From owner-freebsd-hardware Sun Aug 10 19:32:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA02487 for hardware-outgoing; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 19:32:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ducky.net (gate.ducky.net [198.145.101.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA02480; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 19:32:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.ducky.net (localhost.ducky.net [127.0.0.1]) by ducky.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA03202; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 19:32:27 -0700 Message-Id: <199708110232.TAA03202@ducky.net> X-Authentication-Warning: ducky.net: Host localhost.ducky.net didn't use HELO protocol To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 19:32:27 -0700 From: Mike Haertel Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have two boxes, one based on the ASUS SP3G with a 486 DX4/100 processor, and another based on the ASUS P6NP5 with a 150 MHz PPro. The 486 box has a 16-bit WD8013 based ethernet board, and the PPro has an EtherExpress Pro/100. I attempted to do an NFS install of FreeBSD 2.2.2 on the 486 box using the PPro box as the server. At appeared to detect the ethernet board Ok, but it got hung when actually trying to copy files. After a considerable pain I concluded that it was dropping the trailing packets (fragments), and the @#%@! UDP and/or NFS protocol on the server was responding by attempting to retransmit the entire packet again, and thus causing the trailing packets to be lost again. It seems that the PPro pumps the bits out on the wire so fast that the 486 had no time to catch its breath. Setting the maximum NFS read size to 2K or smaller allowed it to work. But slowly. The same wd8013 ethernet card worked fine for a network install to a Pentium/90 based Intel Xpress box. I really have trouble believing the 486/100 is so much slower than the Pentium/90 it can't keep up. So: Is there anything special I should know about wd8013 cards and ASUS SP3G's and/or 486/100's? Or am I just plain out of luck? In the latter case could anybody recommend a faster ISA ethernet card that's widely supported by the free OS's? Thanks, Mike From owner-freebsd-hardware Sun Aug 10 21:04:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA07519 for hardware-outgoing; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 21:04:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from databus.databus.com (databus.databus.com [198.186.154.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA07487; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 21:04:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Barney Wolff To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 23:52 EDT Subject: Re: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 Content-Type: text/plain Message-ID: <33ee8f490.55c9@databus.databus.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As a data point, I just copied 5MB from a P6/200 running fbsd 2.1.5 & a Pro 100B (at 10 MHz) to a 486/66 running Unixware 2.0.3 with a WD8013. Via NFS, 651 KB/sec. I have in fact seen slow transfers to a 486 with WD8013 from an SGI workstation. I wonder if it has more to do with the ethernet than with the 8013. But on the same lan, another 486 with a 3com 3c509 was able to keep up. It may have something to do with how collisions get handled, as I vaguely recall (was a couple of years ago) that running multiple transfers simultaneously caused trouble with the 8013 but not with the 3c509. WARNING: In all the tests I've run, the 486 was running Unixware, not fbsd. > Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 19:32:27 -0700 > From: Mike Haertel > > I have two boxes, one based on the ASUS SP3G with a 486 DX4/100 > processor, and another based on the ASUS P6NP5 with a 150 MHz PPro. > The 486 box has a 16-bit WD8013 based ethernet board, and the PPro > has an EtherExpress Pro/100. > > I attempted to do an NFS install of FreeBSD 2.2.2 on the 486 box > using the PPro box as the server. At appeared to detect the > ethernet board Ok, but it got hung when actually trying to copy > files. After a considerable pain I concluded that it was dropping > the trailing packets (fragments), and the @#%@! UDP and/or > NFS protocol on the server was responding by attempting to > retransmit the entire packet again, and thus causing the trailing > packets to be lost again. It seems that the PPro pumps the bits > out on the wire so fast that the 486 had no time to catch its breath. > Setting the maximum NFS read size to 2K or smaller allowed it > to work. But slowly. > > The same wd8013 ethernet card worked fine for a network install > to a Pentium/90 based Intel Xpress box. I really have trouble > believing the 486/100 is so much slower than the Pentium/90 > it can't keep up. > > So: Is there anything special I should know about wd8013 cards > and ASUS SP3G's and/or 486/100's? Or am I just plain out of luck? > In the latter case could anybody recommend a faster ISA ethernet > card that's widely supported by the free OS's? > > Thanks, > > Mike > From owner-freebsd-hardware Sun Aug 10 21:31:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA09097 for hardware-outgoing; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 21:31:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (implode.root.com [198.145.90.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA09092; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 21:30:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA08541; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 21:33:16 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708110433.VAA08541@implode.root.com> To: Mike Haertel cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Aug 1997 19:32:27 PDT." <199708110232.TAA03202@ducky.net> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 21:33:16 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >So: Is there anything special I should know about wd8013 cards >and ASUS SP3G's and/or 486/100's? Or am I just plain out of luck? >In the latter case could anybody recommend a faster ISA ethernet >card that's widely supported by the free OS's? It sounds like there is a problem that is special to the Asus SP3G. The obvious thing to check for is the ISA bus speed being correct. As for the wd8013, with its shared memory design, it is the fastest ISA ethernet card that FreeBSD supports. The raw access speed to the shared memory should be about 4MB/second - plenty fast enough to keep up with 10Mbps ethernet. -DG David Greenman Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hardware Sun Aug 10 22:12:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA12113 for hardware-outgoing; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:12:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA12082; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:12:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0wxml5-0001jP-00; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:11:11 -0700 Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:11:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: David Greenman cc: Mike Haertel , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 In-Reply-To: <199708110433.VAA08541@implode.root.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 10 Aug 1997, David Greenman wrote: > >So: Is there anything special I should know about wd8013 cards > >and ASUS SP3G's and/or 486/100's? Or am I just plain out of luck? > >In the latter case could anybody recommend a faster ISA ethernet > >card that's widely supported by the free OS's? > > It sounds like there is a problem that is special to the Asus SP3G. The > obvious thing to check for is the ISA bus speed being correct. As for the > wd8013, with its shared memory design, it is the fastest ISA ethernet card > that FreeBSD supports. The raw access speed to the shared memory should > be about 4MB/second - plenty fast enough to keep up with 10Mbps ethernet. I dunno... I have access to ASUS 3P3G running 2.1-stable that happening to running an anon FTP server and an SMC 8216. I can retrieve files at 930KB/s, and upload files at 898KB/s over shared ethernet with other light traffic. The ASUS SP3G is the fastest 486 motherboard I've seen. > -DG > > David Greenman > Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project > > Tom From owner-freebsd-hardware Sun Aug 10 22:34:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA13006 for hardware-outgoing; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:34:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ducky.net (gate.ducky.net [198.145.101.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA12992; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:34:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.ducky.net (localhost.ducky.net [127.0.0.1]) by ducky.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA03574; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:34:09 -0700 Message-Id: <199708110534.WAA03574@ducky.net> X-Authentication-Warning: ducky.net: Host localhost.ducky.net didn't use HELO protocol To: dg@root.com cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, mike@ducky.net Subject: Re: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Aug 1997 21:33:16 PDT." <199708110433.VAA08541@implode.root.com> Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:34:09 -0700 From: Mike Haertel Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > It sounds like there is a problem that is special to the Asus SP3G. The >obvious thing to check for is the ISA bus speed being correct. As for the >wd8013, with its shared memory design, it is the fastest ISA ethernet card >that FreeBSD supports. The raw access speed to the shared memory should >be about 4MB/second - plenty fast enough to keep up with 10Mbps ethernet. Hmm... this inspired me to write a small benchmark. This program maps the ethernet board's shared memory (assumed to be at 0xd8000) to user space, and then copies 16 megabytes out of it 32 bits at a time. On the 486 box, it takes about 15.5 seconds. On the Pentium box (which worked for the NFS install) it takes about 14.5 seconds. Either of these is just slightly faster than 1 MB/sec and nowhere near the claimed 4 MB/sec. Perhaps my board is pessimal and the Pentium box, being just a hair faster, is fast enough to keep up? Since both the 486 and the Pentium exhibit (nearly) the same performance, and I am 100% positive that the Pentium is running the ISA bus at the right frequency, I'm fairly sure there is no problem with the ISA bus speed in the 486. (I checked the motherboard docs and it does not appear to be configurable anyway.) --cut here-- /* * usage: time ./a.out */ #include #include asm(" _docopy: pushl %ebx movl 8(%esp), %ecx movl 12(%esp), %edx movl $1024, %eax loopy: movl 0(%edx), %ebx movl %ebx, 0(%ecx) movl 4(%edx), %ebx movl %ebx, 4(%ecx) movl 8(%edx), %ebx movl %ebx, 8(%ecx) movl 12(%edx), %ebx movl %ebx, 12(%ecx) addl $16, %ecx addl $16, %edx decl %eax jne loopy popl %ebx ret "); extern void docopy(short *dst, short *src); main() { int fd, i, j; short *p, d[8192]; fd = open("/dev/mem", O_RDONLY); if (fd < 0) { printf("barf\n"); exit(33); } p = (short *) mmap(0, 16384, PROT_READ, MAP_SHARED, fd, 0xd8000); /* * Benchmark: copying 16 megabytes of memory from p a word * at a time. */ printf("p = %p\n", (void *) p); for (i = 0; i < 1024; ++i) docopy(d, p); exit(0); } From owner-freebsd-hardware Sun Aug 10 22:46:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA13529 for hardware-outgoing; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:46:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (implode.root.com [198.145.90.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA13523; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:46:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA09160; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:48:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708110548.WAA09160@implode.root.com> To: Mike Haertel cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:34:09 PDT." <199708110534.WAA03574@ducky.net> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:48:23 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>that FreeBSD supports. The raw access speed to the shared memory should >>be about 4MB/second - plenty fast enough to keep up with 10Mbps ethernet. > >Hmm... this inspired me to write a small benchmark. ... >On the 486 box, it takes about 15.5 seconds. On the Pentium box >(which worked for the NFS install) it takes about 14.5 seconds. > >Either of these is just slightly faster than 1 MB/sec and nowhere >near the claimed 4 MB/sec. Perhaps my board is pessimal and the >Pentium box, being just a hair faster, is fast enough to keep up? My 4MB/second number comes from doing a similar test in the device driver using bcopy at system startup. I don't know why your results are so slow, but I do recall seeing unusually low performance numbers from a P6 system that I once tested - I seem to recall they were about half speed or so, but I didn't investigate further. Just for kicks, you might try doing 16 bit copies rather than 32bit copies and see if your results are affected. -DG David Greenman Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hardware Sun Aug 10 22:51:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA13838 for hardware-outgoing; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:51:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ducky.net (gate.ducky.net [198.145.101.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA13832; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:51:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.ducky.net (localhost.ducky.net [127.0.0.1]) by ducky.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA03617; Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:51:13 -0700 Message-Id: <199708110551.WAA03617@ducky.net> X-Authentication-Warning: ducky.net: Host localhost.ducky.net didn't use HELO protocol To: dg@root.com cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 Date: Sun, 10 Aug 1997 22:51:13 -0700 From: Mike Haertel Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>On the 486 box, it takes about 15.5 seconds. On the Pentium box >>(which worked for the NFS install) it takes about 14.5 seconds. >> >>Either of these is just slightly faster than 1 MB/sec and nowhere >>near the claimed 4 MB/sec. Perhaps my board is pessimal and the >>Pentium box, being just a hair faster, is fast enough to keep up? > > My 4MB/second number comes from doing a similar test in the device driver >using bcopy at system startup. I don't know why your results are so slow, >but I do recall seeing unusually low performance numbers from a P6 system >that I once tested - I seem to recall they were about half speed or so, but >I didn't investigate further. > Just for kicks, you might try doing 16 bit copies rather than 32bit >copies and see if your results are affected. This was a 486 system, not a P6 system. (The problem I am having is that the 486 cannot keep up with the data coming from the P6.) I tried 16-bit copies; they were a little slower (about 16 and 18 seconds on the P5-90 and 486-100 respectively). Further information: I have no idea what brand the board is; I got it as scrap. The NIC is a WDC83C690. I just checked the card edge connector and all 16 data lines really *are* there, so I don't think it's an 8-bit board in disguise. From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 08:48:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA11186 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 08:48:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cynic.portal.ca (root@cynic.portal.ca [204.174.36.