From owner-freebsd-scsi Sun May 21 5:21:51 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E499337B6A8 for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 05:21:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kwc@world.std.com) Received: from world.std.com (root@world-f.std.com [199.172.62.5]) by europe.std.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA03396 for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 08:21:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from kwc@localhost) by world.std.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id IAA01609; Sun, 21 May 2000 08:21:10 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 08:21:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Kenneth W Cochran Message-Id: <200005211221.IAA01609@world.std.com> To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Subject: SCSI 2x-4x slower than IDE? Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hello -scsi, (Yes, the old SCSI vs IDE flamewar, but I'd like to avoid that, thank you... :) This is related to FreeBSD because I'm considering these devices for a FreeBSD box... :) A recent message on this list spoke to this issue in general but I could use some info as to the specifics, if possible. Partly on my recommendation, a freind of mine tried SCSI as a proposed upgrade to his old IDE system. He is/was interested in improving performance with sequential saves while editing & cd-burning music (live recorded recitals). File sizes are in the 10s & possibly 100s of mb. He got a Tekram DC-390U2W & an IBM Ultrastar DNES-318350. There are/were a couple of other previous scsi peripherals (older IBM hdd & a tape drive, I think) running on an Adaptec 2910. OS is Win9x (not sure exactly which). What happened: Sequential saves with older scsi disk (vs older ide) took twice as long, & sequential saves with new IBM took twice as long as with older scsi disk. The file/save on the ide took about 4 minutes, the "old" scsi disk (an IBM) took 8 minutes & the new IBM DNES took 15m:21s. His IDE is not even the newer, supposedly faster, stuff. I've always read & heard that Unix in general & FreeBSD more specifically perform much better with scsi hdds than ide (better, more intelligent i/o, "multithreadedness," multitasking, etc.), & that this might not be the case with Win9x, due to its "single-threaded" nature, but would that account for this magnitude of performance difference? I've always been quite satisfied with scsi & unhappy with ide for systems I've built & used (Unix, Linux, *BSD). 2 questions: 1. What's going on "here" in M$/Win9x? 2. What does this imply (or not imply) for FreeBSD? FAQ, -doc, & other reference pointers are, of course, quite welcome. :) Thanks, -kc To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Sun May 21 10:26: 3 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from front2.grolier.fr (front2.grolier.fr [194.158.96.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEBDC37B808 for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 10:25:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from groudier@club-internet.fr) Received: from ppp-163-55.villette.club-internet.fr (ppp-163-55.villette.club-internet.fr [195.36.163.55]) by front2.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id TAA29403; Sun, 21 May 2000 19:25:45 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 19:01:42 +0200 (CEST) From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=E9rard_Roudier?= X-Sender: groudier@linux.local To: Kenneth W Cochran Cc: freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SCSI 2x-4x slower than IDE? In-Reply-To: <200005211221.IAA01609@world.std.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 21 May 2000, Kenneth W Cochran wrote: > Hello -scsi, > > (Yes, the old SCSI vs IDE flamewar, but I'd like to avoid that, > thank you... :) What flamewar ? :) May-be you refer to IDE being reported fast for sequential access under stupid benchmarks but slow for really useful IO patterns. No flamewar needed here. :-) > This is related to FreeBSD because I'm considering these devices > for a FreeBSD box... :) A recent message on this list spoke to > this issue in general but I could use some info as to the > specifics, if possible. > > Partly on my recommendation, a freind of mine tried SCSI as a > proposed upgrade to his old IDE system. He is/was interested in > improving performance with sequential saves while editing & > cd-burning music (live recorded recitals). File sizes are in > the 10s & possibly 100s of mb. > > He got a Tekram DC-390U2W & an IBM Ultrastar DNES-318350. There > are/were a couple of other previous scsi peripherals (older IBM > hdd & a tape drive, I think) running on an Adaptec 2910. OS is > Win9x (not sure exactly which). The Tekram DC-390U2W uses a SYMBIOS 53C895 PCI-SCSI PCI-SCSI controller. This controller is as _good_ as Tekram drivers for the U2W board are pathologically _bad_. ;-) If your friend is using the Tekram driver, since it seems the SYMBIOS driver for Win95/98 does not recognize the board, things should not be so optimal, in my opinion. > What happened: Sequential saves with older scsi disk (vs older > ide) took twice as long, & sequential saves with new IBM took > twice as long as with older scsi disk. Hmmm... could the driver be incredibily bad or the new drives not having write caching enabled but old ones having write caching enabled ? (Or something too weird to guess about ...) Disk write caching option should be checked, in my opinion. > The file/save on the ide took about 4 minutes, the "old" scsi > disk (an IBM) took 8 minutes & the new IBM DNES took 15m:21s. > His IDE is not even the newer, supposedly faster, stuff. 15 minutes is probably time enough for writing more than 10 GB to the IBM disk. Something seems extremally wrong with the system, unless dozens of GB are actually saved, which I guess is not the case. > I've always read & heard that Unix in general & FreeBSD more > specifically perform much better with scsi hdds than ide > (better, more intelligent i/o, "multithreadedness," > multitasking, etc.), & that this might not be the case with > Win9x, due to its "single-threaded" nature, but would that > account for this magnitude of performance difference? Speaking about SCSI in general and SYMBIOS controllers in particular, I think that FreeBSD gives the best possible support (Btw, we are not using drivers from Tekram for DC-390/U/F/U2W/U2B controllers). > I've always been quite satisfied with scsi & unhappy with ide > for systems I've built & used (Unix, Linux, *BSD). 2 questions: > > 1. What's going on "here" in M$/Win9x? This seems off-topic here. You should suggest your friend to give a try with FreeBSD and may-be pain somewhere he will have compared to his preferred O/S regarding SCSI IO performances. :-) > 2. What does this imply (or not imply) for FreeBSD? In my opinion, this does imply _nothing_ for FreeBSD, neither for Linux by the way (since I also maintain Symbios drivers for Linux:) ). > FAQ, -doc, & other reference pointers are, of course, quite welcome. :) The access method is called 'CAM' and the driver you want to use for the SYMBIOS 53C8XX based controllers is called 'sym'. The 'sym' driver appeared in FreeBSD 4.0 but is also available for 3.X. There is another driver called 'ncr' that also supports the SYM53C895. Regards, Gerard. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Sun May 21 10:40:30 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from mail.hiwaay.net (fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AC3637B90A for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 10:40:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dkelly@hiwaay.net) Received: from nospam.hiwaay.net (tnt6-216-180-4-227.dialup.HiWAAY.net [216.180.4.227]) by mail.hiwaay.net (8.11.0.Beta1/8.11.0.Beta1) with ESMTP id e4LHePr05185; Sun, 21 May 2000 12:40:25 -0500 (CDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nospam.hiwaay.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA66868; Sun, 21 May 2000 12:21:48 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from dkelly@nospam.hiwaay.net) Message-Id: <200005211721.MAA66868@nospam.hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: Kenneth W Cochran Cc: freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG From: David Kelly Subject: Re: SCSI 2x-4x slower than IDE? In-reply-to: Message from Kenneth W Cochran of "Sun, 21 May 2000 08:21:10 EDT." <200005211221.IAA01609@world.std.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 12:21:48 -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Kenneth W Cochran writes: > Hello -scsi, > > (Yes, the old SCSI vs IDE flamewar, but I'd like to avoid that, > thank you... :) [...] > 1. What's going on "here" in M$/Win9x? I think your Win9x friend should look into the caching mode page settings on his new IBM drive. New IBM drives that I've seen have shipped with caching disabled. Its not fair to compare unless the caching is the same on all. > 2. What does this imply (or not imply) for FreeBSD? It means to accurately apply it to FreeBSD you have to try it. -- David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@hiwaay.net ===================================================================== The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its capacity -- the rest is overhead for the operating system. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Sun May 21 13:36:37 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from front1m.grolier.fr (front1m.grolier.fr [195.36.216.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3031F37B991 for ; Sun, 21 May 2000 13:36:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from groudier@club-internet.fr) Received: from ppp-163-110.villette.club-internet.fr (ppp-163-110.villette.club-internet.fr [195.36.163.110]) by front1m.grolier.fr (8.9.3/No_Relay+No_Spam_MGC990224) with ESMTP id WAA12901; Sun, 21 May 2000 22:35:58 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 22:11:54 +0200 (CEST) From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?G=E9rard_Roudier?= X-Sender: groudier@linux.local To: David Kelly Cc: Kenneth W Cochran , freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: SCSI 2x-4x slower than IDE? In-Reply-To: <200005211721.MAA66868@nospam.hiwaay.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 21 May 2000, David Kelly wrote: > Kenneth W Cochran writes: > > Hello -scsi, > >=20 > > (Yes, the old SCSI vs IDE flamewar, but I'd like to avoid that, > > thank you... :) > [...] > > 1. What's going on "here" in M$/Win9x? >=20 > I think your Win9x friend should look into the caching mode page=20 > settings on his new IBM drive. New IBM drives that I've seen have=20 > shipped with caching disabled. Its not fair to compare unless the=20 > caching is the same on all. Given the differences in elapsed time that has been reported: 4 min for old IDE 8 min for old SCSI > 15min for new SCSI I am not sure that write behind caching by the drive is the issue. Btw, an O/S is also supposed to cache disk data and sort requests. =20 > > 2. What does this imply (or not imply) for FreeBSD? >=20 > It means to accurately apply it to FreeBSD you have to try it. And I bet that either differences would be just reversed, or issue,=20 if any, would be quickly fixed. G=E9rard. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Mon May 22 6:19:45 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from p2.acadia.net (p2.acadia.net [205.217.210.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1FE037B565; Mon, 22 May 2000 06:19:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tbuswell@acadia.net) Received: from smpbox (ip142167012045.acadia.net [142.167.12.45]) by p2.acadia.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA15473; Mon, 22 May 2000 09:19:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from tbuswell@localhost) by smpbox (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA00699; Mon, 22 May 2000 09:24:23 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from tbuswell) From: Ted Buswell MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 09:23:22 -0400 (EDT) To: wietse@porcupine.org (Wietse Venema) Cc: freebsd-mobile@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Data point: FreeBSD 4.0 + removable SCSI support In-Reply-To: <20000520143950.0D9664563D@spike.porcupine.org> References: <20000519154650.2816B4563D@spike.porcupine.org> <20000520143950.0D9664563D@spike.porcupine.org> X-Mailer: VM 6.43 under 20.4 "Emerald" XEmacs Lucid Message-ID: <14633.12600.583933.997406@smpbox> Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Wietse Venema writes: > Without devices attached to the SlimSCSI 1460B, "camcontrol rescan 0" > reports success. > > With random hardware connected to the SlimSCSI 1460B, "camcontrol > rescan 0" reports success, and the kernel says: You didn't say it explicitly, I assume (from the message subject) that the limited success (with other targets or no targets attached) is with a 4.0 kernel? I did a quick check, and my understanding is that 3.4 is using the driver in /sys/i386/isa which is the same as the driver in 2.2, while 4.0 and on use the driver in /sys/dev/aic ("old" works vs. "new" doesn't). So your original complaint about the aic driver in 4.0 is probably well founded: it sounds to me like the aic driver is not handling garbage from the Jaz device gracefully. -Ted To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Mon May 22 6:41:12 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from spike.porcupine.org (umbilical.porcupine.org [168.100.189.