From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sun Feb 17 18:03:27 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E1C914D79E4; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 18:03:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C7340804E7; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 18:03:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1HI3N3B095694 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 17 Feb 2019 10:03:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1HI3N31095693; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 10:03:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2019 10:03:23 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: C7340804E7 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.26 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.91)[0.914,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.86)[0.861,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.72)[0.716,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.08)[ip: (0.15), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.21), asn: 73(0.10), country: US(-0.07)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2019 18:03:27 -0000 Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. How does one prevent this autoloading? -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sun Feb 17 23:15:00 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D9AF14E4CF4 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 23:15:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic307-8.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (sonic307-8.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com [98.137.64.32]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E4B5C8DD8C for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 23:14:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) X-YMail-OSG: DRrbEkgVM1l0fytXJ6Qu._.xp1SyVZk7fuJQeAQbmE9UmyAc8JYOuGSdPLAdE1O NpNM.FvP8PODtN0yowIwzOVaHpvEoQoDBmIJflRFj3fEsMttRGmCUKZuUonYSPzDjgc3JhZ8D8Ew ro1ILAIpnRYykqmMfPTPfrnrsDh0sW3e7XE049qsHj37XejHrBikaZOFeL2t7.O5rCha44Qq7kbh FeK0.QMAFHfY_JqfcnEOcvZ3ReAb2LS3ftkUtfZ8G7s7Ti_dmTf62Yc4pexDz5hmDe0UAkKf44RD gEcvvMTicCqaCvuQ5MuGACFobmr1HhY0Ql7FWcLCpPddw3cLmNHiXN8vJj3.A_ZFi5bKbjISaeq4 uUq6eCU_eXDL4UoSapxA0IzFpV2jB_R8JsF2MS0uTAbzoJXYT_NXvsXzEbMYoI87M7ce162jC6qv S_O_xwzP_EJMvWtW8gmCcHNF1GYODYEF_a1ufClQML8E1W6Ig_8iM5dFmMrFQDZ0e0AwrfxuoKff gOUMFpeXCAPyWR4VqjxuiJrhsIQtncMT4rkp0pa3rbDch21xLXgkKpLYysbVM7RtbygwBsJ8JkTN ngwusxE.VfJiq7lrz4eMtF0QlRv734Z5_XIk1WYCzfwuZx8WvOhHcafl73hqRTTs5oQEiM3biSkS YqSIFRkZYTxvgCbcNUBHXIjbQpDCgCVCPRSZYPzHWhgKLvPIRV.5M9lrwOqYYQcIyt9.o89Iq.Bw Tz2CAsFQzikGb1MJhiiuTtDkay9jG9ltwWiGJAOztc_MAEwvRDcEjQKbxzg1fyxxQsFDGRGZiMLd ZYEw6uUMgGdg5n91rAD9_f4JHGSH3Omf3CtSc9Zfwj2d_06hAelkuKyEqTEao2EwaDFB04ll3oJR VWTAxEOgxzAC9un8sw5QU6yskO5Cl6DEGPJZ5HwIhLKCsVXzrxx73EOLMbjzW0OpgVwUWQUvH9Qo Tj7z04q7OnQ5JT7JKKD2ks_073qc0UA9YgOazmznHJowylCCqjxZWZnX14wJKzkEiKybeBXGUqNS Rgm4WELnGBuVzqVOWtb51uZTQ4nCBv1UwrWkc.jCnuPG2TKkDe7c2InOj Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic307.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 23:14:51 +0000 Received: from c-67-170-167-181.hsd1.or.comcast.net (EHLO [192.168.1.113]) ([67.170.167.181]) by smtp411.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 9fa775c7fddaee7b1c83e8dfde0a9cbc; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 23:04:42 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.2 \(3445.102.3\)) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2019 15:04:41 -0800 Cc: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <4135B088-DF13-4867-ABF4-5659D47C8997@yahoo.com> References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> To: Steve Kargl X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.102.3) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: E4B5C8DD8C X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.07 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mta6.am0.yahoodns.net]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/21, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.97)[0.974,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(1.17)[ip: (4.62), ipnet: 98.137.64.0/21(0.72), asn: 36647(0.58), country: US(-0.07)]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.87)[0.868,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.57)[0.570,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[32.64.137.98.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2019 23:15:00 -0000 On 2019-Feb-17, at 10:03, Steve Kargl wrote: Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. How does one prevent this autoloading? Looking via the web lead to: = https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=3Devdev&apropos=3D0&sektion=3D4&= manpath=3DFreeBSD+12.0-RELEASE&arch=3Ddefault&format=3Dhtml So: NAME evdev - Generic Linux input driver SYNOPSIS Section "InputDevice" Identifier "devname" Driver "evdev" Option "Device" "devpath" Option "Emulate3Buttons" "True" Option "Emulate3Timeout" "50" Option "GrabDevice" "False" ... EndSection DESCRIPTION evdev is an Xorg input driver for Linux's generic event devices. = It therefore supports all input devices that the kernel knows = about, including most mice, keyboards, tablets and touchscreens. evdev is the default driver on the major Linux distributions. . . . but it seems to not have a 13-current entry. It does have a 12.0-RELEASE entry. =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com ( dsl-only.net went away in early 2018-Mar) From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 00:02:35 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1923C14E6DF1; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 00:02:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vladimir@kondratyev.su) Received: from corp.infotel.ru (corp.infotel.ru [195.170.219.3]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 484828FD7B; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 00:02:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vladimir@kondratyev.su) Received: from corp (corp.infotel.ru [195.170.219.3]) by corp.infotel.ru (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B35629872; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:02:20 +0300 (MSK) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at corp.infotel.ru Received: from corp.infotel.ru ([195.170.219.3]) by corp (corp.infotel.ru [195.170.219.3]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gRULRRqO6ry2; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:02:18 +0300 (MSK) Received: from mail.cicgroup.ru (unknown [195.170.219.74]) by corp.infotel.ru (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC90F29868; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:02:17 +0300 (MSK) Received: from mail.cicgroup.ru (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cicgroup.ru (Postfix) with ESMTP id 514A742211F; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:02:17 +0300 (MSK) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at cicgroup.ru Received: from mail.cicgroup.ru ([127.0.0.1]) by mail.cicgroup.ru (mail.cicgroup.ru [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with SMTP id HrUP0QtqBWQW; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:02:14 +0300 (MSK) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cicgroup.ru (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 4B70242211C; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:02:14 +0300 (MSK) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:02:13 +0300 From: Vladimir Kondratyev To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? In-Reply-To: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Message-ID: <71aa0ee09292b0e8648e385de33c455f@kondratyev.su> X-Sender: vladimir@kondratyev.su User-Agent: Roundcube Webmail/1.3.5 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 484828FD7B X-Spamd-Bar: +++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [3.86 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.69)[0.694,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kondratyev.su]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.81)[0.813,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mail.kondratyev.su]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.36)[0.363,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8299, ipnet:195.170.192.0/19, country:RU]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[country: RU(0.00)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 00:02:35 -0000 On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to > be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom > kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and > wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > How does one prevent this autoloading? > Anyone have insight into what evdev is? evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input events like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > I do not need nor what these modules loaded. I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config should disable most of evdev.ko dependencies -- WBR Vladimir Kondratyev From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sun Feb 17 18:08:34 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C27214D7B07 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 18:08:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from o.hartmann@walstatt.org) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.gmx.net", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass DE-2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EFF418052F for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 18:08:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from o.hartmann@walstatt.org) Received: from thor.intern.walstatt.dynvpn.de ([78.55.254.108]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx003 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MKqOW-1gvQrb2wwS-00015h for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 19:08:27 +0100 Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2019 19:07:53 +0100 From: "O. Hartmann" To: FreeBSD CURRENT Subject: poudriere: 12-STABLE install fails after r344230 Message-ID: <20190217190808.1922c4b2@thor.intern.walstatt.dynvpn.de> Organization: WALSTATT User-Agent: OutScare 3.1415926 X-Operating-System: ImNotAnOperatingSystem 3.141592527 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:c3DyWkHbqFYBOTDbmk6/DGdEsrFFiYwfk9sCEbkod4uvPKeKtWL K2t4itFOjqYovSJei1gkGOCl28Ec/1rEB3FEkHVTL8rnWVWG1l+QWhaQ0fpYCzDXxdcA+I6 yImcnCGx+8J7UDMDxWicNsFwthSLQkzElgCmNHlYHSR58SZKhbaJFHzwvyP4em75hPJvyGQ oDPl2TT+aOaPR1musdYTw== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:xDkbnkAgvQ8=:bTGWNoJGcNLQdN/+o06+zb FNK/G3B/yiMj5hx/Ka1EancKM/vH6lt0kO7Z/0GzD+c/msEUTqlRSteZXKpdUYw6W/FYm7FFG l8PgQ4vbtYYIRD1uVjaGicZJ1vNHu17Dfxe112hXd5UIq16jl7TZYHELdQi+P9nVO9eyTtzlO peDwQrwDn0+VH9cYwvBJxY90cpHrjg7mEF/Ozo68fmrwzPudD0p/nbWps8Xeat11nyHdEw/gr Oh4dhcP0j5gCQyXkiyIVkYo2KUAWxJAivN82GacSRp/Tc3mdLdf4NJ72R2PT9suq+YyfDzJd1 ncPffbuaEJijwAdt6pxg/qx5TfrEFVUF3aqSizdOl+wyk1j8t+RqX8th/WQHNB6VDOR53Z9Az CRw6zWajSYKESc3TSX1kMjja3jLSzhAnILUSigdGs+39SaRXwTI1Em5UD6vCUO3HvIPQSbkRa dk4uiw4QvGwExlrTc/gChwDmN7DJKHMnBMADIF/rqFoHIwWQN2r6tvA0QcwLOZGN+PmeXivzJ 4QdcdcmA38tcB8ym2jZc72VCeFOa828GQIhBJXfj5nu7ofD9wVy3fSfvZzB+KOZncXLIK12lg ReG3ET7t6qq0w1zONh4TkcbkDH+IOL2zlCdAHZkJjomGBF18EPrXkciBJ9FrjOlQpaUVnX206 tocUvMSQk34i/CgC+qIld1RbFtPXMO5WNuMlkuGK0i31z4gU0j81APY2y9yzosCNKKYAwmgGL KBvR/F063LZhdA44pE5YmKEi3N64xl18EHC0MdDM0rGtJ9c30DU5Y24m5hSudiO1TitKP5Jix wO8ZATrx8+fdTbbh37TGl++8RVvvBX5lwdOWDQw74ISdItW1E/yAhQo5i6nRQeTXmWuda0wym VIdxIVNXsXayWtG9I4onn32VYZKThgF7WEn6gsyEha0m8R2zcLH7kVMLPwJpaJcFxbJs8n8aO fFatsqBpm4A== X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: EFF418052F X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.42 / 15.00]; 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Mon, 18 Feb 2019 00:24:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0671369C5C; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 00:24:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1I0OtEX098286 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 17 Feb 2019 16:24:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1I0OtMM098285; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 16:24:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2019 16:24:55 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Mark Millard Cc: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190218002455.GA98130@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <4135B088-DF13-4867-ABF4-5659D47C8997@yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <4135B088-DF13-4867-ABF4-5659D47C8997@yahoo.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 0671369C5C X-Spamd-Bar: +++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [3.71 / 15.00]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[yahoo.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.08)[ip: (0.15), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.21), asn: 73(0.10), country: US(-0.07)]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.49)[0.492,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.83)[0.834,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.61)[0.614,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 00:24:59 -0000 On Sun, Feb 17, 2019 at 03:04:41PM -0800, Mark Millard wrote: > > > On 2019-Feb-17, at 10:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > > Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to > be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom > kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and > wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > How does one prevent this autoloading? > > Looking via the web lead to: > > https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=evdev&apropos=0&sektion=4&manpath=FreeBSD+12.0-RELEASE&arch=default&format=html > So: > > NAME > evdev - Generic Linux input driver > > DESCRIPTION > > evdev is an Xorg input driver for Linux's generic event devices. It > therefore supports all input devices that the kernel knows about, > including most mice, keyboards, tablets and touchscreens. evdev > is the default driver on the major Linux distributions. > . . . > > > > but it seems to not have a 13-current entry. It does have > a 12.0-RELEASE entry. > Thanks. Kinda odd that freebsd-current doesn't have a manual page, but FreeBSD-12 does. I have a wireless logitech mouse. It seems that the wireless USB dongle is causing the load of the modules. I still understand why as ums(4) does not should a dependency on uhid, wmt, or evdev. -- Steve 20170425 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWUpyCsUKR4 20161221 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbCHE-hONow From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 02:35:33 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66F6214EE613; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 02:35:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AC3A16F5A5; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 02:35:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x1I2ZP4S003280; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 18:35:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x1I2ZPoZ003279; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 18:35:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201902180235.x1I2ZPoZ003279@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? In-Reply-To: <20190218002455.GA98130@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2019 18:35:25 -0800 (PST) CC: Mark Millard , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: AC3A16F5A5 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.08 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.81)[0.815,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.88)[0.880,0]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.50)[0.505,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[ip: (0.02), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.01), asn: 13868(-0.01), country: US(-0.07)]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[yahoo.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 02:35:33 -0000 > On Sun, Feb 17, 2019 at 03:04:41PM -0800, Mark Millard wrote: > > > > > > On 2019-Feb-17, at 10:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to > > be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom > > kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and > > wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > How does one prevent this autoloading? > > > > Looking via the web lead to: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ web lies > > > > https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=evdev&apropos=0&sektion=4&manpath=FreeBSD+12.0-RELEASE&arch=default&format=html > > So: > > > > NAME > > evdev - Generic Linux input driver > > > > DESCRIPTION > > > > evdev is an Xorg input driver for Linux's generic event devices. It > > therefore supports all input devices that the kernel knows about, > > including most mice, keyboards, tablets and touchscreens. evdev > > is the default driver on the major Linux distributions. > > . . . > > > > > > > > but it seems to not have a 13-current entry. It does have > > a 12.0-RELEASE entry. > > > > Thanks. Kinda odd that freebsd-current doesn't have a manual > page, but FreeBSD-12 does. rgrimes@t400:~ % man evdev No manual entry for evdev rgrimes@t400:~ % man -k evdev apropos: nothing appropriate rgrimes@t400:~ % uname -a FreeBSD t400.dnsmgr.net 12.0-RELEASE FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE GENERIC amd64 rgrimes@t400:~ % There is no man page for evdev in 12.0-RELEASE > > I have a wireless logitech mouse. It seems that the > wireless USB dongle is causing the load of the modules. > I still understand why as ums(4) does not should a > dependency on uhid, wmt, or evdev. > -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 02:48:24 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D31114EF587 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 02:48:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) Received: from outbound3d.ore.mailhop.org (outbound3d.ore.mailhop.org [54.186.57.195]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8FEC8701C5 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 02:48:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1550458068; cv=none; d=outbound.mailhop.org; s=arc-outbound20181012; b=CYMmLxDVrlwuFzB+5aKO4pQJvhLHmBiNIfvNfUajjAjSWfmH3tbgjtgbG7IU4jZ9aqor/EmziuUfx MHWWX6Iq/JdB4GJwzwPpsS6BrecKFbWgxVc9EGUlBTZdfWnThJHFkh0xgKMPHoajw6pi6OvBOPfunM M7SnlG0HKb7uIOWfpQTIRLc43HGfKPhPmVX8KJN5yknHfDL8h/vqo0U7m3zx8FY64rW/LsGwbs7W4r 6e537jiLJjOW+dRFPsX94XBviohUmEzark+qYaiEXC1Mn50IZ9JRgkBQG3W6KBMp0Uo3x8bhWPBH// erWyzEJCSGOnzAsN2vj1xDb5mRf1GKQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=outbound.mailhop.org; s=arc-outbound20181012; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:content-type:references:in-reply-to: date:cc:to:from:subject:message-id:dkim-signature:from; bh=tYHoTWYUpCvxFjKF3TSvaLdLO7g0F4Vuf1+bF111Qpk=; b=g5KAMDS1FSYA3vAt+xi0TfAdrP3CsnzHtgI6ROh4IvQZG68+DsypavMS1pKD99iUQ+nOQ1Fb8k1XJ IgQePa+PRv2VS5/IXyvQoxQ+n8RDepYSPwUPpCCVVMnxmYnryexFCFFN+bKPSNUIZBi3cOSKycBsxv sWBmXjGc3kcI7Aa4TISplQaeKKBQkh+ks2qAM2niFvZqFJV7crfAjFY35EmuhNlItcISk6wXOM1vng 3RzjkYur9nVOU6fPNVMkVM2p3cfV1pZ9Js/R4irLt7mOH3gNnSWf5xx49pIx2EqS+YdtkxVkYCOWCB qWy5zMKPFkw2zoDW43j7cawbDvglzug== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; outbound3.ore.mailhop.org; spf=softfail smtp.mailfrom=freebsd.org smtp.remote-ip=67.177.211.60; dmarc=none header.from=freebsd.org; arc=none header.oldest-pass=0; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=outbound.mailhop.org; s=dkim-high; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:content-type:references:in-reply-to: date:cc:to:from:subject:message-id:from; bh=tYHoTWYUpCvxFjKF3TSvaLdLO7g0F4Vuf1+bF111Qpk=; b=KsxIBWssZZU56bwqNS3Rp78oQSsnN7gpzzeVQ0CTOUH3uRl+O2FZk3NrgCgf5B+wm9E2Qvn32v4DH oOfikd4MXnNonVrgF3QboeBuqRgJ8/Ekwgj3SdeWEt8eQK6r3C0Mh/qEFBfzIuwcMiGVu1ellCHwZv EolPZ3zbhuZoYqVC6S4muslIXoREAur8nz5Ba+FbP2dkTIcW1G3vvgBhKXU2oqNiaGlWDDfFGb4Jze u9S2BVymCq4EHbwlFKsvqtYD2Zev5NdtyAyHI4JOfa1NIRus+NeC5sdHy2MWHc6ZsEOO7Un5hWCUmV 1AsbeBC1g6XfQz3KVzPRsH4ppLLcGQA== X-MHO-RoutePath: aGlwcGll X-MHO-User: 92488d09-3327-11e9-9789-75353a1f43cf X-Report-Abuse-To: https://support.duocircle.com/support/solutions/articles/5000540958-duocircle-standard-smtp-abuse-information X-Originating-IP: 67.177.211.60 X-Mail-Handler: DuoCircle Outbound SMTP Received: from ilsoft.org (unknown [67.177.211.60]) by outbound3.ore.mailhop.org (Halon) with ESMTPSA id 92488d09-3327-11e9-9789-75353a1f43cf; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 02:47:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from rev (rev [172.22.42.240]) by ilsoft.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id x1I2mJ3s076432; Sun, 17 Feb 2019 19:48:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <221bcaeb995b085058513323980315b68cd3190f.camel@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? From: Ian Lepore To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu Cc: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2019 19:48:19 -0700 In-Reply-To: <20190218002455.GA98130@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <4135B088-DF13-4867-ABF4-5659D47C8997@yahoo.com> <20190218002455.GA98130@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.28.5 FreeBSD GNOME Team Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 8FEC8701C5 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.99 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.988,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16509, ipnet:54.186.0.0/15, country:US] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 02:48:24 -0000 On Sun, 2019-02-17 at 16:24 -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > On Sun, Feb 17, 2019 at 03:04:41PM -0800, Mark Millard wrote: > > > > > > On 2019-Feb-17, at 10:03, Steve Kargl > troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote: > > > > Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to > > be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom > > kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and > > wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > How does one prevent this autoloading? > > > > Looking via the web lead to: > > > > https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=evdev&apropos=0&sektion=4&manpath=FreeBSD+12.0-RELEASE&arch=default&format=html > > So: > > > > NAME > > evdev - Generic Linux input driver > > > > DESCRIPTION > > > > evdev is an Xorg input driver for Linux's generic event > > devices. It > > therefore supports all input devices that the kernel kn > > ows about, > > including most mice, keyboards, tablets and touchscreens. evdev > > is the default driver on the major Linux distributions. > > . . . > > > > > > > > but it seems to not have a 13-current entry. It does have > > a 12.0-RELEASE entry. > > > > Thanks. Kinda odd that freebsd-current doesn't have a manual > page, but FreeBSD-12 does. > That manpage you found online is in section 4x. It probably gets installed along with the xf86-input-evdev package. -- Ian From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 06:41:50 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC0EB14F4CE8; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 06:41:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ohartmann@walstatt.org) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.22]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.gmx.net", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass DE-2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B1BEE80330; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 06:41:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ohartmann@walstatt.org) Received: from freyja ([46.88.80.226]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx103 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MQzoI-1gTYBp2bnC-00UGBP; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 07:41:24 +0100 Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 07:41:13 +0100 From: "O. Hartmann" To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, Mark Millard , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190218074107.7b9afcda@freyja> In-Reply-To: <201902180235.x1I2ZPoZ003279@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> References: <20190218002455.GA98130@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <201902180235.x1I2ZPoZ003279@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:PrXMd9DQOwifOTi6BgDHpSieJJk33sm8jMBx00smdQA8NWPgU/n bUPexDMFdAb3ZL7ivQSJqaMIwNqF3pP5owkSfhPUeMy2yqmx4PkpcxykDyG91eHwqMQO2k0 R2t0i3phV9EI48Zkf/wWZHE7p5lBaKlmzAll++PnFiCkrIOfZ0trxZ3DgaAQza792W1XnbY Fe673AbB9iY4h8WfEXEKw== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:iPCV8uxLs1s=:eErITMq32UK2k/VZwxLn5q xxVtp2jb3RBprg+VpdGqyrlNY1p2WjjKcf6FZ9lnJb1Wp04kGY2BRNDWlWy1czwu6VFpiZ/Oq lbxQiEvpq5pacNO3C/iPUm0hxengwgZ58H9b1g40eIiaJGTvW22RESXjMPSszVfb5Jzf+Waxs Tyyu4aEfxHO45deg79M5ZXMwCy0OkkW9wxrneH2hJTwcp6Us3mUf4klP2nQEWigcBXO6jV1ha v2hQBweNUuYbdGHms0fwATcJ00vFWVIacUN28ZM18R/5yFG1gGiED2RxRyHkiK5pOlT1mNjWL +bwZXmlWfdWrUeG4FlTMbB+uv/osUHkuQy8rrjUp9UHZxudcUoWe7p+SvtPThPyTXQ5V/1k7l SAx6M4r/cJebC08/W6XeHsQiFMqPbi5ujijQdpS3nT0O2vVoDx2tBVaieGO0ZZbIBxeSX5v/S kxj1GN9OtktW0+732VLUj24iutM/iHVSGi65jyerMaulT2E5u2GgqPeIJB0XlTe1BBUFrYEZC vk+8qH7frvGERXaqMdl0GFiNViDlW3ro/eDq4u/uQZb5BibZShGrIzR0Y2dI1NTeKdeY2bqVq WLiRN+3rEu7tuFTTa8Q1VENvH/u2Khj6ejgAbNwAueFdZ0f750eMtYh/ZIeIpWNagX9AEeG9n MxM00WHwH5UaKWc10si0jDWJavnJdEfiIy4RUB/DbHgdeDW0Gbab22jbEVltsJhhxYsnkhNj2 qdmmxABPrvSewTJ7pS7820VYJ2IorZdF8UmrEj+87hp2T4yJQOkApehKTZxRViYBewnsCiU80 yVbJJqE0SnIUfNyYYrJHj+qS2m4Avhm+f7yPkvBnXgWnEj+Xk4bBNfm2ZR0uvpAuyzcgBQmkQ jVooyY+4NdLBi/vv1K43UFOiWXh4umBVOYacpMs22X4Zt1wRz2f/l1mTtiAElb1KUq14MS8ot VHBHOPUNWoA== X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: B1BEE80330 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.49 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.64)[-0.638,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.49)[ip: (-3.50), ipnet: 212.227.0.0/16(-0.84), asn: 8560(1.90), country: DE(-0.01)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[walstatt.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.84)[-0.845,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mx01.gmx.net]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.80)[-0.804,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[226.80.88.46.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.10]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[22.17.227.212.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.3.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:212.227.0.0/16, country:DE]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 06:41:50 -0000 On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 18:35:25 -0800 (PST) "Rodney W. Grimes" wrote: > > On Sun, Feb 17, 2019 at 03:04:41PM -0800, Mark Millard wrote: > > > > > > > > > On 2019-Feb-17, at 10:03, Steve Kargl > > troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote: > > > > > > Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to > > > be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom > > > kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and > > > wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > > How does one prevent this autoloading? > > > > > > Looking via the web lead to: > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > web lies > > > > > > > https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=evdev&apropos=0&sektion=4&manpath=FreeBSD+12.0-RELEASE&arch=default&format=html > > > So: > > > > > > NAME > > > evdev - Generic Linux input driver > > > > > > DESCRIPTION > > > > > > evdev is an Xorg input driver for Linux's generic event devices. > > > It therefore supports all input devices that the kernel knows > > > about, including most mice, keyboards, tablets and touchscreens. evdev > > > is the default driver on the major Linux distributions. > > > . . . > > > > > > > > > > > > but it seems to not have a 13-current entry. It does have > > > a 12.0-RELEASE entry. > > > > > > > Thanks. Kinda odd that freebsd-current doesn't have a manual > > page, but FreeBSD-12 does. > > rgrimes@t400:~ % man evdev > No manual entry for evdev > rgrimes@t400:~ % man -k evdev > apropos: nothing appropriate > rgrimes@t400:~ % uname -a > FreeBSD t400.dnsmgr.net 12.0-RELEASE FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE GENERIC amd64 > rgrimes@t400:~ % > There is no man page for evdev in 12.0-RELEASE > > > > > I have a wireless logitech mouse. It seems that the > > wireless USB dongle is causing the load of the modules. > > I still understand why as ums(4) does not should a > > dependency on uhid, wmt, or evdev. > > > Nor 12-STABLE: root@freyja:/usr/src # man -k evdev apropos: nothing appropriate FreeBSD 12.0-STABLE #290 r344158: Fri Feb 15 14:42:58 CET 2019 amd64 Kind regards, oh From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 07:06:59 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8458B14F56D4 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 07:06:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ohartmann@walstatt.org) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.22]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.gmx.net", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass DE-2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7819480F82 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 07:06:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ohartmann@walstatt.org) Received: from freyja ([46.88.80.226]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx102 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LfYqz-1hOe7K1fGz-00p8xK for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:06:55 +0100 Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:06:54 +0100 From: "O. Hartmann" To: FreeBSD CURRENT Subject: Re: poudriere: 12-STABLE install fails after r344230 Message-ID: <20190218080648.263615c6@freyja> In-Reply-To: <20190217190808.1922c4b2@thor.intern.walstatt.dynvpn.de> References: <20190217190808.1922c4b2@thor.intern.walstatt.dynvpn.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:+w4BvV3POLE6fH4C6fQ0AdW8AKcmnX/5g7I+R4zdY1NTiQ+I670 Jk1bT/4/VSSpJiEY+sxCe0EQcwPZZP20G4cCJ0tqSLPOmmoimt9T3qSCQRtptqnEXLZNIYO mwT+0KhtAeJVuH5heV/p3jeOZYM/qGcLsinyoj+eUxwmDWI+i3AkY0B15A2Xg/R7qsBtsDp 5Dm3WnfUFiXzRXMJaLTpg== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:cFEdsVelSJo=:ac9cnCqIdPcfdtUd4J+66s XK4a7Mjuk0MZdJFx4R3NTh96ycnio7Nhgre58YBHoifm4RUkMvZD8WSze9strmAwzMRiFryQX L4VtUV6tiU+ss8X7CSlV16BS73KjTUz1/2wzBTGdC/v9dk2guf0jUCYQL++eP/soaSlVjYYis yd3msl/mbbmQnIknM7mlQ4LmzKe02ouoUhUxXX6syfK8XZXDut9CHGFvF55Sl9fiKpIL3ZGCI qA8oUyt9+6m9npWJs9XJY6nuN9txwg/yjvjXhyx9cboM344gZLqq3BS+x9UHqArPalpSl4i6q PUiR9G6bUMvv/r0c4x6NzLvCHQ93gpKX+g09v1z1rguZkx4vJQ7sfHpjWUxu7eJ+Iqgdji9P+ F3neUi/lighkR1XAAbkfOLOEzmdF8v6Qr/065eHoLkI4rmZOoe81EBSIGy/38TUzSzGAX2DIg cdkZrXXfdXdLmtaTb0Shw5CmmWu0ffRr9XOHntZsm+W4Ze8nPWp4Wo64PKXma8ojgNgxgBrux dlTRbz7JHf7qlciA1/F+hILBKzqDEhv6K5GD1L5s/RJYTxuPznj/xxlmfeM/axax3ix6+Eghi yoxcK9SfJyWlldsZF2d8QWcGejDBTSvFboQ7GW4IClGOGwi6ZEZZR2a7WbcxBEoFetyIFND6f wQEnSkAiBwXvhskVfw+bjzQqqnQ5CkpQcEbXZG9QbkJVCGVSjpRxtp4vxN56Srh5jIInu5EgV 2iD6ZkDB6O3XwGZwrrFK++hTaXzAQXWfriq8YIz1qVe0BTNI3WhpzjKcuA9qo4QM4Pv+L5QwU 2HXJtf9PkngncNoEM8cs9yZie7BHTZKqD5VYp5CyA41l+RToNsDtN3U+NlwmHariftf89WUh0 3LE1lg0Kh7ld31SnTk89keC1HKB8NqUPmD89QE28pcxoe4gzxamfOx8gVwlZuUmRvqF8lg9BH xJfeCcrTAfg== X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 7819480F82 X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.41 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.40)[-0.403,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.48)[ip: (-3.45), ipnet: 212.227.0.0/16(-0.84), asn: 8560(1.90), country: DE(-0.01)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[walstatt.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.92)[-0.923,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mx01.gmx.net]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.89)[-0.891,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[22.17.227.212.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.3.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:212.227.0.0/16, country:DE]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[226.80.88.46.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.10] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 07:06:59 -0000 On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 19:07:53 +0100 "O. Hartmann" wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA256 > > Hello, > > after the bump of 12-STABE to 1200503 I'm unable to update AMD64 poudriere > jails's to this version anymore! Now I run on every box into this error: > > [...] > > install -N /pool/sources/12-STABLE/src/etc -C -o root -g wheel -m 444 > libnandfs.a /pool/poudriere/jails/12-amd64/usr/lib/ --- _INCSINS --- > install -N /pool/sources/12-STABLE/src/etc -C -o root -g wheel -m 444 > libnandfs.h /pool/poudriere/jails/12-amd64/usr/include/ --- _libinstall --- > install: libnandfs.a: No such file or directory > *** [_libinstall] Error code 71 > > make[5]: stopped in /pool/sources/12-STABLE/src/lib/libnandfs > > For arm64.aarch64 jails with the same build environment this error doesn't > show up! The base host is running CURRENT. > > What the ... has this libnandfs.a to do? > > Since I build 12-STABLE on CURRENT, I use sources > at /pool/sources/12-STABLE/src and I also > utilize /usr/local/etc/poudriere.d/12-amd64-poudriere.conf with one line > > export MAKEOBJDIRPREFIX=/pool/sources/12-STABLE/obj/ > > to reflect the build tree. > > This worked prior to 12-STABLE r344234, it still worls when building and > installing for arm64.aarch64 (same host, same CURRENT, same 12-STABLE > revision). > > How to fix this? > > Thanks in advance, > > oh > [...] It seems that the issue occurs on CURRENT. Boxes running 12-STABLE (r344158) or 12.0-RELENG (r344247) do not show the problem shown above. From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 08:49:59 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF08614F7AEF for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:49:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic306-20.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic306-20.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.189.82]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6916484895 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:49:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from marklmi@yahoo.com) X-YMail-OSG: jnnnZYQVM1lcmDn2bBmKBk1GkTMK1jBY7SePPLLa7pluWLG8O55XB5idhBTicZY apUtlW04Z1S.ja0rNrz..MwSGj04r6IGmlJdOGZRs3wSIgoNrVyjpvMEQ_nX_6BzDvyP8aS1ZEJs o4n3zkCEvIhs9Jyj2VyrE3v4YHr6swCq_EW.eCn56Z_Jj3ddGrWuz4S0_LvyXUHIJuWAy.bZC2b4 aQAnn4vKAtMPFtON_GyXJdDeTYVBqqKWQjhYKXkc3Q54U2WAtp2YqUXAOrZbqZJKiKiJUAa1n0jE 4sOBqD6yOZrexG822dZtmBywxpME8CosJ3UJS26wJvqnjN_xV9r_TjddwQz01UsoHXXWUIg1DiEY k98HDDlo8BQ_7sm.QZdauOMlWGEILV4cbcc9WRkPFhs0wLGxIvb01dj5KDEndWirS7IN10xHqneP KUubG87E2sG3wf1UUuw.CePS4XUklnnuzTyydn.BdCEQH2uWe5S0j6kYU1Ev78PHi0kDKZXRnQiY UFViQs7WCvoBwkpfEa5dc6K__Gpk08h46TZtL_mRD14IL8l5dsVIDR2VoLBuFM0UwhZ1XEVuBW9G WjG2z7jwe1qRu_QA48oLpzNodlQ9nLi8ak5R7lFUJoabf5RXzUCYy.KMQcTklmcYFo62xNJY1qFJ i3sp692QUEUi6xjGXOJlRnbWWiQklstXYgz9Lo7KgEpWT38.6KaByRi3ZngKju_VStkbDbTVvHKU 9RG7BbjhhUgROio3ulegD0RJyodrKOP0P6YU2q2ZPN6DEnHnFaPsDcIpsyMVpuR.5Cha2B.AqITU V8leNanBt2zJnz0dXr89t4Ng0RFBFtBe5LTRYiCaP2xPzIefE3eY7Ld.Fqe3MgGblUymdNCECOdw 2DdmiJEUWsWf_4eoS.bvpsQ7J18qaxqlUy2P29rrpkNgpUwecZC37OSzCvko6aw92a7AYeP7droW L0F8Xax1WOFlDTWP1NoRQeHcoDAFFRIwTVaYTRhAIkeZPc4eqR.u8qYFIrvRRQUuypLulHFtufG2 KbTo14CkDwAKRk5GvxwaPmakCcvkxonwCNfHjjb.fVB_gd3lXr6YQAPPWl7Ru.WKLa3Dm Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic306.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:49:51 +0000 Received: from c-67-170-167-181.hsd1.or.comcast.net (EHLO [192.168.1.113]) ([67.170.167.181]) by smtp412.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 20a12c3958418ade33dd20c09f76e8e1; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:49:50 +0000 (UTC) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.2 \(3445.102.3\)) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? From: Mark Millard In-Reply-To: <201902180235.x1I2ZPoZ003279@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 00:49:48 -0800 Cc: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <201902180235.x1I2ZPoZ003279@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> To: "Rodney W. Grimes" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.102.3) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 6916484895 X-Spamd-Bar: +++ X-Spamd-Result: default: False [3.76 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mta6.am0.yahoodns.net]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36646, ipnet:66.163.184.0/21, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.66)[0.661,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(1.22)[ip: (4.20), ipnet: 66.163.184.0/21(1.10), asn: 36646(0.88), country: US(-0.07)]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.79)[0.794,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.59)[0.591,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[82.189.163.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:49:59 -0000 On 2019-Feb-17, at 18:35, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >> On Sun, Feb 17, 2019 at 03:04:41PM -0800, Mark Millard wrote: >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On 2019-Feb-17, at 10:03, Steve Kargl wrote: >>>=20 >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to >>> be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom >>> kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and >>> wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. >>> How does one prevent this autoloading? >>>=20 >>> Looking via the web lead to: > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > web lies The URL I listed (below) is to www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query. . . and I looked at the page's content before sending the message. That is how I got the text that I quoted. (It is from section 4 "special files".) The freeBSD manpage servers might provide more man pages than are installed? >>>=20 >>> = https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=3Devdev&apropos=3D0&sektion=3D4&= manpath=3DFreeBSD+12.0-RELEASE&arch=3Ddefault&format=3Dhtml >>> So: >>>=20 >>> NAME >>> evdev - Generic Linux input driver >>>=20 >>> DESCRIPTION >>>=20 >>> evdev is an Xorg input driver for Linux's generic event devices. = It >>> therefore supports all input devices that the kernel knows = about, >>> including most mice, keyboards, tablets and touchscreens. evdev >>> is the default driver on the major Linux distributions. >>> . . . >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> but it seems to not have a 13-current entry. It does have >>> a 12.0-RELEASE entry. >>>=20 >>=20 >> Thanks. Kinda odd that freebsd-current doesn't have a manual >> page, but FreeBSD-12 does. >=20 > rgrimes@t400:~ % man evdev > No manual entry for evdev > rgrimes@t400:~ % man -k evdev > apropos: nothing appropriate > rgrimes@t400:~ % uname -a > FreeBSD t400.dnsmgr.net 12.0-RELEASE FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE GENERIC = amd64 > rgrimes@t400:~ %=20 > There is no man page for evdev in 12.0-RELEASE >=20 >>=20 >> I have a wireless logitech mouse. It seems that the >> wireless USB dongle is causing the load of the modules. >> I still understand why as ums(4) does not should a=20 >> dependency on uhid, wmt, or evdev. >=20 =3D=3D=3D Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com ( dsl-only.net went away in early 2018-Mar) From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 11:06:37 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B1AC14D5DD7; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 11:06:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sblachmann@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ot1-x343.google.com (mail-ot1-x343.