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA11168; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 08:48:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost ([[UNIX: localhost]]) by cynic.portal.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA09098; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: cynic.portal.ca: cjs owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 08:48:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Curt Sampson To: Mike Haertel cc: dg@root.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 In-Reply-To: <199708110551.WAA03617@ducky.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 10 Aug 1997, Mike Haertel wrote: > I tried 16-bit copies; they were a little slower (about 16 and 18 > seconds on the P5-90 and 486-100 respectively). I'd be interested to see what you get with 8-bit copies. Did you drop the board into 16-bit mode before doing your 16-bit reads, BTW? I'm not sure if it makes a difference on reads, but it certainly does on writes. cjs Curt Sampson cjs@portal.ca Info at http://www.portal.ca/ Internet Portal Services, Inc. Through infinite myst, software reverberates Vancouver, BC (604) 257-9400 In code possess'd of invisible folly. From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 13:04:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA26784 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 13:04:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from horst.bfd.com (horst.bfd.com [204.160.242.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA26772; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 13:04:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from harlie.bfd.com (bastion.bfd.com [204.160.242.14]) by horst.bfd.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA15791; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 13:04:09 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 13:04:09 -0700 (PDT) From: "Eric J. Schwertfeger" To: Barney Wolff cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 In-Reply-To: <33ee8f490.55c9@databus.databus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 10 Aug 1997, Barney Wolff wrote: > As a data point, I just copied 5MB from a P6/200 running fbsd 2.1.5 & a > Pro 100B (at 10 MHz) to a 486/66 running Unixware 2.0.3 with a WD8013. > Via NFS, 651 KB/sec. More data points: On a quiet network, I've seen 900K/sec transfers using FreeBSD 2.1.[5-7] and NE2000 clones on both ends, and 1M/sec using the SMC Elites. Oh, and on Pentiums with DEC chipsets, 1.06M/sec From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 15:00:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA02501 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:00:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA02491 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:00:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (jwm@localhost) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id PAA04811; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:00:12 -0700 Message-Id: <199708112200.PAA04811@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> To: hardware@freebsd.org cc: root@meeko.eecs.berkeley.edu Subject: FIC PA-2011 Reply-to: jwm@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 14:59:55 -0700 From: John Milford Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I recently purchased one of these boards, and was very disappointed with it, and with the response (or rather lack of response) from FIC. The board would not work with the external cache enabled irregardless of how conservatively I set the other CMOS settings. After struggling with it for a while I had my supplier order a second board, and that turned out to have the exact same problem. (This was tested w/ an Intel Pentium 100 just to make sure it was really the board causing the trouble, and not the K6). I was really let down by this because I wanted the VIA VP2 chipset, and this board seems to be the only way to get it. I switched to an ASUS P55T2P4 and everything is happy now. Just wanted to warn everyone about it. --John From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 15:37:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA04941 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:37:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA04931 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:37:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmnsens (cmnsens.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.2]) by dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id PAA05218 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:37:29 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708112237.PAA05218@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: "Mike Burgett" To: "hardware@freebsd.org" Date: Mon, 11 Aug 97 15:37:29 -0700 Reply-To: "Mike Burgett" Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 1.92 For OS/2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've tried everything but a new chip here, AMD recommended motherboard and cooler and all, without getting through a 'make world'. The new chip is on the way. :) Has *anyone* been able to do a 'make world' successfully with this chip? Thanks, Mike From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 16:31:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA07766 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:31:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA07758 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:30:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (jwm@localhost) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id QAA12855; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:30:49 -0700 Message-Id: <199708112330.QAA12855@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> To: "Mike Burgett" Cc: root@meeko.eecs.berkeley.edu, hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-reply-to: Message from "Mike Burgett" of "Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:37:29 PDT." <199708112237.PAA05218@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:30:32 -0700 From: John Milford Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Mike Burgett" wrote: > I've tried everything but a new chip here, AMD recommended motherboard and > cooler and all, without getting through a 'make world'. The new chip is on > the way. :) Has *anyone* been able to do a 'make world' successfully with > this chip? > > Thanks, > Mike > I've tried one so far, and it failed: cc -O -I/services/src/gnu/lib/libgmp/../../../contrib/libgmp -I/services/src/gn u/lib/libgmp/../../../contrib/libgmp/mpn/generic -I/services/src/gnu/lib/libgmp /../../../contrib/libgmp/mpn/x86 -DBROKEN_ALIGN -I/usr/obj/services/src/gnu/li b/libgmp -c /services/src/gnu/lib/libgmp/../../../contrib/libgmp/mpq/cmp_ui.c - o mpq/cmp_ui.o /var/tmp/cc023067.s: Assembler messages: /var/tmp/cc023067.s:71: Error: bad register name ('%') *** Error code 1 Wanted to try again to see if I'd get the error. I also am not positive the tree was intact as a make depend failed as well. The make world will be tried again tonight. --John From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 17:20:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA10072 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:20:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (implode.root.com [198.145.90.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA10055 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:20:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA19770; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:22:21 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708120022.RAA19770@implode.root.com> To: "Mike Burgett" cc: "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Aug 1997 15:37:29 PDT." <199708112237.PAA05218@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:22:21 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I've tried everything but a new chip here, AMD recommended motherboard and >cooler and all, without getting through a 'make world'. The new chip is on >the way. :) Has *anyone* been able to do a 'make world' successfully with >this chip? I only have the 166MHz part, and have not been successful after changing everything except the chip. -DG David Greenman Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 17:35:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA11718 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:35:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA11698 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:34:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmnsens (cmnsens.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.2]) by dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id RAA05790; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:34:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708120034.RAA05790@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: "Mike Burgett" To: "dg@root.com" Cc: "hardware@freebsd.org" Date: Mon, 11 Aug 97 17:34:40 -0700 Reply-To: "Mike Burgett" Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 1.92 For OS/2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:22:21 -0700, David Greenman wrote: >>I've tried everything but a new chip here, AMD recommended motherboard and >>cooler and all, without getting through a 'make world'. The new chip is on >>the way. :) Has *anyone* been able to do a 'make world' successfully with >>this chip? > > I only have the 166MHz part, and have not been successful after changing >everything except the chip. Hmmmm. What started off as an annoyance, is getting *really* interesting. I wonder if 2_2_RELENG is somehow incompatible with the chip? AMD claims compatibility with FreeBSD 2.0 on their compatability list, but I wonder if that included rebuilding all the sources? Seems to run fine when it's just perking along doing normal stuff'n quick builds... --Mike From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 17:51:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA12870 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:51:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ducky.net (gate.ducky.net [198.145.101.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA12860; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:51:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.ducky.net (localhost.ducky.net [127.0.0.1]) by ducky.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA04916; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:50:45 -0700 Message-Id: <199708120050.RAA04916@ducky.net> X-Authentication-Warning: ducky.net: Host localhost.ducky.net didn't use HELO protocol To: Curt Sampson cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about "ed" driver performance on ASUS SP3G & 486DX4/100 In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Aug 1997 08:48:02 PDT." Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:50:45 -0700 From: Mike Haertel Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> I tried 16-bit copies; they were a little slower (about 16 and 18 >> seconds on the P5-90 and 486-100 respectively). > >I'd be interested to see what you get with 8-bit copies. Did you >drop the board into 16-bit mode before doing your 16-bit reads, >BTW? I'm not sure if it makes a difference on reads, but it certainly >does on writes. 8 bit copies were 1.5 times as slow as 16-bit copies--about .65 megabytes/sec. I tried both rep movsb and manually unrolled movb's. At this point, I've concluded the board is probably at fault... From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 18:56:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA16225 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 18:56:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (implode.root.com [198.145.90.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA16217 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 18:56:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA21137; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 18:54:20 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708120154.SAA21137@implode.root.com> To: "Mike Burgett" cc: "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:34:40 PDT." <199708120034.RAA05790@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 18:54:20 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >On Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:22:21 -0700, David Greenman wrote: > >>>I've tried everything but a new chip here, AMD recommended motherboard and >>>cooler and all, without getting through a 'make world'. The new chip is on >>>the way. :) Has *anyone* been able to do a 'make world' successfully with >>>this chip? >> >> I only have the 166MHz part, and have not been successful after changing >>everything except the chip. > >Hmmmm. What started off as an annoyance, is getting *really* interesting. I >wonder if 2_2_RELENG is somehow incompatible with the chip? AMD claims >compatibility with FreeBSD 2.0 on their compatability list, but I wonder if >that included rebuilding all the sources? Seems to run fine when it's just >perking along doing normal stuff'n quick builds... It's a problem with the chip, not with FreeBSD. -DG David Greenman Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 18:58:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA16331 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 18:58:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kilgour.nething.com (kilgour.nething.com [204.253.210.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA16323 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 18:58:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from randy.nething.com (randy.nething.com [204.253.210.83]) by kilgour.nething.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA04035; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:56:13 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970811205642.00712384@nething.com> X-Sender: rberndt@nething.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:56:42 -0500 To: "Mike Burgett" , "hardware@freebsd.org" From: Randy Berndt Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-Reply-To: <199708120034.RAA05790@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 05:34 PM 8/11/97 -0700, you wrote: >On Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:22:21 -0700, David Greenman wrote: > >>>I've tried everything but a new chip here, AMD recommended motherboard and >>>cooler and all, without getting through a 'make world'. The new chip is on >>>the way. :) Has *anyone* been able to do a 'make world' successfully with >>>this chip? >> >> I only have the 166MHz part, and have not been successful after changing >>everything except the chip. > >Hmmmm. What started off as an annoyance, is getting *really* interesting. I >wonder if 2_2_RELENG is somehow incompatible with the chip? AMD claims >compatibility with FreeBSD 2.0 on their compatability list, but I wonder if >that included rebuilding all the sources? Seems to run fine when it's just >perking along doing normal stuff'n quick builds... Pardon me for being REALLY dense, but .... Isn't the K6 supposed to be compatible with the Pentium >> CHIP << ??? Not a program that operates on that chip??? If Freebsd uses pentium instructions, how can it become incompatible? Randy Berndt ---------------------------------- AOS/VS, Win95, FreeBSD, WinNT, DOS, Win311: I'm caught in a twisty little maze of operating systems, all different. From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 19:59:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA21063 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 19:59:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pegasus.com (pegasus.com [206.127.225.