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4DE337BACA; Mon, 22 May 2000 06:40:58 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wietse@porcupine.org) Received: by spike.porcupine.org (Postfix, from userid 100) id 4419C4565A; Mon, 22 May 2000 09:40:53 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: Data point: FreeBSD 4.0 + removable SCSI support In-Reply-To: <14633.12600.583933.997406@smpbox> from Ted Buswell at "May 22, 0 09:23:22 am" To: tbuswell@acadia.net (Ted Buswell) Cc: wietse@porcupine.org, freebsd-mobile@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG X-Time-Zone: USA EST, 6 hours behind central European time MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1430 Message-Id: <20000522134053.4419C4565A@spike.porcupine.org> Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 09:40:53 -0400 (EDT) From: wietse@porcupine.org (Wietse Venema) Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Ted Buswell: > > Wietse Venema writes: > > Without devices attached to the SlimSCSI 1460B, "camcontrol rescan 0" > > reports success. > > > > With random hardware connected to the SlimSCSI 1460B, "camcontrol > > rescan 0" reports success, and the kernel says: > > You didn't say it explicitly, I assume (from the message subject) that > the limited success (with other targets or no targets attached) is > with a 4.0 kernel? Indeed, this is the same 4.0-20000518-STABLE kernel that "hangs" with the Jaz 2GB drive plugged into the SlimSCSI 1460B controller. > I did a quick check, and my understanding is that 3.4 is using the > driver in /sys/i386/isa which is the same as the driver in 2.2, while > 4.0 and on use the driver in /sys/dev/aic ("old" works vs. "new" doesn't). Unfortunately, I am not qualified to debug the aic driver. This is better handled by someone who has studied that code before. > So your original complaint about the aic driver in 4.0 is probably well > founded: it sounds to me like the aic driver is not handling garbage > from the Jaz device gracefully. I expect the problem to show up with Jaz 2GB drives on other SCSI controllers, too, and expect that it will eventually be fixed. So there is hope that my primary enviroment will be supported again by mainstream FreeBSD code, which is my preferred solution. Meanwhile, I will migrate to 3.4+PAO so that I can do useful work. Wietse To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Tue May 23 19:16:31 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from netserver.pth.com (cc529084-b.glou1.nj.home.com [24.23.78.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 174C737B9FF for ; Tue, 23 May 2000 19:16:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from paul@pth.com) Received: from dell.pth.com ([192.42.172.11] helo=dell) by netserver.pth.com with smtp (Exim 3.13 #1) id 12uQie-0000NE-00 for freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org; Tue, 23 May 2000 22:16:24 -0400 Message-ID: <010b01bfc525$2c9b4ba0$0bac2ac0@pth.com> From: "Paul Haddad" To: Subject: quirk_table entry for a Hitachi DK319H Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 22:04:19 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi All, I've been trying to get my DK319H scsi/SCA drive to work properly in my server. After looking through some linux kernel sources for similar drives I saw several models of HITACHI drives that do not like more then one LUN probed. I added the following entry to the xpr_quirk_table. { /* Doesn't like multi-LUN probing. */ { T_DIRECT, SIP_MEDIA_FIXED, "HITACHI", "DK319*", "*" }, CAM_QUIRK_NOLUNS, /*mintags*/0, /*maxtags*/255 }, This seems to work, but I'm not sure what the values should be for min/max tags. Can someone tell me how to find that out? Are the above settings 0 & 255 suboptimal? How do I go about making sure the above is added to the code tree? --- Paul Haddad (paul@pth.com) AIM:(ETS Paul) My pen is at the bottom of a page, Which, being finished, here the story ends; 'Tis to be wished it had been sooner done, But stories somehow lengthen when begun. -- Byron To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Wed May 24 0:33:44 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.kdm.org (panzer.kdm.org [216.160.178.169]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B37837B721 for ; Wed, 24 May 2000 00:33:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@panzer.kdm.org) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.kdm.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) id BAA21699; Wed, 24 May 2000 01:33:14 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ken) Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 01:33:14 -0600 From: "Kenneth D. Merry" To: Paul Haddad Cc: freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: quirk_table entry for a Hitachi DK319H Message-ID: <20000524013313.A21635@panzer.kdm.org> References: <010b01bfc525$2c9b4ba0$0bac2ac0@pth.