From owner-freebsd-java Tue Dec 29 18:27:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA16841 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 18:27:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from mailman.ghg.net (mailman.ghg.net [206.29.116.30]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA16836 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 18:27:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from spoofy@ghg.net) Received: from ghg.net (spoofy.ghg.net [208.144.174.250]) by mailman.ghg.net (8.9.1/8.9.1/GHG 1.2) with ESMTP id UAA27928 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 20:13:48 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <36898FD0.64170200@ghg.net> Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 20:28:33 -0600 From: User Spoofy X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Jdk1.2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi, I was wondering if or when would JDK1.2 be ported to FreeBSD? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Tue Dec 29 19:03:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA19378 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 19:03:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.117]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA19372 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 19:03:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA57342; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:01:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:01:53 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey To: User Spoofy cc: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Jdk1.2 In-Reply-To: <36898FD0.64170200@ghg.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 29 Dec 1998, User Spoofy wrote: > Hi, > > I was wondering if or when would JDK1.2 be ported to FreeBSD? Nate was talking about 5 days ago, he said Sun'd released the sources to licensed developers, and it would probably be about a month. > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message > > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (NetBSD). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Tue Dec 29 19:46:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA23257 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 19:46:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from d1o29.telia.com (d1o29.telia.com [194.236.214.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA23252; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 19:46:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from girgen@partitur.se) Received: from stordatan.telia.com (t3o29p107.telia.com [194.236.215.107]) by d1o29.telia.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA12030; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 04:45:53 +0100 (MET) Received: from partitur.se (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by stordatan.telia.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id EAA00522; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 04:45:32 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from girgen@partitur.se) Message-ID: <3689A1DB.3B844BF@partitur.se> Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 04:45:31 +0100 From: Palle Girgensohn Organization: Partitur X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: sv, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Porting java stuff? Proposal? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi, Sorry for the cross post, but I think it's needed here, since many people don't seem to follow both ports and java lists. Short version: I propose that there should be a directory where FreeBSD ports can put java library files (aka .jar files). My suggestion is $PREFIX/share/java/lib. Long version: I have almost finished a port for jsdk-2.0 (java servlet development kit). JSDK is distributed as a tarball with precompiled java classes, docs, examples and stuff in a bunch of directories. Naturally, since it's the easiest for the people making the software, the recommended installation is to extract the tarball into /usr/local/JSDK2.0, add /usr/local/JSDK2.0/bin to the search path and /usr/local/JSDK2.0/lib to the CLASSPATH, etc... sic... I have done this a lot when working with Solaris, and after a while the env variables were several miles long, and it's darn near impossible to get everthing right for many users etc... That's why FreeBSD has hier(7), and the ports collection, right? Now, beeing a BSD:er, I have split the directories in the JSDK tarball as follows, relative to $PREFIX (usually /usr/local): bin -> bin (i.e. /usr/local/bin) lib -> share/java/lib src -> share/java/src examples -> share/examples/jsdk doc -> share/doc/jsdk You can call me a lunatic for putting all this effort into splitting a perfectly well organized directory structure, but anyway... Most of the above list isn't very strange, it's like most other ports, but the share/java is different. (I threw out a question about where to put "ported" java .jar files on the java list a week or so ago, and almost started a flame war, but I'm putting my cheek out again :) I propose that we have a common /usr/local/share/java/lib where ports (and manually too) can put jar files (and sources in share/java/src?). The almost-flame-discussion was wheather this should be in /usr/local/lib, libdata, libexec or share, or maybe a fresh new directory. Well, I run other systems than FreeBSD (though I'd rather not :) , and I like the idea of share/java since I export share to all (unix) platforms (almost). java is platform independent, right? I'd really like to hear your opinions on this. Do you care at all about this matter? Is it important to split java tarballs up like this, or is it just asking for trouble (script wrappers usually has to be patched to some degree, making them possibly error prone...)? Shall we have java appliations in the ports collection? If so, shouldn't we have a USE_JDK macro which defines the JDK version, sort of like with perl? Palle Girgensohn To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Tue Dec 29 22:10:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA07150 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:10:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA07134; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:10:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA13808; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:55:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA03264; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:55:16 -0700 Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:55:16 -0700 Message-Id: <199812300555.WAA03264@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Palle Girgensohn Cc: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-Reply-To: <3689A1DB.3B844BF@partitur.se> References: <3689A1DB.3B844BF@partitur.se> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > Sorry for the cross post, but I think it's needed here, since many > people don't seem to follow both ports and java lists. > > Short version: > > I propose that there should be a directory where FreeBSD ports can put > java library files (aka .jar files). My suggestion is > $PREFIX/share/java/lib. Sounds good, but.... > Long