47:37 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA14532 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:47:35 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA04695; Wed, 23 Aug 95 11:48:49 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508231748.AA04695@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 95 11:48:48 MDT Cc: dennis@et.htp.com, taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <2945.809151091@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 22, 95 09:11:31 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > "Powered by FreeBSD" does not imply approval, nor should it. You're talking > > about restricting "free" advertising. Its like saying that only skinny girls > > can where your tee shirts. The idea is to encourage expansion, not make it > > more work. > > I'm inclined to agree. If people can't even say "I run FreeBSD!" in > public then we've somehow lost the original concept in our race to > make sure that potential for abuse is curbed. The point of the requirement was to allow their pages to be linked, not to prevent someone who is really running Linux from caliming he's running BSD. Of course, anyone claiming to run BSD on an obviously (to net clients) slow and unstable box of a non-BSD flavor *would* be giving "free negative advertising". That kind of "free", no one needs. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 10:53:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA14933 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:53:43 -0700 Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (sri.MT.net [204.94.231.129]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA14926 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 10:53:39 -0700 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA02758; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:55:49 -0600 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:55:49 -0600 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199508231755.LAA02758@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Updated tgdb_wish binary? Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm attempting to get tgdb 1.4 working ona 2.0.5 system, but the tgdb_wish binary I have is from 2.0, and it keeps dumping core. Does anyone have an updated wish binary, or a version that works in 2.0.5? Thanks! Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 11:00:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA15218 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:00:49 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA15211 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:00:42 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA04730; Wed, 23 Aug 95 12:02:10 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508231802.AA04730@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 95 12:02:10 MDT Cc: curent@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508230718.RAA08698@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 23, 95 05:18:15 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > >If there *is* a 512 byte limit in effect here, can I up DEV_BSIZE > >to get around it? I meant DIRBLKSZ in /sys/ufs/ufs/dir.h. The answer is "yes", I can, though the limit is artificially small. There is an assuption in the lib/libc/gen/*dir* code that at some point in the future that kernel/user page trades will at some point be possible. It turns out the dirent.h defines the system wide limit on DIRBLKSIZ to 1024. For anyone who's curious, 1024 is smaller than a page. Probably this ought to be increased to the page size (I'd hope using an include plus a #define DIRBLKSIZ DEFAULTPAGESIZE or something similar). So currently, the practical limit is 1024. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 11:03:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA15341 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:03:18 -0700 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA15335 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:03:15 -0700 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA09795; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:01:42 -0700 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199508231801.LAA09795@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server To: cmsedore@mailbox.syr.edu (Christopher Sedore) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:01:42 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hasty@rah.star-gate.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Christopher Sedore" at Aug 23, 95 10:49:07 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2217 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > > The Network Computing article test were done over FDDI. I got ~3MB/sec > write and ~2MB/sec read while doing the tests. > > Note that the ~2MB/sec read was from a disk which only yielded ~2MB/sec > when using IOZone locally, so a 7200 rpm drive may make the number go up. Even a reasonable 5400RPM drive will do 4MB/s, and I have seen some in the 5.7MB/s class. > As I understand some of the NFS protocol issues, you probably won't see > more than ~2MB/sec read from a single process anyway, so you'd have to use > multiple IOZones or whatever other benchmark you use to break that barrier. I have seen in excess of 3.5MB/s over 100baseTX using a single copy of iozone to a single disk. ... > On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > > >>> Brian Tao said: > > > On Sun, 20 Aug 1995, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > > > > > > > Curious then, where is the time being spend in the NFS code? > > > > > > > > Given that we can drive the ethernet at near capacity and that the > > > > disks are very fast . It pretty much leads me to believe that > > > > the NFS code or protocol is the bottle neck. > > > > > > Are you talking about the case of synchronous writes to a FreeBSD > > > NFS server? I don't expect the bandwidth in the other cases to climb > > > any higher (already in the 800K/sec to 900K/sec range over 10Mbps > > > Ethernet). > > > > > > Should be interesting to find out the NFS performance numbers with > > your configuration using fast ethernet. Mine are in the 2 to 3.5MB/s range using 4MB/s disk drives and 100BaseTx. I suspect this would go up if I was using 6 or 7MB/s drives. Also routing performance on 100BaseTx is not what I had though it was, it is much better and I have measured 5 to 6MB/s using ttcp through a 100Mhz async cache Pentium, suspect it would be much better with sync burst cache as the machine was quite memory bandwidth bound when running the tests. > > If they are very high, I suggest sending the performance figures to > > Networking Computing 8) :-). > > Amancio -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 11:13:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA16074 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:13:28 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA16066 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:13:23 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA04777; Wed, 23 Aug 95 12:14:53 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508231814.AA04777@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: ODBC Support on Free BSD To: davidt@iquest.net Date: Wed, 23 Aug 95 12:14:52 MDT Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "David Taylor" at Aug 23, 95 09:08:01 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > I just ( finally ) got FreeBSD up and running. I love it!!! > The problem has been one of hardware allocation, not problems > with FreeBSD, by the way. > Anyway, I am a full-time Systems developer and part-time consultant > on the side, developing on MicroSofty Windows / NT in C/C++. Part of > my full-time work includes accessing an MS SQL Server. > > ODBC Support on FreeBSD has actually 3 parts : > 1) Currently anyone working on such a package ? > 2) If so, Where can I get info / involved. > 3) If not, I would be interested in investigating it myself. Where > is there a good place or is it even possible to get the specification > for ODBC's Protocol over the net. > > > I believe that ODBC suppot would provide a window to adding a whole > new demention into uses of FreeBSD as a Server / Systems Engine for > intense processing that usually then requires a database. Since most > business require a comercial database, and ODBC is being supported by > a number of databases, I believe this makes since to pursue. Grab it from alt.sources and make a package. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. ] From owner-freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com Tue Aug 1 19:40:30 1995 ] Return-Path: ] Received: from freefall.cdrom.com by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) ] id AA06297; Tue, 1 Aug 95 19:40:27 MDT ] Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost) ] by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA11857 ] ; Tue, 1 Aug 1995 16:02:57 -0700 ] Received: (from majordom@localhost) ] by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA11689 ] for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 1 Aug 1995 15:59:46 -0700 ] Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) ] by freefall.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA11681 ] for ; Tue, 1 Aug 1995 15:59:43 -0700 ] Received: from LOCALHOST (LOCALHOST [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA16280 for ; Tue, 1 Aug 1995 16:59:37 -0600 ] Message-Id: <199508012259.QAA16280@rover.village.org> ] To: hackers@freebsd.org ] Subject: iODBC released ] Date: Tue, 01 Aug 1995 16:59:37 -0600 ] From: Warner Losh ] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org ] Precedence: bulk ] Status: OR ] ] Here's a blurb for this I saw in alt.sources. If anyone is ] interested, I pack-ratted a copy away. ] ] Warner ] ] alt.sources #502 (1) ] From: Ke Jin ] [1] iODBC driver manager -- an ODBC 2.0 compliant driver manager for Unices ] Date: Tue Aug 01 13:56:10 MDT 1995 ] Organization: Queen's University, Kingston ] Lines: 1462 ] Orgnization: Empress Software Inc. ] ] Archive-name: iodbc-2.0b ] Submitted-by: kejin@empress.com ] ] Title: iODBC Driver Manager ] ] Version: 2.00.beta ] ] Description: iODBC (intrinsic Open Database Connectivity) driver manager ] is compatible with ODBC 2.0 specification and performs exactly ] same jobs of ODBC 2.0 driver manager(i.e driver loading, ] parameters and function sequence checking, driver's function ] invoking, etc.). Any ODBC driver works with ODBC 2.0 driver ] manager will also work with iODBC driver manager and vice versa. ] ] Applications(which using ODBC function calls) linked with ] iODBC driver manager will be able to concurrently access ] different data sources through suitable ODBC drivers. See ] README file for detail. ] ] Author: Jin, Ke ] ] Platforms: SunOS 4.1.x ] HP/UX 9.x, 10.x ] Solaris (sparc)2.x ] Solaris (PCx86)2.x ] SGI Irix 5.x ] NCR SVR4 3.x ] UnixWare SVR4.2 1.x ] DEC Alpha (OSF/1) 3.x ] Linux ELF 2.x ] Windows 3.x ] Windows NT 3.x ] OS/2 2.x ] ] Copying-Policy: Freely Redistributable under GNU GPL ] ] Keywords: ODBC, database, SQL ] ] ============================================================= ] begin 644 iodbc.tar.Z ] < omitted to keep the list from killing me :-> From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 11:18:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA16430 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:18:02 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA16423 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:17:55 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id EAA31052; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 04:16:45 +1000 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 04:16:45 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508231816.EAA31052@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, imb@scgt.oz.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> >The sparing doesn't actually go off unless you also disable translation. >> >> Yes it does. Of course you have to add 1 to the number of sectors in >> the BIOS geometry and in disk labels to use the extra sectors. >Think about this for a second. The BSD driver uses "LBA" -- or what the >rest of the world has called absolute sector addressing before the DOS >weenies started to pollute the world with their own vocabulary. Nope. The driver uses c/h/s addressing to talk to the drive. This is the only mode that works for old drives. After I fixed translation in the driver two years ago, I used translated mode without sparing for a year before dumping my ESDI drives. I'm finding the problem hard to debug with the controller in the junkbox as no drives :-). >Basically, that means that as I linearly traverse the drive space, every >36th sector is just... not there. That would mean that translation didn't work. I used a simple translation that didn't change the sector numbers. On a drive with 35 sectors/track, in sector sparing mode the sectors are numbered 0 to 34 with sector 0 spare. In normal mode they are numbered 1 to 35; then they are all accessible and there are no gaps. >The smart driver has to use geometry itself to translate logical absolute >sectors to physical absolute sectors -- skipping the missing "36th" sector >for each set of sectors. >This is more information that a driver really want to have to know, and >it may actually be impossible to provide. I just learned from other mail (too much mail today %-) how to read the WD1007 jumpers. I don't want the driver to handle stuff like this for obsolete drives. >> I think all the BSDs used the disklabel values until I "improved" the >> FreeBSD driver in 2.0.5. This is what the disklabel was for - for >> specifying the final values to be used in case the hardware or BIOS >> values are unavailable or wrong. >The hardware values are wrong, and no matter what disklabel values you They can be fixed up if the jumper settings are known. >specify, they'll be wrong too, since as soon as I try to read the sector >at offset 35 (option base 0) using the BSD driver, I'm going to get an >error unless the driver (not the controller) translates this into a >request for the physical sector at offset 36 (option base 0) and reduces >the overall apparent drive size by 1/36th. Nope, using 35 worked in 2.0, at least if the translation mode jumper was right. The driver skips the spare sectors because it doesn't even know about them. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 11:34:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA17165 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:34:22 -0700 Received: from haven.ios.com (haven.ios.com [198.4.75.45]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA17158 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:34:20 -0700 Received: (from rashid@localhost) by haven.ios.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA19574 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:38:37 -0400 From: "Rashid Karimov." Message-Id: <199508231838.OAA19574@haven.ios.com> Subject: P120 PCI(Adapt.2940/SMC Eth.Power) and 2.0.5 - some problems To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:38:37 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1145 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi there folx, A few days ago I got a few P120 computers ( Triton chipset with PCI { Adaptec 2940/ SMC Ether Power/ Trident SVGA) adapters and 64 MB of RAM. The first server which I've upgraded runs ~4000 accounts with ~6 Gb of HDD space via 2 Seagate Barracudas. Quotas are enabled. First thing - the server dies once in while. It doesn't just lock up - it dies completely. Doesn't even reboot - just sits there forever. Console is dead, host is not reachable via nothing ( incl. network). No diagnstic messages in /var/log/messages. Second - I saw it in the first time - all processes die with ERR. 4 - interrupted system call. I wasn't even able to login from the console. After I passed thru login procedure, tcsh ( my default shell) just died on me :( Details : no X11 stuff runs on that PC. Does anyone have any advices on how to distribute IRQs between those 3 PCI adapters ? Is it important ? Server does work for some time ( ~20 hours - 2 days) before it locks up ... Any problems with Adaptec ( ahc) driver ? Should I upgrade to never version of the driver and where to get it from ? Rashid. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 11:51:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA17940 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:51:47 -0700 Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA17930 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:51:46 -0700 Received: from gemini ([13.231.132.20]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14452(2)>; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:51:08 PDT Received: from gnu.mc.xerox.com (gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com) by gemini (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA26706; Wed, 23 Aug 95 14:51:02 EDT Received: by gnu.mc.xerox.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA04751; Wed, 23 Aug 95 14:50:56 EDT Message-Id: <9508231850.AA04751@gnu.mc.xerox.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 08:40:28 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:50:53 PDT From: "Marty Leisner" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Funny... (btw -- I sent them a letter). I also made the point "You get what you Pay For" doesn't pertain to software (in IEEE Computer Open Channel, May, 1992). marty leisner@sdsp.mc.xerox.com Member of the League for Programming Freedom From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 11:59:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA18348 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:59:35 -0700 Received: from mail.infinet.com (ns.infinet.com [198.30.154.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA18342 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 11:59:25 -0700 Received: by mail.infinet.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #9) id m0slKxW-000JcwC; Wed, 23 Aug 95 14:55 EDT Message-Id: From: macgyver@infinet.com (Wilson Liaw) Subject: data needed for possible FreeBSD book To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:55:30 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 280 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I'm in the process of proposing a "intro to FreeBSD" book to O'Rieilly, the problem is, the editors aren't convenced that there is a market for it. So I'm looking for some hard data to prove to them the market is there. If you have anything on this, please let me know. Thanks From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 12:13:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA18896 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:13:13 -0700 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA18886 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:13:08 -0700 Received: from jolt.eng.umd.edu (jolt.eng.umd.edu [129.2.102.5]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with ESMTP id MAA25080 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:12:49 -0700 Received: from mocha.eng.umd.edu (mocha.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.16]) by jolt.eng.umd.edu (8.6.10/8.6.4) with ESMTP id PAA15181; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:07:37 -0400 Received: (chuckr@localhost) by mocha.eng.umd.edu (8.6.10/8.6.4) id PAA10305; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:07:41 -0400 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:07:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Nate Williams cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Updated tgdb_wish binary? In-Reply-To: <199508231755.LAA02758@rocky.sri.MT.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Aug 1995, Nate Williams wrote: > I'm attempting to get tgdb 1.4 working ona 2.0.5 system, but the > tgdb_wish binary I have is from 2.0, and it keeps dumping core. Does > anyone have an updated wish binary, or a version that works in 2.0.5? Our port of tclX, which is required for tgdb_wish, doesn't pass its own tests, it fails with a floating point error. It says it's dumped a core, but I can't find one. If you get a tgdb_wish, please announce it, I'd like a copy too. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 9120 Edmonston Ct #302 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and n3lxx, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 2.2 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 12:22:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA19337 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:22:27 -0700 Received: from halley.stars.sed.monmouth.army.mil ([158.9.11.166]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA19331 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:22:19 -0700 Message-Id: <199508231922.MAA19331@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Received: from nautilus.stars.sed.monmouth.army.mil.stars.sed.monmouth.army.mi (nautilus.stars.sed.monmouth.army.mil) by halley.stars.sed.monmouth.army.mil with SMTP (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA165941158; Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:05:58 -0400 From: william pechter ILEX Subject: Kermit inclusion with FreeBSD To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 12:05:37 -0400 (EDT) Reply-To: pechter@sesd.ilex.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1275 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Just saw the following posting from Columbia: I wonder what it would take for FreeBSD to put Ckermit in /usr/bin? Bill >> >> In article <40g83f$q78@vassun0.macau.ctm.net>, >> SAM, Chi-Kin (Mr.) wrote: >> >danielh@hpber002.swiss.hp.com (Daniel Huber) wrote: >> >>It should run on a HP (HP-UX 9.x) >> > >> >I should run on a HP. If it is available from U. of Columbia. Since >> >Kermit was invented for so many year. If is almost impossible for the >> >people at U. of Columbia to port a version of Kermit to HP versions of >> >Unix. >> > >> C-Kermit for HP-UX, all versions from 5.21 through the latest 10.x, >> is most definitely available from Columbia University. >> >> In fact, HP-UX 10.0 (and later) is delivered with C-Kermit installed in >> the /bin directory, by contract with Columbia University, along with all >> the supporting initialization files, etc. >> >> Other UNIX vendors should feel free to contact us to make similar >> arrangements. >> >> - Frank >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Pechter |Systems Administrator | N2RDI Ilex Systems |170 Patterson Ave | Shrewsbury, New Jersey 07702 908-532-2238 |pechter@sesd.ilex.com | pechter@stars.sed.monmouth.army.mil From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 12:37:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA19989 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:37:46 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA19979 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:37:44 -0700 Message-Id: <199508231937.MAA19979@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Rashid Karimov." cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: P120 PCI(Adapt.2940/SMC Eth.Power) and 2.0.5 - some problems In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 95 14:38:37 EDT." <199508231838.OAA19574@haven.ios.com> Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:37:44 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Any problems with Adaptec ( ahc) driver ? Should I upgrade > to never version of the driver and where to get it from ? > > Rashid. If you're not running the -stable version of the ahc driver, you should upgrade. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 12:47:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA20629 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:47:07 -0700 Received: from Xenon.Stanford.EDU (Xenon.Stanford.EDU [36.28.0.25]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA20622 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:47:06 -0700 Received: by Xenon.Stanford.EDU (5.61+IDA/25-Xenon-eef) id AA15982; Wed, 23 Aug 95 12:46:58 -0700 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:46:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Terry Lee To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ISDN Anyone? Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Is anyone in the US using ISDN to a local service provider using FreeBSD as a router for a LAN? If so, how to? I N T E R N E T Terry Lee, Technical Director D E S I G N 745 Stanford Avenue, Palo Alto, California 94306 G R O U P 415 424 0747 voice 415 424 0751 fax http://www.mall.net terryl@cs.stanford.edu http://www.mall.net/terry From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 12:52:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA20833 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:52:20 -0700 Received: from lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (lupine.nsi.nasa.gov [198.116.2.100]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA20826 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 12:52:18 -0700 Received: (from mnewell@localhost) by lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA15578; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:49:58 -0400 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:49:55 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael C. Newell" To: Bill Fenner cc: Bill Fenner , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Multicast on PPP devices In-Reply-To: <95Aug23.075252pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Aug 1995, Bill Fenner wrote: > Right. In fact, since multicast routing can't handle the shared addresses, > I'm not sure what the point of doing it is. In any case, apply this patch > to netinet/in_var.h; it restores the original behavior after doing the > special pointtopoint behavior. I think the point was so that in places where you connect one Ethernet network to an ISP you wouldn't have to use a whole (sub)-net for the PPP link. I *thought* one of the design goals of PPP was to avoid having to assign addresses to the link endpoints. Guess not??? Anyway thanks for the patch; I'll try it in the next day or so... :-)!! Mike +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ |Mike Newell | The opinions expressed herein are | |NASA Science Internet Network Systems | my own, and do not necessarily | |Sterling Software, Inc. | reflect those of the NSI program, | |MNewell@nsipo.nasa.gov | Sterling Software, NASA, or anyone | |+1-202-434-8954 | else. | +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ | work: http://www.eco.nsi.nasa.gov/~mnewell | | home: http://www.newell.arlington.va.us | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:03:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA21126 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:03:05 -0700 Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id NAA21120 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:03:03 -0700 Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14526(2)>; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:02:12 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177475>; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:02:07 -0700 X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.1 5/23/95 To: "Michael C. Newell" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Multicast on PPP devices In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 95 12:49:55 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:02:02 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <95Aug23.130207pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I am well aware that it is an accepted practice (esp. see rfc1812) to re-use local addresses. That practice breaks some of the original assumptions of the BSD networking code, in particular, that interfaces are on subnets. The multicast routing code was written with that assumption strongly in mind, and thus multicast routing doesn't work on interfaces which use the same local address. I'm not saying that it's an incorrect practice; I'm saying that if you do this, the current multicast routing code won't work. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:07:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA21306 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:07:45 -0700 Received: from haven.ios.com (haven.ios.com [198.4.75.45]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA21299 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:07:43 -0700 Received: (from rashid@localhost) by haven.ios.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA13040 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:11:59 -0400 From: "Rashid Karimov." Message-Id: <199508232011.QAA13040@haven.ios.com> Subject: Number of ptys in 205 - Any limits ? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:11:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 329 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi there folx, As of now I have 70 users working on my computer and it looks like the system is out of ptys, although I have all /dev/pty* created ( went thru whole 0-7 list) and kernel was compiled with 128 ptys. Are there any restrictions on the amount of ptys available to the users ? This is 2.0.5 P90 Rashid From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:20:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAB21687 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:20:54 -0700 Received: from vetch.cs.washington.edu (vetch.cs.washington.edu [128.95.2.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA21681 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:20:52 -0700 Received: from vetch.cs.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vetch.cs.washington.edu (8.6.12/7.2ws+) with ESMTP id NAA26659; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:20:41 -0700 Message-Id: <199508232020.NAA26659@vetch.cs.washington.edu> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.1 5/23/95 To: Bruce Evans cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 1995 17:18:15 +1000." <199508230718.RAA08698@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:20:41 PDT From: Voradesh Yenbut Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508230718.RAA08698@godzilla.zeta.org.au>, Bruce Evans writes: >Lots of drivers assume that DEV_BSIZE is 512. Hello Bruce, Can the block size different from 512 be used some day? I have been using 512 and 1024-block disk drives for the past 6 months. I had to hack more than half a dozen of files before FreeBSD can run. It would be good if I don't have to do it. My 1024 disk drive is a Maxoptic magnito-optical drive with 1024-block media. Voradesh Yenbut Computer Science & Engineering BOX 352350, U of Washington Seattle, WA 98195 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:24:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA21850 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:24:42 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA21844 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:24:34 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA07738; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:25:40 -0400 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:25:40 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508232025.QAA07738@healer.com> To: terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Is anyone in the US using ISDN to a local service provider using > FreeBSD as a router for a LAN? If so, how to? Sure. Hang a TSU/DSU off a 16550 serial line. Run PPP. Works fine here. We're even using it for a turn-key internet server solution (FreeBSD on a 486) as competition for Sun's Netra. -coranth ------------------------------------------+------------------------+ Coranth Gryphon | "Faith Manages." | | - Satai Delenn | Phone: 603-598-3440 Fax: 603-598-3430 +------------------------+ USMail: 11 Carver St, Nashua, NH 03060 Disclaimer: All these words are yours, except Europa... From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:32:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAB22140 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:32:02 -0700 Received: from lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (lupine.nsi.nasa.gov [198.116.2.100]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA22134 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:32:00 -0700 Received: (from mnewell@localhost) by lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA15794; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:29:24 -0400 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:29:22 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael C. Newell" To: Warner Losh cc: Brian Tao , Tom Samplonius , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! In-Reply-To: <199508230353.VAA12204@rover.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Warner Losh wrote: > : > Speaking of Windows and NFS, does anyone know of a good NFS client for > : > Windows? There's one on wcarchive.cdrom.com [aka ftp.freebsd.org] in either the simtel or cica directory. Sorry I can't remember more except that I downloaded it, installed it (with the WFW Wolverine stack) and it worked. It requires you to load a TSR though before starting Windoze so you lose some low memory. Personally I use SAMBA and WFW 3.11. Works fine for me... :-) Thanks, Mike +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ |Mike Newell | The opinions expressed herein are | |NASA Science Internet Network Systems | my own, and do not necessarily | |Sterling Software, Inc. | reflect those of the NSI program, | |MNewell@nsipo.nasa.gov | Sterling Software, NASA, or anyone | |+1-202-434-8954 | else. | +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ | work: http://www.eco.nsi.nasa.gov/~mnewell | | home: http://www.newell.arlington.va.us | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:37:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA22394 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:37:02 -0700 Received: from lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (lupine.nsi.nasa.gov [198.116.2.100]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA22385 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:36:59 -0700 Received: (from mnewell@localhost) by lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA15816; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:34:37 -0400 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:34:37 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael C. Newell" To: Paul Traina cc: tom@misery.sdf.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD port of netatalk In-Reply-To: <199508220740.AAA08211@puli.cisco.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Paul Traina wrote: > Send it to me, I've been thinking about doing a kernel port workup, > and this is actually something useful for me, so it might just get done. I think there's already an alpha port out there. Someone (sorry - I forgot who and my email on the subject got lost in a recent 1.1.5.1 -> 2.0.5 upgrade; I've not recovered it yet...) posted a message about this a couple of weeks ago and offerred to send the patches on request. I requested (and received) the patches but I've not tried it yet. Could the intrepid porter please stand up? :-) Thanks, Mike +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ |Mike Newell | The opinions expressed herein are | |NASA Science Internet Network Systems | my own, and do not necessarily | |Sterling Software, Inc. | reflect those of the NSI program, | |MNewell@nsipo.nasa.gov | Sterling Software, NASA, or anyone | |+1-202-434-8954 | else. | +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ | work: http://www.eco.nsi.nasa.gov/~mnewell | | home: http://www.newell.arlington.va.us | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:37:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA22460 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:37:37 -0700 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA22452 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:37:35 -0700 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id PAA18889; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:37:01 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199508232037.PAA18889@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU (Terry Lee) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 15:37:01 -0500 (CDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Terry Lee" at Aug 23, 95 12:46:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Is anyone in the US using ISDN to a local service provider using FreeBSD > as a router for a LAN? If so, how to? A pair of Motorola UTA-220 Terminal Adapters? T1 ----------------------- -------------> | gateway.inr.sol.net | s ----------------------- o | l | 10Mbps Ether . | n \|/ e ----------------------- t | wye.sol.net | ----------------------- | | RS232 @ 115200, PPP | \|/ ----------- | UTA-220 | ----------- | / \ PSTN (ISDN, 2 B channels) -- / | ----------- | UTA-220 | ----------- o | d | RS232 @ 115200, PPP s | . \|/ n ----------------------- e | gateway.ods.net | t ----------------------- | |---------------------------------------------- 10Mbps Ether ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:38:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA22510 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:38:02 -0700 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA22503 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:37:59 -0700 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id WAA26630 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:37:55 +0200 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id WAA24323 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:37:55 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.7.Beta.11/keltia-uucp-2.4) id VAA01397 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 21:29:11 +0200 (MET DST) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199508231929.VAA01397@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: Fancy fonts for FreeBSD console ... To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 21:29:10 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1022 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME7a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I don't think I've seen that in the lists... ------- start of forwarded message ------- From: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw (Chien-Ta Lee) Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc Subject: Fancy fonts for FreeBSD console ... Date: 21 Aug 1995 03:43:21 GMT Organization: Dep. Comp.Sci.&Info.Eng., Chiao Tung Univ., Taiwan, R.O.C. I had upload some fonts for syscons, which will make your console looks fancy. ftp://ftp.cdrom.com/pub/FreeBSD/incoming/syscons-fonts.* -- €£ªŸŠó®É, FreeBSD ®š®šªº·È¶i€F§Ú¥i·Rªº€p¹qž£.. §õ «Ø ¹F (Adonis) ¥æ€jžê€u ííŠa¥Í®Ú€F€UšÓ, Åý§Ú€ß·RªºPC³œÅDÂœš­ÅÜŠšÀs.. Mail: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw ------- end of forwarded message ------- -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.2-CURRENT #16: Tue Aug 22 01:54:17 MET DST 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:40:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA22785 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:40:34 -0700 Received: from gvr.win.tue.nl (gvr.win.tue.nl [131.155.210.19]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA22774 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:40:27 -0700 Received: by gvr.win.tue.nl (8.6.10/1.53) id WAA04617; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:40:20 +0200 From: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Message-Id: <199508232040.WAA04617@gvr.win.tue.nl> Subject: bpf output examples To: FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD-hackers) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:40:19 +0200 (MET DST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 128 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Does anyone have a pointer to a program that uses the write feature fopr bpf? Tcpdump only reads, as does libpcap etc.. -Guido From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 13:59:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA23594 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:59:33 -0700 Received: from tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de (tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de [131.159.0.81]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA23588 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 13:59:30 -0700 Received: from sunsystem5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de ([131.159.0.125]) by tuminfo2.informatik.tu-muenchen.de with ESMTP id <26537-3>; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:59:13 +0200 Received: by sunsystem5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de id <15879>; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:58:59 +0200 To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Path: hartl From: hartl@informatik.tu-muenchen.de (Anton Hartl) Newsgroups: muc.lists.freebsd.hackers Subject: make SO_KEEPALIVE optional for TCP NFS mounts Date: 23 Aug 1995 20:58:49 GMT Organization: Technische Universitaet Muenchen, Germany Lines: 9 Message-ID: <41g4q9$mm2@sunsystem5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: hprbg5.informatik.tu-muenchen.de X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #5 (NOV) Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Recently I ran into the problem of high ISDN bills :) and finally found that a NFS mount using TCP makes use of the socket option SO_KEEPALIVE to see if the connection is still alive; the default is 2 hours so my ISDN router dialed every two hours. So I'm asking if it is possible to add a mount option for TCP mounts to turn off the keepalive on the socket? If yes, I'm willing to add this myself, provided I don't have to have it done until tomorrow :) -Toni From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 14:30:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA24713 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:30:01 -0700 Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA24697 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:29:53 -0700 Received: from DATAPLEX.NET (SHARK.DATAPLEX.NET [199.183.109.241]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with ESMTP id OAA25830 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 14:29:35 -0700 Received: from [199.183.109.242] by DATAPLEX.NET with SMTP (MailShare 1.0fc5); Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:23:33 -0600 X-Sender: rkw@shark.dataplex.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:23:34 -0500 To: "Michael C. Newell" From: rkw@dataplex.net (Richard Wackerbarth) Subject: Re: FreeBSD port of netatalk Cc: Paul Traina , tom@misery.sdf.com, hackers@freebsd.org, Mark Dawson Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >On Tue, 22 Aug 1995, Paul Traina wrote: > >> Send it to me, I've been thinking about doing a kernel port workup, >> and this is actually something useful for me, so it might just get done. > >I think there's already an alpha port out there. Someone (sorry - I >forgot who and my email on the subject got lost in a recent 1.1.5.1 -> >2.0.5 upgrade; I've not recovered it yet...) posted a message about this >a couple of weeks ago and offerred to send the patches on request. I >requested (and received) the patches but I've not tried it yet. Mark Dawson provided it. I, too, got the patches and started to turn them into a "port". If you want my files, look at ftp://ftp.dataplex.net/pub/dataplex/netatlk.pkg.tar.gz I never got it to work on my many-zoned phase-2 ethernet. If anyone has additional patches, I will be happy to integrate them. ---- Richard Wackerbarth rkw@dataplex.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 16:10:50 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA29652 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:10:50 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA29646 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:10:49 -0700 Message-Id: <199508232310.QAA29646@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Probing all devices on Wide SCSI busses. Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:10:48 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've just committed changes to the SCSI config code to allow a controller driver to specify the maximum target to probe. If you are the author of a driver that is used on wide bussed controllers, please update your driver to probe beyond target 7. For an example on how to do it, just look at sys/i386/scsi/aic7xxx.c:ahc_attach(). The ncr and bt drivers are already marked with an /* XXX */ style comment where the change is necessary, but since I don't know the model numbers of the cards that need the change, I'm leaving that up to the authors. Thanks __ Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 16:20:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA29954 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:20:57 -0700 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA29942 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:20:52 -0700 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA00688 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:22:50 +0200 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA28885 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org); Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:20:29 +0100 Received: by iafnl.