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <010b01bfc525$2c9b4ba0$0bac2ac0@pth.com>; from paul@pth.com on Tue, May 23, 2000 at 10:04:19PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, May 23, 2000 at 22:04:19 -0400, Paul Haddad wrote: > Hi All, > > I've been trying to get my DK319H scsi/SCA drive to work properly in my > server. After looking through some linux kernel sources for similar drives > I saw several models of HITACHI drives that do not like more then one LUN > probed. I added the following entry to the xpr_quirk_table. > > { > /* Doesn't like multi-LUN probing. */ > { T_DIRECT, SIP_MEDIA_FIXED, "HITACHI", "DK319*", "*" }, > CAM_QUIRK_NOLUNS, /*mintags*/0, /*maxtags*/255 > }, > > This seems to work, but I'm not sure what the values should be for min/max > tags. Can someone tell me how to find that out? Are the above settings 0 & > 255 suboptimal? How do I go about making sure the above is added to the > code tree? You probably want to set the minimum to 2, if the drive does tagged queueing okay. (i.e. if it doesn't time out, or perform poorly with tagged queueing turned on) 255 is fine for the maximum. The actual maximum value will be determined automatically. We reduce the maximum tag count to N if we get a queue full error from the drive when we try to send transaction N+1. As for getting it into the tree, I would suggest filing a PR, either with send-pr or via the web interface on www.freebsd.org. This is mainly so that we don't forget about it. Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@kdm.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Fri May 26 7:52:21 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from relay.connectionsusa.com (relay.connectionsusa.com [209.118.236.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26D4137B52D for ; Fri, 26 May 2000 07:52:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from steve@iserve.com) Received: from [63.64.105.73] (helo=iserve.com) by relay.connectionsusa.com with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 12vLSx-000F1n-00 for scsi@freebsd.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 10:51:59 -0400 Message-ID: <392E570D.9F1342B4@iserve.com> Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 10:50:53 +0000 From: Steve Robinson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 4.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: scsi@freebsd.org Subject: What RAID card ???? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org What is the best, fully supported RAID card that i can get for FreeBSD? I was thinking of getting an Adaptec AAA 131U2, but did not see it in LINT. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Fri May 26 12:49:23 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from sable.cc.vt.edu (sable.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.30]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DEB437B877 for ; Fri, 26 May 2000 12:49:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gemorga2@vt.edu) Received: from mail.vt.edu (gkar.cc.vt.edu [128.173.16.40]) by sable.cc.vt.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA26236 for ; Fri, 26 May 2000 15:49:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gemorga2 ([128.173.52.150]) by gkar.cc.vt.edu (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.2000.03.23.18.03.p10) with ESMTP id <0FV6006MRN1QTH@gkar.cc.vt.edu> for freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org; Fri, 26 May 2000 15:49:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 15:49:01 -0400 From: George Morgan Subject: Best scsi controller for application... To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Message-id: <392E9CED.29541.D0CA9@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I'm going to recommend a particular scsi controller (or controllers) to a friend of mine and wanted to get some advice. Unfortunately the machine will probably be multiple booting some version of Windows (98 or 2000) and FreeBSD. The controller will have at least a Plextor CD-ROM (UW scsi) and an IBM UW, U2W or U160 SCSI hard drive. I'd also like a recommendation on what kind of scsi hard drive to choose (best support of tagged command queueing, tech support, etc) There may be some legacy devices (fast narrow) so the controller needs to support brand new and slower devices. Thank you for your time. George Morgan Virginia Tech Electrical Engineering Class of 2000! (Graduating in 2001, Co-op) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Fri May 26 14:34:15 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.kdm.org (panzer.kdm.org [216.160.178.169]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A19EB37B87B for ; Fri, 26 May 2000 14:34:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@panzer.kdm.org) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.kdm.