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA21046 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 19:59:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pegasus.com (8.6.8/PEGASUS-2.2) id QAA09693; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:58:58 -1001 Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 16:58:58 -1001 From: richard@pegasus.com (Richard Foulk) Message-Id: <199708120259.QAA09693@pegasus.com> In-Reply-To: Randy Berndt "Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ?" (Aug 11, 8:56pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk } Pardon me for being REALLY dense, but .... Isn't the K6 supposed to be } compatible with the Pentium >> CHIP << ??? Not a program that operates on } that chip??? } } If Freebsd uses pentium instructions, how can it become incompatible? So it has no enhancements, extra features, speed ups or anything that might make it different in some way? There's a difference between running programs and running an OS. Richard From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 20:40:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA23824 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:40:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA23819 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:40:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmnsens (cmnsens.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.2]) by dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id TAA06191; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 19:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708120221.TAA06191@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: "Mike Burgett" To: "hardware@freebsd.org" , "Randy Berndt" Date: Mon, 11 Aug 97 19:21:26 -0700 Reply-To: "Mike Burgett" Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 1.92 For OS/2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:56:42 -0500, Randy Berndt wrote: >>Hmmmm. What started off as an annoyance, is getting *really* interesting. I >>wonder if 2_2_RELENG is somehow incompatible with the chip? AMD claims >>compatibility with FreeBSD 2.0 on their compatability list, but I wonder if >>that included rebuilding all the sources? Seems to run fine when it's just >>perking along doing normal stuff'n quick builds... > >Pardon me for being REALLY dense, but .... Isn't the K6 supposed to be >compatible with the Pentium >> CHIP << ??? Not a program that operates on >that chip??? Sure it is, and AMD publishes a list of software that they've tested to try and prove that point. >If Freebsd uses pentium instructions, how can it become incompatible? Well, therein lies the rub. It uses AMD's implementation of the pentium instructions. Possibly there's bugs, hardware flaws, or even a subtle difference in things that happen atomically and things that don't that aren't specified (in the published instruction set) that could be causing the problem. Looking through the kernel sources, there's reasons for indentifiying different compatible chips, sometimes running on specific hardware, that needs things done or not done in the kernel, or just during init. I've seend differences in failure times, in running a 'make world' depending on what flags I gave the npx in my kernel config file, as well as things like the AUTO_EOI? options... So far, I haven't found a combination that gets me beyond about 1.5 hours of a 'make world'.... --Mike From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 20:54:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA24971 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:54:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www2.shoppersnet.com (shoppersnet.com [204.156.152.112]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA24962 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:54:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from hlew@localhost) by www2.shoppersnet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA29380; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:58:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Howard Lew To: Randy Berndt cc: Mike Burgett , "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19970811205642.00712384@nething.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 11 Aug 1997, Randy Berndt wrote: > At 05:34 PM 8/11/97 -0700, you wrote: > >On Mon, 11 Aug 1997 17:22:21 -0700, David Greenman wrote: > > > >>>I've tried everything but a new chip here, AMD recommended motherboard and > >>>cooler and all, without getting through a 'make world'. The new chip is > on > >>>the way. :) Has *anyone* been able to do a 'make world' successfully with > >>>this chip? > >> > >> I only have the 166MHz part, and have not been successful after changing > >>everything except the chip. > > > >Hmmmm. What started off as an annoyance, is getting *really* interesting. I > >wonder if 2_2_RELENG is somehow incompatible with the chip? AMD claims > >compatibility with FreeBSD 2.0 on their compatability list, but I wonder if > >that included rebuilding all the sources? Seems to run fine when it's just > >perking along doing normal stuff'n quick builds... > > Pardon me for being REALLY dense, but .... Isn't the K6 supposed to be > compatible with the Pentium >> CHIP << ??? Not a program that operates on > that chip??? > I think this will be a never ending topic of conversation, but let's try to look at all possibilities. Questions to Ask/Answer/Consider: What configurations (i.e. Motherboard & chipset, cpu, and hd controller is everyone using with the K6)? The problem here is that no one has posted full configuration details, so I urge you guys to do so here. CPU Model: Motherboard: Chipset: L2 Cache: System Memory: HD Controller: Hard Drives: Bios: Switching/Linear VRM: HS Grease Applied: Fan Type: Make World: General FreeBSD Stuff: FreeBSD Version: Things to think about: 1) The K6-233 does run quite hot... Heatsink grease is required for all AMD K6s according to AMD (I would say a fast fan is a good idea too). 2) I have ran a K6-200 as a FreeBSD box and it does run fine, but I am not the type who does make worlds so I can't tell you if it really/really doesn't fail doing that test. It runs fine for typical stuff (X windows, telnet sessions, etc.) 3) I think everyone I have heard around here says that they have "make world" problems were using Asus motherboards. Is this just a coincidence? Yes, I know you guys choose Asus because it is generally a high end motherboard manufacturer. (The K6 does draw more current that a Pentium/MMX so a board that works fine on a Pentium/MMX may not necessarily work on a K6, so swapping it for a Pentium/MMX cpu does not necessarily make all things equal). Anyway my configuration responses. Anyone want to keep a record of them all? CPU Model: AMD K6-200 Motherboard: FreeTech F63T Chipset: 430VX L2 Cache: 256K Pipeline Burst System Memory: 64MB EDO HD Controller: Adaptec 2940UW Hard Drives: 2 Quantum SCSI-2 Fireballs Bios: Award 6/24/97 Switching/Linear VR: Linear HS Grease Applied: Yes Fan Type: Cyrix 6x86 (fast) Make World: not tested General FreeBSD Stuff: no problems FreeBSD Version: 2.1.7.1R From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 21:23:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA26851 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:23:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA26843 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:23:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmnsens (cmnsens.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.2]) by dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id VAA06861 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:23:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708120423.VAA06861@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: "Mike Burgett" To: "hardware@freebsd.org" Date: Mon, 11 Aug 97 21:23:05 -0700 Reply-To: "Mike Burgett" Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 1.92 For OS/2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:58:49 -0700 (PDT), Howard Lew wrote: >I think this will be a never ending topic of conversation, but let's try >to look at all possibilities. > >Questions to Ask/Answer/Consider: > >1) The K6-233 does run quite hot... Heatsink grease is required for all AMD >K6s according to AMD (I would say a fast fan is a good idea too). Check. >2) I have ran a K6-200 as a FreeBSD box and it does run fine, but I am >not the type who does make worlds so I can't tell you if it really/really >doesn't fail doing that test. It runs fine for typical stuff (X windows, >telnet sessions, etc.) It might be very interesting for you to test it on your world. (Maybe just a build, not an install). I seem to remember a rash of "my K6 won't run 'make world' anymore" postings awhile back that hit all around the same time. That was in the 2_2_RELENG branch, I believe. Since your config pre-dates that, it may provide some insight. >3) I think everyone I have heard around here says that they have "make world" >problems were using Asus motherboards. Is this just a coincidence? Yes, I >know you guys choose Asus because it is generally a high end motherboard >manufacturer. (The K6 does draw more current that a Pentium/MMX so a board >that works fine on a Pentium/MMX may not necessarily work on a K6, so >swapping it for a Pentium/MMX cpu does not necessarily make all things >equal). I have *no* problems with 'make world' with a pentium chip, other than it's slow. :) And, if you see below, I had a board that was recommended/tested by AMD for the K6, and it wouldn't make it as far as my Asus. Here's what I've tried (and I've copied yours, as I will any others I see here, so if someone wants to see the list later, I'll certainly have a copy...) (the cooler I'm using is the one recommended for the K6-266, which has a larger heatsink area, and moves over 2X the air the one recommended for the K6-200 does...) (I'm trying to stick with 430HX chipsets because of the >64M caching ability...) CPU Model: AMD K6-200 Motherboard: Asus P/I P55T2P4 3.10 (4 Month Old) Chipset: 430HX L2 Cache: 512K Pipeline Burst System Memory: 96MB EDO HD Controller: Asus SC200 (NCR 53C810) Hard Drives: Seagate ST3255N, HPSW30PN Bios: Award 0203, 0204-7 Switching/Linear VR: Switching HS Grease Applied: Yes Fan Type: CoolerMaster TI5-602525 Make World: Fails after 1-1.5 hours General FreeBSD Stuff: no problems FreeBSD Version: 2.2.2-stable CPU Model: AMD K6-200 Motherboard: Asus P/I P55T2P4 3.10 (New) Chipset: 430HX L2 Cache: 512K Pipeline Burst System Memory: 96MB EDO HD Controller: Asus SC200 (NCR 53C810) Hard Drives: Seagate ST3255N, HPSW30PN Bios: Award 0203 Switching/Linear VR: Switching HS Grease Applied: Yes Fan Type: CoolerMaster TI5-602525 Make World: Fails after 1-1.5 hours General FreeBSD Stuff: no problems FreeBSD Version: 2.2.2-stable CPU Model: AMD K6-200 Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-586HX 1.53(?) (loaner) (AMD tested list) Chipset: 430HX L2 Cache: 512K Pipeline Burst System Memory: 96MB EDO HD Controller: Asus SC200 (NCR 53C810) Hard Drives: Seagate ST3255N, HPSW30PN Bios: Award (version/date unknown, later than reqd for K6) Switching/Linear VR: Linear HS Grease Applied: Yes Fan Type: CoolerMaster TI5-602525 Make World: Fails after 20 minutes General FreeBSD Stuff: no problems FreeBSD Version: 2.2.2-stable (I've tried all of the above with various bios settings, including the slowest for memory, and disabling all the various 'turbo' options, increasing IO recovery times, etc...) --Mike From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 21:32:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA27399 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:32:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tyger.inna.net (root@tyger.inna.net [206.151.66.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA27391 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:32:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from caught.inna.net (caught.inna.net [206.151.66.7]) by tyger.inna.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA01625; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:32:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:31:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas Arnold To: Howard Lew cc: Randy Berndt , Mike Burgett , "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 11 Aug 1997, Howard Lew wrote: > CPU Model: K6-166 ( 1st edition, got two days after intro ) > Motherboard: Machspeed VX motherboard > Chipset: VX > L2 Cache: 512k Pipeline Burst > System Memory: 128megs SDRAM > HD Controller: Onboard UMC IDE > Hard Drives: Western Digital 1.7gig IDE > Bios: AMD Latest upgrade. > Switching/Linear VRM: Linear. > HS Grease Applied: Yes. > Fan Type: Master Cooler > Make World: Yes. No problems. > General FreeBSD Stuff: Yes. No problems. > FreeBSD Version: 2.2.2 I've been happy with the chip, not as fast as I think AMD has touted it as being, but thats marketing eh? +-----------------------------------------------+ : Tom Arnold - No relation to Rosanne : : SysAdmin/Pres - TBI, Ltd ( inna.net ) : : The Middle Peninsula's Internet Connection : +-----------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 21:42:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA28099 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:42:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA28094 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:42:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA14565; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:41:51 -0700 (PDT) To: Howard Lew cc: Randy Berndt , Mike Burgett , "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 11 Aug 1997 20:58:49 PDT." Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:41:51 -0700 Message-ID: <14561.871360911@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > 2) I have ran a K6-200 as a FreeBSD box and it does run fine, but I am > not the type who does make worlds so I can't tell you if it really/really Yikes! Then you really haven't tested it and we don't know if this config is just as bad as the others, simply undetected yet. > Anyway my configuration responses. Anyone want to keep a record of them > all? It would be nicer if we could post a final checkmark next to this which says: "Works with FreeBSD, Y/N: ", otherwise I can't much see much point at all in this exercise - all you're going to wind up as a set of configs with no idea as to which work and which don't. Again, I wouldn't NOT check off any box as "working" until it has passed at least 3 consecutive make worlds. David has gotten the K6/166 we got to replace thud to do an occasional make world, but "occasional" is the operative word here and we certainly consider that configuration to be highly defective as a result. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 22:11:03 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA29577 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:11:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA29572 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:11:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmnsens (cmnsens.