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::343]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E7D8F892F0; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 11:06:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sblachmann@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ot1-x343.google.com with SMTP id t7so11190365otk.8; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:06:36 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=VgxtP391TkPCX2RNWhaP4svRw/lv0CBul2yjyLNR+dY=; b=G8ukcHSy4xEplwFzfzDh0H9DOySr6bl7sb9bZFTkaAnkCbv2pOghL0IUG0XZ5SdRBu p3xNLAaTCTT/1i3xBJO+dSB7VqO3SdaDIjs9jGVid3EcZ4clYzxtUPC/EmV4ffB2i+UY WzOJ2IsHJ905usJEGSf1lL+4wOateQZX5S7gOwzWRdLpUGghFvxjHk2wyyyijCJQlSLc aIpucMFlmAZpJWefLfaFO1pSAjjm/uomkCvWV0ESnjo1voc0yFl6sVRjFnkY7/W1P/uY 6dWddekDU/VzNHUFG+VDUrWWsS35dyu2+xU7BNVhLo4WeKwW3XjtWgTNY/7xRe/L5Mn8 GWqQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=VgxtP391TkPCX2RNWhaP4svRw/lv0CBul2yjyLNR+dY=; b=RG6o+AkQYyPbP1+SH7GB1bkvTkNrbnfMufx0xwLwaUcSFLMHr5R6flUXn69GmoTgFY zHYjVcjBNoRrh1RQtHReRLZRh2MSQne/sGcroJCxCt4XKxCNWOgRGlo9kVMRIayEFtNB GI4p0UJ6mR7SzBlhjrBHwIxBB7TU+WLglv3cNGJFqADDUbeT1cnJzplGSaMef7ZOtmMe a3lS6m+7FfXUkUgxSFwFg+XGKbU1zq499jE8IqqiAjHapXOO5r7L1SpLyvmxK/lweZMc y0TUwhSuHMbDTYR7XUR66MPqWZIDMKJ9Ew4kRpya2G0bkR5fqLQjd2mrI9FCvWOtpOTb wg+g== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZwG6B59RKCc0EkE2u5fGOr6H3RRv9ELb0X3MlMRlzWNwlUnz7Z jslpQDjrX76ANgrebPe8ksjg2RFSfKD1oCFTVdQW2w== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IakAUYnOoHdt8bG1N+S3gowfiibCmnZY4TkdFmCpOFOOn/NGZPlQK8j8C0c/XbZ3QRTN65yTQ+TMwWpzGf1q8A= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:6189:: with SMTP id g9mr13144696otk.311.1550487996317; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:06:36 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 2002:ac9:3044:0:0:0:0:0 with HTTP; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 03:06:35 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <71aa0ee09292b0e8648e385de33c455f@kondratyev.su> References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <71aa0ee09292b0e8648e385de33c455f@kondratyev.su> From: Stefan Blachmann Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:06:35 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: Vladimir Kondratyev Cc: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: E7D8F892F0 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=G8ukcHSy; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of sblachmann@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::343 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=sblachmann@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.16 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.99)[-0.988,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.14)[0.135,0]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; IP_SCORE(-0.30)[ip: (3.15), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.57), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 11:42:51 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 11:06:37 -0000 On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: > On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: >> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? > evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input events > like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. >> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config should > disable most of evdev.ko dependencies Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as well as libinput not be part of the standard packages? The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay Sievers mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up the mess they create. I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland fad... From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 12:43:30 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E5ED14DB264; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:43:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zeising@freebsd.org) Received: from mail.daemonic.se (mail.daemonic.se [IPv6:2607:f740:d:20::25]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DCC4F8D48D; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:43:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zeising@freebsd.org) Received: from cid.daemonic.se (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by mail.daemonic.se (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4433Sb53N6zDjVM; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:43:27 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at daemonic.se Received: from mail.daemonic.se ([IPv6:::1]) (using TLS with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256) by cid.daemonic.se (mailscanner.daemonic.se [IPv6:::1]) (amavisd-new, port 10587) with ESMTPS id uvDiIQECxIjZ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:43:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from garnet.daemonic.se (host-95-192-217-26.mobileonline.telia.com [95.192.217.26]) by mail.daemonic.se (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4433SX668fzDjCL; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:43:24 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev Cc: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <71aa0ee09292b0e8648e385de33c455f@kondratyev.su> From: Niclas Zeising Message-ID: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 13:43:22 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: DCC4F8D48D X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.96 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.963,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36236, ipnet:2607:f740:d::/48, country:US]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:43:30 -0000 On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: >> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? >> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input events >> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > > And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create > pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > >>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. >> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config should >> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > > Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as well > as libinput not be part of the standard packages? > > The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay Sievers > mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do > not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up the > mess they create. > > I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland fad... EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to improve input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means that a lot of input devices stop working, or work much worse. We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve the FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new users, and make current users use FreeBSD more. Evdev and libinput is used by both Wayland and xorg. You are free to use either one. Regards -- Niclas Zeising FreeBSD Graphics Team From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 12:56:11 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7C8A14DB7CD for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:56:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ot1-x32e.google.com (mail-ot1-x32e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::32e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E3D2F8DB04 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:56:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ot1-x32e.google.com with SMTP id n71so28017898ota.10 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 04:56:09 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:references:to:from:openpgp:autocrypt:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language; bh=jXLEALjtWNR8bO0jhCNjAT7YBMV+RNpzC990oKrNnNA=; b=CIgUeYs+bIaJOmrV30k8rRkaBBjUjfTJZDj76CbHbXV8rE2fKV/KhjcPypD7T/3aPj j/lCP156tnY2ZSTtmz5lOFsiWtlqR3jNgpebEy+qulBfavzEBhmyLFaDiR5bton1KGBp cHPxzvZzhvjHC0XwAstRcOAosvKp7B9WhRvWUaopFJ2wEpf/DZM2qM/AXgxjMy8TcsQv npdd3Jh8H+pvF5dQHULsuebxY9IEzjMZHkmGbR0v2I25v87SOKobh2npHQ26IqT1XvyM pyfZOxSrhK9G3BwSpZt94XNbEWoPhl1gcEEg6Uucok1ZkX/G7fC4EDJTSInmqyTjenAh 3fWA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:references:to:from:openpgp:autocrypt :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-language; bh=jXLEALjtWNR8bO0jhCNjAT7YBMV+RNpzC990oKrNnNA=; b=Qrze2YPpPvmijo9GbIAc/6M29xwp7bkzDCb885wh28TZMWL5faqd7ct4OCM8uAMa3W ym3xXSpKPkR+0cRGg0tt5tDAjwLe7RetuFsRdbh1VSnqwbQ+jNBs9k+I/z1TSn6FrqQt ddzuOYE4h+6+qwZQlm3GX6iqJIfKG0fjcU4y9d6Uaqlr8vNfewJ8eZA/UOCb82QEwC9A Fq2AeApkOK/uVzEWChdkDkNk6Mly0YcGKnGw2hKp5nKWprK0XxHwmGq1aL6i1LHz5IVs MvNPr23xOPVjGMIcE9yB2ueEjXbEFf8CcIwqdKauGjD+ekmuKnUu9tdDliPH0bzCTpYO OfHQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuYNdfNZorE3/oM2w+2z564rsJ468sEMfzlfuPVp4tIeVq9C61a2 PjRhI9KSwuFJGljnIh7TgDniqUPs X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IZ2GaAQoPS7FDoSfwRunjGTF4I4/dQRgHLuRFIusNTJcPpgFTfw3ShO6avkR0uU3KcBbYa1Mg== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6830:108c:: with SMTP id y12mr10624176oto.133.1550494568919; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 04:56:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.33] ([81.174.250.12]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s21sm1910695oie.52.2019.02.18.04.56.07 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 04:56:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: Fwd: What is evdev and autoloading? References: <928394c1-adab-d5bb-e2de-bd41a940392d@gmail.com> To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org From: Johannes Lundberg Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=johalun0@gmail.com; keydata= mQINBFxFmoIBEADoFO5jY+Fmsg44KiZjufEmpEf4kt7nCOfxNG9SruWpoXUaq0B296F+fIZC hNZqv1v7lGTsfoWRusxJmLd5CQgHHxEyruZbbPpNsQ/JKoDY3GGmrmWfN/SX3y0t0kdB9HsW mJcvZhK7we52f4gxddIVBS9nQoVoONX+hzXf8zwOAa0ik0EPgEwpIKS4j9lLq4bU+mqVKdRR bPeDujEA/qbsCKhaFJkPzXZtzEe6srq4RK1doEztwnKz02b+8gs642TRkWDQeTRZputrAaoN Un4R76A1QpXWyrFG1dQu48IGHi3KbkrvNyq6R1aUBIA0+CG1npIbxmc2mtSjoyvdipmDRbBD +mhECIxmYfBT6818zuj91XjrfOyfVdV2BryBvqFkJLkS3N3QElBIiVdDgdrqiNFWiOlDMxNI tdP16oQBNo8IB27/0YHpnQEw1MafZv5gG5DO0zLtLy88ASAfL7BYf90JP19rT4JIwnxsXxyv kEJnzhsXf0QVObEiAu1MqeFyWfZ8PpunmvEmJ0VChOL+v/kIx1E9cxhhzMZhqiMXfyM4zx2+ BF1FwAwJYPuJLu2B3L0uVBu+M1YvSOmKAbXPDP8PsqPjgSBTYI51MUjuuxN6jSsHDuK6G5k4 pUWR8axa+wafhd6Vz8zVwdTJZ9LdxgLLVg0kprBgccPHhPAZVQARAQABtCZKb2hhbm5lcyBM dW5kYmVyZyA8am9oYWx1bjBAZ21haWwuY29tPokCVAQTAQgAPhYhBIl1Pb3+hI60ivmRSULn yG4BGvSeBQJcRZqCAhsjBQkJZgGABQsJCAcCBhUKCQgLAgQWAgMBAh4BAheAAAoJEELnyG4B GvSe9O0P/RzeQAu1R37RlONZTXNn+qIAHvHbZEhzrCibzaZnwYdC31wGrYmXNDyiQIqOngFf QJuufQtH/+95OESJsjR+42L/pNfFdaEWxiI003qE7uCMzLK5UWUXd/5d5vYY0CaPyNCj1tyM ZIq7x4CaR3QLTh/Fw4zMUI/ZPH2S5SxVFGv0ZZFAdNYILD3qCkAS/9HmXsqufBWbfutA8TTf wyJfywmvf7ENjlZ4QOjb242ZY9NndqbmqTgWVAws+PN5e9AT8HkadscCTCSkYnxJyYG2El27 DpAAkekYplb/C0j82KSz2fy9RgwD+tTqt88DJOeFbIbrYt44u7KLHpzaZeqyUtn0reHCkE0W lnKH2kXXbuswFB4sONxI/J5+qSmOsAm5ItO3voyjm/swpmFR1yBlxo4th26gbO5NfBOK9YsY zHKgiRDv6ZdnHo+htphRxcCDHsFPzkQe5jouI25dvMZYl1LaTS/09lwYVwVIB2SFmMtFZ7rB N4NBSzPlpsg+g4dJNqiw6Rfa2Q/wUv+MzTJgLtHjDccXlpm33Nc09UytHFtNn26PO/zrM39r TwzdLu1mg0x2WWEWTIqe4CaczQU9SIg49BSyJNoPSZx3V7nMhTKbOeQKR5aV3dXI66aENw86 pa1tipuUKCPmope/GTJatUgPiD3JkyiD+7c1zQX2UAGmuQINBFxFmoIBEACb55RAkM59huAx 4Ddd8WBjsw25qf7rzxeRKAQ7or/8LvJBYQDPXZy0RhkRiu+P+MjxwGb6HVh+LDyAYDn9d8Mt ZqCP/dOGNcl7pkb6IhfRc3i5neckXCYfbm0cigiX9JkqZSt3KT96zbjCxsFZKyIyEFsMl46q 7wKWK5Irj3zxV/Z51JNTJyMLcIRWhY8G6qlMNFgZkz2Hv63w6BRekKVImOmOdThLAscy5ybq 2CIUeAwPG7lMYG9rgcPdn3tMPeWlLmUmi5pSwOQ3AKg3xFrW3WfegjRHdqpeuXoeTjYPPCW4 gyl59uv6E12a6eivItCxj67vlBXgOr4um+zoPyXG/WfidIFtWaEgyBrlGR1Klk7SIcqjEHUA FdiM+PweY4opHXXKn60NOZCqBJ59K43drOQgRouz8E2T3yEoYg40xAfY3lhJV/Vx5+kSTjmy sT2xotlPn/GzfaAEvNuJDK+Mec3LvfbbDoOWFolNyEvoMQqF5Q3A8eGqYsoVGBPxyzNvF2iY LkymxiXpgrSN0Q/LOK7pFlWwbVC8Z6g5I0J9ecgD55dGLoX2luLir787XX/JxGffzbRnP9NE ifenJGrQmx4CyEaz/CHQqSbROm5Uo/YFUX9J7OfUO4mtu90j773j32I3psey/Fz3EC/A2PHv Ghb0KsWYpS3Pj5TV1gGyswARAQABiQI8BBgBCAAmFiEEiXU9vf6EjrSK+ZFJQufIbgEa9J4F AlxFmoICGwwFCQlmAYAACgkQQufIbgEa9J7qOQ//YG/4e69YTSjtiYLXzBI8tRU2Sx+NFByx zx+C/r0EBThLtgRwCqEUZRB7iIDSO8aZ0Qa3vwWRohlD1tn/LBdDFfMmuQkNVdLIrjBoGBB9 B5xHdZJ9xnTZEwpTtk6IWolT4j+8rpGemGKKiFo3X6l02On4Qb4iM7h6rcDb76mfwooNYzB3 8PPcLvyOWb/9iCXAb5N7doo5zmOl15DVwvIF04eXU0q1FFj/iS1zNmtZ5Got82O1TQFV+de4 Rb3YA80IZhhhCiHHJqkMKeKQogRqU+UNDBARUBxfUtKsJtQzTQ2JUGwkb6X6bx53FTLP6O9q hDoODVweE1LdB1k1H5Nn+gawPdRMBqj43Y2amK7KEgoTBrwU04CLpKiaAC0S+EcJFfJcwtpK k3F+uTtP/hnhFnWbn8SgRkHKXKWqSCt63NstXhMzAJut1gEzV+CcPNKqa/sFgQaYEvzCS5Kl F/PXj0++f3TIFqT+2ZNNp8Bz8dT7gh8RPPg5oYQiCHH8K1RAmq7gKqmwyg0qgOazHnped+od X4f3qx320JAP6NP9wglDm6eht48NJzb0sffN8z34wrP66oz8oPKtS5CFV0m/384hEg0lmi3W wo2Hno7rA1etTPJX0dI6/GLlQDtNTHvKQ077HQdWVOMQVWC9j7YH7Zr9NjtOvxcNVRX3fxpJ 6CE= X-Tagtoolbar-Keys: D20190218125605829 X-Forwarded-Message-Id: <928394c1-adab-d5bb-e2de-bd41a940392d@gmail.com> Message-ID: Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:56:05 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; 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MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(-2.53)[ip: (-8.05), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.57), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[e.2.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:56:11 -0000 Missed to include current@ -------- Forwarded Message -------- Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 12:02:50 +0000 From: Johannes Lundberg To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org On 2/18/19 11:06 AM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: >> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? >> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input events >> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create > pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > >>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. >> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config should >> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as well > as libinput not be part of the standard packages? Evdev with libinput provide things like, multitouch gestures, horizontal scrolling, touchpad support, etc, i.e. functionality that one might expect from a laptop or desktop computer newer than 10 years,  also for X11. Having it enabled by default doesn't force you to use it but it makes it a whole lot easier for all of those who want to use it. Please try to consider what is the best middle ground for ALL users. If you have a special application for FreeBSD you're probably building your own kernel anyway and it is easy to disable if needed. Most normal (and especially new to FreeBSD) desktop/laptop users use stock kernel and would benefit from having access to this functionality. Cheers > The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay Sievers > mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do > not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up the > mess they create. > > I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland fad... > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 15:32:12 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A080014DEEE7; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 15:32:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A52766C8EC; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 15:32:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x1IFCPAY005712; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 07:12:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x1IFCOwm005711; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 07:12:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? In-Reply-To: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> To: Niclas Zeising Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 07:12:24 -0800 (PST) CC: Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: A52766C8EC X-Spamd-Bar: +++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [7.07 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; GREYLIST(0.00)[pass,body]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.39)[0.394,0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.83)[0.834,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.46)[0.461,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[ip: (0.02), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.01), asn: 13868(-0.01), country: US(-0.07)]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; SORTED_RECIPS(3.50)[]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 15:32:12 -0000 > On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > > On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: > >> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? > >> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input events > >> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > > > > And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create > > pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > > > >>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > >> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config should > >> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > > > > Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as well > > as libinput not be part of the standard packages? > > > > The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay Sievers > > mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do > > not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up the > > mess they create. > > > > I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland fad... > > EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to improve > input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means that a lot > of input devices stop working, or work much worse. > > We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve the > FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new users, > and make current users use FreeBSD more. Sadly your execution on that seems to be missing the mark, telling people they have to go get a port now to get drm working because it could not be maintained in base, and then telling them, oh, you need this new code in base so that it is so much easier to use graphical stuff this way. These seem to be conflicting stories. > > Evdev and libinput is used by both Wayland and xorg. You are free to > use either one. And sadly now must take action when no action was required before when using neither. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 15:57:01 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 723BD14DFF75; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 15:57:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [96.47.72.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8CB646D84D; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 15:57:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: from ivaldir.etoilebsd.net (etoilebsd.net [178.32.217.76]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: bapt) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8E0FDE029; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 15:56:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bapt@FreeBSD.org) Received: by ivaldir.etoilebsd.net (Postfix, from userid 1001) id D6D8EB732B; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:56:57 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:56:57 +0100 From: Baptiste Daroussin To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Niclas Zeising , owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Stefan Blachmann , freebsd-current@freebsd.org, sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, Vladimir Kondratyev Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190218155656.2mefeqixly6h25us@ivaldir.net> References: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="mz3cptckyzkaom3k" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> User-Agent: NeoMutt/20180716 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 8CB646D84D X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.97 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[FreeBSD.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.97)[-0.971,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:96.47.64.0/20, country:US] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 15:57:01 -0000 --mz3cptckyzkaom3k Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 07:12:24AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > > > On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: > > >> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > > >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? > > >> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input even= ts > > >> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > > >=20 > > > And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create > > > pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > > >=20 > > >>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > >> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config shou= ld > > >> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > > >=20 > > > Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as well > > > as libinput not be part of the standard packages? > > >=20 > > > The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay Sievers > > > mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do > > > not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up the > > > mess they create. > > >=20 > > > I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland fad= =2E.. > >=20 > > EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to improve=20 > > input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means that a lot= =20 > > of input devices stop working, or work much worse. > >=20 > > We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve the=20 > > FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new users,= =20 > > and make current users use FreeBSD more. >=20 > Sadly your execution on that seems to be missing the mark, > telling people they have to go get a port now to get drm working > because it could not be maintained in base, and then telling them, > oh, you need this new code in base so that it is so much easier > to use graphical stuff this way. >=20 > These seem to be conflicting stories. >=20 You are missing the point, one does not evolve as fast as the other, meaning one can be maintained within usual freebsd lifecycle, the other cannot or it becomes very painful. Bapt --mz3cptckyzkaom3k Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEEgOTj3suS2urGXVU3Y4mL3PG3PloFAlxq1cUACgkQY4mL3PG3 PlqdZQ/+PhAx2+Psefj4h846oBTwMjN03RuDOTUb+XrJZIyr6waYP8dHtZX5+VOE 7vMp+kHY5iFYrmx4fbpXpaQ3U5r24rGoO/ktWPET3mGTpETcYHpe+MTOMX00d2lB RR0tW1cDQT9qXBUTdGUdkOdGETSWwauDvzumcPY1RbnX8BlSVb8BvHmLV5wDPv9x +cTjygEhqMPwp5XjFpJrT6qlHSXxJcNnQa8zAT3pgpGqX3Zhf+iseWiPlKfZ4SxU LfOCaz+jxGUXi++THFJgKitFxPypWNiithqnN6nN3fsNiEC5uak4NbmKRNB40r2r HWsTd6nfGwUTN3XBLH3Z+1JArlSr7I30HYnwheNwjcmf8vMa26jOtdWTlApdq15q L1XOhxnEhVZW/+SSY0cZx7ic8wYxKYtjPJ1Ghv/9BONCS2OV3ktrH21S7aRO+xUy rmZtSD5Vn1uwWPE0r6dlzx3E29InSj9cqrqdbT5KLcW/vOXfE1AHs4InvBO0Bt9R YEBfgX0a0R9Xj/3yZEbyf8nArA5H30hJPJoBz/SBQXbtxqowTtK0scrDTRmGwwBB BRxWbJY8MEo8c8iFYMaoluVKAdDfnomSmdDXoBUatc8W211iVM/GpQp+LipY9xtU MpcGi5Yl8lZEVRVWHRTTS98c/A6KWeSimGoeuh8c/I9iTEsPgGM= =o0Zz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --mz3cptckyzkaom3k-- From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 16:11:29 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A212E14E0AAF for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:11:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-qk1-x743.google.com (mail-qk1-x743.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::743]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 84BDF6E7AD for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:11:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-qk1-x743.google.com with SMTP id x9so10288405qkf.0 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:11:28 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=o81iQshmY8bndyj4QyGgg7qH/OwOC1BRDHBlIAh/akw=; b=Hoxa/L5dYOXJOCHiLAvh2coO5ywRsWgNs5kO+4FjkpFP0wEwIzaPg0Omf69JXWDuJv X2RcMND5xQ+KgTaBCDzE8M/mgmrcko3hfCVcUp6SgZtwglJtY4oBJRxw4Nd8ZcxKQFfd Kr62faceeCThu9Zb6IiO7/hqny99u48PR/ONRNT7HkZuo1ycTNlNATDJDbUfxC7o0pyU PO5uX5DND/NtZ0w6PVcKlmqbw3ejmdxpAFZ5rqz/49/8QlBGXzxxYodYmsj0tCJ5YXyM ZjMEbMegk6KtXaCPGg3Qv+n2M3nQdNZ6wnfekLjqqC706DDymODahHZ37vxZaI26JOrU Se1Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=o81iQshmY8bndyj4QyGgg7qH/OwOC1BRDHBlIAh/akw=; b=XkxiY7JYljaUbh8cMNiSSZRwxIG6Smp8vXeIS54NhlKYCGNStHWyPz2oIIQq1LRQl1 JjAmRfPcxqVG32qa0pee+WXRpfP0Ppr3jJbnavx7Dtv3ZU4Lvo27r+OEaExgRV9e+k3j y5BGWblsglrRgEMIamNXFbJsq0/v16UOW9n6Dd6I1EPGuvr/Jfwl4acL62pobWCuDfr/ Mnm0/ubnbZDbCRCWcNIknWcfivnyrdDtldKvtN2Xgzv1aT9likLnZk7jEWCG1GVcL+tA LLy3JgZmSEShujJv8jSoB/SOCPsFNwlxqZPdLSvnCunJ394s9akjxW5Z2uvifJHDDsl4 I0Nw== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuYWhF9JFMgO9VWJ9pgBsD51zyF9M940OpYzJZIsz5DfaxRi6KQG 0FF5z6kS1J24tO7wcGyP9C02RrCPPPlhHdwuBfCaZg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IZD4qiA9m7SJyiK36QVMRrHcfeapmMkHwyLX4jWqO6uaCpxW6AOMB0SzhnU3BEPAMHfQKNm3uC24NpOnSJSSvo= X-Received: by 2002:ae9:e702:: with SMTP id m2mr8505010qka.279.1550506285870; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:11:25 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> In-Reply-To: <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> From: Warner Losh Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:11:14 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 84BDF6E7AD X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=Hoxa/L5d X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.73 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.25)[0.247,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[ip: (4.59), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.57), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.22)[0.220,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.72)[-0.717,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[ALT1.aspmx.l.google.com,aspmx.l.google.com,ALT2.aspmx.l.google.com]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:11:29 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 8:33 AM Rodney W. Grimes < freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > > > On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: > > >> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > > >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? > > >> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input events > > >> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > > > > > > And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create > > > pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > > > > > >>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > >> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config should > > >> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > > > > > > Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as well > > > as libinput not be part of the standard packages? > > > > > > The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay Sievers > > > mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do > > > not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up the > > > mess they create. > > > > > > I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland > fad... > > > > EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to improve > > input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means that a lot > > of input devices stop working, or work much worse. > > > > We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve the > > FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new users, > > and make current users use FreeBSD more. > > Sadly your execution on that seems to be missing the mark, > telling people they have to go get a port now to get drm working > because it could not be maintained in base, and then telling them, > oh, you need this new code in base so that it is so much easier > to use graphical stuff this way. > The drm stuff in the tree didn't support new hardware. And the in-tree rules made it impossible to import the GPL'd graphics drivers. And the in-tree code was abandonware that worked only by accident. > These seem to be conflicting stories. > You do know these constant complaints about people trying to make things better is demoralizing and counter productive. > > > Evdev and libinput is used by both Wayland and xorg. You are free to > > use either one. > > And sadly now must take action when no action was required before > when using neither. > Oh for foxs sake. We have so much stuff in the GENERIC kernel today that this complaint rings hallow. How many desktop users benefit from TCP_OFFLOAD? How many people SCTP? How many people are using ahc, ahd, siis, mvs, ata, hptiop, esp, trm, amr, ciss, twa, mfi, cbb, pccard, cardbus, de, le, ti, ae, hme, cas, nge, sf, tl, tx, wb, all the sound drivers, or all 4 of the different virtualization environments at the same time? Warner From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 16:11:31 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3998B14E0AC6; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:11:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4629A6E7D4; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:11:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x1IGBR79005948; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:11:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x1IGBQMD005946; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:11:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201902181611.x1IGBQMD005946@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? In-Reply-To: <20190218155656.2mefeqixly6h25us@ivaldir.net> To: Baptiste Daroussin Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:11:26 -0800 (PST) CC: Niclas Zeising , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Stefan Blachmann , freebsd-current@freebsd.org, sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, Vladimir Kondratyev X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4629A6E7D4 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.15 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.86)[0.862,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[ip: (0.02), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.01), asn: 13868(-0.01), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.83)[0.833,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.58)[0.580,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:11:31 -0000 > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 07:12:24AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > > On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > > > > On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: > > > >> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? > > > >> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input events > > > >> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > > > > > > > > And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create > > > > pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > > > > > > > >>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > > >> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config should > > > >> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > > > > > > > > Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as well > > > > as libinput not be part of the standard packages? > > > > > > > > The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay Sievers > > > > mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do > > > > not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up the > > > > mess they create. > > > > > > > > I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland fad... > > > > > > EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to improve > > > input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means that a lot > > > of input devices stop working, or work much worse. > > > > > > We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve the > > > FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new users, > > > and make current users use FreeBSD more. > > > > Sadly your execution on that seems to be missing the mark, > > telling people they have to go get a port now to get drm working > > because it could not be maintained in base, and then telling them, > > oh, you need this new code in base so that it is so much easier > > to use graphical stuff this way. > > > > These seem to be conflicting stories. > > > You are missing the point, one does not evolve as fast as the other, meaning > one can be maintained within usual freebsd lifecycle, the other cannot or it > becomes very painful. So to ditch our 5 years support model, kick the code out of the tree and make the users suffer? The support model is suppose to be under review, and IMHO, if kicking functional code out of the base system is to make it possible to meet some support model we should defanitly take a very close look at that issue. The code has simply gone from being in base to a few git repositories which are probably going to rot every time a breaking ABI change occurs and we wend up with un happy users, un happy developers and bugmisters who have to close bogus bug reports. Have we really moved the state of the art forward by this action, simply in the name of "we could not suppor that code?" -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 16:33:05 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A89D14E1ADF for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:33:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-qt1-x843.google.com (mail-qt1-x843.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::843]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 424B26FECC for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:33:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-qt1-x843.google.com with SMTP id b8so19789868qtr.9 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:33:04 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=JbPDdJJOLofwgwGdEbIEx/dCWpVs2snSZ1cmDe2RnNM=; b=JAKSsvkKxc7IEgmIJoTH99uI7Q21O7jLY/xZAHdijCiZD2bc6/HSeGw3DiaZZmtvy1 cF77wyqde9PD5HWJ0t/zeyr5+l5hJW6bBMTx9M93Og3+Rb5GCQaqq/M0D9/mww/o0TvX HpqjupzdA6HhaX2sGwy0hAnaPqmaWcDzDk2d6gJA8o2X9QEj6ETpP+2QHIIzb5j/WZzP fmD0GAiML8PLK+dYEHyKtCuh0nb6oyLS0tpR8CIvIHFPG33GeNtEituo0GE/p5tpXtLu psLCdX/9jUF5YK3ugd13OokFMIcMRVMrrfNKGtX13ql5iQHGQr66WWeklN/RurIkui3E LunQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=JbPDdJJOLofwgwGdEbIEx/dCWpVs2snSZ1cmDe2RnNM=; b=MkifuLN2eqtGHovoW5/MtYCjmSAo8grlkQcirv1hw4u12CnwvLxxsvSr13/haO9kqt sKmzEpBr+rYOZsm9ryqsbV56M87GAHXeXQf1IXuklGnzHOaGhSBDY1Xhq78ltDX6DXHM 8CUWeV0uO6FXHv2osF/TGxlVIG/5OTwI2kwAuqY06bHMDwlnyXPHGGvj4/lTOUm5JS/2 UEYFKpCqeSpbm2sXWsL9wPux+vx12YrEcA3xZ/klshgF105vu1224M8sA3EbEKNM5xlp ENYWC40wHPKaWhdLVs9W+RALKyJsB4dUGC7ybm4O1g51Ji9+SvPOkwy29+R9YJnyb4Ew 7Qhw== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZxgm4MAcW4WKqmqYnCAa4B0CoFdTabXleNw1UeBK5Gtdrfh+H8 puzyAeIdDFbJh/4EBGcoYQOAmIwfRgVxCkzdzXrWZg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYzVQr9Tm2ckvRY2KImR+Riqhy0Ph/IzwZWnF3ilv9W3XQCZTmWvrOKeY3vPInYlcNjDpqxzRzhJXmovhp4BFw= X-Received: by 2002:a0c:e98f:: with SMTP id z15mr18267976qvn.115.1550507583621; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:33:03 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20190218155656.2mefeqixly6h25us@ivaldir.net> <201902181611.x1IGBQMD005946@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> In-Reply-To: <201902181611.x1IGBQMD005946@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> From: Warner Losh Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:32:52 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 424B26FECC X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=JAKSsvkK X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.65 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.49)[-0.494,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.03)[-0.033,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.17)[ip: (3.76), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.57), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.94)[-0.944,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT1.aspmx.l.google.com]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.8.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:33:05 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 07:12:24AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > > > On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > > > > > On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: > > > > >> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? > > > > >> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input > events > > > > >> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > > > > > > > > > > And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create > > > > > pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > > > > > > > > > >>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > > > >> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config > should > > > > >> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > > > > > > > > > > Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as > well > > > > > as libinput not be part of the standard packages? > > > > > > > > > > The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay > Sievers > > > > > mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do > > > > > not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up > the > > > > > mess they create. > > > > > > > > > > I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland > fad... > > > > > > > > EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to improve > > > > input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means that a > lot > > > > of input devices stop working, or work much worse. > > > > > > > > We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve the > > > > FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new > users, > > > > and make current users use FreeBSD more. > > > > > > Sadly your execution on that seems to be missing the mark, > > > telling people they have to go get a port now to get drm working > > > because it could not be maintained in base, and then telling them, > > > oh, you need this new code in base so that it is so much easier > > > to use graphical stuff this way. > > > > > > These seem to be conflicting stories. > > > > > You are missing the point, one does not evolve as fast as the other, > meaning > > one can be maintained within usual freebsd lifecycle, the other cannot > or it > > becomes very painful. > > So to ditch our 5 years support model, kick the code out of the tree and > make the users suffer? The support model is suppose to be under review, > and IMHO, if kicking functional code out of the base system is to make > it possible to meet some support model we should defanitly take a very > close look at that issue. > > The code has simply gone from being in base to a few git repositories > which are probably going to rot every time a breaking ABI change occurs > and we wend up with un happy users, un happy developers and bugmisters > who have to close bogus bug reports. > > Have we really moved the state of the art forward by this action, simply > in the name of "we could not suppor that code?" > I don't know. I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything newer than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the old way is broken and doesn't work. Warner From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 16:35:38 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B3FC14E1CEB for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:35:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-qt1-x82a.google.com (mail-qt1-x82a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::82a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BAAD670129 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:35:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-qt1-x82a.google.com with SMTP id d18so9781344qtg.12 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:35:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=UVtTGJasIaMEMwexe1hhDBtP4J+jl+3ySvsWr9mSk6w=; b=xDDYov5Yj4zGH9GJI3/9fCVTlNQ+VXN7R1x/O7xncNUNTqAJF0t9p5f3kmAVliU6p4 lAYcP9bfucnNtsSpMHkLvR5FJQsbT3zuyj5mhADHn/CbXwHGUC+xjT2AX9AwVT/VkeU0 eV2akn/4Bws3JIwGY/xERXIzmiA+X6IPV9LoW/qyhZNpb8tSFsSSK+LcF/KqBGcauihj qPy6Q+V460cCPjkDDUgnM+65DtdwGxDLGEA5vab32Rev/0nojgt+KJMnByjxQzw6PIsB a6glQJ+DP/9nsu78hIlQYamL2AJdTGTYd6qd+sPTe0OK3Kh7xtmu7towsdXEC7uA2+lm W6PQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=UVtTGJasIaMEMwexe1hhDBtP4J+jl+3ySvsWr9mSk6w=; b=O3U3oSOUQKW5IIThE8oIGJPzcdv4U+jnSW/vsm+uSaF65Kpi4/bbOcDr5iLIvFn8wS 8sSf1m6tOJ7wYIWLayVYmC5oPvRT9SHolouidB0jWItkuGJPEqU34CKVcjxBiy2NitGX QYsfz2e0FLtwybu4mm6AC/R3h1jF7c9vUMFddAZzC4WGHlQKHfZRA04zZqpD8pjj4xc5 UdGoqIv/4SY44IvEtbLl+U2eK5tMc1+qgEQXRrtvWVaESq8lhvsxjDKxjT21XsEFVltN O2fLjSfVvy/rXY1uR7jezAIpsKGNkmwHeSFynJNXSpOYKTnNeSJ41JAAByIhGfqDvb94 9U8Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAubFMBakhISnk4a8W8v08J1pUwir+xKdTqb83YtrcrXkkzEEtoQg 33BLbzGsaTMyNZMuDfVo6kFKNjn7+hNB2iWOMapMfXPI X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYHnHbdiOEU80jdt/txgL4ehQq6uX8ElDp5BW9fK/neFvNLtkWllbOPiCIUY91eGsKQwjMV6mUtKveOaFmIgPI= X-Received: by 2002:ac8:16d0:: with SMTP id y16mr18428974qtk.345.1550507737273; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:35:37 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> In-Reply-To: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> From: Warner Losh Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:35:26 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: Steve Kargl Cc: FreeBSD Current , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: BAAD670129 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=xDDYov5Y X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.58 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.66)[ip: (-8.69), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.57), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT1.aspmx.l.google.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[a.2.8.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.91)[-0.910,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:35:38 -0000 On Sun, Feb 17, 2019 at 3:52 PM Steve Kargl < sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote: > Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to > be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom > kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and > wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > How does one prevent this autoloading? > Hi Steve, This thread has taken a weird turn, so I went back to the original post. When do these things get loaded? Is it when you start up X11? Or is it being brought in by devmatch? If it is being brought in by x11, there's likely an x11 config that you'll need to avoid them (but that will reduce functionality). If it is devmatch, then you can add them to the black list and have them not load them. Warner From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 16:38:32 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E42C14E2017; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:38:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 95D1A70408; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:38:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1IGcMjq003048 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:38:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1IGcMu6003047; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:38:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:38:22 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Baptiste Daroussin Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Niclas Zeising , owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, Stefan Blachmann , freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Vladimir Kondratyev Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190218163822.GA2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <20190218155656.2mefeqixly6h25us@ivaldir.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20190218155656.2mefeqixly6h25us@ivaldir.