From owner-freebsd-realtime Wed Mar 11 08:25:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA03182 for freebsd-realtime-outgoing; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 08:25:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from blackadder.cis.mcmaster.ca (root@blackadder.CIS.McMaster.CA [130.113.128.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA03158 for ; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 08:25:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rich@immrc1.Eng.McMaster.CA) Received: from immrc.Eng.McMaster.CA by blackadder.cis.mcmaster.ca with SMTP id AA19713 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Wed, 11 Mar 1998 11:24:50 -0500 Received: by immrc.eng.mcmaster.ca (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA20255; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 11:25:01 -0500 Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 11:25:01 -0500 From: rich@immrc1.Eng.McMaster.CA (Richard Teltz) Message-Id: <199803111625.LAA20255@immrc.eng.mcmaster.ca> To: realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: is anybody out there Sender: owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org To whom it may concern, I posted a question regarding threads use last week and got no reply. Not even a whimper... Is this mailing list dead? (ie: active....) Rich To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-realtime" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-realtime Wed Mar 11 08:38:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA04846 for freebsd-realtime-outgoing; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 08:38:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from hda.hda.com (hda-bicnet.bicnet.net [208.220.66.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA04838 for ; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 08:38:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dufault@hda.hda.com) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA25740; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 11:37:56 -0500 (EST) From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199803111637.LAA25740@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: is anybody out there In-Reply-To: <199803111625.LAA20255@immrc.eng.mcmaster.ca> from Richard Teltz at "Mar 11, 98 11:25:01 am" To: rich@immrc1.Eng.McMaster.CA (Richard Teltz) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 11:37:56 -0500 (EST) Cc: realtime@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > I posted a question regarding threads use last week and > got no reply. Not even a whimper... > > Is this mailing list dead? Yeah, it is pretty dead. Let me go and find your question and answer. -- Peter Dufault (dufault@hda.com) Realtime development, Machine control, HD Associates, Inc. Safety critical systems, Agency approval To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-realtime" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-realtime Wed Mar 11 08:52:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA07402 for freebsd-realtime-outgoing; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 08:52:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from hda.hda.com (hda-bicnet.bicnet.net [208.220.66.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA07394 for ; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 08:52:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dufault@hda.hda.com) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA25788; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 11:52:25 -0500 (EST) From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199803111652.LAA25788@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: threads questions In-Reply-To: <199803032151.QAA05739@immrc.eng.mcmaster.ca> from Richard Teltz at "Mar 3, 98 04:51:04 pm" To: rich@immrc1.Eng.McMaster.CA (Richard Teltz) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 11:52:25 -0500 (EST) Cc: realtime@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL25 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org There is no rt-FreeBSD. I've been putting the infrastructure for P1003.1B into -current, and that along with the scheduler pieces should be there this weekend. Once that is there my understanding is that the threads package will notice the support from the header files and you can specify the alternative schedulers. I haven't looked at this, though, so you'll have to research how it works for yourself. You still have the many issues of the non-reentrancy of the kernel, etc, that make FreeBSD inappropriate for most serious uses. If I had the time I'd follow this route: 1. First set it up so that you could have the scheduler policy apply only within a process group, making the system a lot better for developing and simulating real time processes, though not delivering them. For example, you could then use the Ptolemy system's real time scheduling to drive simulations without having to be root and taking over the system. 2. Develop an approach of adding new pieces that were reentrant and targeted at real time, and a way of detecting when regular interrupts, system code, etc was activated and use make that information available to the process as a "real time fault". 3. Work toward an MP system where you'd have a dedicated realtime system. Peter -- Peter Dufault (dufault@hda.com) Realtime development, Machine control, HD Associates, Inc. Safety critical systems, Agency approval To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-realtime" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-realtime Wed Mar 11 09:08:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA08914 for freebsd-realtime-outgoing; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 09:08:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (Ilsa.StevesCafe.com [205.168.119.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA08841 for ; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 09:07:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from fbsd@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com) Received: from Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Ilsa.StevesCafe.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA10990; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 10:07:30 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199803111707.KAA10990@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 From: Steve Passe To: Peter Dufault cc: rich@immrc1.Eng.McMaster.CA (Richard Teltz), realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: threads questions In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 11 Mar 1998 11:52:25 EST." <199803111652.LAA25788@hda.hda.