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA07944 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:23:16 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.8/8.6.6) id UAA01949 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:35:52 +0200 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199508231835.UAA01949@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: On ESDI install. To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers list) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:35:51 +0200 (MET DST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1115 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi there, Some time ago I promised to write a ESDI-Howto section of the FBSD handbook. From the confusion that still reigns I get the impression this is sorely needed ;-) My problem is I really are only slowly getting some idea about what should go into that chapter 8) There isn't much point in getting more confusion. Question: who has ever tried an ESDI controller != WD1007 ? I have one working myself now, but like to know how other controllers work. Although I'm hunting for a Adaptec 2322 I still only have a WD1007. And the 2322 has a number of variants. So: please send your input. Related question, might be a silly one: I just noticed that after installing 205R on the said WD1007 system the disklabel has rpm=0 and rotdelay=0. Why?? Rotdelay=0 is used for (e.g.) SCSI drives with caches, yes? Wilko _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 16:20:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA29962 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:20:58 -0700 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA29936 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:20:46 -0700 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA00681; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:22:44 +0200 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA28868 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:20:18 +0100 Received: by iafnl.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA07934 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:23:11 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.8/8.6.6) id UAA01891; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:23:14 +0200 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199508231823.UAA01891@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Install issues (was: State of the union speech To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:23:13 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: imb@scgt.oz.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508230139.UAA01217@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Aug 22, 95 08:39:14 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 858 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >_ > > In article <199508221438.AAA21168@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> you write: > >Terry Lambert writes: > >> without ruining the distintions in the kernel that cause some of the > >> current install problems (ie: WD1007). > > >Is there any mechanism by which it is possible to get FreeBSD (-current or > >otherwise) onto a WD1007 controlled drive ? > > Problems with WD1007? > > What problems with the 1007? > > (looks at 1007 he was going to use for a beater system) And I look at a 486/33 just humming happily with a WD1007 & 330 Mb HD. Running 205R btw. Wilko _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 16:53:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA00962 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:53:08 -0700 Received: from eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (eikon.regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.42.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA00944 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 16:53:05 -0700 Received: from vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de [129.187.142.36]) by eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA15460; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:52:48 +0200 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA05953; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:55:47 +0200 Message-Id: <199508231855.UAA05953@vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de> X-Authentication-Warning: vector.eikon.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Christoph Kukulies cc: gary@palmer.demon.co.uk (Gary Palmer), hackers@freebsd.org, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Subject: Re: Why Linux? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 22 Aug 1995 22:58:45 +0200." <199508222058.WAA01017@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:55:45 +0200 From: "Julian Stacey " Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Thanks to all the people who replied something like: "iX Multiuser Multitasking Magazin" (4/95). pp. 60 www.ix.de I'll go check the URL when I'm on line, & The mag. will also be at the AAchen FreeBSD meet 2&3 Sept. Julian S From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 18:43:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA04701 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:43:14 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA04686 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:43:09 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id VAA02735; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 21:36:39 -0400 Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 21:36:37 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: mail outages. To: gary@palmer.demon.co.uk cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Hi there > > Not sure if anyone else has noticed this, but I'm seeing e-mail > replies in mailing lists when I don't remember seeing the origional > e-mail. I've done some digging, and according to my local mail logs I > was never offered the e-mail (it was from John Dyson, message ID > <199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>). I've dug through the > mail log on freefall, and have come up with a blank. Either > bulk_mailer never resent the mail to me, or I have overlooked > something obvious. > > Anyone else seen this? Am I experiencing memory loss or e-mail loss? i have just checked the maillogs on freefall. the message in questions is: Aug 20 18:48:39 freefall sendmail[1536]: SAA01536: from=dyson, size=1095, class=0, pri=91095, nrcpts=3, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, relay=dyson@localhost this went out, or was spooled for delivery, to "everyone" within minutes. but remember bulk_mailer reorders the mailing list everytime it sends out mail. if someone is added or removed from the list, you may moved from one bulk_mailer'ed message to another. you may get stuck behind several slow sites or even sites that time out. this is one of the costs of the mail delivery speed up that bulk_mailer has given us. as a result of the reordering, you may get replies before you the see the questions!! more log data below, if you really want it ;) Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346 Aug 20 18:48:41 freefall sendmail[1545]: SAA01545: from=hackers-owner, size=1398, class=-60, pri=199398, nrcpts=3, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, relay=majordom@localhost Aug 20 18:48:44 freefall sendmail[1558]: SAA01558: from=, size=1558, class=-60, pri=679558, nrcpts=19, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, proto=SMTP, relay=daemon@localhost Aug 20 18:48:46 freefall sendmail[1561]: SAA01561: from=, size=1558, class=-60, pri=709558, nrcpts=20, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, proto=SMTP, relay=daemon@localhost Aug 20 18:48:48 freefall sendmail[1567]: SAA01566: from=, size=996, class=-60, pri=828996, nrcpts=24, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, proto=SMTP, relay=daemon@localhost Aug 20 18:48:49 freefall sendmail[1569]: SAA01569: from=, size=1558, class=-60, pri=799558, nrcpts=23, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, proto=SMTP, relay=daemon@localhost Aug 20 18:48:50 freefall sendmail[1571]: SAA01571: from=, size=1558, class=-60, pri=769558, nrcpts=22, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, proto=SMTP, relay=daemon@localhost Aug 20 18:48:52 freefall sendmail[1573]: SAA01573: from=, size=1558, class=-60, pri=769558, nrcpts=22, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, proto=SMTP, relay=daemon@localhost Aug 20 18:50:14 freefall sendmail[1575]: SAA01575: from=, size=1558, class=-60, pri=739558, nrcpts=21, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, proto=SMTP, relay=daemon@localhost Aug 20 20:09:25 freefall sendmail[7804]: UAA07804: from=, size=2168, class=-60, pri=140168, nrcpts=1, msgid=<199508210148.SAA01536@freefall.FreeBSD.org>, proto=SMTP, relay=ns.dknet.dk [193.88.44.42] so it came in as SAA01536 and went out as SAA01545 locally and went out to the net as SAA01558 SAA01561 SAA01566 SAA01569 SAA01571 SAA01573 SAA01575 UAA07804 SAA01558 had problems ;( Aug 20 18:50:15 freefall sendmail[1548]: SAA01545: to="|/home/majordomo-1.92/bulk_mailer -m owner-freebsd-hackers /home/mail/lists/freebsd-hackers", delay=00:01:34, mailer=prog, stat=unknown mailer error 1 Aug 20 18:50:15 freefall sendmail[1548]: SAA01545: SAA01548: return to sender: unknown mailer error 1 SAA01561 went without problems as did SAA01566, SAA01569, SAA01571, SAA01573, SAA01575, UAA07804 aside from the usual, no route to host, etc.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 18:43:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA04839 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:43:59 -0700 Received: from npd.ufsc.br (npd.ufsc.br [150.162.1.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA04614 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:41:38 -0700 Received: from mtm (mtm.ufsc.br [150.162.1.32]) by npd.ufsc.br (8.6.8.1/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA23044 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:39:09 -0500 Received: by mtm (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA06723; Wed, 23 Aug 95 22:42:22 EST Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:42:21 -0300 (EST) From: lenzi X-Sender: lenzi@mtm To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Help on diskless Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Please I need some help on configuring a kernel for diskless operation using a dos box. I could not found any info on how to setup the kernel. It boots on dos using fbsdboot.exe the system boots and displays "cannot mount root on wd0..." Of course, the kernel has wrong setup for root fs. Lenzi, Sergio email: lenzi@mtm.ufsc.br From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 18:59:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA05517 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:59:08 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA05511 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 18:59:07 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA06198; Wed, 23 Aug 95 20:00:02 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508240200.AA06198@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE To: yenbut@cs.washington.edu (Voradesh Yenbut) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 95 20:00:01 MDT Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508232020.NAA26659@vetch.cs.washington.edu> from "Voradesh Yenbut" at Aug 23, 95 01:20:41 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > In message <199508230718.RAA08698@godzilla.zeta.org.au>, Bruce Evans writes: > >Lots of drivers assume that DEV_BSIZE is 512. > > Hello Bruce, > > Can the block size different from 512 be used some day? I have been > using 512 and 1024-block disk drives for the past 6 months. I had to > hack more than half a dozen of files before FreeBSD can run. It would > be good if I don't have to do it. My 1024 disk drive is a Maxoptic > magnito-optical drive with 1024-block media. Are these bimodal (ie: 512 or 1024) or generalization (n, where n must be at least 512, but no one depends on the value) type fixes? Any change of rolling your diffs back into the main code base? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 20:03:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA07367 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:03:49 -0700 Received: from fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (Fieber-John.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA07347 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:03:32 -0700 Received: (from jfieber@localhost) by fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id WAA00380; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:02:58 -0500 From: John Fieber Message-Id: <199508240302.WAA00380@fieber-john.campusview.indiana.edu> Subject: Re: Samba To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:02:57 -0500 (EST) Cc: james@miller.cs.uwm.edu, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <3470.809160851@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 22, 95 11:54:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 209 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard writes: > Sahib! /usr/ports/INDEX is your friend! :-) better yet, http://www.freebsd.org/Ports/index.html -john === jfieber@cs.smith.edu ========== Come up and be a kite! --K. Bush === From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 20:09:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA07737 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:09:41 -0700 Received: from sains.ipch.shizuoka.ac.jp (sains.ipch.shizuoka.ac.jp [133.70.128.254]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA07730 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:09:38 -0700 From: purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp Received: from shzkgw.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp (shzkgw.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp [133.70.169.5]) by sains.ipch.shizuoka.ac.jp (8.6.12+2.5Wb4/3.4Wb5) with SMTP id MAA14322 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:09:40 +0900 Received: from amalthea.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp by shzkgw.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp (4.1/6.4J.6-shzk7) id AA09615; Thu, 24 Aug 95 12:09:05 JST Received: from jaguar.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp by amalthea.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp (4.1/6.4J.6-shzk7) id AA14025; Thu, 24 Aug 95 12:09:05 JST Received: by jaguar.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp (4.1/6.4J.6-shzk6) id AA01210; Thu, 24 Aug 95 12:09:02 JST Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 12:09:02 JST Message-Id: <9508240309.AA01210@jaguar.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Help installing IDE CD-ROM driver Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, there! I'm new at this mailing list. I'm sorry if this question is a FAQ. I just tried installing IDE CD-ROM driver (I got from ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/ FreeBSD/incoming/wcd11.tgz) into FreeBSD 2.0.5ALPHA but with no success. >From the "dmesg", see below, I could see that at least the kernel recognized the CD-ROM drive. But, it showed that the controller (atapi1.0) were not ready so that I could not access the drive. ... wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 on isa wdc0: unit 0(wd0) : wd0: 1549 MB (3173184 sectors), 3148 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S wdc0: unit 1(wd1) : wd1: 1222 MB (2503872 sectors), 2484 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S wdc1 at 0x170-0x177 irq 15 on isa ==> wdc1: unit 0 (atapi) : , removable, intr ==> atapi1.0: controller not ready ... By the way, the following are about my system: - Gateway P5-120XL with: - WD31600 HD set as a master in the primary IDE controller - WD31200 HD set as a slave in the primary IDE controller - Sanyo 3-Disk CD-ROM (3-CD Changer) drive set as a master in the secondary IDE controller - The CD-ROM drive works well with Linux although I can use only the bottom slot. Does anybody know the solution ? Please help. Thanks a lot in advance. Regards, Yusuf Wilajati Purna Dept. of Comp. Sci. Grad. School of Elec. Sci. & Tech. Shizuoka University, JAPAN (purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 20:32:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA09153 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:32:42 -0700 Received: from uuneo.neosoft.com (uuneo.NeoSoft.COM [198.64.84.252]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA09146 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:32:41 -0700 Received: from ris1.UUCP (ficc@localhost) by uuneo.neosoft.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with UUCP id WAA28372 for freebsd.org!hackers; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:24:07 -0500 Received: by ris1.nmti.com (smail2.5) id AA09582; 23 Aug 95 16:44:59 CDT (Wed) Received: by sonic.nmti.com; id AA23656; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 17:11:00 -0500 From: peter@nmti.com (Peter da Silva) Message-Id: <9508232211.AA23656@sonic.nmti.com.nmti.com> Subject: WD7000 jumpers To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 17:10:59 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 352 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk There's WD7000 drivers in FreeBSD, that means one of you guys has a WD7000. I have to get a WD7000 up under FreeBSD. Anyone want to tell me what the jumpers are? (the good news is, I've finally got FreeBSD in here. The bad news is, it's on an HP Vectra RS/20 with big old MFM drives and no SCSI card, and I've got this WD SCSI card lying around...) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 20:47:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA10033 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:47:33 -0700 Received: from phoenix.csie.nctu.edu.tw (phoenix.csie.nctu.edu.tw [140.113.17.171]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA10022 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:47:17 -0700 Received: from ccsun30.csie.nctu.edu.tw (jdli@ccsun30.csie.nctu.edu.tw [140.113.17.157]) by phoenix.csie.nctu.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.4) with SMTP id LAA03032 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:46:59 +0800 From: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw (Chien-Ta Lee) Message-Id: <199508240346.LAA03032@phoenix.csie.nctu.edu.tw> Subject: mount To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:46:06 +0800 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 403 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk HI : type mount on SunOS shows this for a NFS filesystem... dragon:/home-gcp/user on /tmp_mnt/u/gcp type nfs (rw,intr,quota,nosuid) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Can freebsd do this, too ? It will be more convenient.... Thanks.... -- §õ «Ø ¹F (Adonis) ¥æ€jžê€u Mail: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 20:49:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA10127 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:49:00 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA10119 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:48:40 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA04936; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:46:33 +0800 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:46:31 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: David Michael Holloway cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Why Linux? (fwd) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Aug 1995, David Michael Holloway wrote: > > I am just checking but, so correct me if I am wrong, > but aren't Diamond Stealth cards mostly incompatible > with XFree86? because I saw an add in Computer Currents > about a Linux system, that came with a Diamond Stealth. There was some support for Diamond cards in 3.1.1 and a lot more in 3.1.2. Diamond relented and disclosed some of the firmware entry points or driver hook locations (or somesuch techie nonsense ;-)) to their cards. From the 3.1.2 README: | Note: The Diamond SpeedStar 24 (and possibly recent SpeedStar+) boards | are NOT supported, even though they use the ET4000. The Stealth 32 | which uses the ET4000/W32p is also not fully supported. The Weitek | 9100 and 9130 chipsets are not supported (these are used on the | Diamond Viper Pro and Viper SE boards). Most other Diamond boards | will work with this release of XFree86. Diamond is now actively | supporting The XFree86 Project, Inc. Grab the X312doc.tgz tarball and scan through the README's for mention of Diamond support. It looks like most of the S3-based Diamond Stealth 64's are supported now. -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 20:50:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA10267 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:50:04 -0700 Received: from gdwest.gd.com (gdwest.gd.com [134.120.3.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA10261 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:50:02 -0700 Received: by gdwest.gd.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA18358; Wed, 23 Aug 95 20:51:13 PDT Date: Wed, 23 Aug 95 20:51:13 PDT From: eyfarris@gdwest.gd.com (Eblan Y Farris) Message-Id: <9508240351.AA18358@gdwest.gd.com> To: freelist@elf.kendall.mdcc.edu, henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu Subject: Re: Netsite communications server works Great Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk What is better with the Netscape server when compared to the NCSA? efarris From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 20:57:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA10764 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:57:07 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA10756 ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:57:04 -0700 Message-Id: <199508240357.UAA10756@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: eyfarris@gdwest.gd.com (Eblan Y Farris) cc: freelist@elf.kendall.mdcc.edu, henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netsite communications server works Great In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 95 20:51:13 PDT." <9508240351.AA18358@gdwest.gd.com> Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:56:58 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >What is better with the Netscape server when >compared to the NCSA? > >efarris The only thing I've seen is the HTML based administration tools. We're using their Comerce server here, but our main site will be running Apache since we can't justify the cost just to serve pages that don't need to be secure. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 22:22:31 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA14384 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:22:31 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA14360 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:22:27 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA01142; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 07:22:24 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id GAA03103; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:23:23 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id XAA19859; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 23:14:04 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508232114.XAA19859@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Number of ptys in 205 - Any limits ? To: rashid@haven.ios.com (Rashid Karimov.) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 23:14:04 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508232011.QAA13040@haven.ios.com> from "Rashid Karimov." at Aug 23, 95 04:11:59 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 467 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Rashid Karimov. wrote: > > Are there any restrictions on the amount of ptys available to the > users ? I think the number of available letter to name them is the biggest restriction. It's not as easy to add more letters to MAKEDEV, since most programs have a hardcoded idea which letters to use for naming ptys. :( -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 22:22:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA14413 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:22:36 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA14365 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:22:27 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA01145; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 07:22:25 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id GAA03188; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:28:17 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id XAA20050; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 23:35:45 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508232135.XAA20050@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE To: yenbut@cs.washington.edu (Voradesh Yenbut) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 23:35:44 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199508232020.NAA26659@vetch.cs.washington.edu> from "Voradesh Yenbut" at Aug 23, 95 01:20:41 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 789 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Voradesh Yenbut wrote: > > Can the block size different from 512 be used some day? I have been > using 512 and 1024-block disk drives for the past 6 months. I had to > hack more than half a dozen of files before FreeBSD can run. It would > be good if I don't have to do it. My 1024 disk drive is a Maxoptic > magnito-optical drive with 1024-block media. MOD's are certaily the only candidates that sometimes _require_ a different hardware block size (except you can also format floppies with up to 1024 or 2048 byte block size). I'm interested in seeing what you've got to change, since i'm currently working on integrating MO support. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 22:43:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA16059 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:43:03 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA16052 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:42:53 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA01998; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:49:56 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508240619.PAA01998@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: bpf output examples To: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:49:56 +0930 (CST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508232040.WAA04617@gvr.win.tue.nl> from "Guido van Rooij" at Aug 23, 95 10:40:19 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 668 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Guido van Rooij stands accused of saying: > > Does anyone have a pointer to a program that uses the write feature > fopr bpf? Tcpdump only reads, as does libpcap etc.. The code for CAP (an appletalk protocol stack) uses bpf to read and write. Have a chat to archie about it. > -Guido -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 23:07:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA16817 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 23:07:52 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA16810 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 23:07:48 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA19091; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:02:46 +1000 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:02:46 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508240602.QAA19091@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, yenbut@cs.washington.edu Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Can the block size different from 512 be used some day? I have been I think it can be used now if the driver supports it. Of course, file systems with a fragment size of 512 wouldn't work (unless the driver splits the blocks). DEV_BSIZE doesn't have much to do with hardware. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 23 23:22:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA17387 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 23:22:34 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA17378 for ; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 23:22:27 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA19754; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:18:09 +1000 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:18:09 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508240618.QAA19754@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl Subject: Re: On ESDI install. Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Related question, might be a silly one: I just noticed that after >installing 205R on the said WD1007 system the disklabel has >rpm=0 and rotdelay=0. Why?? Bugs in sysinstall in 2.0.5. I think you mean interleave, not rotdelay. Interleave is what sysinstall gets wrong. >Rotdelay=0 is used for (e.g.) SCSI drives with caches, yes? rpm and interleave aren't used (except to barf). rotdelay is set by newfs and tunefs, not by sysinstall, fdisk or disklabel. The default is 0. 0 is suitable for all drives with read and write caches, i.e., for modern drives, but can give very bad results if the caching is deficient. My ESDI drives had read caches but not write caches, so they wanted rotdelay=0 for read and rotdelay>0 for write. All nonzero rotdelays tend to be equivalent because they force sequential blocks to be separated on the disk and very few drives are slow enough to require a rotdelay of more than one block time. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 00:19:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA27176 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:19:03 -0700 Received: (from phk@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA27153 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:19:00 -0700 From: Poul-Henning Kamp Message-Id: <199508240719.AAA27153@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:19:00 -0700 (PDT) Cc: terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508232037.PAA18889@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from "Joe Greco" at Aug 23, 95 03:37:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 536 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Is anyone in the US using ISDN to a local service provider using FreeBSD > > as a router for a LAN? If so, how to? Anybody considering ISDN: Check out the new Zyxel 2864I, that is a killer-device for ISDN. Talks to analog modems too! http://www.zyxel.com -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Just that: dried leaves in boiling water ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 00:19:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA27238 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:19:15 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA27071 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:18:46 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA05448; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:11:30 +0800 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:11:29 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Joerg Wunsch cc: "Rashid Karimov." , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Number of ptys in 205 - Any limits ? In-Reply-To: <199508232114.XAA19859@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Aug 1995, J Wunsch wrote: > > I think the number of available letter to name them is the biggest > restriction. It's not as easy to add more letters to MAKEDEV, since > most programs have a hardcoded idea which letters to use for naming > ptys. :( One of best.com's shell servers reported 129 users on it. I wonder how they did it. 128 dialup users and 1 console user? :) 3:52PM up 2 days, 5:34, 129 users, load averages: 7.47, 5.60, 6.28 [shell1]-p8:2> uname -a FreeBSD shell1.best.com 2.2-BEST FreeBSD 2.2-BEST #1: Mon Jul 31 15:52:47 PDT -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 00:34:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA29582 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:34:55 -0700 Received: from trinity.radio-do.de (trinity.Radio-do.de [193.101.164.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA29560 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:34:50 -0700 From: Frank Nobis Message-Id: <199508240732.JAA05563@trinity.radio-do.de> Received: by trinity.radio-do.de (8.6.11/TRINITY-1.2.0-a) via EUnet for freebsd.org id JAA05563; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:32:47 +0200 Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: phk@freefall.FreeBSD.org (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:32:47 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508240719.AAA27153@freefall.FreeBSD.org> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Aug 24, 95 00:19:00 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 536 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > > > > Is anyone in the US using ISDN to a local service provider using FreeBSD > > > as a router for a LAN? If so, how to? > > Anybody considering ISDN: Check out the new Zyxel 2864I, that is > a killer-device for ISDN. Talks to analog modems too! > > http://www.zyxel.com > First it sounds good, but yesterday I did a test between a Mac with the Zyxel against a German ISP. We encountered one big Problem in the asynchron to synchron conversion. A MTU greater then 240 will result in CRC errors on the MacPPP. -fn- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 00:44:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA01593 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:44:01 -0700 Received: (from phk@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA01584 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:44:00 -0700 From: Poul-Henning Kamp Message-Id: <199508240744.AAA01584@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: fn@trinity.radio-do.de (Frank Nobis) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:44:00 -0700 (PDT) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508240732.JAA05563@trinity.radio-do.de> from "Frank Nobis" at Aug 24, 95 09:32:47 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 981 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > > Is anyone in the US using ISDN to a local service provider using FreeBSD > > > > as a router for a LAN? If so, how to? > > > > Anybody considering ISDN: Check out the new Zyxel 2864I, that is > > a killer-device for ISDN. Talks to analog modems too! > > > > http://www.zyxel.com > > > > First it sounds good, but yesterday I did a test between a Mac with > the Zyxel against a German ISP. We encountered one big Problem in the > asynchron to synchron conversion. > > A MTU greater then 240 will result in CRC errors on the MacPPP. Report it to Zyxel then, they are very open for bug-reports. Still, you cannot find that amount of functionality anywhere else and certainly not for that price... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Just that: dried leaves in boiling water ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 01:03:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA02823 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:03:41 -0700 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA02806 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:03:16 -0700 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id KAA17371; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:04:00 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199508240804.KAA17371@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Help installing IDE CD-ROM driver To: purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:03:59 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9508240309.AA01210@jaguar.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp> from "purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp" at Aug 24, 95 12:08:43 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1621 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Hi, there! > > I'm new at this mailing list. I'm sorry if this question is a FAQ. I just > tried installing IDE CD-ROM driver (I got from ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/ > FreeBSD/incoming/wcd11.tgz) into FreeBSD 2.0.5ALPHA but with no success. > From the "dmesg", see below, I could see that at least the kernel recognized > the CD-ROM drive. But, it showed that the controller (atapi1.0) were not > ready so that I could not access the drive. > > ==> wdc1: unit 0 (atapi) : , removable, intr > ==> atapi1.0: controller not ready I get the same report on my systems (both 1.1 and 2.0.5) with a Sony CDU55 unit mounted as slave on the primary IDE. Nevertheless, I can mount wcd1a just fine. The only thing that does not work is the audio-cd support. > By the way, the following are about my system: > > - Gateway P5-120XL with: > - WD31600 HD set as a master in the primary IDE controller > - WD31200 HD set as a slave in the primary IDE controller > - Sanyo 3-Disk CD-ROM (3-CD Changer) drive set as a master > in the secondary IDE controller If you still have problems you can try to switch the WD31200 and the cdrom. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 01:10:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA03354 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:10:37 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA03346 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:10:30 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA07181; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:08:37 -0700 Message-Id: <199508240808.BAA07181@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: fn@trinity.radio-do.de (Frank Nobis), jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:44:00 PDT." <199508240744.AAA01584@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:08:35 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Poul-Henning Kamp said: > > > > > Is anyone in the US using ISDN to a local service provider using Fre eBSD > > > > > as a router for a LAN? If so, how to? > > > > > > Anybody considering ISDN: Check out the new Zyxel 2864I, that is > > > a killer-device for ISDN. Talks to analog modems too! > > > > > > http://www.zyxel.com > > > > > > > First it sounds good, but yesterday I did a test between a Mac with > > the Zyxel against a German ISP. We encountered one big Problem in the > > asynchron to synchron conversion. > > > > A MTU greater then 240 will result in CRC errors on the MacPPP. > > Report it to Zyxel then, they are very open for bug-reports. > > Still, you cannot find that amount of functionality anywhere else > and certainly not for that price... Perhaps the Ascend Pipeline 50 can matche the Zyxel option. At any rate, PacBell offers a *free* Pipeline 50 if you signed up for 2 years. Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 01:19:32 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA03598 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:19:32 -0700 Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA03592 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:19:26 -0700 Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id JAA05170; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:20:23 +0100 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:20:22 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Help installing IDE CD-ROM driver In-Reply-To: <9508240309.AA01210@jaguar.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995 purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp wrote: > Hi, there! > > I'm new at this mailing list. I'm sorry if this question is a FAQ. I just > tried installing IDE CD-ROM driver (I got from ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/ > FreeBSD/incoming/wcd11.tgz) into FreeBSD 2.0.5ALPHA but with no success. > >From the "dmesg", see below, I could see that at least the kernel recognized > the CD-ROM drive. But, it showed that the controller (atapi1.0) were not > ready so that I could not access the drive. > > ... > wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 on isa > wdc0: unit 0(wd0) : > wd0: 1549 MB (3173184 sectors), 3148 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S > wdc0: unit 1(wd1) : > wd1: 1222 MB (2503872 sectors), 2484 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S > wdc1 at 0x170-0x177 irq 15 on isa > ==> wdc1: unit 0 (atapi) : , removable, intr > ==> atapi1.0: controller not ready > ... Did you try accessing the drive? I had this problem and I could access the drive without any problems. -- Doug Rabson, Microsoft RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 171 251 4411 FAX: +44 171 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 01:32:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA04475 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:32:04 -0700 Received: from mailhub.cts.com (mailhub.cts.com [192.188.72.25]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id BAA04466 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:32:01 -0700 Received: from io.cts.com by mailhub.cts.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #18) id m0slXhf-000UzgC; Thu, 24 Aug 95 01:31 PDT Received: (from root@localhost) by io.cts.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id BAA13528 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:32:00 -0700 From: Morgan Davis Message-Id: <199508240832.BAA13528@io.cts.com> Subject: How to rebuild /stand? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 01:31:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 276 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I'm curious. 1. Is /stand necessary after your system has been installed? 2. If so, is there a way to update it with the latest stuff? 3. If not, is it okay to remove it? (Please cc your reply to my e-mail address since I don't follow this list regularly. Thank you.) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 02:29:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA10246 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 02:29:23 -0700 Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA10226 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 02:29:16 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id CAA23005; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 02:28:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@freebsd.org, hardware@freebsd.org Subject: pcmcia/pccard stuff Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 02:28:38 -0700 Message-ID: <23003.809256518@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Now, my friends, the foundations are in the kernel for pcmcia and pccard support. Now we need people to jump in and make it work all the way. *** WARNING *** At this time this code is very green. In general I would say: UNLESS YOUR EMAIL CONTAINS A PATCH, AT THIS TIME WE'RE NOT INTERESTED IN THAT EMAIL. It doesn't work, it's not supposed to. People who know how to can make it work. Please wait for them to polish it up before complaining! I'd like to thank Andrew for doing all of this, it has been long time in the making, but that is not the first thing to do that. It is particular important for something as complicated as the pccard stuff to be done right from the begining, and that has now been done, I think. Thanks Andrew! The goals we need to reach now are: make pccardd work. get rid of if_ze and make if_ed do it. get rid of if_zp and make if_?? do it. add "generic modem" recognizion to pccardd. make sio.c power down the card when not opened. make if_ed.c power down the card when not opened. make if_??.c power down the card when not opened. make card-removal as robust as we can. Volounteers needed... Andrew has for various personal reasons not too much time and facilities for this anymore, so jump in if you can. I will prefer it you keep me posted and let me review changes BEFORE you commit them. Thanks! Now how to play: compile a kernel with: controller crd0 device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr modload /lkm/pcic_mod.o pccardc pccardmem 0xd0000 insert MEGAHERTZ modem pccardc dumpcis pccardc wrattr 0 0x200 0x21 pccardc enabler 0 sio1 -a 0x2f8 Have fun! -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Just that: dried leaves in boiling water ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 02:34:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA10598 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 02:34:12 -0700 Received: from bnr.ca (x400gate.bnr.ca [192.58.194.73]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id CAA10590 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 02:34:07 -0700 X400-Received: by mta bnr.ca in /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:31:08 -0400 X400-Received: by /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:31:02 -0400 X400-Received: by /PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/; Relayed; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:29:00 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:29:00 +0100 X400-Originator: /dd.id=cnt60637/g=barry/i=ba/s=scott/@bnr.ca X400-MTS-Identifier: [/PRMD=BNR/ADMD=TELECOM.CANADA/C=CA/;bcars520.b.954:24.07.95.09.31.02] X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2) Content-Identifier: FreeBSD vs. W... From: "barry (b.a.) scott" Message-ID: <"28955 Thu Aug 24 05:31:03 1995"@bnr.ca> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD vs. Window NT 3.51 boot problems Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk After installing 2.0.5R from CDROM I could boot MS-DOS, Windows NT 3.51 or FreeBSB 2.0.5R. FreeBSD is on my second SCSI disk. But Windows NT could not find its pagefile. It turned out that the drive letters had changed. I use N: for the Windows NT NTFS partion not D: as would be the default. Using the disk admin program told me that the signaure data that NT keeps on each disk was missing. I ask permission to put a new signature onto the disks. After this I could setup the drive assignments and NT was happy. But FreeBSD was not bootable from the MBR boot manager. I hit F5 to go to the second disk but hitting F2 to select FreeBSD just gets me the F1 to F5 list of options again. I'm using the bootstrap on the FreeBSD boot floppy to load wd(1,a)/kernel as a work around. Can anyone explain the confict with Window NT disk signatures? What is the MBR program looking for in the FreeBSD partition to be able to boot it? Barry Scott From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 03:22:51 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA12065 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 03:22:51 -0700 Received: from mail0.iij.ad.jp (mail0.iij.ad.jp [192.244.176.61]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA12059 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 03:22:48 -0700 Received: from uucp0.iij.ad.jp (uucp0.iij.ad.jp [192.244.176.51]) by mail0.iij.ad.jp (8.6.12+2.4W/3.3W9-MAIL) with ESMTP id TAA18079; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:20:14 +0900 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uucp0.iij.ad.jp (8.6.12+2.4W/3.3W9-UUCP) with UUCP id TAA14430; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:20:15 +0900 Received: from xxx.fct.kgc.co.jp by fender.fct.kgc.co.jp (8.6.12+2.4W/3.4W:95071117) id TAA03635; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:07:23 +0900 Received: by xxx.fct.kgc.co.jp (8.6.12+2.4W/3.3W8:95062916) id TAA18570; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:07:21 +0900 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:07:21 +0900 From: Toshihiro Kanda Message-Id: <199508241007.TAA18570@xxx.fct.kgc.co.jp> To: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl's message of 24 Aug 1995 12:19:38 +0900 Subject: bpf output examples Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Does anyone have a pointer to a program that uses the write feature > fopr bpf? Tcpdump only reads, as does libpcap etc.. > > -Guido Here's a very PART of my program which talks EtherTalk Phase 2. Pardon for comments in Japanese. See bpf(4) which once lost in FreeBSD 2.0 :-) You can write to bpf by: err = write(bpf_fd, ether_frame, len); Warning: If you use FreeBSD 2.0 or 2.0.5, Ethernet type field (ether_frame[12] and ether_frame[13]) must be in machine byte order NOT network byte order. I thought it's a bug and asked hackers@freebsd, though no answer was given yet. candy@fct.kgc.co.jp (Toshihiro Kanda) ---- 8< ---- 8< ---- 8< ---- 8< ---- 8< ---- 8< ---- #include #include #include #include #include #include /* open */ #include #include /* read */ #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include /* struct ifr */ #define BPF_BUFFER_SIZE 0x8000 /* bpf read buffer */ static volatile unsigned ringring; static unsigned char mac_addr[6]; static int bpf_fd; static unsigned int bpf_len; static struct bpf_program prog; static char *bpf_buf; static void (*callback)(unsigned long, void *, unsigned long, unsigned long); static int pipe_fd[2]; static int child; /* * bpf $B%W%m%0%i%`(B */ static struct bpf_insn insns[] = { /* GENERATED by tcpdump. source is: #!