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 95D1A70408 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.03 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.77)[0.771,0]; IP_SCORE(0.08)[ip: (0.15), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.21), asn: 73(0.10), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.61)[0.609,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.88)[0.882,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:38:32 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 04:56:57PM +0100, Baptiste Daroussin wrote: > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 07:12:24AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > > > Sadly your execution on that seems to be missing the mark, > > telling people they have to go get a port now to get drm working > > because it could not be maintained in base, and then telling them, > > oh, you need this new code in base so that it is so much easier > > to use graphical stuff this way. > > > > These seem to be conflicting stories. > > > You are missing the point, one does not evolve as fast as the other, meaning > one can be maintained within usual freebsd lifecycle, the other cannot or it > becomes very painful. > And you seem to be missing the point. I'm now in week two of trying to figure out why drm-legacy-kmod no longer works, and suddenly new devices are popping up which are not configured in my kernel. I have deleted all ports. I have delete /usr/src and /usr/obj. I used svn to pull a -r "{2019-01-01}" /usr/src. That builds and works fine. I then build the minimum ports needs to install drm-legacy-kmod and xorg. I can fire a fvwm2 desktop. I'm now up to -r "{2019-01-28}". Yes, bi-section be date. It takes 6-7 hours to rebuild world and kernel and another hour or 2 for the minimum set of ports. PS: It still does answer why there isn't a manual page for evdev. -- steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 16:45:42 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25A7514E2690; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:45:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5A5F270B25; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:45:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1IGjdBe003116 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:45:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1IGjced003115; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:45:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:45:38 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Warner Losh Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Vladimir Kondratyev Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190218164538.GB2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <20190218155656.2mefeqixly6h25us@ivaldir.net> <201902181611.x1IGBQMD005946@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 5A5F270B25 X-Spamd-Bar: +++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [3.98 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.08)[ip: (0.15), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.21), asn: 73(0.10), country: US(-0.07)]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.83)[0.830,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.77)[0.772,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.61)[0.614,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:45:42 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 09:32:52AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < > freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > > So to ditch our 5 years support model, kick the code out of the tree and > > make the users suffer? The support model is suppose to be under review, > > and IMHO, if kicking functional code out of the base system is to make > > it possible to meet some support model we should defanitly take a very > > close look at that issue. > > > > The code has simply gone from being in base to a few git repositories > > which are probably going to rot every time a breaking ABI change occurs > > and we wend up with un happy users, un happy developers and bugmisters > > who have to close bogus bug reports. > > > > Have we really moved the state of the art forward by this action, simply > > in the name of "we could not suppor that code?" > > > > I don't know. I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything newer > than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the old way > is broken and doesn't work. > When drm2 was unhooked from the build, it was working fine. drm2 was unhooked because it supposedly interferred with the drm-stable-kmod and drm-current-kmod ports. -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 16:50:32 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FA4A14E2A50; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:50:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 598C770EC0; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:50:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x1IGoRZ3006132; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:50:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x1IGoRsZ006131; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:50:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? In-Reply-To: To: Warner Losh Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:50:27 -0800 (PST) CC: Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 598C770EC0 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.19 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.85)[0.850,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[ip: (0.02), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.01), asn: 13868(-0.01), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.91)[0.911,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.56)[0.556,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:50:32 -0000 > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < > freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > > > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 07:12:24AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > > > > On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > > > > > > On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: > > > > > >> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > > >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? > > > > > >> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input > > events > > > > > >> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > > > > > > > > > > > > And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create > > > > > > pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > > > > > > > > > > > >>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > > > > >> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config > > should > > > > > >> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > > > > > > > > > > > > Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as > > well > > > > > > as libinput not be part of the standard packages? > > > > > > > > > > > > The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay > > Sievers > > > > > > mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do > > > > > > not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up > > the > > > > > > mess they create. > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland > > fad... > > > > > > > > > > EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to improve > > > > > input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means that a > > lot > > > > > of input devices stop working, or work much worse. > > > > > > > > > > We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve the > > > > > FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new > > users, > > > > > and make current users use FreeBSD more. > > > > > > > > Sadly your execution on that seems to be missing the mark, > > > > telling people they have to go get a port now to get drm working > > > > because it could not be maintained in base, and then telling them, > > > > oh, you need this new code in base so that it is so much easier > > > > to use graphical stuff this way. > > > > > > > > These seem to be conflicting stories. > > > > > > > You are missing the point, one does not evolve as fast as the other, > > meaning > > > one can be maintained within usual freebsd lifecycle, the other cannot > > or it > > > becomes very painful. > > > > So to ditch our 5 years support model, kick the code out of the tree and > > make the users suffer? The support model is suppose to be under review, > > and IMHO, if kicking functional code out of the base system is to make > > it possible to meet some support model we should defanitly take a very > > close look at that issue. > > > > The code has simply gone from being in base to a few git repositories > > which are probably going to rot every time a breaking ABI change occurs > > and we wend up with un happy users, un happy developers and bugmisters > > who have to close bogus bug reports. > > > > Have we really moved the state of the art forward by this action, simply > > in the name of "we could not suppor that code?" > > > > I don't know. I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything newer > than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the old way > is broken and doesn't work. But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that 5 year old hardware that are totally happy with the intree DRM2 that is in stable/12, and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with the "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit). I know that there is wip to get CI coverage for that, but wip is wip, and we need to start changing the cart horse driver order we keep doing and get things right. Port up and working, with CI testing *before* we go remove kmod'ed code from base would be a much more appropriate path. I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things simply on the "5 year old" basis. Not everyone, and infact few now a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware, giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low. One of the long standing features of running a BSD is that it could stretch very good life out of hardware, and imho it would be in our best interest to try and keep that. And we do in most aspects, though recently in some hardware testing OpenBSD beat us in several cases of "just booted and worked" on several pieces of hardware that came accross my bench for data recovery. FreeBSD would not even boot, or paniced early in the kernel :-( None of these systems was older than a P4. > Warner -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 16:50:57 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0DA014E2AAC; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:50:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9AE8A70F86; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:50:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1IGorBM003213 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:50:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1IGorue003212; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:50:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 08:50:53 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Warner Losh Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , FreeBSD Current , owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? 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MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.79)[0.789,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.89)[0.895,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.61)[0.611,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:50:58 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 09:11:14AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > > You do know these constant complaints about people trying to make things > better is demoralizing and counter productive. > You do realize some of the emails are from frustrated users who are trying to make FreeBSD (see for example libm). -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 16:58:32 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27C3014E33C9 for ; 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Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:58:17 +0000 (UTC) Received: from rev (rev [172.22.42.240]) by ilsoft.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id x1IGwEWM078506; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:58:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from ian@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <57e29b3835c0e0a35336959212be0b3075e31714.camel@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? From: Ian Lepore To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, Warner Losh Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , FreeBSD Current , owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:58:14 -0700 In-Reply-To: <20190218165053.GC2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> References: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <20190218165053.GC2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailer: Evolution 3.28.5 FreeBSD GNOME Team Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 542CE71842 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.98 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.976,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16509, ipnet:52.58.0.0/15, country:US]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:58:32 -0000 On Mon, 2019-02-18 at 08:50 -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 09:11:14AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > > > > You do know these constant complaints about people trying to make > > things > > better is demoralizing and counter productive. > > > > You do realize some of the emails are from frustrated users > who are trying to make FreeBSD (see for example libm). > And do you realize that you've trimmed away all the context so that now it looks like Warner was talking to you, when in fact he was replying to Rod? I sure hope that was an accident. -- Ian From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 17:01:09 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD8AC14E388A; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:01:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9FC8071D53; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:01:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1IH15uv003342 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:01:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1IH155O003341; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:01:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:01:05 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Warner Losh Cc: FreeBSD Current , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190218170105.GD2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 9FC8071D53 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.07 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.07)[ip: (0.14), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.20), asn: 73(0.09), country: US(-0.07)]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.83)[0.832,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.88)[0.879,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.59)[0.594,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:01:10 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 09:35:26AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > On Sun, Feb 17, 2019 at 3:52 PM Steve Kargl < > sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote: > > > Anyone have insight into what evdev is? There appears to > > be no manual page. When I reboot a system with custom > > kernel, the system is autoloading evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and > > wmt.ko. I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > How does one prevent this autoloading? > > > > > This thread has taken a weird turn, so I went back to the original post. > > When do these things get loaded? Is it when you start up X11? Or is it > being brought in by devmatch? If it is being brought in by x11, there's > likely an x11 config that you'll need to avoid them (but that will reduce > functionality). If it is devmatch, then you can add them to the black list > and have them not load them. > I think it is devmatch (or at least devd.conf related). I have a wireless USB logitch mouse. If I unplug the dongle from its port and reboot, evdev.ko, uhid.ko, and wmt.ko do not get loaded. When I plug in the dongle, the 3 get loaded. I can kldunload wmt and evdev, but as soon as the mouse is moved both are reloaded. ums(4) does not mention any of these devices as a requirement. wmt(4) says it only works for touchscreen. This laptop pre-dates touchscreens, so loading the module is simply wasteful. There is no evdev(4), so can't determine what it is or does. -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 17:02:22 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B83FE14E3B38; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:02:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BE9AF72136; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:02:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1IH2Bfo003386 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:02:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1IH2B4v003385; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:02:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:02:11 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Ian Lepore Cc: Warner Losh , "Rodney W. Grimes" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , FreeBSD Current , owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190218170211.GE2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <20190218165053.GC2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <57e29b3835c0e0a35336959212be0b3075e31714.camel@freebsd.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <57e29b3835c0e0a35336959212be0b3075e31714.camel@freebsd.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: BE9AF72136 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.13 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.07)[ip: (0.14), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.20), asn: 73(0.09), country: US(-0.07)]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.86)[0.865,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.89)[0.891,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.61)[0.611,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:02:23 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 09:58:14AM -0700, Ian Lepore wrote: > On Mon, 2019-02-18 at 08:50 -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 09:11:14AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > > > > > > You do know these constant complaints about people trying to make > > > things > > > better is demoralizing and counter productive. > > > > > > > You do realize some of the emails are from frustrated users > > who are trying to make FreeBSD (see for example libm). > > > > And do you realize that you've trimmed away all the context so that now > it looks like Warner was talking to you, when in fact he was replying > to Rod? I sure hope that was an accident. > Thanks for your considered input. It has been noted. -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 17:09:18 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7855814E4467 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:09:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ot1-x341.google.com (mail-ot1-x341.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::341]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0526B72C9A for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:09:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ot1-x341.google.com with SMTP id m1so29475164otf.5 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:09:16 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding :content-language; bh=qLRb9Ar2SE/8YoTCU6nfMNufY63frDKxBj0SOWtriXk=; b=imBUr+YB1DHsAUExSimffYmbdpCfox025EJ1DlwMVryBP0eZTXXFN+J6WECdERy+Cj wYUpVmVfIcXejc/93XvNqRUDKqER0sRONBcHDprC6PKI+M9SpvMDZntBO5NdSXcanB6D Hnyb4zaap+Km8xfr79MXErd7k3slQSEptyLwKz6g3qV4CvGNlM05AUJIIGGPsXfuG5E6 tnuVj7TdgOQRcRzsOmgOoeWS6erPxDeICLU2iMo0Ui/CswvFwiFWEnBEqcobBU2T+e/G 28oxPpyVqq5W+ZxqCUiDVFrdeyfEtwVKdpvosD+v1YmnOS6woxDjZ5l/pVfafYkTv4/L gdmg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=qLRb9Ar2SE/8YoTCU6nfMNufY63frDKxBj0SOWtriXk=; b=fC+h9i/VM47p2k7MYUrNx0hiFkP2c1THzdBG96yVjnU4csjalov0ktiycjOc1EPnyk UVP17Ct/qYzm6/ZF62WJwqSgqTUVR3fyhhUIrUy6OJ3LuTsBILWM8p7vHHUuVJxD/d4H /cCMOKQoLCjwaZm5osBa30iIfJzF6lg5fC2VMNfattYtpqbeAQsw/CZvkq/FoBOlFHjY 2scRLrm2zquLWPT2Tc7a/JNhw/Xhs3Hr25I/xaTRn+Kxxh6/GEPyAtbVgGOsZBhCPoIj cWmxKF6/Z2qjT8Bx+qdRr31/Bo7YxU73nHXWGJsSNbwgSmIlCbgOC4g2fd0mlVQ/z02W SlAg== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZ6p9eOv96JqbB0QBc+JaGMMfJqfQ1u59nWhfo8u8NqO1Ks0VfM b6mL17g1RMJDTwDAW10nQdqC/UUu X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IbZn+78PDpO0rEypg1Qf6wDINJi4PKFVaRzSPxDWeskVEaztZBEaaGIFZMoLGSWit85uEGCBg== X-Received: by 2002:a9d:58c3:: with SMTP id s3mr13538039oth.233.1550509755521; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:09:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.33] ([81.174.250.12]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j88sm6044684otj.47.2019.02.18.09.09.13 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:09:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org References: <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> From: Johannes Lundberg Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=johalun0@gmail.com; keydata= mQINBFxFmoIBEADoFO5jY+Fmsg44KiZjufEmpEf4kt7nCOfxNG9SruWpoXUaq0B296F+fIZC hNZqv1v7lGTsfoWRusxJmLd5CQgHHxEyruZbbPpNsQ/JKoDY3GGmrmWfN/SX3y0t0kdB9HsW mJcvZhK7we52f4gxddIVBS9nQoVoONX+hzXf8zwOAa0ik0EPgEwpIKS4j9lLq4bU+mqVKdRR bPeDujEA/qbsCKhaFJkPzXZtzEe6srq4RK1doEztwnKz02b+8gs642TRkWDQeTRZputrAaoN Un4R76A1QpXWyrFG1dQu48IGHi3KbkrvNyq6R1aUBIA0+CG1npIbxmc2mtSjoyvdipmDRbBD +mhECIxmYfBT6818zuj91XjrfOyfVdV2BryBvqFkJLkS3N3QElBIiVdDgdrqiNFWiOlDMxNI tdP16oQBNo8IB27/0YHpnQEw1MafZv5gG5DO0zLtLy88ASAfL7BYf90JP19rT4JIwnxsXxyv kEJnzhsXf0QVObEiAu1MqeFyWfZ8PpunmvEmJ0VChOL+v/kIx1E9cxhhzMZhqiMXfyM4zx2+ BF1FwAwJYPuJLu2B3L0uVBu+M1YvSOmKAbXPDP8PsqPjgSBTYI51MUjuuxN6jSsHDuK6G5k4 pUWR8axa+wafhd6Vz8zVwdTJZ9LdxgLLVg0kprBgccPHhPAZVQARAQABtCZKb2hhbm5lcyBM dW5kYmVyZyA8am9oYWx1bjBAZ21haWwuY29tPokCVAQTAQgAPhYhBIl1Pb3+hI60ivmRSULn yG4BGvSeBQJcRZqCAhsjBQkJZgGABQsJCAcCBhUKCQgLAgQWAgMBAh4BAheAAAoJEELnyG4B GvSe9O0P/RzeQAu1R37RlONZTXNn+qIAHvHbZEhzrCibzaZnwYdC31wGrYmXNDyiQIqOngFf QJuufQtH/+95OESJsjR+42L/pNfFdaEWxiI003qE7uCMzLK5UWUXd/5d5vYY0CaPyNCj1tyM ZIq7x4CaR3QLTh/Fw4zMUI/ZPH2S5SxVFGv0ZZFAdNYILD3qCkAS/9HmXsqufBWbfutA8TTf wyJfywmvf7ENjlZ4QOjb242ZY9NndqbmqTgWVAws+PN5e9AT8HkadscCTCSkYnxJyYG2El27 DpAAkekYplb/C0j82KSz2fy9RgwD+tTqt88DJOeFbIbrYt44u7KLHpzaZeqyUtn0reHCkE0W lnKH2kXXbuswFB4sONxI/J5+qSmOsAm5ItO3voyjm/swpmFR1yBlxo4th26gbO5NfBOK9YsY zHKgiRDv6ZdnHo+htphRxcCDHsFPzkQe5jouI25dvMZYl1LaTS/09lwYVwVIB2SFmMtFZ7rB N4NBSzPlpsg+g4dJNqiw6Rfa2Q/wUv+MzTJgLtHjDccXlpm33Nc09UytHFtNn26PO/zrM39r TwzdLu1mg0x2WWEWTIqe4CaczQU9SIg49BSyJNoPSZx3V7nMhTKbOeQKR5aV3dXI66aENw86 pa1tipuUKCPmope/GTJatUgPiD3JkyiD+7c1zQX2UAGmuQINBFxFmoIBEACb55RAkM59huAx 4Ddd8WBjsw25qf7rzxeRKAQ7or/8LvJBYQDPXZy0RhkRiu+P+MjxwGb6HVh+LDyAYDn9d8Mt ZqCP/dOGNcl7pkb6IhfRc3i5neckXCYfbm0cigiX9JkqZSt3KT96zbjCxsFZKyIyEFsMl46q 7wKWK5Irj3zxV/Z51JNTJyMLcIRWhY8G6qlMNFgZkz2Hv63w6BRekKVImOmOdThLAscy5ybq 2CIUeAwPG7lMYG9rgcPdn3tMPeWlLmUmi5pSwOQ3AKg3xFrW3WfegjRHdqpeuXoeTjYPPCW4 gyl59uv6E12a6eivItCxj67vlBXgOr4um+zoPyXG/WfidIFtWaEgyBrlGR1Klk7SIcqjEHUA FdiM+PweY4opHXXKn60NOZCqBJ59K43drOQgRouz8E2T3yEoYg40xAfY3lhJV/Vx5+kSTjmy sT2xotlPn/GzfaAEvNuJDK+Mec3LvfbbDoOWFolNyEvoMQqF5Q3A8eGqYsoVGBPxyzNvF2iY LkymxiXpgrSN0Q/LOK7pFlWwbVC8Z6g5I0J9ecgD55dGLoX2luLir787XX/JxGffzbRnP9NE ifenJGrQmx4CyEaz/CHQqSbROm5Uo/YFUX9J7OfUO4mtu90j773j32I3psey/Fz3EC/A2PHv Ghb0KsWYpS3Pj5TV1gGyswARAQABiQI8BBgBCAAmFiEEiXU9vf6EjrSK+ZFJQufIbgEa9J4F AlxFmoICGwwFCQlmAYAACgkQQufIbgEa9J7qOQ//YG/4e69YTSjtiYLXzBI8tRU2Sx+NFByx zx+C/r0EBThLtgRwCqEUZRB7iIDSO8aZ0Qa3vwWRohlD1tn/LBdDFfMmuQkNVdLIrjBoGBB9 B5xHdZJ9xnTZEwpTtk6IWolT4j+8rpGemGKKiFo3X6l02On4Qb4iM7h6rcDb76mfwooNYzB3 8PPcLvyOWb/9iCXAb5N7doo5zmOl15DVwvIF04eXU0q1FFj/iS1zNmtZ5Got82O1TQFV+de4 Rb3YA80IZhhhCiHHJqkMKeKQogRqU+UNDBARUBxfUtKsJtQzTQ2JUGwkb6X6bx53FTLP6O9q hDoODVweE1LdB1k1H5Nn+gawPdRMBqj43Y2amK7KEgoTBrwU04CLpKiaAC0S+EcJFfJcwtpK k3F+uTtP/hnhFnWbn8SgRkHKXKWqSCt63NstXhMzAJut1gEzV+CcPNKqa/sFgQaYEvzCS5Kl F/PXj0++f3TIFqT+2ZNNp8Bz8dT7gh8RPPg5oYQiCHH8K1RAmq7gKqmwyg0qgOazHnped+od X4f3qx320JAP6NP9wglDm6eht48NJzb0sffN8z34wrP66oz8oPKtS5CFV0m/384hEg0lmi3W wo2Hno7rA1etTPJX0dI6/GLlQDtNTHvKQ077HQdWVOMQVWC9j7YH7Zr9NjtOvxcNVRX3fxpJ 6CE= X-Tagtoolbar-Keys: D20190218170911774 Message-ID: <9a8f4152-af60-88f3-c5a0-8990cccbc2f1@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:09:11 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 0526B72C9A X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=imBUr+YB; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of johalun0@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::341 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=johalun0@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.09 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.83)[-0.833,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.997,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(-0.25)[ip: (3.39), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.57), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[1.4.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:09:18 -0000 On 2/18/19 3:12 PM, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >> On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: >>> On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: >>>> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: >>>>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? >>>> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input even= ts >>>> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. >>> And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create >>> pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. >>> >>>>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. >>>> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config shou= ld >>>> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies >>> Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as well= >>> as libinput not be part of the standard packages? >>> >>> The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay Sievers >>> mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do >>> not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up th= e >>> mess they create. >>> >>> I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland fad= =2E.. >> EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to improve=20 >> input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means that a lo= t=20 >> of input devices stop working, or work much worse. >> >> We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve the=20 >> FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new users= ,=20 >> and make current users use FreeBSD more. > Sadly your execution on that seems to be missing the mark, > telling people they have to go get a port now to get drm working > because it could not be maintained in base, and then telling them, > oh, you need this new code in base so that it is so much easier > to use graphical stuff this way. > > These seem to be conflicting stories. You don't need evdev or libinput to have a functional desktop with a 3-button mouse but some modern desktop environments require it. Why should we not include the large group of people who want to run a modern desktop? Including more users does not mean excluding anyone in this case= =2E > >> Evdev and libinput is used by both Wayland and xorg. You are free to = >> use either one. > And sadly now must take action when no action was required before > when using neither. Take what action? If you don't need it, just don't use it. If you don't want change, stay on older release. If you are a purist and want to remove everything in the kernel you don't use, you probably already have your custom kernel config, and you probably are a minority. Consider the well-being, progress and future of the project and the community at large instead of your ego. > From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 17:24:23 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFD1314E507E; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:24:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pete@nomadlogic.org) Received: from mail.nomadlogic.org (mail.nomadlogic.org [140.82.23.70]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.nomadlogic.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3620373B0E; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:24:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pete@nomadlogic.org) Received: from duke.gem.co (cpe-23-243-162-239.socal.res.rr.com [23.243.162.239]) by mail.nomadlogic.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 53ed8881 TLS version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:17:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Warner Losh Cc: Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> From: Pete Wright Message-ID: <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:17:37 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 3620373B0E X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of pete@nomadlogic.org designates 140.82.23.70 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=pete@nomadlogic.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.78 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[nomadlogic.org]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[239.162.243.23.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.10]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mail.nomadlogic.org]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.965,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE(-2.50)[ip: (-8.86), ipnet: 140.82.16.0/21(-4.43), asn: 20473(0.84), country: US(-0.07)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:20473, ipnet:140.82.16.0/21, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:24:23 -0000 On 2/18/19 8:50 AM, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < >> >> I don't know. I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything newer >> than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the old way >> is broken and doesn't work. > But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that 5 year > old hardware that are totally happy with the intree DRM2 that is in stable/12, > and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with thete a > "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit). I know that there is wip > to get CI coverage for that, but wip is wip, and we need to start changing > the cart horse driver order we keep doing and get things right. Port > up and working, with CI testing *before* we go remove kmod'ed code from > base would be a much more appropriate path. > > I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things > simply on the "5 year old" basis. Not everyone, and infact few now > a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware, > giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 > years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low. I've put a lot of effort helping test and document how to get a usable desktop environment on a modern laptop.  there were two issues which motivated me to do this: 1) my observation that many developers at conferences and online were using macOS as their primary desktop environment.  when comparing this to the OpenBSD and Linux community I felt pretty embarrassed, but it did explain the stagnant nature of our graphics subsystem.  people seemed afraid to touch things due the brittle nature of its hardware support. 2) i was in need to an *affordable* machine with a warranty. fortunately there are many affordable laptops at staples, best-buy and amazon - but they were all post haswell systems, rendering them basically useless from a FreeBSD perspective. after trying to get traction to update the in-tree drm subsystem i was lucky enough to sync up with the graphics team which was working on syncing things up with modern hardware support.  because of that i'm now able to get my small startup pretty much all on board with FreeBSD.  i use it on my workstations as well as on or server infrastructure (physical and AWS).  i would consider this a success for our community as it's opened up the eyes to a whole new generation of devs to FreeBSD. one thing missing from all of these arguments is real data.  how many people are on haswell era hardware?  i can tell from my experience the past several years the number of people who have post-haswell gear seem to be more numerous, or at least more vocal (and frankly easier to work with while squashing bugs). i can also say that personally it would be great to improve support for systems requiring drm2 - but that gear is hard to come by, so we are really dependent on helpful collaboration from those who are being effected. -pete -- Pete Wright pete@nomadlogic.org @nomadlogicLA From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 17:27:32 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03AF714E5246 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:27:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from AWilcox@Wilcox-Tech.com) Received: from mail.wilcox-tech.com (mail.wilcox-tech.com [45.32.83.9]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "*.wilcox-tech.com", Issuer "COMODO RSA Domain Validation Secure Server CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 38372741AE for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:27:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from AWilcox@Wilcox-Tech.com) Received: (qmail 8349 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2019 17:27:12 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO ?IPv6:2600:1702:2a80:1b90::25?) (awilcox@wilcox-tech.com@127.0.0.1) by localhost with ESMTPA; 18 Feb 2019 17:27:12 -0000 Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> From: "A. Wilcox" Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Message-ID: <0a408c30-98ba-7816-7d8d-917942426534@Wilcox-Tech.com> Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 11:27:17 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux ppc64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.9.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="6gVcvqK2S1Wk3UDfvbVXLa0gGBaV2FDNO" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 38372741AE X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=Wilcox-Tech.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of AWilcox@Wilcox-Tech.com designates 45.32.83.9 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=AWilcox@Wilcox-Tech.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.59 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; HAS_ATTACHMENT(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,multipart/mixed,text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mail.Wilcox-Tech.com,tarbaby.junkemailfilter.com,mail.Wilcox-Tech.com,tarbaby.junkemailfilter.com,mail.Wilcox-Tech.com,tarbaby.junkemailfilter.com,mail.Wilcox-Tech.com,tarbaby.junkemailfilter.com,mail.Wilcox-Tech.com,tarbaby.junkemailfilter.com,mail.Wilcox-Tech.com,tarbaby.junkemailfilter.com,mail.Wilcox-Tech.com,tarbaby.junkemailfilter.com,mail.Wilcox-Tech.com,tarbaby.junkemailfilter.com]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[Wilcox-Tech.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.82)[-0.825,0]; IP_SCORE(0.15)[asn: 20473(0.81), country: US(-0.07)]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:20473, ipnet:45.32.64.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:27:32 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --6gVcvqK2S1Wk3UDfvbVXLa0gGBaV2FDNO Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="ElK4o4xXz8u0VKu9sQSLHjDxqZk9lYzkT"; protected-headers="v1" From: "A. Wilcox" To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Message-ID: <0a408c30-98ba-7816-7d8d-917942426534@Wilcox-Tech.com> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> In-Reply-To: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> --ElK4o4xXz8u0VKu9sQSLHjDxqZk9lYzkT Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 02/18/19 10:50, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < >> freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: >> >>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 07:12:24AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >>>>>> On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: >>>>>>> On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: >>>>>>>> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: >>>>>>>>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? >>>>>>>> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input >>> events >>>>>>>> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. That's... wrong. evdev has nothing to do with libinput. Rather, it can be used by libinput, but I never once used libinput on FreeBSD/X11. I used xf86-input-evdev. evdev is a generic event device subsystem originated in the Linux kernel.= > But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that 5 ye= ar > old hardware that are totally happy with the intree DRM2 that is in sta= ble/12, > and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with the > "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit). >=20 > I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things > simply on the "5 year old" basis. Not everyone, and infact few now > a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware,=20 > giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 > years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low. That's the primary reason I don't focus on FreeBSD any more, and the primary reason when I have sudden time crunches, FreeBSD stuff is the first to go out the window. It's not that I don't like FreeBSD any more, it's that it just doesn't fit in with my ideas on how a system project should be run, or how it should prioritise. And that isn't really a comment on FreeBSD, nor me, it's just a statement. Everyone's different. Perhaps all the people who are upset at FreeBSD becoming the next OS X (you must have hardware *this* *new* to run!) should start putting more effort in to keeping the old hardware alive and working in the processes defined by FreeBSD. Make proposals, participate and communicate on MLs (instead of just complain), etc. This is all just observations I've made over the last few months of reading -current and not really contributing much. Apologies if I'm off the mark on any of this. Best to you and yours, --arw --=20 A. Wilcox (awilfox) Open-source programmer (C, C++, Python) https://code.foxkit.us/u/awilfox/ --ElK4o4xXz8u0VKu9sQSLHjDxqZk9lYzkT-- --6gVcvqK2S1Wk3UDfvbVXLa0gGBaV2FDNO Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEEjNyWOYPU1SaTSMHHyynLUZIrnRQFAlxq6vUACgkQyynLUZIr nRSuSRAAqdP6BNs4xAEPHo32YALg790rxcm9bS7a/MgHxS7/vBVMLuaOvn3x1Itd Xv+nHMEqzS2repj36KkovXg8Y3+wwQR2JqQyfInq/4eXU+/kGtZij7P/kQO1acM8 KQ/CdJKf1jkit240OARzdeJNm+a5kdgTfYIiYonGqHZEzKTsNYtN+B1mtNQoZclr hARoHefEclyMaD9a53JfRa7XHE2n3/PXsWNftNYWBSj52rml4bR2eW5MYox1fY/D dYTW/qceh/Nu2Wkj4Mn0Co5Sedz0a4akrUGZsDqHZXodWB/lMO9he+I32OAtmxnL 3WLnTR1Opd8qCdYXhL5buxbc3Fwf8qbXT1/GFqed9CRoTJH0KLtKHNkTBnDzXE/O nseoUHQT2V4yHZ9WNZA1oSLIJuozwPDErmw4bPDKTvwOBYuH+ZIfiqniwoOKXKHn /FufKnILVcZZr7K3Z30LGXKiD8dp3uoKC/fgWk0Zz4xpyy2IJFHgHz4PIyaP9+l8 E9lVero2LnMV1/fEGuwu5PlKDBWZgdtEX+s/8v/nVpWS63nZintwjaAWmpJ8F2lj PZsz6AzeiT0eaoDskUmITtJtftZ36iYxXxA5Cdh6YKH1VnQr2CDqXTjHPc+9zVad NmYGwmJm9LDNJ24CkzAXYmC+ckWhspbUAZyTjSkziP1Nx0lp86M= =++Kz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --6gVcvqK2S1Wk3UDfvbVXLa0gGBaV2FDNO-- From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 17:44:47 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21C2B14E5B2A; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:44:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pete@nomadlogic.org) Received: from mail.nomadlogic.org (mail.nomadlogic.org [140.82.23.70]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.nomadlogic.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E630774CBD; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:44:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pete@nomadlogic.org) Received: from duke.gem.co (cpe-23-243-162-239.socal.res.rr.com [23.243.162.239]) by mail.nomadlogic.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 94afe598 TLS version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:44:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: Ian Lepore , sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu Cc: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <4135B088-DF13-4867-ABF4-5659D47C8997@yahoo.com> <20190218002455.GA98130@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <221bcaeb995b085058513323980315b68cd3190f.camel@freebsd.org> From: Pete Wright Message-ID: Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 09:44:43 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <221bcaeb995b085058513323980315b68cd3190f.camel@freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: E630774CBD X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of pete@nomadlogic.org designates 140.82.23.70 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=pete@nomadlogic.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.76 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[239.162.243.23.