version: > > I have almost finished a port for jsdk-2.0 (java servlet development > kit). > > JSDK is distributed as a tarball with precompiled java classes, docs, > examples and stuff in a bunch of directories. Naturally, since it's the > easiest for the people making the software, the recommended installation > is to extract the tarball into /usr/local/JSDK2.0, add > /usr/local/JSDK2.0/bin to the search path and /usr/local/JSDK2.0/lib to > the CLASSPATH, etc... ... > Now, beeing a BSD:er, I have split the directories in the JSDK tarball > as follows, relative to $PREFIX (usually /usr/local): > > bin -> bin (i.e. /usr/local/bin) > lib -> share/java/lib > src -> share/java/src > examples -> share/examples/jsdk > doc -> share/doc/jsdk .... > I propose that we have a common /usr/local/share/java/lib where ports > (and manually too) can put jar files (and sources in share/java/src?). The problem with this is that it makes it much harder to track 3rd party stuff, because that stuff is created separately and *expects* the directory hierarchy to be the way it was created. By breaking it up you make a couple of things harder. 1) If they totally re-organize their distribution upgrading the port is harder to upgrade. 2) Dependencies are harder to track. 3) Java is a moving target, and having multiple version of Java on your system is a going to be a very strong possibility. 1) JDK1.1 a.out/ELF 2) JDK1.2 a.out/ELF I could a single machine having easily 1 or 2 binaries on it, depending on alot of factors. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Tue Dec 29 22:45:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA10492 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:45:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from osprey.grizzly.com (osprey.grizzly.com [209.133.20.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA10487; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:45:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from markd@Grizzly.COM) Received: (from markd@localhost) by osprey.grizzly.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) id WAA01885; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:44:08 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:44:08 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199812300644.WAA01885@osprey.grizzly.com> X-Authentication-Warning: osprey.grizzly.com: markd set sender to markd@grizzly.com using -f From: Mark Diekhans To: girgen@partitur.se CC: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <3689A1DB.3B844BF@partitur.se> (message from Palle Girgensohn on Wed, 30 Dec 1998 04:45:31 +0100) Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? References: <3689A1DB.3B844BF@partitur.se> Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Great your doing the work on the JSDK port; FreeBSD could end up an ideal environment for server-side java applications (which happens to be one of the things I do). This design looks great from the BSD perspective. However the problem with a non-standard layout for Java software is it now requires modifying software obtained from other sources to run on BSD. Most java software requires one to set an environment variable per dependency such as JAVA_HOME that point to desired packages and come with install instructions or scripts. FreeBSD not becomes a special case to port to, when no port should be required. An additional advantage with the defacto java software structure is that it easily allows for multiple versions of the same package to be installed. This is critical in a world where the software is changing so quickly. I generally end up with two different version of swing installed on my systems. I fear that an approach like this would give freebsd a bad reputation in the java world; and we all know how hard it is to shake a bad reputation. Mark To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Tue Dec 29 23:14:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA12707 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:14:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from scam.xcf.berkeley.edu (scam.XCF.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA12702 for ; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:14:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grady@scam.XCF.Berkeley.EDU) Message-Id: <199812300714.XAA12702@hub.freebsd.org> Received: (qmail 9927 invoked by uid 348); 30 Dec 1998 07:15:53 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO scam.XCF.Berkeley.EDU) (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 30 Dec 1998 07:15:53 -0000 To: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, java-port@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: question about Java Sound From: grady@xcf.berkeley.edu (Steven Grady) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <9923.915002152.1@scam.XCF.Berkeley.EDU> Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:15:53 -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org (I do not subscribe to these mailing lists, so please respond to me directly.) Sun just announced the early access of the Java Sound API. This is something I have been waiting for for a while, because I would like to write a sophisticated Java sound application under FreeBSD, and the current interface doesn't cut it. I am wondering what the intention will be (is?) about what technology to use for the FreeBSD port. I assume the standard Voxware ioctl's (which I believe is what is used now). If that is the case, I would like to recommend that the implementer of the JavaSound .so library keep in mind that other sound technologies exist (e.g. the KDE sound daemon, the Network Audio Server, etc.) Please keep the code clean enough to be easily portable to these other interfaces. Ideally, the user can choose which version to use by installing the appropriate .so file under lib/i386/green_threads. Or perhaps I'm assuming too much. Is it likely that anyone will be taking on the tasking of porting the API, when it becomes available? Has anyone looked at the early access? Depending on my availability, I _may_ be able to do it myself when the source becomes available. BTW, to give a sense of what kind of work will need to be done, here are all the native methods, as indicated by using javap on sound.jar, and grepping for "native": com.sun.media.sound.engine.JSThread private native void runNative(); com.sun.media.sound.JSAudioInSystemDevice protected native void nAcquire(); protected native void nInitializeCapture(float, int, int); protected native void nRelease(); protected native void nSetAudioFormat(float, int, int); protected native float nSetLinearGain(float); protected native float nSetPan(float); protected native void nStart(); protected native void nStop(); protected native boolean nSupportsChannels(int); protected native boolean nSupportsSampleRate(float); protected native boolean nSupportsSampleSizeInBits(int); com.sun.media.sound.JSAudioOutput protected native int nCreateChannel(int, float, int, int); protected native void nDestroyChannel(int); protected native void nDrainChannel(int); protected native void nFlushChannel(int); protected native long nGetChannelFrames(int); protected native void nPauseChannel(int); protected native void