/bin/sh super tcpdump -dds-1 ' ( (ether[0:2] == 0x0000 and ether[2:4] == 0x1b384d97) or (ether[0:2] == 0xffff and ether[2:4] == 0xffffffff) or (ether[0:2] == 0x0900 and (ether[2:4] == 0x07ffffff or (ether[2:4] >= 0x07000000 and ether[2:4] <= 0x070000fc))) ) and ( (ether[12:2] == 0x809b or ether[12:2] == 0x80f3) or (ether[12:2] < 0x600 and ether[14:2] == 0xaaaa and (ether[20:2] == 0x809b or ether[20:2] == 0x80f3)) ) ' */ { 0x28, 0, 0, 0x00000000 }, { 0x15, 0, 2, 0x00000000 }, { 0x20, 0, 0, 0x00000002 }, { 0x15, 10, 0, 0x1b384d97 }, { 0x28, 0, 0, 0x00000000 }, { 0x15, 0, 2, 0x0000ffff }, { 0x20, 0, 0, 0x00000002 }, { 0x15, 6, 0, 0xffffffff }, { 0x28, 0, 0, 0x00000000 }, { 0x15, 0, 14, 0x00000900 }, { 0x20, 0, 0, 0x00000002 }, { 0x15, 2, 0, 0x07ffffff }, { 0x35, 0, 11, 0x07000000 }, { 0x25, 10, 0, 0x070000fc }, { 0x28, 0, 0, 0x0000000c }, { 0x15, 7, 0, 0x0000809b }, { 0x15, 6, 0, 0x000080f3 }, { 0x35, 6, 0, 0x00000600 }, { 0x28, 0, 0, 0x0000000e }, { 0x15, 0, 4, 0x0000aaaa }, { 0x28, 0, 0, 0x00000014 }, { 0x15, 1, 0, 0x0000809b }, { 0x15, 0, 1, 0x000080f3 }, { 0x6, 0, 0, 0xffffffff }, { 0x6, 0, 0, 0x00000000 }, }; /* * bpf?? $B$r%*!<%W%s(B */ static int open_bpf(void) { int fd = -1, n = 0; char name[32]; do { sprintf(name, "/dev/bpf%d", n++); errno = 0; fd = open(name, O_RDWR); } while (fd < 0 && errno == EBUSY); return fd; }/* open_bfp */ /* * bpf $B$r%*!<%W%s$73F= 0) { /* $B$^$:%P!<%8%g%s$r%A%'%C%/$9$k!#(B */ struct bpf_version ver; if (ioctl(fd, BIOCVERSION, &ver) == 0) { if (BPF_MAJOR_VERSION == ver.bv_major && BPF_MINOR_VERSION <= ver.bv_minor) { /* bpf $B$NFI$_9~$_%P%C%U%!%5%$%:$r@_Dj$9$k!#(B */ unsigned int blen = BPF_BUFFER_SIZE; if (ioctl(fd, BIOCSBLEN, &blen) == 0) { /* $B%O!<%I%&%(%"%$%s%?!<%U%'!<%9$r@_Dj$9$k!#(B */ struct ifreq ifr; strncpy(ifr.ifr_name, name, sizeof(ifr.ifr_name)); if (ioctl(fd, BIOCSETIF, &ifr) == 0) { /* promiscuous $B%b!<%I$K$9$k(B */ if (ioctl(fd, BIOCPROMISC, NULL) == 0) { /* immediate $B%b!<%I$K$9$k(B */ unsigned int im = 1; if (ioctl(fd, BIOCIMMEDIATE, &im) == 0) { /* $B%U%#%k%?%W%m%0%i%`$r@_Dj$9$k!#(B */ if (ioctl(fd, BIOCSETF, prog) == 0) { #if 0 /* $B%G!<%?%j%s%/%?%$%W$rD4$Y$k(B */ unsigned dlt; if (ioctl(fd, BIOCGDLT, &dlt) == 0) { printf("DLT=%u\n", dlt); } #endif err = fd; } } } } } } } if (err < 0) close(fd); } return err; }/* open_dev */ /* * unix version only */ int ETDInit(void) { int err = -1; extern int getmac(char *ifname, char *result); getmac("ed0", mac_addr); insns[1].k = GETUW(&mac_addr[0]); insns[3].k = GETUL(&mac_addr[2]); prog.bf_len = sizeof(insns) / sizeof(insns[0]); prog.bf_insns = insns; bpf_fd = open_dev("ed0", &prog); #ifdef unix setgid(getgid()); setuid(getuid()); #endif if (bpf_fd >= 0) { if (ioctl(bpf_fd, BIOCGBLEN, &bpf_len) == 0) { bpf_buf = malloc(bpf_len); if (bpf_buf != NULL) { err = 0; } } } return err; }/* ETDInit */ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 05:10:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA16272 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:10:56 -0700 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA16223 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:09:49 -0700 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id OAA02175 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 14:09:46 +0200 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id OAA26620 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 14:09:46 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.7.Beta.11/keltia-uucp-2.4) id MAA03659 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:53:50 +0200 (MET DST) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199508241053.MAA03659@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: [ANNOUNCE] kernel builder To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:53:50 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1022 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME7a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk FYI. ------- start of forwarded message ------- From: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw (Chien-Ta Lee) Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc Subject: [ANNOUNCE] kernel builder Date: 24 Aug 1995 06:04:37 GMT Organization: Dep. Comp.Sci.&Info.Eng., Chiao Tung Univ., Taiwan, R.O.C. This is a very simple kernel builder for helping new users. It is very simple, so don't laught at it, please. :) ftp://ftp.cdrom.com/pub/FreeBSD/incoming/make_kernel* ftp://ftp.edu.tw/Op/FreeBSD/packages/jdli/collect/make_kernel* ftp://freebsd.csie.nctu/pub/FreeBSD/packages-jdli/collect/make_kernel* -- §õ «Ø ¹F (Adonis) ¥æ€jžê€u Mail: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw ------- end of forwarded message ------- -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.2-CURRENT #16: Tue Aug 22 01:54:17 MET DST 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 05:22:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA16840 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:22:44 -0700 Received: from aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw ([140.109.40.248]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA16833 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:22:41 -0700 Received: (from taob@localhost) by aries.ibms.sinica.edu.tw (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA05864; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 20:21:24 +0800 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 20:21:24 +0800 (CST) From: Brian Tao To: Mark Dawson cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Making a FreeBSD NFS server In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Aug 1995, Mark Dawson wrote: > > It has a couple of megs of battery-backed memory, two fast scsi-2 > controllers and does various levels of RAID on upto 14 hot-pluggable > disks - it screams along at RAID 0 and the nv-ram gives reliable async-like > performance. Switching to RAID 5 makes it really bullet-proof. BTW, just how much do one of these puppies cost? :) -- Brian ("Though this be madness, yet there is method in't") Tao taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw <-- work ........ play --> taob@io.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 05:35:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA17176 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:35:33 -0700 Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA17170 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:35:31 -0700 Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA15834; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:28:19 -0400 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199508241228.IAA15834@hda.com> Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:28:19 -0400 (EDT) Cc: yenbut@cs.washington.edu In-Reply-To: <199508232135.XAA20050@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 23, 95 11:35:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 510 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > MOD's are certaily the only candidates that sometimes _require_ a > different hardware block size (except you can also format floppies > with up to 1024 or 2048 byte block size). I'm not sure if you meant "certainly not", but in case you really meant "certainly", some disk arrays have a "sector size" that is the stripe multiple of the underlying sector size. Of course if you reformat the base drives to some tiny sector size such as 64 bytes for an 8 way stripe you could get away with it. Peter From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 05:38:44 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA17335 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:38:44 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA17326 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:38:42 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA17597; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:36:41 -0700 To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco), terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:19:00 PDT." <199508240719.AAA27153@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:36:41 -0700 Message-ID: <17595.809267801@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Anybody considering ISDN: Check out the new Zyxel 2864I, that is > a killer-device for ISDN. Talks to analog modems too! Yeah, this would be *especially* hot if FreeBSD could talk parallel to it in the same manner as lp0 but without the overhead of the current lp0 driver. I've seen it really drag a machine down, and that wouldn't be quite as tolerable with a dedicated ISDN parallel connection as your main feed. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 05:39:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA17400 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:39:37 -0700 Received: from palmer.demon.co.uk (palmer.demon.co.uk [158.152.50.150]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA17393 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:39:34 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by palmer.demon.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id NAA13861 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:12:25 +0100 X-Message: This is a dial-up site. Quick responses to e-mails should not be relied upon. Thanks! To: Eblan Y Farris cc: freelist@elf.kendall.mdcc.edu, henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netsite communications server works Great In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 1995 20:51:13 PDT." <9508240351.AA18358@gdwest.gd.com> Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:12:24 +0100 Message-ID: <13859.809266344@palmer.demon.co.uk> From: Gary Palmer Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <9508240351.AA18358@gdwest.gd.com>, Eblan Y Farris writes: >What is better with the Netscape server when >compared to the NCSA? Depending on which Netscape server you are talking about, probably the encryption/security. Netscape has a nice HTML based administration section, although it'll probably only be used to set it up. Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 05:48:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA17736 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:48:34 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA17730 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:48:32 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA17667 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:48:28 -0700 To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Resurrecting our friend "sendbug"? Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:48:28 -0700 Message-ID: <17665.809268508@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It occurs to me that since the demise of `sendbug', we can easily drop send-pr in its place as an alias and thus come back INTO conformance with the long and cherished tradition of having a "sendbug" command that gripped to CSRG or, in some cases, MtXinu! What say folks? Shall we alias sendbug to send-pr? Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 06:06:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA18248 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:06:36 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA18242 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:06:34 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id GAA17725; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:05:50 -0700 To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Subject: Re: [ANNOUNCE] kernel builder In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:53:50 +0200." <199508241053.MAA03659@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:05:50 -0700 Message-ID: <17723.809269550@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > FYI. Pretty prohibitive license! :-( I think I'd just prefer to see someone do it over. I believe they are already, in fact! Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 06:14:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA18574 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:14:15 -0700 Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA18567 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:14:14 -0700 Received: from rks32.pcs.dec.com by mail1.digital.com; (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA15879; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:06:00 -0700 Received: by rks32.pcs.dec.com (Smail3.1.27.1 #16) id m0slby0-0005PIC; Thu, 24 Aug 95 15:05 MSZ Message-Id: To: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: new tgdb wish Reply-To: gj@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 13:05:08 GMT From: "gj%pcs.dec.com@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I have a new tgdb_wish made under -current, but it also runs under 2.1.0-950726-SNAP. I don't have a 2.0.5 to test it on :-(. I'll put a copy into my home directory (~gj) on freefall. This tgdb_wish was made using BLT-1.3, so the TOC works in help :) The tar file also include the tcllib directory, so you can just ./maketgdb. Gary J From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 06:22:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA18936 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:22:20 -0700 Received: from UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU (UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU [129.7.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA18930 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:22:15 -0700 Received: from Taronga.COM by UUCP-GW.CC.UH.EDU with UUCP id AA13299 (5.67a/IDA-1.5); Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:11:21 -0500 Received: by bonkers.taronga.com (smail2.5p) id AA19426; 24 Aug 95 08:04:56 CDT (Thu) Received: (from peter@localhost) by bonkers.taronga.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA19423; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:04:56 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:04:56 -0500 From: Peter da Silva Message-Id: <199508241304.IAA19423@bonkers.taronga.com> To: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl Subject: Re: On ESDI install. Newsgroups: taronga.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: <199508231835.UAA01949@yedi.iaf.nl> Organization: Taronga Park BBS Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <199508231835.UAA01949@yedi.iaf.nl>, Wilko Bulte wrote: >Question: who has ever tried an ESDI controller != WD1007 ? I was using an Ultrastor under 386BSD, until my Compaq died. (anyone wanna buy 16M of Compaq Deskpro memory? I mean it this time.) Since bad144 was broken for drives over 1024 cylinders, I had to reformat a couple of times to get it down to 1 bad sector per track and use sector sparing. That left a couple of bad sectors on wd1, took care of them by creating a bunch of files until I had a file with the bad block in it. Xenix did all their bad blocks that way. Created a .badblock file in the partition root and filled it with bad blocks. Was a lot more convenient than bad144... From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 06:26:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA19241 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:26:23 -0700 Received: from lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (lupine.nsi.nasa.gov [198.116.2.100]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA19228 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:26:21 -0700 Received: (from mnewell@localhost) by lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA16873; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:24:02 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:24:02 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael C. Newell" To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Odd X behaviour Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I just upgraded to 2.0.5-Release from 1.1.5.1 on my main home system ("FBSD"). This system is connected via Ethernet to another system ("TEST1") running 2.0.5-Stable (as of about 2 weeks ago). The -Stable system (test1) does not have a keyboard or monitor attached. Before the upgrade I'd been using FBSD as an X terminal for access to TEST1 with no problems. Since upgrading I'm getting strange behaviour of X applications running on TEST1 displaying on FBSD. In specific some applications don't respond to button presses, while others do. For example, the sd utility runs just fine; I can double click sessions and/or press buttons and all works well. On the other hand the vmix utility does not respond at all to pressing any buttons - the buttons do change colour when the mouse focueses on them, but clicking on the buttons has no effect. The same is true of vat. Has anyone seen this problem? Can anyone give me some hints? Thanks, Mike +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ |Mike Newell | The opinions expressed herein are | |NASA Science Internet Network Systems | my own, and do not necessarily | |Sterling Software, Inc. | reflect those of the NSI program, | |MNewell@nsipo.nasa.gov | Sterling Software, NASA, or anyone | |+1-202-434-8954 | else. | +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ | work: http://www.eco.nsi.nasa.gov/~mnewell | | home: http://www.newell.arlington.va.us | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 06:39:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA19795 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:39:16 -0700 Received: from haven.ios.com (haven.ios.com [198.4.75.45]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA19789 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:39:14 -0700 Received: (from rashid@localhost) by haven.ios.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA29984 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:43:10 -0400 From: "Rashid Karimov." Message-Id: <199508241343.JAA29984@haven.ios.com> Subject: HOW to upgrade to -stable ? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:43:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 423 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi there folx, I've just got the whole FreeBSD-stable tree from ftp.freebsd.org and there are only Makefiles ... Against what sources I am supposed to run them ? Where to get the stuff from ? Any advice/detailed instructions ? PS Looks like I posted the e-mail with "-current - HOW TO UPGrADE TO" just a minute ago . My mistake and I'm sorry ( looks like 4Gb HDD jus died in one of PCs here :(( Rashid From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 06:50:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA20145 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:50:49 -0700 Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA20139 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:50:48 -0700 Received: from jolt.eng.umd.edu by mail1.digital.com; (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA26956; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:37:13 -0700 Received: from espresso.eng.umd.edu (espresso.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.13]) by jolt.eng.umd.edu (8.6.10/8.6.4) with ESMTP id JAA11981; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:37:10 -0400 Received: (chuckr@localhost) by espresso.eng.umd.edu (8.6.10/8.6.4) id JAA01457; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:37:08 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:37:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: gj@freebsd.org Cc: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: Re: new tgdb wish In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, gj%pcs.dec.com@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com wrote: > I have a new tgdb_wish made under -current, but it also runs under > 2.1.0-950726-SNAP. I don't have a 2.0.5 to test it on :-(. > > I'll put a copy into my home directory (~gj) on freefall. > > This tgdb_wish was made using BLT-1.3, so the TOC works in help :) The tar file > also include the tcllib directory, so you can just ./maketgdb. Gary, I don't have visibility to that directory over ftp, could you put it somewhere public, please? I really want that tgdb_wish. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 9120 Edmonston Ct #302 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and n3lxx, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 2.2 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 07:22:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA21645 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 07:22:27 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA21634 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 07:22:13 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA18238; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:21:40 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id QAA06381; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:21:40 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA02160; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:39:02 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508241139.NAA02160@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: How to rebuild /stand? To: root@io.cts.com (Morgan Davis) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:39:01 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508240832.BAA13528@io.cts.com> from "Morgan Davis" at Aug 24, 95 01:31:59 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 347 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Morgan Davis wrote: > > 1. Is /stand necessary after your system has been installed? > 2. If so, is there a way to update it with the latest stuff? > 3. If not, is it okay to remove it? It's ok. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 07:29:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA21951 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 07:29:43 -0700 Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA21933 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 07:29:39 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id GAA23336; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:35:32 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Poul-Henning Kamp , jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco), terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 05:36:41 PDT." <17595.809267801@time.cdrom.com> Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:35:32 -0700 Message-ID: <23334.809271332@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Anybody considering ISDN: Check out the new Zyxel 2864I, that is > > a killer-device for ISDN. Talks to analog modems too! > > Yeah, this would be *especially* hot if FreeBSD could talk parallel to > it in the same manner as lp0 but without the overhead of the current > lp0 driver. I've seen it really drag a machine down, and that wouldn't > be quite as tolerable with a dedicated ISDN parallel connection as your > main feed. There is actually a lot more promise in a 16550 or 16650 at 460800 bps. You only get 1/16th or 1/32th the number of interrupts. The parallel port thingie is mostly a gimmick, until they reveal a very smart protocol for it... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Just that: dried leaves in boiling water ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 07:54:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA22933 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 07:54:08 -0700 Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA22924 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 07:54:05 -0700 Received: from rks32.pcs.dec.com by mail1.digital.com; (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA30396; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 07:48:38 -0700 Received: by rks32.pcs.dec.com (Smail3.1.27.1 #16) id m0sldZT-0005PIC; Thu, 24 Aug 95 16:47 MSZ Message-Id: To: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: Re: new tgdb wish Reply-To: gj@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 14:47:54 GMT From: "gj%pcs.dec.com@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk OK, by popular demand I've put the new tgdb_wish in a more "visible" place. It can be had at: ftp.cdrom.com:/pub/FreeBSD/incoming/tgdb_wish-static-2.2FBSD.tgz Enjoy Gary J From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 08:12:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA23944 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:12:34 -0700 Received: from power.ci.uv.es (power.ci.uv.es [147.156.1.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA23891 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:12:23 -0700 Received: by power.ci.uv.es (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA35944; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:10:55 +0200 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:10:55 +0200 (METDST) From: Francisco Rosich Viana To: "Stephen F. Combs" Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pkg_add in 2.0.5 In-Reply-To: <199508231227.IAA06913@combs.salem.ge.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Aug 1995, Stephen F. Combs wrote: > Your '/tmp' space is too small! I don't remember the exact option > but check the man page for pkg_add. It has a command for a 'template' > which allows you to specify a different directory for temporary workspace! > I'm absolutely sure this is not the problem. Free space in /tmp is 3.7 Gb ! :-). I think more in a bug in pkg_add. I don't have source, but maybe some variable is going negative due to so much free space. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 08:18:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA24385 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:18:22 -0700 Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA24379 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:18:16 -0700 Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA02655; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:17:32 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199508241517.IAA02655@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:17:32 -0700 (PDT) Cc: yenbut@cs.washington.edu In-Reply-To: <199508232135.XAA20050@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 23, 95 11:35:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 732 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > As Voradesh Yenbut wrote: > > > > Can the block size different from 512 be used some day? I have been > > using 512 and 1024-block disk drives for the past 6 months. I had to > > hack more than half a dozen of files before FreeBSD can run. It would > > be good if I don't have to do it. My 1024 disk drive is a Maxoptic > > magnito-optical drive with 1024-block media. > > MOD's are certaily the only candidates that sometimes _require_ a > different hardware block size (except you can also format floppies > with up to 1024 or 2048 byte block size). the cd driver adapts itself to use whatever blocksize the drive is set up for.. Sun drives use 512 bytes (as do some SGI I think..) everyone else uses 2K julian > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 08:22:50 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA24694 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:22:50 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA24670 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:22:35 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA20816; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:31 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id RAA07136 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:31 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA16172 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:59:38 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508241459.QAA16172@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:59:36 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <17595.809267801@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 24, 95 05:36:41 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 821 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > [Zyxel 2864I] > Yeah, this would be *especially* hot if FreeBSD could talk parallel to > it in the same manner as lp0 but without the overhead of the current > lp0 driver. I've seen it really drag a machine down, and that wouldn't > be quite as tolerable with a dedicated ISDN parallel connection as your > main feed. This is unavoidable for a generic parallel ("Centronics") port, since it has never been designed to perform input operations, and the only chance to raise an interrupt is the ACK line. Perhaps we need a driver for the more "intelligent" parallel adaptors. I think, 115 kbps on a FIFO UART are a more solid solution by now. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 08:22:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA24714 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:22:55 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA24681 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:22:42 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA20811; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:29 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id RAA07135 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:29 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA15789 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:55:35 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508241455.QAA15789@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:55:32 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199508241228.IAA15834@hda.com> from "Peter Dufault" at Aug 24, 95 08:28:19 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 553 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Peter Dufault wrote: > > > MOD's are certaily the only candidates that sometimes _require_ a > > different hardware block size > I'm not sure if you meant "certainly not", but in case you really > meant "certainly", some disk arrays have a "sector size" that is > the stripe multiple of the underlying sector size. I meant "certainly", but i didn't knew about these disk arrays. Yet another reason... -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 08:24:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA24876 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:24:54 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA24829 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:24:16 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA20824; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:34 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id RAA07140 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:34 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA16922 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:05:20 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508241505.RAA16922@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/sbin/mount mntopts.h mount.c To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:05:17 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <17617.809267994@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 24, 95 05:39:54 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1153 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > Is what I am saying, is don't change default behavior, make it more > > flexiable. Defaults are not sutiable for all sites, so changeing them > > As was my motivation behind committing noauto. How in the dickens did > we get off in the tangent about modifying rc now?? Maybe we > should take this off committers? :) (moved to -hackers) Well, i'm still claiming that it's not a matter of "noauto" or not, it's simply inappropriate for most people around to have the multi- user boot fail simply because the CD didn't mount, while they would like to have the CD auto-mounted whenever there is a medium in the drive at boot time (thus, "noauto" wouldn't help). I'm currently running such a configuration, and i don't think my machine is too much off the "generic user's expectation" :) in this area. The "noauto" thing might have other merits (not typing the full mount command line, allow non-root mounts), but it's IMHO the wrong workaround for just _this_ problem.. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 08:25:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA24947 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:25:18 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA24820 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:24:09 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA20820; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:32 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id RAA07137 for hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:32 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA17060 for hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:06:28 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508241506.RAA17060@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Resurrecting our friend "sendbug"? To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:06:25 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <17665.809268508@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 24, 95 05:48:28 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 291 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > It occurs to me that since the demise of `sendbug', we can easily drop > send-pr in its place as an alias. Fine. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 08:26:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA25079 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:26:59 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA24799 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:23:53 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA20834; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:42 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id RAA07142 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:22:41 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA17646 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:11:00 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508241511.RAA17646@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: On ESDI install. To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:10:55 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508241304.IAA19423@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Aug 24, 95 08:04:56 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1287 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Peter da Silva wrote: > > Xenix did all their bad blocks that way. Created a .badblock file in the > partition root and filled it with bad blocks. Was a lot more convenient than > bad144... BADSECT(8) UNIX System Manager's Manual BADSECT(8) NAME badsect - create files to contain bad sectors SYNOPSIS /etc/badsect bbdir sector ... DESCRIPTION Badsect makes a file to contain a bad sector. Normally, bad sectors are made inaccessible by the standard formatter, which provides a forwarding table for bad sectors to the driver; see bad144(8) for details. If a driver supports the bad blocking standard it is much preferable to use that method to isolate bad blocks, since the bad block forwarding makes the pack appear perfect, and such packs can then be copied with dd(1). The technique used by this program is also less general than bad block forwarding, as badsect can't make amends for bad blocks in the i-list of file systems or in swap areas. "/etc/badsect", hmmm. :) Despite of this, the problems of this approach are clearly outlined above. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 08:40:24 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA25906 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:40:24 -0700 Received: from wdl1.wdl.loral.com (wdl1.wdl.loral.com [137.249.32.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA25900 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:40:21 -0700 Received: from hps.sso.loral.com (hps.wdl.loral.com) by wdl1.wdl.loral.com (5.x/WDL-2.4-1.0) id AA01961; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 08:39:43 -0700 Received: by hps.sso.loral.com (4.1/SSO-SUN-2.04) id AA03349; Thu, 24 Aug 95 11:36:01 EDT Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:36:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Toren X-Sender: rpt@hps To: Francisco Rosich Viana Cc: "Stephen F. Combs" , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pkg_add in 2.0.5 In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I had problems also with the template option. (From memory), while the man page says /tmp, the code uses /var/tmp instead. I used a soft link to put that over on a larger partition. The problem I had with -template was when trying to stat a volume for space it had the template filename (with ..XXX) in the string and was not finding the file?? ==================================================== Rip Toren | The bad news is that C++ is not an object-oriented | rpt@miles.sso.loral.com | programming language. .... The good news is that | | C++ supports object-oriented programming. | | C++ Programming & Fundamental Concepts | | by Anderson & Heinze | ==================================================== On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Francisco Rosich Viana wrote: > > > On Wed, 23 Aug 1995, Stephen F. Combs wrote: > > > Your '/tmp' space is too small! I don't remember the exact option > > but check the man page for pkg_add. It has a command for a 'template' > > which allows you to specify a different directory for temporary workspace! > > > > I'm absolutely sure this is not the problem. > Free space in /tmp is 3.7 Gb ! :-). > > I think more in a bug in pkg_add. I don't have source, but maybe some > variable is going negative due to so much free space. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 09:25:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA27552 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:25:45 -0700 Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA27546 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:25:44 -0700 Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14615(1)>; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:25:02 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177475>; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:24:40 -0700 X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.1 5/23/95 To: Joe Greco cc: terryl@cs.stanford.edu (Terry Lee), freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 95 13:37:01 PDT." <199508232037.PAA18889@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:24:38 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <95Aug24.092440pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508232037.PAA18889@brasil.moneng.mei.com> you write: > | > | RS232 @ 115200, PPP > | > \|/ > ----------- > | UTA-220 | > ----------- > | > / > \ PSTN (ISDN, 2 B channels) -- > / > | Er, forgive me if I'm being obtuse, but don't you need a higher serial rate than 115200 to get full performance out of 2 B channels? Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 09:40:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA28132 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:40:25 -0700 Received: from hemi.com (hemi.com [204.132.158.10]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA28126 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:40:23 -0700 Received: (from mbarkah@localhost) by hemi.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA18684 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:43:41 -0600 From: Ade Barkah Message-Id: <199508241643.KAA18684@hemi.com> Subject: Re: pkg_add in 2.0.5 To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:43:41 -0600 (MDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 762 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Your '/tmp' space is too small! I don't remember the exact option > > but check the man page for pkg_add. It has a command for a 'template' > > which allows you to specify a different directory for temporary workspace! > > I'm absolutely sure this is not the problem. > Free space in /tmp is 3.7 Gb ! :-). > > I think more in a bug in pkg_add. I don't have source, but maybe some > variable is going negative due to so much free space. Try setting the variable PKG_TMPDIR explicitly to /tmp, and then try again. Let me know how it goes. -Ade -------------------------------------------------------------------- Inet: mbarkah@hemi.com - HEMISPHERE ONLINE - www: -------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 09:45:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA28339 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:45:46 -0700 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA28333 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:45:45 -0700 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id LAA19807; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:44:55 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199508241644.LAA19807@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: fenner@parc.xerox.com (Bill Fenner) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:44:55 -0500 (CDT) Cc: terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <95Aug24.092440pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> from "Bill Fenner" at Aug 24, 95 09:24:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Er, forgive me if I'm being obtuse, but don't you need a higher serial rate > than 115200 to get full performance out of 2 B channels? Yes. You get about 90% cap at 115200. However, I challenge you to plug a TA into a standard PC serial port and go faster than that. :-) (The UTA-220 can't hit 230.4K at this point in time anyways, so the picture *was* the optimal setup, and a PC serial port can't go faster with a standard crystal). For the brave, you can take a standard PC serial card and play switchum-crystalum. I personally prefer and special-order STB's DSP-550 cards (2 9-pin serial and a bidir parallel, Startech 16552 part) which lend themselves to such a modification quite nicely, as they use a standard 1.8432MHz crystal. Some motherboards with built in serial and/or all-in-one multifunction cards apparently derive the clock from a higher frequency crystal and may need those rates for other things (not like I'd feel too comfortable replacing crystals on a MB). The surgery is simple. Pull the 1.8432MHz crystal. Insert a 3.6864MHz crystal, or a 7.3728MHz crystal. The former is 2x, the latter is 4x. Now when you talk to that port at 9600 baud you are actually at {19200, 38400 depending on 2x or 4x}. Or if you talk to that port at 115200 you are actually at {230400, 460800}. You lose the ability to do some of the lower speeds, but then again... so what. Note: Chintzy line driver chips may not cope too well. Note^2: The faster you go, the shorter and more shielded your cable should be!!! (I haven't had any problems at 230400 but then I tend to build quality cables myself). For the chickenhearted: I have a pair of DSP-550's modified to run 230400 that I no longer use (I am tending to purchase MB's with built in serial ports). If anybody really needs one, well... hey they can get you a 20K/sec network link and they're cheaper than Ethernet cards (and you get TWO interfaces). :-) ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 09:48:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA28453 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:48:33 -0700 Received: from haven.ios.com (haven.ios.com [198.4.75.45]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA28446 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:48:30 -0700 Received: (from rashid@localhost) by haven.ios.