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[nomadlogic.org]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mail.nomadlogic.org]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.963,0]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE(-2.49)[ip: (-8.77), ipnet: 140.82.16.0/21(-4.39), asn: 20473(0.81), country: US(-0.07)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:20473, ipnet:140.82.16.0/21, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:44:47 -0000 On 2/17/19 6:48 PM, Ian Lepore wrote: > > That manpage you found online is in section 4x. It probably gets > installed along with the xf86-input-evdev package. yes - unfortunately that seems to be the only form of man page that exists on the linux side as well.  did a quick search through the linux source and there is unsurprisingly a lack of coherent documentation for the evdev driver there (there is plenty online - wikipedia is a decent starting place). getting a man page is a pretty high priority and should hopefully get sorted out before 12.1-RELEASE is ready...so the system works? lol -pete -- Pete Wright pete@nomadlogic.org @nomadlogicLA From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 18:13:56 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5261914E6A7D; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 18:13:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wojtek@puchar.net) Received: from puchar.net (puchar.net [194.1.144.90]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0C79475E94; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 18:13:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wojtek@puchar.net) Received: Received: from 127.0.0.1 (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by puchar.net (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1II4Cot065977 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:04:12 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from puchar-wojtek@puchar.net) Received: from localhost (puchar-wojtek@localhost) by puchar.net (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id x1II46HT065974; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:04:06 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from puchar-wojtek@puchar.net) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:04:06 +0100 (CET) From: Wojciech Puchar To: Pete Wright cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Warner Losh , Baptiste Daroussin , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? In-Reply-To: <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> User-Agent: Alpine 2.20 (BSF 67 2015-01-07) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 0C79475E94 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of wojtek@puchar.net designates 194.1.144.90 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=wojtek@puchar.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.75 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/mixed,text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[puchar.net]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[puchar.net]; CTYPE_MIXED_BOGUS(1.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[90.144.1.194.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[10]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.88)[-0.877,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:43476, ipnet:194.1.144.0/24, country:PL]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-3.56)[ip: (-9.41), ipnet: 194.1.144.0/24(-4.70), asn: 43476(-3.76), country: PL(0.05)] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 20:02:56 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 18:13:56 -0000 > motivated me to do this: > > 1) my observation that many developers at conferences and online were using > macOS as their primary desktop environment.  when comparing this to the > OpenBSD and Linux community I felt pretty embarrassed, but it did explain the > stagnant nature of our graphics subsystem.  people seemed afraid to touch > things due the brittle nature of its hardware support. > > 2) i was in need to an *affordable* machine with a warranty. fortunately > there are many affordable laptops at staples, best-buy and amazon - but they > were all post haswell systems, rendering them basically useless from a > FreeBSD perspective. I've bought recently (like half year ago) cheapest laptop available. Everything supported with FreeBSD out of the box, except little problem with sound but dev.hdac.0.polling=1 made it work. What a problem? Even lowest end today computer is really high end for normal programs. From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 20:28:20 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06F8614EAABC for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 20:28:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ohartmann@walstatt.org) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.18]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.gmx.net", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass DE-2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C886484835 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 20:28:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ohartmann@walstatt.org) Received: from thor.intern.walstatt.dynvpn.de ([77.183.236.46]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx002 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MXIov-1gajof0rq9-00WIGi for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 21:23:08 +0100 Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 21:22:32 +0100 From: "O. Hartmann" To: FreeBSD CURRENT Subject: Re: poudriere: 12-STABLE install fails after r344230 Message-ID: <20190218212259.26283d29@thor.intern.walstatt.dynvpn.de> In-Reply-To: <20190218080648.263615c6@freyja> References: <20190217190808.1922c4b2@thor.intern.walstatt.dynvpn.de> <20190218080648.263615c6@freyja> Organization: WALSTATT User-Agent: OutScare 3.1415926 X-Operating-System: ImNotAnOperatingSystem 3.141592527 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:YEcIWjLvTBTPgeGJjh5+fYPdbRMWzzlOfdY6Pei5aVLgJZc8trW PsJfuXLWCrIM2Qf4ci/QKwyRJGOyWmigSDdvf7Os+OWlCTPtcN2yuWRnGY++T2slSLWs4CI lWbaK14s0wlFLvUartueHzQh26/J8J/2m9OM5lAagexUo6UGeSkUECiyRUPwZnzs1WUDEVB inmXjBLprakqfIIF9x1eQ== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:3U0EuhItSNk=:pyR0g4aMvZmvC0DR0hGyfT 0LZrq5Gu0iEjQOHrZD71U0kz2pfsyTgXjR5DoAgG8ttvveB06zH4I7TCAUJjMBUg715cGYgNZ cwtLTrqLrQtVfzmjphEUuhYLsl6i2XHHDFbmSiBjAEJ/pm+9tzsG2r+ynvUDSivBmoGRXaqme 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ZUx6YmlrMVV3N2YrdlEzYkZkbTdXL1l2VkJuZ0QvVWtXQkwyOStCdlpYDQo5REdaOVBYRmNvN05B bXdFeHZrYXlIZDZEaExwdFFBPQ0KPWlOWHgNCi0tLS0tRU5EIFBHUCBTSUdOQVRVUkUtLS0tLQ0K From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 22:54:12 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0384114EE7B1; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 22:54:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from mail.soaustin.net (mail.soaustin.net [18.222.6.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.soaustin.net", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0750B89AE8; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 22:54:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from lonesome.com (unknown [18.188.142.31]) by mail.soaustin.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B719C17080; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 22:54:09 +0000 (UTC) Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 22:54:08 +0000 From: Mark Linimon To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Warner Losh , Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190218225407.GA7187@lonesome.com> References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 0750B89AE8 X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.74 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.86)[0.862,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.27)[ipnet: 18.220.0.0/14(0.06), asn: 16509(-1.34), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[lonesome.com]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.11)[0.106,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.65)[-0.646,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[11.6.222.18.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mail.soaustin.net]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16509, ipnet:18.220.0.0/14, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 22:54:12 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 08:50:27AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things > simply on the "5 year old" basis. IIUC the graphics changes are being forced upon FreeBSD by external projects (mainly Linux-based) that are making huge architectural changes that rely more and more on features from newer hardware. If our upstreams aren't willing to do the work to keep from violating POLA on older hardware, IMHO it's an awful lot to ask of our already thinly stretched graphics volunteers to provide it in their stead. w/rt graphics, we are at far more danger of being left further and further behind on modern hardware than we are at risk of losing users on older hardware here. Again all IMHO. disclaimer: I don't use any fancy graphics stuff, so (as the old folks say around here) "I have no dog in this hunt". mcl From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Mon Feb 18 23:04:39 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA24114EEF9E for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 23:04:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grembo@freebsd.org) Received: from mail.grem.de (outcast.grem.de [213.239.217.27]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 59CC48A23A for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 23:04:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grembo@freebsd.org) Received: (qmail 85254 invoked by uid 89); 18 Feb 2019 23:04:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ?100.87.89.213?) (mg@grem.de@109.41.194.37) by mail.grem.de with ESMTPA; 18 Feb 2019 23:04:31 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? From: Michael Gmelin X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (16D39) In-Reply-To: <20190218225407.GA7187@lonesome.com> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:04:20 +0100 Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Warner Losh , Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <21E2EBA6-F4EE-4608-B2EA-AF731F892583@freebsd.org> References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <20190218225407.GA7187@lonesome.com> To: Mark Linimon X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 59CC48A23A X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.97 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.97)[-0.968,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:24940, ipnet:213.239.192.0/18, country:DE] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 23:44:47 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 23:04:39 -0000 > On 18. Feb 2019, at 23:54, Mark Linimon wrote: >=20 >> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 08:50:27AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things >> simply on the "5 year old" basis. >=20 > IIUC the graphics changes are being forced upon FreeBSD by external > projects (mainly Linux-based) that are making huge architectural changes > that rely more and more on features from newer hardware. >=20 > If our upstreams aren't willing to do the work to keep from violating > POLA on older hardware, IMHO it's an awful lot to ask of our already > thinly stretched graphics volunteers to provide it in their stead. >=20 > w/rt graphics, we are at far more danger of being left further and > further behind on modern hardware than we are at risk of losing users > on older hardware here. >=20 > Again all IMHO. >=20 > disclaimer: I don't use any fancy graphics stuff, so (as the old folks > say around here) I=E2=80=99m very happy (and grateful) that 2018 was the first year in over a= decade I was able to run FreeBSD on a state of the art laptop with all the f= eatures that are essential to me working - which included decent touchpad su= pport provided through evdev+libinput. -m From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 00:33:34 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56B6E14F160A for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:33:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-qt1-x843.google.com (mail-qt1-x843.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::843]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4D8348D2BC for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:33:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-qt1-x843.google.com with SMTP id y4so21254280qtc.10 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:33:33 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=XNriMNmY7bi/kBS+kas7Kkgv1qO/55KEF73G1HiTtyg=; b=JkLHnBT/ZyLTpcX+4H5hJ3hLCECUWlmaP58AUOtS/GweJ2ePx9J2/9BTGo0P5QacVZ Uzn16lzpcyLKZNaQ1Kp9dr1DRxZScw1kTqiD6/onqCN9O51FSgSI5S2IJC/llsYlHG1c qHWLhVkyxyCPqDnymwlrH660YSGrxoj1lkW1oQJHSm/QEAKRSN1QCtjNTIZbqDu0RRIz XH7dcC9YJQhW8YZuRi3sTpdEgvNzUMm+xoqWaKdz+EWFX5kHVUp7WQqUDTIiYAHiZFjP WLmK6Bj8ZI/ycY1RY9LWFUtLloUz1exDr7dzo0SuFS+mtnPGppFgutqXl4f4Fz6GMosV mZAw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=XNriMNmY7bi/kBS+kas7Kkgv1qO/55KEF73G1HiTtyg=; b=H3Ku/y39g8n/yGLZLofWddXW/hC73ZjuOgpj/QqHSSKcILKbC2uIfGEZ0MGJ3fCkfb nDDou7w+ay2UspekUnJFuyqIeL63eYIjq1rESKemPld8TaONZKct7NcAyRqJlCgDp/Fs PqwtElYxMHQ6xp7Z4uxTQW3AZ+mxPpCzpqXhvhvMErM+Ch23NbefSt8xHo2PENjHFLtZ Mf3UQdkaCADbEiiwCh2KWv0+hL6G10cuH2/AjkZVwGPW4rjj8aZiOzmGJi903X/ctmxJ jTxwI1hp6GGhbJzxVO/e/Z/cZKaUdAXAAZYh1ytb57lFjMirueXT5fp41z4BcLNxbC5Z QJIA== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZCLRfXTWS5YXg6jX2HRDNH/yuKIiymzPFtM8V6QlZNsVOGKbaG KV3KazG0qWwfNEQSSKGdvZ4TCd3kkgS6pyj6PtNjfw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IbNifbgLzLv2MfdceKpaW2riLgI/1HQe8RbndvLXH69fyu1k4Bo4uFU3/hmp9US2U9DG69jTf8FwwfPLd4VOfY= X-Received: by 2002:ac8:35f8:: with SMTP id l53mr21029504qtb.15.1550536412606; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:33:32 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> In-Reply-To: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> From: Warner Losh Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:33:21 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4D8348D2BC X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=JkLHnBT/ X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.66 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.63)[-0.629,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.10)[0.100,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.18)[ip: (3.75), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.59), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.95)[-0.945,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT1.aspmx.l.google.com]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.8.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:33:34 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:50 AM Rodney W. Grimes < freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < > > freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 07:12:24AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > > > > > On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > > > > > > > On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev > wrote: > > > > > > >> On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > > > >>> Anyone have insight into what evdev is? > > > > > > >> evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your > input > > > events > > > > > > >> like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to > create > > > > > > > pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>> I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > > > > > > >> I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel > config > > > should > > > > > > >> disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, > as > > > well > > > > > > > as libinput not be part of the standard packages? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay > > > Sievers > > > > > > > mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. > They do > > > > > > > not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to > clean up > > > the > > > > > > > mess they create. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that > Wayland > > > fad... > > > > > > > > > > > > EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to > improve > > > > > > input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means > that a > > > lot > > > > > > of input devices stop working, or work much worse. > > > > > > > > > > > > We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve > the > > > > > > FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new > > > users, > > > > > > and make current users use FreeBSD more. > > > > > > > > > > Sadly your execution on that seems to be missing the mark, > > > > > telling people they have to go get a port now to get drm working > > > > > because it could not be maintained in base, and then telling them, > > > > > oh, you need this new code in base so that it is so much easier > > > > > to use graphical stuff this way. > > > > > > > > > > These seem to be conflicting stories. > > > > > > > > > You are missing the point, one does not evolve as fast as the other, > > > meaning > > > > one can be maintained within usual freebsd lifecycle, the other > cannot > > > or it > > > > becomes very painful. > > > > > > So to ditch our 5 years support model, kick the code out of the tree > and > > > make the users suffer? The support model is suppose to be under > review, > > > and IMHO, if kicking functional code out of the base system is to make > > > it possible to meet some support model we should defanitly take a very > > > close look at that issue. > > > > > > The code has simply gone from being in base to a few git repositories > > > which are probably going to rot every time a breaking ABI change occurs > > > and we wend up with un happy users, un happy developers and bugmisters > > > who have to close bogus bug reports. > > > > > > Have we really moved the state of the art forward by this action, > simply > > > in the name of "we could not suppor that code?" > > > > > > > I don't know. I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything newer > > than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the old way > > is broken and doesn't work. > > But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that 5 year > old hardware that are totally happy with the in tree DRM2 that is in > stable/12, > and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with the > "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit). First off, current is current. Second, they have two different drm modules to choose from. The drm-legacy stuff was broken by a commit to base, but even if it had been in base, and connected to the build, it would have been broken. kib would have fixed the compile issue (which we did fix in github almost as soon as it happend). However, the semantic issue he wouldn't have seen because he wouldn't have actually tested the setup that's broken because he doesn't have it. So please stop saying it does work. It does not work. It was silently broken by kib's changes. The compile issue is a red herring. You'd be fighting the same issue in current if it was connected to the build. It's literally the same code. > I know that there is wip > to get CI coverage for that, but wip is wip, and we need to start changing > the cart horse driver order we keep doing and get things right. Port > up and working, with CI testing *before* we go remove kmod'ed code from > base would be a much more appropriate path. > > I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things > simply on the "5 year old" basis. Not everyone, and infact few now > a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware, > giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 > years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low No you are purposely mischaracterizing what's going on here. Nobody is being dismissive of 5 year old hardware. You are mischaracterizing what I'm saying. Please stop. What I'm being dismissive about is that drm2 only supports 5 year old hardware. Not because the hardware is broken, but because the model we used to keep in the tree is broken. Newer hardware just isn't supported at all by it. That's the problem we're trying to fix. drm2 only supporting old hardware is a bigger problem. Read another way, our support model is so broken that we can't support anything newer than 5 year old hardware in drm2. It's our inability to move faster in base that I'm dissing here, not the hardware. We're transitioning to a newer / better model. There are bumps along the way. ne of the long standing features of running a BSD is that it could > stretch very good life out of hardware, and imho it would be in our > best interest to try and keep that. And we do in most aspects, > though recently in some hardware testing OpenBSD beat us in several > cases of "just booted and worked" on several pieces of hardware > that came accross my bench for data recovery. FreeBSD would not > even boot, or paniced early in the kernel :-( None of these systems > was older than a P4. > If you can't handle the bumpiness of -current, you can run stable/12. You can also run any of the 64-bit hardware. It all still works. 32-bit laptops haven't been mainstream in even longer, so none of the developers have them. They are kinda hard to come by, so things don't get tested. When things aren't tested, other changes in the system break them. Warner From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 00:38:04 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73D6A14F19F6 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:38:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-qt1-x836.google.com (mail-qt1-x836.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::836]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9A7918D7A1 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:38:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-qt1-x836.google.com with SMTP id a48so21299527qtb.4 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:38:03 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=W+gVelf03l7sawq+hkQ65zcvFhaH63dWKP8Jp1LA1Tw=; b=cXlqfFjF0ZGTGzQzGhBW4cENOah/qk2517U4QbAizzug1bowZAnxDo6F4kwGrXJpHl d3x8iyYPLcqflJ/iKsquA8EzhhH93JNNLwNlmQB60DHbYojdYRfzAkGrIoRK8pPuX8oK TztDxDUpMuFtfR+NOToqo0s6OEs3aiKxn1XTltUwoMkzptCWP8kUDYm+VlPlQ8WY5OR1 Zyk5ueDjIzMintF4HlZ0UcN3n7cMKRhDy52LA+LemHwK+f+08MJQfBdOAgvidsvvtxXZ ww06jMgRdBwpfzmR5Vu337gZXyYWGPO7zfcjM9KY0CYhLUCY0lKEdDj5Q9WvxKvRk2BK F0sw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=W+gVelf03l7sawq+hkQ65zcvFhaH63dWKP8Jp1LA1Tw=; b=C49qFusvUExDgp/0FxcxA9PpN9ov2cULixugM+YVbv6ZVp8CBzXpNbHBeF/ambdAgk auVgNRbuTsNyWXcGA08vkFe5R/Snqssi0ElpJ3NXQAwj4osUGlSi5df21NnRqTPtgw8L eOCq5mOAIKsr4Mst9zAGN/mAPLUe1UcQmzr8jlsBBFak5LjjdtdIjLPIIQ7vugkHet14 h26coVUb8teRgBzhdKX86liEo2kGcPMzIx5QH8zWp1cnFheOP09TgWgX9atU3brd2tit NQ1X1xHT744bVIa0bOumj27x5fELlbB4EP71OtF2K846nG8IxaD2SO0rL2wEtjzPkDtq gQEQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAubvGfEFH/qVPIPhuzfg+/F3x3NZlxx+x+oW8RGURDrL/gLcvr8V Ig8o0n0YmAA2is+SQNq5DWV9BTKZlO7gh5CNJ7ovWw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IbZO07FK+d5ApAaYeA3gLxy0Rf/xCAhxFH2/UQjtpvv/Z4PQzaDvnNQt9Tuay7t6AQdm9VN6krBAkx/5yPChsc= X-Received: by 2002:a0c:b68a:: with SMTP id u10mr19259913qvd.57.1550536683121; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 16:38:03 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <20190218165053.GC2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> In-Reply-To: <20190218165053.GC2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> From: Warner Losh Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 17:37:52 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: Steve Kargl Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , FreeBSD Current , owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 9A7918D7A1 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=cXlqfFjF X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.36 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.71)[-0.708,0]; IP_SCORE(-2.64)[ip: (-8.56), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.59), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT1.aspmx.l.google.com]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[6.3.8.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:38:04 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:50 AM Steve Kargl < sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote: > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 09:11:14AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > > > > You do know these constant complaints about people trying to make things > > better is demoralizing and counter productive. > > > > You do realize some of the emails are from frustrated users > who are trying to make FreeBSD (see for example libm). > Yes. I get that. My frustration isn't with you, or your questions. I get why you want to run -current. I'm sorry it's being painful for you. Sometimes, -current is like that. Warner From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 02:29:25 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8776F14FB9FB for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 02:29:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grahamperrin@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wr1-x436.google.com (mail-wr1-x436.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::436]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3D20794E49 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 02:29:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grahamperrin@gmail.com) Received: by mail-wr1-x436.google.com with SMTP id o17so20466387wrw.3 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 18:29:23 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=to:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=NDGqbtMs9ONiTwMqIvjiMx93JV1elTeYLXM5jqORXyc=; b=GxzBfflwbaJ1IFxlTyNME6WcgWNgBcwRvvu5IDmvws/qiajSVMs+QuSQtq1DIosqcq FlX7/b1GqCBP2+m+UXubhGywLcYTRwey9CvrUiquVtKfLPWX/sftzz+i6GC8jXNzIg3V dP5kourkIXT6l5ZcxNBa4qL/xx1geXF4ppuHaMQpPPAAH6JNwDqoyyTXR9sJosT6Ay13 mSUgJhx+qOQABqPJGKolu61b23hWOXEJ/yCqCsI9zt8vuIOmZRUv1kvQjJDdzX4Acls0 LPwD73Jkc5a5UjcJQNyiiCxT4KJ/svdccewr/Zn1Q+kVCl+vhqAZD0hYHzS4vwg7K8ff 5fYg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:to:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=NDGqbtMs9ONiTwMqIvjiMx93JV1elTeYLXM5jqORXyc=; b=nw4p4QmuNEbVhuzVr1aDeI0b3HG9QYIe11DKhKdiWkg7pgpcXiFAQajc6iOA4XxyYT kFqnIrYXPkA6xevmNAK1e8HAmsPPc84pfThHLiYEMuo58WP8vU7RABlLDWX4KOX4p3zV 5f9RZ3f4sVM+mE9xC7A1wo6QvrohH5XrMP+iSW47Npj+5/nU/A6gkzsY32wO/1nK3VeT NHM2CAM9HxFffA5zz4FrqCEfBNs/F8IzF8B1gk8rneQusiLkKko9VtkGsiIjbsRJ+uwE 66tikMwBeA/B5b4JSl4ryk98ovn8RfZC/lq8UdTUrFPvpTwlB355C0l04c0CdMuHAOyN 63Iw== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZWvKqQmlj+z0W1F7DBPPY1emE+LszgWN6wSvWbZTB7gnP23ly5 /6afaRV8tuW6mDaDnOuSP8ftooj0CeU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYuEOvXjLBKIx9L7+QJ/+gFbQmQy0yGk7g4j3EWpTgaqVHRiuUpYfPSBP5ko5X32Jf0BHSIOw== X-Received: by 2002:adf:c7c6:: with SMTP id y6mr18358784wrg.217.1550543360384; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 18:29:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.7] (79-66-139-63.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com. [79.66.139.63]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x11sm9646573wrt.27.2019.02.18.18.29.18 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=AEAD-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 18:29:18 -0800 (PST) To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org From: Graham Perrin Subject: bectl slow Message-ID: <004243c2-e473-ee1a-7343-e718f2177308@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 02:29:18 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 3D20794E49 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=GxzBfflw; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of grahamperrin@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::436 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=grahamperrin@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.53 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.73)[-0.733,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(-2.79)[ip: (-9.59), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.28), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[6.3.4.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 02:29:25 -0000 Preparing to update the OS, I created a new boot environment. Creation took a long time, subsequent bectl commands are extraordinarily slow. Whilst composing this e-mail I'm awaiting completion of a simple list. Any ideas? zpool status shows no problem. Last scrubbed 27th December, I'll begin a scrub after the current 'bectl list' command completes … ---- grahamperrin@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ % su - Password: root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # svn up /usr/src Updating '/usr/src': U    /usr/src/lib/libmemstat/memstat_uma.c U    /usr/src/lib/clang/libllvmminimal/Makefile U    /usr/src/stand/common/part.c U    /usr/src/stand/common/disk.c U    /usr/src/stand/uboot/common/main.c U    /usr/src/stand/uboot/lib/libuboot.h U    /usr/src/stand/libsa/cd9660.c U    /usr/src/stand/libsa/zfs/zfs.c U    /usr/src/stand/lua/password.lua U    /usr/src/stand/powerpc/uboot/Makefile U    /usr/src/sys/arm/freescale/imx/imx6_snvs.c U    /usr/src/sys/amd64/amd64/pmap.c U    /usr/src/sys/amd64/sgx/sgx_linux.c U    /usr/src/sys/dev/netmap/netmap_freebsd.c U    /usr/src/sys/dev/netmap/netmap_kern.h U    /usr/src/sys/conf/ldscript.riscv U    /usr/src/sys/contrib/libnv/nvpair.c U    /usr/src/sys/kern/sys_pipe.c U    /usr/src/contrib/libc++/include/type_traits U    /usr/src/usr.bin/kdump/kdump.c U /usr/src/usr.sbin/bsnmpd/modules/snmp_hostres/hostres_partition_tbl.c U    /usr/src/usr.sbin/rpc.ypupdated/update.c U    /usr/src/usr.sbin/bsdinstall/partedit/partedit_powerpc.c U    /usr/src/etc/mtree/BSD.root.dist Updated to revision 344269. root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # svn up /usr/src Updating '/usr/src': At revision 344269. root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # bectl create r344269 load: 0.64  cmd: bectl 33517 [fu_ans] 29.69r 0.00u 0.01s 0% 4460k load: 0.49  cmd: bectl 33517 [fu_ans] 53.59r 0.00u 0.01s 0% 4460k root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # date ; uptime ; uname -v Tue Feb 19 01:46:46 GMT 2019  1:46AM  up  1:11, 4 users, load averages: 0.42, 0.57, 0.79 FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r344013 GENERIC-NODEBUG root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # time bectl list | sort load: 0.10  cmd: sort 33904 [piperd] 1145.34r 0.00u 0.00s 0% 2612k ^C^C load: 0.18  cmd: bectl 33903 [fu_ans] 1175.24r 0.01u 0.03s 0% 4740k ^Croot@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # date Tue Feb 19 02:07:07 GMT 2019 root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # time bectl list BE            Active Mountpoint Space Created r344013       NR     /          22.6G 2019-02-11 16:17 r344231       -      -          3.81G 2019-02-17 16:38 r343747       -      -          6.57G 2019-02-04 18:04 r343883       -      -          6.90G 2019-02-07 23:11 r342466       -      -          521M  2019-01-07 07:53 r344269       -      -          392K  2019-02-19 01:42 20190131-0125 -      -          487M  2019-01-31 01:25 default       -      -          2.16M 2018-12-22 05:01 From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 02:50:48 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3924014D5891 for ; 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MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.3.1.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(-2.71)[ip: (-8.89), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.59), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 02:50:48 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 8:35 PM Graham Perrin wrote: > Preparing to update the OS, I created a new boot environment. Creation > took a long time, subsequent bectl commands are extraordinarily slow. > > Whilst composing this e-mail I'm awaiting completion of a simple list. > > Any ideas? > > zpool status shows no problem. Last scrubbed 27th December, I'll begin a > scrub after the current 'bectl list' command completes =E2=80=A6 > What happens if you try it without fuse loaded? --=20 Adam From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 03:00:58 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C94414D621C for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:00:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grahamperrin@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wm1-x32a.google.com (mail-wm1-x32a.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::32a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 60B91963B0 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:00:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grahamperrin@gmail.com) Received: by mail-wm1-x32a.google.com with SMTP id a62so981123wmh.4 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:00:57 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language; bh=04R5wszVeMCtoerg4vQTQtcjcrWgWq+afs/O9gjwDNY=; b=HKqYi6W4laTE491n7VkmDwdsMZXQZYc57A96Tu4mlvoLQ1nePEhEM22HacoEU+cTpk WlwBM9p9oYdKLEXSedzwmnGtAkwh1w6zSvKnVFf/QqV3vIQ2epaQaLtcFnsEhMbY4GEv p8QLaoiqmBaM7I7IpoXFQDj2V/SwpCwlfMphauEqetScaS/guPa3S9gNAulwRusr8tvM imdmZxvuQksODouHwCTEMcJ1oK+URoYOJ+hWyv76hVxtf5rILCzRw5Km9niLjPTGLF8j WnyNiQafdVE8DnqYxrCa0Ndm+u76VCtM37Mqep9JlRKgfUxlvkzGa617n1ZE83TnBHuv HMRQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language; bh=04R5wszVeMCtoerg4vQTQtcjcrWgWq+afs/O9gjwDNY=; b=SBsngBIEf16sU33NTt38rqqW1NJAHmyGHgvZWLPkZSAnBg3VBI+T74d4V8jERsrrtB eT+a+cD3JtfScFejdNpDvEy0lx9XeYoEs9yt4sDSkecqYDjZQ9sazkRQP7LGIboWUVw5 Mrx3QNrXm6DKhMSFjUMKlBFH1YwzvMTWCu0+cRGImQhNazWmt0+bv7QMCb+lfYrBtfHP L0z/51/kLmFVj4NX0wQ9Ar3xbypum5HvXip67rCd1oR7+0h7pCki8vyJV/PsecxaOFyM HJEKpgfcN6mMAEq1xr1id9E5EMPEIAmHUdux9PFZXgT7mlGy7UO0f7qKKuNH5vuw4cRe pCYQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuaHVO5rHEsX4vYQNEnUq2dVjsDsw7nSzP+kOJvj8mPoc1FhjRb6 XkkSya9S8MMQo92ut6jChNvbkr2brqI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IZKQyDvlWhvC+/HEyN21rA4fmiehAQrcMpABmbjM5suHnu2gQxce7YQtSlpbyiS4qLA/qIg6Q== X-Received: by 2002:a1c:8086:: with SMTP id b128mr1124075wmd.117.1550545255663; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:00:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.7] (79-66-139-63.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com. [79.66.139.63]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id h184sm2552000wmf.0.2019.02.18.19.00.54 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=AEAD-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:00:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: bectl slow To: FreeBSD CURRENT References: <004243c2-e473-ee1a-7343-e718f2177308@gmail.com> From: Graham Perrin Message-ID: Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:00:53 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 60B91963B0 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=HKqYi6W4; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of grahamperrin@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::32a as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=grahamperrin@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.63 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.81)[-0.812,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(-2.81)[ip: (-9.71), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.28), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[a.2.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:00:58 -0000 On 19/02/2019 02:50, Adam wrote: > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 8:35 PM Graham Perrin > wrote: > > Preparing to update the OS, I created a new boot environment. > Creation > took a long time, subsequent bectl commands are extraordinarily slow. > > Whilst composing this e-mail I'm awaiting completion of a simple list. > > Any ideas? > > zpool status shows no problem. Last scrubbed 27th December, I'll > begin a > scrub after the current 'bectl list' command completes … > > > What happens if you try it without fuse loaded? > > -- > Adam root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # kldunload fuse.ko kldunload: can't unload file: Device busy If it helps: fusefs-ext4fuse was amongst packages that were identified during a recent run of `pkg autoremove`. I recall running this before actually allowing removal: pkg query %e jackit celt fdk-aac fusefs-ext4fuse luajit mbedtls From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 03:05:50 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 644A414D66A8 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:05:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kevans@freebsd.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [96.47.72.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A0FE896B9B for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:05:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kevans@freebsd.org) Received: from mail-lj1-f182.google.com (mail-lj1-f182.google.com [209.85.208.182]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) (Authenticated sender: kevans) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3035D128F4 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:05:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kevans@freebsd.org) Received: by mail-lj1-f182.google.com with SMTP id l5so12704116lje.1 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:05:49 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZL616piHNECVNWIkLDna/28kV3F8nggB/vw5Sgk/ibf+YkIOJG ybN68L0/RS6dv46QFtwFk9FwcvQAQ6HTIi/eSC4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYw8kLUWiHi+3jOwdtpfij8nkEyvS7/4wI6aDnd8u9tjU8E1fjssO4ycfLIgM2isUGZqqIwcPBMGxc+Ab/Q6dg= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:8456:: with SMTP id u22mr14443063ljh.108.1550545547532; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:05:47 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <004243c2-e473-ee1a-7343-e718f2177308@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <004243c2-e473-ee1a-7343-e718f2177308@gmail.com> From: Kyle Evans Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 21:05:36 -0600 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: bectl slow To: Graham Perrin Cc: FreeBSD Current Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: A0FE896B9B X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.97 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.97)[-0.967,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:96.47.64.0/20, country:US]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:05:50 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 8:34 PM Graham Perrin wrot= e: > > Preparing to update the OS, I created a new boot environment. Creation > took a long time, subsequent bectl commands are extraordinarily slow. > > Whilst composing this e-mail I'm awaiting completion of a simple list. > > Any ideas? > > zpool status shows no problem. Last scrubbed 27th December, I'll begin a > scrub after the current 'bectl list' command completes =E2=80=A6 > > ---- > > grahamperrin@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ % su - > Password: > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # svn up /usr/src > Updating '/usr/src': > U /usr/src/lib/libmemstat/memstat_uma.c > U /usr/src/lib/clang/libllvmminimal/Makefile > U /usr/src/stand/common/part.c > U /usr/src/stand/common/disk.c > U /usr/src/stand/uboot/common/main.c > U /usr/src/stand/uboot/lib/libuboot.h > U /usr/src/stand/libsa/cd9660.c > U /usr/src/stand/libsa/zfs/zfs.c > U /usr/src/stand/lua/password.lua > U /usr/src/stand/powerpc/uboot/Makefile > U /usr/src/sys/arm/freescale/imx/imx6_snvs.c > U /usr/src/sys/amd64/amd64/pmap.c > U /usr/src/sys/amd64/sgx/sgx_linux.c > U /usr/src/sys/dev/netmap/netmap_freebsd.c > U /usr/src/sys/dev/netmap/netmap_kern.h > U /usr/src/sys/conf/ldscript.riscv > U /usr/src/sys/contrib/libnv/nvpair.c > U /usr/src/sys/kern/sys_pipe.c > U /usr/src/contrib/libc++/include/type_traits > U /usr/src/usr.bin/kdump/kdump.c > U /usr/src/usr.sbin/bsnmpd/modules/snmp_hostres/hostres_partition_tbl.c > U /usr/src/usr.sbin/rpc.ypupdated/update.c > U /usr/src/usr.sbin/bsdinstall/partedit/partedit_powerpc.c > U /usr/src/etc/mtree/BSD.root.dist > Updated to revision 344269. > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # svn up /usr/src > Updating '/usr/src': > At revision 344269. > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # bectl create r344269 > load: 0.64 cmd: bectl 33517 [fu_ans] 29.69r 0.00u 0.01s 0% 4460k > load: 0.49 cmd: bectl 33517 [fu_ans] 53.59r 0.00u 0.01s 0% 4460k > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # date ; uptime ; uname -v > Tue Feb 19 01:46:46 GMT 2019 > 1:46AM up 1:11, 4 users, load averages: 0.42, 0.57, 0.79 > FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r344013 GENERIC-NODEBUG > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # time bectl list | sort > load: 0.10 cmd: sort 33904 [piperd] 1145.34r 0.00u 0.00s 0% 2612k > ^C^C > load: 0.18 cmd: bectl 33903 [fu_ans] 1175.24r 0.01u 0.03s 0% 4740k > ^Croot@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # date > Tue Feb 19 02:07:07 GMT 2019 > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # time bectl list > BE Active Mountpoint Space Created > r344013 NR / 22.6G 2019-02-11 16:17 > r344231 - - 3.81G 2019-02-17 16:38 > r343747 - - 6.57G 2019-02-04 18:04 > r343883 - - 6.90G 2019-02-07 23:11 > r342466 - - 521M 2019-01-07 07:53 > r344269 - - 392K 2019-02-19 01:42 > 20190131-0125 - - 487M 2019-01-31 01:25 > default - - 2.16M 2018-12-22 05:01 > I'd be interested in seeing what happens when you apply this diff: https://people.freebsd.org/~kevans/bectl-perf.diff From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 03:20:11 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4108114D9BA5 for ; 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[79.66.139.63]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y22sm57917166wrd.45.2019.02.18.19.20.06 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=AEAD-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:20:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: bectl slow To: Kyle Evans Cc: FreeBSD Current References: <004243c2-e473-ee1a-7343-e718f2177308@gmail.com> From: Graham Perrin Message-ID: <95e64c9c-08d2-1258-115f-7a93b7a7469b@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:20:04 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: B167797805 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=kl4jNAL4; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of grahamperrin@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::330 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=grahamperrin@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.44 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.72)[-0.724,0]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-2.70)[ip: (-9.19), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.28), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[0.3.