nResumeChannel(int); protected native float nSetChannelLinearGain(int, float); protected native float nSetPan(int, float); protected native int nSetSampleRate(int, int); protected native void nStartChannel(int); com.sun.media.sound.JSAudioOutSystemDevice protected native void nAcquire(); protected native void nAllocateEngineVoices(int, int); protected native int nGetCurrentData(byte[], byte[], int); protected native long nGetEngineLatencyInMicroseconds(); protected native void nInitializeEngine(float, int, int, int, int); protected native void nRelease(); protected native void nSetAudioFormat(float, int, int); protected native float nSetLinearGain(float); protected native void nSetOutputCallback(boolean); protected native float nSetPan(float); protected native boolean nSetSoundbank(java.lang.String); protected native void nStart(); protected native void nStop(); protected native boolean nSupportsChannels(int); protected native boolean nSupportsSampleRate(float); protected native boolean nSupportsSampleSizeInBits(int); com.sun.media.sound.JSAudioTimeBase protected native long nGetSamplesCaptured(); protected native long nGetSamplesPlayed(); com.sun.media.sound.JSLoadableAudioOutput protected native int nCreateChannel(byte[], int, float, int, int); protected native void nDestroyChannel(int); protected native void nDrainChannel(int); protected native void nFlushChannel(int); protected native long nGetChannelFrames(int); protected native float nSetChannelLinearGain(int, float); protected native float nSetPan(int, float); protected native int nSetSampleRate(int, int); com.sun.media.sound.JSMidiChannel protected native void nAllNotesOff(int, byte, long); protected native void nControlChange(int, byte, byte, short, long); protected native void nNoteOff(int, byte, byte, byte, long); protected native void nNoteOn(int, byte, byte, byte, long); protected native void nProgramChange(int, byte, byte, long); protected native void nProgramChange(int, byte, short, byte, long); protected native void nResetAllControllers(int, byte); protected native void nSetChannelPressure(int, byte, byte, long); protected native float nSetLinearGain(int, byte, float); protected native boolean nSetMute(int, byte, boolean); protected native void nSetPitchBend(int, byte, byte, byte, long); protected native void nSetPolyPressure(int, byte, byte, byte, long); protected native boolean nSetSolo(int, byte, boolean); com.sun.media.sound.JSMidiOutControlDevice protected native long nGetSequencerMicroseconds(); private native int nLoadSoundbank(java.lang.String); private native boolean nSetSoundbank(int); private native boolean nUnloadSoundbank(int); com.sun.media.sound.JSMidiPlayer protected native int nCreateMidiDirect(); protected native void nDestroyChannel(int); protected native long nGetSequencerMicrosecondPosition(int); protected native long nGetSequencerTickPosition(int); protected native boolean nLoadPatch(int, int); protected native void nPauseChannel(int); protected native boolean nRemapPatch(int, int, int); protected native void nResumeChannel(int); protected native float nSetChannelLinearGain(int, float); protected native float nSetChannelPan(int, float); protected native void nStartMidiDirect(int); protected native boolean nUnloadPatch(int, int); com.sun.media.sound.JSSequencePlayer protected native int nCreateMidiSequencer(byte[], int); protected native int nCreateRmfSequencer(byte[], int); protected native long nGetSequenceMicrosecondLength(int); protected native long nGetSequenceTickLength(int); protected native long nGetSequencerMicrosecondPosition(int); protected native long nGetSequencerTickPosition(int); protected native int nGetTempoInBPM(int); protected native int nGetTempoInMPQ(int); protected native long nSetSequencerMicrosecondPosition(int, long); protected native long nSetSequencerTickPosition(int, long); protected native int nSetTempoInBPM(int, int); protected native int nSetTempoInMPQ(int, int); protected native void nStartSequencer(int); com.sun.media.sound.JSSoundbank protected native java.lang.String nGetName(); protected native int nGetVersionMajor(); protected native int nGetVersionMinor(); protected native int nGetVersionSubMinor(); protected native com.sun.media.sound.HsbResource nListEmbeddedSequences()[]; protected native com.sun.media.sound.HsbResource nListPatches()[]; -- Steven grady@xcf.berkeley.edu "No egg nog! In fact, no nog, period!" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Tue Dec 29 23:27:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA13965 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:27:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (sj-dsl-9-129-138.dspeed.net [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA13931; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:26:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA79221; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:26:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199812300726.XAA79221@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: grady@xcf.berkeley.edu (Steven Grady) cc: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, java-port@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about Java Sound In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:15:53 PST." <199812300714.XAA12733@hub.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:26:05 -0800 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org It thats the API sun is going to have to do a lot more that just published the api . It looks like a full fledge major audio subsystem probably in the order of NCD's network audio server. I doubt that the implementation of such audio system will be easily tailored to other audio server architectures. Amancio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Tue Dec 29 23:31:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA14505 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:31:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (sj-dsl-9-129-138.dspeed.net [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA14487; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:31:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA79254; Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:30:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199812300730.XAA79254@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Mark Diekhans cc: girgen@partitur.se, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:44:08 PST." <199812300644.WAA01885@osprey.grizzly.