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.2]) by dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id WAA07110 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:11:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708120511.WAA07110@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: "Mike Burgett" To: "hardware@freebsd.org" Date: Mon, 11 Aug 97 22:10:59 -0700 Reply-To: "Mike Burgett" Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 1.92 For OS/2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: More K6 info... Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I don't know what insight might be gleaned from it, but I've seen the following types of errors in my numereous attempts to build: I've seen (I think) at least these different failures: signal 10 or 11 in cc, make or as Also, I've seen it choke on code in a .c, .s or temporary compiler file in /var/tmp, where it looks like it 'misread' the file (i.e., the error was bogus...) --Mike From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 22:16:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA29889 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:16:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sabre.goldsword.com (sabre.goldsword.com [199.170.202.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA29879 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:16:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jfarmer@localhost) by sabre.goldsword.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA05117; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:18:38 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:18:38 -0400 (EDT) From: "John T. Farmer" Message-Id: <199708120518.BAA05117@sabre.goldsword.com> To: hlew@www2.shoppersnet.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? Cc: hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, jfarmer@goldsword.com, mburgett@cmnsens.zoom.com, rberndt@nething.com Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 11 Aug 1997 21:41:51 -0700 "Jordan K. Hubbard" said: >It would be nicer if we could post a final checkmark next to this >which says: "Works with FreeBSD, Y/N: ", otherwise I can't much see >much point at all in this exercise - all you're going to wind up as >a set of configs with no idea as to which work and which don't. > >Again, I wouldn't NOT check off any box as "working" until it has >passed at least 3 consecutive make worlds. David has gotten the >K6/166 we got to replace thud to do an occasional make world, but >"occasional" is the operative word here and we certainly consider that >configuration to be highly defective as a result. > > Jordan I think that table listed does answer the question. The questions that I have are: 1.) what kernel (custom vs. generic) is being used by those that seem to have gotten it working 2.) If you build a kernel _elsewhere_, does the K6 configuration run ok? I.e., if I build a kernel for an apache webserver using my K5 and then install that on a K6 system, will it work? (& how stable is it?) 3.) Does anybody have any clues as to what excatly is dieing in the "make world" process? John (Who has questions instead of finishing the proposal he should be working on...) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- John T. Farmer Proprietor, GoldSword Systems jfarmer@goldsword.com Public Internet Access in East Tennessee dial-in (423)470-9953 for info, e-mail to info@goldsword.com Network Design, Internet Services & Servers, Consulting From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 22:47:46 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA01499 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:47:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA01492 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:47:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmnsens (cmnsens.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.2]) by dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id WAA07363 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:47:39 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708120547.WAA07363@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: "Mike Burgett" To: "hardware@freebsd.org" Date: Mon, 11 Aug 97 22:47:38 -0700 Reply-To: "Mike Burgett" Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 1.92 For OS/2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:31:52 -0400 (EDT), Thomas Arnold wrote: >> CPU Model: K6-166 ( 1st edition, got two days after intro ) >> Motherboard: Machspeed VX motherboard >> Chipset: VX >> L2 Cache: 512k Pipeline Burst >> System Memory: 128megs SDRAM >> HD Controller: Onboard UMC IDE >> Hard Drives: Western Digital 1.7gig IDE >> Bios: AMD Latest upgrade. >> Switching/Linear VRM: Linear. >> HS Grease Applied: Yes. >> Fan Type: Master Cooler >> Make World: Yes. No problems. >> General FreeBSD Stuff: Yes. No problems. >> FreeBSD Version: 2.2.2 Interesting. (AMD bios?) Different chipset, different type of disk controller, different type of memory. I'll confess my ignorance on the matter, does FreeBSD do busmastering of IDE? Given the type of errors I've seen, posted earlier, they *could* all be caused by a small flake in DMA handling, or cache invalidation. --Mike From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Aug 11 23:41:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA04503 for hardware-outgoing; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 23:41:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tyger.inna.net (root@tyger.inna.net [206.151.66.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA04494 for ; Mon, 11 Aug 1997 23:41:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from caught.inna.net (caught.inna.net [206.151.66.7]) by tyger.inna.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA11568; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 02:41:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 02:41:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas Arnold To: Mike Burgett cc: "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-Reply-To: <199708120547.WAA07363@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 11 Aug 1997, Mike Burgett wrote: > On Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:31:52 -0400 (EDT), Thomas Arnold wrote: > > >> Bios: AMD Latest upgrade. > Interesting. (AMD bios?) Urk. AMI BIOS. I will finally be torturing a motherboard with the AMD640 chipset on it for more then just a couple days. Have one of the Shuttle AMD640 based boards coming in as well as a FIC PA2007 with the VIA590VP2. Hopefully -THESE- will have switching regulators unlike the last ones. +-----------------------------------------------+ : Tom Arnold - No relation to Rosanne : : SysAdmin/Pres - TBI, Ltd ( inna.net ) : : The Middle Peninsula's Internet Connection : +-----------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 00:40:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA07923 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:40:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (implode.root.com [198.145.90.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA07916 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:40:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA25806; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:42:17 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708120742.AAA25806@implode.root.com> To: "John T. Farmer" cc: hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:18:38 EDT." <199708120518.BAA05117@sabre.goldsword.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:42:17 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I think that table listed does answer the question. The questions that >I have are: > 1.) what kernel (custom vs. generic) is being used by those that > seem to have gotten it working It's not that simple. My K6-166 worked fine for 15+ make worlds for the first 2 weeks and then one day decided to become flakey and has remained flakey despite every attempt to remedy the problem - replacing everything except the CPU. All of this was with the *same* source tree. The last step would be to replace the CPU with another K6 chip, but I'm not willing to waste any more money on it at this point (nor do I have the money to waste in any case). > 3.) Does anybody have any clues as to what excatly is dieing in the > "make world" process? When CPUs are non-idle for extended periods (such as what occurs during a "make world"), they get hot. My K6 appears to have developed a sensitivity to heat and giant heat sinks with thermal compound can't keep it cool enough to be reliable. It dies anywhere from 1 hour to 2.25 hours into the make world, depending on the quality of the heat sink, how warm the room is at the time, and the phase of the moon. Dies in this case means that a process exited with a a weird syntax error or a sig-11. -DG David Greenman Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 01:36:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA10418 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:36:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ha1.rdc1.sdca.home.com (siteadm@ha1.rdc1.sdca.home.com [24.0.3.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA10413 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:36:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from home.com ([24.0.130.58]) by ha1.rdc1.sdca.home.com (Netscape Mail Server v2.02) with ESMTP id AAA24919; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:36:15 -0700 Message-ID: <33F020AB.E496E193@home.com> Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:36:59 -0700 From: Marty Gordon Organization: @Home X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02b7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Thomas Arnold CC: Mike Burgett , "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk After checking out Tom's Hardware Page, I was rather interested in the FIC PA2007 and the VP2 chipset. Of course no store in San Diego had ever heard of First International. However, much to my suprize, one of the stores that I happened to speak to the Sales Manager regarding FIC, started advertising several FIC boards a few weeks later. I'm hoping the PA2007 turns out to be as good as Tom thinks it is and better than John Milfords experience (8/11/97 msg) with his PA2011. Thomas Arnold wrote: > > On Mon, 11 Aug 1997, Mike Burgett wrote: > > > On Tue, 12 Aug 1997 00:31:52 -0400 (EDT), Thomas Arnold wrote: > > > > >> Bios: AMD Latest upgrade. > > Interesting. (AMD bios?) > > Urk. AMI BIOS. > > I will finally be torturing a motherboard with the AMD640 chipset on it > for more then just a couple days. Have one of the Shuttle AMD640 based > boards coming in as well as a FIC PA2007 with the VIA590VP2. Hopefully > -THESE- will have switching regulators unlike the last ones. > > +-----------------------------------------------+ > : Tom Arnold - No relation to Rosanne : > : SysAdmin/Pres - TBI, Ltd ( inna.net ) : > : The Middle Peninsula's Internet Connection : > +-----------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 01:38:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA10465 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:38:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lituus.fr (lituussun.lituus.fr [195.25.51.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA10459 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 01:38:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [195.25.51.10] (stephane.lituus.fr [195.25.51.10]) by lituus.fr (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA00667 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 10:36:42 +0100 (WET DST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 10:38:47 +0200 To: hardware@FreeBSD.ORG From: stephane@e2c.com (Stephane Legrand) Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> 3.) Does anybody have any clues as to what excatly is dieing in the >> "make world" process? > > When CPUs are non-idle for extended periods (such as what occurs during >a "make world"), they get hot. My K6 appears to have developed a sensitivity >to heat and giant heat sinks with thermal compound can't keep it cool enough >to be reliable. It dies anywhere from 1 hour to 2.25 hours into the make >world, depending on the quality of the heat sink, how warm the room is at >the time, and the phase of the moon. Dies in this case means that a process >exited with a a weird syntax error or a sig-11. > So, the problem with the K6 would be caused by heat problem when the CPU are heavily load during a long time ? Simply a suggestion, but may be a test like several parallel intensive POV calculations (or others intensive CPU operations) during some hours should lead to the same errors and should definitely show that the problem come from the CPU and not from FreeBSD, no ? Just my 0.02$ :) *** I'M LOOKING FOR A JOB IN COMPUTER SCIENCE *** *** If you are interested --> http://www.lituus.fr/stephane/ *** - To save the Internet, stop using Micro$oft softwares NOW ! - Do you want a REAL OS ? -> http://www.freebsd.org/ From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 06:22:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA20841 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 06:22:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sabre.goldsword.com (sabre.goldsword.com [199.170.202.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA20833 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 06:22:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jfarmer@localhost) by sabre.goldsword.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA05886; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 09:24:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 09:24:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "John T. Farmer" Message-Id: <199708121324.JAA05886@sabre.goldsword.com> To: hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, stephane@e2c.com Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? Cc: jfarmer@goldsword.com Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 12 Aug 1997 10:38:47 +0200 (Stephane Legrand) said: >>> 3.) Does anybody have any clues as to what excatly is dieing in the >>> "make world" process? >> >> When CPUs are non-idle for extended periods (such as what occurs during >>a "make world"), they get hot. My K6 appears to have developed a sensitivity >>to heat and giant heat sinks with thermal compound can't keep it cool enough >>to be reliable. It dies anywhere from 1 hour to 2.25 hours into the make >>world, depending on the quality of the heat sink, how warm the room is at >>the time, and the phase of the moon. Dies in this case means that a process >>exited with a a weird syntax error or a sig-11. >> > >So, the problem with the K6 would be caused by heat problem when the CPU >are heavily load during a long time ? > >Simply a suggestion, but may be a test like several parallel intensive POV >calculations (or others intensive CPU operations) during some hours should >lead to the same errors and should definitely show that the problem come >from the CPU and not from FreeBSD, no ? > >Just my 0.02$ :) > This is what I was getting at. So far, everybody has had a problem with doing "make world" after some period of time. To get AMD to pay attention, they need to see that it's a problem that's _not_ tied to any specific action in the make world itself, but something within the chip or it's operating environment. If it is a heat related problem with boards that are supposed to be approved for use with the K6, well, we may get the "It works fine under NT & 95..." argument. Ie, the average user doesn't impose the same load on their cpu that we're talking about. Sigh. I really like using the K5 chips in my servers & was looking forward to the performance of the K6. If it can't run load under 7x24 conditions, then it's _not_ an option for me. Anybody know how the Cyrix chips hold up under heavy server usage conditions? John (Who doesn't want to go back to "Intel Inside"...) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- John T. Farmer Proprietor, GoldSword Systems jfarmer@goldsword.com Public Internet Access in East Tennessee dial-in (423)470-9953 for info, e-mail to info@goldsword.com Network Design, Internet Services & Servers, Consulting From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 09:35:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA02667 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 09:35:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA02655 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 09:35:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (jwm@localhost) by soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA05752; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 09:35:35 -0700 Message-Id: <199708121635.JAA05752@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> To: "John T. Farmer" Cc: hardware@freebsd.org, stephane@e2c.com, jfarmer@goldsword.com Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-reply-to: Message from "John T. Farmer" of "Tue, 12 Aug 1997 09:24:27 EDT." <199708121324.JAA05886@sabre.goldsword.com> Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 09:35:17 -0700 From: John Milford Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "John T. Farmer" wrote: > Anybody know how the Cyrix chips hold up under heavy server usage conditions? I have 2 servers based on Cyrix P166+ chips, and they have been rock solid. I Have not had experience with the low voltage (2.8v) Cyrix chips yet. One of these servers was run for about 3 days straight with parallel kernel builds, but unfortunately have not done a make world on any of them yet. I'l try it today with all this interest in K6 and make world I am curious. > > John (Who doesn't want to go back to "Intel Inside"...) > John (Who understands that completely) From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 11:09:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA07960 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 11:09:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lightning.tbe.net (qmailr@lightning.tbe.net [208.208.122.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA07955 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 11:09:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 14014 invoked by uid 1010); 12 Aug 1997 18:03:32 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 14:03:31 -0400 (EDT) From: "Gary D. Margiotta" To: John Milford cc: "John T. Farmer" , hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, stephane@e2c.com, jfarmer@goldsword.com Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-Reply-To: <199708121635.JAA05752@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Anybody know how the Cyrix chips hold up under heavy server usage conditions? > > I have 2 servers based on Cyrix P166+ chips, and they have > been rock solid. I Have not had experience with the low voltage > (2.8v) Cyrix chips yet. One of these servers was run for about 3 days > straight with parallel kernel builds, but unfortunately have not > done a make world on any of them yet. I'l try it today with all > this interest in K6 and make world I am curious. I'll second that... We have several Cyrix 166+'s and a few 150+'s and have never had a problem. I know that they are only 5-series and not 6-, but they are very stable nontheless. We just bought a couple 2.9v and are running on a combination of Gigabyte and Asus boards (mostly GA586HX and T2P4's). One of the 166+'s is in a webserver that pulls near 100K hits/day, and shows no load and never complains (did I ever say I love FreeBSD? ;) ). I'm going to try a make world on my personal 150+ and I'll see how it fares. The performance of the 5-series is definately equal or better thatn the same Intel, except for the heavy math-intensive apps, which Intel still has the upper hand. But, with the price gap of almost $100, I'll wait the extra second or two. Just my $.02 ;) ______________________________________________________________ -Gary Margiotta Voice: (973) 835-8811 TBE Internet Services Fax: (973) 256-4605 http://www.tbe.net E-Mail: gary@tbe.net From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 14:10:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA20646 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 14:10:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA20628 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 14:10:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id OAA23110 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 14:09:39 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id RAA04003; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 17:09:36 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id RAA02333; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 17:09:15 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by compound.east.sun.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id QAA16691; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 16:04:55 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 16:04:55 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199708122104.QAA16691@compound.east.sun.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: hardware@freebsd.org Subject: SIS5571 X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk A number of nicely featured MBs now exist SIS5571 "trinity" PCI. How well does this set work with FBSD? Any complications with respect to newly supportable fast EIDE modes? Any cachable memory size limitations? From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 19:02:58 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA09296 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 19:02:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA09282 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 19:02:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmnsens (cmnsens.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.2]) by dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with SMTP id TAA12714 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 19:02:45 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708130202.TAA12714@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: "Mike Burgett" To: "hardware@freebsd.org" Date: Tue, 12 Aug 97 19:02:45 -0700 Reply-To: "Mike Burgett" Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 1.92 For OS/2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: AMD tech support response, re: K6 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From my last exchange with AMD tech support, WRT FreeBSD 'make world' failures. (I had suggested they set up a FreeBSD system in their lab...) > We are currently looking into this issue for you. I will keep you > posted this issue. I'm not sure how long it will take, but I'll let you > know as soon as I find out. Again, thanks for your patience and trying > an approved board. > > AMD Technical Service Center > -- Hopefully, this isn't just smoke, and they're really going to check into it... --Mike From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 19:17:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA10406 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 19:17:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from istari.home.net (cc158233-a.catv1.md.home.com [24.3.25.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA10398 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 19:17:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sjr@localhost) by istari.home.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) id WAA10985 for freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 22:17:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 22:17:05 -0400 (EDT) From: "Stephen J. Roznowski" Message-Id: <199708130217.WAA10985@istari.home.net> To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Intel EtherExpress PRO/10 vice PRO/10+ Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Currently, the sys/i386/isa/if_ex.c driver only seems to support the Intel EtherExpress Pro/10, and not the Pro/10+. Does anyone know the difference between these two devices, and is a patch available to upgrade this driver? Thanks, Stephen J. Roznowski (sjr@home.net) From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 20:57:37 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA17917 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 20:57:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www2.shoppersnet.com (shoppersnet.com [204.156.152.112]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA17912 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 20:57:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from hlew@localhost) by www2.shoppersnet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA23419; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 21:02:16 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 21:02:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Howard Lew To: Mike Burgett cc: "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: More K6 info... In-Reply-To: <199708120511.WAA07110@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 11 Aug 1997, Mike Burgett wrote: > I don't know what insight might be gleaned from it, but I've seen the > following types of errors in my numereous attempts to build: > > I've seen (I think) at least these different failures: > > signal 10 or 11 in cc, make or as > > Also, I've seen it choke on code in a .c, .s or temporary compiler file in > /var/tmp, where it looks like it 'misread' the file (i.e., the error was > bogus...) Hmmm... I have done some reading in the chips newsgroup and someone mentioned that running the K6-233 had a real cool heatsink when running NT4 but was burning hot with Win95. There is talk that this maybe because NT uses the "halt" instruction when the cpu idles. This may explain why some people with FreeBSD have said that make world fails after about 1.5 hours or so. I guess if the issue is heat-related then there are several options: 1) Use a Peltier cooler on the K6 if you need to keep it working hard all the time. Would a Cyrix 6x86 fan do? 2) Implement a "halt" like feature in the kernel configuration for the K6 (don't know if this is possible though) 3) Run the K6 at a lower speed (not a popular idea of course and won't work for 166 users)... Perhaps the new 233-300 will be better... According to FreeTech's web site, the new K6-233, 266, and 300s will use 4.15, 4.75, and 5.40 Amps and run at 2.00V so they should run much cooler. This is in contrast to the 6.25, 7.5, and 9.5 Amps that the 166, 200, and 233 require now. http://www.freetech.com/INFO/97T/97t02.htm From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Aug 12 22:08:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA21794 for hardware-outgoing; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 22:08:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (implode.root.com [198.145.90.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA21789 for ; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 22:08:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from implode.root.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by implode.root.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA07767; Tue, 12 Aug 1997 22:10:28 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708130510.WAA07767@implode.root.com> To: Howard Lew cc: "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: More K6 info... In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Aug 1997 21:02:15 PDT." From: David Greenman Reply-To: dg@root.com Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1997 22:10:28 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I guess if the issue is heat-related then there are several options: > >1) Use a Peltier cooler on the K6 if you need to keep it working hard all >the time. Would a Cyrix 6x86 fan do? I tried that and it helped more than just a regular heat sink, but not as well as an extra large heat sink. I'm not happy with the thermal coupling of the Peltier device that I used, so perhaps it would work better if it wasn't attached with thermal tape (e.g. use thermal compound instead). The heat sink alone solutions I used all had an appropriate amount of thermal compound. >2) Implement a "halt" like feature in the kernel configuration for the K6 >(don't know if this is possible though) We already do, but when the system is busy, you aren't halted very often, so the effect of this is minor. -DG David Greenman Core-team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Aug 13 12:36:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA23091 for hardware-outgoing; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 12:36:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA23086 for ; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 12:36:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from East.Sun.COM ([129.148.1.241]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id MAA09548; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 12:36:17 -0700 Received: from suneast.East.Sun.COM by East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id PAA14763; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 15:36:14 -0400 Received: from compound.east.sun.com by suneast.East.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA23309; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 15:36:14 -0400 Received: (from alk@localhost) by compound.east.sun.com (8.8.6/8.7.3) id OAA20096; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:37:33 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:37:33 -0500 (CDT) Reply-To: Anthony.Kimball@East.Sun.COM Message-Id: <199708131937.OAA20096@compound.east.sun.com> From: Tony Kimball MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: jfarmer@sabre.goldsword.com Cc: hardware@FreeBSD.ORG, richard@pegasus.com Subject: Re: Compaq ProLiant systems -- problems? References: <199708061632.MAA20834@sabre.goldsword.com> X-Face: O9M"E%K;(f-Go/XDxL+pCxI5*gr[=FN@Y`cl1.Tn Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth John T. Farmer on Wed, 6 August: : : The problem I run into is that Compaq & Dell are so beloved by : "corporate America!" It's similar to to the old "Nobody ever got fired : for buying IBM" in my mainframe days... There's no problem running FBSD on a Compaq or Dell server. If they are using some oddball SCSI controller in the models under consideration, just spec a well-known aftermarket controller. Justification: Use an external enclosure, and you can get hot-swap. Very nice. From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Aug 13 14:23:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA28511 for hardware-outgoing; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:23:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from DonaldBurr.DonaldBurr.dyn.ml.org (ppp6232.la.inreach.net [199.107.160.232]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA28506; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:23:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dburr@localhost) by DonaldBurr.DonaldBurr.dyn.ml.