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 10:07:30 -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi, > You still have the many issues of the non-reentrancy of the kernel, > etc, that make FreeBSD inappropriate for most serious uses. If I > had the time I'd follow this route: > ... I am trying to use 2.2.5 for soft realtime in a project, including the use of threads. One trick we are experimenting with is the use of NMI on our custom hardware. When the hardware needs service it (optionally) asserts both an NMI and a regular INT. The NMI code jumps in and grabs timely info from the hardware, storing it away with the 64bit CPU timestamp, then exits. The regular INT then comes along later and does the higher level things that require reentrancy and critical region protection of the kernel proper. I've been toying around with the idea of setting up a web page to support RT and possibly threads, as a place where we could all gather our experiences in this area. Any interest out there in contributing info for such a page? -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-realtime" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-realtime Wed Mar 11 09:30:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA12787 for freebsd-realtime-outgoing; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 09:30:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from alpo.whistle.com (alpo.whistle.com [207.76.204.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA12726 for ; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 09:30:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@whistle.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by alpo.whistle.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA21638; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 09:27:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from UNKNOWN(), claiming to be "current1.whistle.com" via SMTP by alpo.whistle.com, id smtpd021635; Wed Mar 11 09:27:10 1998 Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 09:22:50 -0800 (PST) From: Julian Elischer To: Richard Teltz cc: realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: is anybody out there In-Reply-To: <199803111625.LAA20255@immrc.eng.mcmaster.ca> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org no, it isn't dead, but somethimes that happens if no-one thinks that they are the best person to answer that question. threads questions are fair in -current or -hackers as they are of general interest. julian On Wed, 11 Mar 1998, Richard Teltz wrote: > > To whom it may concern, > > I posted a question regarding threads use last week and > got no reply. Not even a whimper... > > Is this mailing list dead? > > (ie: active....) > > Rich > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-realtime" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-realtime" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-realtime Wed Mar 11 14:44:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA00514 for freebsd-realtime-outgoing; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:44:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from gal.logic.it (gal.logic.it [195.120.151.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA00406 for ; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 14:43:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from molter@logic.it) Received: from [195.120.151.124] by gal.logic.it (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id da608585 for ; Wed, 11 Mar 1998 23:43:13 +0200 Received: (qmail 1704 invoked by uid 1000); 11 Mar 1998 18:30:35 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 19:30:31 +0100 (MET) From: Marco Molteni To: Steve Passe cc: realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: threads questions In-Reply-To: <199803111707.KAA10990@Ilsa.StevesCafe.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Wed, 11 Mar 1998, Steve Passe wrote: > I've been toying around with the idea of setting up a web page to > support RT and possibly threads, as a place where we could all gather > our experiences in this area. Any interest out there in contributing > info for such a page? Steve, I think such a page would be very nice. At least now, I'll be able to get info from your page, not to put... ;-) Marco --- Il mondo e' bello perche' e' Bacio To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-realtime" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-realtime Thu Mar 12 22:11:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA00896 for freebsd-realtime-outgoing; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 22:11:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from mail.xmission.com (mail.xmission.com [198.60.22.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA00890 for ; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 22:11:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from softweyr@xmission.com) Received: from xmission.com [166.70.3.34] by mail.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 1.73 #4) id 0yDNh0-0003Aq-00; Thu, 12 Mar 1998 23:11:43 -0700 Message-ID: <3508CEA1.30DE65F4@xmission.com> Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 23:13:53 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2.5-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Richard Teltz , realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: is anybody out there References: <199803111625.LAA20255@immrc.eng.mcmaster.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-realtime@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Richard Teltz wrote: > > To whom it may concern, > > I posted a question regarding threads use last week and > got no reply. Not even a whimper... > > Is this mailing list dead? Depends on what you mean by dead... > (ie: active....) ...and on what you mean by active. If you're asking if your message got out, yes it did. If you're asking if there are a lot of people working diligently on realtime freebsd, that would depend on your defintion of 'working.' And 'diligently.' And even 'realtime.' ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.xmission.com/~softweyr softweyr@xmission.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-realtime" in the body of the message