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:30:16 -0800 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > Great your doing the work on the JSDK port; FreeBSD could end up an ideal > environment for server-side java applications (which happens to be one of the > things I do). Curious have you played with Apache JServ, SSI or GNUJSP on FreeBSD? JSPs are great to compile with jikes 8) Amancio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 00:10:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA18236 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 00:10:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA18214; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 00:10:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id BAA14719; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 01:10:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id BAA03792; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 01:09:55 -0700 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 01:09:55 -0700 Message-Id: <199812300809.BAA03792@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Mark Diekhans , girgen@partitur.se, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-Reply-To: <199812300730.XAA79254@rah.star-gate.com> References: <199812300644.WAA01885@osprey.grizzly.com> <199812300730.XAA79254@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > Great your doing the work on the JSDK port; FreeBSD could end up an ideal > > environment for server-side java applications (which happens to be one of the > > things I do). > > Curious have you played with Apache JServ I've done a bit of work with Apache's JServ, but not much. Unfortunately w/out a JIT FreeBSD's Java performance isn't too hot. However, the two JIT's (SHUjit and TYA) ported to FreeBSD show promise. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 00:24:12 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA19245 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 00:24:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (sj-dsl-9-129-138.dspeed.net [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA19229; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 00:24:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA80195; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 00:23:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199812300823.AAA80195@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Nate Williams cc: Mark Diekhans , girgen@partitur.se, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 30 Dec 1998 01:09:55 MST." <199812300809.BAA03792@mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 00:23:23 -0800 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I am doing a little work on Jserv and it looks like its performance is not bad . Will have to qualify that later on the week with something like Apache JMeter 8) As some of you may know Apache JServ is a servlet server which works with Apache. The interesting scenario is that JServ loads a servlet think about it as a CGI and it remains resident on the server . servlets are multi threaded so a single copy gets used to serve multiple clients. If anyone is interested there are a couple of books on Servlets: Computing Mcgraw-Hill Java Servlets by Karl Moss O'Reilly Java Servlet Programmy by Jason Hunter with William Crawford O'Reillys so far is my favorite one. Servlets are being used in high-end commerce web servers . Sun's commerce web server uses http://www.atg.com servlet / application engine. http://www.xs4all.nl/~vincentp/gnujsp is an implementation of of Java Server Pages which basically one can mix HTML and Java 8) http://www.javasoft.com/products/jsp/jsp092.html#applications Have Fun Guys, Amancio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 01:57:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA25592 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 01:57:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from jiyu.net ([209.100.98.61]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA25587 for ; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 01:57:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from daichi@ongs.net) Received: from localhost (ppph173.wbs.ne.jp [202.219.55.173]) by jiyu.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA10151 for ; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 18:59:49 +0900 To: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: About Japanese problem with Swing. X-Mailer: Mew version 1.94b1 on XEmacs 20.4 (Emerald) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19981230185745U.daichi@ongs.net> Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 18:57:45 +0900 From: "Daichi T.GOTO" X-Dispatcher: imput version 981019(IM102) Lines: 13 Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hello. This is my first access to this mailing list. Now I am useing Swing 1.1 with jdk1.1.7 on FreeBSD 3.0 Release. This is very good. I can use Japanese Charactors(EUC) as labels, but cannot use it in JTextArea and JEditorPane. Why? Is this an especialy problem of FreeBSD or original bug of Swing? Can I use Japanese in those Area? Please help me. ---- Daichi T.GOTO (ONGS) http://www.ongs.net/daichi, daichi@ongs.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 04:22:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA10068 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 04:22:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.117]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id EAA10047; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 04:22:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from chuckr@mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA57969; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 07:20:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 07:20:53 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey To: Nate Williams cc: Palle Girgensohn , freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-Reply-To: <199812300555.WAA03264@mt.sri.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 29 Dec 1998, Nate Williams wrote: > > Sorry for the cross post, but I think it's needed here, since many > > people don't seem to follow both ports and java lists. > > > > Short version: > > > > I propose that there should be a directory where FreeBSD ports can put > > java library files (aka .jar files). My suggestion is > > $PREFIX/share/java/lib. > > Sounds good, but.... My own personal nomination is to give it a top level hierarchy, at /usr/local/java. Each new port would get installed at something like /usr/local/jdk1.1....(whatever) and I could softlink that to /usr/local/java. Since I want to be able to move forwards and backwords in different jdk revisions (to run neat applications like DocWiz, that only use Swing 1.0.3), this would allow moving a lot easier than having a fractured java. It would also allow one to export java directories any way you want them, and allow for easier installation of 3rd party apps, that make assumptions about the file hierarchy. ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@glue.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 213 Lakeside Drive Apt T-1 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and picnic (FreeBSD-current) (301) 220-2114 | and jaunt (NetBSD). ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 07:46:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA26426 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 07:46:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from bastuba.partitur.se (bastuba.partitur.se [193.219.246.194]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA26405; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 07:46:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from girgen@partitur.se) Received: from partitur.se (tb303.partitur.se [193.219.246.230]) by bastuba.partitur.se (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA05970; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:45:32 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from girgen@partitur.se) Message-ID: <368A4A9C.77C9BF86@partitur.se> Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:45:32 +0100 From: Palle Girgensohn Organization: Partitur X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-BETA i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Amancio Hasty CC: Nate Williams , Mark Diekhans , freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? References: <199812300823.AAA80195@rah.star-gate.