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA14187; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:23:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: DonaldBurr.DonaldBurr.dyn.ml.org: dburr owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 14:23:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Donald Burr X-Sender: dburr@DonaldBurr.DonaldBurr.dyn.ml.org To: FreeBSD Mobile cc: FreeBSD Hardware Subject: suypport for IBM Home and away Modem+ethernet combo card? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'd like to use my IBM Home and Away PCMCIA adapter (This is a combo 14.4 Modem / Ethernet card) on my laptop. I don't care about the 14.4 modem part of the card, all I'm interested in is the Ethernet. I took a look at the "PAO" package (http://www.jp.FreeBSD.org/PAO/) but it did not mention my card as one of the supported ones. I also took a look at the if_ze.c and if_zp.c drivers builtin to the kernel, and they did not appear to support my card either. I'm running FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE. I can upgrade to 3.0 or whatever if necessary, but I'd rather not (transferring it over PLIP is a major pain!) Incidentally, there is a Linux driver for this card, which works rather well (I ran Linux before I discovered FreeBSD, and I'd rather not go back to it -- I like FreeBSD better! :) ) Please respond by email if possible. Thanks! Donald Burr - Ask me for my PGP key | PGP: Your WWW HomePage: http://DonaldBurr.base.org/ ICQ #1347455 | right to Address: P.O. Box 91212, Santa Barbara, CA 93190-1212 | 'Net privacy. Phone: (805) 957-9666 FAX: (800) 492-5954 | USE IT. From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Aug 13 18:20:12 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA12268 for hardware-outgoing; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 18:20:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fly.HiWAAY.net (fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA12256 for ; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 18:20:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (tnt1-19.HiWAAY.net [208.147.147.19]) by fly.HiWAAY.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id UAA08649 for ; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 20:19:31 -0500 (CDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nospam.hiwaay.net (8.8.6/8.8.4) with ESMTP id TAA17173 for ; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 19:48:24 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199708140048.TAA17173@nospam.hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "hardware@freebsd.org" From: dkelly@hiwaay.net Subject: Re: AMD tech support response, re: K6 In-reply-to: Message from "Mike Burgett" of "Tue, 12 Aug 1997 19:02:45 PDT." <199708130202.TAA12714@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 19:48:24 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >From my last exchange with AMD tech support, WRT FreeBSD 'make world' > failures. (I had suggested they set up a FreeBSD system in their lab...) > > > We are currently looking into this issue for you. I will keep you > > posted this issue. I'm not sure how long it will take, but I'll let you > > know as soon as I find out. Again, thanks for your patience and trying > > an approved board. > > > > AMD Technical Service Center > > -- > > Hopefully, this isn't just smoke, and they're really going to check into it... Would bet DG would be happy to loan AMD his known-bad K6. :-) And even happier to get a good one in exchange. -- David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@hiwaay.net ===================================================================== The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its capacity -- the rest is overhead for the operating system. From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Aug 13 18:22:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA12451 for hardware-outgoing; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 18:22:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fly.HiWAAY.net (root@fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA12198 for ; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 18:19:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (tnt1-19.HiWAAY.net [208.147.147.19]) by fly.HiWAAY.net (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id UAA06875 for ; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 20:19:29 -0500 (CDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nospam.hiwaay.net (8.8.6/8.8.4) with ESMTP id TAA17163 for ; Wed, 13 Aug 1997 19:45:51 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199708140045.TAA17163@nospam.hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0zeta 7/24/97 To: "hardware@freebsd.org" From: dkelly@hiwaay.net Subject: Re: More K6 info... In-reply-to: Message from David Greenman of "Tue, 12 Aug 1997 22:10:28 PDT." <199708130510.WAA07767@implode.root.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1997 19:45:51 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >2) Implement a "halt" like feature in the kernel configuration for the K6 > >(don't know if this is possible though) > > We already do, but when the system is busy, you aren't halted very often, > so the effect of this is minor. So that sounds like a good way to break (cook) it: hack the halt out of a kernel and watch it fail faster. Or maybe the failure is coming out of halt... Sounds like my forthcoming upgrade will not be an AMD K6. Am waffling between Cyrix 6x86MX, Pentium (maybe MSX), and Pentium Pro 150 or 180. Any recommendations for a FreeBSD-only system? If I go socket 7 then Tyan Tomcat IV will most likely be my MB. -- David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@hiwaay.net ===================================================================== The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its capacity -- the rest is overhead for the operating system. From owner-freebsd-hardware Thu Aug 14 06:33:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA17247 for hardware-outgoing; Thu, 14 Aug 1997 06:33:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cre8tivegroup.com (abt6.bitwise.net [204.97.222.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA17240; Thu, 14 Aug 1997 06:32:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [204.255.227.117] by mail.cre8tivegroup.com (SMTPD32-3.04) id A99668CE0376; Thu, 14 Aug 1997 09:35:18 -0400 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.0 [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 09:30:40 -0400 (EDT) Organization: The Creative Group From: Patrick Gardella To: Donald Burr Subject: RE: suypport for IBM Home and away Modem+ethernet combo card? Cc: FreeBSD Hardware Cc: FreeBSD Hardware , FreeBSD Mobile Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Donald, I tried to use that card to no avail. I hacked around with the tuples, and eventually gave up. I went out and bought Accton card. PAO as you said, does not support this card. I went ahead and sent the card information to the PAO team. But since this is a closeout card, I don't think they will do much with it. (I got mine from Damark for like $30). Patrick On 13-Aug-97 Donald Burr wrote: >I'd like to use my IBM Home and Away PCMCIA adapter (This is a combo 14.4 >Modem / Ethernet card) on my laptop. I don't care about the 14.4 modem >part of the card, all I'm interested in is the Ethernet. > >I took a look at the "PAO" package (http://www.jp.FreeBSD.org/PAO/) but it >did not mention my card as one of the supported ones. I also took a look >at the if_ze.c and if_zp.c drivers builtin to the kernel, and they did not >appear to support my card either. > >I'm running FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE. I can upgrade to 3.0 or whatever if >necessary, but I'd rather not (transferring it over PLIP is a major pain!) > >Incidentally, there is a Linux driver for this card, which works rather >well (I ran Linux before I discovered FreeBSD, and I'd rather not go back >to it -- I like FreeBSD better! :) ) > >Please respond by email if possible. Thanks! > >Donald Burr - Ask me for my PGP key | PGP: Your >WWW HomePage: http://DonaldBurr.base.org/ ICQ #1347455 | right to >Address: P.O. Box 91212, Santa Barbara, CA 93190-1212 | 'Net privacy. >Phone: (805) 957-9666 FAX: (800) 492-5954 | USE IT. ---------------------------------- E-Mail: Patrick Gardella Date: 14-Aug-97 Time: 09:30:40 This message was sent by XFMail ---------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hardware Thu Aug 14 09:34:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA27810 for hardware-outgoing; Thu, 14 Aug 1997 09:34:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mindcrime.termfrost.org (root@mindcrime.termfrost.org [208.141.2.81]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA27772 for ; Thu, 14 Aug 1997 09:34:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mandrews@localhost) by mindcrime.termfrost.org (8.8.6/8.8.6/mindcrime-19970604) with SMTP id MAA07938 for ; Thu, 14 Aug 1997 12:33:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 12:33:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Andrews To: hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-Reply-To: <199708120518.BAA05117@sabre.goldsword.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'll throw in my two cents on this... Running Intel Pentium 120 and 133 chips on the same boards worked fine. I bought two Asus T2P4 boards and two K6-200's. The K6's were backordered, and so I ran an Intel Pentium 120 and 133 in the boards. No problems with "make world". Once the K6's were installed, I started having the same problems everyone else here has: 'as' getting corrupt input and dying, gcc internal errors, sig 11's, sig 6's.... you name it. One of the machines also had Windows 95 on it, and I noticed many more GPFs than even usual... Even DOS-extender programs, like MAME, started to misbehave and crash. I decided pretty quickly that it didn't have anything to do with FreeBSD... I had my vendor get me a third MB/CPU, this time as a PRETESTED set from his vendor. Much to my surprise, the thing worked. Even more to my surprise was that there wasn't any heat sink paste on it, and I'd also forgotten to plug the CPU fan in. Yet it had survived half a dozen make worlds. Weird... I started swapping chips and fans around, and found at first that the first two chips would run great in the new board, but after a few swaps even the known good chip started to fail, even after everything was restored exactly the way it had been on the pretest set. Argh. By the time I'd gotten done doing all this, Intel had dropped their prices... so I (very grudgingly!) returned the pretest set and the other two K6's, and got a pair of P200-MMX's. Even overclocked to 225mhz (3x75), they've passed every torture test I can throw at it, including many dozens of "make world"s. Specifics: CPU Model: K6-200 Motherboard: Asus P/I P55T2P4 v3.10 Chipset: 430HX L2 Cache: 512K System Memory: 64M true parity (tried with 32M EDO also) HD Controller: Asus SC875 (NCR 53c875) Hard Drives: Seagate ST15230N, Quantum Fireball TM3200S [System #1] Hard Drives: IBM DORS 32160 [System #2] Bios: Award v0203 (first K6-supporting rev) Switching/Linear VRM: dunno, I assume linear based on what I've read HS Grease Applied: usually; see above Fan Type: a green one that came in a pink box :) Don't know the manufacturer exactly, sorry Make World: fails w/ sig 11's or with 'as' dying on garbage input Also stability problems in Win95 General FreeBSD Stuff: occasional sig 11's outside of make world FreeBSD Version: 2.2-STABLE -- Mike Andrews (MA12) network & systems guy, Digital Crescent, Frankfort KY -- mandrews@dcr.net -- mandrews@termfrost.org -- http://www.termfrost.org/ -- "Evil shall always prevail over good, because evil has better marketing..." -- Sick of junk e-mail? Visit http://www.cauce.org/ or http://spam.abuse.net/ From owner-freebsd-hardware Thu Aug 14 12:13:29 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA06553 for hardware-outgoing; Thu, 14 Aug 1997 12:13:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www2.shoppersnet.com (shoppersnet.com [204.156.152.112]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA06547 for ; Thu, 14 Aug 1997 12:13:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from hlew@localhost) by www2.shoppersnet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA29860; Thu, 14 Aug 1997 12:17:31 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 14 Aug 1997 12:17:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Howard Lew To: Mike Andrews cc: hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: K6-200 Has anyone successfully done a 'make world' ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 14 Aug 1997, Mike Andrews wrote: > I'll throw in my two cents on this... > > Running Intel Pentium 120 and 133 chips on the same boards worked fine. > I bought two Asus T2P4 boards and two K6-200's. The K6's were > backordered, and so I ran an Intel Pentium 120 and 133 in the boards. No > problems with "make world". Once the K6's were installed, I started > having the same problems everyone else here has: 'as' getting corrupt > input and dying, gcc internal errors, sig 11's, sig 6's.... you name it. > > One of the machines also had Windows 95 on it, and I noticed many more > GPFs than even usual... Even DOS-extender programs, like MAME, started to > misbehave and crash. I decided pretty quickly that it didn't have > anything to do with FreeBSD... > Hmmm... you definitely should not get GPFs in Win 95. Something else is flaky (MB?). > I had my vendor get me a third MB/CPU, this time as a PRETESTED set from > his vendor. Much to my surprise, the thing worked. Even more to my > surprise was that there wasn't any heat sink paste on it, and I'd also > forgotten to plug the CPU fan in. Yet it had survived half a dozen make > worlds. Weird... okay, sounds like it works when you first get it. 3 identical Asus MBs? > > I started swapping chips and fans around, and found at first that the > first two chips would run great in the new board, but after a few swaps > even the known good chip started to fail, even after everything was > restored exactly the way it had been on the pretest set. Argh. If this was all done scientifically and no errors were made in the experiment, here is a summary: 1) The first 2 original K6 cpus when paired with the 2 Asus MBs had problems. Could most likely be a MB or CPU problem. 