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) id PAA41688; Fri, 26 May 2000 15:34:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ken) Date: Fri, 26 May 2000 15:34:08 -0600 From: "Kenneth D. Merry" To: George Morgan Cc: freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Best scsi controller for application... Message-ID: <20000526153408.A41647@panzer.kdm.org> References: <392E9CED.29541.D0CA9@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <392E9CED.29541.D0CA9@localhost>; from gemorga2@vt.edu on Fri, May 26, 2000 at 03:49:01PM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Fri, May 26, 2000 at 15:49:01 -0400, George Morgan wrote: > I'm going to recommend a particular scsi controller (or controllers) > to a friend of mine and wanted to get some advice. > > Unfortunately the machine will probably be multiple booting some > version of Windows (98 or 2000) and FreeBSD. The controller will > have at least a Plextor CD-ROM (UW scsi) and an IBM UW, U2W > or U160 SCSI hard drive. I'd also like a recommendation on what > kind of scsi hard drive to choose (best support of tagged command > queueing, tech support, etc) There may be some legacy devices > (fast narrow) so the controller needs to support brand new and > slower devices. I would recommend getting an Adaptec controller. Before someone screams, you can also get a Symbios/LSI controller or QLogic controller. All are well supported, but the Adaptec boards are easiest to find. You should get a controller that has the combination of connectors you need for whatever you're going to put on it. Some controllers, like the Adaptec 29160 have a SCSI-SCSI bridge chip that lets you put single ended and LVD devices on the same bus. The 29160 would probably fit your criteria -- it has an internal Ultra160 connector, an internal Ultra Wide connector, and an internal 50-pin connector. The only caveat about the Adaptec boards right now is that the Ultra160 controllers will only run at 80MB/sec with 4.0 or -current. You need Justin's patches that he posted to the -scsi list a couple of weeks ago in order to do Ultra160. Because of that, a Symbios/LSI controller or a QLogic controller might be better if you have to have Ultra160 right now. As for drives, I'd recommend high end Seagate and IBM drives. i.e. IBM Ultrastar and Seagate Cheetah and Barracuda. Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@kdm.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Sat May 27 7:27:31 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from cx587235-a.chnd1.az.home.com (cx587235-a.chnd1.az.home.com [24.11.88.170]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14E4837BACD for ; Sat, 27 May 2000 07:27:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jjreynold@home.com) Received: from whale.home-net (whale [192.168.1.2]) by cx587235-a.chnd1.az.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA00422 for ; Sat, 27 May 2000 07:27:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jjreynold@home.com) Received: (from jjreynold@localhost) by whale.home-net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA92471; Sat, 27 May 2000 07:27:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from jjreynold@home.com) From: John Reynolds MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <14639.56140.811003.867404@whale.home-net> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 07:27:24 -0700 (MST) To: scsi@freebsd.org Subject: What chipset is Tekram DC-315U? X-Mailer: VM 6.73 under Emacs 20.6.1 Cc: Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Does anybody know what chipset Tekram is using for their DC-315U controller? http://www.tekram.com/hot_products.asp?Product=DC-3X5_Series I've got the DC-310 in my machine currently and am quite happy with it (it uses the symbios/ncr 53c810a chip which is quite well supported). This is a good "cheap" scsi controller that I'm thinking of throwing in another box that will run 3.4-S then eventually 4.1-S. Does anybody have any idea what chipset it is, and if it is supported under 3.4-S and 4.0-S? Searching the archives for DC-315 yielded absolutely nothing. Thanks, -Jr -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= John Reynolds Chandler Capabilities Engineering, CDS, Intel Corporation jreynold@sedona.ch.intel.com My opinions are mine, not Intel's. Running jjreynold@home.com FreeBSD 3.4-STABLE. FreeBSD: The Power to Serve. http://members.home.com/jjreynold/ Come join us!!! @ http://www.FreeBSD.org/ =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Sat May 27 12:31:27 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from mail.inka.de (quechua.inka.de [212.227.14.