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi Amancio! I'm half way done through the process of making a FreeBSD port of apache jserv; that's why I need the JSDK. Are you working on porting it too, or just using it :-) ? /Palle Amancio Hasty wrote: > > I am doing a little work on Jserv and it looks like its performance is not > bad . Will have to qualify that later on the week with something like > Apache JMeter 8) > > As some of you may know Apache JServ is a servlet server which works with > Apache. The interesting scenario is that JServ loads a servlet think about > it as a CGI and it remains resident on the server . servlets are multi > threaded so a single copy gets used to serve multiple clients. > > If anyone is interested there are a couple of books on Servlets: > > Computing Mcgraw-Hill > Java Servlets by Karl Moss > > O'Reilly > Java Servlet Programmy by Jason Hunter with William Crawford > > O'Reillys so far is my favorite one. > > Servlets are being used in high-end commerce web servers . Sun's commerce > web server uses http://www.atg.com servlet / application engine. > > http://www.xs4all.nl/~vincentp/gnujsp is an implementation of of Java Server > Pages which basically one can mix HTML and Java 8) > > http://www.javasoft.com/products/jsp/jsp092.html#applications > > Have Fun Guys, > Amancio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 08:40:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA01805 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 08:40:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA01787; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 08:40:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA17947; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:40:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA04956; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:40:05 -0700 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:40:05 -0700 Message-Id: <199812301640.JAA04956@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Amancio Hasty Cc: Nate Williams , Mark Diekhans , girgen@partitur.se, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-Reply-To: <199812300823.AAA80195@rah.star-gate.com> References: <199812300809.BAA03792@mt.sri.com> <199812300823.AAA80195@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > I am doing a little work on Jserv and it looks like its performance is not > bad . Since JServ uses the FreeBSD JDK, it certainly is not going to rock your world. Our JDK is *NOT* a performance monster by any stretch of the imagination. JServ is not the problem so much as our Java engine, hence my hint about using the TYA or SHUjit JIT compilers with the JDK. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 08:42:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA02276 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 08:42:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA02270 for ; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 08:42:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA17962; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:42:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA04998; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:42:11 -0700 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:42:11 -0700 Message-Id: <199812301642.JAA04998@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: "Daichi T.GOTO" Cc: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: About Japanese problem with Swing. In-Reply-To: <19981230185745U.daichi@ongs.net> References: <19981230185745U.daichi@ongs.net> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > Now I am useing Swing 1.1 with jdk1.1.7 on FreeBSD 3.0 Release. > This is very good. I can use Japanese Charactors(EUC) as labels, but > cannot use it in JTextArea and JEditorPane. Why? Is this an especialy > problem of FreeBSD or original bug of Swing? I'm not sure. The only way to know is to try it on the reference platform (Solaris) and see if it works there. It's possible that it's a FreeBSD specific bug, but I doubt it. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 08:46:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA02817 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 08:46:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA02804; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 08:45:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA17991; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:45:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA05014; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:45:37 -0700 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:45:37 -0700 Message-Id: <199812301645.JAA05014@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: grady@xcf.berkeley.edu (Steven Grady) Cc: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, java-port@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about Java Sound In-Reply-To: <199812300714.XAA12702@hub.freebsd.org> References: <199812300714.XAA12702@hub.freebsd.org> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > Sun just announced the early access of the Java Sound API.... .... > Is it likely that anyone will be > taking on the tasking of porting the API, when it becomes available? Amancio is the 'sound guru', so if anyone is going to do it I would guess it would be him. Amancio, you haven't done much with the JDK, how about doing something with your specialty, multimedia stuff? Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 10:42:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA16841 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 10:42:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from hp9000.chc-chimes.com (hp9000.chc-chimes.com [206.67.97.84]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA16793; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 10:42:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from billf@chc-chimes.com) Received: from localhost by hp9000.chc-chimes.com with SMTP (1.39.111.2/16.2) id AA099342161; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 07:49:21 -0500 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 07:49:20 -0500 (EST) From: Bill Fumerola To: Nate Williams Cc: Amancio Hasty , Mark Diekhans , girgen@partitur.se, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-Reply-To: <199812301640.JAA04956@mt.sri.