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA04899 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:52:27 -0400 From: "Rashid Karimov." Message-Id: <199508241652.MAA04899@haven.ios.com> Subject: GOOD and W/O extras ISDN modem - advice needed. To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:52:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 343 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi there folx, It's a little offtopic , but what a heck considering this ISDN thread here. What I need is a slightly different form the end user would need : just ISDN modem. No fax/V34/TA stuff. Just the serial port and RJ11 to plug the ISDN line in ( the ability to go with 128K is a must). Any suggestions ? Phones ? Rashid From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 09:59:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA28909 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:59:28 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA28903 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:59:27 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA08097; Thu, 24 Aug 95 11:00:19 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508241700.AA08097@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: Number of ptys in 205 - Any limits ? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 11:00:17 MDT Cc: rashid@haven.ios.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508232114.XAA19859@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 23, 95 11:14:04 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Are there any restrictions on the amount of ptys available to the > > users ? > > I think the number of available letter to name them is the biggest > restriction. It's not as easy to add more letters to MAKEDEV, since > most programs have a hardcoded idea which letters to use for naming > ptys. :( Time for clone devices in pty/ttyp directories. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 10:28:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA29716 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:28:33 -0700 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA29710 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:28:32 -0700 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id MAA19891; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:27:26 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199508241727.MAA19891@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: GOOD and W/O extras ISDN modem - advice needed. To: rashid@haven.ios.com (Rashid Karimov.) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:27:26 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508241652.MAA04899@haven.ios.com> from "Rashid Karimov." at Aug 24, 95 12:52:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > just ISDN modem. No fax/V34/TA stuff. Just the serial > port and RJ11 to plug the ISDN line in ( the ability > to go with 128K is a must). > Any suggestions ? Phones ? Hello, We have a terminology problem. And you DON'T want to have a terminology problem when buying things, because you'll end up getting something you don't want. Especially if you tell someone you want an "ISDN modem". An "ISDN modem" is generally a saynothing. ISDN is a *digital* service, and hence modulation and demodulation (mo/dem) has no meaning. Some people will take "ISDN modem" to mean an ISDN device with a built-in V.34 modem. This type of device allows you to use your ISDN line to connect to a conventional V.34 modem on a POTS line (Plain Old Telephone Service, etc). The V.34 "modem" could potentially be all digital, but apparently the typical method is to literally stuff a V.34 modem in along with analog phone line interface circuitry that translates analog to digital. An "ISDN TA" (Terminal Adapter) is a device that takes a serial line (sync V.35 or async RS232) and uses a protocol to transmit that data over the ISDN circuit. Since the protocol does not really introduce any overhead, you are essentially able to run at ISDN speeds (57.6K async or 64K sync). Newer products allow you to connect two channels simultaneously and use both together as a virtual faster link. This is sometimes called "BONDING" (which actually refers to sync links to which this is done). If you want to be able to do 115.2K you need to make sure that the units are able to do this in some fashion. You cannot do 128K on an async link because 128K isn't a standard RS232 speed. Your next choice would probably be 230.4K, but I haven't seen any terminal adaptors that support this speed, and you need a special serial port to handle it. Anyways, in conclusion: An ISDN TA does not deal with analog information in any way. The latest products are generally hybrids - they are terminal adapters that also have an analog circuit so that you can plug in a V.34 or regular telephone. Given your description of what it is you want, you ARE absolutely positively looking for an ISDN TA. Motorola makes several products. The one I've used is the UTA-220. This is a fairly decent and flexible terminal adapter. The Bitsurfer and Bitsurfer Pro are reportedly able to do the things you are asking, as well, and are hybrids of some sort. Ironically I believe that you may find the Bitsurfer and other hybrids for a *lower* price than many of the plain terminal adapters. At least based on the last pricings I've seen... Good luck, ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 10:29:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA29765 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:29:40 -0700 Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA29759 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:29:39 -0700 Received: from sri.MT.net by mail1.digital.com; (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA09199; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:24:01 -0700 Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA05740; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:26:08 -0600 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:26:08 -0600 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199508241726.LAA05740@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: gj@freebsd.org Cc: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: Re: new tgdb wish In-Reply-To: References: Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk garyj@rks32.pcs.dec.com writes: > I have a new tgdb_wish made under -current, but it also runs under > 2.1.0-950726-SNAP. I don't have a 2.0.5 to test it on :-(. > Thanks YOU! Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 10:36:02 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA00169 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:36:02 -0700 Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA00159 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:35:58 -0700 Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA08132; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:35:17 -0400 From: Charles Henrich Message-Id: <199508241735.NAA08132@crh.cl.msu.edu> Subject: Re: Netsite communications server works Great To: eyfarris@gdwest.gd.com (Eblan Y Farris) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:35:16 -0400 (EDT) Cc: freelist@elf.kendall.mdcc.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9508240351.AA18358@gdwest.gd.com> from "Eblan Y Farris" at Aug 23, 95 08:51:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 316 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > What is better with the Netscape server when > compared to the NCSA? It can handle massive loading much much better. As there is no way to "limit" users with the NCSA server. -Crh Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 10:40:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA00416 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:40:00 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA00410 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 10:39:58 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA08205; Thu, 24 Aug 95 11:41:11 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508241741.AA08205@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: On ESDI install. To: peter@bonkers.taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 11:41:10 MDT Cc: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508241304.IAA19423@bonkers.taronga.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Aug 24, 95 08:04:56 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Since bad144 was broken for drives over 1024 cylinders, I had to > reformat a couple of times to get it down to 1 bad sector per track and > use sector sparing. That left a couple of bad sectors on wd1, took care > of them by creating a bunch of files until I had a file with the bad > block in it. Yeah, I think the relocation of the bad block replacements to the end of the partition is a bad thing. It should either go before the 'a' slice (limiting its size) or after the 'a' slice (pushing out what "might work" to get the kernel under 1024). > Xenix did all their bad blocks that way. Created a .badblock file in the > partition root and filled it with bad blocks. Was a lot more convenient than > bad144... I think the idea of "perfect media" and "file system independent block replacement" is bad. If I had my druthers, I'd probably bring back the bad block list on inode 1 instead. Consider a mounted DOS partition with bad blocks on it. What do you do when you find one under BSD? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 11:06:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA01393 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:06:47 -0700 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA01387 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:06:44 -0700 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA08110; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:06:28 -0700 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199508241806.LAA08110@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/sbin/mount mntopts.h mount.c To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:06:27 -0700 (PDT) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.Org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <17617.809267994@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 24, 95 05:39:54 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1604 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.Org Precedence: bulk [Redirected to -hackers :-)] > > > Is what I am saying, is don't change default behavior, make it more > > flexiable. Defaults are not sutiable for all sites, so changeing them > > As was my motivation behind committing noauto. Which I agree with the concept of noauto, we need that ``flexibility'', it is just that the particular implementation has a little to be disired as it mucks with the kernel interface files and it should not have. I'll conceded the point on noauto vs noall, letting all the other unix's who have misnamed this option take precedence simply in the name of compatibility. > How in the dickens did > we get off in the tangent about modifying rc now?? Some one feels that failing non-ufs mounts should be made non-fatal, I disagree as it may be critical to some (and I am one of them, but far from an ``exception'') that nfs, cd9660, lfs or other non-ufs file systems are critical to system operation. I countered with a ``flexibility'' option by adding a few more knobs, while preserveing the current defaults. We ``got off in the tangent'' as one of the reasons the noauto option was added to fstab in its current form was because you and others did not like /etc/rc dropping to single user because it failed to mount at boot time. Similiar problem, different solutions, same thread :-) > Maybe we > should take this off committers? :) I moved it to hackers, seems like a good place for it :-) > Jordan -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 11:15:23 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA01611 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:15:23 -0700 Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA01605 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:15:22 -0700 Received: from rks32.pcs.dec.com by mail1.digital.com; (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA05852; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:09:40 -0700 Received: by rks32.pcs.dec.com (Smail3.1.27.1 #16) id m0slghz-0005PIC; Thu, 24 Aug 95 20:08 MSZ Message-Id: Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 20:08 MSZ From: garyj@rks32.pcs.dec.com (Gary Jennejohn) To: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: Re: new tgdb wish Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Chuck Robey wrote: > Gary, if I'm not pushing too hard, I'd appreciate the shared version, if > there is one. Sorry, I only made a static version. I figured this had better chances of running on more platforms. BTW, the Reply-to is bogus. Reply ot hackers. Gary J From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 11:29:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA01881 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:29:46 -0700 Received: from trinity.radio-do.de (trinity.Radio-do.de [193.101.164.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA01875 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:29:43 -0700 From: Frank Nobis Message-Id: <199508241829.UAA06410@trinity.radio-do.de> Received: by trinity.radio-do.de (8.6.11/TRINITY-1.2.0-a) via EUnet for freebsd.org id UAA06410; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 20:29:36 +0200 Subject: Re: Odd X behaviour To: mnewell@lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (Michael C. Newell) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 20:29:36 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Michael C. Newell" at Aug 24, 95 09:24:02 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1372 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > From: "Michael C. Newell" > > I just upgraded to 2.0.5-Release from 1.1.5.1 on my main home system > ("FBSD"). This system is connected via Ethernet to another system > ("TEST1") running 2.0.5-Stable (as of about 2 weeks ago). The -Stable > system (test1) does not have a keyboard or monitor attached. Before the > upgrade I'd been using FBSD as an X terminal for access to TEST1 with no > problems. > > Since upgrading I'm getting strange behaviour of X applications running > on TEST1 displaying on FBSD. In specific some applications don't respond > to button presses, while others do. For example, the sd utility runs > just fine; I can double click sessions and/or press buttons and all works > well. On the other hand the vmix utility does not respond at all to > pressing any buttons - the buttons do change colour when the mouse > focueses on them, but clicking on the buttons has no effect. The same is > true of vat. > > Has anyone seen this problem? Can anyone give me some hints? > I have seen this some time before, when switched from 1.1 to 2.0.5; Check wether the numlock is active or not. If You have numlock pressed, xterm and many other clients don't respond to mouse events as one would expect. This seems to be a generall X problem. This behaviour is reproducable on Sun workstations too. -fn- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 11:47:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA02543 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:47:48 -0700 Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id LAA02537 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:47:46 -0700 Received: from jolt.eng.umd.edu by mail1.digital.com; (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA31241; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:35:47 -0700 Received: from mocha.eng.umd.edu (mocha.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.16]) by jolt.eng.umd.edu (8.6.10/8.6.4) with ESMTP id OAA22179; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 14:35:40 -0400 Received: (chuckr@localhost) by mocha.eng.umd.edu (8.6.10/8.6.4) id OAA07520; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 14:35:21 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 14:35:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Chuck Robey To: Gary Jennejohn Cc: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: gdb In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Rod told me that you are the person I should direct questions to, in regards to gdb. During making world, there is a warning printed in regards to /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/gdb/mmalloc/mmap-sup.o saying that it has no namelist. Looking at mmap-sup.c, it seems to be dependent on HAVE_MMAP. Don't we have MMAP? I was wondering if you knew about this warning, and since I don't know enough about mmap myself, I thought I'd make sure you knew about this. Thanks. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 9120 Edmonston Ct #302 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and n3lxx, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 2.2 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 12:08:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA03025 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:08:06 -0700 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA03009 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:08:01 -0700 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA08345; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:06:05 -0700 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199508241906.MAA08345@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:06:05 -0700 (PDT) Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508241644.LAA19807@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from "Joe Greco" at Aug 24, 95 11:44:55 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2827 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Er, forgive me if I'm being obtuse, but don't you need a higher serial rate > > than 115200 to get full performance out of 2 B channels? > > Yes. You get about 90% cap at 115200. > > However, I challenge you to plug a TA into a standard PC serial port and go > faster than that. :-) (The UTA-220 can't hit 230.4K at this point in time > anyways, so the picture *was* the optimal setup, and a PC serial port can't > go faster with a standard crystal). > > For the brave, you can take a standard PC serial card and play > switchum-crystalum. I personally prefer and special-order STB's DSP-550 > cards (2 9-pin serial and a bidir parallel, Startech 16552 part) which lend > themselves to such a modification quite nicely, as they use a standard > 1.8432MHz crystal. Some motherboards with built in serial and/or all-in-one > multifunction cards apparently derive the clock from a higher frequency > crystal and may need those rates for other things (not like I'd feel too > comfortable replacing crystals on a MB). > > The surgery is simple. Pull the 1.8432MHz crystal. Insert a 3.6864MHz > crystal, or a 7.3728MHz crystal. The former is 2x, the latter is 4x. Now ^^^^^^^^^ Carefull here, many Uarts are only rated for on f(max) of 5Mhz, others are good to 8Mhz. I think all 16550AFN's are rated for 8MHz, but not sure if they still had the -5/-8 speed option that late in the game. > when you talk to that port at 9600 baud you are actually at {19200, 38400 > depending on 2x or 4x}. Or if you talk to that port at 115200 you are > actually at {230400, 460800}. You lose the ability to do some of the lower > speeds, but then again... so what. :-). > > Note: Chintzy line driver chips may not cope too well. Note^2: The faster > you go, the shorter and more shielded your cable should be!!! (I haven't > had any problems at 230400 but then I tend to build quality cables myself). Watch the capacitance on that shielded cable, the higher the pf/foot the shorter it needs to be. If you use high quality, low loss, low capacitance individually shielded twisted pair data cable grounded one side of each pair for the TX and RX (yea, okay, so you need a few more wires :-) you can run 230KB quite a distance. A scope comes in pretty handy to see your signal quality and the receiver as well. > > For the chickenhearted: I have a pair of DSP-550's modified to run 230400 > that I no longer use (I am tending to purchase MB's with built in serial > ports). If anybody really needs one, well... hey they can get you a > 20K/sec network link and they're cheaper than Ethernet cards (and you get > TWO interfaces). :-) :-). -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 12:52:18 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA03982 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:52:18 -0700 Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.20.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA03975 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 12:52:16 -0700 Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id OAA20237; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 14:50:26 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199508241950.OAA20237@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com (Rodney W. Grimes) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 14:50:26 -0500 (CDT) Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508241906.MAA08345@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> from "Rodney W. Grimes" at Aug 24, 95 12:06:05 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi Rod, > Carefull here, many Uarts are only rated for on f(max) of 5Mhz, others > are good to 8Mhz. I think all 16550AFN's are rated for 8MHz, but not > sure if they still had the -5/-8 speed option that late in the game. This is something to consider. However I am talking out of a NS data book and the only references I have seen are: NS16450/16C450/ 3.1 MHz max, 56k "top" baud rate suggested INS8250A/ INS82C50A INS8250/ 3.1 MHz max, 56k "top" baud rate suggested INS8250-B NS16550AF 8.0 MHz max, 256k "top" baud rate suggested NS16C451 24.0 MHz max, no suggested top :-) NS16C551 24.0 MHz max, 1.5M "top" baud rate suggested Now if I am reading this right the INS8250-B is a slower speed part, judging from the electrical characteristics. I do not see any lower-speed offerings on the other parts. Although it IS funny that the 16C451 can have a 24 MHz clock and they didn't bother to list a top rate, I can imagine that you could get pretty busy trying to shove a million bits per second through a device without any real FIFO. > Watch the capacitance on that shielded cable, the higher the pf/foot the > shorter it needs to be. If you use high quality, low loss, low capacitance > individually shielded twisted pair data cable grounded one side of each > pair for the TX and RX (yea, okay, so you need a few more wires :-) you can > run 230KB quite a distance. A scope comes in pretty handy to see your > signal quality and the receiver as well. Or if you are only going 2 feet like I usually do. :-) Anyways the moral of the story is: don't try to hot rod a non-FIFO chip or you may torch the sucker. (heck, you may even torch a FIFO chip, there are no guarantees... if you can't afford to lose the UART don't play with fire). And of course if you're using non-NS parts (i.e. Startech, etc) you might want to check the specs. Inferior chips made for the PC market and all... I've run Startech at 2x without problems. ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 13:25:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA04768 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:25:55 -0700 Received: from linux4nn.iaf.nl (linux4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA04760 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:25:51 -0700 Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA01873; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:24:50 +0200 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA10038 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:21:29 +0100 Received: by iafnl.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA24232 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4); Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:34:22 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.8/8.6.6) id WAA02565; Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:18:26 +0200 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199508232018.WAA02565@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: ESDI installs on WD1007 To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:18:25 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, imb@scgt.oz.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net In-Reply-To: <199508231816.EAA31052@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 24, 95 04:16:45 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 802 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I just learned from other mail (too much mail today %-) how to read the > WD1007 jumpers. I don't want the driver to handle stuff like this for > obsolete drives. > OK, guys. Please note that I have this document called Preliminary Engineering Specification, WD1007A-WA2 (dated oct 2, 1987) sitting on my shelf. I could photocopy it and send it to (*REALLY*) interested people. My guess is this would help to resolve the issues currently being debated. Takers please email to me directly Wilko _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 13:28:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA04949 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:28:30 -0700 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA04937 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:28:25 -0700 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA08474; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:26:37 -0700 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199508242026.NAA08474@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:26:37 -0700 (PDT) Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508241950.OAA20237@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from "Joe Greco" at Aug 24, 95 02:50:26 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 3477 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Hi Rod, > > > Carefull here, many Uarts are only rated for on f(max) of 5Mhz, others > > are good to 8Mhz. I think all 16550AFN's are rated for 8MHz, but not > > sure if they still had the -5/-8 speed option that late in the game. > > This is something to consider. However I am talking out of a NS data book > and the only references I have seen are: > > NS16450/16C450/ 3.1 MHz max, 56k "top" baud rate suggested > INS8250A/ > INS82C50A > INS8250/ 3.1 MHz max, 56k "top" baud rate suggested > INS8250-B > NS16550AF 8.0 MHz max, 256k "top" baud rate suggested > NS16C451 24.0 MHz max, no suggested top :-) > NS16C551 24.0 MHz max, 1.5M "top" baud rate suggested I am not so worried about the National parts, it is the other manufactures, as you point out later, that have different upper clock rates. I seem to recall the TMS version topping at 5MHz, but maybe confusing that with the Zylog SIO chip. > > Now if I am reading this right the INS8250-B is a slower speed part, judging > from the electrical characteristics. I do not see any lower-speed offerings > on the other parts. Although it IS funny that the 16C451 can have a 24 MHz > clock and they didn't bother to list a top rate, I can imagine that you > could get pretty busy trying to shove a million bits per second through a > device without any real FIFO. I can tell you why they upped fmax to 24Mhz, that is the same clock needed by most floppy controller chips, so now you can run both chips off the same crystal on a multipurpose card. This is quite common in the Winbond and SMC chips, there is an additional divider inside the chip that cuts this down for the uarts, but uses it raw for the floppy controller. Look on any winbond based atio card and you will see 1 24Mhz crystal. The 451/551 integrate some stuff, but I can't recall what ``stuff''. > > Watch the capacitance on that shielded cable, the higher the pf/foot the > > shorter it needs to be. If you use high quality, low loss, low capacitance > > individually shielded twisted pair data cable grounded one side of each > > pair for the TX and RX (yea, okay, so you need a few more wires :-) you can > > run 230KB quite a distance. A scope comes in pretty handy to see your > > signal quality and the receiver as well. > > Or if you are only going 2 feet like I usually do. :-) :-), you can use just about anything for 2 feet < 1Mhz :-). > Anyways the moral of the story is: don't try to hot rod a non-FIFO chip or > you may torch the sucker. (heck, you may even torch a FIFO chip, there are > no guarantees... if you can't afford to lose the UART don't play with fire). Thats basically what I was trying to point out. Not all Uarts are made by National, not all 16XXX clones meet the 8Mhz clock spec of nationals, etc, etc... > And of course if you're using non-NS parts (i.e. Startech, etc) you might > want to check the specs. Inferior chips made for the PC market and all... > I've run Startech at 2x without problems. And I have run the National parts in excess of 10Mhz, but they aren't very stable at that speed, and that was on a bench setup just to see how far I could push one of them :-) Just be aware, YMMV!!! > Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net > Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 13:57:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA06449 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:57:58 -0700 Received: from alpha.dsu.edu (alpha.dsu.edu [138.247.32.12]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA06443 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:57:56 -0700 Received: (from ghelmer@localhost) by alpha.dsu.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA24166; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:57:53 -0500 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:57:53 -0500 (CDT) From: Guy Helmer To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: eBones question: kprop/kpropd available? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Are kprop & kpropd available anywhere? I would like to make a FreeBSD Kerberos server slave from my FreeBSD master server... Guy Helmer, Dakota State University Computing Services - ghelmer@alpha.dsu.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 14:02:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA06670 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 14:02:14 -0700 Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA06663 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 14:02:12 -0700 Received: from rks32.pcs.dec.com by mail1.digital.com; (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA06548; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:46:24 -0700 Received: by rks32.pcs.dec.com (Smail3.1.27.1 #16) id m0slj9f-0005PIC; Thu, 24 Aug 95 22:45 MSZ Message-Id: Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 22:45 MSZ From: garyj@rks32.pcs.dec.com (Gary Jennejohn) To: chuckr%Glue.umd.edu@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: gdb & MMAP Cc: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Chuck Robey writes: > Rod told me that you are the person I should direct questions to, in > regards to gdb. During making world, there is a warning printed in > regards to /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/gdb/mmalloc/mmap-sup.o saying that it has > no namelist. Looking at mmap-sup.c, it seems to be dependent on > HAVE_MMAP. Don't we have MMAP? I was wondering if you knew about this > warning, and since I don't know enough about mmap myself, I thought I'd > make sure you knew about this. Yeah, I saw your mail in hackers a few days ago and thought "you know, he's right!". To be perfectly honest, it never even occurred to me that gdb could or did make use of mmap. Anyway, I quickly identified the 2 places where HAVE_MMAP needs to be defined and remade gdb with (as far as I can tell) no ill effects. But, I also didn't notice any real benefits either. I'm forced to admit that I haven't exactly stress-tested the new gdb, though. Anyway, here are diffs: (BEWARE !!! cut and paste. I've tried to fix all tabs) 1) Makefile in gdb/gdb - *** Makefile.orig Sun Aug 20 16:54:59 1995 --- Makefile Sun Aug 20 16:55:32 1995 *************** *** 45,50 **** --- 45,51 ---- CFLAGS+= -I$(.CURDIR)/. -I${DESTDIR}/usr/include/readline -I$(.CURDIR)/../bfd + CFLAGS+= -DHAVE_MMAP DPADD+= ${LIBREADLINE} ${LIBTERMCAP} ${LIBGNUREGEX} LDADD+= -lreadline -ltermcap -lgnuregex 2) Makefile in gdb/mmalloc *** Makefile.orig Sun Aug 20 16:49:41 1995 --- Makefile Sun Aug 20 16:50:11 1995 *************** *** 1,3 **** --- 1,4 ---- + CFLAGS+= -DHAVE_MMAP LIB= mmalloc SRCS= mcalloc.c mfree.c mmalloc.c mmcheck.c mmemalign.c mmstats.c \ mmtrace.c mrealloc.c mvalloc.c mmap-sup.c attach.c detach.c keys.c \ Gary J From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 15:07:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA08860 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:07:22 -0700 Received: from elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (elf.kendall.mdcc.edu [147.70.150.122]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA08850 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:07:16 -0700 Received: (from freelist@localhost) by elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA07136; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:57:46 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:57:43 -0400 (EDT) From: "Don's FList drop" To: Joe Greco cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: GOOD and W/O extras ISDN modem - advice needed. In-Reply-To: <199508241727.MAA19891@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Joe Greco wrote: > this in some fashion. You cannot do 128K on an async link because 128K > isn't a standard RS232 speed. Your next choice would probably be 230.4K, > but I haven't seen any terminal adaptors that support this speed, and you > need a special serial port to handle it. Anyways, in conclusion: An ISDN TA > does not deal with analog information in any way. Aren't there a few ISDN adaptors out there with parallel and ethernet interfaces to deal with this speed problem? From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 15:25:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA09283 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:25:35 -0700 Received: from elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (elf.kendall.mdcc.edu [147.70.150.122]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA09275 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:25:17 -0700 Received: (from freelist@localhost) by elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA07187; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:15:05 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:15:01 -0400 (EDT) From: "Don's FList drop" To: Gary Palmer cc: Eblan Y Farris , henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netsite communications server works Great In-Reply-To: <13859.809266344@palmer.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Gary Palmer wrote: > In message <9508240351.AA18358@gdwest.gd.com>, Eblan Y Farris writes: > >What is better with the Netscape server when > >compared to the NCSA? > > Depending on which Netscape server you are talking about, probably the > encryption/security. Yes, the commerce server has this. I'll be dumping it soon to put just the communications server in place, though. If nothign else, it should be a smaller binary. Dunno if the memory consumption will be any less. > Netscape has a nice HTML based administration section, although it'll > probably only be used to set it up. I assume you've never seen the whole thing. There's a lot of useful stuff in there. You can up, restart and shut down the server, alter the max and min number of processes you run at once, read and rotate the logs, get current and overall load reports. One kinda okay thing is the abilty to remap directories from there instead of needing to go to the line and do symlinks. So if you want just /tech-papers to point to /usr/home/dorks/babble, you can do it from the interface. It's a no brainer for me to do it, but the Windoze folks I work with don't have to learn anything new. (Apparently a life goal for some of them) The setup was easier than _anything_ I have ever set up before. Even the directory choices and things were through the web browser, which doesn't have to be local. (A big plus for me, I don't run X so I can save the memory and cycles) You can lock out administration logins by IP (including subnets - mine is 147.70.*.*, so you gotta be a MDCC person to access it) I'm not saying I'da paid $1500 of my money or my exployers money for it, but their nonprofit deal was certainly worth it. I'm trying to convince the network guys here to dump the Netware NLM server they have now (with no CGI! jeez...) for communications server on NT. (anti-unix bigots, don't flame me about it...) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 15:49:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA10141 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:49:12 -0700 Received: from palmer.demon.co.uk (palmer.demon.co.uk [158.152.50.150]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA10133 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:49:03 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by palmer.demon.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.11) with SMTP id XAA15966 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:43:41 +0100 X-Message: This is a dial-up site. Quick responses to e-mails should not be relied upon. Thanks! To: "Don's FList drop" cc: Eblan Y Farris , henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netsite communications server works Great In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:15:01 EDT." Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:43:39 +0100 Message-ID: <15964.809304219@palmer.demon.co.uk> From: Gary Palmer Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message , "Don 's FList drop" writes: >Yes, the commerce server has this. I'll be dumping it soon to put just >the communications server in place, though. If nothign else, it should be >a smaller binary. Dunno if the memory consumption will be any less. Probably not much smaller. Crypto code isn't all that big. >I assume you've never seen the whole thing. I saw the eval product, which is meant to be the full thing, but it was several months ago, and I only had to see if it would do what we wanted... >There's a lot of useful stuff >in there. You can up, restart and shut down the server, alter the max and >min number of processes you run at once, read and rotate the logs, get >current and overall load reports. Yep. Remember that. Not all highly useful stuff - we prefer using cron jobs for log rotation and analysis... >One kinda okay thing is the abilty to >remap directories from there instead of needing to go to the line and do >symlinks. So if you want just /tech-papers to point to >/usr/home/dorks/babble, you can do it from the interface. It's a no >brainer for me to do it, but the Windoze folks I work with don't have to >learn anything new. (Apparently a life goal for some of them) Hehe. Yeah, there seemed to be a lot of nice features which look nice, and make nice bell & whistle sounds for you (ok, no sounds, but you get the idea), but only a few had any real use past the installation procedure, if at all. >The setup was easier than _anything_ I have ever set up before. Even the >directory choices and things were through the web browser, which doesn't >have to be local. (A big plus for me, I don't run X so I can save the >memory and cycles) You can lock out administration logins by IP >(including subnets - mine is 147.70.*.*, so you gotta be a MDCC person to >access it) Yep. But I'd prefer firewalls (IP source addresses can be spoofed ...), and there are better ways of protecting your system, like not making it so easily accessible (e.g. not supplying a TCP port, and just running it off the file system...) >I'm not saying I'da paid $1500 of my money or my exployers money for it, >but their nonprofit deal was certainly worth it. I'm trying to convince >the network guys here to dump the Netware NLM server they have now (with >no CGI! jeez...) for communications server on NT. (anti-unix bigots, >don't flame me about it...) Sorry? Did I just hear you call NT UN*X? :-) I've used NT. It's not UN*X, it's a POSIX compliant (alledgedly - never had the chance to verify that) multi-user version of windows. Nothing special. For server use it's hopeless - the overhead is way to high :-( Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 15:56:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA10359 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:56:54 -0700 Received: from elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (elf.kendall.mdcc.edu [147.70.150.122]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA10352 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 15:56:46 -0700 Received: (from freelist@localhost) by elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA07298; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:47:53 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:47:52 -0400 (EDT) From: "Don's FList drop" To: Peter da Silva cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: WD7000 jumpers In-Reply-To: <9508232211.AA23656@sonic.nmti.com.nmti.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 23 Aug 1995, Peter da Silva wrote: > There's WD7000 drivers in FreeBSD, that means one of you guys has a WD7000. > > I have to get a WD7000 up under FreeBSD. > > Anyone want to tell me what the jumpers are? If you just need the jumper sheet, email me a fax number and I'll fax you the one-sheet for my WD7000. I don't use it with a FreeBSD machine, though. (Hell, don't use it at all anymore. Anyone interested can make an offer if they want. I'll accepts trades as well - right now I need a sound device for this machine) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 16:08:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA10852 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:08:53 -0700 Received: from elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (elf.kendall.mdcc.edu [147.70.150.122]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA10838 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:08:36 -0700 Received: (from freelist@localhost) by elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA07322; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:58:13 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:58:12 -0400 (EDT) From: "Don's FList drop" To: Gary Palmer cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netsite communications server works Great In-Reply-To: <15964.809304219@palmer.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Gary Palmer wrote: > In message , "Don > 's FList drop" writes: > >Yes, the commerce server has this. I'll be dumping it soon to put just > >the communications server in place, though. If nothign else, it should be > >a smaller binary. Dunno if the memory consumption will be any less. > > Probably not much smaller. Crypto code isn't all that big. Nope, but it's Extra Crap I Don't Need and adds junk to the admin menu. I run under the assumption I will not the the last person twiddling stuff, so unnecessary junk goes the way of the wind. > >There's a lot of useful stuff > >in there. You can up, restart and shut down the server, alter the max and > >min number of processes you run at once, read and rotate the logs, get > >current and overall load reports. > > Yep. Remember that. Not all highly useful stuff - we prefer using cron > jobs for log rotation and analysis... Ditto, but my point was it's not all stuff useful only at install time. > >One kinda okay thing is the abilty to > >remap directories from there instead of needing to go to the line and do > >symlinks. So if you want just /tech-papers to point to > >/usr/home/dorks/babble, you can do it from the interface. It's a no > >brainer for me to do it, but the Windoze folks I work with don't have to > >learn anything new. (Apparently a life goal for some of them) > > Hehe. Yeah, there seemed to be a lot of nice features which look nice, > and make nice bell & whistle sounds for you (ok, no sounds, but you > get the idea), but only a few had any real use past the installation > procedure, if at all. I don't see how this is only useful at install time. I add symlinks all the time. While we think it's dorky, there are plenty of people who would prefer to be able to do this kind of thing. There is also the standpoint that it is better to do this translation at the front end instead of at the filesystem level. Not _my_ standpoint, but a point none the less. > Yep. But I'd prefer firewalls (IP source addresses can be spoofed > ...), and there are better ways of protecting your system, like not > making it so easily accessible (e.g. not supplying a TCP port, and > just running it off the file system...) *shrug* We are firewalled, and I don't have the admin port open to the outside world, but it's a useful feature anyways. I was speaking of what the value of the software is to the world in general, not just to me. > >I'm not saying I'da paid $1500 of my money or my exployers money for it, > >but their nonprofit deal was certainly worth it. I'm trying to convince > >the network guys here to dump the Netware NLM server they have now (with > >no CGI! jeez...) for communications server on NT. (anti-unix bigots, > >don't flame me about it...) > > Sorry? Did I just hear you call NT UN*X? :-) Do I stutter? Hmm... I see how that could read that way now. No, I meant I was encouraging them to use the NT version (rather than encouraging them to use the FreeBSD/BSDI version) because they are anti-unix bigots. Or rather, they are unwilling to "put all their eggs in one basket" and want to spread the load. (Which is a nice way to say only one person there has any unix ability and they don't want to be beholden to him or bother to hire someone with the ability) > I've used NT. It's not UN*X, it's a POSIX compliant (alledgedly - > never had the chance to verify that) multi-user version of windows. > Nothing special. For server use it's hopeless - the overhead is way to > high :-( What _do_ you like, Gary? From here it looks like not much. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 16:27:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA11356 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:27:49 -0700 Received: from lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (lupine.nsi.nasa.gov [198.116.2.100]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA11350 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:27:48 -0700 Received: (from mnewell@localhost) by lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA18109; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:23:33 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:23:32 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael C. Newell" To: Frank Nobis cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Odd X behaviour In-Reply-To: <199508241829.UAA06410@trinity.radio-do.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Frank Nobis wrote: > Check wether the numlock is active or not. If You have numlock > pressed, xterm and many other clients don't respond to mouse events as > one would expect. Cool - that seemed to be it!! What's also odd os that pressing the "Num Lock" key leaves the "Num Lock" *LIGHT* turned on, but alternatively pressing it enables/disables the buttons. Weird. !!*THANKS*!! for the hint! > This seems to be a generall X problem. This behaviour is reproducable > on Sun workstations too. Hmmmmm... Hadn't noticed it on my office workstation. Have to try it. :-) Again, thanks! Mike +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ |Mike Newell | The opinions expressed herein are | |NASA Science Internet Network Systems | my own, and do not necessarily | |Sterling Software, Inc. | reflect those of the NSI program, | |MNewell@nsipo.nasa.gov | Sterling Software, NASA, or anyone | |+1-202-434-8954 | else. | +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ | work: http://www.eco.nsi.nasa.gov/~mnewell | | home: http://www.newell.arlington.va.us | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 16:32:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA11548 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:32:20 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA11531 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:32:16 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA09192; Thu, 24 Aug 95 16:36:58 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508242236.AA09192@cs.weber.edu> Subject: sys/malloc.h To: hackers@FreeBSD.org, current@FreeBSD.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 16:36:57 MDT X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Some kernel memory allocation issues: 1) Does it seem to anyone else as if the statistic's gathering macros on the MALLOC/FREE are rather bizarre? 2) Has anyone else noticed the mixing of FREE/free on cn_pnbuf elements of nameidata structures? Doesn't this seem broken, considering the use of MALLOC in the non-'HASBUF' case for allocation in all cases in vfs_lookup.c? Won't this fail for the case of a kernel without either KMEMSTATS or DIAGNOSTIC defined? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 16:36:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA11825 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:36:42 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA11814 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:36:35 -0700 Message-Id: <199508242336.QAA11814@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Don's FList drop" cc: Gary Palmer , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netsite communications server works Great In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 95 18:58:12 EDT." Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 16:36:34 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Gary Palmer wrote: > >> Hehe. Yeah, there seemed to be a lot of nice features which look nice, >> and make nice bell & whistle sounds for you (ok, no sounds, but you >> get the idea), but only a few had any real use past the installation >> procedure, if at all. > >I don't see how this is only useful at install time. I add symlinks all >the time. While we think it's dorky, there are plenty of people who would >prefer to be able to do this kind of thing. There is also the standpoint >that it is better to do this translation at the front end instead of at >the filesystem level. Not _my_ standpoint, but a point none the less. Both NCSA httpd 1.4 and Apache allow you to do this. I don't like symlinks either. Our entire website is under CVS repository control so all of the symlinks had to die. Having source is also an important thing to consider. You aren't even eligible for updates or bug fixes with netscape unless you cough up an extra $500 for "tech-support". For an site that can get the software for free, maybe these are not issues, but there alternatives to using Netscape servers if you don't need encryption and from what I've seen, the alternatives perform just as well and offer similar feature sets save the HTML based configuration. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 18:10:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA14304 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:10:22 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA14298 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:10:21 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id SAA10125; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:09:20 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id SAA00647; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:11:14 -0700 Message-Id: <199508250111.SAA00647@corbin.Root.COM> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sys/malloc.h In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 95 16:36:57 MDT." <9508242236.AA09192@cs.weber.edu> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:11:13 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Some kernel memory allocation issues: > >1) Does it seem to anyone else as if the statistic's gathering > macros on the MALLOC/FREE are rather bizarre? I'd say that was a matter of opinion, but they make sense to me. >2) Has anyone else noticed the mixing of FREE/free on cn_pnbuf > elements of nameidata structures? Doesn't this seem broken, > considering the use of MALLOC in the non-'HASBUF' case for > allocation in all cases in vfs_lookup.c? Won't this fail > for the case of a kernel without either KMEMSTATS or > DIAGNOSTIC defined? The KMEMSTATS #ifdefs are bogus and should be removed. I had removed them once in my local sources but the changes got lost. We always gather malloc stats in FreeBSD - the information is just too important to be without. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 18:45:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA15237 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:45:38 -0700 Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.191.196.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA15230 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:45:29 -0700 Received: by misery.sdf.com id <1036>; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:40:04 +0100 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:39:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: Joe Greco cc: Bill Fenner , terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-Reply-To: <199508241644.LAA19807@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Joe Greco wrote: > > Er, forgive me if I'm being obtuse, but don't you need a higher serial rate > > than 115200 to get full performance out of 2 B channels? > > Yes. You get about 90% cap at 115200. > > However, I challenge you to plug a TA into a standard PC serial port and go > faster than that. :-) (The UTA-220 can't hit 230.4K at this point in time > anyways, so the picture *was* the optimal setup, and a PC serial port can't > go faster with a standard crystal). The Hayes ESP card can do 230.4K, and looks like a regular 16550. Some patches for using the ESP's larger buffers were posted recently. Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 18:51:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA15581 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:51:41 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA15572 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:51:37 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA11774; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:51:24 -0700 Message-Id: <199508250151.SAA11774@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: "Don's FList drop" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: GOOD and W/O extras ISDN modem - advice needed. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 17:57:43 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:51:23 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> "Don's FList drop" said: > > On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Joe Greco wrote: > > > this in some fashion. You cannot do 128K on an async link because 128K > > isn't a standard RS232 speed. Your next choice would probably be 230.4K, > > but I haven't seen any terminal adaptors that support this speed, and you > > need a special serial port to handle it. Anyways, in conclusion: An ISDN TA > > does not deal with analog information in any way. > > Aren't there a few ISDN adaptors out there with parallel and ethernet > interfaces to deal with this speed problem? > Yeap, my Ascend Pipeline 50 has an ethernet interface which translates to less overhead on my system and I do get 128kb when I need it . Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 18:58:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA15943 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:58:01 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA15936 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:57:58 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA11835; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:56:24 -0700 Message-Id: <199508250156.SAA11835@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: Bill Fenner cc: Joe Greco , terryl@cs.stanford.edu (Terry Lee), freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 09:24:38 PDT." <95Aug24.092440pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:56:23 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Bill Fenner said: > In message <199508232037.PAA18889@brasil.moneng.mei.com> you write: > > | > > | RS232 @ 115200, PPP > > | > > \|/ > > ----------- > > | UTA-220 | > > ----------- > > | > > / > > \ PSTN (ISDN, 2 B channels) -- > > / > > | > > Er, forgive me if I'm being obtuse, but don't you need a higher serial rate > than 115200 to get full performance out of 2 B channels? > I wonder what are the issues to have support for something like the Intel ISDN 128kb card? Looks to me that people are allergic to writing ISDN drivers for U.S. ISDN cards :) Cheers, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 19:08:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA16465 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:08:09 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA16452 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:08:07 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA09902; Thu, 24 Aug 95 20:09:44 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508250209.AA09902@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: sys/malloc.h To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 20:09:44 MDT Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508250111.SAA00647@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Aug 24, 95 06:11:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >2) Has anyone else noticed the mixing of FREE/free on cn_pnbuf > > elements of nameidata structures? Doesn't this seem broken, > > considering the use of MALLOC in the non-'HASBUF' case for > > allocation in all cases in vfs_lookup.c? Won't this fail > > for the case of a kernel without either KMEMSTATS or > > DIAGNOSTIC defined? > > The KMEMSTATS #ifdefs are bogus and should be removed. I had removed them > once in my local sources but the changes got lost. We always gather malloc > stats in FreeBSD - the information is just too important to be without. In which case the MALLOC()/free() parings are incorrect, and should be using MALLOC()/FREE() instead, right? Or malloc()/free(). It doesn't seem legal to mix pairings. On the other hand, the spl() code still seems ...bizarre. The spl() is being set twice, once in the malloc()/free() and once on the macroized versions. Seems that maybe the stats gathering should be moved into malloc()/free() itself instead of being in malloc.h to save at least one spl/splx pair. We may even want to reconsider why spl/splx is needed to guard around the malloc()/free() anyway -- obviously to allow allocation/freeing in interrupt code. Perhaps we should adopt an architecture of prealloc and free later for interrupt level alloc/free? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 19:08:27 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA16498 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:08:27 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA16490 ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:08:24 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id MAA25813; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:06:52 +1000 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:06:52 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508250206.MAA25813@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: current@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org, terry@cs.weber.edu Subject: Re: sys/malloc.h Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >1) Does it seem to anyone else as if the statistic's gathering > macros on the MALLOC/FREE are rather bizarre? The seem normal. The NON-statistics gathering parts have probably suffered from bitrot since they haven't been the default for so long. If splhigh() is necessary in malloc(), then splimp() is a bug in MALLOC()... >2) Has anyone else noticed the mixing of FREE/free on cn_pnbuf > elements of nameidata structures? Doesn't this seem broken, There are many other cases where they are mixed. This should not be a problem, since the two versions are supposed to be equivalent. The macro versions are supposed to be faster. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 19:12:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA16859 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:12:47 -0700 Received: from sains.ipch.shizuoka.ac.jp (sains.shizuoka.ac.jp [133.70.128.254]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA16851 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:12:44 -0700 From: purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp Received: from shzkgw.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp (shzkgw.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp [133.70.169.5]) by sains.ipch.shizuoka.ac.jp (8.6.12+2.5Wb4/3.4Wb5) with SMTP id LAA03747; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:12:20 +0900 Received: from amalthea.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp by shzkgw.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp (4.1/6.4J.6-shzk7) id AA28929; Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:11:44 JST Received: from jaguar.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp by amalthea.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp (4.1/6.4J.6-shzk7) id AA27561; Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:11:43 JST Received: by jaguar.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp (4.1/6.4J.6-shzk6) id AA01765; Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:11:40 JST Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:11:40 JST Message-Id: <9508250211.AA01765@jaguar.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp> To: hackers@freebsd.org Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, dfr@render.com Subject: Re: Help installing IDE CD-ROM driver Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995 I wrote: >>Hi, there! >> >>I'm new at this mailing list. I'm sorry if this question is a FAQ. I just >>tried installing IDE CD-ROM driver (I got from ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/ >>FreeBSD/incoming/wcd11.tgz) into FreeBSD 2.0.5ALPHA but with no success. >>From the "dmesg", see below, I could see that at least the kernel recognized >>the CD-ROM drive. But, it showed that the controller (atapi1.0) were not >>ready so that I could not access the drive. >> >> ... >> wdc1 at 0x170-0x177 irq 15 on isa >> ==> wdc1: unit 0 (atapi) : , removable, intr >> ==> atapi1.0: controller not ready >> ... >> >>By the way, the following are about my system: >> >> - Gateway P5-120XL with: >> - WD31600 HD set as a master in the primary IDE controller >> - WD31200 HD set as a slave in the primary IDE controller >> - Sanyo 3-Disk CD-ROM (3-CD Changer) drive set as a master >> in the secondary IDE controller >> >> >> - The CD-ROM drive works well with Linux although I can use only >> the bottom slot. >> ... luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (LUIGI) and dfr@render.com (DFR) responded: >[LUIGI] I get the same report on my systems (both 1.1 and 2.0.5) with a >[LUIGI] Sony CDU55 unit mounted as slave on the primary IDE. Nevertheless, >[LUIGI] I can mount wcd1a just fine. The only thing that does not work is >[LUIGI] the audio-cd support. >[DFR] Did you try accessing the drive? I had this problem and I could access >[DFR] the drive without any problems. I tried accessing the drive by "mount -r /dev/wcd0c /cdrom". But, it failed. On the console, the following messages appeared (YWP is the hostname): YWP# mount -r /dev/wcd0c /cdrom /dev/wcd0c on /cdrom: Input/output error YWP# Aug 24 22:13:30 YWP /kernel: atapi1.0: controller not ready Aug 24 22:13:30 YWP /kernel: atapi1.0: controller not ready BTW, I used 19 and 67 as the BDEV major number and CDEV major number, respectively, since they were the first unused numbers in 2.0.5ALPHA. But, I think this doesn't have something to do with the problem. Perhaps, the problem is because I'm using 3-CD Changer Drive, and the driver still needs tuning in order to handle it. Anybody, with IDE 3-CD Changer Drive, successful in installing the IDE CD-ROM driver? Regards, Yusuf Wilajati Purna Shizuoka Univ. (purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 19:12:50 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA16873 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:12:50 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA16867 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:12:48 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA09924; Thu, 24 Aug 95 20:12:58 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508250212.AA09924@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Thu, 24 Aug 95 20:12:57 MDT Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508250156.SAA11835@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Aug 24, 95 06:56:23 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I wonder what are the issues to have support for something like the > Intel ISDN 128kb card? Having ISDN to test it with. > Looks to me that people are allergic to writing ISDN drivers for U.S. > ISDN cards :) Looks like the people who would be willing to do it (like me) don't have ISDN available in their area. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 19:17:21 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA17204 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:17:21 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA17197 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:17:17 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id TAA10279; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:16:16 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id TAA13550; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:18:10 -0700 Message-Id: <199508250218.TAA13550@corbin.Root.COM> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sys/malloc.h In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 95 20:09:44 MDT." <9508250209.AA09902@cs.weber.edu> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:18:10 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> The KMEMSTATS #ifdefs are bogus and should be removed. I had removed them >> once in my local sources but the changes got lost. We always gather malloc >> stats in FreeBSD - the information is just too important to be without. > >In which case the MALLOC()/free() parings are incorrect, and should be >using MALLOC()/FREE() instead, right? Or malloc()/free(). > >It doesn't seem legal to mix pairings. MALLOC/FREE are bogus and should be removed. >On the other hand, the spl() code still seems ...bizarre. The spl() is >being set twice, once in the malloc()/free() and once on the macroized >versions. The stats are collected in malloc/free, not in the macroized versions. >Seems that maybe the stats gathering should be moved into malloc()/free() >itself instead of being in malloc.h to save at least one spl/splx pair. The extra spls are never executed since KMEMSTATS is always true. >We may even want to reconsider why spl/splx is needed to guard around >the malloc()/free() anyway -- obviously to allow allocation/freeing >in interrupt code. Perhaps we should adopt an architecture of prealloc >and free later for interrupt level alloc/free? It's because mallocs and frees have to happen in the networking code at interrupt time. It would be tremendously wasteful to pre-alloc megabytes of memory just to avoid this. -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 19:22:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA17354 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:22:35 -0700 Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (schizo.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.32]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA17346 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:22:33 -0700 Received: (from mrcpu@localhost) by schizo.cdsnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.9) id TAA01046; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:22:27 -0700 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:22:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: wu-ftd problem. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hmph. I installed the 7/26 snap on a box, and it's working just fine. I grabbed the 2.0.5 wu-ftpd, pkg_added it, and now I get: web1:/var/ftp/pub/mirrors/unix/freebsd/2.0.5-RELEASE/compat20 % !! ftp ftp2 Connected to ftp2.cdsnet.net. ld.so: warning: libc.so.2.1: minor version < 2 expected, using it anyway ftp> quit It doesn't log anything, it doesn't syslog anything, nothing, it just doesn't work. I looked at the shlibs in /usr/lib, and some of them were owned by a UID 2035.wheel, rather than bin.bin, I changed that, but still didn't fix it. Relp, Relp. It's gotta be something monumentally stupid, but I don't know what. Also, where are the docs on getting started with CTM? From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 19:28:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA17638 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:28:30 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA17632 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:28:26 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA20549; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:26:44 -0700 To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: Poul-Henning Kamp , jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco), terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 06:35:32 PDT." <23334.809271332@critter.tfs.com> Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:26:44 -0700 Message-ID: <20546.809317604@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > There is actually a lot more promise in a 16550 or 16650 at 460800 bps. > You only get 1/16th or 1/32th the number of interrupts. Hmmm. I find that the serial interrupt overhead is pretty intense at 115.2 even with a 16550. You know some secret for doing this I don't? Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 19:50:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA18360 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:50:58 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA18350 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:50:54 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA12243; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:49:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199508250249.TAA12243@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 20:12:57 MDT." <9508250212.AA09924@cs.weber.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:49:16 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Terry Lambert said: > > I wonder what are the issues to have support for something like the > > Intel ISDN 128kb card? > > Having ISDN to test it with. > > > Looks to me that people are allergic to writing ISDN drivers for U.S. > > ISDN cards :) > > Looks like the people who would be willing to do it (like me) don't have > ISDN available in their area. > Perhaps, you can write a driver and have someone else test it for you. On my first programming job (which I refuse to say how long ago), I wrote typesetter drivers without the machine in-house... In fact, I never had to visit the customers site. Regards, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 20:43:45 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA21039 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 20:43:45 -0700 Received: from mail2.netcom.com (mail2.netcom.com [192.100.81.122]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA21033 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 20:43:43 -0700 Received: from aries.ai.net by mail2.netcom.com (8.6.12/Netcom) id SAA19810; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 18:58:52 -0700 Received: (from nc@localhost) by aries.ai.net (8.6.11/8.6.12) id VAA21859; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:57:59 -0400 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:57:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Network Coordinator To: Peter da Silva cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Marketing opportunity... In-Reply-To: <9508211746.AA17428@sonic.nmti.com.nmti.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > For $12,795... let's see, for $300 per drive, plus $100 per cabinet for each > group of 7 drives, plus $300 for a good SCSI card... > > $2000 FreeBSD server, 1 CD, Pentium, 16 MB. $2000 > $2600 7 CD cabinet, x4 $10400 > Total $12400 > > For $12400 I get 29 CDROMS, under one drive letter. Not bad... Keep in mind that quad speed internal CD-ROMs can go as low as $200 each. That means at least one more cabinet I suspect and a heck of a lot faster performance. -Jerry. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 20:48:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA21240 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 20:48:04 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA21234 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 20:47:58 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA29018; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:44:15 +1000 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:44:15 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508250344.NAA29018@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: jkh@time.cdrom.com, phk@critter.tfs.com Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, phk@freefall.FreeBSD.org, terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> There is actually a lot more promise in a 16550 or 16650 at 460800 bps. >> You only get 1/16th or 1/32th the number of interrupts. >Hmmm. I find that the serial interrupt overhead is pretty intense at 115.2 >even with a 16550. You know some secret for doing this I don't? Hrmph. I've posted accurate benchmarks about 50 times saying that for raw mode select()/read()/write() i/o, the overhead of the sio driver on a 486DX2/66 VLB system is about 7% for input and 3.5% for output. Of this, about 0.5% for input and 0.5% for ouput would go away if interrupts were free, and about 2.5% more for input and 1.5% for output would go away if the hardware was infinitely fast. The remainder (about half) is pure software overhead - it exists even for ptys. In fact, the pty implementation is not so good (for raw mode) and the input overhead is 5-10 times larger for ptys. An interrupt overhead of 0.5+0.5% isn't small, but it is acceptable when the software overheads are so large. Same for the hardware overhead of 2.5+1.5%. The 32-bit fifos on the 16650 would reduce the interrupt (and total) overhead by a whole 0.25%+0.25%. For the current cyclades driver, the fifos are only 12 bytes instead of 16, so the interrupt overhead is about 16/12 times larger. Other overheads are similar. For 16450 UARTs, there are about 16 times as many interrupts, so the interrupt overhead is about 16 times higher = 8% (more precisely, input overhead is 11% more and output overhead is 10% more). ISA parallel ports have significantly higher overheads that 16450s. They generate an interrupt per byte for output and an interrupt per nybble for input. They take about twice as many i/o's per byte for output and even more for input. The are only "fast" compared with serial ports because serial ports run at a fixed, relatively low, speed. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 21:13:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA22709 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:13:53 -0700 Received: from chrome.onramp.net (chrome.onramp.net [199.1.166.202]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA22701 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:13:51 -0700 Received: from localhost.jdl.com (localhost.jdl.com [127.0.0.1]) by chrome.onramp.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA18803; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:13:18 -0500 Message-Id: <199508250413.XAA18803@chrome.onramp.net> X-Authentication-Warning: chrome.onramp.net: Host localhost.jdl.com didn't use HELO protocol To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:49:16 PDT." <199508250249.TAA12243@rah.star-gate.com> Reply-To: jdl@chromatic.com Clarity-Index: null Threat-Level: none Software-Engineering-Dead-Seriousness: There's no excuse for unreadable code. Net-thought: If you meet the Buddha on the net, put him in your Kill file. Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:13:18 -0500 From: Jon Loeliger Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [cc's whacked] Apparently, "Amancio Hasty Jr." scribbled: > >>> Terry Lambert said: > > > I wonder what are the issues to have support for something like the > > > Intel ISDN 128kb card? > > > > Having ISDN to test it with. > > > > > Looks to me that people are allergic to writing ISDN drivers for U.S. > > > ISDN cards :) > > > > Looks like the people who would be willing to do it (like me) don't have > > ISDN available in their area. > > > > Perhaps, you can write a driver and have someone else test it for you. Hmm. I thought the same thing here, but didn't know how well it would float in general. I have ISDN and an IBM Waverunner card. I know a *little* about writing drivers, and would be willing to participate in such an effort. I doubt that I would be the right person to try and write a driver cold, though. Perhaps starting with one of the other ISDN cards is a good starting framework? I don't know how good the technical specs for the IBM WR card are, or perhaps more importantly, if they are even available. I could begin to look into it if people would be interested. > On my first programming job (which I refuse to say how long ago), I Ohhhh nooooo you don't. We're not getting into *that* one! :-) jdl From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 21:21:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA23148 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:21:04 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA23140 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:20:55 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA15752; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:20:53 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id GAA13183 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:20:52 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id AAA17399 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:11:24 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508242211.AAA17399@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:11:20 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199508242026.NAA08474@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> from "Rodney W. Grimes" at Aug 24, 95 01:26:37 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1699 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > I am not so worried about the National parts, it is the other manufactures, > as you point out later, that have different upper clock rates. I seem > to recall the TMS version topping at 5MHz, but maybe confusing that with > the Zylog SIO chip. Incidentally, i've got a pile of ancient photocopied Z80 docs on my desk: the SIO could handle up to 400 ns TxC/RxC cycles, or 2.5 MHz. The usual limitation to async rates of only 9600 Baud resulted out of 2.5 MHz pre-divided by 16 in the CTC "baud rate generator", and by using the 1:16 pre-divider in the SIO to avoid synchronization problems. Anyway, it seems impressive from today's point of view that you could go much beyond that... (and even got SDLC/HDLC). Even using the 1:16 divider at maximal clock rate would still yield 150 kbps. (And the Z80 SIO came with a 3-byte FIFO.) :-) 16C451 -- is this the PLCC-packaged chip (as opposed to the usual DIL-packaged 16[45]50's)? > I can tell you why they upped fmax to 24Mhz, that is the same clock needed > by most floppy controller chips, so now you can run both chips off the > same crystal on a multipurpose card. This is quite common in the Winbond > and SMC chips, there is an additional divider inside the chip that cuts > this down for the uarts, but uses it raw for the floppy controller. Look > on any winbond based atio card and you will see 1 24Mhz crystal. > > The 451/551 integrate some stuff, but I can't recall what ``stuff''. Is it possible to acces and re-program the pre-divider on this chip? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 21:21:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA23160 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:21:06 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA23143 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:21:04 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA15756; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:20:54 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id GAA13184 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:20:54 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id AAA17528 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:15:47 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508242215.AAA17528@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: gdb & MMAP To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:15:44 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: from "Gary Jennejohn" at Aug 24, 95 10:45:00 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 844 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Gary Jennejohn wrote: > > Anyway, I quickly identified the 2 places where HAVE_MMAP needs to be > defined and remade gdb with (as far as I can tell) no ill effects. But, > I also didn't notice any real benefits either. I'm forced to admit that > I haven't exactly stress-tested the new gdb, though. It's in gdb's (private -- hey why? why not link it against -lgnumalloc?) malloc library. The XFree86 folks are also experimenting with an mmap-based malloc(). I know that they do experience some problems, and David confirmed me that at least ``memory holes'' in a process' address space could cause some trouble. Just as a reminder... if it doesn't gain gdb anything, don't try to break it. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 21:24:19 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id VAA23434 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:24:19 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA23428 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:24:13 -0700 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA12898; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:24:00 -0700 Message-Id: <199508250424.VAA12898@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: jdl@chromatic.com cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:13:18 CDT." <199508250413.XAA18803@chrome.onramp.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 21:24:00 -0700 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Good luck in trying to pry the WaveRunner's API from IBM . Back when the WaveRunner came out, I send mail if memory does not failed me to the VP of the division handling the ISDN product line. They claim at the time that the code was split between the driver and the downloadable microde and that they were not willing to release the microde nor how to download the microcode. Amancio >>> Jon Loeliger said: > [cc's whacked] > > Apparently, "Amancio Hasty Jr." scribbled: > > >>> Terry Lambert said: > > > > I wonder what are the issues to have support for something like the > > > > Intel ISDN 128kb card? > > > > > > Having ISDN to test it with. > > > > > > > Looks to me that people are allergic to writing ISDN drivers for U.S. > > > > ISDN cards :) > > > > > > Looks like the people who would be willing to do it (like me) don't hav e > > > ISDN available in their area. > > > > > > > Perhaps, you can write a driver and have someone else test it for you. > > Hmm. I thought the same thing here, but didn't know how well it would > float in general. > > I have ISDN and an IBM Waverunner card. I know a *little* about writing > drivers, and would be willing to participate in such an effort. I doubt > that I would be the right person to try and write a driver cold, though. > > Perhaps starting with one of the other ISDN cards is a good starting > framework? I don't know how good the technical specs for the IBM WR > card are, or perhaps more importantly, if they are even available. > I could begin to look into it if people would be interested. > > > > On my first programming job (which I refuse to say how long ago), I > > Ohhhh nooooo you don't. We're not getting into *that* one! :-) > > jdl > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 22:06:49 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA24596 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:06:49 -0700 Received: from jaguar.cris.com (jaguar.cris.com [199.3.123.33]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA24590 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:06:48 -0700 Received: (from bsd@localhost) by jaguar.cris.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id WAA00208 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 24 Aug 1994 22:06:09 GMT From: BSD Mailing List Message-Id: <199408242206.WAA00208@jaguar.cris.com> Subject: PCI NCR-SCSI woes To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 24 Aug 1994 22:06:09 +0000 () X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME7] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1521 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I've been told to write to this list re: my problems. I upgraded my FreeBSD machine from a 486/66 EISA to a P90 PCI yesterday by basically pulling out the hard drive from one and placing it in another and booting & UserConfiguring kernel.GENERIC shipped w/ 2.0.5R. So far so good - system boots, everything works fine. I did a sup and "make world" to get a -stable release, everything makes, I configure a config file (below), make the new kernel, and the pci code in the kernel no longer detects the ncr scsi device: ---snip--- probing for devices on the pci0 bus: configuration mode 1 allows 32 devices changing root device to sd0a panic: cannot mount root ---snip--- The confusing part is that it works fine w/ 2.0.5R but not with 2.1.0-STABLE. Is it me, my machine, or the code, I wonder?? I hope it's me! System hardware: AST Premmia GX P/90, 32 mb RAM, PCI ATI Mach64 Vid, Soundblaster 16 ISA. Onboard ncr/ethernet. Disk is 2 GB Micropolis. Appropriate sections of my config file: (FWIW, this was extracted from someone who has the same pci/ncr controller as I): ... config kernel root on wd0 controller isa0 controller pci0 controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 vector fdintr disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 disk fd1 at fdc0 drive 1 controller ncr0 controller scbus0 ... If you'd like to see my entire "CONFIG" file, please finger bsd@jaguar.cris.com (I don't want to fill up everyone's mail box excessively :)) Thank you very much! - Richard Beerman From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 22:19:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA25204 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:19:03 -0700 Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.191.196.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA25196 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:19:00 -0700 Received: by misery.sdf.com id <1044>; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:14:04 +0100 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:13:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: Morgan Davis cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: How to rebuild /stand? In-Reply-To: <199508240832.BAA13528@io.cts.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Morgan Davis wrote: > 1. Is /stand necessary after your system has been installed? It's for emergencies. > 2. If so, is there a way to update it with the latest stuff? Latest stuff? What would that be? > 3. If not, is it okay to remove it? To save 1.7meg? Sure go right ahead.... Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 22:35:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA26059 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:35:16 -0700 Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id WAA26047 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:35:13 -0700 Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14893(1)>; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:34:31 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177475>; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:34:26 -0700 To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 95 00:18:44 PDT." <199508230718.AAA16049@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:34:19 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <95Aug24.223426pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508230718.AAA16049@freefall.FreeBSD.org> you write: >Actually, since all IP-nets SHALL transfer a minimum MTU of 576 (or >thereabout), there is no reason to receive a fragment with an offset of less. Actually, the minimum MTU in IPv6 is 576; the minimum MTU in IPv4 is 68. 68 bytes is enough to get past the transport layer ports, so you should be able to prevent this kind of attack by dropping fragments with an offset of less than 68. This will still allow overwriting TCP options, but it's not likely that a firewall is going to be filtering on them... Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 23:23:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA27760 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:23:36 -0700 Received: from gvr.win.tue.nl (gvr.win.tue.nl [131.155.210.19]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA27753 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:23:32 -0700 Received: by gvr.win.tue.nl (8.6.10/1.53) id IAA08602; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:22:50 +0200 From: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) Message-Id: <199508250622.IAA08602@gvr.win.tue.nl> Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND To: fenner@parc.xerox.com (Bill Fenner) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:22:50 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: phk@freefall.freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <95Aug24.223426pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> from "Bill Fenner" at Aug 24, 95 10:34:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 595 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Bill Fenner wrote: > > Actually, the minimum MTU in IPv6 is 576; the minimum MTU in IPv4 is 68. > 68 bytes is enough to get past the transport layer ports, so you should > be able to prevent this kind of attack by dropping fragments with an > offset of less than 68. This will still allow overwriting TCP options, > but it's not likely that a firewall is going to be filtering on them... Not true. an ip header kan be 60 bytes maximum (20 byte header, 40 byte options). you should at least make sure that you can 'look' to the ACK it of the TCP header. That means at least 14 bytes.. -Guido From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 23:27:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA28047 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:27:09 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id XAA28040 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:27:06 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA17857; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:27:03 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA13546 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:27:03 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA01178 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:14:15 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508250614.IAA01178@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Odd X behaviour To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:14:15 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Michael C. Newell" at Aug 24, 95 07:23:32 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 632 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Michael C. Newell wrote: > > > This seems to be a generall X problem. This behaviour is reproducable > > on Sun workstations too. > > Hmmmmm... Hadn't noticed it on my office workstation. Have to try it. :-) They didn't turn NumLock on by default. It's been a bug in the Xaw code, and the Good News is, it's been fixed in the X11R6 public fix 12, as included in XFree86 3.1.2. (The latter does also turn NumLock off by default.) I think we've complained enough meanwhile. :-) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 23:27:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA28068 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:27:12 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id XAA28041 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:27:07 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA17853; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:27:02 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA13545 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:27:01 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA01137 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:09:45 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508250609.IAA01137@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:09:45 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199508250344.NAA29018@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 25, 95 01:44:15 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 651 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Bruce Evans wrote: > > ISA parallel ports have significantly higher overheads that 16450s. They > generate an interrupt per byte for output and an interrupt per nybble for > input. They take about twice as many i/o's per byte for output and even > more for input. The are only "fast" compared with serial ports because > serial ports run at a fixed, relatively low, speed. You can also say it in other words: they are not allowed to burn all CPU cycles (provided you don't have a 368/16 only). :-) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 23:27:33 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA28172 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:27:33 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id XAA28089 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:27:15 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de with SMTP (5.67b+/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) id AA17862; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:27:06 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA13547; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:27:04 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA01232; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:19:03 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508250619.IAA01232@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: wu-ftd problem. To: mrcpu@cdsnet.net (Jaye Mathisen) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:19:02 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Jaye Mathisen" at Aug 24, 95 07:22:26 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 1109 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Jaye Mathisen wrote: > > > > web1:/var/ftp/pub/mirrors/unix/freebsd/2.0.5-RELEASE/compat20 % !! > ftp ftp2 > Connected to ftp2.cdsnet.net. > ld.so: warning: libc.so.2.1: minor version < 2 expected, using it anyway > ftp> quit The program has been linked against libc.so.2.2. > It doesn't log anything, it doesn't syslog anything, nothing, it just > doesn't work. Surprising. Normally, it does work anyway. The version number has been bumped since: revision 1.13 date: 1995/08/09 06:50:52; author: asami; state: Exp; lines: +1 -1 Bump shlib minor because xdr_* functions have been enabled. Do NOT bump it again if something else is added before 2.2. The xdr_* functions are enabled only in the 2.2 (-current) branch so far. If that modification is moved to the 2.1 (-stable) branch, this one should, too. Reviewed by: the mailing lists > Also, where are the docs on getting started with CTM? Hmm, docs? /usr/share/FAQ/Text/ctm.FAQ perhaps? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 24 23:40:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA29777 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:40:41 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA29769 for ; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:40:39 -0700 Received: (from jkh@localhost) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA21113 for hackers@freefall; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:40:36 -0700 Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 23:40:36 -0700 From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Message-Id: <199508250640.XAA21113@time.cdrom.com> To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Zyxel ISDN modems. Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Chuck recommends the Adtrans, actually: http://www.adtran.com/cpe/isdn/isu.html ISU Express model on that page. Only does V.32 as a _modem_ but features *async* bonding. If you're going to use ISDN, that would make more sense. JOrdan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 00:02:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA03239 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:02:05 -0700 Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id AAA03229 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:02:02 -0700 Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14889(2)>; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:01:09 PDT Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177475>; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:01:01 -0700 To: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 95 23:22:50 PDT." <199508250622.IAA08602@gvr.win.tue.nl> Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:00:54 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <95Aug25.000101pdt.177475@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199508250622.IAA08602@gvr.win.tue.nl> you write: >you should at least make sure that you can 'look' to the >ACK it of the TCP header. Right, I forgot about the stupid SYN hack (I prefer secure firewalls =). So for TCP, that means that you will potentially drop legal packets (of course, I pity the fool who uses an MTU of 68, but it's legal...). Basically, this just means that the minimum acceptable fragment offset needs to be configurable; perhaps even differently for TCP and UDP (or TCP and everything-else)... Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 00:12:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA04262 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:12:20 -0700 Received: from web.azstarnet.com (azstarnet.com [169.197.1.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA04247 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:12:18 -0700 Received: from dialup87.azstarnet.com (dialup87.azstarnet.com [169.197.2.87]) by web.azstarnet.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with SMTP id AAA28407; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:11:24 -0700 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:11:24 -0700 Message-Id: <199508250711.AAA28407@web.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: maher@azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: questions@FreeBSD.org, ports@FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-FAQ@freefall.FreeBSD.org From: maher@azstarnet.com (maher katbah) Subject: cu on BSD Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi I have freeBSD on my machine, and I connect to internet provider through a modem by using cu. The provider is using sun solries in his machine. Now when I am trying to download a 2.97 MB file by using the ~t , or ~take I will receive 2.93MB file. After that if I want to gunzip it , I have "corrupt file" message. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 00:15:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id AAA04673 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:15:10 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id AAA04652 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:14:56 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id QAA04701 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:44:53 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508250714.QAA04701@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Changes in sio driver since 2.0.5? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:44:52 +0930 (CST) Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1445 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Greetings serial wizards; Given the unavailability of the mailing list search engine, I'm wondering if anyone can fill me in on the changes to the sio driver that have been made subsequent to the release of 2.0.5. In particular, I have a system here with an AST 4-port clone that is crashing regularly, usually when modem status changes. I say "a" loosely; the _entire_ system has been changed (except for the case & the modems), and we're at our wit's end as to what to try next. "crash" is loosely defined too - "freeze", "spontaneous reboot" and "trap 12" have all been seen. Normally, I'd suspect hardware in a case like this, and the number of 2.0.5 modem servers around tends to dissuade belief in a serial driver problem, but there's nothing left to suspect 8( If nothing surfaces in the next day or so, we'll be producing a much more detailed report as to what we've tried, but it'd be nice to know what's been changed. (we tried folding the -current sio.c in, but by the time you update everything else, you end up with a nonworking kernel 8( ) -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 02:18:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA17857 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:18:12 -0700 Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA17841 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:18:04 -0700 Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id LAA01188; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:06:54 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199508250906.LAA01188@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Help installing IDE CD-ROM driver To: purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:06:53 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, dfr@render.com In-Reply-To: <9508250211.AA01765@jaguar.cs.shizuoka.ac.jp> from "purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp" at Aug 25, 95 11:11:21 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1576 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (LUIGI) and dfr@render.com (DFR) responded: > > >[LUIGI] I get the same report on my systems (both 1.1 and 2.0.5) with a > >[LUIGI] Sony CDU55 unit mounted as slave on the primary IDE. Nevertheless, > >[LUIGI] I can mount wcd1a just fine. The only thing that does not work is > >[LUIGI] the audio-cd support. > > >[DFR] Did you try accessing the drive? I had this problem and I could access > >[DFR] the drive without any problems. > > I tried accessing the drive by "mount -r /dev/wcd0c /cdrom". But, it failed. > On the console, the following messages appeared (YWP is the hostname): I think you should rather use mount -t cd9660 /dev/wcd0a /cdrom (but this should give a different error message, such as "bogus superblock" or so), and wait for a few seconds after you have inserted the disk, so that the controller can recognize it. But then, the changer might need some special command to load a disk. > YWP# mount -r /dev/wcd0c /cdrom > /dev/wcd0c on /cdrom: Input/output error > YWP# Aug 24 22:13:30 YWP /kernel: atapi1.0: controller not ready > Aug 24 22:13:30 YWP /kernel: atapi1.0: controller not ready Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 02:34:14 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA19421 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:34:14 -0700 Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA19413 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:34:11 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id CAA00576; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:30:35 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Poul-Henning Kamp , jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco), terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:26:44 PDT." <20546.809317604@time.cdrom.com> Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:30:35 -0700 Message-ID: <574.809343035@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > There is actually a lot more promise in a 16550 or 16650 at 460800 bps. > > You only get 1/16th or 1/32th the number of interrupts. > > Hmmm. I find that the serial interrupt overhead is pretty intense at 115.2 > even with a 16550. You know some secret for doing this I don't? Yes, make sure you have a 16550AN (I belive the 'A' is the important part). The fifo's didn't work on the first "16550" parts. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Just that: dried leaves in boiling water ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 02:39:26 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA19964 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:39:26 -0700 Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA19954 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:39:23 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id CAA00681; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:37:12 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: guido@gvr.win.tue.nl (Guido van Rooij) cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com (Bill Fenner), phk@freefall.freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: IPFW and SCREEND In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:22:50 +0200." <199508250622.IAA08602@gvr.win.tue.nl> Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:37:12 -0700 Message-ID: <679.809343432@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Bill Fenner wrote: > > > > Actually, the minimum MTU in IPv6 is 576; the minimum MTU in IPv4 is 68. > > 68 bytes is enough to get past the transport layer ports, so you should > > be able to prevent this kind of attack by dropping fragments with an > > offset of less than 68. This will still allow overwriting TCP options, > > but it's not likely that a firewall is going to be filtering on them... > > Not true. an ip header kan be 60 bytes maximum (20 byte header, 40 byte > options). you should at least make sure that you can 'look' to the > ACK it of the TCP header. That means at least 14 bytes.. I'm pretty sure that you wont get bit by denying any fragments starting < 256 bytes. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Just that: dried leaves in boiling water ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 02:48:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id CAA21044 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:48:38 -0700 Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.64.181]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id CAA21037 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:48:36 -0700 Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.9) id CAA18029; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:44:44 -0700 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 02:44:44 -0700 Message-Id: <199508250944.CAA18029@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de CC: mrcpu@cdsnet.net, hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <199508250619.IAA01232@uriah.heep.sax.de> (message from J Wunsch on Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:19:02 +0200 (MET DST)) Subject: Re: wu-ftd problem. From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk * > ld.so: warning: libc.so.2.1: minor version < 2 expected, using it anyway * > ftp> quit * * The program has been linked against libc.so.2.2. That's right, all new ports are linked against 2.2-current. The original poster said he grabbed the 2.0.5 version though....are you sure, Jaye? But anyway, this can't be the reason why it's failing, as I don't think wu-ftpd uses the new functions. (And if it does, ld.so should fail instead of just complaining and starting the program anyway...right?) Satoshi From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 05:07:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id FAA29553 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 05:07:16 -0700 Received: from fathergoose.net6c.io.org (fathergoose.net6c.io.org [204.92.6.86]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id FAA29547 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 05:07:13 -0700 Received: (from kwong@localhost) by fathergoose.net6c.io.org (8.6.12/8.6.10) id DAA01286; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 03:34:30 -0400 From: Ken Wong Message-Id: <199508250734.DAA01286@fathergoose.net6c.io.org> Subject: Re: How to abort a DMA transfer ? To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 03:34:29 -0400 (EDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199508201701.TAA12803@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Aug 20, 95 07:01:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 676 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Luigi Rizzo Wrote: > > How (within a device driver) do I abort a DMA transfer which has > been started but has not completed yet ? I am having this problem > in the driver for a hand-scanner (the scanner does some read ahead; > meanwhile, a user might close the device and we want to abort the > transfer and free the buffer). I am surprised I haven't seen (or > understood!) anything like this in existing drivers, not even in > the floppy driver! To abort the DMA transfer: 1) reset the device that is using the DMA. being that scanner controller. 2) change some DMA registers for that channel. ( I don't have my book here today, but I can find out if needed). Ken From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 06:19:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA02127 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:19:30 -0700 Received: from Jessica.RatsNest.VaBeach.VA.US (h-antique.richmond.infi.net [204.117.145.168]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id GAA02117 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:19:27 -0700 Message-Id: <199508251319.GAA02117@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Pavlov's Cat" Organization: Organized? Me? Hah! To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:19:20 -240 Subject: ARP'ing (Discovery of IP Interfaces on a subnet) Reply-to: SimsS@Infi.Net Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.01) Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Greetings, hack-folks. (Sorry for being a little off-topic, but I'm coming straight to the experts) My shop has a problem managing IP addresses. This is only being compounded by the roll-out of Win-95, since now *everybody's a Net-Expert ;-). Problem is: Users are configuring their boxes with arbitrary IP addresses. By this I mean, they'll go over to the next cubicle, snoop at the IP address and then go back and configure a "similar" address in order to get IP running on their box. Something like: "Gee, Joe Blow is 192.168.69.69, huh? Well, it's 1:30 right now, so I'll make my box 192.168.69.130." You can probably imagine that this is *not* a "Good Thing(tm)". I've looked at a DHCP implementation to help solve this problem, but until I can round up a Non-NT DHCP server (is there a "Free" one?) I'm in a jam. Bootp isn't an option because most of the boxes we're running don't have a bootp client capability. I figured that I could cobble up a little hack that works kind of like the following nugget of meta-code: for ( i=0 ; i<256 ; i++ ) { // look for every IP in the subnet MacAddress = arp("192.168.69", i ); // anybody out there? if (MacAddress) // If I got a MAC address from IP address printf("192.168.69.i\t",MacAddress); // show it } This would give me a list of the MAC addresses of the interfaces connected to the local segment. Then I got to thinking (always dangerous!) and decided that I could probably hack up a script that banged this output against *my* canonical list of assigned addresses and show me those IP addresses that I don't know about. (Then I can hunt down these rogues (dogs that they are) and comandeer their ethernet adapters until they learn to play nice on the net.) Before I jump in and make the all-singing, all-dancing ARP discovery toolkit, is there a package somewhere that does this sort of thing? Some background: I've got RMON'ed Cabletron hubs, but they don't know about IP-layer stuff, just datalink layer stuff. Sun NetMangler isn't any help here. Spectrum sucks. At least for this kind of thing. Ultimately, I'd like to "cron" this thing so every couple of hours or so it'd tell me who's on the verge of creating an address collision with another node. If you've got any ideas, I'd sure like to hear about 'em. Again, sorry for being off-topic, but the FreeBSD brain trust is too potent to ignore. Thanks! -- ...sjs... Steve Sims (SJS7) SimsS@Infi.Net Systems Engineer, IPC Technologies, Inc. Virginia Beach, VA "Everyone wants to save the Earth; Nobody wants to help Mom do the dishes." ...P.J. O'Roarke From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 06:20:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA02202 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:20:57 -0700 Received: from server.netcraft.co.uk (server.netcraft.co.uk [194.72.238.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA02196 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:20:55 -0700 Received: (from paul@localhost) by server.netcraft.co.uk (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA17245; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 14:18:44 +0100 From: Paul Richards Message-Id: <199508251318.OAA17245@server.netcraft.co.uk> Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! To: mnewell@lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (Michael C. Newell) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 14:18:43 +0100 (BST) Cc: imp@village.org, taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw, tom@misery.sdf.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Michael C. Newell" at Aug 23, 95 04:29:22 pm Reply-to: paul@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 838 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In reply to Michael C. Newell who said > > > There's one on wcarchive.cdrom.com [aka ftp.freebsd.org] in either the > simtel or cica directory. Sorry I can't remember more except that I > downloaded it, installed it (with the WFW Wolverine stack) and it > worked. It requires you to load a TSR though before starting Windoze so > you lose some low memory. > > Personally I use SAMBA and WFW 3.11. Works fine for me... :-) > What TCP/IP stacks are people using to get their WFW boxes talking to SAMBA? I can't get it to work :-( I had Microsoft's beta stack working with SAMBA but Netscape crashed the machines accessing the winsock.dll -- Paul Richards, Bluebird Computer Systems. FreeBSD core team member. Internet: paul@FreeBSD.org, http://www.freebsd.org/~paul Phone: 0370 462071 (Mobile), +44 1222 457651 (home) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 06:45:40 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA03503 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:45:40 -0700 Received: from mail.rwth-aachen.de (mail.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.144.9]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA03496 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 06:45:34 -0700 Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de by mail.rwth-aachen.de (PMDF V4.3-10 #7297) id <01HUHUKRJ4ZK008DKS@mail.rwth-aachen.de>; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:46:00 +0100 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.8/8.6.9) id PAA07285; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:59:15 +0200 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:59:14 +0200 (MET DST) From: Christoph Kukulies Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! In-reply-to: <199508251318.OAA17245@server.netcraft.co.uk> from "Paul Richards" at Aug 25, 95 02:18:43 pm To: paul@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-to: Christoph Kukulies Message-id: <199508251359.PAA07285@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-type: text Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-length: 584 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > What TCP/IP stacks are people using to get their WFW boxes talking to SAMBA? > > I can't get it to work :-( I had Microsoft's beta stack working with > SAMBA but Netscape crashed the machines accessing the winsock.dll I'm using MS TCP-IP/32-3.11 all the time w/o problems though I never used netscape with it. > > -- > Paul Richards, Bluebird Computer Systems. FreeBSD core team member. > Internet: paul@FreeBSD.org, http://www.freebsd.org/~paul > Phone: 0370 462071 (Mobile), +44 1222 457651 (home) > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 07:32:56 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA04938 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 07:32:56 -0700 Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA04930 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 07:32:54 -0700 Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA08798; Fri, 25 Aug 95 10:32:22 -0400 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id KAA26472; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:32:19 -0400 Message-Id: <199508251432.KAA26472@exalt.x.org> To: "Michael C. Newell" Cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Odd X behaviour In-Reply-To: Your message of Thu, 24 Aug 1995 19:23:32 EST. Organization: X Consortium Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:32:18 EST From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Frank Nobis wrote: > > > Check wether the numlock is active or not. If You have numlock > > pressed, xterm and many other clients don't respond to mouse events as > > one would expect. > > Cool - that seemed to be it!! What's also odd os that pressing the "Num > Lock" key leaves the "Num Lock" *LIGHT* turned on, but alternatively > pressing it enables/disables the buttons. Weird. Toggle the value of the "typematic keyboard" in your CMOS setup. The newer Key Tronic keyboards and who knows what else now latch the Caps_Lock and Num_Lock keys. The BIOS won't know what kind of keyboard you've got unless you tell it. > !!*THANKS*!! for the hint! > > > This seems to be a generall X problem. This behaviour is reproducable > > on Sun workstations too. > Get thyself patched. This is fixed in fix-12. Here's a patch for xterm that didn't make it into fix-12: *** charproc.c Wed Apr 5 19:59:00 1995 --- programs/xterm/charproc.c Thu Aug 24 17:06:01 1995 *************** *** 1,5 **** /* ! * $XConsortium: charproc.c,v 1.183 95/04/05 19:59:00 kaleb Exp $ */ /* --- 1,5 ---- /* ! * $XConsortium: charproc.c /main/185 1995/08/24 17:05:11 kaleb $ */ /* *************** *** 276,301 **** */ static char defaultTranslations[] = "\ ! Shift Prior:scroll-back(1,halfpage) \n\ ! Shift Next:scroll-forw(1,halfpage) \n\ ! Shift Select:select-cursor-start() select-cursor-end(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) \n\ ! Shift Insert:insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) \n\ ! ~Meta :insert-seven-bit() \n\ ! Meta :insert-eight-bit() \n\ ! !Ctrl :popup-menu(mainMenu) \n\ ! !Lock Ctrl :popup-menu(mainMenu) \n\ ! ~Meta :select-start() \n\ ! ~Meta :select-extend() \n\ ! !Ctrl :popup-menu(vtMenu) \n\ ! !Lock Ctrl :popup-menu(vtMenu) \n\ ! ~Ctrl ~Meta :ignore() \n\ ! ~Ctrl ~Meta :insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) \n\ ! !Ctrl :popup-menu(fontMenu) \n\ ! !Lock Ctrl :popup-menu(fontMenu) \n\ ! ~Ctrl ~Meta :start-extend() \n\ ! ~Meta :select-extend() \n\ ! :select-end(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) \n\ ! :bell(0) \ "; static XtActionsRec actionsList[] = { --- 276,307 ---- */ static char defaultTranslations[] = "\ ! Shift Prior:scroll-back(1,halfpage) \n\ ! Shift Next:scroll-forw(1,halfpage) \n\ ! Shift Select:select-cursor-start() select-cursor-end(PRIMARY , CUT_BUFFER0) \n\ ! Shift Insert:insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) \n\ ! ~Meta :insert-seven-bit() \n\ ! Meta :insert-eight-bit() \n\ ! !Ctrl :popup-menu(mainMenu) \n\ ! !Lock Ctrl :popup-menu(mainMenu) \n\ ! !Lock Ctrl @Num_Lock :popup-menu(mainMenu) \n\ ! ! @Num_Lock Ctrl :popup-menu(mainMenu) \n\ ! ~Meta :select-start() \n\ ! ~Meta :select-extend() \n\ ! !Ctrl :popup-menu(vtMenu) \n\ ! !Lock Ctrl :popup-menu(vtMenu) \n\ ! !Lock Ctrl @Num_Lock :popup-menu(vtMenu) \n\ ! ! @Num_Lock Ctrl :popup-menu(vtMenu) \n\ ! ~Ctrl ~Meta :ignore() \n\ ! ~Ctrl ~Meta :insert-selection(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) \n\ ! !Ctrl :popup-menu(fontMenu) \n\ ! !Lock Ctrl :popup-menu(fontMenu) \n\ ! !Lock Ctrl @Num_Lock :popup-menu(fontMenu) \n\ ! ! @Num_Lock Ctrl :popup-menu(fontMenu) \n\ ! ~Ctrl ~Meta :start-extend() \n\ ! ~Meta :select-extend() \n\ ! :select-end(PRIMARY, CUT_BUFFER0) \n\ ! :bell(0) \ "; static XtActionsRec actionsList[] = { From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 08:05:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA06671 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:05:13 -0700 Received: from haven.ios.com (haven.ios.com [198.4.75.45]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA06664 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:05:09 -0700 Received: (from rashid@localhost) by haven.ios.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA28128 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:05:48 -0400 From: "Rashid Karimov." Message-Id: <199508251505.LAA28128@haven.ios.com> Subject: Fatal traps 12 == shitty motherboard | memory ??? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:05:47 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 781 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi there ppl, Pretty often 2 absolutely identical systems crash ( kernel panics ) with the messageL Fatal trap 12 while in kernel mode .... .... supersuser read, page not present process - PID ( different all the times) ..... What exactly does it mean: >> there is some bug in the kernel ( which I doubt, since kernel does intercept the exception) ? >> I've got shitty computers ( motherboard and/or memory) ? The systems are P120 Triton chipset, PCI SMC ethernet adapter,PCI Adaptec 2940, PCI SVGA trident ( no X11). I've upgraded the systems to 2.1 stable ( both kernel and binaries ). Any suggestions ? Any particular PC's brand to use ( the systems are _very heavily loaded : ~3000-4000 accounts on ea.,~50-70 users on-line). Rashid From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 08:51:47 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA10155 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:51:47 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA10101 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:51:39 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA22499; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:51:25 -0700 To: maher@azstarnet.com (maher katbah) cc: questions@FreeBSD.org, ports@FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, FreeBSD-FAQ@freefall.FreeBSD.org Followup-to: questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: cu on BSD In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Aug 1995 00:11:24 PDT." <199508250711.AAA28407@web.azstarnet.com> Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:51:25 -0700 Message-ID: <22497.809365885@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have freeBSD on my machine, and I connect to internet provider through a I'd like to ask everyone to let this question drop. I don't know what it is with this guy, but he's totally ignored my previous two pleas to STOP cross-posting his messages to every list we own! I have asked him nicely, I have asked him more firmly, but still the spam. I figure he'll go away if we simply ignore him completely or maybe he'll get the message that if he wants to talk to us, he shouldn't shout! Either way, I figure he's just lost his free Q&A privileges until he's at least willing to respond to one of my messages asking him to stop! Thanks. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 08:55:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA10838 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:55:07 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA10812 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 08:54:55 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id LAA29247; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:55:21 -0400 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:55:21 -0400 Message-Id: <199508251555.LAA29247@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: hackers@freebsd.org From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone - How about Sync? Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Apparently, "Amancio Hasty Jr." scribbled: >> >>> Terry Lambert said: >> > > I wonder what are the issues to have support for something like the >> > > Intel ISDN 128kb card? >> > >> > Having ISDN to test it with. >> > >> > > Looks to me that people are allergic to writing ISDN drivers for U.S. >> > > ISDN cards :) >> > >> > Looks like the people who would be willing to do it (like me) don't have >> > ISDN available in their area. >> > >> >> Perhaps, you can write a driver and have someone else test it for you. > There's been much discussion about high speed async and ISDN TAs. One of the better ways to get the most out of a 128k connection and ISDN in general is using a smart sync card with V.25bis dialing (which is sync dialing). If you're not comfortable with RS-232 at 128kbs there's V.35. We have an old V.25bis test module lying around somewhere.... If someone wants to work with me on this type of access I'd be willing to provide hardware and resources. Without V.25bis, It should work pretty much out of the box on a single dest auto-dial scenario. Dennis Emerging Technologies, Inc. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 09:11:58 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA12582 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:11:58 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA12559 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:11:54 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id MAA29425; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:11:42 -0400 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:11:42 -0400 Message-Id: <199508251611.MAA29425@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Paul Richards From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: alias ( secondary IP ) for Ethernet Ifaces in FreeBSD Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >In reply to Rashid Karimov. who said >> >> Hi there folx, >> >> Is it working ? >> If yes - how can one set it up ? What's the correct format for >> the command ? Should it be reflected somehow in ifconfig output >> or netstat ? > >Co-incidentally I've spent the last few days playing with this and >after talking with Garret, who explained a few problems I was >seeing, my conclusion is that it works but it needs some time spent >on it to make it more useable. A netstat -i will show up the alias >but I plan to look at revamping ifconfig to be more alias friendly >after 2.0.5 goes out. > >> >> For example , I have ep0 iface and I want to assign the >> secondary( alias) IP address to it . >> What command should be issued ? >> >> ifconfig ep0 alias 199.199.199.22 > I've read several messages in this thread and can't get it to work. SOMETHING shows up with netstat -in but I can't ping it. I've tried ifconfig ed0 204.141.95.2 alias (This takes but doesn't work) and ifconfig ed0 alias 204.141.95.2 (I get "File Exists" here) Has anyone figured this out yet? Dennis From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 09:13:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA12951 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:13:57 -0700 Received: from tesla.cview.com (tesla.cview.com [204.95.57.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA12903 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:13:48 -0700 Received: by tesla.cview.com (Smail3.1.29.0 #1) id m0sm1O5-0001E4C; Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:13 CDT Message-Id: From: malenovi@cview.com (Nik Malenovic) Subject: Q: ppp.slattach bugs/ppp server/load balancing To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:13:45 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 4817 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi folks - I just joined in on freebsd-* mailing list, so I apologize if this has been discussed - I don't have access to mailing lists archives. I am crossposting this to freebsd-hackers and freebsd-questions here is what I am about to ask: 1. slattach bug 2. ppp (iij) bug 3. question about load balancing (specificly over ppp links) 4. ppp server questions - offer of dynamic ip pppd server and misc. here we go. 1. has the slattach bug been fixed? under pre-2.0.5-950622-SNAP and the mentioned release, slattach has a bug - it doesn't release the comunication device when redialing - that would cause your kermit to time out becuase it's not able to open the comm device. I fixed it with the simple function call - which I am including at the end of the message: 2. ppp (iij) has a bug - try having your tunnel device as a 9th on the device list (netstat -i) - the bug is that the buffer was preset and too small for the systems that have more then 8 slip/ppp/tunel devices total. I am including the relevant 2 liner code fix at the end. 3. has any work been done on load balancing? I know Linux has it working, but I don't see it in 2.0.5-950622-SNAP - so is anyone working on it? If not, is anyone planning to do any work on it? 4. I am using ppp EXTENSIVELY - I even wrote dynamic ip ppp server - so here are a few ppp-related Qs: a. is there a FAQ on dynamic ppp? I wrote a doc for internal use on dynamic ip ppp server - whom do I talk to to make it available for wider use? maybe included in /usr/share/FAQ? b. I am getting LOTZA reboots with pppd - specially if my dialup ppp client hungs up (or gets a call when his call waiting is on, or when somebody else picks up the phone (and wonders what all that noise is about :-)). Has anyone been working extensively with pppd to help me out with those kind of problems? c. I am also getting reconnection problems with pppd - there are two subproblems: - when my connection is violently broken (without graceful shutdown), when I reconnect, pppd will refuse to start up firing of a message: ioctl(SIOCAIFADDR): Address already exists in other words - it trying to add a route to the ppp client but the route allready exists - so it fails miserably. the only solution so far has been to wait for some time and retry again. - when the connection is broken on my ppp link to another node - let's say I reboot, but the physical link is still up (i.e. the phone call is still in progress and modems have not hung up), I can't reconnect - slip does this automaticaly i.e. when you fire off slattach - if it's connected to the other side - it just keep going --- can I achieve similar effect under FreeBSD? - sometimes when I disconnect normally ppp client from FreeBSD pppd server, it "forgets" that the phone call has ended and keeps the ppp user process going. :( when it happened I tried experimenting and sending -HUP signal to the client ppp process but it would ignore it. any help? - Anyone willing to chat a bit more about ppp? :) I am just right out ready to kill for a chat with somebody who knows ppp extensively. thank you for reading. Nik -- malenovi@cview.com -------------------------------------------------- CODE: 1. slattach problem - in slattach.c: /* Close all FDs, fork */ void release_line() { int ttydisc = TTYDISC; ioctl(fd, TIOCSETD, &ttydisc); /* reset to tty discipline */ (void)close(STDIN_FILENO); /* close FDs before forking. */ (void)close(STDOUT_FILENO); (void)close(STDERR_FILENO); if (fd > 2) (void)close(fd); signal(SIGHUP, SIG_IGN); /* ignore HUP signal when parent dies. */ daemon(0,0); /* fork, setsid, chdir /, and close std*. */ while (getppid () != 1) sleep (1); /* Wait for parent to die. */ if ((int)signal(SIGHUP,sighup_handler) < 0) /* Re-enable HUP signal */ syslog(LOG_NOTICE,"cannot install SIGHUP handler: %m"); } and then add in: /* signup_handler() is invoked when carrier drops, eg. before redial. */ void sighup_handler() { if(exiting) return; again: /* invoke a shell for redial_cmd or punt. */ if (redial_cmd) { syslog(LOG_NOTICE,"SIGHUP on %s (sl%d); running %s", dev,unit,redial_cmd); /* * First close the slip line in case redial_cmd wants it * (like to use kermit to redial). */ release_line(); /* System() the redial command */ if (system(redial_cmd)) goto again; acquire_line(); setup_line(CLOCAL); ... [snip] [snip] [snip] ... -------------------------------------------------- 2. ppp (iij) problem - from route.c: int GetIfIndex(name) char *name; { #define NUM_DEVICES 8*10 struct ifreq *ifrp; int s, len, elen, index; struct ifconf ifconfs; struct ifreq reqbuf[4*NUM_DEVICES]; ... [snip] [snip] [snip] ... -------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 09:18:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA13587 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:18:38 -0700 Received: from healer.com (healer-gw.Empire.Net [205.164.80.204]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA13571 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:18:33 -0700 Received: (from gryphon@localhost) by healer.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA15279 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:20:59 -0400 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:20:59 -0400 From: Coranth Gryphon Message-Id: <199508251620.MAA15279@healer.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Hardware List... Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi. Someone was compiling a list of known-stable (ie. preferred) harware for 2.0.5 and later versions. I am looking for a good ISA 16 bit Ethernet card. The one I saw mentioned was a SMC Ultra Does anyone have a SMC part number, or a better suggestion? -coranth ------------------------------------------+------------------------+ Coranth Gryphon | "Faith Manages." | | - Satai Delenn | Phone: 603-598-3440 Fax: 603-598-3430 +------------------------+ USMail: 11 Carver St, Nashua, NH 03060 Disclaimer: All these words are yours, except Europa... From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 09:33:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA14703 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:33:05 -0700 Received: from uuneo.neosoft.com (uuneo.NeoSoft.COM [198.64.84.252]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA14697 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:33:03 -0700 Received: from ris1.UUCP (ficc@localhost) by uuneo.neosoft.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with UUCP id LAA15075 for freebsd.org!hackers; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:22:29 -0500 Received: by ris1.nmti.com (smail2.5) id AA01415; 24 Aug 95 11:04:42 CDT (Thu) Received: by sonic.nmti.com; id AA08098; Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:30:43 -0500 From: peter@nmti.com (Peter da Silva) Message-Id: <9508241630.AA08098@sonic.nmti.com.nmti.com> Subject: WD7000 not on boot.flp! To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 11:30:42 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 76 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Aieeee! (calm down) How do I get a boot.flp with WD7000ASC (wds) support? From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 09:35:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA14985 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:35:28 -0700 Received: from uuneo.neosoft.com (uuneo.NeoSoft.COM [198.64.84.252]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA14979 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:35:27 -0700 Received: from ris1.UUCP (ficc@localhost) by uuneo.neosoft.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with UUCP id LAA15144 for freefall.cdrom.com!hackers; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:23:03 -0500 Received: by ris1.nmti.com (smail2.5) id AA18557; 25 Aug 95 01:29:57 CDT (Fri) Received: by sonic.nmti.com; id AA11449; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 01:55:36 -0500 From: peter@nmti.com (Peter da Silva) Message-Id: <9508250655.AA11449@sonic.nmti.com.nmti.com> Subject: ESDI drive woes To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 01:55:35 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 719 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk OK, I'm trying for the umpteenth time to install FreeBSD 2.0.5 on an ESDI drive. Drive is formatted with Disk Manager. Apparently when Disk Manager sees a bad sector, it "spares" the whole track. Unfortunately, FreeBSD doesn't know where to find the spare track, or the spare track is unformatted. Disk Manager won't format outside the official data space on the drive. When bad144 sees a spare track, it eats all 35 of the sectors on it and it doesn't take many defects to beat the maximum of 126 defects per partition at that rate. The controller is an HP special. It looks like a WD1007 but doesn't appear to have a BIOS accessible through DEBUG, so I can't use the WD sector sparing even if I wanted to. Help? From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 09:44:57 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id JAA15389 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:44:57 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA15374 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:44:51 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id CAA24661; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 02:38:58 +1000 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 02:38:58 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508251638.CAA24661@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, purna@cs.shizuoka.ac.jp Subject: Re: Help installing IDE CD-ROM driver Cc: dfr@render.com, hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> I tried accessing the drive by "mount -r /dev/wcd0c /cdrom". But, it failed. >> On the console, the following messages appeared (YWP is the hostname): >I think you should rather use > mount -t cd9660 /dev/wcd0a /cdrom In 2.2-current, MAKEDEV only creates the 'c' partition. This is probably bogus. The 'c' partition is actually the 'a' partition (it has minor 0). This is certainly bogus. The wcd*) case is similar to the cd*|mcd*|scd*) and should be merged. The matcd*) case is not so similar. There is a second set of `l' (lockable) devices and the `c' partition is abused to provide a different interface (this will have to be changed when all disk drivers use the slice code. I haven't been able to remove the old disklabel support because beelyuns of cd drivers depend on it. The slice code doesn't do much for readonly disks, but it should save beelyuns of cd drivers from duplicating support for label ioctls). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 10:19:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA18502 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:19:06 -0700 Received: from scylla.sovam.com (scylla.sovam.com [192.216.212.97]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA18491 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:18:57 -0700 Received: from arminco.aic.net by scylla.sovam.com with SMTP id AA13864 (5.67b8s3p1/IDA-1.5); Fri, 25 Aug 1995 21:17:26 +0400 From: sam@arminco.com (Samvel Stepanian) X-Mailer: SCO System V Mail (version 3.2) To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: Changes in sio driver Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 21:17:11 MMT Message-Id: <9508252117.aa11303@arminco.arminco.com> Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk ------------------------------ >From: Michael Smith >Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:44:52 +0930 (CST) >Subject: Changes in sio driver since 2.0.5? >Greetings serial wizards; >In particular, I have a system here with an AST 4-port clone that is >crashing regularly, usually when modem status changes. >"crash" is loosely defined too - "freeze", "spontaneous reboot" and >"trap 12" have all been seen. Normally, I'd suspect hardware in a case >like this, and the number of 2.0.5 modem servers around tends to >dissuade belief in a serial driver problem, but there's nothing left >to suspect 8( I have the same problem with FreeBSD 2.0 and AST clone multicard. Something is definitely wrong with flow control. ALthough when I changed modem entry in /etc/ttys to "std.2400" everything works,no crashes, but slow 2400 baud...%$#@ :-) Are there any guys who already faced that problem and solved it? Help would be *GREATLY* appreciated..... -----------------------------------+---------------------------------------- Samvel Stepanian |ARMINCO (Armenian Internet Company Ltd) Network Information Center Manager |43, Mashtots ave.,375009,P.O.BOX #010 Tel/Fax: +7(8852)28-50-82 |Yerevan E-Mail: sam@arminco.com |Republic of Armenia From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 10:24:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA18774 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:24:03 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA18768 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:24:01 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA11901; Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:25:38 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508251725.AA11901@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: sys/malloc.h To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:25:37 MDT Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508250218.TAA13550@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Aug 24, 95 07:18:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >We may even want to reconsider why spl/splx is needed to guard around > >the malloc()/free() anyway -- obviously to allow allocation/freeing > >in interrupt code. Perhaps we should adopt an architecture of prealloc > >and free later for interrupt level alloc/free? > > It's because mallocs and frees have to happen in the networking code at > interrupt time. It would be tremendously wasteful to pre-alloc megabytes of > memory just to avoid this. Are you saying megabytes of memory worth of packets come in at interrupt time before the buffers have a chance to be processed and subsequently freed? If that's the case, then the "megabytes of memory" are allocated anyway, and I don't see how changing when this happens is wasteful. It seems that this is just a hack to handle bursting of data, and even then it's a hack that only works for non-interrupt time servicing of interrupt data -- something the drivers aren't architected for. If they were architected this way, then you'd have a soft interrupt to service (and free) the buffer -- not in interrupt mode. On the other hand, if you are referring to something like the NFS server calling VOP_READDIR, which necessitates calling malloc/free each time it is called, well I agree that's wasteful and shouldn't be preallocated. By the same token, it shouldn't be allocated at all; it should be using a stack variable for the discardable buffer it uses to temporarily save the directory search results while processing them into an RPC reply. In any case, there doesn't seem to be a significant handicap to requiring explicit allocation of interrupt time memory. In point of fact, SMP will require this in any case... or a memory domain private to interrupt level as opposed to private to a particular CPU (which amounts to permananet allocation, since freeing is also limited to interrupt level, unless you want to trade I/O for CPU bandwidth, and an SMP box is rarely I/O bound...). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 10:25:03 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA18916 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:25:03 -0700 Received: from irbs.irbs.com (irbs.com [199.182.75.129]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA18907 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:25:00 -0700 Received: (from jc@localhost) by irbs.irbs.com (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA07044; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:24:13 -0400 From: John Capo Message-Id: <199508251724.NAA07044@irbs.irbs.com> Subject: Re: alias ( secondary IP ) for Ethernet Ifaces in FreeBSD To: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:24:11 -0400 (EDT) Cc: paul@isl.cf.ac.uk, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508251611.MAA29425@mail.htp.com> from "dennis" at Aug 25, 95 12:11:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1240 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk dennis writes: > > >In reply to Rashid Karimov. who said > >> > >> Hi there folx, > >> > >> Is it working ? > >> If yes - how can one set it up ? What's the correct format for > >> the command ? Should it be reflected somehow in ifconfig output > >> or netstat ? > > > >Co-incidentally I've spent the last few days playing with this and > >after talking with Garret, who explained a few problems I was > >seeing, my conclusion is that it works but it needs some time spent > >on it to make it more useable. A netstat -i will show up the alias > >but I plan to look at revamping ifconfig to be more alias friendly > >after 2.0.5 goes out. > > > >> > >> For example , I have ep0 iface and I want to assign the > >> secondary( alias) IP address to it . > >> What command should be issued ? > >> > >> ifconfig ep0 alias 199.199.199.22 > > > > I've read several messages in this thread and can't get it to work. > SOMETHING shows up with netstat -in but I can't ping it. I've tried > > > ifconfig ed0 204.141.95.2 alias (This takes but doesn't work) > > and > > ifconfig ed0 alias 204.141.95.2 (I get "File Exists" here) > Try ifconfig ed0 alias 204.141.95.2 netmask 0xffffffff John Capo IRBS Engineering From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 10:28:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA19140 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:28:00 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA19131 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:27:59 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA11925; Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:28:03 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508251728.AA11925@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:28:02 MDT Cc: phk@critter.tfs.com, phk@freefall.FreeBSD.org, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, terryl@CS.Stanford.EDU, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <20546.809317604@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 24, 95 07:26:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > There is actually a lot more promise in a 16550 or 16650 at 460800 bps. > > You only get 1/16th or 1/32th the number of interrupts. > > Hmmm. I find that the serial interrupt overhead is pretty intense at 115.2 > even with a 16550. You know some secret for doing this I don't? That's because it's being done wrong. You take the interrupt and poll like hell in the service routine to handle higher data rates. You can do 115k on a non-FIFO'ed UART using this technique. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 10:30:10 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA19349 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:30:10 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA19343 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:30:08 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA11938; Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:30:16 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508251730.AA11938@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:30:15 MDT Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508250249.TAA12243@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Aug 24, 95 07:49:16 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Perhaps, you can write a driver and have someone else test it for you. > > On my first programming job (which I refuse to say how long ago), I > wrote typesetter drivers without the machine in-house... In fact, > I never had to visit the customers site. I wrote Calcomp plotter drivers under the same conditions. I'm not ready to try that again. 8-(. This is supposed to be entertaining. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 10:36:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA19581 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:36:43 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA19575 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:36:42 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA11968; Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:38:14 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508251738.AA11968@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: ESDI drive woes To: peter@nmti.com (Peter da Silva) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 11:38:13 MDT Cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <9508250655.AA11449@sonic.nmti.com.nmti.com> from "Peter da Silva" at Aug 25, 95 01:55:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > OK, I'm trying for the umpteenth time to install FreeBSD 2.0.5 on an > ESDI drive. > > Drive is formatted with Disk Manager. > > Apparently when Disk Manager sees a bad sector, it "spares" the whole track. > Unfortunately, FreeBSD doesn't know where to find the spare track, or the > spare track is unformatted. Disk Manager won't format outside the official > data space on the drive. > > When bad144 sees a spare track, it eats all 35 of the sectors on it and > it doesn't take many defects to beat the maximum of 126 defects per > partition at that rate. > > The controller is an HP special. It looks like a WD1007 but doesn't appear > to have a BIOS accessible through DEBUG, so I can't use the WD sector > sparing even if I wanted to. WD1007 format utility on ftp.wdc.com. Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 10:38:30 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA19780 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:38:30 -0700 Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA19772 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:38:26 -0700 Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id DAA26409; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 03:34:41 +1000 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 03:34:41 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199508251734.DAA26409@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, peter@nmti.com Subject: Re: ESDI drive woes Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >OK, I'm trying for the umpteenth time to install FreeBSD 2.0.5 on an >ESDI drive. >Drive is formatted with Disk Manager. >Apparently when Disk Manager sees a bad sector, it "spares" the whole track. >Unfortunately, FreeBSD doesn't know where to find the spare track, or the >spare track is unformatted. Disk Manager won't format outside the official >data space on the drive. A non-braindamaged format program would only mark the bad sectors as bad provided you aren't using firmware sector sparing (whole tracks are normally marked as bad when there are too many bad sectors for the firmware. >The controller is an HP special. It looks like a WD1007 but doesn't appear >to have a BIOS accessible through DEBUG, so I can't use the WD sector >sparing even if I wanted to. wdfmt supports it. Get wdfmt from the WD archive. Don't use WD sector sparing if you can help it. Disks with localized areas of dense bad sectors can be handled with bad144 by not putting FreeBSD partitions over those areas. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 10:46:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA20316 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:46:41 -0700 Received: from mail.htp.com (mail.htp.com [199.171.4.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA20310 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:46:39 -0700 Received: from et.htp.com (et.htp.com [199.171.4.228]) by mail.htp.com (8.6.5/8.6.5) with SMTP id NAA00140; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:47:02 -0400 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:47:02 -0400 Message-Id: <199508251747.NAA00140@mail.htp.com> X-Sender: dennis@mail.htp.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) From: dennis@et.htp.com (dennis) Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> > There is actually a lot more promise in a 16550 or 16650 at 460800 bps. >> > You only get 1/16th or 1/32th the number of interrupts. >> >> Hmmm. I find that the serial interrupt overhead is pretty intense at 115.2 >> even with a 16550. You know some secret for doing this I don't? > >That's because it's being done wrong. > >You take the interrupt and poll like hell in the service routine to handle >higher data rates. You can do 115k on a non-FIFO'ed UART using this >technique. > One interrupt per packet with a smart sync card. db From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 10:57:05 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA21193 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:57:05 -0700 Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.191.196.34]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA21184 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:57:01 -0700 Received: by misery.sdf.com id <1118>; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:52:15 +0100 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 10:51:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: Nik Malenovic cc: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Q: ppp.slattach bugs/ppp server/load balancing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 25 Aug 1995, Nik Malenovic wrote: > 1. has the slattach bug been fixed? under pre-2.0.5-950622-SNAP and the > mentioned release, slattach has a bug - it doesn't release the comunication > device when redialing - that would cause your kermit to time out becuase > it's not able to open the comm device. I fixed it with the simple function > call - which I am including at the end of the message: I just walked someone through setting this up, and it works fine on a 2.0.5 system. As I recall, I believe stdin/stdout are connected to the port for the re-dial, which is very convienent for "chat". Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 11:14:01 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA21974 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:14:01 -0700 Received: from trinity.radio-do.de (trinity.Radio-do.de [193.101.164.3]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA21968 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:13:58 -0700 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 20:13:55 +0200 Message-Id: <199508251813.UAA01216@trinity.radio-do.de> Received: by trinity.radio-do.de (8.6.11/TRINITY-1.2.0-a) via EUnet id UAA01216; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 20:13:55 +0200 From: Frank Nobis To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <199508240744.AAA01584@freefall.FreeBSD.org> (message from Poul-Henning Kamp on Thu, 24 Aug 1995 00:44:00 -0700 (PDT)) Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Poul-Henning" == Poul-Henning Kamp writes: >> > > > Is anyone in the US using ISDN to a local service >> provider using FreeBSD > > > as a router for a LAN? If so, how >> to? > > Anybody considering ISDN: Check out the new Zyxel >> 2864I, that is > a killer-device for ISDN. Talks to analog >> modems too! > > http://www.zyxel.com > >> >> First it sounds good, but yesterday I did a test between a Mac >> with the Zyxel against a German ISP. We encountered one big >> Problem in the asynchron to synchron conversion. >> >> A MTU greater then 240 will result in CRC errors on the MacPPP. Poul-Henning> Report it to Zyxel then, they are very open for Poul-Henning> bug-reports. Poul-Henning> Still, you cannot find that amount of functionality Poul-Henning> anywhere else and certainly not for that price... We have reported that error to Zyxel. Now there is the release of 1.07. This one is working great again all the big ISDN Routers. -fn- -- Frank Nobis Email: fn@Radio-do.de Landgrafenstr. 130 dg3dcn 44139 Dortmund Fax: +49 231 7213816 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 11:24:52 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id LAA22598 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:24:52 -0700 Received: from gndrsh.aac.dev.com (gndrsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id LAA22588 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:24:48 -0700 Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by gndrsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA02693; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:24:37 -0700 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199508251824.LAA02693@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: ARP'ing (Discovery of IP Interfaces on a subnet) To: SimsS@Infi.Net Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 11:24:37 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508251319.GAA02117@freefall.FreeBSD.org> from "Pavlov's Cat" at Aug 25, 95 09:19:20 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1994 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Greetings, hack-folks. (Sorry for being a little off-topic, but I'm coming > straight to the experts) > > My shop has a problem managing IP addresses. This is only being compounded > by the roll-out of Win-95, since now *everybody's a Net-Expert ;-). > > Problem is: Users are configuring their boxes with arbitrary IP addresses. > By this I mean, they'll go over to the next cubicle, snoop at the IP address > and then go back and configure a "similar" address in order to get IP running > on their box. Something like: "Gee, Joe Blow is 192.168.69.69, huh? Well, > it's 1:30 right now, so I'll make my box 192.168.69.130." > > You can probably imagine that this is *not* a "Good Thing(tm)". :-(. > I've looked at a DHCP implementation to help solve this problem, but until I can > round up a Non-NT DHCP server (is there a "Free" one?) I'm in a jam. Bootp > isn't an option because most of the boxes we're running don't have a bootp > client capability. > > I figured that I could cobble up a little hack that works kind of like the > following nugget of meta-code: > for ( i=0 ; i<256 ; i++ ) { // look for every IP in the subnet > MacAddress = arp("192.168.69", i ); // anybody out there? > if (MacAddress) // If I got a MAC address from IP address > printf("192.168.69.i\t",MacAddress); // show it > } Real fast way that will get you a bunch of them in a very short time is ``ping -c 2 192.168.69.255'' if your netmask is 0xffffff00. Then just look at the arp cache. Note the count needs to be 2 or the ping stops after the first packet comes back instead of waiting for a bit. This can cause a bit of a storm as all host try to reply to you at once, but it is usable. Then a quick arp -a will show you which IP addresses responded that DNS can not look up as they won't have a hostname :-). -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 12:01:22 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA24046 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:01:22 -0700 Received: from tommy.extendsys.com (TOMMY.EXTENDSYS.COM [198.102.102.30]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA24038 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:01:20 -0700 Message-Id: <199508251901.MAA24038@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: ARP'ing (Discovery of IP Interfaces on a subnet) To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:02:55 -0600 (MDT) From: David Poole In-Reply-To: <199508251824.LAA02693@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> from "Rodney W. Grimes" at Aug 25, 95 11:24:37 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL17] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1311 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > I've looked at a DHCP implementation to help solve this problem, but until I can > > round up a Non-NT DHCP server (is there a "Free" one?) I'm in a jam. Bootp > > isn't an option because most of the boxes we're running don't have a bootp > > client capability. FTP Software has a WinSock DHCP server for ~$100. You do have to be running their PC/TCP OnNet WinSock stack for it to work, though. We've done some testing with it and found it mildly flakey but it works. FTP Software sales: 800-282-4387 There's also the WIDE DHCP server & client implementation. It's source for a DHCP server and client. I got the client to compile, but ran into some problems with the server. (My FreeBSD is down while I try to get 2.0.5R to install so I haven't done much else with WIDE.) (From the DHCP FAQ) 950630 WIDE Project: Akihiro Tominaga (tomy@sfc.wide.ad.jp) WIDE Project Keio Univ. Japan ftp://sh.wide.ad.jp/WIDE/free-ware/dhcp/dhcp-1.2.1.tar.gz Check Archie for dhcp-1.2.1 because lots of sites distribute it. -- --------------------------------------------------------------------------- David Poole Networking under Dos is like davep@extendsys.com adding a fifth leg to a cow. Extended Systems, Inc. -me From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 12:23:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA24876 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:23:25 -0700 Received: from elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (elf.kendall.mdcc.edu [147.70.150.122]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA24869 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:23:11 -0700 Received: (from freelist@localhost) by elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA11191; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:14:39 -0400 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:14:38 -0400 (EDT) From: "Don's FList drop" To: Peter da Silva cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: WD7000 not on boot.flp! In-Reply-To: <9508241630.AA08098@sonic.nmti.com.nmti.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 24 Aug 1995, Peter da Silva wrote: > Aieeee! > > (calm down) > > How do I get a boot.flp with WD7000ASC (wds) support? If someone will tell me what (if any) difference there is in making a kernel and making one for the boot floppy, I'll be glad to compile a 2.0.5 kernel with WD7000 support for ya. (and anyone else, for that matter) I think I'll try the card in this machine just for kicks anyways - it's not doing anything else, and I can always trade my employer it for a SB16, I suppose. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 12:47:15 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA26636 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:47:15 -0700 Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA26627 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 12:47:13 -0700 Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA14378 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:46:26 -0400 From: Charles Henrich Message-Id: <199508251946.PAA14378@crh.cl.msu.edu> Subject: Disassembler/debugger? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:46:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 195 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Does anyone have a adb-clone or disassembler for FreeBSD? -Crh Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@crh.cl.msu.edu http://rs560.msu.edu/~henrich/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 13:26:35 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA29158 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:26:35 -0700 Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [198.137.146.49]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA29146 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:26:28 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA22331; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 14:25:53 -0600 Message-Id: <199508252025.OAA22331@rover.village.org> To: Charles Henrich Subject: Re: Disassembler/debugger? Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:46:26 EDT Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 14:25:52 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : Does anyone have a adb-clone or disassembler for FreeBSD? What's wrong with gdb's disassemble command? Or the objdump program in binutils? Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 14:32:25 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA02758 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 14:32:25 -0700 Received: from alpha.dsu.edu (alpha.dsu.edu [138.247.32.12]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA02751 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 14:32:23 -0700 Received: (from ghelmer@localhost) by alpha.dsu.edu (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA06792; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:32:21 -0500 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:32:19 -0500 (CDT) From: Guy Helmer To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: vat on 2.0.5 with SB16 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Is there any way to get vat working with my SB16 on 2.0.5? I've built a kernel with MROUTING, pseudo-device vat_audio, and the sb devices: # SoundBlaster16 # IRQ 10, DMA 1 & 6, Audio I/O 0x220, FM I/O 0x388 controller snd0 device sb0 at isa? port 0x220 irq 10 drq 1 vector sbintr device sbxvi0 at isa? drq 6 device sbmidi0 at isa? port 0x300 device opl0 at isa? port 0x388 I'm able to play sounds with rplay, so I know the SoundBlaster and speakers work. I've tried replacing /dev/audio with /dev/vatio, and I've also tried using vmix 0.2 as suggested by Mr. Hasty in an email last April. Can anyone make any suggestions? Do I have to replace the sound support in 2.0.5's kernel with more recent drivers? Or do I just need a ProAudio card? Guy Helmer, Dakota State University Computing Services - ghelmer@alpha.dsu.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 14:43:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA03586 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 14:43:04 -0700 Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA03580 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 14:42:51 -0700 Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id XAA14150 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 23:42:41 +0200 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id XAA03188 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 23:42:32 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.frmug.fr.net (8.7.Beta.11/keltia-uucp-2.4) id JAA07960; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:00:14 +0200 (MET DST) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199508250700.JAA07960@keltia.frmug.fr.net> Subject: Re: Odd X behaviour To: mnewell@lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (Michael C. Newell) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 09:00:13 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: fn@trinity.radio-do.de, hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: roberto@Keltia.Freenix.FR (Ollivier Robert) In-Reply-To: from "Michael C. Newell" at Aug 24, 95 07:23:32 pm X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1022 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME7a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Michael C. Newell said: > Cool - that seemed to be it!! What's also odd os that pressing the "Num > Lock" key leaves the "Num Lock" *LIGHT* turned on, but alternatively > pressing it enables/disables the buttons. Weird. > > !!*THANKS*!! for the hint! I'm afraid it is in the FAQ :-) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia 2.2-CURRENT #16: Tue Aug 22 01:54:17 MET DST 1995 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 15:08:55 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA04465 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:08:55 -0700 Received: from vetch.cs.washington.edu (vetch.cs.washington.edu [128.95.2.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA04458 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:08:52 -0700 Received: from vetch.cs.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vetch.cs.washington.edu (8.6.12/7.2ws+) with ESMTP id PAA00106; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:03:38 -0700 Message-Id: <199508252203.PAA00106@vetch.cs.washington.edu> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.1 5/23/95 To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: Changing DEV_BSIZE In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Aug 1995 23:35:44 +0200." <199508232135.XAA20050@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed ; boundary="===_0_Fri_Aug_25_13:23:48_PDT_1995" Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:03:37 PDT From: Voradesh Yenbut Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This is a multipart MIME message. --===_0_Fri_Aug_25_13:23:48_PDT_1995 Content-Type: text/plain I made mods to both 1.1.5 and 2.0-RELEASE for non-512 block media. The mods are not specific to 512 and 1024 block sizes but I've never tested any thing beyond the two block sizes. Files being modified are: ./sys/i386/i386/autoconf.c ./sys/kern/kern_physio.c ./sys/kern/vfs_cluster.c ./sys/miscfs/specfs/spec_vnops.c ./sys/scsi/sd.c ./sys/scsi/scsiconf.c ./sys/ufs/ffs/ffs_vfsops.c ./sys/ufs/ffs/ffs_inode.c ./sys/ufs/ffs/ffs_alloc.c ./sys/ufs/ufs/ufs_disksubr.c ./sys/ufs/ufs/ufs_readwrite.c ./sys/vm/vm_swap.c ./sys/vm/vnode_pager.c I haven't used disklabel to write a label on a 1024-byte block size under 2.0-RELEASE yet (I modified it under 1.1.5.). I suspect it might need modifying also. The mods are in no way accurate. They are in many places I are not sure if "sector" mentioned in comment is supposed to be 512-byte sector or disk sector whose size is not 512 bytes. I hope someone will verify before the code is used. The attached files below are disklabel, swapinfo, dmesg output and the patches. The system runs entirely on one 1024-byte media. There are two #ifdef's in the patches: DBSIZEne512 for non-512, and SARSIAM for my special treatment on swap filesystem -- I would like to be able to remove an optical disk media when it is configured in the kernel for swap but swapon has not issued on it yet. Enjoy, Voradesh Yenbut --===_0_Fri_Aug_25_13:23:48_PDT_1995 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Description: disklabel # /dev/rsd0c: type: SCSI disk: 3M 33019 label: flags: bytes/sector: 1024 sectors/track: 17 tracks/cylinder: 1 sectors/cylinder: 17 cylinders: 37473 rpm: 3375 interleave: 1 trackskew: 0 cylinderskew: 0 headswitch: 0 # milliseconds track-to-track seek: 0 # milliseconds drivedata: 0 5 partitions: # size offset fstype [fsize bsize cpg] a: 17000 17 4.2BSD 1024 8192 320 # (Cyl. 1 - 1000) b: 34000 17017 4.2BSD 1024 8192 320 # (Cyl. 1001 - 3000) c: 637024 17 4.2BSD 1024 8192 320 # (Cyl. 1 - 37472) d: 637041 0 4.2BSD 1024 8192 320 # (Cyl. 0 - 37472) e: 586024 51017 4.2BSD 1024 8192 320 # (Cyl. 3001 - 37472) Device 1K-blocks Used Available Capacity /dev/sd0b 33984 2460 31524 7% /dev/wd0b 0 *** not available for swapping *** /dev/sd1b 0 *** not available for swapping *** /dev/sd2b 0 *** not available for swapping *** --===_0_Fri_Aug_25_13:23:48_PDT_1995 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Description: dmesg FreeBSD 2.0-RELEASE #0: Sat Feb 11 21:46:05 PST 1995 yenbut@sarsiam:/usr/src/sys/compile/SARSIAM.bpf CPU: i486DX (486-class CPU) real memory = 16384000 (4000 pages) avail memory = 15118336 (3691 pages) using 290 buffers containing 2379776 bytes of memory Probing for devices on the ISA bus: sc0 at 0x60-0x6f irq 1 on motherboard sc0: VGA color <4 virtual consoles> ed0 at 0x280-0x29f irq 3 maddr 0xe8000 msize 16384 on isa ed0: address 00:00:c0:a1:3d:81, type SMC8216/SMC8216C (16 bit) bpf: ed0 attached sio0 at 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 on isa sio0: type 16550A sio1 not found at 0x2f8 sio2 not found at 0x3e8 sio3 at 0x2e8-0x2ef irq 9 on isa sio3: type 16550A lpt0 at 0x378-0x37f irq 7 on isa lpt0: Interrupt-driven port lp0: TCP/IP capable interface lpt1 not found at 0xffffffff lpt2 not found at 0xffffffff fdc0 at 0x3f0-0x3f7 irq 6 drq 2 on isa fdc0: [0: fd0: 1.2MB 5.25in] [1: fd1: 1.44MB 3.5in] wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 on isa wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): wd0: 144MB (296514 total sec), 969 cyl, 9 head, 34 sec, bytes/sec 512 aha0: 1542C/CF detected, unlocking mailbox aha0: reading board settings, dma=5 int=11 (bus speed defaulted) aha0 at 0x330-0x333 irq 11 drq 5 on isa aha0 waiting for scsi devices to settle aha0 targ 0 lun 0: type 0(direct) removable SCSI2 aha0 targ 0 lun 0: sdattach 0 sd0: 622MB (637041 total sec), 37594 cyl, 1 head, 16 sec, bytes/sec 1024 npx0 on motherboard changing root device to sd0a sdopen: dev=0x403 (unit 0 (of 4),partition 3) bpf: lo0 attached bpf: ppp0 attached bpf: sl0 attached bpf: sl1 attached sdopen: dev=0x400 (unit 0 (of 4),partition 0) ffs_mountfs 1024 nspf 1 WARNING: no swap space found --===_0_Fri_Aug_25_13:23:48_PDT_1995 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Description: patch for non-512-byte blocksize Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 KioqIDEuMQkxOTk0LzExLzI2IDEyOjQ4OjA4Ci0tLSAuL3N5cy9pMzg2L2kzODYvYXV0b2Nv bmYuYwkxOTk0LzExLzI2IDEyOjQ4OjQ5CioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKgoqKiogMTMzLDE0MyAq 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--===_0_Fri_Aug_25_13:23:48_PDT_1995-- From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 15:13:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA04860 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:13:38 -0700 Received: from simon.chi.il.us (simon.chi.il.us [199.245.227.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA04854 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:13:36 -0700 Received: by simon.chi.il.us (Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0sm6z1-0006IIC; Fri, 25 Aug 95 17:12 CDT Message-Id: Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 17:12 CDT From: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) To: bde@zeta.org.au, wilko@yedi.iaf.nl Subject: Re: ESDI installs on WD1007 Cc: terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, imb@scgt.oz.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > From freefall.FreeBSD.org!owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 03:07:05 1995 > Sender: freefall.FreeBSD.org!owner-freebsd-hackers > From: Wilko Bulte > Subject: ESDI installs on WD1007 > To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) > Date: Wed, 23 Aug 1995 22:18:25 +0200 (MET DST) > Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, terry@cs.weber.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, > imb@scgt.oz.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, > roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net > > > I just learned from other mail (too much mail today %-) how to read the > > WD1007 jumpers. I don't want the driver to handle stuff like this for > > obsolete drives. > > > > OK, guys. Please note that I have this document called > > Preliminary Engineering Specification, WD1007A-WA2 > (dated oct 2, 1987) > > sitting on my shelf. I could photocopy it and send it to > (*REALLY*) interested people. My guess is this would help > to resolve the issues currently being debated. > > Takers please email to me directly > > Wilko Thanks, but I already have one. Thats one of the references I used to set up the one here. I also have the tech sheets and the foldout card WD sends with the controller and a 3rd party jumper sheet. I'll copy any of the above on request. Or scan in parts and send images. Steve From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 15:15:59 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id PAA05088 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:15:59 -0700 Received: from simon.chi.il.us (simon.chi.il.us [199.245.227.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA05082 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 15:15:57 -0700 Received: by simon.chi.il.us (Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0sm71r-0006IKC; Fri, 25 Aug 95 17:15 CDT Message-Id: Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 17:15 CDT From: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > From freefall.FreeBSD.org!owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 03:07:07 1995 > Sender: freefall.FreeBSD.org!owner-freebsd-hackers > From: "Rodney W. Grimes" > Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? > To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco) > Date: Thu, 24 Aug 1995 13:26:37 -0700 (PDT) > Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org > > > > The 451/551 integrate some stuff, but I can't recall what ``stuff''. > > > > Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net > > Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 > > > -- > Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com > Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD > They integrate the parallel port on chip and the 552 does to FIFO'd serial plus one parallel. Steve From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 16:18:13 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA08346 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:18:13 -0700 Received: from wiliki.eng.hawaii.edu (wiliki.eng.hawaii.edu [128.171.60.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA08340 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:18:11 -0700 Received: by wiliki.eng.hawaii.edu (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA140422673; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:17:53 -1000 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 13:17:50 -1000 (HST) From: Terrence T Ozaki Subject: FreeBSD and EIDE Controllers and HD To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I own a generic VL-Bus EIDE Controller and a MAXTOR EIDE HD will it work with FreeBSD. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 16:18:28 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA08367 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:18:28 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA08361 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:18:25 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA13133; Fri, 25 Aug 95 17:20:05 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508252320.AA13133@cs.weber.edu> Subject: UNIFIED FILE SYSTEM PATCHES, PLEASE APPLY To: current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 17:20:04 MDT X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I have just uploaded a set of patches that are general cleanup patches for file system related code, with special emphasis on cleanup of the use of the namei() interface. freefall.cdrom.com:~terry/UNI.diff.gz There is no README for this patch set. Mostly, these patches deal with using NDINIT() rather than manually initializing the equivalent pieves of the nameidata structure before passing the data to namei(). The biggest offenders in this area are the binary compatability modules. There are several places where the credentials were initialized from the proc being passed before namei was called. This is broken, since the first thing namei does is set the credentials from the process passed in anyway. These patches also prereserve two manifest constants for use in multibyte aware/capable file systems. This reservation has no effect on the operation of the code, though it does cause some integer bit values to be recoded as hexadecimal values. This is, in general, a good thing in any case. I've also patched flags checking of the mnt_maxsymlinklen field to use the macro for format detection, and renames the FSFMT to OFSFMT (apropriate, considering it returns "true" when the file system format is old and "false" when it is new). Finally, there are patches to dir.h to make the DIRSIZ macro independent of compiler structure alignment, internal changes to the dirent/direct structures, and support for sizing of non-struct direct objects. This last resolves a subtle bug in ufs_lookup.c regarding a possible 4 byte discrepancy in directory entries during compaction on mounts of pre-4.4 (FreeBSD 1.x) file systems. I went looking for it when my NetBSD 0.8 -> FreeBSD 2.x upgraded system started showing occasional directory corruption for files renamed from some name to some other name where newnamelen % 4 == 3. The change in the DIRSIZ macro results in *exactly the same assembly code* as the previous macro definition for an unmodified struct direct. THIS IS NOT ADDITIONAL OVERHEAD, EVEN THOUGH IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS -- THE COMPILER GENERATES THE SAME ASSEMBLY, SINCE A MULTIPLY BY A MANIFEST CONSTANT ONE IS ELIMINATED! Please commit these patches. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 16:32:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA09568 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:32:16 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA09560 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:32:14 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id QAA12282; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:31:12 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id QAA14584; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:33:08 -0700 Message-Id: <199508252333.QAA14584@corbin.Root.COM> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: UNIFIED FILE SYSTEM PATCHES, PLEASE APPLY In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Aug 95 17:20:04 MDT." <9508252320.AA13133@cs.weber.edu> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:33:08 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >I have just uploaded a set of patches that are general cleanup patches >for file system related code, with special emphasis on cleanup of the >use of the namei() interface. > > freefall.cdrom.com:~terry/UNI.diff.gz > >There is no README for this patch set. > >Mostly, these patches deal with using NDINIT() rather than manually >initializing the equivalent pieves of the nameidata structure before >passing the data to namei(). The biggest offenders in this area are >the binary compatability modules. These patches sound interesting and I plan to integrate most or all of them as soon as I get some time to do it. BTW, only one mailing list need be mentioned (probably hackers). -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 16:34:53 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id QAA09775 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:34:53 -0700 Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA09769 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:34:52 -0700 Received: from corbin.Root.COM (corbin [198.145.90.34]) by Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with ESMTP id QAA12296; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:33:49 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by corbin.Root.COM (8.6.11/8.6.5) with SMTP id QAA14601; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:35:45 -0700 Message-Id: <199508252335.QAA14601@corbin.Root.COM> To: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: UNIFIED FILE SYSTEM PATCHES, PLEASE APPLY In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 25 Aug 95 17:20:04 MDT." <9508252320.AA13133@cs.weber.edu> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Fri, 25 Aug 1995 16:35:45 -0700 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >I have just uploaded a set of patches that are general cleanup patches >for file system related code, with special emphasis on cleanup of the >use of the namei() interface. Oh, I almost forgot... Thanks! -DG From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 17:08:04 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA10777 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 17:08:04 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id RAA10771 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 17:08:03 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA13394; Fri, 25 Aug 95 18:09:41 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508260009.AA13394@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: UNIFIED FILE SYSTEM PATCHES, PLEASE APPLY To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 18:09:40 MDT Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508252333.QAA14584@corbin.Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Aug 25, 95 04:33:08 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > These patches sound interesting and I plan to integrate most or all of them > as soon as I get some time to do it. > BTW, only one mailing list need be mentioned (probably hackers). I wasn't sure who read what list -- sorry. Maybe with the "list expansion extravaganza" going on, we should have a "patches@freebsd.org" used only to send patches/patch-notupload-notification? Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 17:27:00 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id RAA11450 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 17:27:00 -0700 Received: from strider.ibenet.it ([194.179.130.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id RAA11444 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 17:26:54 -0700 Received: (from piero@localhost) by strider.ibenet.it (8.6.12/8.6.12) id CAA16384 for Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 02:30:59 +0200 From: Piero Serini Message-Id: <199508260030.CAA16384@strider.ibenet.it> Subject: precompiled Mosaic To: Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' List) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 02:30:59 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: Piero@strider.ibenet.it Operating-System: FreeBSD 1.1.5.1 X-Phone-Number: +39 (2) 58113562 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 457 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hello. This is just to let you all know I sent an e-mail to Mosaic Help to ask them the reason why they don't distribute Mosaic for FreeBSD precompiled (as they do for Linux). Note that no BSDI bi- nary is available, either. Bye, -- # $Id: .signature,v 1.12 1995/08/14 12:10:54 piero Exp $ Piero Serini Via Giambologna, 1 I 20136 Milano - ITALY From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 18:04:16 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA12470 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 18:04:16 -0700 Received: from asstdc.scgt.oz.au (asstdc.scgt.oz.au [202.14.234.65]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA12462 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 18:04:08 -0700 Received: (from imb@localhost) by asstdc.scgt.oz.au (8.6.12/BSD4.4) id LAA06718; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 11:03:39 +1000 From: michael butler Message-Id: <199508260103.LAA06718@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> Subject: Re: precompiled Mosaic To: Piero@strider.ibenet.it Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 11:03:38 +1000 (EST) Cc: Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199508260030.CAA16384@strider.ibenet.it> from "Piero Serini" at Aug 26, 95 02:30:59 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24beta] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 472 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Piero Serini writes: > This is just to let you all know I sent an e-mail to Mosaic Help > to ask them the reason why they don't distribute Mosaic for > FreeBSD precompiled (as they do for Linux). Note that no BSDI bi- > nary is available, either. You can find an executable of Mosaic 2.6 on http://www.bsdi.com/ .. under "contrib" somewhere (I forget). It issues a a whole mound of warnings about resources which I haven't yet investigated but it runs, michael From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 18:55:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id SAA13176 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 18:55:38 -0700 Received: from randomc.com (ra1.randomc.com [205.160.16.20]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA13159 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 18:55:35 -0700 Received: from masinter.randomc.com (masinter.randomc.com [205.160.21.159]) by randomc.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with SMTP id VAA01264; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 21:55:15 -0400 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 95 01:46:39 EST From: "John F. Masinter" Subject: How do I quit this mail subscription? To: hackers-owner@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers-owner@freebsd.org, hackers-owner@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org X-Mailer: Chameleon V0.05, TCP/IP for Windows, NetManage Inc. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Help! How do I quit this mail subscription? John F. Masinter From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 19:00:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id TAA13563 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 19:00:43 -0700 Received: from cs.weber.edu (cs.weber.edu [137.190.16.16]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA13546 ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 19:00:39 -0700 Received: by cs.weber.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1.1) id AA13804; Fri, 25 Aug 95 20:02:05 MDT From: terry@cs.weber.edu (Terry Lambert) Message-Id: <9508260202.AA13804@cs.weber.edu> Subject: Re: How do I quit this mail subscription? To: masinter@randomc.com (John F. Masinter) Date: Fri, 25 Aug 95 20:02:04 MDT Cc: hackers-owner@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "John F. Masinter" at Aug 26, 95 01:46:39 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL52] Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Help! How do I quit this mail subscription? > > > John F. Masinter You should have received a message like the following for each of the lists you subscribed to: ====================================================================== Welcome to the freebsd-current mailing list! If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, send the following command in email to "Majordomo@freebsd.org": unsubscribe freebsd-current masinter@randomc.com (John F. Masinter) Here's the general information for the list you've subscribed to, in case you don't already have it: [ ... ] ====================================================================== The "unsubscribe" line above assumes you provided the correct information in your mail message. Note that you *must* unsubscribe from the machine you subscribed from (for obvious reasons). Terry Lambert terry@cs.weber.edu --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 25 23:47:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id XAA23545 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 23:47:42 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id XAA23519 for ; Fri, 25 Aug 1995 23:47:39 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id IAA01667 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 08:47:30 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA23956 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 08:47:30 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA09421 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 08:09:12 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508260609.IAA09421@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: UNIFIED FILE SYSTEM PATCHES, PLEASE APPLY To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 08:09:11 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9508260009.AA13394@cs.weber.edu> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 25, 95 06:09:40 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 344 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > > > BTW, only one mailing list need be mentioned (probably hackers). > > I wasn't sure who read what list -- sorry. I think hackers is _the_ subset of all other lists. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 01:31:50 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA29234 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:31:50 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA29226 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:31:47 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA25218; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:31:18 -0700 To: michael butler cc: Piero@strider.ibenet.it, Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: precompiled Mosaic In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 26 Aug 1995 11:03:38 +1000." <199508260103.LAA06718@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:31:17 -0700 Message-ID: <25216.809425877@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > You can find an executable of Mosaic 2.6 on http://www.bsdi.com/ .. under > "contrib" somewhere (I forget). It issues a a whole mound of warnings about > resources which I haven't yet investigated but it runs, We also have a package copy available here, which I'll give to Satoshi to stick up on ftp since that seems safe enough.. Still don't know if I should stick it on the CD, since BSDI seems happy enough to do so and it's kinda _annoying_ not to have our own browser available out of the box! It makes it hard to claim that we're such a fine out-of-box WEB solution.. :-( Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 01:36:54 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA29643 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:36:54 -0700 Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.64.181]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA29637 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:36:51 -0700 Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.9) id BAA03408; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:36:34 -0700 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:36:34 -0700 Message-Id: <199508260836.BAA03408@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de CC: hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <199508260609.IAA09421@uriah.heep.sax.de> (message from J Wunsch on Sat, 26 Aug 1995 08:09:11 +0200 (MET DST)) Subject: Re: UNIFIED FILE SYSTEM PATCHES, PLEASE APPLY From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk * I think hackers is _the_ subset of all other lists. ^^^^^^ You meant "superset"? Satoshi (just pickin') From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 01:37:36 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id BAA29694 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:37:36 -0700 Received: from asstdc.scgt.oz.au (asstdc.scgt.oz.au [202.14.234.65]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA29686 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 01:37:30 -0700 Received: (from imb@localhost) by asstdc.scgt.oz.au (8.6.12/BSD4.4) id SAA29591; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 18:37:13 +1000 From: michael butler Message-Id: <199508260837.SAA29591@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> Subject: Re: precompiled Mosaic To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 18:37:13 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <25216.809425877@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 26, 95 01:31:17 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24beta] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 869 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > You can find an executable of Mosaic 2.6 on http://www.bsdi.com/ .. > > under "contrib" somewhere (I forget). It issues a a whole mound of > > warnings about resources which I haven't yet investigated but it runs, > We also have a package copy available here, which I'll give to Satoshi > to stick up on ftp since that seems safe enough.. Yes, please :-) > Still don't know if I should stick it on the CD, since BSDI seems happy > enough to do so and it's kinda _annoying_ not to have our own browser > available out of the box! It makes it hard to claim that we're such a > fine out-of-box WEB solution.. :-( Indeed :-(. Related to this subject .. is there any news on the Motif (1.2, 2.0 ?) libs for FreeBSD so we can compile our own .. is their CD shipping yet ? If so, what 2.0.5 dependencies am I likely to fall over when running -current ? michael From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 03:04:34 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id DAA06199 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 03:04:34 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id DAA06193 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 03:04:32 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id DAA25988; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 03:04:19 -0700 To: michael butler cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: precompiled Mosaic In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 26 Aug 1995 18:37:13 +1000." <199508260837.SAA29591@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 03:04:18 -0700 Message-ID: <25986.809431458@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Related to this subject .. is there any news on the Motif (1.2, 2.0 ?) libs > for FreeBSD so we can compile our own .. is their CD shipping yet ? If so, > what 2.0.5 dependencies am I likely to fall over when running -current ? info@lasermoon.co.uk Only they know for sure. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 04:53:06 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id EAA14276 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 04:53:06 -0700 Received: from strider.ibenet.it ([194.179.130.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id EAA14264 ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 04:53:02 -0700 Received: (from piero@localhost) by strider.ibenet.it (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA17765; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:57:11 +0200 From: Piero Serini Message-Id: <199508261157.NAA17765@strider.ibenet.it> Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the Press To: kleiner@panix.com (David Kleiner) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:57:11 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: questions@freebsd.org, Hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers' List) In-Reply-To: <199508240351.XAA25232@panix2.panix.com> from "David Kleiner" at Aug 23, 95 11:51:08 pm Reply-To: Piero@strider.ibenet.it Operating-System: FreeBSD 1.1.5.1 X-Phone-Number: +39 (2) 58113562 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 852 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello. Quoting from David Kleiner (Thu Aug 24 05:51:08 1995): > In case you missed it, there was an article on FreeBSD a couple of > issues ago in SunExpert Magazine (by Michael O'Brien, Ask Mr. Protocol > section.) My colleague at work has a copy, so in case anyone is > interested, I will try to dig it up and, all things permitting, will > fax it to anyone in the US (sorry you guys overseas). For those interested, David sent me a scanned text version, which is now available via ftp at: ftp://strider.free.it/pub/FreeBSD/SunExpert.article.txt.gz This is in cc to 2 lists because I thought someone could be interested. Bye, -- # $Id: .signature,v 1.12 1995/08/14 12:10:54 piero Exp $ Piero Serini Via Giambologna, 1 I 20136 Milano - ITALY From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 06:40:29 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id GAA18243 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 06:40:29 -0700 Received: from strider.ibenet.it ([194.179.130.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id GAA18229 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 06:39:59 -0700 Received: (from piero@localhost) by strider.ibenet.it (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA17950; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 15:42:29 +0200 From: Piero Serini Message-Id: <199508261342.PAA17950@strider.ibenet.it> Subject: Re: precompiled Mosaic To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 15:42:29 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: imb@scgt.oz.au, Piero@strider.ibenet.it, Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <25216.809425877@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 26, 95 01:31:17 am Reply-To: Piero@strider.ibenet.it Operating-System: FreeBSD 1.1.5.1 X-Phone-Number: +39 (2) 58113562 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 771 Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hello. Quoting from Jordan K. Hubbard (Sat Aug 26 10:31:17 1995): > > You can find an executable of Mosaic 2.6 on http://www.bsdi.com/ .. under > > "contrib" somewhere (I forget). It issues a a whole mound of warnings about > > resources which I haven't yet investigated but it runs, > > We also have a package copy available here, which I'll give to Satoshi > to stick up on ftp since that seems safe enough.. Still don't know if ... Agreed. But still, for people archie'ing for Mosaic 2.7b1 there's plenty of Linux out there and no FreeBSD. Bye, -- # $Id: .signature,v 1.12 1995/08/14 12:10:54 piero Exp $ Piero Serini Via Giambologna, 1 I 20136 Milano - ITALY From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 07:10:20 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA18826 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 07:10:20 -0700 Received: from chrome.onramp.net (chrome.onramp.net [199.1.166.202]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA18820 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 07:10:18 -0700 Received: from localhost.jdl.com (localhost.jdl.com [127.0.0.1]) by chrome.onramp.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA25201 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 09:09:56 -0500 Message-Id: <199508261409.JAA25201@chrome.onramp.net> X-Authentication-Warning: chrome.onramp.net: Host localhost.jdl.com didn't use HELO protocol To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Byte-swapping on NEC IDE CD ROM Reply-To: jdl@chromatic.com Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 09:09:56 -0500 From: Jon Loeliger Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Joerg suggested, I byte swapped the entire atapi probe tb buffer, and things look promising. It's raised a few questions too. Here's what I got: wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 on isa wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): wd0: 1033MB (2116800 sectors), 2100 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S atapi0.1 at 0x1f0: attach called wdc0: unit 1 (atapi): , removable, iordy wcd0: info 80-85-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20- 20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-0-0-0-0-0-0-34-2e-32-33-20-20-20-20-4e-45-43-20 -20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-43-44-2d-52-4f-4d-20-44-52-49-5 6-45-3a-32-36-30-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-a-0-0-0-3-0-0-3-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0 -0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-b4-0-b4-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0 atapi0.1: req im 5a-0-2a-0-0-0-0-0-18-0-0-0-0-0-0-0 len=24 atapi0.1: start atapi0.1: send cmd 5a-0-2a-0-0-0-0-0-18-0-0-0-0-0-0-0 atapi0.1: intr ireason=0x1, len=24, status=48, error=0 atapi0.1: send cmd 5a-0-2a-0-0-0-0-0-18-0-0-0-0-0-0-0 atapi0.1: controller not ready Without the ATAPI spec in front of me (!), I'm at a loss to know if the command structure is reasonable. Also, I've not yet byte swapped the *other* buffers coming back from the drive. One question: Is it likely that I will have to byte swap the buffers headed out to the drive? Will the user data buffers need to be swapped too, or just things like the command/response buffers? Any help here would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, jdl From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 07:13:48 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA18926 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 07:13:48 -0700 Received: from hk.super.net (hk.super.net [202.14.67.4]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA18915 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 07:13:26 -0700 Received: from is1.hk.super.net by hk.super.net with SMTP id AA19179 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:09:16 +0800 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:09:16 +0800 (HKT) From: John Beukema To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: michael butler , Piero@strider.ibenet.it, Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: precompiled Mosaic In-Reply-To: <25216.809425877@time.cdrom.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Sat, 26 Aug 1995, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > You can find an executable of Mosaic 2.6 on http://www.bsdi.com/ .. under > > "contrib" somewhere (I forget). It issues a a whole mound of warnings about > > resources which I haven't yet investigated but it runs, the bsdi mosaic works fine on freebsd. ln -s /usr/X11R6 /usr/X11 gets rid of the warnings. netscape httpd from bsdi dumps core with bus error on 2.0.5R FBSD. Is this because of shared libs? > > We also have a package copy available here, which I'll give to Satoshi > to stick up on ftp since that seems safe enough.. Still don't know if > I should stick it on the CD, since BSDI seems happy enough to do so > and it's kinda _annoying_ not to have our own browser available out of > the box! It makes it hard to claim that we're such a fine out-of-box > WEB solution.. :-( > > Jordan > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 07:51:38 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id HAA20042 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 07:51:38 -0700 Received: from hutcs.cs.hut.fi (hutcs.cs.hut.fi [130.233.192.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id HAA20035 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 07:51:23 -0700 Received: from shadows.cs.hut.fi by hutcs.cs.hut.fi with SMTP id AA15784 (5.65c8/HUTCS-S 1.4 for ); Sat, 26 Aug 1995 17:50:57 +0300 Received: (hsu@localhost) by shadows.cs.hut.fi (8.6.10/8.6.10) id RAA22725; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 17:50:58 +0300 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 17:50:58 +0300 Message-Id: <199508261450.RAA22725@shadows.cs.hut.fi> From: Heikki Suonsivu To: Michael Smith Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: Michael Smith's message of 25 Aug 1995 10:18:27 +0300 Subject: Changes in sio driver since 2.0.5? Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Otaniemi, Finland Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In particular, I have a system here with an AST 4-port clone that is crashing regularly, usually when modem status changes. I upped RS_IBUFSIZE to 1024 and TTYHOG to 4096. Increasing TTYHOG alone seems to cure loosing characters, but I needed RS_IBUFSIZE tuneup to get rid of the crashes. TTYHOG can be given as option already. Both are lazily kept -current (upgrade approximately once a month). These problems seem to be motherboard or other hardware related and have been there since 1.1.5.1 (but increased somewhat when we upgraded to 2.*). I have got a 386-40 (AMD) with ast4 + 5 ethernets and 486-40 (AMD) with ast4 + 5 ethernets, and they both lost characters and paniced, but 386-40 did it considerably less frequently. Without patches the 486-40 was unusable, lost too much stuff to get through PPP initial handshakes. It could be that the cheap taiwanese NE2000 ethernet boards are the source of the problems, as there more of them in the 486-40 than in a 386-40. Serial ports carry modems and leased lines up to 115.2kbps, but we have more problems with the slow links (leased 38.4) than the fast ones. I can't explain this. Maybe sio has been developed with too fast machines & devices around :-) I still have problems with serial ports not correctly probed after a panic. I'm trying duplicating the AST4 sio config lines now, seemed to help after one reboot, but it is too early to say its the workaround. *** sys/i386/isa/cy.c.orig Thu Aug 24 21:57:50 1995 --- sys/i386/isa/cy.c Thu Aug 24 21:58:17 1995 *************** *** 153,159 **** --- 153,161 ---- #define LOTS_OF_EVENTS 64 /* helps separate urgent events from input */ #define RB_I_HIGH_WATER (TTYHOG - 2 * RS_IBUFSIZE) + #ifndef RS_IBUFSIZE #define RS_IBUFSIZE 256 + #endif #define CALLOUT_MASK 0x80 #define CONTROL_MASK 0x60 *** sys/i386/isa/sio.c.orig Thu Aug 24 21:56:48 1995 --- sys/i386/isa/sio.c Thu Aug 24 21:57:13 1995 *************** *** 71,77 **** --- 71,79 ---- #define LOTS_OF_EVENTS 64 /* helps separate urgent events from input */ #define RB_I_HIGH_WATER (TTYHOG - 2 * RS_IBUFSIZE) + #ifndef RS_IBUFSIZE #define RS_IBUFSIZE 256 + #endif #define CALLOUT_MASK 0x80 #define CONTROL_MASK 0x60 I don't know if cy.c really needs the patch, but I changed it anyway (avoids burning some cpu, anyway). -- Heikki Suonsivu, T{ysikuu 10 C 83/02210 Espoo/FINLAND, hsu@cs.hut.fi home +358-0-8031121 work -4513377 fax -4555276 riippu SN From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 08:39:46 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id IAA21497 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 08:39:46 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id IAA21489 ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 08:39:42 -0700 Message-Id: <199508261539.IAA21489@freefall.FreeBSD.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.FreeBSD.org: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: John Beukema cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , michael butler , Piero@strider.ibenet.it, Hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: precompiled Mosaic In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 26 Aug 95 22:09:16 +0800." Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 08:39:41 -0700 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >the bsdi mosaic works fine on freebsd. ln -s /usr/X11R6 /usr/X11 gets >rid of the warnings. > >netscape httpd from bsdi dumps core with bus error on 2.0.5R FBSD. Is this >because of shared libs? > We're running the commerce server on a 2.1-STABLE box and don't see this. Perhaps this is from the uname() thing? The server we have is compiled static I believe. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== Software Developer - Walnut Creek CDROM FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 10:52:08 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id KAA24848 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 10:52:08 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA24838 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 10:52:03 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id TAA15688 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 19:51:58 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA27454 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 19:51:58 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA16233 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 15:52:17 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508261352.PAA16233@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: UNIFIED FILE SYSTEM PATCHES, PLEASE APPLY To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 15:52:17 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508260836.BAA03408@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> from "Satoshi Asami" at Aug 26, 95 01:36:34 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 304 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Satoshi Asami wrote: > > * I think hackers is _the_ subset of all other lists. > ^^^^^^ > You meant "superset"? Of course <:) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 12:02:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id MAA26737 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 12:02:12 -0700 Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id MAA26731 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 12:02:10 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA02387; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 12:01:53 -0700 To: Chien-Ta Lee cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: [ANNOUNCE] kernel builder In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 24 Aug 1995 22:18:05 +0800." <199508241418.WAA11087@linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw> Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 12:01:53 -0700 Message-ID: <2385.809463713@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I am sorry for that, I said that no commercial use is for some > CDROM sellers who will not respect your stuffs. > > FreeBSD core team are very welcome to use it (even put on cdrom), > but if I were you, I will not do it, b'cos my script is very POOR. > (first you will have to re-write it all) :( I didn't mean to get the impression that we didn't like your stuff, far from it. I was simply trying to make it clear that the "BSD" copyright represents our ideal as far as copyrights are concerned, and we see no reason to put "no commercial use" limitations on anything. Sure, I understand your own motivation for doing so but we're also not particularly worried about "CDROM sellers who don't respect our stuff." We would, of course, ALWAYS prefer that they respect our work but to try to legally enforce it just ends you up with lots of code with overly-restrictive copyrights on it! :-( Your own little script is actually quite an inspiration, and I hope that we can do an even fancier version that lets you "zoom" on different devices when you want to edit their port/irq/drq settings rather than just accepting the defaults. It would also be nice if it inherited the defaults from your previous kernel config file! All of those features can be added to a more complex kernel-config tool, and I'm sure that they will be, but you've at least shown that a pretty credible job can be done the simple way too! I was actually fairly impressed with your little shell script.. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 13:25:42 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA29448 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:25:42 -0700 Received: from syzygy.zytek.com (syzygy.zytek.com [140.174.241.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA29442 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:25:39 -0700 Received: (from melvin@localhost) by syzygy.zytek.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA08775; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:25:42 -0700 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:25:42 -0700 From: Stephen Melvin Message-Id: <199508262025.NAA08775@syzygy.zytek.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Patch to PPP code (magic disagreement on echo reply) Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, I applied the patch shown below to /usr/src/usr.sbin/ppp/fsm.c. It was not actually affecting anything but I got tired of seeing endless error messages in the log file. I don't know if the problem is with ppp or with Trumpet 2.0B (a Windows PPP driver), but ppp was sending echo request packets with its magic number and expecting a reply with the magic number that Trumpet had previously requested. Instead, Trumpet simply sends a reply packet with the same magic number it got in the request packet. Steve Melvin ------- *** fsm.c Sat Aug 26 13:13:37 1995 --- fsm.c.orig Sat Aug 26 13:13:02 1995 *************** *** 689,698 **** lp = (u_long *)MBUF_CTOP(bp); magic = ntohl(*lp); ! /* ! * Tolerate echo replies with either magic number ! */ ! if (magic != 0 && magic != LcpInfo.his_magic && magic != LcpInfo.want_magic) { logprintf("RecvEchoRep: his magic is wrong! expect: %x got: %x\n", LcpInfo.his_magic, magic); /* --- 689,695 ---- lp = (u_long *)MBUF_CTOP(bp); magic = ntohl(*lp); ! if (magic != 0 && magic != LcpInfo.his_magic) { logprintf("RecvEchoRep: his magic is wrong! expect: %x got: %x\n", LcpInfo.his_magic, magic); /* From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 13:35:37 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA29776 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:35:37 -0700 Received: from elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (elf.kendall.mdcc.edu [147.70.150.122]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA29767 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:35:34 -0700 Received: (from freelist@localhost) by elf.kendall.mdcc.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA17233; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 16:27:17 -0400 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 16:27:15 -0400 (EDT) From: "Don's FList drop" To: "Justin T. Gibbs" cc: Hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: precompiled Mosaic In-Reply-To: <199508261539.IAA21489@freefall.FreeBSD.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 26 Aug 1995, Justin T. Gibbs wrote: > >netscape httpd from bsdi dumps core with bus error on 2.0.5R FBSD. Is this > >because of shared libs? > > We're running the commerce server on a 2.1-STABLE box and don't see this. > Perhaps this is from the uname() thing? The server we have is compiled > static I believe. Commerce server ran w/ no probs on my 2.0.5R box w/ 8M ram, NE2000 compat, 486-33DX Gateway2000 bo, so it ain't 2.0.5R..... From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 13:42:41 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA00351 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:42:41 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA00333 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:42:37 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA18050 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:42:33 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA28086 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:42:32 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id WAA17141 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:40:19 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508262040.WAA17141@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Byte-swapping on NEC IDE CD ROM To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:40:18 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508261409.JAA25201@chrome.onramp.net> from "Jon Loeliger" at Aug 26, 95 09:09:56 am Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 2348 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Jon Loeliger wrote: > > As Joerg suggested, I byte swapped the entire atapi probe tb buffer, > and things look promising. It's raised a few questions too. ... > One question: Is it likely that I will have to byte swap the buffers > headed out to the drive? Will the user data buffers need to be swapped > too, or just things like the command/response buffers? No idea, but i've found this in the archive, even though i've never seen Søren's original message, just Paul's reply only: : From: Paul Richards : Message-Id: <199508211013.LAA28054@server.netcraft.co.uk> : Subject: Re: ATAPI : To: sos@freebsd.org : Date: Mon, 21 Aug 1995 11:13:39 +0100 (BST) : Cc: paul@freebsd.org, vak@cronyx.ru, FreeBSD-current@freebsd.org : In-Reply-To: <199508210531.WAA21303@freefall.FreeBSD.org> from "sos@freebsd.org" : at Aug 20, 95 10:31:41 pm : Reply-to: paul@freebsd.org : X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] : MIME-Version: 1.0 : Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 : Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit : Content-Length: 1591 : Sender: current-owner@freebsd.org : Precedence: bulk : Status: OR : : In reply to sos@freebsd.org who said : > : > In reply to Paul Richards who wrote: : > > : > > My IDE cdrom seems to think it's a hard disk. : > > : > > wdc0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7 irq 14 on isa : > > wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): : > > wd0: 515MB (1056384 sectors), 1048 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S : > > wdc0: unit 1 (wd1): : > > wd1: 515MB (1056384 sectors), 1048 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S : > > wdc1 at 0x170-0x177 irq 15 on isa : > > wdc1: unit 0 (atapi): , removable, dma : , iordis : > > wdc1: ATAPI hard disks not supported : > > : > > It's not working anyway. It's an NEC CDR-260, claims to be ATAPI rev 1.7B : > > compatible. : > : > Oh well, you have one of the drives that doesn't byteswap its name :) : > It probably has other "non-std" things as well, making the driver : > fail to see it as a CDROM. This was one of the probelms that effectively : > delayed my ata driver, there seems to be no clear way to deal with this : > except searching through a table with known stange devices.... :-( : -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 13:48:07 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA00793 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:48:07 -0700 Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA00787 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:48:01 -0700 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA18141 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:47:57 +0200 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA28110 for Hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:47:57 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id WAA17305 for Hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:47:20 +0200 From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199508262047.WAA17305@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the Press To: Hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:47:20 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: Hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199508261157.NAA17765@strider.ibenet.it> from "Piero Serini" at Aug 26, 95 01:57:11 pm Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 548 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Piero Serini wrote: > > For those interested, David sent me a scanned text version, which is > now available via ftp at: > > ftp://strider.free.it/pub/FreeBSD/SunExpert.article.txt.gz I get only connection timeouts from that site (and no reverse lookup data, btw.), even though the ping times and package loss rates don't seem to be bad. Can somebody put it up on a site with better connectivity? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 13:57:31 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id NAA01292 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:57:31 -0700 Received: from lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (lupine.nsi.nasa.gov [198.116.2.100]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id NAA01284 ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 13:57:27 -0700 Received: (from mnewell@localhost) by lupine.nsi.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA21120; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 16:55:01 -0400 Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 16:55:01 -0400 (EDT) From: "Michael C. Newell" To: paul@FreeBSD.ORG cc: imp@village.org, taob@gate.sinica.edu.tw, tom@misery.sdf.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the paper! In-Reply-To: <199508251318.OAA17245@server.netcraft.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: hackers-owner@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Fri, 25 Aug 1995, Paul Richards wrote: > I can't get it to work :-( I had Microsoft's beta stack working with > SAMBA but Netscape crashed the machines accessing the winsock.dll Are you using the LATEST wolverine stack? That's what I'm using, but I don't run Netscape on my Windoze machine so I don't know if it crashes. Thanks, Mike +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ |Mike Newell | The opinions expressed herein are | |NASA Science Internet Network Systems | my own, and do not necessarily | |Sterling Software, Inc. | reflect those of the NSI program, | |MNewell@nsipo.nasa.gov | Sterling Software, NASA, or anyone | |+1-202-434-8954 | else. | +--------------------------------------+------------------------------------+ | work: http://www.eco.nsi.nasa.gov/~mnewell | | home: http://www.newell.arlington.va.us | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 14:21:12 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id OAA02270 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 14:21:12 -0700 Received: from strider.ibenet.it ([194.179.130.1]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id OAA02264 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 14:21:06 -0700 Received: (from piero@localhost) by strider.ibenet.it (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA21349 for Hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 23:25:22 +0200 From: Piero Serini Message-Id: <199508262125.XAA21349@strider.ibenet.it> Subject: Re: FreeBSD in the Press To: Hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 23:25:21 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <199508262047.WAA17305@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 26, 95 10:47:20 pm Reply-To: Piero@strider.ibenet.it Operating-System: FreeBSD 1.1.5.1 X-Phone-Number: +39 (2) 58113562 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Content-Length: 1136 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello. Quoting from J Wunsch (Sat Aug 26 22:47:20 1995): > > ftp://strider.free.it/pub/FreeBSD/SunExpert.article.txt.gz > > I get only connection timeouts from that site (and no reverse lookup > data, btw.), even though the ping times and package loss rates don't > seem to be bad. Can somebody put it up on a site with better > connectivity? Well, 1st of all the article is now mode 0000 because we still have to check the Copyright on that stuff. Sorry, I didn't think of it in the beginning. Regarding the connectivity, can you tell me the site you're call- ing from? We're experiencing some network problem in these days, but it should be reachable from everywhere. I tried from a site in Miami via Sprint I have a login on, and everything was fine. P.S. The site is very young, so we're waiting to be delegated to re- verse nameservice by the RIPE, which is much slower than the In- ternic. Bye, -- # $Id: .signature,v 1.12 1995/08/14 12:10:54 piero Exp $ Piero Serini Via Giambologna, 1 I 20136 Milano - ITALY From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 20:14:09 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id UAA04187 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 20:14:09 -0700 Received: from merlin.nando.net (merlin.nando.net [152.52.2.2]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id UAA04181 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 20:14:07 -0700 Received: from nando.net.nando.net (parsifal.nando.net) by merlin.nando.net (4.1/davel-nando/dec93) id AA02950; Sat, 26 Aug 95 23:13:41 EDT Received: by nando.net.nando.net (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA05709; Sat, 26 Aug 95 23:13:47 EDT From: kmitch@nando.net (kmitch) Message-Id: <9508270313.AA05709@nando.net.nando.net> Subject: restore dump volume and tape hardware failure To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 26 Aug 1995 23:13:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1157 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I have a Conner CTD-8000 SCSI-2 Tape drive on a adaptec 2940W PCI SCSI contoller. Recently, I wanted to repartition everything, so I backed everything up via dump. Aug 26 22:45:06 playpen /kernel: ahc0: target 6 synchronous at 5.0MB/s, offset = 0xf Aug 26 22:45:06 playpen /kernel: (ahc0:6:0): "ARCHIVE Python 28388-XXX 5.28" type 1 removable SCSI 2 Aug 26 22:45:06 playpen /kernel: st0(ahc0:6:0): Sequential-Access density code 0x13, 512-byte blocks, write-enabled After repartioning, I proceeded to restore. All of my partitions restored correctly, except for /usr. When I tried to restore /usr, it goes for a while and then when it gets to some file in /usr/share/man, I get the following error: Aug 26 22:37:35 playpen /kernel: st0(ahc0:6:0): HARDWARE FAILURE info:8000 asc:44,80 Aug 26 22:37:38 playpen /kernel: st0(ahc0:6:0): HARDWARE FAILURE info:f000 asc:44,80 Aug 26 22:37:38 playpen last message repeated 13 times At this point, the light on my tape drive is blinking, and I can't even eject the tape (perhaps it is still "mounted"??). It seems to me that there is a media failure here, but why would this cause a hardware failure?? From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 26 22:16:43 1995 Return-Path: hackers-owner Received: (from majordom@localhost) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) id WAA08732 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:16:43 -0700 Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.FreeBSD.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP id WAA08726 for ; Sat, 26 Aug 1995 22:16:41 -0700 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA19968; Sun, 27 Aug 1995 14:44:18 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199508270514.OAA19968@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: ISDN Anyone? To: steve@simon.chi.il.us (Steven E. Piette) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 1995 14:44:18 +0930 (CST) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com, fenner@parc.xerox.com, terryl@cs.stanford.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Steven E. Piette" at Aug 25, 95 05:15:00 pm Content-Type: text Content-Length: 891 Sender: hackers-owner@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Steven E. Piette stands accused of saying: > > The 451/551 integrate some stuff, but I can't recall what ``stuff''. > > > > > > > Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net > > They integrate the parallel port on chip and the 552 does to FIFO'd serial > plus one parallel. This probably belongs on -hardware, but I've had _very_ bad experiences with the Startech 552 parts - they tend to hang the bus on fast (486+) systems, often after as long as 5 or 10 minutes after powerup. > Steve -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] My car has "demand start" -Terry Lambert UNIX: live FreeBSD or die! [[