2) The 3rd K6 paired with another Asus MB ran fine doing make-world at first. (control) 3) When you take the 2 "make world-failed" K6 cpus and pop them in this 3rd board, make-world works. Hmmm.... 4) But after swapping the cpus around none will work with even the 3rd MB. Let's look at the experiment. #2 tells us that we have one combination (mb + cpu) that seems to work fine. This is the control. #3 tells us that the first 2 cpus that failed the make-world test can pass the make-world test with a new motherboard (in other words, the cpu was not damaged, and most likely the problem with the first 2 cpu-mb sets were 2 bad MBs). #4 may be explained by reasoning that perhaps something has changed again with the 3rd MB (3rd MB is now damaged). I don't want to say that the K6 is a Asus MB killer, but it seems that everyone who has been complaining about the K6 failing make-world has been using Asus MBs. Yes, Asus is a high end board manufacturer, but there is probably a problem with compatibility with the K6 cpu. Although to some swapping the K6 cpu for a Pentium MMX seems to solve the problem, this may not be quite valid here because it does not hold all things equal. The 2 cpus have different electrical needs and are architecturally different. I have seen weirder cases that indicate that swapping a cpu is not a particularly good "control." For example, when the FreeTech F63T MB came out, the AMD K5, Pentium and Cyrix 6x86 were also available. With the onboard 256K Pipeline Burst Cache no one complained about any problems with the K5, Pentium, or Cyrix 6x86. But some people wanted 512K of PBC. For some reason the MB would work with the K5 and Pentium fine even with 512K, but the moment we swapped in a Cyrix 6x86, it would GPF in Win 95. It turns out this dual-banked cache memory was not compatible with the Cyrix even though it works fine on the K5 and Pentium. Because our distributor did not carry the Cyrix, they said it was a crappy cpu because it did not work with their mb. We even replaced the original board with identical ones and they too had the same problem with the Cyrix 6x86. I was suspicious if it were not true that we had another brand that was using 512K and did not have problems with the same Cyrix 6x86 chips. After talking with the MB manufacturer tech support, they said the cache modules we were getting are not compatible with the Cyrix 6x86 even though they work with the other 2 brands because of the way the MB is designed and cpu differences. The solution was to get LiteOn or Winbond modules (We originally used the UMC ones that came from our same distributor.) And after we replaced them with LiteOn ones everything worked rock solid with 512K for all those 6x86 customers. The moral is that I am not saying the Asus MB is bad; it just may have a compatibility issue with the K6 and swapping the cpu does not necessarily make all things equal. > > By the time I'd gotten done doing all this, Intel had dropped their > prices... so I (very grudgingly!) returned the pretest set and the other > two K6's, and got a pair of P200-MMX's. Even overclocked to 225mhz > (3x75), they've passed every torture test I can throw at it, including > many dozens of "make world"s. This probably tells us despite the fact the MBs no longer work with the K6, they still work fine with the Pentium 200MMXs. > > Specifics: > > CPU Model: K6-200 > Motherboard: Asus P/I P55T2P4 v3.10 > Chipset: 430HX > L2 Cache: 512K > System Memory: 64M true parity (tried with 32M EDO also) > HD Controller: Asus SC875 (NCR 53c875) > Hard Drives: Seagate ST15230N, Quantum Fireball TM3200S [System #1] > Hard Drives: IBM DORS 32160 [System #2] > Bios: Award v0203 (first K6-supporting rev) > Switching/Linear VRM: dunno, I assume linear based on what I've read A linear voltage regulator on your MB will most likely look like a big heatsink on the MB. A switching voltage regulator on the other hand looks like a coil around a ceramic washer the size of "Certs" candy. In the past, I have learned that if the voltage regulator (i.e. linear) on the motherboard (i.e. FIC PA2002) gets too hot (i.e. original Cyrix 6x86s), you will all kinds of weird stability problems due to its inability to get rid of the heat. That's why there was a big fus about having special cpu fans oriented in a way to blow air at the voltage regulator of the motherboard. This heat problem is unrelated to the heat problems of a cpu heatsink. But nowadays switching VRs solve this problem. > HS Grease Applied: usually; see above > Fan Type: a green one that came in a pink box :) Don't know > the manufacturer exactly, sorry > Make World: fails w/ sig 11's or with 'as' dying on garbage input > Also stability problems in Win95 > General FreeBSD Stuff: occasional sig 11's outside of make world > FreeBSD Version: 2.2-STABLE > > > -- Mike Andrews (MA12) network & systems guy, Digital Crescent, Frankfort KY > -- mandrews@dcr.net -- mandrews@termfrost.org -- http://www.termfrost.org/ > -- "Evil shall always prevail over good, because evil has better marketing..." > -- Sick of junk e-mail? Visit http://www.cauce.org/ or http://spam.abuse.net/ > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Shoppers Network (Support) AMD K5/K6s, Cyrix 6x86, Intel Pentiums/Pro Phone: (415) 759-8584 Email: howard@shoppersnet.com ==============================> WWW - http://www.shoppersnet.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 03:01:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA18850 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 03:01:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from soleil.uvsq.fr (soleil.uvsq.fr [193.51.24.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA18827; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 03:01:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from guillotin.prism.uvsq.fr (guillotin.prism.uvsq.fr [193.51.25.1]) by soleil.uvsq.fr (8.8.6/jtpda-5.2) with ESMTP id MAA11339 ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 12:01:40 +0200 (METDST) Received: from coreff (rtc104.reseau.uvsq.fr [193.51.24.20]) by guillotin.prism.uvsq.fr (8.8.4/jtpda-5.2) with SMTP id MAA03862 ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 12:01:37 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <33F43E94.41C67EA6@prism.uvsq.fr> Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 11:33:40 +0000 From: Nicolas Souchu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: FreeBSD hackers CC: FreeBSD hardware Subject: Parallel port developpements - ppbus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi there! ppbus (Parallel port bus) brings generic functions for peripherial detection and parallel port sharing. This generic support for the parallel port allows us to port the existing Linux drivers develpped by the Linux-parport Team. see http://www.torque.net/linux-pp.html for more info. The code is under the GPL... of course. These drivers are mostly maintained by: Philip Blundell and Grant R. Guenther First, _stable_ drivers may be ported and later others if their spec become available (or if somebody is happy to hack them :) You may want to contribute... The existing ppi (Parallel port interface on ppbus) supports loadable kernel modules. ;) Anyway, tell us which parallel-port-hardware should be first ported. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- nicolas -- Nicolas.Souchu@prism.uvsq.fr My ZIP Iomega home page... http://www.prism.uvsq.fr/~son/ppa3.html From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 03:45:00 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA20744 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 03:45:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA20729; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 03:44:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.dk.tfs.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.dk.tfs.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA05698; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 12:43:46 +0200 (CEST) To: Nicolas Souchu cc: FreeBSD hackers , FreeBSD hardware Subject: Re: Parallel port developpements - ppbus In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 15 Aug 1997 11:33:40 -0000." <33F43E94.41C67EA6@prism.uvsq.fr> Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 12:43:45 +0200 Message-ID: <5696.871641825@critter.dk.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <33F43E94.41C67EA6@prism.uvsq.fr>, Nicolas Souchu writes: >Hi there! > >ppbus (Parallel port bus) brings generic functions for peripherial >detection >and parallel port sharing. Cool! >Anyway, tell us which parallel-port-hardware should be first ported. >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well, how about parallel printers and the PLIP/LPIP support ? :-) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Power and ignorance is a disgusting cocktail. From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 04:45:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA22856 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 04:45:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from netserv1.chg.ru (netserv1.chg.ru [193.233.46.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA22838 for ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 04:44:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from itp.ac.ru (itp.ac.ru [193.233.32.4]) by netserv1.chg.ru (8.8.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id PAA01589 for ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 15:46:52 +0400 (MSD) Received: from speecart.chg.ru (speecart.chg.ru [193.233.46.2]) by itp.ac.ru (8.8.3/8.8.3) with SMTP id QAA03982 for ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 16:01:41 +0400 (MSD) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.1 [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 15:20:50 +0400 (MSD) Organization: Landau Institute for Theoretical Physics From: "Sergey S. Kosyakov" To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Barracuda speed anomaly Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi! I found very strange Seagate 4Gb & 9Gb disks speed behavio when tested with iozone and bonnie (FreeBSD-2.2.2) - 9Gb disk two times slower on writing in compare with 4Gb disk. Specification: AMD K6/233 box with Adaptec AIC7880 Ultra Wide SCSI ST-34371N Ultra-SCSI (Barracuda 4LP) 4.35Gb, external transfer rate 20 MB/sec Sync, internal transfer rate 80 - 122 Mbit/sec ST-19171N Ultra-SCSI (Barracuda 9) 9.1 Gb, external transfer rate 20 MB/sec Sync, internal transfer rate 80 - 124 Mbit/sec The 9GB disk was divided on two equal volume partitions. iozone auto bonnie Results (appr.): writing reading Barracuda 4LP 9 MB/sec 40 MB/sec(iozone) - 10 MB/sec(bonnie) Barracuda 9 4.5 MB/sec(!) 40 MB/sec - 10 MB/sec Is it FreeBSD (SCSI driver, file system, etc), Adaptec or Seagate problem ? ---------------------------------- Sergey Kosyakov Landau Institute for Theoretical Physics E-Mail: Sergey S. Kosyakov Date: 15-Aug-97 Time: 15:20:51 ---------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 06:55:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA27869 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 06:55:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bmccane.uit.net (bmccane.uit.net [209.83.205.48]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA27864 for ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 06:55:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bmccane.uit.net (localhost.mccane.com [127.0.0.1]) by bmccane.uit.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA10459 for ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 08:55:32 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199708151355.IAA10459@bmccane.uit.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 To: hardware@FreeBSD.org Subject: ISDN Modems Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 08:55:32 -0500 From: Wm Brian McCane Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, I am looking for a list of ISDN modems that are supported by FreeBSD 2.1.5 or 3.0, but I hate to have to modify skip to work with 3.0 since the customer this is for won't absorb the cost. I would prefer a modem that has compression capabilities and would allow a greater than 128K feed to go to it, for example 512K to allow better compression. I have been looking at some of the Ascend equipment, but I think I could get by cheaper using a FreeBSD box as my router, and running skip in the kernel. brian From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 09:32:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA04997 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 09:32:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA04989 for ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 09:32:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tom by misery.sdf.com with smtp (Exim 1.62 #1) id 0wzPGX-0005Gr-00; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 09:30:21 -0700 Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 09:30:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: Wm Brian McCane cc: hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Modems In-Reply-To: <199708151355.IAA10459@bmccane.uit.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 15 Aug 1997, Wm Brian McCane wrote: > Hello, > I am looking for a list of ISDN modems that are supported by FreeBSD > 2.1.5 or 3.0, but I hate to have to modify skip to work with 3.0 since the > customer this is for won't absorb the cost. I would prefer a modem that has > compression capabilities and would allow a greater than 128K feed to go to it, > for example 512K to allow better compression. I have been looking at some of > the Ascend equipment, but I think I could get by cheaper using a FreeBSD box > as my router, and running skip in the kernel. > > brian The 3COM Impact II is nice. However, FreeBSD has poor support for the high speed serial ports (230400 bps) that you need to drive these things properly. You can get serial cards with a jumper that doubles the rate internally on the card. So FreeBSD thinks the card is running at 115200, but it really running at 230400. Tom From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 11:36:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA11433 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 11:36:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from soleil.uvsq.fr (soleil.uvsq.fr [193.51.24.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA11410; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 11:36:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from guillotin.prism.uvsq.fr (guillotin.prism.uvsq.fr [193.51.25.1]) by soleil.uvsq.fr (8.8.6/jtpda-5.2) with ESMTP id UAA24472 ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 20:36:16 +0200 (METDST) Received: from coreff (rtc104.reseau.uvsq.fr [193.51.24.20]) by guillotin.prism.uvsq.fr (8.8.4/jtpda-5.2) with SMTP id UAA09130 ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 20:36:14 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <33F4BEF3.446B9B3D@prism.uvsq.fr> Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 20:41:23 +0000 From: Nicolas Souchu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.1-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Poul-Henning Kamp CC: FreeBSD hackers , FreeBSD hardware Subject: Re: Parallel port developpements - ppbus References: <5696.871641825@critter.dk.tfs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > In message <33F43E94.41C67EA6@prism.uvsq.fr>, Nicolas Souchu writes: > >Hi there! > > > >ppbus (Parallel port bus) brings generic functions for peripherial > >detection > >and parallel port sharing. > > Cool! > > >Anyway, tell us which parallel-port-hardware should be first ported. > >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Well, how about parallel printers and the PLIP/LPIP support ? :-) You're right, we should keep in mind existing good stuff :) - lpt.c has been ported (keeping code untouched, just inserting ppbus request/release func.) and must be tested About parallel printers, Anybody knows which printers are IEEE1284.1 (Transport Independent Printer Interface) compliant. What about this standard, should we implement it? - plip should of course. We want to move it to a standalone file... plip.c? nicolas -- Nicolas.Souchu@prism.uvsq.fr My ZIP Iomega home page... http://www.prism.uvsq.fr/~son/ppa3.html From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 12:55:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA15790 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 12:55:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from folco.lms.ru (folco.lms.ru [193.125.142.