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Wed, 30 Dec 1998, Nate Williams wrote: > > I am doing a little work on Jserv and it looks like its performance is not > > bad . > > Since JServ uses the FreeBSD JDK, it certainly is not going to rock your > world. Our JDK is *NOT* a performance monster by any stretch of the > imagination. JServ is not the problem so much as our Java engine, hence > my hint about using the TYA or SHUjit JIT compilers with the JDK. My knowledge on Java technology is rather limited, but just a comment to make. Internet World recently did an article on Java implementations and speed and the FreeBSD tests were rather poor. We were below a certain company in Redmond's implementation. - bill fumerola - billf@chc-chimes.com - BF1560 - computer horizons corp - - ph:(800) 252-2421 - bfumerol@computerhorizons.com - billf@FreeBSD.org - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 11:37:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA22868 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 11:37:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (sj-dsl-9-129-138.dspeed.net [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA22852; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 11:37:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA83830; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 11:36:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199812301936.LAA83830@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Palle Girgensohn cc: Nate Williams , Mark Diekhans , freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:45:32 +0100." <368A4A9C.77C9BF86@partitur.se> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 11:36:31 -0800 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I am just using jserv 8) Cheers, Amancio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 13:41:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA04164 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 13:41:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (sj-dsl-9-129-138.dspeed.net [209.249.129.138]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA04158; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 13:41:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.9.1/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA05462; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 13:40:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hasty@rah.star-gate.com) Message-Id: <199812302140.NAA05462@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: Nate Williams cc: grady@xcf.berkeley.edu (Steven Grady), freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, java-port@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about Java Sound In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 30 Dec 1998 09:45:37 MST." <199812301645.JAA05014@mt.sri.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 13:40:43 -0800 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Tnks Nate for the good tip ! I will browse more closely at Java's multimedia offering including the sound api. Bear in mind that I have a heavy workload so if anyone wants to take a shot at the sound api please do so and I am more than happy to help . Cheers, Amancio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 15:47:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA16795 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 15:47:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA16779; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 15:47:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA21021; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:46:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA06707; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:46:32 -0700 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:46:32 -0700 Message-Id: <199812302346.QAA06707@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Bill Fumerola Cc: Nate Williams , Amancio Hasty , Mark Diekhans , girgen@partitur.se, freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-Reply-To: References: <199812301640.JAA04956@mt.sri.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > > I am doing a little work on Jserv and it looks like its performance is not > > > bad . > > > > Since JServ uses the FreeBSD JDK, it certainly is not going to rock your > > world. Our JDK is *NOT* a performance monster by any stretch of the > > imagination. JServ is not the problem so much as our Java engine, hence > > my hint about using the TYA or SHUjit JIT compilers with the JDK. > > Internet World recently did an article on Java implementations and speed > and the FreeBSD tests were rather poor. We were below a certain company in > Redmond's implementation. Yep. As a matter of fact, we were almost the slowest, if not *THE* slowest. That's because we have no JIT, while every other JVM compared uses one. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 16:02:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA18993 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:02:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from scam.xcf.berkeley.edu (scam.XCF.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.43.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA18948 for ; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:02:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grady@scam.XCF.Berkeley.EDU) Message-Id: <199812310002.QAA18948@hub.freebsd.org> Received: (qmail 25038 invoked by uid 348); 31 Dec 1998 00:03:00 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO scam.XCF.Berkeley.EDU) (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 31 Dec 1998 00:03:00 -0000 To: Amancio Hasty Cc: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, java-port@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: question about Java Sound From: grady@xcf.berkeley.edu (Steven Grady) In-reply-to: Your message of Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:26:05 -0800 <199812300726.XAA79221@rah.star-gate.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <25034.915062579.1@scam.XCF.Berkeley.EDU> Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:02:59 -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Just to be clear, that was not the API, that was just the result of my grepping through the output of "javap" to find native methods. The API is higher-level, and does not include any of those calls. I was providing that list as an indication of effort (based on granularity and extent) necessary to port the API when it becomes available. If you're interested, please check the Early Access page for JavaSound: http://developer.java.sun.com/developer/earlyAccess/sound/index.html BTW, the code I had written provides a (very limited so far) JNI-based interface to the Network Audio Server. Unfortunately, a little ways into my implementation, I found that the server was hanging, I'm guessing due to NAS bugs. I haven't had the heart to try track them down, since the system is unsupported at this point. Steven > From: Amancio Hasty > Subject: Re: question about Java Sound > It thats the API sun is going to have to do a lot more that just published > the api . It looks like a full fledge major audio subsystem probably > in the order of NCD's network audio server. I doubt that the implementation > of such audio system will be easily tailored to other > audio server architectures. > > Amancio > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 16:06:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA20677 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:06:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from fever.semiotek.com (host-062.canadiantire.ca [209.146.201.62]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA20661; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:06:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from reader@fever.semiotek.com) Received: (from reader@localhost) by fever.semiotek.