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53B2C37BA46 for ; Sat, 27 May 2000 12:31:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from daemon@mips.inka.de) Received: from bigeye.rhein-neckar.de (uucp@) by mail.inka.de with local-bsmtp id 12vmIg-0000kk-04; Sat, 27 May 2000 21:31:10 +0200 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by bigeye.rhein-neckar.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) id VAA56805 for freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org; Sat, 27 May 2000 21:11:13 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from daemon) From: naddy@mips.inka.de (Christian Weisgerber) Subject: Re: What chipset is Tekram DC-315U? Date: 27 May 2000 21:11:12 +0200 Message-ID: <8gp6kg$1neo$1@bigeye.rhein-neckar.de> References: <14639.56140.811003.867404@whale.home-net> To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org John Reynolds wrote: > Does anybody know what chipset Tekram is using for their DC-315U controller? Their very own TRM-S1040. This should be mentioned somewhere on their web site, btw. I'm under the impression that this is supported, but I can't find any reference to it, so I may be mistaken. Check the archive of this list. Also, don't Tekram themselves provide drivers for FreeBSD? -- Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Sat May 27 13:13:56 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from panzer.kdm.org (panzer.kdm.org [216.160.178.169]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEAAD37BA2A for ; Sat, 27 May 2000 13:13:53 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ken@panzer.kdm.org) Received: (from ken@localhost) by panzer.kdm.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) id OAA52843; Sat, 27 May 2000 14:13:50 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from ken) Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 14:13:49 -0600 From: "Kenneth D. Merry" To: Christian Weisgerber Cc: freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: What chipset is Tekram DC-315U? Message-ID: <20000527141349.A52796@panzer.kdm.org> References: <14639.56140.811003.867404@whale.home-net> <8gp6kg$1neo$1@bigeye.rhein-neckar.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2i In-Reply-To: <8gp6kg$1neo$1@bigeye.rhein-neckar.de>; from naddy@mips.inka.de on Sat, May 27, 2000 at 09:11:12PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sat, May 27, 2000 at 21:11:12 +0200, Christian Weisgerber wrote: > John Reynolds wrote: > > > Does anybody know what chipset Tekram is using for their DC-315U controller? > > Their very own TRM-S1040. This should be mentioned somewhere on > their web site, btw. > > I'm under the impression that this is supported, but I can't find > any reference to it, so I may be mistaken. Check the archive of > this list. Also, don't Tekram themselves provide drivers for FreeBSD? Tekram has written a CAM driver for FreeBSD, so it is supported by Tekram. The driver isn't in the tree, however. Another caveat about the chip is that it doesn't appear to have its own SCSI phase engine. So you'll likely have several interrupts per SCSI I/O with that chip. I think you'd probably be better off with one of their Symbios/LSI controllers. Ken -- Kenneth Merry ken@kdm.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-scsi Sat May 27 15:30:43 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Received: from mail.inka.de (quechua.inka.de [212.227.14.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62AD737BA6A for ; Sat, 27 May 2000 15:30:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from daemon@mips.inka.de) Received: from bigeye.rhein-neckar.de (uucp@) by mail.inka.de with local-bsmtp id 12vp6J-0003wl-00; Sun, 28 May 2000 00:30:35 +0200 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by bigeye.rhein-neckar.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA63448 for freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org; Sat, 27 May 2000 23:38:44 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from daemon) From: naddy@mips.inka.de (Christian Weisgerber) Subject: Re: What chipset is Tekram DC-315U? Date: 27 May 2000 23:38:43 +0200 Message-ID: <8gpf93$1tud$1@bigeye.rhein-neckar.de> References: <14639.56140.811003.867404@whale.home-net> <8gp6kg$1neo$1@bigeye.rhein-neckar.de> <20000527141349.A52796@panzer.kdm.org> To: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-scsi@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Kenneth D. Merry wrote: > I think you'd probably be better off with one of their Symbios/LSI > controllers. Oh, certainly, but those are more expensive. If you look at Tekram's product line, the S1040-based cards are obviously the low-end ones. -- Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-scsi" in the body of the message