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA15785 for ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 12:55:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minas-tirith.lms.ru (uucp@localhost) by folco.lms.ru (8.8.5/8.6.9) with UUCP id XAA23025 for freebsd.org!hardware; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 23:55:12 +0400 (MSD) Received: from minas-tirith (tarkhil@minas-tirith [127.0.0.1]) by minas-tirith.lms.ru (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA00537 for ; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 20:51:53 +0400 (MSD) Message-Id: <199708151651.UAA00537@minas-tirith.lms.ru> To: freebsd.org!hardware@minas-tirith.lms.ru Subject: BusLogic FlashPoint PCI SCSI controller Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 20:51:52 +0400 From: Alex Povolotsky Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello! Does anyone have driver for BusLogic FlashPoint PCI SCSI controller? 2.2.2 fails to recognise it. Alex. From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 18:38:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA00773 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 18:38:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA00768; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 18:38:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA29530; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 11:08:20 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199708160138.LAA29530@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Parallel port developpements - ppbus In-Reply-To: <5696.871641825@critter.dk.tfs.com> from Poul-Henning Kamp at "Aug 15, 97 12:43:45 pm" To: phk@critter.dk.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 11:08:19 +0930 (CST) Cc: Nicolas.Souchu@prism.uvsq.fr, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Poul-Henning Kamp stands accused of saying: > > >Anyway, tell us which parallel-port-hardware should be first ported. > >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Well, how about parallel printers and the PLIP/LPIP support ? :-) Printers are already (sort of) supported with the 'nlpt' driver. If you could work out why interrupts don't work, that'd be great of course. As for PLIP, well, Jordan sez you're Mr PLIP, so I think this one is best done with your help... > Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 19:02:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA01701 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 19:02:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA01695; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 19:02:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA29599; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 11:32:20 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199708160202.LAA29599@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Parallel port developpements - ppbus In-Reply-To: <33F4BEF3.446B9B3D@prism.uvsq.fr> from Nicolas Souchu at "Aug 15, 97 08:41:23 pm" To: Nicolas.Souchu@prism.uvsq.fr (Nicolas Souchu) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 11:32:20 +0930 (CST) Cc: phk@critter.dk.tfs.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Nicolas Souchu stands accused of saying: > > - plip should of course. > We want to move it to a standalone file... plip.c? To be consistent, it should probably be if_lp or if_plip (probably the latter). > nicolas -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Aug 15 19:29:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA02771 for hardware-outgoing; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 19:29:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.webspan.net (root@mail.webspan.net [206.154.70.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA02751; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 19:29:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.5]) by mail.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA07406; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 22:29:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (WEBSPAN/970608) with ESMTP id WAA26638; Fri, 15 Aug 1997 22:29:19 -0400 (EDT) To: Nicolas Souchu cc: Poul-Henning Kamp , FreeBSD hackers , FreeBSD hardware From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: Parallel port developpements - ppbus In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 15 Aug 1997 20:41:23 -0000." <33F4BEF3.446B9B3D@prism.uvsq.fr> Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 22:29:19 -0400 Message-ID: <26636.871698559@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Nicolas Souchu wrote in message ID <33F4BEF3.446B9B3D@prism.uvsq.fr>: > - plip should of course. > We want to move it to a standalone file... plip.c? How about QCam support? Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-hardware Sat Aug 16 07:13:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA24754 for hardware-outgoing; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 07:13:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA24749; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 07:13:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id XAA01911; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 23:43:00 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199708161413.XAA01911@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Parallel port developpements - ppbus In-Reply-To: <26636.871698559@orion.webspan.net> from Gary Palmer at "Aug 15, 97 10:29:19 pm" To: gpalmer@FreeBSD.ORG (Gary Palmer) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 23:43:00 +0930 (CST) Cc: Nicolas.Souchu@prism.uvsq.fr, phk@critter.dk.tfs.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Gary Palmer stands accused of saying: > Nicolas Souchu wrote in message ID > <33F4BEF3.446B9B3D@prism.uvsq.fr>: > > - plip should of course. > > We want to move it to a standalone file... plip.c? > > How about QCam support? The QuickCam people are doing everything with user-space I/O these days, which falls under the ppi driver in the new model. The old 'qc' driver can probably be diked. > Gary -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hardware Sat Aug 16 11:09:27 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA03284 for hardware-outgoing; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 11:09:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wall.jhs.no_domain (vector.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA03216; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 11:09:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jhs@localhost) by wall.jhs.no_domain (8.8.5/8.6.9) id QAA02403; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 16:06:34 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 16:06:34 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199708161406.QAA02403@wall.jhs.no_domain> To: hardware@freebsd.org cc: leo@marco.de, gj@freebsd.org, jkh@freebsd.org Subject: free token ring hardware offered, if you reply quickly. From: "Julian H. Stacey" Reply-To: "Julian H. Stacey" X-Email: Home: Lists: Work (firewall blocks incoming): X-web: http://www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ X-address: Holz Strasse 27d, 80469 Munich, Germany X-tel: Home +49.89.268616, Work +49.89.607.29788 Fax +49.89.2608126, Data +49.89.26023276 X-company: Vector Systems Ltd, Unix & Internet Consultants. X-software: FreeBSD (Unix) + EXMH 1.6.9 (PGP key on web) Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I sent this To: hardware@freebsd.org bcc: current@freebsd.org cc: various friends to inform but avoid follow-up overload. Available free to any Free/Net/OpenBSD/Linux type hacker ... (except recipient to pay shippings from Munich Germany & I've no time to find out what that would cost).. & Due to be chucked out within a week to make space ... so answer me quickly!: The heap weighs about 13.5 Kilogrammes. 2 * Token Ring 8 Port (+RI +RO) MAU Multiple Access Unit (Hub), Front: Proteon proNET-4 Back: Model P2710 (2 Technology Drive, Westboro MA 01581) SN30770002170 400mA 9V DC Documents in perfect condition, labelled: UNISYS Personal Workstation USERNET Token Ring Intelligent Wire Center, Installation Guide, Operating Guide, Manuel d'Installation, Installationsanleitung, Manuale di installazione, Guia de instalaci'on I have 1 power supply (220V/9V) for the 2 MAUs, + daisy chain power cable included. Doc says: "Three wire centers can share one transformer". Shipping Crate: 64 x 15 x 35 centimetre. 2 * ISA 16 bit PC cards Cabletron Systems Inc PN 9000275-03 On flange: 9 pin D + RJ + 4 LEDs 5.25" Floppy, 1 Manual for 2 cards. Zustand: Gut Documentation: include sealed floppy. 3 * 3Com TokenLink Plus (1 still in original seal. Docu: inc orig floppy Now simply in my way, so available free, NO FreeBSD drivers available, you'll need to write some, or use it under some horrific Gates-OS, which is what it was used with before. I have no docu beyond user manuals, & no time to make enquiries, just phone or mail me an address, find me a shipping authorisation with FedEx/UPS/DHL/whatever, so I don't pay the freight & it's yours. Note Jordan had found some volunteer to write FreeBSD token ring drivers for more modern hardware, but I've seen no announcement of progress, so I see no harm in offering this free perhaps to give the PD C src community a 2nd route to token ring support ? gj@freebsd.org looked at the hardwar & pronounced it very old. old it may be, but the friend I got it from assures me it's in full working order, but I have a new job, no time or space, & am having a clear out ... anyone want to take it off my hands ? Matthias, (& others) please feel free to copy this across to appropriate lists for other PD hacker groups, Thanks. Julian --- Julian H. Stacey jhs@freebsd.org http://www.freebsd.org/~jhs/ From owner-freebsd-hardware Sat Aug 16 16:28:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA16298 for hardware-outgoing; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 16:28:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA16288 for ; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 16:28:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmnsens (cmnsens.cmnsens.zoom.com [207.33.155.2]) by dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com (8.8.7/8.8.6) with SMTP id QAA15563 for ; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 16:28:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708162328.QAA15563@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> From: "Mike Burgett" To: "hardware@freebsd.org" Date: Sat, 16 Aug 97 16:28:08 -0700 Reply-To: "Mike Burgett" Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 1.92 For OS/2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: K6 - New results.. Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ok, I got my replacement K6-200 yesterday, after the distributor tried to say there was nothing wrong with the old chip (because they couldn't make it fail running windoze for a couple of hours... :( So far, the chip is performing flawlessly. I've run 10 full 'make worlds' in the last 24 hours (takes about 2 hours, with a 20 minute pause between them), and all have completed perfectly, without any sign of the errors I was seeing before. The original chip contained the manufacturing code: 9716CJD And noted the voltage as 2.9 The replacement contains the manufacturing code: B 9731FPAW And notes the voltage as 2.9 core/3.3 I/O Significant? Dunno, just trying to fill in blanks. :) Here's the hardware config: CPU Model: AMD K6-200 Motherboard: Asus P/I P55T2P4 (4 Month Old) Chipset: 430HX L2 Cache: 512K Pipeline Burst System Memory: 96MB EDO HD Controller: Asus SC200 (NCR 53C810) Hard Drives: Seagate ST3255N, HPSW30PN Bios: Award 0203, 0204 Switching/Linear VR: Switching HS Grease Applied: Yes Fan Type: CoolerMaster TI5-602525 Make World: X 10 without problems so far. General FreeBSD Stuff: no problems FreeBSD Version: 2.2.2-stable (This is the original configuration that I tried...) I will be continuing to run tests, running a full 'make world' at least once a day for the next month, to see if this chip looks like it's going to develop any problems, and I'll keep the list informed of anything I find out, either via these tests, or from AMD tech support. Thanks, Mike From owner-freebsd-hardware Sat Aug 16 20:33:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA28468 for hardware-outgoing; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 20:33:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www2.shoppersnet.com (shoppersnet.com [204.156.152.112]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA28459 for ; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 20:33:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from hlew@localhost) by www2.shoppersnet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA08499; Sat, 16 Aug 1997 20:39:03 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 16 Aug 1997 20:39:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Howard Lew To: Mike Burgett cc: "hardware@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: K6 - New results.. In-Reply-To: <199708162328.QAA15563@dragon.cmnsens.zoom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 16 Aug 1997, Mike Burgett wrote: > Ok, I got my replacement K6-200 yesterday, after the distributor tried to say > there was nothing wrong with the old chip (because they couldn't make it fail > running windoze for a couple of hours... :( > > So far, the chip is performing flawlessly. I've run 10 full 'make worlds' in > the last 24 hours (takes about 2 hours, with a 20 minute pause between them), > and all have completed perfectly, without any sign of the errors I was seeing > before. > > The original chip contained the manufacturing code: > > 9716CJD > > And noted the voltage as 2.9 > > The replacement contains the manufacturing code: > > B 9731FPAW > > And notes the voltage as 2.9 core/3.3 I/O > > Significant? Dunno, just trying to fill in blanks. :) I think currently all the K6's are Rev B. I don't know for sure, but my guess is that the 2 digits after the 97 are the week number... So this new one is a July chip I think. The previous was probably the first batch (near the end of March and beginning of April) if I have the code right. AMD has been playing around with the markings so I guess they are still changing the markings. I think Rev A was the engineering sample batch that was sent to MB companies. I am still suspicious about the MB though, but let us know how it goes. Was this the 3rd MB? Or a new one? I think you say it is 4months old... > > Here's the hardware config: > > CPU Model: AMD K6-200 > Motherboard: Asus P/I P55T2P4 (4 Month Old) > Chipset: 430HX > L2 Cache: 512K Pipeline Burst > System Memory: 96MB EDO > HD Controller: Asus SC200 (NCR 53C810) > Hard Drives: Seagate ST3255N, HPSW30PN > Bios: Award 0203, 0204 > Switching/Linear VR: Switching > HS Grease Applied: Yes > Fan Type: CoolerMaster TI5-602525 > Make World: X 10 without problems so far. > General FreeBSD Stuff: no problems > FreeBSD Version: 2.2.2-stable > > > (This is the original configuration that I tried...) > > I will be continuing to run tests, running a full 'make world' at least once a > day for the next month, to see if this chip looks like it's going to develop > any problems, and I'll keep the list informed of anything I find out, either > via these tests, or from AMD tech support. > > Thanks, > Mike > > >