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:20:11 -0000 On 19/02/2019 03:05, Kyle Evans wrote: > I'd be interested in seeing what happens when you apply this diff: > https://people.freebsd.org/~kevans/bectl-perf.diff Thanks, I'll let you know. In the meantime: here are timings for creating then activating a boot environment. root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # svn up /usr/src Updating '/usr/src': At revision 344270. root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # date ; uptime ; uname -v ; time bectl create r344270 Tue Feb 19 03:16:08 GMT 2019  3:16AM  up  2:41, 4 users, load averages: 1.27, 1.82, 1.59 FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r344013 GENERIC-NODEBUG 0.000u 0.013s 1:05.83 0.0%      12+140k 22+0io 0pf+0w root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # time bectl activate r344270 successfully activated boot environment r344270 0.000u 0.018s 1:08.08 0.0%      24+280k 19+0io 0pf+0w root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # exit logout grahamperrin@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ % shutdown -r now From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 03:36:30 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8461414DA802 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:36:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kevans@freebsd.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [96.47.72.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2EE7068462 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:36:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kevans@freebsd.org) Received: from mail-lf1-f47.google.com (mail-lf1-f47.google.com [209.85.167.47]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) (Authenticated sender: kevans) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B782512C50 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:36:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kevans@freebsd.org) Received: by mail-lf1-f47.google.com with SMTP id q11so13817590lfd.3 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:36:29 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuYWUjoJxpREX+TfFQnWUDCYgZpa9XcVQcMl4jSqorb6FINqDyjU aP6P3qOhifRjc6wLyauRrXW6GQGxSiKqui737Ew= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IaKeMMiaTYLkHPTLW7oIY5rGVMjVoJmL7jCtjvF0LVBolasPMbjc7acj/lYTGie8VXF/5HgJqK30+pUDL5r8Hg= X-Received: by 2002:ac2:53b1:: with SMTP id j17mr15232163lfh.143.1550547388156; Mon, 18 Feb 2019 19:36:28 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <004243c2-e473-ee1a-7343-e718f2177308@gmail.com> <95e64c9c-08d2-1258-115f-7a93b7a7469b@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <95e64c9c-08d2-1258-115f-7a93b7a7469b@gmail.com> From: Kyle Evans Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2019 21:36:16 -0600 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: bectl slow To: Graham Perrin Cc: FreeBSD Current Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 2EE7068462 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.98 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.980,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:96.47.64.0/20, country:US] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 03:36:30 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:20 PM Graham Perrin wrote: > > On 19/02/2019 03:05, Kyle Evans wrote: > > I'd be interested in seeing what happens when you apply this diff: > > https://people.freebsd.org/~kevans/bectl-perf.diff > > > Thanks, I'll let you know. > > In the meantime: here are timings for creating then activating a boot > environment. > > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # svn up /usr/src > Updating '/usr/src': > At revision 344270. > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # date ; uptime ; uname -v ; time bectl create > r344270 > Tue Feb 19 03:16:08 GMT 2019 > 3:16AM up 2:41, 4 users, load averages: 1.27, 1.82, 1.59 > FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r344013 GENERIC-NODEBUG > 0.000u 0.013s 1:05.83 0.0% 12+140k 22+0io 0pf+0w > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # time bectl activate r344270 > successfully activated boot environment r344270 > 0.000u 0.018s 1:08.08 0.0% 24+280k 19+0io 0pf+0w > root@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ # exit > logout > grahamperrin@momh167-gjp4-8570p:~ % shutdown -r now > Oh, sorry, I missed the part where bectl create was also slow -- the patch will likely reveal nothing interesting. How about things like 'zfs list' and 'zfs get all /ROOT/default'? Also slow? From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 09:34:28 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6156B14E88E1; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:34:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ot1-x32b.google.com (mail-ot1-x32b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::32b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3E96376310; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:34:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ot1-x32b.google.com with SMTP id c18so11503519otl.13; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 01:34:27 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding :content-language; bh=eyesO+MglHEQYukJIesD5xIqYfcV/NXO5Pp0pBRDok8=; b=nJGMb7+XKIQSgYZ/msQQULL3gLyMGc4zxNI2G5Dz9D6cDBs2IgMSvjYa8+i/NvLSPS hQvne1rQ0qnpJr7JTohcHBMf93O0s/WGcDE3tgYgmIiVHD8Z1XNFVJqGrT5dUhTe+Ir/ uEGBXf7J1519qccqX1SqU5RXInI61qWtrN3/DC1sCBg7Fhjh6rk/LX7kOdwU+Kr4/NCT QawqEjfAOBatOmkz6kRIpk+DvxbN9ix/fYOHbCUGIxUgEg1g0+m5MKqVW7uj+S3jbvm7 jFnzITAqjmqWYqtqPbnS1MlgZzPQHfqN5q4ileg8rkGOc92BJr3hNv4VhZaO9pbBEJ79 gFBg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:cc:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=eyesO+MglHEQYukJIesD5xIqYfcV/NXO5Pp0pBRDok8=; b=RN7EhzpTO9UN4fQokmdGWHW/ezBwvsIvEbEV0Ca8NIJMyRKa9OGaTvrGIFD/Zh3Fnl XJJN0HBbEl9y3XI/99IhS7gS0tM2Thfsar9Ecw1qrmome141YF+ABjHQON+dPSvzsBap FDSsPzsJgaUUM0RIlKblGpaAgRP7g9GLXo/XoSoywn6jpAD5/G4tDuipIqRNyqf02HtI ZY68DlnEqlR641uY2bU01TLnW+rk9RSggPLf9MmmKg4K+5JXuF8Dp5tOquvKgoLYzjEy eaY+rZZyr875uDw6DFD/7xGJkk5tExtny4Egql0RPMsL3CnYphLSlE2tPKXKxKUdg16M t6xg== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZv+4GYSZQXdvD4RcmEGwc3ThoRZMG30l3UDRnOEpnLE8loZlb2 ZZf7UopdBqTqTyLtjSHWl9Dx0YGFmQU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYzv3tqSurhxk5rrwdeE0O1o3qgU/G2fPBujVtihFTPwgXmbpMwTn2fSgw1YN2zJcQpKQjtrg== X-Received: by 2002:aca:c691:: with SMTP id w139mr1882225oif.82.1550568865812; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 01:34:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.33] ([81.174.250.12]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y5sm6884499oix.38.2019.02.19.01.34.23 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 19 Feb 2019 01:34:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: Warner Losh , Steve Kargl Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , FreeBSD Current , owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org References: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> <201902181512.x1IFCOwm005711@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <20190218165053.GC2912@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> From: Johannes Lundberg Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=johalun0@gmail.com; keydata= mQINBFxFmoIBEADoFO5jY+Fmsg44KiZjufEmpEf4kt7nCOfxNG9SruWpoXUaq0B296F+fIZC hNZqv1v7lGTsfoWRusxJmLd5CQgHHxEyruZbbPpNsQ/JKoDY3GGmrmWfN/SX3y0t0kdB9HsW mJcvZhK7we52f4gxddIVBS9nQoVoONX+hzXf8zwOAa0ik0EPgEwpIKS4j9lLq4bU+mqVKdRR bPeDujEA/qbsCKhaFJkPzXZtzEe6srq4RK1doEztwnKz02b+8gs642TRkWDQeTRZputrAaoN Un4R76A1QpXWyrFG1dQu48IGHi3KbkrvNyq6R1aUBIA0+CG1npIbxmc2mtSjoyvdipmDRbBD +mhECIxmYfBT6818zuj91XjrfOyfVdV2BryBvqFkJLkS3N3QElBIiVdDgdrqiNFWiOlDMxNI tdP16oQBNo8IB27/0YHpnQEw1MafZv5gG5DO0zLtLy88ASAfL7BYf90JP19rT4JIwnxsXxyv kEJnzhsXf0QVObEiAu1MqeFyWfZ8PpunmvEmJ0VChOL+v/kIx1E9cxhhzMZhqiMXfyM4zx2+ BF1FwAwJYPuJLu2B3L0uVBu+M1YvSOmKAbXPDP8PsqPjgSBTYI51MUjuuxN6jSsHDuK6G5k4 pUWR8axa+wafhd6Vz8zVwdTJZ9LdxgLLVg0kprBgccPHhPAZVQARAQABtCZKb2hhbm5lcyBM dW5kYmVyZyA8am9oYWx1bjBAZ21haWwuY29tPokCVAQTAQgAPhYhBIl1Pb3+hI60ivmRSULn yG4BGvSeBQJcRZqCAhsjBQkJZgGABQsJCAcCBhUKCQgLAgQWAgMBAh4BAheAAAoJEELnyG4B GvSe9O0P/RzeQAu1R37RlONZTXNn+qIAHvHbZEhzrCibzaZnwYdC31wGrYmXNDyiQIqOngFf QJuufQtH/+95OESJsjR+42L/pNfFdaEWxiI003qE7uCMzLK5UWUXd/5d5vYY0CaPyNCj1tyM ZIq7x4CaR3QLTh/Fw4zMUI/ZPH2S5SxVFGv0ZZFAdNYILD3qCkAS/9HmXsqufBWbfutA8TTf wyJfywmvf7ENjlZ4QOjb242ZY9NndqbmqTgWVAws+PN5e9AT8HkadscCTCSkYnxJyYG2El27 DpAAkekYplb/C0j82KSz2fy9RgwD+tTqt88DJOeFbIbrYt44u7KLHpzaZeqyUtn0reHCkE0W lnKH2kXXbuswFB4sONxI/J5+qSmOsAm5ItO3voyjm/swpmFR1yBlxo4th26gbO5NfBOK9YsY zHKgiRDv6ZdnHo+htphRxcCDHsFPzkQe5jouI25dvMZYl1LaTS/09lwYVwVIB2SFmMtFZ7rB N4NBSzPlpsg+g4dJNqiw6Rfa2Q/wUv+MzTJgLtHjDccXlpm33Nc09UytHFtNn26PO/zrM39r TwzdLu1mg0x2WWEWTIqe4CaczQU9SIg49BSyJNoPSZx3V7nMhTKbOeQKR5aV3dXI66aENw86 pa1tipuUKCPmope/GTJatUgPiD3JkyiD+7c1zQX2UAGmuQINBFxFmoIBEACb55RAkM59huAx 4Ddd8WBjsw25qf7rzxeRKAQ7or/8LvJBYQDPXZy0RhkRiu+P+MjxwGb6HVh+LDyAYDn9d8Mt ZqCP/dOGNcl7pkb6IhfRc3i5neckXCYfbm0cigiX9JkqZSt3KT96zbjCxsFZKyIyEFsMl46q 7wKWK5Irj3zxV/Z51JNTJyMLcIRWhY8G6qlMNFgZkz2Hv63w6BRekKVImOmOdThLAscy5ybq 2CIUeAwPG7lMYG9rgcPdn3tMPeWlLmUmi5pSwOQ3AKg3xFrW3WfegjRHdqpeuXoeTjYPPCW4 gyl59uv6E12a6eivItCxj67vlBXgOr4um+zoPyXG/WfidIFtWaEgyBrlGR1Klk7SIcqjEHUA FdiM+PweY4opHXXKn60NOZCqBJ59K43drOQgRouz8E2T3yEoYg40xAfY3lhJV/Vx5+kSTjmy sT2xotlPn/GzfaAEvNuJDK+Mec3LvfbbDoOWFolNyEvoMQqF5Q3A8eGqYsoVGBPxyzNvF2iY LkymxiXpgrSN0Q/LOK7pFlWwbVC8Z6g5I0J9ecgD55dGLoX2luLir787XX/JxGffzbRnP9NE ifenJGrQmx4CyEaz/CHQqSbROm5Uo/YFUX9J7OfUO4mtu90j773j32I3psey/Fz3EC/A2PHv Ghb0KsWYpS3Pj5TV1gGyswARAQABiQI8BBgBCAAmFiEEiXU9vf6EjrSK+ZFJQufIbgEa9J4F AlxFmoICGwwFCQlmAYAACgkQQufIbgEa9J7qOQ//YG/4e69YTSjtiYLXzBI8tRU2Sx+NFByx zx+C/r0EBThLtgRwCqEUZRB7iIDSO8aZ0Qa3vwWRohlD1tn/LBdDFfMmuQkNVdLIrjBoGBB9 B5xHdZJ9xnTZEwpTtk6IWolT4j+8rpGemGKKiFo3X6l02On4Qb4iM7h6rcDb76mfwooNYzB3 8PPcLvyOWb/9iCXAb5N7doo5zmOl15DVwvIF04eXU0q1FFj/iS1zNmtZ5Got82O1TQFV+de4 Rb3YA80IZhhhCiHHJqkMKeKQogRqU+UNDBARUBxfUtKsJtQzTQ2JUGwkb6X6bx53FTLP6O9q hDoODVweE1LdB1k1H5Nn+gawPdRMBqj43Y2amK7KEgoTBrwU04CLpKiaAC0S+EcJFfJcwtpK k3F+uTtP/hnhFnWbn8SgRkHKXKWqSCt63NstXhMzAJut1gEzV+CcPNKqa/sFgQaYEvzCS5Kl F/PXj0++f3TIFqT+2ZNNp8Bz8dT7gh8RPPg5oYQiCHH8K1RAmq7gKqmwyg0qgOazHnped+od X4f3qx320JAP6NP9wglDm6eht48NJzb0sffN8z34wrP66oz8oPKtS5CFV0m/384hEg0lmi3W wo2Hno7rA1etTPJX0dI6/GLlQDtNTHvKQ077HQdWVOMQVWC9j7YH7Zr9NjtOvxcNVRX3fxpJ 6CE= X-Tagtoolbar-Keys: D20190219093421241 Message-ID: <050a6adb-8769-2ef9-7859-78df2bd6e0b3@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:34:21 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; 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SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-2.48)[ip: (-7.77), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.59), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[b.2.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:34:28 -0000 On 2/19/19 12:37 AM, Warner Losh wrote: > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:50 AM Steve Kargl < > sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote: > >> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 09:11:14AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: >>> You do know these constant complaints about people trying to make thi= ngs >>> better is demoralizing and counter productive. >>> >> You do realize some of the emails are from frustrated users >> who are trying to make FreeBSD (see for example libm). >> > Yes. I get that. My frustration isn't with you, or your questions. I ge= t > why you want to run -current. I'm sorry it's being painful for you. > Sometimes, -current is like that. When this happens, there's always vesa and scfb (software rendering) to fall back to so your machine won't be rendered useless. Not saying this should be the norm, but good to know so that your work get minimal interruption. Alternatively, run experimental kernels/worlds in bhyve (what I tend to do when I want everything accessible on the same local machine). > > Warner > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.o= rg" From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 08:15:25 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5787F14E4B30; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 08:15:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gonzo@bluezbox.com) Received: from id.bluezbox.com (id.bluezbox.com [45.55.20.155]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5DFA972A1B; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 08:15:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gonzo@bluezbox.com) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=id.bluezbox.com) by id.bluezbox.com with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1gw0Yb-000KMf-Oz; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:15:14 -0800 Received: (from gonzo@localhost) by id.bluezbox.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1J8FBBf078284; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:15:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gonzo@bluezbox.com) X-Authentication-Warning: id.bluezbox.com: gonzo set sender to gonzo@bluezbox.com using -f Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 00:15:11 -0800 From: Oleksandr Tymoshenko To: Michael Gmelin Cc: Mark Linimon , Baptiste Daroussin , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , "Rodney W. Grimes" , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190219081511.GA78044@bluezbox.com> References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <20190218225407.GA7187@lonesome.com> <21E2EBA6-F4EE-4608-B2EA-AF731F892583@freebsd.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <21E2EBA6-F4EE-4608-B2EA-AF731F892583@freebsd.org> X-Operating-System: FreeBSD/11.1-RELEASE-p4 (amd64) User-Agent: Mutt/1.10.0 (2018-05-17) X-Spam-Level: -- X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "id.bluezbox.com", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see The administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Michael Gmelin (grembo@freebsd.org) wrote: > > > > On 18. Feb 2019, at 23:54, Mark Linimon wrote: > > > >> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 08:50:27AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > >> [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 5DFA972A1B X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of gonzo@bluezbox.com designates 45.55.20.155 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=gonzo@bluezbox.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.72 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bluezbox.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mx.bluezbox.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.59)[-0.593,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[10]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14061, ipnet:45.55.0.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-1.82)[ip: (-7.73), ipnet: 45.55.0.0/19(-3.86), asn: 14061(2.57), country: US(-0.07)] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 11:33:52 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 08:15:25 -0000 Michael Gmelin (grembo@freebsd.org) wrote: > > > > On 18. Feb 2019, at 23:54, Mark Linimon wrote: > > > >> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 08:50:27AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > >> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things > >> simply on the "5 year old" basis. > > > > IIUC the graphics changes are being forced upon FreeBSD by external > > projects (mainly Linux-based) that are making huge architectural changes > > that rely more and more on features from newer hardware. > > > > If our upstreams aren't willing to do the work to keep from violating > > POLA on older hardware, IMHO it's an awful lot to ask of our already > > thinly stretched graphics volunteers to provide it in their stead. > > > > w/rt graphics, we are at far more danger of being left further and > > further behind on modern hardware than we are at risk of losing users > > on older hardware here. > > > > Again all IMHO. > > > > disclaimer: I don't use any fancy graphics stuff, so (as the old folks > > say around here) > > I’m very happy (and grateful) that 2018 was the first year in over a decade I was able to run FreeBSD on a state of the art laptop with all the features that are essential to me working - which included decent touchpad support provided through evdev+libinput. I want to second this. evdev + libinput was the only option out of several that provided smooth multitouch experience for Xorg on my 2018 laptop I really appreciate all the efforts to make it work both on kernel and ports side. -- gonzo From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 10:14:50 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 934EE14EAB37; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 10:14:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ot1-x32f.google.com (mail-ot1-x32f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::32f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7736280106; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 10:14:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ot1-x32f.google.com with SMTP id b3so33254388otp.4; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 02:14:49 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding :content-language; bh=+EgTmta24yW6IDADtZH/jTShhz+EPVJEjNAJBSTqs1o=; b=J/alzgS534TJdQU3q9+m4xG8xp7+iinG8zgUcVYkXpGKdhj1DUKvbeU+oLVo7mKJQv /bDyPJ84zPcQzrQ6XkbKaiFUaImO0bs107Js5AVAKopI2BvxBmjiPPCLLLj8DQ/EBItc cgIHLefGSuEWrIgHC5ByQMoT5LtrS7fhd5z6GrWabN07zgxmhKBixX1sPJRuIoCoobVC Cmh1r5kz2iLLVVXeY1FdhlrPOQ4EUC5rVn9vlFll10RusMuQZ2dwkjaSnUNpHHRcoknI XXUaOXOifcBI4sq7cvUfCfoidaRnRPCKQrvLW5qTAwpMbNkfucDUna99wqqD678ojLky VUsw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:cc:references:from:openpgp:autocrypt :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=+EgTmta24yW6IDADtZH/jTShhz+EPVJEjNAJBSTqs1o=; b=myktLBeDC/vrRhBjQu2KXecBEAz5tRQEPRR+MHZDxevcYsACC5PS9IaprqxUn0/bgd CCS9gVujk2y9JBHX5rIysWtdiqzXsMgwB8FJvgMZZ0tho/szHgmTmtkLsMLCHhFUYBOO Pt7eUfJ9Ie5mlltz+gxrDCEHjdBJxZU9Q9z/v4AIcRF6kHywojo/ySLAdfXpxatnU/QI lJ5XZBGausMfgoUyLn7MU4Cx6T/wrvRo6w9xfPdJ0ALFsAe4P3UiKt0vAHaLHh9jUHzr rNNVHkh7s+bLZxK96JFbJQaTFLlLNBEJt2ew2e3VZqcuWPQzCu0Vi1FnfG7XqEuIW4Oi m/mQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuaDrzixSdZTYeXCpr7MXnQYJU4dZ3Kfy6ZM8WZsx6AhvvPr3xCf SWa9eJ/Fq4y7uINe3b3w8Qw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IaaEUSMd0EFV+Q//Jjrh9ZyMhGKAZRLXKAsfNMQvu+5+BiLGcQfn8WVJTDrBV5u1cLk8MDvuQ== X-Received: by 2002:a9d:5e8c:: with SMTP id f12mr17760443otl.343.1550571288270; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 02:14:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.33] ([81.174.250.12]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r132sm4249463oie.20.2019.02.19.02.14.45 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 19 Feb 2019 02:14:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: Mark Linimon , "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Warner Losh , Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <20190218225407.GA7187@lonesome.com> From: Johannes Lundberg Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=johalun0@gmail.com; keydata= mQINBFxFmoIBEADoFO5jY+Fmsg44KiZjufEmpEf4kt7nCOfxNG9SruWpoXUaq0B296F+fIZC hNZqv1v7lGTsfoWRusxJmLd5CQgHHxEyruZbbPpNsQ/JKoDY3GGmrmWfN/SX3y0t0kdB9HsW mJcvZhK7we52f4gxddIVBS9nQoVoONX+hzXf8zwOAa0ik0EPgEwpIKS4j9lLq4bU+mqVKdRR bPeDujEA/qbsCKhaFJkPzXZtzEe6srq4RK1doEztwnKz02b+8gs642TRkWDQeTRZputrAaoN Un4R76A1QpXWyrFG1dQu48IGHi3KbkrvNyq6R1aUBIA0+CG1npIbxmc2mtSjoyvdipmDRbBD +mhECIxmYfBT6818zuj91XjrfOyfVdV2BryBvqFkJLkS3N3QElBIiVdDgdrqiNFWiOlDMxNI tdP16oQBNo8IB27/0YHpnQEw1MafZv5gG5DO0zLtLy88ASAfL7BYf90JP19rT4JIwnxsXxyv kEJnzhsXf0QVObEiAu1MqeFyWfZ8PpunmvEmJ0VChOL+v/kIx1E9cxhhzMZhqiMXfyM4zx2+ BF1FwAwJYPuJLu2B3L0uVBu+M1YvSOmKAbXPDP8PsqPjgSBTYI51MUjuuxN6jSsHDuK6G5k4 pUWR8axa+wafhd6Vz8zVwdTJZ9LdxgLLVg0kprBgccPHhPAZVQARAQABtCZKb2hhbm5lcyBM dW5kYmVyZyA8am9oYWx1bjBAZ21haWwuY29tPokCVAQTAQgAPhYhBIl1Pb3+hI60ivmRSULn yG4BGvSeBQJcRZqCAhsjBQkJZgGABQsJCAcCBhUKCQgLAgQWAgMBAh4BAheAAAoJEELnyG4B GvSe9O0P/RzeQAu1R37RlONZTXNn+qIAHvHbZEhzrCibzaZnwYdC31wGrYmXNDyiQIqOngFf QJuufQtH/+95OESJsjR+42L/pNfFdaEWxiI003qE7uCMzLK5UWUXd/5d5vYY0CaPyNCj1tyM ZIq7x4CaR3QLTh/Fw4zMUI/ZPH2S5SxVFGv0ZZFAdNYILD3qCkAS/9HmXsqufBWbfutA8TTf wyJfywmvf7ENjlZ4QOjb242ZY9NndqbmqTgWVAws+PN5e9AT8HkadscCTCSkYnxJyYG2El27 DpAAkekYplb/C0j82KSz2fy9RgwD+tTqt88DJOeFbIbrYt44u7KLHpzaZeqyUtn0reHCkE0W lnKH2kXXbuswFB4sONxI/J5+qSmOsAm5ItO3voyjm/swpmFR1yBlxo4th26gbO5NfBOK9YsY zHKgiRDv6ZdnHo+htphRxcCDHsFPzkQe5jouI25dvMZYl1LaTS/09lwYVwVIB2SFmMtFZ7rB N4NBSzPlpsg+g4dJNqiw6Rfa2Q/wUv+MzTJgLtHjDccXlpm33Nc09UytHFtNn26PO/zrM39r TwzdLu1mg0x2WWEWTIqe4CaczQU9SIg49BSyJNoPSZx3V7nMhTKbOeQKR5aV3dXI66aENw86 pa1tipuUKCPmope/GTJatUgPiD3JkyiD+7c1zQX2UAGmuQINBFxFmoIBEACb55RAkM59huAx 4Ddd8WBjsw25qf7rzxeRKAQ7or/8LvJBYQDPXZy0RhkRiu+P+MjxwGb6HVh+LDyAYDn9d8Mt ZqCP/dOGNcl7pkb6IhfRc3i5neckXCYfbm0cigiX9JkqZSt3KT96zbjCxsFZKyIyEFsMl46q 7wKWK5Irj3zxV/Z51JNTJyMLcIRWhY8G6qlMNFgZkz2Hv63w6BRekKVImOmOdThLAscy5ybq 2CIUeAwPG7lMYG9rgcPdn3tMPeWlLmUmi5pSwOQ3AKg3xFrW3WfegjRHdqpeuXoeTjYPPCW4 gyl59uv6E12a6eivItCxj67vlBXgOr4um+zoPyXG/WfidIFtWaEgyBrlGR1Klk7SIcqjEHUA FdiM+PweY4opHXXKn60NOZCqBJ59K43drOQgRouz8E2T3yEoYg40xAfY3lhJV/Vx5+kSTjmy sT2xotlPn/GzfaAEvNuJDK+Mec3LvfbbDoOWFolNyEvoMQqF5Q3A8eGqYsoVGBPxyzNvF2iY LkymxiXpgrSN0Q/LOK7pFlWwbVC8Z6g5I0J9ecgD55dGLoX2luLir787XX/JxGffzbRnP9NE ifenJGrQmx4CyEaz/CHQqSbROm5Uo/YFUX9J7OfUO4mtu90j773j32I3psey/Fz3EC/A2PHv Ghb0KsWYpS3Pj5TV1gGyswARAQABiQI8BBgBCAAmFiEEiXU9vf6EjrSK+ZFJQufIbgEa9J4F AlxFmoICGwwFCQlmAYAACgkQQufIbgEa9J7qOQ//YG/4e69YTSjtiYLXzBI8tRU2Sx+NFByx zx+C/r0EBThLtgRwCqEUZRB7iIDSO8aZ0Qa3vwWRohlD1tn/LBdDFfMmuQkNVdLIrjBoGBB9 B5xHdZJ9xnTZEwpTtk6IWolT4j+8rpGemGKKiFo3X6l02On4Qb4iM7h6rcDb76mfwooNYzB3 8PPcLvyOWb/9iCXAb5N7doo5zmOl15DVwvIF04eXU0q1FFj/iS1zNmtZ5Got82O1TQFV+de4 Rb3YA80IZhhhCiHHJqkMKeKQogRqU+UNDBARUBxfUtKsJtQzTQ2JUGwkb6X6bx53FTLP6O9q hDoODVweE1LdB1k1H5Nn+gawPdRMBqj43Y2amK7KEgoTBrwU04CLpKiaAC0S+EcJFfJcwtpK k3F+uTtP/hnhFnWbn8SgRkHKXKWqSCt63NstXhMzAJut1gEzV+CcPNKqa/sFgQaYEvzCS5Kl F/PXj0++f3TIFqT+2ZNNp8Bz8dT7gh8RPPg5oYQiCHH8K1RAmq7gKqmwyg0qgOazHnped+od X4f3qx320JAP6NP9wglDm6eht48NJzb0sffN8z34wrP66oz8oPKtS5CFV0m/384hEg0lmi3W wo2Hno7rA1etTPJX0dI6/GLlQDtNTHvKQ077HQdWVOMQVWC9j7YH7Zr9NjtOvxcNVRX3fxpJ 6CE= X-Tagtoolbar-Keys: D20190219101444679 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 10:14:44 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; 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FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-2.64)[ip: (-8.54), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.59), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[f.2.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 11:34:13 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 10:14:50 -0000 On 2/18/19 10:54 PM, Mark Linimon wrote: > On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 08:50:27AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things >> simply on the "5 year old" basis. > IIUC the graphics changes are being forced upon FreeBSD by external > projects (mainly Linux-based) that are making huge architectural change= s > that rely more and more on features from newer hardware. > > If our upstreams aren't willing to do the work to keep from violating > POLA on older hardware, IMHO it's an awful lot to ask of our already > thinly stretched graphics volunteers to provide it in their stead. > > w/rt graphics, we are at far more danger of being left further and > further behind on modern hardware than we are at risk of losing users > on older hardware here. This! Especially, support for modern laptops is important. Personally, I don't know many developers who use a desktop PC these days (but I do respect the fact that many do - old PCs as well). My laptop builds world in 1h30m which is pretty decent. I don't feel a need at all for desktop computer and I don't want to trade away the freedom of bringing my laptop with me anywhere for work. When it comes to attracting new developers, modern laptop support also plays an important role. Without new developers coming in, this project will fade out and die. Another side of graphics which isn't discussed at all is GPU computing using technologies like Radeon Open Compute, made possible by the amdgpu driver with KFD (porting work in progress but not a priority atm). i915kms has GVT for virtualization of the GPU (porting initialized). These are pretty serious technologies that could potentially lead to good business (which is now lost to Linux). Modern graphics support isn't all about fancy desktops and spinning gears.=C2=A0 Totally outside the topic of this thread but I felt like ranting a bit...= =2E PS, if anyone want to help develop an iommu driver for amdkfd, please let us know :) Cheers! > Again all IMHO. > > disclaimer: I don't use any fancy graphics stuff, so (as the old folks > say around here) "I have no dog in this hunt". > > mcl > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.o= rg" From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 12:49:07 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48FD014F0240; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 12:49:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from debdrup@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ed1-x536.google.com (mail-ed1-x536.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::536]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 38F6585ED6; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 12:49:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from debdrup@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ed1-x536.google.com with SMTP id p27so9076418edc.6; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 04:49:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=trWqwI/1lU/8DgC4qcgFmT9AArU0Pi1wHe62uQhB4fM=; b=DfkpTzt9KezFuDpqzD2324JQ+KmaKF5+esalJrZXHkfDZN2LYdZPw4ah18WIEqDU6b sSTngUvqpaTWtxgQ36hS9/Q70KcyMWUowy7/DDBWjJ+lauKlSOoXqtWF+yYTAcEK62lc /tNWiSIrvc4nqTrtXT0Yo442ojNJh77nPP7fbV692Pfj7Z0jwYVYf1FtMtWY0zQe5eq6 v0WPH5ncyNG535A6072fTBLeuURfsKqc0deW5oCEBWLcMJUYAuoh2H+eN9kmJ4xYpGmx LFhm4xt/XN+vwCn2vSX4SJmdLl8oGT/WeBpIFqkZM5Y3RL4jn5+Asbp0OBCiNMNQd8Gu svNg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=trWqwI/1lU/8DgC4qcgFmT9AArU0Pi1wHe62uQhB4fM=; b=amSaaGFJZo2Y1gXh2GNGInP7LLXPN/f33EXZiPFWa1SbgbU56ATleYxc9NmlJkaBi6 Gw+npmKG4qRBc5h/B11aQeYwWfhJt1VDJIqhAxVj6EerA0EY5r13NnMrkGZHf0nDLUJB 61w+K8uJJoQ7g3n2wjieRxy6XdatfecvHdFn+dzBtHt2ezd2jf1y9eeLZANr4/QwalvK BR7xoTIw98QY5j1d27yUYQEahN7/v4yPAd083wvHZiTF4qXS8RMjBZJi7XP7N48DUz0X 5CDnvVbdVL/4R2FBK76lKfJ1nt5Bs4fDnujV2XT9XM+Jpmw77FFCs7FfyNsiIDUim4IT JONA== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZoC+dM+nTXnQxFHosWiWNehZ5G8zbHN62VWEs814EdzxSIVU0F giaQAhjx+bFPa1qjgH6Qxzw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IZuWRpMJv6sKPXpuzBdu6Uu4QGWJNEjcZCSTB/fRhRY7mvSfSwFs7DPl7omthhY3YELPP+mpg== X-Received: by 2002:aa7:d396:: with SMTP id x22mr20781520edq.182.1550580543986; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 04:49:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from [83.74.56.175] ([83.74.56.175]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id o63sm4772411edb.16.2019.02.19.04.49.02 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 19 Feb 2019 04:49:02 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? From: Daniel Ebdrup X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (16C101) In-Reply-To: <20190219081511.GA78044@bluezbox.com> Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 13:49:02 +0100 Cc: Michael Gmelin , Baptiste Daroussin , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , "Rodney W. Grimes" , Steve Kargl , Mark Linimon , Vladimir Kondratyev Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <77542747-D818-4A61-9D40-934A71D4EAEE@gmail.com> References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <20190218225407.GA7187@lonesome.com> <21E2EBA6-F4EE-4608-B2EA-AF731F892583@freebsd.org> <20190219081511.GA78044@bluezbox.com> To: Oleksandr Tymoshenko X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 38F6585ED6 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=DfkpTzt9; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of debdrup@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::536 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=debdrup@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.18 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[11]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.991,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[6.3.5.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(-2.68)[ip: (-9.06), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.27), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 12:56:46 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 12:49:07 -0000 > On 19 Feb 2019, at 09.15, Oleksandr Tymoshenko wrote:= >=20 > Michael Gmelin (grembo@freebsd.org) wrote: >>=20 >>=20 >>>> On 18. Feb 2019, at 23:54, Mark Linimon wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 08:50:27AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >>>> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things >>>> simply on the "5 year old" basis. >>>=20 >>> IIUC the graphics changes are being forced upon FreeBSD by external >>> projects (mainly Linux-based) that are making huge architectural changes= >>> that rely more and more on features from newer hardware. >>>=20 >>> If our upstreams aren't willing to do the work to keep from violating >>> POLA on older hardware, IMHO it's an awful lot to ask of our already >>> thinly stretched graphics volunteers to provide it in their stead. >>>=20 >>> w/rt graphics, we are at far more danger of being left further and >>> further behind on modern hardware than we are at risk of losing users >>> on older hardware here. >>>=20 >>> Again all IMHO. >>>=20 >>> disclaimer: I don't use any fancy graphics stuff, so (as the old folks >>> say around here) >>=20 >> I=E2=80=99m very happy (and grateful) that 2018 was the first year in ove= r a decade I was able to run FreeBSD on a state of the art laptop with all t= he features that are essential to me working - which included decent touchpa= d support provided through evdev+libinput. >=20 > I want to second this. evdev + libinput was the only option out of > several that provided smooth multitouch experience for Xorg on my 2018 > laptop I really appreciate all the efforts to make it work both on > kernel and ports side. >=20 > --=20 > gonzo > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org"= If I may throw my 0,02=E2=82=AC, getting a newer graphics stack also gives m= e (and others) the option to combine many machine functions into one; for ex= ample, I can use a single machine as all the usual things like: router+firew= all(ipfw), fileserver which can satuate 1Gbps LAN and WAN with NFSv4 and/or S= MB, and many other things (those aren=E2=80=99t _that_ new) What is new is that we can now use it as a media center for efficient hardwa= re accelerated playback of h264 and h265, as well as on-the-fly transcoding t= o stream to mobile devices via libva or vdpau, qsv or similar.= From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 13:04:11 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C888114F0B69 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 13:04:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ish@amail.plala.or.jp) Received: from msc11.plala.or.jp (msc11.plala.or.jp [60.36.166.21]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62A4586B94 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 13:04:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ish@amail.plala.or.jp) Received: from localhost ([2400:4050:9320:7a00::8]) by msc11.plala.or.jp with ESMTP id <20190219130129.ETUY30589.msc11.plala.or.jp@localhost> for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 22:01:29 +0900 Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 22:01:22 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20190219.220122.810151023308691159.ish@amail.plala.or.jp> To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: libunwind: decodeEHHdr From: Masachika ISHIZUKA X-Mailer: Mew version 6.8 on Emacs 26.1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-VirusScan: Outbound; mvir-ac11; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 22:01:30 +0900 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 62A4586B94 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ish@amail.plala.or.jp designates 60.36.166.21 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ish@amail.plala.or.jp X-Spamd-Result: default: False [6.15 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(0.00)[+ip4:60.36.166.0/24]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.99)[0.990,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; BAD_REP_POLICIES(0.10)[]; RBL_VIRUSFREE_BOTNET(2.00)[21.166.36.60.bip.virusfree.cz : 127.0.0.2]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mx.plala.or.jp]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[0.998,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[21.166.36.60.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.51)[0.507,0]; IP_SCORE(0.06)[ipnet: 60.32.0.0/12(0.70), asn: 4713(-0.31), country: JP(-0.08)]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:4713, ipnet:60.32.0.0/12, country:JP]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[plala.or.jp] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 13:04:12 -0000 On 13.0-CURRENT r344253, many applications can not run with the error message as follows. okra.ish.org[101]_% firefox libunwind: decodeEHHdr /usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/src/contrib/llvm/projects/libunwind/src/EHHeaderParser.hpp:62 - Unsupported .eh_frame_hdr version Redirecting call to abort() to mozalloc_abort Segmentation fault (core dumped) okra.ish.org[102]_% uname -a FreeBSD okra.ish.org 13.0-CURRENT FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT #15 r344253M: Tue Feb 19 05:02:52 JST 2019 ishizuka@okra.ish.org:/usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/obj/usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/src/amd64.amd64/sys/GENERIC amd64 Is this error only me ? -- Masachika ISHIZUKA From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 13:26:46 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 595C914F13A4 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 13:26:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ish@amail.plala.or.jp) Received: from msc11.plala.or.jp (msc11.plala.or.jp [60.36.166.21]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D51AC879B2 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 13:26:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ish@amail.plala.or.jp) Received: from localhost ([2400:4050:9320:7a00::8]) by msc11.plala.or.jp with ESMTP id <20190219132640.EUGE30589.msc11.plala.or.jp@localhost> for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 22:26:40 +0900 Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 22:26:31 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20190219.222631.1062784869320023115.ish@amail.plala.or.jp> To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: libunwind: decodeEHHdr From: Masachika ISHIZUKA In-Reply-To: <20190219.220122.810151023308691159.ish@amail.plala.or.jp> References: <20190219.220122.810151023308691159.ish@amail.plala.or.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 6.8 on Emacs 26.1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-VirusScan: Outbound; mvir-ac11; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 22:26:41 +0900 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: D51AC879B2 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ish@amail.plala.or.jp designates 60.36.166.21 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ish@amail.plala.or.jp X-Spamd-Result: default: False [6.14 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(0.00)[+ip4:60.36.166.0/24]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mx.plala.or.jp]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:4713, ipnet:60.32.0.0/12, country:JP]; IP_SCORE(0.06)[ipnet: 60.32.0.0/12(0.69), asn: 4713(-0.31), country: JP(-0.08)]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.50)[0.502,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[plala.or.jp]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.99)[0.990,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; BAD_REP_POLICIES(0.10)[]; RBL_VIRUSFREE_BOTNET(2.00)[21.166.36.60.bip.virusfree.cz : 127.0.0.2]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[0.998,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[21.166.36.60.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 13:26:46 -0000 > On 13.0-CURRENT r344253, many applications can not run with the error > message as follows. > > okra.ish.org[101]_% firefox > libunwind: decodeEHHdr /usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/src/contrib/llvm/projects/libunwind/src/EHHeaderParser.hpp:62 - Unsupported .eh_frame_hdr version > Redirecting call to abort() to mozalloc_abort 'https://reviews.llvm.org/D57081' was found, but I have not tried this patch yet. -- Masachika ISHIZUKA From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 14:27:04 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 058A614F254F; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 14:27:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5C42189419; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 14:27:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x1JEPYjV010742; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 06:25:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x1JEPWAw010741; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 06:25:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201902191425.x1JEPWAw010741@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? In-Reply-To: <77542747-D818-4A61-9D40-934A71D4EAEE@gmail.com> To: Daniel Ebdrup Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 06:25:32 -0800 (PST) CC: Oleksandr Tymoshenko , Michael Gmelin , Baptiste Daroussin , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Mark Linimon , Vladimir Kondratyev X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 5C42189419 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.11 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.76)[0.756,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[ip: (0.02), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.01), asn: 13868(-0.01), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.97)[0.971,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.51)[0.509,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[11]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 15:16:14 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 14:27:04 -0000 > > On 19 Feb 2019, at 09.15, Oleksandr Tymoshenko wrote: > > > > Michael Gmelin (grembo@freebsd.org) wrote: > >> > >> > >>>> On 18. Feb 2019, at 23:54, Mark Linimon wrote: > >>>> > >>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 08:50:27AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > >>>> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things > >>>> simply on the "5 year old" basis. > >>> > >>> IIUC the graphics changes are being forced upon FreeBSD by external > >>> projects (mainly Linux-based) that are making huge architectural changes > >>> that rely more and more on features from newer hardware. The port was created long ago to get newer graphcis, that port even had very nice instructions on how to bypass the inbase kmod of the same name that accsesed the same hardware. > >>> > >>> If our upstreams aren't willing to do the work to keep from violating > >>> POLA on older hardware, IMHO it's an awful lot to ask of our already > >>> thinly stretched graphics volunteers to provide it in their stead. > >>> > >>> w/rt graphics, we are at far more danger of being left further and > >>> further behind on modern hardware than we are at risk of losing users > >>> on older hardware here. We had the kmod in ports that supported this, no one was being left behind in any respect of the word. We are certainly driving users away by our operation model, I here it often from several different places I interact with users, linux conferences, oscon, local user group meetings, other BSD users that have moved to another platform, our own #freebsd irc channel. > >>> > >>> Again all IMHO. > >>> > >>> disclaimer: I don't use any fancy graphics stuff, so (as the old folks > >>> say around here) > >> > >> I?m very happy (and grateful) that 2018 was the first year in over a decade I was able to run FreeBSD on a state of the art laptop with all the features that are essential to me working - which included decent touchpad support provided through evdev+libinput. > > > > I want to second this. evdev + libinput was the only option out of > > several that provided smooth multitouch experience for Xorg on my 2018 > > laptop I really appreciate all the efforts to make it work both on > > kernel and ports side. > > > > -- > > gonzo > > If I may throw my 0,02?, getting a newer graphics stack also gives me (and others) the option to combine many machine functions into one; for example, I can use a single machine as all the usual things like: router+firewall(ipfw), fileserver which can satuate 1Gbps LAN and WAN with NFSv4 and/or SMB, and many other things (those aren?t _that_ new) > What is new is that we can now use it as a media center for efficient hardware accelerated playback of h264 and h265, as well as on-the-fly transcoding to stream to mobile devices via libva or vdpau, qsv or similar. The new driver exists and existsted before any touching of in base DRM2 happened. Many seem to be ignoring that fact, you did not get any new software, you simply moved the bits around a little. And the root problem, not being able to easily over ride an inbase module with a module for ports is only slighly better addressed in that we can now blacklist modules (that is a net gain, but from looking at things that is the only gain here.) Let me repeat, there is no new supported hardware or software that did not exist before the removal of in base DRM2, and it is only very slightly easier to use the new drm2 kmod for new hardware, and slighly more difficult to use the legacy drm2 kmod moved to ports. This is not some leap forward for anyone, and defanitly a slight step backwards for some, many, who knows, I put it in the 1000's, of users. We have never been very good at having kmod's work well over a long period, we break them left and right, and we got away with it in virtualbox, but you start doing that to the graphics driver and you are going to driver users away as they simply can not have there desktop go non-functional for even hours, let alone days. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 17:30:43 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5636E14F6405; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:30:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ticso@cicely7.cicely.de) Received: from raven.bwct.de (raven.bwct.de [195.149.99.3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "raven.bwct.de", Issuer "raven.bwct.de" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6DE168F44D; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:30:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ticso@cicely7.cicely.de) Received: from mail.cicely.de ([10.1.1.37]) by raven.bwct.de (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1JHSoVS036358 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:28:51 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from ticso@cicely7.cicely.de) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cicely.de; s=default; t=1550597332; bh=H4VXZm1kVV1w4S4C8l3qDn9IoAgCNQ3l7fhz+Mvhqg4=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:Reply-To:References:In-Reply-To; b=vaku5qfV4PklZhRxULXNL4YmGvdy8N057GG/csDySBF/bnHIdtgRF79MoDCQmO/Yc GthBM0n2j/l0Vi305h21UFprU18GtZgz0+scKhQzefX0J3ZmwBZpzTh4VF+TvOfNne y2AlUI7b+Pfb3AWYlbYCKFBmpzhRAOfeR05U+Ksc= Received: from cicely7.cicely.de (cicely7.cicely.de [10.1.1.9]) by mail.cicely.de (8.14.5/8.14.4) with ESMTP id x1JHSkbW025928 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:28:46 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from ticso@cicely7.cicely.de) Received: from cicely7.cicely.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cicely7.cicely.de (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id x1JHSkw5065670; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:28:46 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from ticso@cicely7.cicely.de) Received: (from ticso@localhost) by cicely7.cicely.de (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1JHSfHu065669; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:28:41 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from ticso) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:28:41 +0100 From: Bernd Walter To: Niclas Zeising Cc: Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev , sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190219172841.GA93368@cicely7.cicely.de> Reply-To: ticso@cicely.de References: <20190217180323.GA95686@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <71aa0ee09292b0e8648e385de33c455f@kondratyev.su> <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <7b25c1bf-5648-cd52-544b-828538a742d9@freebsd.org> X-Operating-System: FreeBSD cicely7.cicely.de 12.0-STABLE amd64 User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.9 required=4.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED=-1, BAYES_00=-1.9 autolearn=ham version=3.3.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.0 (2010-01-18) on spamd.cicely.de X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 6DE168F44D X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cicely.de header.s=default header.b=vaku5qfV X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.01 / 15.00]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[ticso@cicely.de]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cicely.de:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mx1.bwct.de]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.00)[country: DE(-0.01)]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:21461, ipnet:195.149.99.0/24, country:DE]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.37)[-0.369,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cicely.de:s=default]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.06)[0.060,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.89)[-0.889,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cicely.de]; REPLYTO_DOM_NEQ_FROM_DOM(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.99.149.195.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.20.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:30:43 -0000 On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 01:43:22PM +0100, Niclas Zeising wrote: > On 2/18/19 12:06 PM, Stefan Blachmann wrote: > >On 2/18/19, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: > >>On 2019-02-17 21:03, Steve Kargl wrote: > >>>Anyone have insight into what evdev is? > >>evdev.ko is a small in-kernel library that makes all your input events > >>like keyboard presses libinput-compatible. > > > >And libinput was created by the Freedesktop Wayland team to create > >pressure on OS people to make their systems Wayland-compatible. > > > >>>I do not need nor what these modules loaded. > >>I think removing "option EVDEV_SUPPORT" from your kernel config should > >>disable most of evdev.ko dependencies > > > >Shouldn't the EVDEV_SUPPORT default be off on FreeBSD anyway, as well > >as libinput not be part of the standard packages? > > > >The Freedesktop Wayland team consists of people with the Kay Sievers > >mentality, which made Linus Torvalds ban his contributions. They do > >not care about the bugs they introduce, forcing others to clean up the > >mess they create. > > > >I'd be glad if FreeBSD would keep clean of following that Wayland fad... > > EVDEV_SUPPORT was enabled in GENERIC on 13 and 12-stable to improve > input device handling in X and Wayland. Not having it means that a lot > of input devices stop working, or work much worse. I use it to run a wmt(4) touchpanel display, which wouldn't work otherwise. I have to say that I kind of like the evdev system as it also makes it very easy to place events from userland processes. What I don't like is that we had no autosetup support in XOrg when I first used it - in the meantime this might have changed however. > > We in the FreeBSD Graphics Team are working very hard to improve the > FreeBSD Desktop experience, since it is an avenue to recruit new users, > and make current users use FreeBSD more. > > Evdev and libinput is used by both Wayland and xorg. You are free to > use either one. > > Regards > -- > Niclas Zeising > FreeBSD Graphics Team > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" -- B.Walter http://www.bwct.de Modbus/TCP Ethernet I/O Baugruppen, ARM basierte FreeBSD Rechner uvm. From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 15:32:00 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B621414F3E7E for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 15:32:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-qt1-x82a.google.com (mail-qt1-x82a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::82a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 69CCE8B7D4 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 15:31:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-qt1-x82a.google.com with SMTP id w4so23608280qtc.1 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 07:31:59 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=BocDHvH8Q7C6/Ma0B+BxHvBkYNSEW5/vOogOZO84S4E=; b=Cc9YVgUaAAD4iSBHI25HItW5hH1+IAeSePkxJ/4kCYVyFG8pqfEJzSJsRTC7NXcOqO ryLIlWfNsjXepjimZVAaVxrZdjxP6lOps+YxdQfjwqvJjPmxcd3rSWu/1XmR6pN6jjhH xNj85145EZpnrfxFE6Gse9qTLta2w0iZvcwLuIp3tbtQaFMTuFVk3BX3PM7YHqUBbuUK w+H6doiqqYEKkRTiayOBlDgsV1HG6KSN6jDdwybxwf+lI0Itavq1Q93771LTVs773lcK +3ckB2Qh2w7//7jIRWCIWMc2JoJ8YNK1cwGD9kWHJTFG0sFaczshUdQmFMvOMXsHIGDv tuSg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=BocDHvH8Q7C6/Ma0B+BxHvBkYNSEW5/vOogOZO84S4E=; b=Xm63n4N+Czyx/cxeaDA7LRJ2Uqx2Yr1ZgKpui1fxGTXRPpjyi10zV8C9GQfW6Dd8uo 8Cum+2csTWgBwaDRrRgXoUfwli0V6cuF0MUHqH3GEGM4AknssVCzotg0kAYuIt9VhHYV UUAk3yI5bT2qok2C5H4kTIQc3kk6UT3PEdlyXn7w1Ca4aPLGDrmXuJ8vuGj2vppeqMHf JWHS2kGkPgEvbfvlxthXlVYSBJt8VIGB/spSMb9ejbF6oY4zd3vrOHs3clvZz9WtN/6V Gt9ZyDkqgt80BtMsk1RkO+YlsBa0JT8e7il6n4xQezcE6QGehVn9Nvuk534xLWPXbPPm wgJA== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuaTGT6+pnpYZhF40A9PSOiUG0s2qfe5DGCxIWADN9JdtP0/aY7f Sm4O45nMCvYrIlXBwGonm588pi3ltD8qYmIKNwR03w== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IbxZrnT3XUh1gTQ0TjKgnyDUEnjDHxfb0WUiQEhkcBiddhxEfyYGN2HVac+rmjMVUQYLQQncLZq3bOhPyfkw2Q= X-Received: by 2002:ac8:35f8:: with SMTP id l53mr23607069qtb.15.1550590318562; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 07:31:58 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <77542747-D818-4A61-9D40-934A71D4EAEE@gmail.com> <201902191425.x1JEPWAw010741@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> In-Reply-To: <201902191425.x1JEPWAw010741@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> From: Warner Losh Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 08:31:47 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Daniel Ebdrup , Oleksandr Tymoshenko , Michael Gmelin , Baptiste Daroussin , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Mark Linimon , Vladimir Kondratyev X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 69CCE8B7D4 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=Cc9YVgUa X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.55 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT1.aspmx.l.google.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.83)[-0.832,0]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; IP_SCORE(-2.71)[ip: (-8.89), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.59), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWELVE(0.00)[12]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[a.2.8.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:03:43 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 15:32:00 -0000 On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 8:17 AM Rodney W. Grimes < freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > > On 19 Feb 2019, at 09.15, Oleksandr Tymoshenko > wrote: > > > > > > Michael Gmelin (grembo@freebsd.org) wrote: > > >> > > >> > > >>>> On 18. Feb 2019, at 23:54, Mark Linimon > wrote: > > >>>> > > >>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 08:50:27AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > >>>> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things > > >>>> simply on the "5 year old" basis. > > >>> > > >>> IIUC the graphics changes are being forced upon FreeBSD by external > > >>> projects (mainly Linux-based) that are making huge architectural > changes > > >>> that rely more and more on features from newer hardware. > > The port was created long ago to get newer graphcis, that port even > had very nice instructions on how to bypass the inbase kmod of the > same name that accsesed the same hardware. > Yes. Those in-base drivers don't work. Or rather don't work well. The kinda sorta work for some people, but there's a huge number of kludges and hacks the graphics guys have been doing to keep it going and it's too much. Those hacks, like needing to make xf86-video-ati-legacy, like hacking back in support for drm2 in mesa which has moved on to requiring, basically drm3, like looking at issues that arise from there being regressions in drm-kmod on some older hardware. It's too much. There's lots of duct-tape and bailing wire that you don't see that's necessary to keep it going. That's the real bottom line here, whether you want to accept this harsh reality or not: we simply do not have the resources to continue to support drm2. I deleted the rest of your rant. It's not worth answering point by point. Things aren't like you think they are, and if the many polite (and not so polite) explanations haven't sunk in, another round sure won't help. drm2 is dead. The decision was made months ago. The game is finally over. I'll be committing the removal later today. Warner From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 15:33:19 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEF6314F3ECA; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 15:33:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from manu@bidouilliste.com) Received: from mail.blih.net (mail.blih.net [212.83.177.182]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.blih.net", Issuer "mail.blih.net" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C03E28B894; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 15:33:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from manu@bidouilliste.com) Received: from mail.blih.net (mail.blih.net [212.83.177.182]) by mail.blih.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id eeffaf1f; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:33:13 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=bidouilliste.com; h=date :from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=mail; bh=Ifb0zp12U0ZNl/QJg2+1HZpok2I=; b=IA3aWqCADiA5Kdcg0NPoRFT93kOf x6GNpxCoMzm9IulRdTHJCk7xdIW4Y0Br5Y6qOMw2sWwhmO50Fcbkhu3f3qdhKA7m YUKq78vigOjzfCFAWy8lLn62x613K72/xE/IsapTbMjuooneUcHdlnH+TBD8r2Ma 7mVDtXvVqPt3XsI= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=bidouilliste.com; h=date :from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; q=dns; s= mail; b=LfZLkAyS7NOjIOreawYCoGUMtkAzS3YIxSQztPIDC/o3oql3xoSVAE0y H3RAXxQ8Lke4CzHKL+o4WsEvylcOOJkghDko+lZDyfM1tly4+1WvsamAN+jv40Sh DspSV6UdWumokUK4CPT16C4qRN6PA3vmd1bifMQGvPJTAcx2/CQ= Received: from skull.home.blih.net (ip-9.net-89-3-105.rev.numericable.fr [89.3.105.9]) by mail.blih.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 4b6e6815 TLS version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:33:13 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:33:12 +0100 From: Emmanuel Vadot To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Daniel Ebdrup , Baptiste Daroussin , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Michael Gmelin , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Oleksandr Tymoshenko , Steve Kargl , Mark Linimon , Vladimir Kondratyev Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-Id: <20190219163312.c366eaead26ba2240018184f@bidouilliste.com> In-Reply-To: <201902191425.x1JEPWAw010741@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> References: <77542747-D818-4A61-9D40-934A71D4EAEE@gmail.com> <201902191425.x1JEPWAw010741@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd13.0) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: C03E28B894 X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bidouilliste.com header.s=mail header.b=IA3aWqCA; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of manu@bidouilliste.com designates 212.83.177.182 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=manu@bidouilliste.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.91 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:212.83.177.182/32]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mx-backup.blih.net]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bidouilliste.com:+]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.89)[-0.891,0]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.19)[ip: (-1.18), ipnet: 212.83.160.0/19(0.66), asn: 12876(-0.42), country: FR(-0.01)]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:12876, ipnet:212.83.160.0/19, country:FR]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.92)[-0.923,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bidouilliste.com:s=mail]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.992,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bidouilliste.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWELVE(0.00)[12]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:22:05 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 15:33:20 -0000 On Tue, 19 Feb 2019 06:25:32 -0800 (PST) "Rodney W. Grimes" wrote: > > > On 19 Feb 2019, at 09.15, Oleksandr Tymoshenko wrote: > > > > > > Michael Gmelin (grembo@freebsd.org) wrote: > > >> > > >> > > >>>> On 18. Feb 2019, at 23:54, Mark Linimon wrote: > > >>>> > > >>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 08:50:27AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > >>>> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things > > >>>> simply on the "5 year old" basis. > > >>> > > >>> IIUC the graphics changes are being forced upon FreeBSD by external > > >>> projects (mainly Linux-based) that are making huge architectural changes > > >>> that rely more and more on features from newer hardware. > > The port was created long ago to get newer graphcis, that port even > had very nice instructions on how to bypass the inbase kmod of the > same name that accsesed the same hardware. > > > >>> > > >>> If our upstreams aren't willing to do the work to keep from violating > > >>> POLA on older hardware, IMHO it's an awful lot to ask of our already > > >>> thinly stretched graphics volunteers to provide it in their stead. > > >>> > > >>> w/rt graphics, we are at far more danger of being left further and > > >>> further behind on modern hardware than we are at risk of losing users > > >>> on older hardware here. > > We had the kmod in ports that supported this, no one was being > left behind in any respect of the word. We are certainly driving > users away by our operation model, I here it often from several > different places I interact with users, linux conferences, oscon, > local user group meetings, other BSD users that have moved to > another platform, our own #freebsd irc channel. I'm pretty sure that you can find more user of -CURRENT that are happy that i915kms from base isn't loaded automatically than users who aren't. > > > >>> > > >>> Again all IMHO. > > >>> > > >>> disclaimer: I don't use any fancy graphics stuff, so (as the old folks > > >>> say around here) > > >> > > >> I?m very happy (and grateful) that 2018 was the first year in over a decade I was able to run FreeBSD on a state of the art laptop with all the features that are essential to me working - which included decent touchpad support provided through evdev+libinput. > > > > > > I want to second this. evdev + libinput was the only option out of > > > several that provided smooth multitouch experience for Xorg on my 2018 > > > laptop I really appreciate all the efforts to make it work both on > > > kernel and ports side. > > > > > > -- > > > gonzo > > > > If I may throw my 0,02?, getting a newer graphics stack also gives me (and others) the option to combine many machine functions into one; for example, I can use a single machine as all the usual things like: router+firewall(ipfw), fileserver which can satuate 1Gbps LAN and WAN with NFSv4 and/or SMB, and many other things (those aren?t _that_ new) > > What is new is that we can now use it as a media center for efficient hardware accelerated playback of h264 and h265, as well as on-the-fly transcoding to stream to mobile devices via libva or vdpau, qsv or similar. > > The new driver exists and existsted before any touching of in base DRM2 > happened. Many seem to be ignoring that fact, you did not get any new > software, you simply moved the bits around a little. > > And the root problem, not being able to easily over ride an inbase > module with a module for ports is only slighly better addressed > in that we can now blacklist modules (that is a net gain, but from > looking at things that is the only gain here.) > > Let me repeat, there is no new supported hardware or software that > did not exist before the removal of in base DRM2, and it is only > very slightly easier to use the new drm2 kmod for new hardware, > and slighly more difficult to use the legacy drm2 kmod moved > to ports. No, it's easier for amd64 users (which should not use the legacy-drm anyway) but harder (apparently) for i386 users, which are what ? 1% of our base users ? (at least for graphics purpose) And no I'm not saying that we should left them alone, but clearly the graphics team don't have the resources (time or people) do deal with all the arches. We are now two people working on drm for arm/arm64 and we hope to have something commitable soon, we need the same thing for i386 (and probably other arches). > This is not some leap forward for anyone, and defanitly a slight > step backwards for some, many, who knows, I put it in the 1000's, > of users. Again wrong, this is a big leap forward for 99% of the users. > We have never been very good at having kmod's > work well over a long period, we break them left and right, and > we got away with it in virtualbox, but you start doing that to > the graphics driver and you are going to driver users away as > they simply can not have there desktop go non-functional for > even hours, let alone days. > > -- > Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" Cheers, -- Emmanuel Vadot From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 16:18:22 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8556214F4D19; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:18:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from smtp-out-no.shaw.ca (smtp-out-no.shaw.ca [64.59.134.12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9F26B8CE7E; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:18:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([70.67.125.17]) by shaw.ca with ESMTPA id w861g363VMRX3w863gdgFp; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:18:18 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=TL87tGta c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:117 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:17 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=CFTnQlWoA9kA:10 a=H2chl1sJAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=oC-9f4RUFUvXFAz4hbIA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=1LKL4F7LEIE-fDNXaEJ9:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 Received: from android-68f84e02b5988183.esitwifi.local (S0106788a207e2972.gv.shawcable.net [70.66.154.233]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 19B41307; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 08:18:13 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 08:17:48 -0800 User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Pete Wright , "Rodney W. Grimes" , Warner Losh CC: Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev From: Cy Schubert Message-ID: <362D8283-0B7D-402F-99CD-657021597955@cschubert.com> X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfKuof13Yc4iiioYbHxCv2yJx1+x6/cdJ29KQGaIWpX32n5M7lfm90/IJiya5vWiXXurgwdpqolULEKo2jPuCCUymSFErm74MiHTbC2gimXbPflpi0PIS nmLkx0SBT2uAgsKAzWq2/p4KZS1Mb3cIl+8WgroVdTJPKQtoIbUPj9prkVHUgGQFa8bLdy1f2dQ93m/+UgR1W1U9fbSeRUIO6DUNp3t3bdnB6SWSBgX3eTEI s9x2SbaNu1ecrOpWy4ROIZjGKiO0XcFwmpQsL5W0DcHFAMZSS7o0id1k8hMyms4DWPyC5ShqOxwDkUhml8VlrMKyuaX4ygZJXSq/08DAlnISiSEMoD40T43n 5xchx1PW9ASiEl54rE8aH9M2ItcT5g9UQlHrDwRHQS+JXtDFz6cN2rLdB+GKH6djiGbUgAmZxtEZMtRBvWhfbSJM6FKu9x2Ia/+EH3irfsouEbcuTkpb9iZJ MUjzLNfQD/J7Gw+WemIaLKifBwO29xjnZ4B4xg== X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 9F26B8CE7E X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.24 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: spqr.komquats.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.979,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[11]; IP_SCORE(-2.05)[ip: (-5.54), ipnet: 64.59.128.0/20(-2.59), asn: 6327(-2.02), country: CA(-0.09)]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[12.134.59.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6327, ipnet:64.59.128.0/20, country:CA]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[233.154.66.70.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.11, 17.125.67.70.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.11] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:22:23 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 16:18:22 -0000 On February 18, 2019 9:17:37 AM PST, Pete Wright wr= ote: > > >On 2/18/19 8:50 AM, Rodney W=2E Grimes wrote: >>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W=2E Grimes < >>> >>> I don't know=2E I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything >newer >>> than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the >old way >>> is broken and doesn't work=2E >> But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that 5 >year >> old hardware that are totally happy with the intree DRM2 that is in >stable/12, >> and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with >thete a >> "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit)=2E I know that there is >wip >> to get CI coverage for that, but wip is wip, and we need to start >changing >> the cart horse driver order we keep doing and get things right=2E Port >> up and working, with CI testing *before* we go remove kmod'ed code >from >> base would be a much more appropriate path=2E >> >> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things >> simply on the "5 year old" basis=2E Not everyone, and infact few now >> a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware, >> giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 >> years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low=2E >I've put a lot of effort helping test and document how to get a usable=20 >desktop environment on a modern laptop=2E=C2=A0 there were two issues whi= ch=20 >motivated me to do this: > >1) my observation that many developers at conferences and online were=20 >using macOS as their primary desktop environment=2E=C2=A0 when comparing = this=20 >to the OpenBSD and Linux community I felt pretty embarrassed, but it >did=20 >explain the stagnant nature of our graphics subsystem=2E=C2=A0 people see= med=20 >afraid to touch things due the brittle nature of its hardware support=2E I noticed this too=2E And every time it struck me as odd=2E > >2) i was in need to an *affordable* machine with a warranty=2E >fortunately=20 >there are many affordable laptops at staples, best-buy and amazon - but > >they were all post haswell systems, rendering them basically useless=20 >from a FreeBSD perspective=2E Which is why removing drm2 was necessary=2E=20 > >after trying to get traction to update the in-tree drm subsystem i was=20 >lucky enough to sync up with the graphics team which was working on=20 >syncing things up with modern hardware support=2E=C2=A0 because of that i= 'm >now=20 >able to get my small startup pretty much all on board with FreeBSD=2E=C2= =A0 i=20 >use it on my workstations as well as on or server infrastructure=20 >(physical and AWS)=2E=C2=A0 i would consider this a success for our commu= nity=20 >as it's opened up the eyes to a whole new generation of devs to >FreeBSD=2E > >one thing missing from all of these arguments is real data=2E=C2=A0 how m= any=20 >people are on haswell era hardware?=C2=A0 i can tell from my experience t= he=20 >past several years the number of people who have post-haswell gear seem > >to be more numerous, or at least more vocal (and frankly easier to work > >with while squashing bugs)=2E > >i can also say that personally it would be great to improve support for > >systems requiring drm2 - but that gear is hard to come by, so we are=20 >really dependent on helpful collaboration from those who are being >effected=2E Drm2 is not required=2E My current laptop is 5 years old, an HD3000=2E The= previous one is 13 years old, i915=2E Both work perfectly with drm-current= on 13-current=2E Franky, I don't see what the fuss is about=2E > > >-pete > >--=20 >Pete Wright >pete@nomadlogic=2Eorg >@nomadlogicLA > >_______________________________________________ >freebsd-current@freebsd=2Eorg mailing list >https://lists=2Efreebsd=2Eorg/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current >To unsubscribe, send any mail to >"freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd=2Eorg" The only irritation with drm-current is after doing a NO_CLEAN build ARC i= s large enough that on occasion a video may not play because X is unable to= get the memory=2E Other than that it works better than drm-legacy -- with = no artifacts=2E --=20 Pardon the typos and autocorrect, small keyboard in use=2E Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www=2EFreeBSD=2Eorg The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few=2E From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 17:24:02 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D681D14F638A; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:24:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from mail.soaustin.net (mail.soaustin.net [18.222.6.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.soaustin.net", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C695C8F14C; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:24:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from lonesome.com (unknown [18.188.142.31]) by mail.soaustin.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 11A8017080; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:24:01 +0000 (UTC) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:23:59 +0000 From: Mark Linimon To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Daniel Ebdrup , Oleksandr Tymoshenko , Michael Gmelin , Baptiste Daroussin , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Niclas Zeising , Stefan Blachmann , FreeBSD Current , Steve Kargl , Vladimir Kondratyev Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190219172358.GB26499@lonesome.com> References: <77542747-D818-4A61-9D40-934A71D4EAEE@gmail.com> <201902191425.x1JEPWAw010741@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <201902191425.x1JEPWAw010741@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: C695C8F14C X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.79 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[11.6.222.18.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mail.soaustin.net]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[11]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.27)[ipnet: 18.220.0.0/14(0.06), asn: 16509(-1.34), country: US(-0.07)]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16509, ipnet:18.220.0.0/14, country:US]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.26)[0.261,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.70)[-0.698,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[lonesome.com]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.81)[0.806,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:22:32 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:24:03 -0000 On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 06:25:32AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > We are certainly driving users away by our operation model If you want to help take up more support duties -- especially for aging hardware -- I doubt anyone would stop you. There is plenty of work to take up; just check Bugzilla. > This is not some leap forward for anyone Nonsense. > and definitely a slight step backwards for some, many, who knows, > I put it in the 1000s of users. Utter nonsense. Right now we see the the following case: "latest graphics fail to work on i386 laptops". I fail to believe that is more than a handful of users. mcl From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 17:36:07 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47F1214F6806; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:36:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BC7F48F9F0; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:36:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1JHZsql001623 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:35:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1JHZsK3001622; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:35:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:35:54 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Cy Schubert Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Pete Wright , "Rodney W. Grimes" , Warner Losh , Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190219173554.GA1066@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> <362D8283-0B7D-402F-99CD-657021597955@cschubert.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <362D8283-0B7D-402F-99CD-657021597955@cschubert.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: BC7F48F9F0 X-Spamd-Bar: +++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [3.97 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[10]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.07)[ip: (0.14), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.20), asn: 73(0.09), country: US(-0.07)]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.72)[0.719,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.98)[0.977,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.51)[0.511,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:22:50 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 17:36:07 -0000 On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 08:17:48AM -0800, Cy Schubert wrote: > On February 18, 2019 9:17:37 AM PST, Pete Wright wrote: > > > > > >On 2/18/19 8:50 AM, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > >>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < > >>> > >>> I don't know. I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything > >newer > >>> than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the > >old way > >>> is broken and doesn't work. > >> But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that 5 > >year > >> old hardware that are totally happy with the intree DRM2 that is in > >stable/12, > >> and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with > >thete a > >> "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit). I know that there is > >wip > >> to get CI coverage for that, but wip is wip, and we need to start > >changing > >> the cart horse driver order we keep doing and get things right. Port > >> up and working, with CI testing *before* we go remove kmod'ed code > >from > >> base would be a much more appropriate path. > >> > >> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things > >> simply on the "5 year old" basis. Not everyone, and infact few now > >> a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware, > >> giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 > >> years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low. > >I've put a lot of effort helping test and document how to get a usable > >desktop environment on a modern laptop.  there were two issues which > >motivated me to do this: > > > >1) my observation that many developers at conferences and online were > >using macOS as their primary desktop environment.  when comparing this > >to the OpenBSD and Linux community I felt pretty embarrassed, but it > >did > >explain the stagnant nature of our graphics subsystem.  people seemed > >afraid to touch things due the brittle nature of its hardware support. > > I noticed this too. And every time it struck me as odd. > > > > >2) i was in need to an *affordable* machine with a warranty. > >fortunately > >there are many affordable laptops at staples, best-buy and amazon - but > > > >they were all post haswell systems, rendering them basically useless > >from a FreeBSD perspective. > > Which is why removing drm2 was necessary. > > > > >after trying to get traction to update the in-tree drm subsystem i was > >lucky enough to sync up with the graphics team which was working on > >syncing things up with modern hardware support.  because of that i'm > >now > >able to get my small startup pretty much all on board with FreeBSD.  i > >use it on my workstations as well as on or server infrastructure > >(physical and AWS).  i would consider this a success for our community > >as it's opened up the eyes to a whole new generation of devs to > >FreeBSD. > > > >one thing missing from all of these arguments is real data.  how many > >people are on haswell era hardware?  i can tell from my experience the > >past several years the number of people who have post-haswell gear seem > > > >to be more numerous, or at least more vocal (and frankly easier to work > > > >with while squashing bugs). > > > >i can also say that personally it would be great to improve support for > > > >systems requiring drm2 - but that gear is hard to come by, so we are > >really dependent on helpful collaboration from those who are being > >effected. > > Drm2 is not required. My current laptop is 5 years old, an HD3000. The previous one is 13 years old, i915. Both work perfectly with drm-current on 13-current. Franky, I don't see what the fuss is about. > > My Dell Latitude D530 running i386 freebsd, which used the i915kms.ko now locks up solid with drm-legacy-kmod. The PAE vs non-PAE i386/conf/pmap.h merger in r342567 broke drm-legacy-kmod. It seems that Niclas has provided a patch that fixes the building of drm-legacy-kmod. Doing a bisection on /usr/src commits is fairly slow as it takes a day to build world/kernel and the minimum set of ports need to fire up Xorg. r343543 and earlier appear to work fine with drm-legacy-kmod. I have now lost 2 weeks of hacking time that could have been spent on the missing C99 complex math routines. Yeah, I know very few people care about numerical simulations on FreeBSD. -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 18:59:31 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF41414F9752; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:59:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ot1-x343.google.com (mail-ot1-x343.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::343]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2109B6D57E; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:59:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from johalun0@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ot1-x343.google.com with SMTP id v62so27208314otb.3; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 10:59:30 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:cc:references:to:from:openpgp:autocrypt:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding :content-language; bh=sgHhCK7nyMQ4j9VWlgKyrcsvP19H0l1xEkjrw3wP21M=; b=JY9NexTjv9UT6/ghzAIl0qRccRPFIOcyAQJyb4BDeyPdEiLN4xp7HB2gLIehSkMkgV EKy5Idc2wa9Zid65x1SPYLRz0AINXvnN2VubG53BAPtnPyDi5IBbusXv5kqiZMgXZqk8 ZBmifrw1kGg4J2EIY5iCYHH0TiaqwfhBKzvSWSwXFg/awcCiDYLBFf+8uLyfHgDSJAsu bCQNufl70U2AMb1VjsWsI5u/lon267ms8XeS2eFY/F9zh+Btk0Eq8rpy2K8+8D592Vlh 1Ux6qKzbWPzm0+AFt4Oxh7OR5shsgNTvTupBdS0ZLy8M3C0thZAPFUSwn/Q8AgXI5y1c duFw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:cc:references:to:from:openpgp:autocrypt :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=sgHhCK7nyMQ4j9VWlgKyrcsvP19H0l1xEkjrw3wP21M=; b=jtZvaJql/9Ij0Z63NEMMuiblhwb4hgtAGRkyWfvHB33UCeSXfnwj6dbyiYPdbkgFLu xx8jts/7W56bKtcKrpTx08Avv4VZ2AT75LuCp656odMRu7oHIGdWg63YsJZ5asxvkWs9 sm2YCcvUXeGhz53zayvOpk/FrDnS892jvpLFtz6K+ZCD5MMpRbTP6Ttenls3KJAGp5bT wJbAvZjanBULXYIc7/ECd8lU9bsPq9R75JBcLtnExmBW3jqsQQlhiVMGExvHBkjoQALj uEZ9riKYiZgpRkcvN6fvVg4UUAWGdTcMEFX4OwT6LhxnE6jS4CmZeT4+9ynPVmjzorYV rOLQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAubLVnXuSno4ef8k9EvX27cCznE3ZQZVcB1ZGieIThvsRdodUEvy gS6RaLMvBC9qbuW+IyOdpZ+5RngjYik= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYDVfXS/tFtwd6ofztBzVydL64vTQQeSNoLN7biEnXCuRxmpb8S6lYgE0ouHz6o2en/u8g0yQ== X-Received: by 2002:a9d:2963:: with SMTP id d90mr19459819otb.286.1550602769200; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 10:59:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.33] ([81.174.250.12]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id k100sm3463224otk.5.2019.02.19.10.59.27 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 19 Feb 2019 10:59:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Steve Kargl References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> <362D8283-0B7D-402F-99CD-657021597955@cschubert.com> <20190219173554.GA1066@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> To: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" From: Johannes Lundberg Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=johalun0@gmail.com; keydata= mQINBFxFmoIBEADoFO5jY+Fmsg44KiZjufEmpEf4kt7nCOfxNG9SruWpoXUaq0B296F+fIZC hNZqv1v7lGTsfoWRusxJmLd5CQgHHxEyruZbbPpNsQ/JKoDY3GGmrmWfN/SX3y0t0kdB9HsW mJcvZhK7we52f4gxddIVBS9nQoVoONX+hzXf8zwOAa0ik0EPgEwpIKS4j9lLq4bU+mqVKdRR bPeDujEA/qbsCKhaFJkPzXZtzEe6srq4RK1doEztwnKz02b+8gs642TRkWDQeTRZputrAaoN Un4R76A1QpXWyrFG1dQu48IGHi3KbkrvNyq6R1aUBIA0+CG1npIbxmc2mtSjoyvdipmDRbBD +mhECIxmYfBT6818zuj91XjrfOyfVdV2BryBvqFkJLkS3N3QElBIiVdDgdrqiNFWiOlDMxNI tdP16oQBNo8IB27/0YHpnQEw1MafZv5gG5DO0zLtLy88ASAfL7BYf90JP19rT4JIwnxsXxyv kEJnzhsXf0QVObEiAu1MqeFyWfZ8PpunmvEmJ0VChOL+v/kIx1E9cxhhzMZhqiMXfyM4zx2+ BF1FwAwJYPuJLu2B3L0uVBu+M1YvSOmKAbXPDP8PsqPjgSBTYI51MUjuuxN6jSsHDuK6G5k4 pUWR8axa+wafhd6Vz8zVwdTJZ9LdxgLLVg0kprBgccPHhPAZVQARAQABtCZKb2hhbm5lcyBM dW5kYmVyZyA8am9oYWx1bjBAZ21haWwuY29tPokCVAQTAQgAPhYhBIl1Pb3+hI60ivmRSULn yG4BGvSeBQJcRZqCAhsjBQkJZgGABQsJCAcCBhUKCQgLAgQWAgMBAh4BAheAAAoJEELnyG4B GvSe9O0P/RzeQAu1R37RlONZTXNn+qIAHvHbZEhzrCibzaZnwYdC31wGrYmXNDyiQIqOngFf QJuufQtH/+95OESJsjR+42L/pNfFdaEWxiI003qE7uCMzLK5UWUXd/5d5vYY0CaPyNCj1tyM ZIq7x4CaR3QLTh/Fw4zMUI/ZPH2S5SxVFGv0ZZFAdNYILD3qCkAS/9HmXsqufBWbfutA8TTf wyJfywmvf7ENjlZ4QOjb242ZY9NndqbmqTgWVAws+PN5e9AT8HkadscCTCSkYnxJyYG2El27 DpAAkekYplb/C0j82KSz2fy9RgwD+tTqt88DJOeFbIbrYt44u7KLHpzaZeqyUtn0reHCkE0W lnKH2kXXbuswFB4sONxI/J5+qSmOsAm5ItO3voyjm/swpmFR1yBlxo4th26gbO5NfBOK9YsY zHKgiRDv6ZdnHo+htphRxcCDHsFPzkQe5jouI25dvMZYl1LaTS/09lwYVwVIB2SFmMtFZ7rB N4NBSzPlpsg+g4dJNqiw6Rfa2Q/wUv+MzTJgLtHjDccXlpm33Nc09UytHFtNn26PO/zrM39r TwzdLu1mg0x2WWEWTIqe4CaczQU9SIg49BSyJNoPSZx3V7nMhTKbOeQKR5aV3dXI66aENw86 pa1tipuUKCPmope/GTJatUgPiD3JkyiD+7c1zQX2UAGmuQINBFxFmoIBEACb55RAkM59huAx 4Ddd8WBjsw25qf7rzxeRKAQ7or/8LvJBYQDPXZy0RhkRiu+P+MjxwGb6HVh+LDyAYDn9d8Mt ZqCP/dOGNcl7pkb6IhfRc3i5neckXCYfbm0cigiX9JkqZSt3KT96zbjCxsFZKyIyEFsMl46q 7wKWK5Irj3zxV/Z51JNTJyMLcIRWhY8G6qlMNFgZkz2Hv63w6BRekKVImOmOdThLAscy5ybq 2CIUeAwPG7lMYG9rgcPdn3tMPeWlLmUmi5pSwOQ3AKg3xFrW3WfegjRHdqpeuXoeTjYPPCW4 gyl59uv6E12a6eivItCxj67vlBXgOr4um+zoPyXG/WfidIFtWaEgyBrlGR1Klk7SIcqjEHUA FdiM+PweY4opHXXKn60NOZCqBJ59K43drOQgRouz8E2T3yEoYg40xAfY3lhJV/Vx5+kSTjmy sT2xotlPn/GzfaAEvNuJDK+Mec3LvfbbDoOWFolNyEvoMQqF5Q3A8eGqYsoVGBPxyzNvF2iY LkymxiXpgrSN0Q/LOK7pFlWwbVC8Z6g5I0J9ecgD55dGLoX2luLir787XX/JxGffzbRnP9NE ifenJGrQmx4CyEaz/CHQqSbROm5Uo/YFUX9J7OfUO4mtu90j773j32I3psey/Fz3EC/A2PHv Ghb0KsWYpS3Pj5TV1gGyswARAQABiQI8BBgBCAAmFiEEiXU9vf6EjrSK+ZFJQufIbgEa9J4F AlxFmoICGwwFCQlmAYAACgkQQufIbgEa9J7qOQ//YG/4e69YTSjtiYLXzBI8tRU2Sx+NFByx zx+C/r0EBThLtgRwCqEUZRB7iIDSO8aZ0Qa3vwWRohlD1tn/LBdDFfMmuQkNVdLIrjBoGBB9 B5xHdZJ9xnTZEwpTtk6IWolT4j+8rpGemGKKiFo3X6l02On4Qb4iM7h6rcDb76mfwooNYzB3 8PPcLvyOWb/9iCXAb5N7doo5zmOl15DVwvIF04eXU0q1FFj/iS1zNmtZ5Got82O1TQFV+de4 Rb3YA80IZhhhCiHHJqkMKeKQogRqU+UNDBARUBxfUtKsJtQzTQ2JUGwkb6X6bx53FTLP6O9q hDoODVweE1LdB1k1H5Nn+gawPdRMBqj43Y2amK7KEgoTBrwU04CLpKiaAC0S+EcJFfJcwtpK k3F+uTtP/hnhFnWbn8SgRkHKXKWqSCt63NstXhMzAJut1gEzV+CcPNKqa/sFgQaYEvzCS5Kl F/PXj0++f3TIFqT+2ZNNp8Bz8dT7gh8RPPg5oYQiCHH8K1RAmq7gKqmwyg0qgOazHnped+od X4f3qx320JAP6NP9wglDm6eht48NJzb0sffN8z34wrP66oz8oPKtS5CFV0m/384hEg0lmi3W wo2Hno7rA1etTPJX0dI6/GLlQDtNTHvKQ077HQdWVOMQVWC9j7YH7Zr9NjtOvxcNVRX3fxpJ 6CE= X-Tagtoolbar-Keys: D20190219185925981 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:59:26 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20190219173554.GA1066@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 2109B6D57E X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=JY9NexTj; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of johalun0@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::343 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=johalun0@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.44 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.12)[-0.117,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-0.31)[ip: (3.08), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.60), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 18:59:31 -0000 On 2/19/19 5:35 PM, Steve Kargl wrote: > On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 08:17:48AM -0800, Cy Schubert wrote: >> On February 18, 2019 9:17:37 AM PST, Pete Wright = wrote: >>> >>> On 2/18/19 8:50 AM, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >>>>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < >>>>> >>>>> I don't know. I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything >>> newer >>>>> than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the >>> old way >>>>> is broken and doesn't work. >>>> But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that 5= >>> year >>>> old hardware that are totally happy with the intree DRM2 that is in >>> stable/12, >>>> and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with >>> thete a >>>> "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit). I know that there is= >>> wip >>>> to get CI coverage for that, but wip is wip, and we need to start >>> changing >>>> the cart horse driver order we keep doing and get things right. Por= t >>>> up and working, with CI testing *before* we go remove kmod'ed code >>> from >>>> base would be a much more appropriate path. >>>> >>>> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things >>>> simply on the "5 year old" basis. Not everyone, and infact few now >>>> a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware, >>>> giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 >>>> years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low. >>> I've put a lot of effort helping test and document how to get a usabl= e=20 >>> desktop environment on a modern laptop.