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) id TAA04896; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 19:06:01 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from reader) Message-ID: <19981230190601.A4424@semiotek.com> Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 19:06:01 -0500 From: Justin Wells To: Palle Girgensohn , freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? Mail-Followup-To: Palle Girgensohn , freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG References: <3689A1DB.3B844BF@partitur.se> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.1i In-Reply-To: <3689A1DB.3B844BF@partitur.se>; from Palle Girgensohn on Wed, Dec 30, 1998 at 04:45:31AM +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org My two cents on the porting issue: Nate is right, there are likely to be multiple versions of Java on any system. The most important differences, though, are the version-of-java differences. Most applications won't care whether their JVM is a JIT, ELF, or what type of thread library it uses. Some will, but not most. I think that means: -- Versions of Java should be installed as /usr/local/jdk.x.y.z -- The most featureful, newest version of Java should be symlinked so that it appears under /usr/local/java, and this should change regularly as Java is upgraded. A port should check if it is highest version of Java installed so far, and if so, symlink /usr/local/java to itself. -- Eventually, the most stable, reliable, and trusted version of Java should appear as /usr/java: whenever it is that the FreeBSD community finds Java useful enough to use for some core functionality. This won't exist for some time, but it's eventual existence justifies the notion that /usr/local/java is the most recent. If you want the most stable, that would be /usr/java--and if /usr/java doesn't exist, that's because there is not yet a version worthy of the "stable" designation. -- People choose what JVM to use by default by setting their CLASSPATH and PATH to reflect their choice. Just because /usr/java and /usr/local/java exist doesn't mean you HAVE to use them -- Core/critical applications would rely on /usr/java. Most userland applications should try and use /usr/local/java. Individual applications that are known not to work with the most recent version of Java should instead rely on the last specific version of Java with which they do work. All other issues, such as what thread library to use, whether to use ELF or a.out, should not be solved using the filesystem layout. Instead they should be determined by the port maintainer, or selected by an environment variable (either during install, or at runtime). Since I'm not doing any of the work, feel free to ignore me. However I have an application I'd like to write a PORT for (webmacro: www.webmacro.org) and without a good underlying JDK port I can't do that :-) Justin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 22:29:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA27836 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 22:29:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA27822; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 22:29:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA23642; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:29:30 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id XAA07802; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:29:29 -0700 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:29:29 -0700 Message-Id: <199812310629.XAA07802@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Justin Wells Cc: Palle Girgensohn , freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-Reply-To: <19981230190601.A4424@semiotek.com> References: <3689A1DB.3B844BF@partitur.se> <19981230190601.A4424@semiotek.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > Nate is right, there are likely to be multiple versions of Java on any system. > > The most important differences, though, are the version-of-java differences. > Most applications won't care whether their JVM is a JIT, ELF, or what type of > thread library it uses. Some will, but not most. I was thinking of non-100% pure applications that use JNI, which definitely care which version of FreeBSD is used. Many of the newer API's from Sun use JNI (Java 3D, Sound, etc...) > I think that means: > > -- Versions of Java should be installed as /usr/local/jdk.x.y.z > > -- The most featureful, newest version of Java should be symlinked so > that it appears under /usr/local/java, and this should change regularly > as Java is upgraded. A port should check if it is highest version of > Java installed so far, and if so, symlink /usr/local/java to itself. The problem with this is that users of the system might have the version of java 'changed' out from underneath them. As both the system administrator and user for a couple large networks, this has been a cause of confusion/grief for many of my users, which is why I don't create the symlink anymore. And, is JD1.0.2, JDK1.1.7, or JDK1.2 the latest release? (It depends on your perspective...) > -- Eventually, the most stable, reliable, and trusted version of Java > should appear as /usr/java: whenever it is that the FreeBSD community > finds Java useful enough to use for some core functionality. See above. > -- People choose what JVM to use by default by setting their CLASSPATH > and PATH to reflect their choice. Just because /usr/java and > /usr/local/java exist doesn't mean you HAVE to use them Adding things that you don't expect users to use isn't a good calls IMO. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 22:37:14 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA28756 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 22:37:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp (cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp [133.9.68.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA28740; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 22:37:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shudoh@muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp) Received: from muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp (shudoh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp (8.9.1a/3.7W) with ESMTP id PAA27354; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 15:36:48 +0900 Message-Id: <199812310636.PAA27354@cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp> To: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 30 Dec 1998 16:46:32 MST." <199812302346.QAA06707@mt.sri.com> Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 15:36:48 +0900 From: SHUDO Kazuyuki Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > Internet World recently did an article on Java implementations and speed > > and the FreeBSD tests were rather poor. > > Yep. As a matter of fact, we were almost the slowest, if not *THE* > slowest. That's because we have no JIT, while every other JVM compared > uses one. My understanding is that JDK for FreeBSD make use of C version of interpreter instead of assembly language version as executeJava_p5.*. Is this right? Kazuyuki SHUDO Happy Hacking! Muraoka Lab., Grad. School of Sci. & Eng., Waseda Univ. E-mail: shudoh@muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp Address: Muraoka Lab., Waseda Univ., 3-4-1 Okubo Shinjuku-ku Tokyo 169-8555 JAPAN TEL: +81-3-3209-5198 FAX: +81-3-3209-5198 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 22:51:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA29911 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 22:51:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA29895; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 22:51:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA23825; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:51:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id XAA07977; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:51:09 -0700 Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:51:09 -0700 Message-Id: <199812310651.XAA07977@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: SHUDO Kazuyuki Cc: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-Reply-To: <199812310636.PAA27354@cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp> References: <199812302346.QAA06707@mt.sri.com> <199812310636.PAA27354@cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > > Internet World recently did an article on Java implementations and speed > > > and the FreeBSD tests were rather poor. > > > > Yep. As a matter of fact, we were almost the slowest, if not *THE* > > slowest. That's because we have no JIT, while every other JVM compared > > uses one. > > My understanding is that JDK for FreeBSD make use of C > version of interpreter instead of assembly language > version as executeJava_p5.*. Is this right? That is correct, but we weren't that much slower than the Linux JDK, which *does* use the assembly language version of executeJava. My comparison's of the FreeBSD JDK vs. the Solaris one with the JIT disabled show us *slighly* faster for most things (except networking...). I believe the reason we're so slow for networking is due to using select and not having a good multi-threading library. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Wed Dec 30 23:44:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA04405 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:44:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp (cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp [133.9.68.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA04389; Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:44:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shudoh@muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp) Received: from muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp (shudoh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp (8.9.1a/3.7W) with ESMTP id QAA28564; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 16:44:01 +0900 Message-Id: <199812310744.QAA28564@cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp> To: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 30 Dec 1998 23:51:09 MST." <199812310651.XAA07977@mt.sri.com> Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 16:44:01 +0900 From: SHUDO Kazuyuki Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > My understanding is that JDK for FreeBSD make use of C > > version of interpreter instead of assembly language > > version as executeJava_p5.*. Is this right? > > That is correct, but we weren't that much slower than the Linux JDK, > which *does* use the assembly language version of executeJava. I feel that FreeBSD JDK is pretty slower than Linux JDK. With Linpack benchmark for Java (*), Linux JDK117 on PentiumPro/200MHz results 1.357 Mflops/s, FreeBSD JDK117 on PentiumII/233MHz results 0.734 Mflops/s. Java interpreter shows these results, no JIT. (*) Linpack Benchmark -- Java Version http://www.netlib.org/benchmark/linpackjava/ I wonder why isn't FreeBSD port based on Linux port. I love FreeBSD as same as Linux, but I'm sad to say porting effort to Linux is superior to the FreeBSD one. Kazuyuki SHUDO Happy Hacking! Muraoka Lab., Grad. School of Sci. & Eng., Waseda Univ. E-mail: shudoh@muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp Address: Muraoka Lab., Waseda Univ., 3-4-1 Okubo Shinjuku-ku Tokyo 169-8555 JAPAN TEL: +81-3-3209-5198 FAX: +81-3-3209-5198 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-java Thu Dec 31 09:48:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA24880 for freebsd-java-outgoing; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 09:48:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.mt.sri.com (sri-gw.MT.net [206.127.105.141]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA24864; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 09:48:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nate@mt.sri.com) Received: from mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by ns.mt.sri.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA28268; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 10:47:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from nate@rocky.mt.sri.com) Received: by mt.sri.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA10105; Thu, 31 Dec 1998 10:47:55 -0700 Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 10:47:55 -0700 Message-Id: <199812311747.KAA10105@mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: SHUDO Kazuyuki Cc: freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Porting java stuff? Proposal? In-Reply-To: <199812310744.QAA28564@cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp> References: <199812310651.XAA07977@mt.sri.com> <199812310744.QAA28564@cafe.muraoka.info.waseda.ac.jp> X-Mailer: VM 6.34 under 19.16 "Lille" XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > > My understanding is that JDK for FreeBSD make use of C > > > version of interpreter instead of assembly language > > > version as executeJava_p5.*. Is this right? > > > > That is correct, but we weren't that much slower than the Linux JDK, > > which *does* use the assembly language version of executeJava. > > I feel that FreeBSD JDK is pretty slower than Linux JDK. > > With Linpack benchmark for Java (*), > Linux JDK117 on PentiumPro/200MHz results 1.357 Mflops/s, > FreeBSD JDK117 on PentiumII/233MHz results 0.734 Mflops/s. > Java interpreter shows these results, no JIT. > > (*) Linpack Benchmark -- Java Version > http://www.netlib.org/benchmark/linpackjava/ > > I wonder why isn't FreeBSD port based on Linux port. It is. As a matter of fact, the Linux port uses FreeBSD patches and vice-versa. The only *large* differences are: 1) ELF support (The FreeBSD JDK uses a.out) 2) Warning support (The Linux version has casts all over the place to avoid warnings which provide no functional differences on the x86.) 3) Kernel support (Linux uses poll, not select). And, recently they also added multi-threaded support because the Linux kernel has basic multithreading. Compare older Linux releases to older FreeBSD release and the differences should be less stark. Nate To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-java" in the body of the message