=C2=A0 there were two issues w= hich=20 >>> motivated me to do this: >>> >>> 1) my observation that many developers at conferences and online were= =20 >>> using macOS as their primary desktop environment.=C2=A0 when comparin= g this=20 >>> to the OpenBSD and Linux community I felt pretty embarrassed, but it >>> did=20 >>> explain the stagnant nature of our graphics subsystem.=C2=A0 people s= eemed=20 >>> afraid to touch things due the brittle nature of its hardware support= =2E >> I noticed this too. And every time it struck me as odd. >> >>> 2) i was in need to an *affordable* machine with a warranty. >>> fortunately=20 >>> there are many affordable laptops at staples, best-buy and amazon - b= ut >>> >>> they were all post haswell systems, rendering them basically useless = >> >from a FreeBSD perspective. >> >> Which is why removing drm2 was necessary.=20 >> >>> after trying to get traction to update the in-tree drm subsystem i wa= s=20 >>> lucky enough to sync up with the graphics team which was working on=20 >>> syncing things up with modern hardware support.=C2=A0 because of that= i'm >>> now=20 >>> able to get my small startup pretty much all on board with FreeBSD.=C2= =A0 i=20 >>> use it on my workstations as well as on or server infrastructure=20 >>> (physical and AWS).=C2=A0 i would consider this a success for our com= munity=20 >>> as it's opened up the eyes to a whole new generation of devs to >>> FreeBSD. >>> >>> one thing missing from all of these arguments is real data.=C2=A0 how= many=20 >>> people are on haswell era hardware?=C2=A0 i can tell from my experien= ce the=20 >>> past several years the number of people who have post-haswell gear se= em >>> >>> to be more numerous, or at least more vocal (and frankly easier to wo= rk >>> >>> with while squashing bugs). >>> >>> i can also say that personally it would be great to improve support f= or >>> >>> systems requiring drm2 - but that gear is hard to come by, so we are = >>> really dependent on helpful collaboration from those who are being >>> effected. >> Drm2 is not required. My current laptop is 5 years old, an HD3000. The= previous one is 13 years old, i915. Both work perfectly with drm-current= on 13-current. Franky, I don't see what the fuss is about. >> >> > My Dell Latitude D530 running i386 freebsd, which used the > i915kms.ko now locks up solid with drm-legacy-kmod. The PAE vs > non-PAE i386/conf/pmap.h merger in r342567 broke drm-legacy-kmod. > It seems that Niclas has provided a patch that fixes the building > of drm-legacy-kmod. > > Doing a bisection on /usr/src commits is fairly slow as it > takes a day to build world/kernel and the minimum set of ports > need to fire up Xorg. r343543 and earlier appear to work fine > with drm-legacy-kmod. So it's not only a build error, it's also a runtime bug that would have happened even with drm2 in base? Hmm.. > > I have now lost 2 weeks of hacking time that could have been spent > on the missing C99 complex math routines. Yeah it sucks when you have to get your hands dirty and actually contribute yourself to keep the code you use alive and no one else does it for you... How many hours do you think we have lost dealing with all the whining and complaining on the mailing list where we instead could have done productive work? > Yeah, I know very few > people care about numerical simulations on FreeBSD.=20 > From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 19:18:11 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A945914FA160; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 19:18:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 787346E737; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 19:18:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1JJI84N003134 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 19 Feb 2019 11:18:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1JJI8f0003128; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 11:18:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 11:18:07 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Johannes Lundberg Cc: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190219191807.GA2941@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> <362D8283-0B7D-402F-99CD-657021597955@cschubert.com> <20190219173554.GA1066@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 787346E737 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.10 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.07)[ip: (0.13), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.19), asn: 73(0.09), country: US(-0.07)]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.87)[0.871,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.97)[0.974,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.50)[0.497,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 19:18:11 -0000 On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 06:59:26PM +0000, Johannes Lundberg wrote: > > On 2/19/19 5:35 PM, Steve Kargl wrote: >> On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 08:17:48AM -0800, Cy Schubert wrote: >>> >>> Drm2 is not required. My current laptop is 5 years old, an HD3000. The previous one is 13 years old, i915. Both work perfectly with drm-current on 13-current. Franky, I don't see what the fuss is about. >>> >>> >> My Dell Latitude D530 running i386 freebsd, which used the >> i915kms.ko now locks up solid with drm-legacy-kmod. The PAE vs >> non-PAE i386/conf/pmap.h merger in r342567 broke drm-legacy-kmod. >> It seems that Niclas has provided a patch that fixes the building >> of drm-legacy-kmod. >> >> Doing a bisection on /usr/src commits is fairly slow as it >> takes a day to build world/kernel and the minimum set of ports >> need to fire up Xorg. r343543 and earlier appear to work fine >> with drm-legacy-kmod. > > So it's not only a build error, it's also a runtime bug that would have > happened even with drm2 in base? Hmm.. It appears that that's the case. The likely candidates are r343564(+65 for missing header), r343566, and r343567. -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Tue Feb 19 19:06:58 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7724A14F9CA6; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 19:06:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from smtp-out-so.shaw.ca (smtp-out-so.shaw.ca [64.59.136.137]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8B30A6DD67; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 19:06:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([70.67.125.17]) by shaw.ca with ESMTPA id wAj3gI0SInBo4wAj5gKUBg; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 12:06:46 -0700 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=J8fUEzvS c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:117 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:17 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=CFTnQlWoA9kA:10 a=H2chl1sJAAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=14nd0HSAzgTfDkdeeb4A:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=1LKL4F7LEIE-fDNXaEJ9:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 Received: from android-68f84e02b5988183.esitwifi.local (S0106788a207e2972.gv.shawcable.net [70.66.154.233]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C4BA9576; Tue, 19 Feb 2019 11:06:40 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 10:47:08 -0800 User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: <20190219173554.GA1066@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> <362D8283-0B7D-402F-99CD-657021597955@cschubert.com> <20190219173554.GA1066@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, Steve Kargl CC: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Pete Wright , "Rodney W. Grimes" , Warner Losh , Baptiste Daroussin , Niclas Zeising , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Stefan Blachmann , Vladimir Kondratyev From: Cy Schubert Message-ID: X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfH7EbJlg27ZeAJHZdUpuI1k1CbLIZFQ6pz8EalFybzlC89KmE4KogvkI8rd3yugh+haJGMsfFKw1hjJ7Gfh3nHfvWUwAXPnG8trn66I7eGITcD0f0UZ4 jjQHJU6KbbxW6Ldtb5Lda6Z2HB5gNWw8IqjggNsiHM6nBIu2gmMqOc8Csr0eZYRq51EWj+1LSUlFLFOHbRBZNHwjDXa15az0AYBRqATNEXwt/NTjvz3HcLu6 l3pTz0ZMaz4Ept9mkhsOG8nMLF026zjSegNvvs5K2T2kOGqXSI4D+jj8efm3MPRvyTm4KqKpx+6peBHT6HWwj6tDOzBw64HuwPEJfuFc9be9uH9uJksmG7ky 0mi1moYN433Sg2WTS6hgFiBiUMT2CYUKraDLLiklGRvE2Zu+G2zrgPwY3NFwGeUnMJ7+ozgeB5Pv6pHdkZamRKHz3YwNW3/lIM+u/QKSuejZ4Ho6oy5DMtxj bC/+0+vgNNngbCTUOvD2T3ylWaaPq8sQzG5NkA== X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 8B30A6DD67 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.03 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-1.93)[ip: (-4.98), ipnet: 64.59.128.0/20(-2.59), asn: 6327(-2.02), country: CA(-0.09)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: spqr.komquats.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.88)[-0.883,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[11]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[137.136.59.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6327, ipnet:64.59.128.0/20, country:CA]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[233.154.66.70.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.11, 17.125.67.70.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.11] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 20:10:26 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 19:06:58 -0000 On February 19, 2019 9:35:54 AM PST, Steve Kargl wrote: >On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 08:17:48AM -0800, Cy Schubert wrote: >> On February 18, 2019 9:17:37 AM PST, Pete Wright > wrote: >> > >> > >> >On 2/18/19 8:50 AM, Rodney W=2E Grimes wrote: >> >>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W=2E Grimes < >> >>> >> >>> I don't know=2E I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything >> >newer >> >>> than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the >> >old way >> >>> is broken and doesn't work=2E >> >> But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that >5 >> >year >> >> old hardware that are totally happy with the intree DRM2 that is >in >> >stable/12, >> >> and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with >> >thete a >> >> "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit)=2E I know that there >is >> >wip >> >> to get CI coverage for that, but wip is wip, and we need to start >> >changing >> >> the cart horse driver order we keep doing and get things right=2E=20 >Port >> >> up and working, with CI testing *before* we go remove kmod'ed code >> >from >> >> base would be a much more appropriate path=2E >> >> >> >> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of >things >> >> simply on the "5 year old" basis=2E Not everyone, and infact few >now >> >> a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware, >> >> giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 >> >> years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low=2E >> >I've put a lot of effort helping test and document how to get a >usable=20 >> >desktop environment on a modern laptop=2E=C2=A0 there were two issues = which > >> >motivated me to do this: >> > >> >1) my observation that many developers at conferences and online >were=20 >> >using macOS as their primary desktop environment=2E=C2=A0 when compari= ng >this=20 >> >to the OpenBSD and Linux community I felt pretty embarrassed, but it >> >did=20 >> >explain the stagnant nature of our graphics subsystem=2E=C2=A0 people >seemed=20 >> >afraid to touch things due the brittle nature of its hardware >support=2E >>=20 >> I noticed this too=2E And every time it struck me as odd=2E >>=20 >> > >> >2) i was in need to an *affordable* machine with a warranty=2E >> >fortunately=20 >> >there are many affordable laptops at staples, best-buy and amazon - >but >> > >> >they were all post haswell systems, rendering them basically useless > >> >from a FreeBSD perspective=2E >>=20 >> Which is why removing drm2 was necessary=2E=20 >>=20 >> > >> >after trying to get traction to update the in-tree drm subsystem i >was=20 >> >lucky enough to sync up with the graphics team which was working on=20 >> >syncing things up with modern hardware support=2E=C2=A0 because of tha= t i'm >> >now=20 >> >able to get my small startup pretty much all on board with FreeBSD=2E= =C2=A0 >i=20 >> >use it on my workstations as well as on or server infrastructure=20 >> >(physical and AWS)=2E=C2=A0 i would consider this a success for our >community=20 >> >as it's opened up the eyes to a whole new generation of devs to >> >FreeBSD=2E >> > >> >one thing missing from all of these arguments is real data=2E=C2=A0 ho= w >many=20 >> >people are on haswell era hardware?=C2=A0 i can tell from my experienc= e >the=20 >> >past several years the number of people who have post-haswell gear >seem >> > >> >to be more numerous, or at least more vocal (and frankly easier to >work >> > >> >with while squashing bugs)=2E >> > >> >i can also say that personally it would be great to improve support >for >> > >> >systems requiring drm2 - but that gear is hard to come by, so we are > >> >really dependent on helpful collaboration from those who are being >> >effected=2E >>=20 >> Drm2 is not required=2E My current laptop is 5 years old, an HD3000=2E >The previous one is 13 years old, i915=2E Both work perfectly with >drm-current on 13-current=2E Franky, I don't see what the fuss is about= =2E >>=20 >>=20 > >My Dell Latitude D530 running i386 freebsd, which used the >i915kms=2Eko now locks up solid with drm-legacy-kmod=2E The PAE vs >non-PAE i386/conf/pmap=2Eh merger in r342567 broke drm-legacy-kmod=2E >It seems that Niclas has provided a patch that fixes the building >of drm-legacy-kmod=2E > >Doing a bisection on /usr/src commits is fairly slow as it >takes a day to build world/kernel and the minimum set of ports >need to fire up Xorg=2E r343543 and earlier appear to work fine >with drm-legacy-kmod=2E > >I have now lost 2 weeks of hacking time that could have been spent >on the missing C99 complex math routines=2E Yeah, I know very few >people care about numerical simulations on FreeBSD=2E=20 Going down an unexpected rabbit hole is frustrating=2E --=20 Pardon the typos and autocorrect, small keyboard in use=2E Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www=2EFreeBSD=2Eorg The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few=2E From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Wed Feb 20 00:53:50 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B40A014DFDD9 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 00:53:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (mailman.ysv.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::50:5]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07CEE84ABC for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 00:53:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) id B517014DFDD8; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 00:53:49 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DFE014DFDD7 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 00:53:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from slim.berklix.org (slim.berklix.org [94.185.90.68]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "slim.berklix.org", Issuer "slim.berklix.org" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7230D84ABB for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 00:53:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from mart.js.berklix.net (p2E52C0CB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [46.82.192.203]) (authenticated bits=128) by slim.berklix.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id x1K0rXWd039527 (version=TLSv1 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 01:53:38 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from fire.js.berklix.net (fire.js.berklix.net [192.168.91.41]) by mart.js.berklix.net (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id x1K0rRxJ012275 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 01:53:27 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Received: from fire.js.berklix.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fire.js.berklix.net (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id x1K0rFg2025986 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 01:53:27 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jhs@berklix.com) Message-Id: <201902200053.x1K0rFg2025986@fire.js.berklix.net> To: current@freebsd.org Subject: rm /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a From: "Julian H. Stacey" Organization: http://berklix.eu BSD Unix Linux Consultants, Munich Aachen Kent User-agent: EXMH on FreeBSD http://www.berklix.eu/free/ X-From: http://www.berklix.eu/~jhs/ Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 01:53:15 +0100 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 7230D84ABB X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.13 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[slim.berklix.com]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[203.192.82.46.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.10]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:33824, ipnet:94.185.88.0/22, country:DE]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; URI_HIDDEN_PATH(1.00)[http://www.berklix.com/~jhs/bin/.csh/customise]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[current@freebsd.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.64)[0.640,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[berklix.com]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.61)[0.606,0]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[0.996,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[68.90.185.94.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.00)[country: DE(-0.01)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 00:53:51 -0000 Hi current@ Has anyone else in the last few months needed to do: rm /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a My generic make buildworld & make installworld seem to usually succeed, but after I've then run my own normal customise /usr/src (which I've been running about 20 years now, no problem, applying my local diffs), lately the subsequent cd /usr/src; make all has hung as typescript below, & others here http://www.berklix.com/~jhs/tmp/src/typescript.0 http://www.berklix.com/~jhs/tmp/src/typescript.1 http://www.berklix.com/~jhs/tmp/src/lib/libgcc_s/typescript I don't think it's my diffs which tweak commands, but not libs like lib/libgcc_s & not C lang, tools ( http://www.berklix.com/~jhs/src/bsd/fixes/freebsd/src/ # Matches to /usr/src/ http://www.berklix.com/~jhs/all.html # Full list of diffs & releases http://www.berklix.com/~jhs/bin/.csh/customise # My script to apply diffs: ) I'm wondering, is if it's something to do with eg make.conf CFLAGS though I see nothing. With a src/Makefile with: jhs: echo "JHS ${CFLAGS} JHS" make jhs JHS -O2 -pipe JHS -O2 -pipe seems OK, it's from generic share/mk/sys.mk:CFLAGS ?= -O2 -pipe sys/conf/kern.pre.mk:COPTFLAGS?=-O2 -pipe My /etc/src.conf just has: NEED_MAKE_UPGRADE=YES WITH_RCMDS=YES WITHOUT_REPRODUCIBLE_BUILD="YES" # see /usr/src/UPDATING ls -l /usr/lib/libc.a /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a* -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel 16779882 Feb 18 16:50 /usr/lib/libc.a -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 16779882 Feb 19 11:46 /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 16779882 Feb 17 23:09 /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a.MV.1 -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 16779882 Feb 18 23:09 /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a.MV.2 -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 16779882 Feb 19 11:41 /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a.MV.3 md5 /usr/lib/libc.a /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a* MD5 (/usr/lib/libc.a) = a4d2881b6dd08a71a8adb126125efa66 MD5 (/usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a) = 75995a3cd1436bad5cf124a9ba80033f MD5 (/usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a.MV.1) = a4d2881b6dd08a71a8adb126125efa66 MD5 (/usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a.MV.2) = 75995a3cd1436bad5cf124a9ba80033f MD5 (/usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a.MV.3) = 75995a3cd1436bad5cf124a9ba80033f ========== 13.0-CURRENT /dev/pts/3 root 1 lapr/usr/src/lib/libgcc_s make building shared library libgcc_s.so.1 cc -nodefaultlibs -Wl,--version-script=/usr/src/lib/libgcc_s/Version.map -shared -Wl,-x -Wl,--fatal-warnings -Wl,--warn-shared-textrel -o libgcc_s.so.1.full -Wl,-soname,libgcc_s.so.1 `NM='nm' NMFLAGS='' lorder absvdi2.pico absvsi2.pico absvti2.pico addvdi3.pico addvsi3.pico addvti3.pico apple_versioning.pico ashldi3.pico ashlti3.pico ashrdi3.pico ashrti3.pico clear_cache.pico clzdi2.pico clzsi2.pico clzti2.pico cmpdi2.pico cmpti2.pico ctzdi2.pico ctzsi2.pico ctzti2.pico divdc3.pico divdi3.pico divmoddi4.pico divmodsi4.pico divsc3.pico divsi3.pico divtc3.pico divti3.pico divxc3.pico enable_execute_stack.pico eprintf.pico extendhfsf2.pico ffsdi2.pico ffssi2.pico ffsti2.pico fixdfdi.pico fixdfti.pico fixsfdi.pico fixsfti.pico fixunsdfdi.pico fixunsdfsi.pico fixunsdfti.pico fixunssfdi.pico fixunssfsi.pico fixunssfti.pico fixunsxfdi.pico fixunsxfsi.pico fixunsxfti.pico fixxfdi.pico fixxfti.pico floatditf.pico floatsitf.pico floattidf.pico floattisf.pico floattixf.pico floatunditf.pico floatunsidf.pico floatunsisf.pico floatuntidf.pico floatuntisf.pico floatuntixf.pico gcc_personality_v0.pico int_util.pico lshrdi3.pico lshrti3.pico moddi3.pico modsi3.pico modti3.pico muldc3.pico muldi3.pico mulodi4.pico mulosi4.pico muloti4.pico mulsc3.pico multi3.pico mulvdi3.pico mulvsi3.pico mulvti3.pico multc3.pico mulxc3.pico negdf2.pico negdi2.pico negsf2.pico negti2.pico negvdi2.pico negvsi2.pico negvti2.pico paritydi2.pico paritysi2.pico parityti2.pico popcountdi2.pico popcountsi2.pico popcountti2.pico powidf2.pico powisf2.pico powitf2.pico powixf2.pico subvdi3.pico subvsi3.pico subvti3.pico trampoline_setup.pico truncdfhf2.pico truncsfhf2.pico ucmpdi2.pico ucmpti2.pico udivdi3.pico udivmoddi4.pico udivmodsi4.pico udivmodti4.pico udivsi3.pico udivti3.pico umoddi3.pico umodsi3.pico umodti3.pico floatdidf.pico floatdisf.pico floatdixf.pico floatundidf.pico floatundisf.pico floatundixf.pico cpu_model.pico adddf3.pico addsf3.pico divdf3.pico divsf3.pico extendsfdf2.pico fixdfsi.pico fixsfsi.pico floatsidf.pico floatsisf.pico muldf3.pico mulsf3.pico subdf3.pico subsf3.pico truncdfsf2.pico comparedf2.pico comparesf2.pico gcc_personality_v0.pico int_util.pico Unwind-EHABI.pico Unwind-sjlj.pico UnwindLevel1-gcc-ext.pico UnwindLevel1.pico UnwindRegistersRestore.pico UnwindRegistersSave.pico libunwind.pico s_fabs.pico s_fabsf.pico s_fabsl.pico s_fmax.pico s_fmaxf.pico s_logb.pico s_logbf.pico s_scalbn.pico s_scalbnf.pico s_fmaxl.pico s_logbl.pico s_scalbnl.pico | tsort -q` -L/usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc -lc ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32S against symbol: __je_sz_size2index_tab in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_sz.o) >>> referenced by sz.h:0 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/sz.h:0) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by mutex.h:144 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/mutex.h:144) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by mutex.h:203 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/mutex.h:203) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by mutex.h:214 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/mutex.h:214) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against symbol: __je_arenas_lock in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by mutex.h:144 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/mutex.h:144) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against symbol: __je_arenas_lock in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by mutex.h:203 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/mutex.h:203) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against symbol: __je_extent_hooks_default in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_extent.o) >>> referenced by jemalloc_jemalloc.c:366 >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against symbol: __je_arenas_lock in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by mutex.h:214 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/mutex.h:214) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by sz.h:166 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/sz.h:166) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by sz.h:166 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/sz.h:166) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by sz.h:166 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/sz.h:166) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by bit_util.h:109 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/bit_util.h:109) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by bit_util.h:109 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/bit_util.h:109) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by bit_util.h:109 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/bit_util.h:109) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by sz.h:159 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/sz.h:159) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by sz.h:159 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/sz.h:159) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by sz.h:159 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/sz.h:159) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by bit_util.h:103 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/bit_util.h:103) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by bit_util.h:103 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/bit_util.h:103) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mcan't create dynamic relocation R_X86_64_32 against local symbol in readonly segment; recompile object files with -fPIC or pass '-Wl,-z,notext' to allow text relocations in the output >>> defined in /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a(jemalloc_jemalloc.o) >>> referenced by bit_util.h:103 (/usr/src/contrib/jemalloc/include/jemalloc/internal/bit_util.h:103) >>> jemalloc_jemalloc.o:(a0ialloc) in archive /usr/obj/usr/src/amd64.amd64/lib/libc/libc.a ld: [0;1;31merror: [0mtoo many errors emitted, stopping now (use -error-limit=0 to see all errors) cc: [0;1;31merror: [0mlinker command failed with exit code 1 (use -v to see invocation)[0m *** Error code 1 ========== Cheers, Julian -- Julian Stacey, Consultant Systems Engineer, BSD Linux Unix, Munich Aachen Kent No Blind Crash : Brexit now a minority : 2nd Referendum : Revoke Article 50. 1.9 M in UK were too young: More Remainers; 1.3 M died: less Leavers; UK Stole 700,000+ votes from British in EU:near all Remainers + 3M globally; + 2.5 years of move to Remain. http://www.berklix.uk/brexit/#email_an_mp From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Wed Feb 20 16:07:43 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03FCB14F79DE; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 16:07:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tijl@freebsd.org) Received: from mailrelay114.isp.belgacom.be (mailrelay114.isp.belgacom.be [195.238.20.141]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "relay.skynet.be", Issuer "GlobalSign Organization Validation CA - SHA256 - G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 087EC867AD; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 16:07:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tijl@freebsd.org) X-Belgacom-Dynamic: yes X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A2BdAABjem1c/99MQFdkDg4BAQEEAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?HBAEBgVEHAQELAQGCAlZiMieMIV+LCgEBggw1AYlwjXaBe4R5AoNzIzQJDQE?= =?us-ascii?q?DAQECAQECbShCARABhHcBBTocIxALDgoJJQ8qHgYThRevAYkngQ6MW4F/hCO?= =?us-ascii?q?KYQKRF5I1CZJOJZMGnjk4gVZNMAiDJ4IoF41jPD4DMAGFJopkAQE?= X-IPAS-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A2BdAABjem1c/99MQFdkDg4BAQEEAQEHBAEBgVEHAQELA?= =?us-ascii?q?QGCAlZiMieMIV+LCgEBggw1AYlwjXaBe4R5AoNzIzQJDQEDAQECAQECbShCA?= =?us-ascii?q?RABhHcBBTocIxALDgoJJQ8qHgYThRevAYkngQ6MW4F/hCOKYQKRF5I1CZJOJ?= =?us-ascii?q?ZMGnjk4gVZNMAiDJ4IoF41jPD4DMAGFJopkAQE?= Received: from 223.76-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be (HELO kalimero.tijl.coosemans.org) ([87.64.76.223]) by relay.skynet.be with ESMTP; 20 Feb 2019 17:07:41 +0100 Received: from kalimero.tijl.coosemans.org (kalimero.tijl.coosemans.org [127.0.0.1]) by kalimero.tijl.coosemans.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id x1KG7d1S042574; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 17:07:39 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from tijl@FreeBSD.org) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 17:07:38 +0100 From: =?UTF-8?B?VMSzbA==?= Coosemans To: Steve Kargl Cc: Johannes Lundberg , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <20190220170738.37181f94@kalimero.tijl.coosemans.org> In-Reply-To: <20190219191807.GA2941@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> <362D8283-0B7D-402F-99CD-657021597955@cschubert.com> <20190219173554.GA1066@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190219191807.GA2941@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 087EC867AD X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.95 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.95)[-0.951,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:5432, ipnet:195.238.0.0/19, country:BE] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 16:07:43 -0000 On Tue, 19 Feb 2019 11:18:07 -0800 Steve Kargl wrote: > On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 06:59:26PM +0000, Johannes Lundberg wrote: >> On 2/19/19 5:35 PM, Steve Kargl wrote: >>> My Dell Latitude D530 running i386 freebsd, which used the >>> i915kms.ko now locks up solid with drm-legacy-kmod. The PAE vs >>> non-PAE i386/conf/pmap.h merger in r342567 broke drm-legacy-kmod. >>> It seems that Niclas has provided a patch that fixes the building >>> of drm-legacy-kmod. >>> >>> Doing a bisection on /usr/src commits is fairly slow as it >>> takes a day to build world/kernel and the minimum set of ports >>> need to fire up Xorg. r343543 and earlier appear to work fine >>> with drm-legacy-kmod. >> >> So it's not only a build error, it's also a runtime bug that would have >> happened even with drm2 in base? Hmm.. > > It appears that that's the case. The likely candidates > are r343564(+65 for missing header), r343566, and r343567. That last commit added hw.above4g_allow tunable. Does it help if you set this to 0 in /boot/loader.conf? Also, it's worth trying drm-current-kmod if you haven't done so recently. If you did try already what were the problems? From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Wed Feb 20 17:08:31 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA2D414F9791 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 17:08:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zarychtam@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl) Received: from plan-b.pwste.edu.pl (plan-b.pwste.edu.pl [IPv6:2001:678:618::40]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "plan-b.pwste.edu.pl", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5055589299 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 17:08:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zarychtam@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl) Received: from bsdondell.lab.pwste.edu.pl ([IPv6:2001:470:71:d47:a5f0:58c1:236e:c4d5]) (authenticated bits=0) by plan-b.pwste.edu.pl (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id x1KH8PhI041596 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Wed, 20 Feb 2019 18:08:26 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from zarychtam@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=plan-b.pwste.edu.pl; s=plan-b-mailer; t=1550682506; bh=P0EI53GaKxMzpqqkjYiCab6cdahQnaaSLqPOoodj8pA=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=YGcGCuexzeLHWYjWL/IL3g2ks1V+0cenhJ5ygprDYqPC/P/8npQUd0xioedhPm1Lj 5KkUZ8TUUi9ehHsPp+OsudurnKFpUJuJwOlMlqLQ8/tLxxj3hrgZi6nfgyeJRZb3Hk aBAz2MWjsQsl0/lVUQm/rMK++ocqsWRP2AOLnTEdWg7LgAA6WE9jypMf/8RhArQ5bZ WJvTxzBTYE8ggmwd1OP9kSk4qgz9+YWtosszLzDOGV4+d1xZdpR5FMnepTXCwvYro+ mLOb9lpzV72RQeVhIr15JveO0KDIuBEytgGJpbuv3PmjdbLXOs4+6MZNruqCDQyXsh F3pgR/J3mM+tw== X-Authentication-Warning: plan-b.pwste.edu.pl: Host [IPv6:2001:470:71:d47:a5f0:58c1:236e:c4d5] claimed to be bsdondell.lab.pwste.edu.pl Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Pete Wright References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> From: Marek Zarychta Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=zarychtam@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl; keydata= mQENBFfi3cMBCADLecMTFXad4uDXqv3eRuB4qJJ8G9tzzFezeRnnwxOsPdytW5ES2z1ibSrR IsiImx6+PTqrAmXpTInxAi7yiZGdSiONRI4CCxKY9d1YFiNYT/2WyNXCekm9x29YeIU7x0JB Llbz0f/9HC+styBIu2H+PY/X98Clzm110CS+n/b9l1AtiGxTiVFj7/uavYAKxH6LNWnbkuc5 v8EVNc7NkEcl5h7Z9X5NEtzDxTOiBIFQ/kOT7LAtkYUPo1lqLeOM2DtWSXTXQgXl0zJI4iP1 OAu4qQYm2nXwq4b2AH9peknelvnt1mpfgDCGSKnhc26q6ibTfMwydp+tvUtQIQYpA6b9ABEB AAG0N01hcmVrIFphcnljaHRhIChQbGFuLWIpIDx6YXJ5Y2h0YW1AcGxhbi1iLnB3c3RlLmVk dS5wbD6JATcEEwEIACEFAlfi4LkCGwMFCwkIBwIGFQgJCgsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQHZW8 vIFppoJXdgf8D9X3VRFSNaR9lthSx/+uqas17J3FJKBo1xMQsC2a+44vzNvYJSuPGLLJ+LW2 HPVazjP/BWZJbxOYpliY4zxNRU0YCp0BLIVLibc//yax+mE42FND/+NiIZhqJscl6MLPrSwo sIwXec4XYkldkyqW/xBbBYXoIkBqdKB9j5j42Npy1IV/RizOSdmvTWY27ir8e/yGMR1RLr4F 8P5K3OWTdlGy2H2F/3J8bIPBLG6FpaIyLQw4dHSx8V02PYqDxK1cNo2kAOnU8PnZL/AGuMOH iv3MN1VYL8ehcmpBBsrZGebQJxrjY2/5IaTSgp9xHYT70kshuU6Qb97vk1mOjNZxgbkBDQRX 4t3DAQgA10h6RCXuBLMHxq5B8X/ZIlj9sgLoeyfRdDZEc9rT2KUeUJVHDsbvOFf4/7F1ovWY hJbA6GK/LUZeHHTjnbZcH1uDYQeHly4UOLxeEvhGoz4JhS2C7JzN/uRnwbdOAUbJr8rUj/IY a7gk906rktsc/Ldrxrxh7O6WO0JCh2XO/p4pDfEwwB37g4xHprSab28ECYJ9JMbtA8Sy4M55 g3+GQ28FvSlGnx48OoGXU2BZdc1vZKSQmNOlikB+9/hDX8zdYWVfDaX1TLQ8Ib4+xTUmapza mV/bxIsaZRBw+jFjLQHhTbIMfPEU+4mxFDvTdbKPruKPqVf1ydgMnPZWngowdwARAQABiQEf BBgBCAAJBQJX4t3DAhsMAAoJEB2VvLyBaaaC6qkIAJs9sDPqrqW0bYoRfzY6XjDWQ59p9tJi v8aogxacQNCfAu+WkJ8PNVUtC1dlVcG5NnZ80gXzd1rc8ueIvXlvdanUt/jZd8jbb3gaDbK3 wh1yMCGBl/1fOJTyEGYv1CRojv97KK89KP5+r8x1P1iHcSrunlDNqGxTMydNCwBH23QcOM+m u4spKnJ/s0VRBkw3xoKBZfZza6fTQ4gTpAipjyk7ldOGBV+PvkKATdhK2yLwuWXhKbg/GRlD 1r5P0gxzSqfV4My+KJuc2EDcrqp1y0wOpE1m9iZqCcd0fup5f7HDsYlLWshr7NQl28f6+fQb sylq/j672BHXsdeqf/Ip9V65AQ0EV+OTdwEIAMxnGg7OO/ZAnSwiIiABA9lil1Lfa5BWTH3c l1rz4slz7Gw99G9J3bX3FiPA0vU89dgBZ2k0/UVk5cI5EsMAvwJN4bPwRsfBELQqjCKkVZr4 vUeGyvgQ2jnoK1fcEFOnCRdwFy4EJ6Y/fsZCTj4IfQpkM1W7C3KuSGPcjPDA9XCLDjjp8bbA Q9VgQ68MntAnYxMqK0S3CrHp5Pruvb0x4MfFLNwaKtWK+UnJGPT4umj8PMP6XLsFC3g+SGoP aWoYRDI297ZGx4IBWEaJq181oEC5iUQ6WREti9fNQ3TsAB3Q2CjNlkx1geSczIFJSyOHmyJZ RqAocw1sIuPopvhWtR0AEQEAAYkCRAQYAQgADwUCV+OTdwIbAgUJCWYBgAEpCRAdlby8gWmm gsBdIAQZAQgABgUCV+OTdwAKCRB1n+z//VKNLOETCAC3ggwAAQij4hkIxQFapnRuIVb5vq7D AwJ9+Ld5/zYHOj2Tfu+BPSNGzI2edqboz2w1t55UHEYzYDp2axxIfPrZrXsBV4DsjtGwzVV/ jZ9or5qTaYFDEStRkzL4mRpTyYhl/T7GgWpwOJWOih+cU7RWzjSOxiYMi4QSYlkpDUCcZew0 C3HfcxeFqpeL46zgysHC2ptjINXQ+xR2/F6dbed+l7OsvJAfkBqJoQ/48m+8ly1lbViKck7q gWw143ljaKn2qGIjZdb95zcI/CP4L45SXq8NOweACdx2NfUphLrIMbNCqLkMUJcrnruKfbnp C8OMjFJIqlu+PsW593NcZyOugEAH/0cBsDxlSauSVK4kp8ald26pcBI6igNnIMgjaxMiZBjn eoxBiKAOAO93sPnPr9/64CMMwv1T+0vU2lj8SMKOdHVrB9sW/ICGji5skE85xPEAtUkdAQN+ +c2clotujcaj9lBZKJdncKmSxY0SshEa66H+s76u+2Q3jGK6vOrdxakWYCvh2P0/l52Nd/t2 eazLFgwtk5rbo7O0MSC1GNXUsG07vtZ+zxJXFRx7PQ3ZIn0Y4HqwvXUvqgZ9EHiKy8F+ondz 9IS8/Fs81N5ieujHhSWqbaibapnpeDHvT/FWf8iXfJqWq+F7C8lGShSkmsS5AOhB4TNNH5/m ZzECJa1ql64= Message-ID: <0f1d8227-b6f3-1ac7-9da5-2c1bb90f6f48@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 18:08:17 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="cGALCgVZSISssGqSVIWqfC8Ou2c097Gtx" X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 17:08:31 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --cGALCgVZSISssGqSVIWqfC8Ou2c097Gtx Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="2yaCPF0JPVti8d1pU7CgyvOdYx7KmtfEZ"; protected-headers="v1" From: Marek Zarychta To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Pete Wright Message-ID: <0f1d8227-b6f3-1ac7-9da5-2c1bb90f6f48@plan-b.pwste.edu.pl> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> In-Reply-To: <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> --2yaCPF0JPVti8d1pU7CgyvOdYx7KmtfEZ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US W dniu 18.02.2019 o=C2=A018:17, Pete Wright pisze: > > > On 2/18/19 8:50 AM, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < >>> >>> I don't know. I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything new= er >>> than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the >>> old way >>> is broken and doesn't work. >> But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that 5 >> year >> old hardware that are totally happy with the intree DRM2 that is in >> stable/12, >> and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with >> thete a >> "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit).=C2=A0 I know that there= is wip >> to get CI coverage for that, but wip is wip, and we need to start >> changing >> the cart horse driver order we keep doing and get things right.=C2=A0 = Port >> up and working, with CI testing *before* we go remove kmod'ed code fro= m >> base would be a much more appropriate path. >> >> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things >> simply on the "5 year old" basis.=C2=A0 Not everyone, and infact few n= ow >> a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware, >> giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 >> years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low. > I've put a lot of effort helping test and document how to get a usable > desktop environment on a modern laptop.=C2=A0 there were two issues whi= ch > motivated me to do this: > > 1) my observation that many developers at conferences and online were > using macOS as their primary desktop environment.=C2=A0 when comparing = this > to the OpenBSD and Linux community I felt pretty embarrassed, but it > did explain the stagnant nature of our graphics subsystem.=C2=A0 people= > seemed afraid to touch things due the brittle nature of its hardware > support. > > 2) i was in need to an *affordable* machine with a warranty. > fortunately there are many affordable laptops at staples, best-buy and > amazon - but they were all post haswell systems, rendering them > basically useless from a FreeBSD perspective. > > after trying to get traction to update the in-tree drm subsystem i was > lucky enough to sync up with the graphics team which was working on > syncing things up with modern hardware support.=C2=A0 because of that i= 'm > now able to get my small startup pretty much all on board with > FreeBSD.=C2=A0 i use it on my workstations as well as on or server > infrastructure (physical and AWS).=C2=A0 i would consider this a succes= s > for our community as it's opened up the eyes to a whole new generation > of devs to FreeBSD. > > one thing missing from all of these arguments is real data.=C2=A0 how m= any > people are on haswell era hardware?=C2=A0 i can tell from my experience= the > past several years the number of people who have post-haswell gear > seem to be more numerous, or at least more vocal (and frankly easier > to work with while squashing bugs). > > i can also say that personally it would be great to improve support > for systems requiring drm2 - but that gear is hard to come by, so we > are really dependent on helpful collaboration from those who are being > effected. > Thank you for reworking laptop hardware support, it has been improved a lot lately. Nowadays almost everything works out of the box. In my case things not working, for a brand new laptop, had patches in the review and available to download from FreeBSD Phabricator. Laptop support is the key to gain popularity of the OS, especially among the younger generation of users. =46rom the other hand, I am not able to boot 12.0 RELEASE on a couple of ~10 years old servers, though I still can actively follow 11-STABLE there. It's not easy to find the cause of the breakage. I'd like to encourage you Developers to MFC as much as we can handle into the STABLE branch to involve even more users into the software testing process. Breaking ABI is unacceptable, but brave MFC would sometimes help the community avoid/reduce a gap between STABLE and CURRENT which accumulates and appears in the final of the release cycle. With best regards, -- Marek Zarychta --2yaCPF0JPVti8d1pU7CgyvOdYx7KmtfEZ-- --cGALCgVZSISssGqSVIWqfC8Ou2c097Gtx Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEMOqvKm6wKvS1/ZeCdZ/s//1SjSwFAlxtiYcACgkQdZ/s//1S jSxzeQf/cMWIesVvfG0CrXPH9hUxDfAeQ3BYfYIsvp8dMD+VTrIZ3IYlMQ0+xjNI H1QdqvI/DmLJqAsWgvqkNJ7swKYuUWyDqJYm8cBRs5rOJ8Xw0KzCs+azyzkLAjVo Qu0xO1i2KcNyIOrBs/VEsqBrKYcq9i3APUQoUDiZ0qqi+Q1TbVG6pjZPsNEkUsOK 1Xc66P3ckvbyGbAc+9Tz0eUlUb6yKdELeJZAsLrx+fGrUW9JfE1lsxU+cYQpIg8T D4u9TQn+XZwyp9qd9DSv42x+5fatyfIkmxM0TxM+dseSMIw9hdbTXN3h+h7YMR4L bklQ2DbUXpsHVCINGyZ7qk1Ug0vJyA== =lGpQ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --cGALCgVZSISssGqSVIWqfC8Ou2c097Gtx-- From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Wed Feb 20 19:59:56 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCB6614D9A72 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 19:59:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dim@FreeBSD.org) Received: from tensor.andric.com (tensor.andric.com [IPv6:2001:470:7a58:1::1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "tensor.andric.com", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7A6316AA09 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 19:59:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dim@FreeBSD.org) Received: from [IPv6:2001:470:7a58::b86b:a86:1c26:7f1c] (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:7a58:0:b86b:a86:1c26:7f1c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tensor.andric.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5D12B32502; Wed, 20 Feb 2019 20:59:54 +0100 (CET) From: Dimitry Andric Message-Id: Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_86DB0F1B-5079-4B54-80D9-9AF9B999071A"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.2 \(3445.102.3\)) Subject: Re: libunwind: decodeEHHdr Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 20:59:53 +0100 In-Reply-To: <20190219.220122.810151023308691159.ish@amail.plala.or.jp> Cc: FreeBSD Current To: Masachika ISHIZUKA References: <20190219.220122.810151023308691159.ish@amail.plala.or.jp> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.102.3) X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 19:59:57 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_86DB0F1B-5079-4B54-80D9-9AF9B999071A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On 19 Feb 2019, at 14:01, Masachika ISHIZUKA = wrote: >=20 > On 13.0-CURRENT r344253, many applications can not run with the error > message as follows. >=20 > okra.ish.org[101]_% firefox > libunwind: decodeEHHdr = /usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/src/contrib/llvm/projects/libunwind/src/EHHe= aderParser.hpp:62 - Unsupported .eh_frame_hdr version > Redirecting call to abort() to mozalloc_abort >=20 > Segmentation fault (core dumped) > okra.ish.org[102]_% uname -a > FreeBSD okra.ish.org 13.0-CURRENT FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT #15 r344253M: = Tue Feb 19 05:02:52 JST 2019 = ishizuka@okra.ish.org:/usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/obj/usr/altlocal/freeb= sd-current/src/amd64.amd64/sys/GENERIC amd64 >=20 > Is this error only me ? Looks like it, you are the first one reporting it. For me, Firefox works just fine on 13.0-CURRENT. Are you compiling world with any special options, or with a non-default compiler? -Dimitry --Apple-Mail=_86DB0F1B-5079-4B54-80D9-9AF9B999071A Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.2 iF0EARECAB0WIQR6tGLSzjX8bUI5T82wXqMKLiCWowUCXG2xuQAKCRCwXqMKLiCW oyS3AKCpdmFF0wsY+0ZpmIOrC8XkkhacqgCgzucasSN4kqHKxeSSAJRAwsQ5cYo= =zim9 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_86DB0F1B-5079-4B54-80D9-9AF9B999071A-- From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Thu Feb 21 05:12:04 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9951614F368D for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 05:12:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ish@amail.plala.or.jp) Received: from msc11.plala.or.jp (msc11.plala.or.jp [60.36.166.21]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2B9F8CD5B for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 05:12:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ish@amail.plala.or.jp) Received: from localhost ([2400:4050:9320:7a00::8]) by msc11.plala.or.jp with ESMTP id <20190221051155.KJMY30589.msc11.plala.or.jp@localhost> for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 14:11:55 +0900 Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 14:11:49 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20190221.141149.503065714050778060.ish@amail.plala.or.jp> To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: libunwind: decodeEHHdr From: Masachika ISHIZUKA In-Reply-To: References: <20190219.220122.810151023308691159.ish@amail.plala.or.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 6.8 on Emacs 26.1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-VirusScan: Outbound; mvir-ac11; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 14:11:55 +0900 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: C2B9F8CD5B X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.97 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.97)[-0.968,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 05:12:04 -0000 >> On 13.0-CURRENT r344253, many applications can not run with the error >> message as follows. >> >> okra.ish.org[101]_% firefox >> libunwind: decodeEHHdr /usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/src/contrib/llvm/projects/libunwind/src/EHHeaderParser.hpp:62 - Unsupported .eh_frame_hdr version >> Redirecting call to abort() to mozalloc_abort >> >> Segmentation fault (core dumped) >> okra.ish.org[102]_% uname -a >> FreeBSD okra.ish.org 13.0-CURRENT FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT #15 r344253M: Tue Feb 19 05:02:52 JST 2019 ishizuka@okra.ish.org:/usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/obj/usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/src/amd64.amd64/sys/GENERIC amd64 >> >> Is this error only me ? > > Looks like it, you are the first one reporting it. For me, Firefox > works just fine on 13.0-CURRENT. Are you compiling world with any > special options, or with a non-default compiler? Thank you for reply. I was compiling without special options. % cd /usr/src (/usr/src -> nfsserver:/usr/altlocal/freebsd-current/src) % svn up % time sh -c 'make -j4 buildworld && make -j4 buildkernel' (nfs connection was stalled. So I rebooted machine and re-makeworld as follows) % su # reboot % cd /usr/src % time sh -c 'make -j4 buildworld && make -j4 buildkernel' % su # make installkernel # reboot # cd /usr/src # make installworld (Broked userland was installed.) # mergemaster -Ui # make check-old # make BATCH_DELETE_OLD_FILES=yes delete-old # make check-old-libs # make BATCH_DELETE_OLD_FILES=yes delete-old-libs # pkg upgrade # reboot (I can not make buildworld with the libunwind: decodeEHHdr error.) I did rebuild kernel and userland with another machine and reinstall kernel/userland to the broken machines. Now they are working well. P.S. Althougth I was applied patches of https://reviews.llvm.org/D57081, no libunwind: decodeEHHdr messages are displayed. I think D57081 is not cause of this. -- Masachika ISHIZUKA From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Thu Feb 21 16:37:32 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D31614E7252 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 16:37:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olevole@olevole.ru) Received: from mail-lf1-x143.google.com (mail-lf1-x143.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::143]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2D87582671 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 16:37:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olevole@olevole.ru) Received: by mail-lf1-x143.google.com with SMTP id g2so20788494lfh.11 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 08:37:29 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=olevole-ru.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=rk4LUApECKDumstgAGkENvvS9syLMSB0pBh8yf0S8CY=; b=McdmpSlJr3E29sikjsUa3fL0NB9BJwL74vMcSuHfxcHh/UFPHXw/aprOybORJgNrVJ NEEpbVkEh27l06B/1dED8mY1BPKshBNsSFuCHsU71sChW7Cc0NvEw8RNgjcgCQzvfpkK 5V1l0qWORKs5AKFmuMs16anpO+ndNR/WyiKScBUp4qzRmQzNBVLsIE6liOHWAiu3SrG1 aCoYGFtg04CS/kOWdrOQ3bFHmVUzQjORaE/MfC+/Vc50PYgbJqwa1ab8ocCpI0B/BzGU Iza4FogXIXZPTRxa84dzXM6vGYlLdD+uwjzyUYXMeuJXKavunZl+V4hmjD1FdbqqJrLH eyRg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=rk4LUApECKDumstgAGkENvvS9syLMSB0pBh8yf0S8CY=; b=mei4KnJ15ygZg6+Urwwy546dvzrsbYawG5bcPlbxX7RT/q1622o3+vOB3afVGOoNSK Kd+jGlRWH5lBDqvrCugXKZdyXFwtjXQsqMVllcPZ+QCPA2nHPfKdSTMnyht8r7lB8aXo Z7oypktY1QAw7xuUz+Pq5u5wpy1blWVw5aRsPnwnI9kTcvpNWwMcFwYkUQAK8Aga0Wof HO0Q61f44esvIS9X2UUWfmPHfaspmfYN+4dCtvcyio5Mrv2O7fM2jSfONpk0RPjJ/Cf3 xBgpRhfUIRN3nlLEIfr0jFWlcgCx8PpyJLEDe0eKvGVY4p56p9Pzm4wxCJdqmRcq5d43 8cjg== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZ73XP6hXuKbJqqhwAkl3qnkD4QO5rV3sNxUQZ+UXB95MQ4s+k+ SrFB8tj8l/Are9UIi86cnCt2kgZs6y0fYG0Obt/rDnDcnrE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IbS3GCb6HU1Jdy67U8avFiySXGozRVJoCcxGY45DqIcJLx+Oa7nEykjNTMzLM9VWVATFqB19m5Gp8AkDD8hH88= X-Received: by 2002:a19:a211:: with SMTP id l17mr23569260lfe.144.1550767048189; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 08:37:28 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Oleg Ginzburg Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 19:37:17 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: r344398 Import ACPICA 20190215: breaks bhyve To: FreeBSD Current , freebsd-virtualization@freebsd.org, jkim@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 2D87582671 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=olevole-ru.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=McdmpSlJ X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.85 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.97)[-0.969,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[olevole-ru.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.991,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[olevole.ru]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[olevole-ru.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM,ALT2.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM,ALT1.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM,ASPMX3.GOOGLEMAIL.COM,ASPMX2.GOOGLEMAIL.COM]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.1.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.38)[-0.385,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(-0.20)[ip: (3.33), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.26), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 16:37:32 -0000 Hi, most likely r344398[1] commit breaks bhyve with the following errors: Subtable Type : 02 Error 6302 - Flag value is too large ^ (Maximum 1 bit) 58: [0002] Flags (decoded below) : 0005 Error 6302 - Flag value is too large ^ (Maximum 2 bit) 66: [0004] Interrupt : 00000009 Error 6302 - Flag value is too large ^ (Maximum 2 bit) Assertion failed: (error == 0), function main, file /usr/src/usr.sbin/bhyve/bhyverun.c, line 1190. Can anyone else confirm this? Howto reproduce: fetch ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/releases/ISO-IMAGES/10.3/FreeBSD-10.3-RELEASE-amd64-bootonly.iso sh /usr/share/examples/bhyve/vmrun.sh -c 1 -m 1024M -i -I FreeBSD-10.3-RELEASE-amd64-bootonly.iso guestname __ [1] - https://svnweb.freebsd.org/base?view=revision&revision=r344398 From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Thu Feb 21 17:45:01 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3F3314E99E9; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 17:45:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cse.cem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-io1-f46.google.com (mail-io1-f46.google.com [209.85.166.46]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48DB9852BC; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 17:44:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cse.cem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-io1-f46.google.com with SMTP id p17so2573342iol.7; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 09:44:59 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=dJ6/a3DRNCGyibX6h37cgnjGH4CLo4LITPU8zp1HbMc=; b=FaliBfFsbOAdm9Fw8i6m0+m467Tj4aJe+SDq6LYrfW682yc9mZDgkdpZqx4jbBAh9c 2IF1vM7eipo/j6riytZHDwHlmYYDTd4vfrW8/nTZN9VlQ/xodptMSO+5lSKNBmdjnZGX V1AtnXvzcPphSqmpUiTRei/hyieSt001WO6otPo66HXFJVj7wpzL5ftupgp3wefHMTlT 0ggLth6pdTxfftwhqTe3Vgar9iPhdqUBruXXWvQN+lZt5MQCpMfZP8n2b/wTI6ezCLgA clMmv+YfGf83CcI/l4fynZS/amfw1q0lsf1jI5ni2rAUS/LFBxs1UhCHIH0HA0urDl0V GR7w== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAubjDadh+iOMPab9x6SotPmXmHiJXh4JanoJ3+iZ4AUva8ScLesX QcETds/jobeyLTXbYq60T/3gRLuR X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IawPhukg4kVsFRajsKJ+rb+jsnhyhqm19Z4gjEPZDXjmSIWDRHQ3ElJmZ0+Tp2/ccH/+iluYg== X-Received: by 2002:a5d:968a:: with SMTP id m10mr20955885ion.134.1550769356597; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 09:15:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-io1-f45.google.com (mail-io1-f45.google.com. [209.85.166.45]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y26sm9398234iob.16.2019.02.21.09.15.56 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 21 Feb 2019 09:15:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-io1-f45.google.com with SMTP id i5so2351356ioq.8; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 09:15:56 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a02:4084:: with SMTP id n126mr17242787jaa.78.1550769356063; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 09:15:56 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: Reply-To: cem@freebsd.org From: Conrad Meyer Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 09:15:45 -0800 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: r344398 Import ACPICA 20190215: breaks bhyve To: Oleg Ginzburg Cc: FreeBSD Current , "freebsd-virtualization@freebsd.org" , Jung-uk Kim Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48DB9852BC X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of csecem@gmail.com designates 209.85.166.46 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=csecem@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.96 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[cem@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.976,0]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[cem@freebsd.org,csecem@gmail.com]; IP_SCORE(-2.98)[ip: (-9.03), ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-3.80), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[cem@freebsd.org,csecem@gmail.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[46.166.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 17:45:01 -0000 Oops, to the list this time. Hi Oleg, Those look like the ACPI lines bhyve attempts to generate and compile in basl_fwrite_madt(): 272 /* Legacy IRQ0 is connected to pin 2 of the IOAPIC */ 273 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0001]\t\tSubtable Type : 02\n"); 274 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0001]\t\tLength : 0A\n"); 275 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0001]\t\tBus : 00\n"); 276 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0001]\t\tSource : 00\n"); 277 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0004]\t\tInterrupt : 00000002\n"); 278 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0002]\t\tFlags (decoded below) : 0005\n"); ^^^ this line ("maximum 1 bit") 279 EFPRINTF(fp, "\t\t\tPolarity : 1\n"); 280 EFPRINTF(fp, "\t\t\tTrigger Mode : 1\n"); 281 EFPRINTF(fp, "\n"); 282 283 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0001]\t\tSubtable Type : 02\n"); 284 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0001]\t\tLength : 0A\n"); 285 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0001]\t\tBus : 00\n"); 286 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0001]\t\tSource : %02X\n", SCI_INT); 287 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0004]\t\tInterrupt : %08X\n", SCI_INT); ^^^ this line ("maximum 2 bit"; SCI_INT=3D=3D9) 288 EFPRINTF(fp, "[0002]\t\tFlags (decoded below) : 0000\n"); 289 EFPRINTF(fp, "\t\t\tPolarity : 3\n"); 290 EFPRINTF(fp, "\t\t\tTrigger Mode : 3\n"); 291 EFPRINTF(fp, "\n"); Would you mind filing a PR to track this investigation? The error message and constraint on Value being in range of BitLength was added to DtCompileFlag() in compiler/dtfield.c way back in r208625 (ACPICA 20100528) =E2=80=94 it's not new. What must be new is the idea tha= t these fields have a smaller bit width that the numbers bhyve has chosen, or bhyve's choice of numbers. We can eliminate bhyve as a suspect, maybe? acpi.c hasn't changed substantially for years. In fact, there is a seemingly related commit r272838 which converted some fields to hexadecimal in order to comply with length limitations. The first of these two tables was introduced in r257933 by tycho@ / neel@. The second was changed from a bare constant by jhb@ in r259998, but previously held the value 9. It dates to the original 2012 "ACPI support for bhyve" commit by grehan@ in r243327. So yeah, probably something changed recently in ACPICA. Best, Conrad On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 8:38 AM Oleg Ginzburg wrote: > > Hi, > > most likely r344398[1] commit breaks bhyve with the following errors: > > Subtable Type : 02 > Error 6302 - Flag value is too large ^ (Maximum 1 bit) > 58: [0002] Flags (decoded below) : 0005 > Error 6302 - Flag value is too large ^ (Maximum 2 b= it) > 66: [0004] Interrupt : 00000009 > Error 6302 - Flag value is too large ^ (Maximum 2 bit) > Assertion failed: (error =3D=3D 0), function main, file > /usr/src/usr.sbin/bhyve/bhyverun.c, line 1190. > > Can anyone else confirm this? > > Howto reproduce: > > fetch ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/releases/ISO-IMAGES/10.3/FreeBSD-= 10.3-RELEASE-amd64-bootonly.iso > > sh /usr/share/examples/bhyve/vmrun.sh -c 1 -m 1024M -i -I > FreeBSD-10.3-RELEASE-amd64-bootonly.iso guestname > > > __ > [1] - https://svnweb.freebsd.org/base?view=3Drevision&revision=3Dr344398 > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org= " From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Thu Feb 21 19:44:07 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 762D014EE19A for ; 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charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 3C5008A807 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=olevole-ru.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=ifaVwAlu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.89 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[olevole-ru.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.981,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.993,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[olevole.ru]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[olevole-ru.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.1.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.39)[-0.393,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(-0.22)[ip: (3.24), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.26), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 19:44:07 -0000 On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 8:15 PM Conrad Meyer wrote: > Would you mind filing a PR to track this investigation? Done: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=235922 Thanks! From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Thu Feb 21 21:42:05 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C99114F24CC for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 21:42:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lwhsu.freebsd@gmail.com) Received: from mail-yb1-f196.google.com (mail-yb1-f196.google.com [209.85.219.196]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7188D8F566 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 21:42:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lwhsu.freebsd@gmail.com) Received: by mail-yb1-f196.google.com with SMTP id f5so55992ybf.3 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 13:42:04 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=KvC97R//Pp52bp5VYikfvyOqdH0la4Nn7VUISr6fTRw=; b=m5uQeBmU3l6ZxlTa6qI4aJAoTgJmTBugS4w3DaHe4hhoNxaOTDSn4ubsgZh1zDz6Rw gC1AWsdo6N5Iy+AycKbruvvomHFBu6G75ZNhaQ7Rub7gZB7V+wAu0NsVSfhUQMrKzVG8 a/om8Te88hTuAsnJ1NBt1nkXsFxfmSQ+QtDAY7Pg3gVjAM/zq1exWioPZRa9xwfu3CZO NIedOAaq3J+skSjN8aEdiCNIblIGLMSB0pCmV5mPYeiEQB2WuzI/pbqtuj/6CqevUmVR fwtOWifA226KeLuLsW5MPzfm1K/9N86GrmabKOTUmsF56HWayMIYs6bDcJpW2YRVABFh H1gw== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuYBlnYZ/G8XWllStNz887wjXU4/jWBgyBMUnSE+jB72JhyWMvTI xFm3pHAXQwysE1kRv6c80Jiqac/NGxnaoMQEkN4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IZdOm+cGdMbqHgmgW8tc0F1kvu9iQvnEKjhQErveyskv8NTTDgKqAidbtfUCsBUQyDQ8WduWddxguP1/E2oV+U= X-Received: by 2002:a25:6d05:: with SMTP id i5mr479992ybc.489.1550783752539; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 13:15:52 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Li-Wen Hsu Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 05:15:38 +0800 Message-ID: Subject: FreeBSD CI Weekly Report 2019-02-17 To: freebsd-testing@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 7188D8F566 X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of lwhsufreebsd@gmail.com designates 209.85.219.196 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=lwhsufreebsd@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.64 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.46)[-0.458,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[196.219.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(-1.17)[ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-3.79), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[lwhsu@freebsd.org,lwhsufreebsd@gmail.com]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; FORGED_RECIPIENTS(0.00)[freebsd-testing@freebsd.org,freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[lwhsu@freebsd.org,lwhsufreebsd@gmail.com]; TO_DOM_EQ_FROM_DOM(0.00)[] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 22:25:02 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 21:42:05 -0000 (bcc -current and -stable for more audience) FreeBSD CI Weekly Report 2019-02-17 =================================== Here is a summary of the FreeBSD Continuous Integration results for the period from 2019-02-11 to 2019-02-17. During this period, we have: * 2348 builds (93.4% passed, 6.6% failed) were executed on aarch64, amd64, armv6, armv7, i386, mips, mips64, powerpc, powerpc64, powerpcspe, riscv64, sparc64 architectures for head, stable/12, stable/11 branches. * 553 test runs (23.7% passed, 73.6% unstable, 2.7% exception) were executed on amd64, i386, riscv64 architectures for head, stable/12, stable/11 branches. * 12 doc buils (100% passed) If any of the issues found by CI are in your area of interest or expertise please investigate the PRs listed below. Web version of this report is available at https://hackmd.io/s/By8HaYcSV and archive is available at http://hackfoldr.org/freebsd-ci-report/, any help is welcome. ## Fixed Tests * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-head-amd64-test/ * lib.libc.regex.exhaust_test.regcomp_too_big * lib.libregex.exhaust_test.regcomp_too_big These two began failing since r343964 and do not show up after r344128. ## Failing Tests * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-head-amd64-test/ * lib.libc.sys.sendfile_test.hdtr_positive_v4 * lib.libc.sys.sendfile_test.hdtr_positive_v6 See https://bugs.freebsd.org/235200 and https://bugs.freebsd.org/234809 for deails. WIP: https://bugs.freebsd.org/234809 * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-head-amd64-test_zfs/ * There are ~60 failing cases, including flakey ones, see https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-head-amd64-test_zfs/lastCompletedBuild/testReport/ for more details * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-head-i386-test/ * sys.netmap.ctrl-api-test.main * sys.opencrypto.runtests.main * lib.libc.regex.exhaust_test.regcomp_too_big * lib.libregex.exhaust_test.regcomp_too_big * sys.kern.coredump_phnum_test.coredump_phnum WIP: https://reviews.freebsd.org/D18495 * lib.libc.sys.sendfile_test.hdtr_positive_v4 * lib.libc.sys.sendfile_test.hdtr_positive_v6 see https://bugs.freebsd.org/235200 and https://bugs.freebsd.org/234809 for deails. WIP: https://bugs.freebsd.org/234809 * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-stable-12-i386-test/ * sbin.bectl.bectl_test.bectl_mount * sys.netmap.ctrl-api-test.main * sys.opencrypto.runtests.main * lib.libc.regex.exhaust_test.regcomp_too_big * lib.libregex.exhaust_test.regcomp_too_big * sys.kern.coredump_phnum_test.coredump_phnum WIP: https://reviews.freebsd.org/D18495 * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-stable-11-amd64-test/ * usr.bin.procstat.procstat_test.kernel_stacks * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-stable-11-i386-test/ * sys.netmap.ctrl-api-test.main * sys.opencrypto.runtests.main * usr.bin.procstat.procstat_test.kernel_stacks * local.kyua.* (31 cases) * local.lutok.* (3 cases) ## Disabled Tests * lib.libc.sys.mmap_test.mmap_truncate_signal https://bugs.freebsd.org/211924 * sys.fs.tmpfs.mount_test.large https://bugs.freebsd.org/212862 * sys.fs.tmpfs.link_test.kqueue https://bugs.freebsd.org/213662 * sys.kqueue.libkqueue.kqueue_test.main https://bugs.freebsd.org/233586 * usr.bin.procstat.procstat_test.command_line_arguments https://bugs.freebsd.org/233587 * usr.bin.procstat.procstat_test.environment https://bugs.freebsd.org/233588 ## Open Issues ### Cause build fails * [233339: genassym.o build race](https://bugs.freebsd.org/233339) * Patch available: https://people.freebsd.org/~bdrewery/patches/PR233339.diff * [233735: Possible build race: genoffset.o /usr/src/sys/sys/types.h: error: machine/endian.h: No such file or directory](https://bugs.freebsd.org/233735) * [233769: Possible build race: ld: error: unable to find library -lgcc_s](https://bugs.freebsd.org/233769) ### Others [Tickets related to testing@](https://preview.tinyurl.com/y9maauwg) ## Other News * QEMU has onboarded FreeBSD CI: https://cirrus-ci.com/github/qemu/qemu * New clang800-import project jobs added: * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-srcproj-clang800-import-aarch64-build/ * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-srcproj-clang800-import-amd64-build/ * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-srcproj-clang800-import-amd64-test/ * https://ci.freebsd.org/job/FreeBSD-srcproj-clang800-import-i386-build/ * The artifacts are available at https://artifact.ci.freebsd.org/snapshot/clang800-import/ for further testing needs. * Jobs for testing if drm pkgs (graphics/drm-*) can be built fine on latest -current and -stable, are being tested in staging env. From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Thu Feb 21 22:30:32 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5498714F3D8E for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 22:30:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from augustperson25@gmail.com) Received: from mail-yb1-xb2e.google.com (mail-yb1-xb2e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b2e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4682A6A834 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 22:30:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from augustperson25@gmail.com) Received: by mail-yb1-xb2e.google.com with SMTP id j189so88459ybj.9 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 14:30:31 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=ortJiQuaPFn7+pDdp5MM87TcW0aaI7S23GrwAE3cNM4=; b=SYboEfNzc+9m42WRwEtpTdvnLKdDkpFTANsUp+CM1v3/bKbjFPFBKXr5ON9kGmjT4B cw4LR1cjenKVaJPI5CQIhXPhaSKe8txREl+5Myt9aitXmKkt84KyqxVZ3Y0TZBDCY/Ut uoEvnYfW8jkq1i3Oi703jw5r/VTDLYwnj41iDoBuoeFY/mAUvsvYdxricungKDOEXdGm +FLBEdXruFhqGycovn2U7Tx4jVPXCCRnZ1y4CVxyVSl3m+ZnIkWY7vQNsSDcPKZLTc97 jJSIt2OGTK/rp0ltO436U+k+dxMaswxucX8cTy8pkIagFwVFlp3Rzx4Uu4hY3FLtXnii V02A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=ortJiQuaPFn7+pDdp5MM87TcW0aaI7S23GrwAE3cNM4=; b=UHD5nhlqS2t9lCMUSrqBFME7oLC6G7tFX7sJz/zPuV0jh/eyXN7jSteA7pfelm8cxX 1l2yzTezBI1D0sKHTfxR1ZN8/+7D2CDesZYfqv7WMhelY4wCecUrRCG5JO1W0c53IPGl TK2oa3iAiS7Fwx9b4QW5BEYswQ6Ezicrk4quB8zCaOyV0sWlOxTWezG61pIfkve5JPHK qYcuhfMV5/ldbLYlUUfOnOhFvesAAVTeMrX3ShbeIBFFYM5H3TVDTWVBadf8JtcJJxed 7Zzh4E6XZ6dDbtEGwF+LKKRf768Pn3+aWDDClwZjmjgq2/954dSTYKstJz7OvLp9isp9 LHOg== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuZ4479ddkx8Sru+uB6Lxr1lQss1f2VBbhA+hFnzBKCqqNCUhVZL ZaVprF0EfsT/LZKmAN2mEx32xwHKC8e2/xFbfdp35zXX X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYHJZAgu/yXLb2ok+ZrCmtMBsrHfjxIbvLq+AnIJuPcO3wRQfK+R3QVJLvq+b0KD1c8FlXUUfv8IkuIR3OMMG4= X-Received: by 2002:a25:98c9:: with SMTP id m9mr770941ybo.167.1550788230060; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 14:30:30 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: August Johansson Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 23:30:04 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: kernel build failed To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4682A6A834 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=SYboEfNz; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of augustperson25@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::b2e as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=augustperson25@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.76 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[e.2.b.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; IP_SCORE(-2.87)[ip: (-9.67), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.61), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.88)[-0.877,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 22:30:32 -0000 hello, I am new to running FreeBSD current. My kernel build failed with this message: https://pastebin.com/raw/Cpg7nAiX My kernel config: https://pastebin.com/raw/3nnKdKtS also another question, I have options ZFS because I use ZFS. but my ZFS worked before. so is that line not needed? thanks for your help From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Fri Feb 22 03:39:30 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5225014FD792 for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 03:39:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 45BFC7710F for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 03:39:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1M3dPMD025314 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 19:39:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1M3dPgI025313 for freebsd-current@freebsd.org; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 19:39:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 19:39:25 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd Message-ID: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 45BFC7710F X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.61 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.74)[0.743,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.83)[0.829,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.28)[0.284,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.07)[ip: (0.13), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.18), asn: 73(0.09), country: US(-0.07)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 03:39:30 -0000 r343567 merges the PAE vs non-PAE pmap headers for i386 freebsd. After bisection and dealing with the drm-legacy-kmod fallout, I bisected /usr/src to r343567. Building world and a GENERIC kernel and the minimum set of ports to start Xorg on my Dell Latitude D530 laptop, results in a black screen of death and a locked up laptop (no keyboard, mouse, or video). A comparison of /etc/log/Xorg.0.log for r343566 (Xorg loads and functions) and r353467 (Xorg black screen of death) shows that /boot/modules/i915kms.ko loads correctly as the log files are identical. Comparing dmesg for r343566 to r343567 shows the following --- dmesg.343566 2019-02-20 08:13:07.727202000 -0800 +++ dmesg.343567 2019-02-21 19:02:24.469562000 -0800 @@ -3,11 +3,11 @@ Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. FreeBSD is a registered trademark of The FreeBSD Foundation. -FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343566 GENERIC i386 +FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343567 GENERIC i386 FreeBSD clang version 7.0.1 (tags/RELEASE_701/final 349250) (based on LLVM 7.0.1) WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. VT(vga): resolution 640x480 -CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.05-MHz 686-class CPU) +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 Features=0xbfebfbff Features2=0xe3bd @@ -16,7 +16,7 @@ VT-x: (disabled in BIOS) HLT,PAUSE TSC: P-state invariant, performance statistics real memory = 4294967296 (4096 MB) -avail memory = 3639914496 (3471 MB) +avail memory = 4154175488 (3961 MB) Somehow the r343567 kernel found an addition 490 MB of memory, which leads me to believe the after loading i915kms.ko there is some serious memory stomping issues. I willing to do whatever is necessary to fix this issue (shorter of mailing the laptop to someone). Is it possible to revert r343567 and move forward? -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Fri Feb 22 06:04:14 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B61B14DA254 for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 06:04:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9FD2883B6D for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 06:04:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1M64Ah9025825 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 22:04:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1M64ASC025824 for freebsd-current@freebsd.org; Thu, 21 Feb 2019 22:04:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2019 22:04:10 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd Message-ID: <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 9FD2883B6D X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.10 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.73)[0.734,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.32)[0.322,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.29)[0.291,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.07)[ip: (0.12), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.18), asn: 73(0.09), country: US(-0.07)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 06:04:14 -0000 On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 07:39:25PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > r343567 merges the PAE vs non-PAE pmap headers for i386 > freebsd. After bisection and dealing with the drm-legacy-kmod > fallout, I bisected /usr/src to r343567. Building world and > a GENERIC kernel and the minimum set of ports to start Xorg > on my Dell Latitude D530 laptop, results in a black screen > of death and a locked up laptop (no keyboard, mouse, or video). > > A comparison of /etc/log/Xorg.0.log for r343566 (Xorg loads > and functions) and r353467 (Xorg black screen of death) shows > that /boot/modules/i915kms.ko loads correctly as the log > files are identical. > > Comparing dmesg for r343566 to r343567 shows the following > > --- dmesg.343566 2019-02-20 08:13:07.727202000 -0800 > +++ dmesg.343567 2019-02-21 19:02:24.469562000 -0800 > @@ -3,11 +3,11 @@ > Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > FreeBSD is a registered trademark of The FreeBSD Foundation. > -FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343566 GENERIC i386 > +FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343567 GENERIC i386 > FreeBSD clang version 7.0.1 (tags/RELEASE_701/final 349250) (based on LLVM 7.0.1) > WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. > VT(vga): resolution 640x480 > -CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.05-MHz 686-class CPU) > +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) > Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 > Features=0xbfebfbff > Features2=0xe3bd > @@ -16,7 +16,7 @@ > VT-x: (disabled in BIOS) HLT,PAUSE > TSC: P-state invariant, performance statistics > real memory = 4294967296 (4096 MB) > -avail memory = 3639914496 (3471 MB) > +avail memory = 4154175488 (3961 MB) > > Somehow the r343567 kernel found an addition 490 MB of memory, > which leads me to believe the after loading i915kms.ko there > is some serious memory stomping issues. > > I willing to do whatever is necessary to fix this issue (shorter > of mailing the laptop to someone). Is it possible to revert > r343567 and move forward? > More info from sysctl. With the "good" r343566, I see vm.kmem_map_free: 1187033088 vm.kmem_map_size: 27234304 vm.kmem_size_scale: 3 vm.kmem_size_max: 1715470336 vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 vm.kmem_size: 1214267392 hw.physmem: 3714269184 hw.usermem: 3650867200 hw.realmem: 4294963200 With the problematic r343567, I see vm.kmem_map_free: 1683152896 vm.kmem_map_size: 28123136 vm.kmem_size_scale: 1 vm.kmem_size_max: 1711276032 vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 vm.kmem_size: 1711276032 hw.physmem: 4252360704 hw.usermem: 4146999296 hw.realmem: 4294963200 Ideas? -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 03:26:49 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DC0E1504908 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 03:26:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C4DE86F317; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 03:26:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1N3QiMD014068 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Fri, 22 Feb 2019 19:26:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1N3QiEs014067; Fri, 22 Feb 2019 19:26:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 19:26:44 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Cc: kib@freebsd.org, pho@freebsd.org, markj@freebsd.org Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd Message-ID: <20190223032644.GA14058@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: C4DE86F317 X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.39 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.52)[-0.523,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.79)[0.786,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.38)[0.377,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.06)[ip: (0.12), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.18), asn: 73(0.09), country: US(-0.07)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 03:26:49 -0000 On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 10:04:10PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 07:39:25PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > r343567 merges the PAE vs non-PAE pmap headers for i386 > > freebsd. After bisection and dealing with the drm-legacy-kmod > > fallout, I bisected /usr/src to r343567. Building world and > > a GENERIC kernel and the minimum set of ports to start Xorg > > on my Dell Latitude D530 laptop, results in a black screen > > of death and a locked up laptop (no keyboard, mouse, or video). > > > > A comparison of /etc/log/Xorg.0.log for r343566 (Xorg loads > > and functions) and r353467 (Xorg black screen of death) shows > > that /boot/modules/i915kms.ko loads correctly as the log > > files are identical. > > > > Comparing dmesg for r343566 to r343567 shows the following > > > > --- dmesg.343566 2019-02-20 08:13:07.727202000 -0800 > > +++ dmesg.343567 2019-02-21 19:02:24.469562000 -0800 > > @@ -3,11 +3,11 @@ > > Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 > > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > > FreeBSD is a registered trademark of The FreeBSD Foundation. > > -FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343566 GENERIC i386 > > +FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343567 GENERIC i386 > > FreeBSD clang version 7.0.1 (tags/RELEASE_701/final 349250) (based on LLVM 7.0.1) > > WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. > > VT(vga): resolution 640x480 > > -CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.05-MHz 686-class CPU) > > +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) > > Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 > > Features=0xbfebfbff > > Features2=0xe3bd > > @@ -16,7 +16,7 @@ > > VT-x: (disabled in BIOS) HLT,PAUSE > > TSC: P-state invariant, performance statistics > > real memory = 4294967296 (4096 MB) > > -avail memory = 3639914496 (3471 MB) > > +avail memory = 4154175488 (3961 MB) > > > > Somehow the r343567 kernel found an addition 490 MB of memory, > > which leads me to believe the after loading i915kms.ko there > > is some serious memory stomping issues. > > > > I willing to do whatever is necessary to fix this issue (shorter > > of mailing the laptop to someone). Is it possible to revert > > r343567 and move forward? > > > > More info from sysctl. With the "good" r343566, I see > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1187033088 > vm.kmem_map_size: 27234304 > vm.kmem_size_scale: 3 > vm.kmem_size_max: 1715470336 > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > vm.kmem_size: 1214267392 > hw.physmem: 3714269184 > hw.usermem: 3650867200 > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > With the problematic r343567, I see > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1683152896 > vm.kmem_map_size: 28123136 > vm.kmem_size_scale: 1 > vm.kmem_size_max: 1711276032 > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > vm.kmem_size: 1711276032 > hw.physmem: 4252360704 > hw.usermem: 4146999296 > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > Ideas? > Here's the 'diff -uw' between a verbose dmesg boot of r343566 and dmesg boot of r343567. The memory size looks rather puzzling. Can the people responsible for the i386 pmap.h merging take a look? --- dmesg.343566.verbose 2019-02-22 19:08:33.458559000 -0800 +++ dmesg.343567.verbose 2019-02-22 08:55:21.623310000 -0800 @@ -8,25 +8,25 @@ Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. FreeBSD is a registered trademark of The FreeBSD Foundation. -FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343566 GENERIC i386 +FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343567 GENERIC i386 FreeBSD clang version 7.0.1 (tags/RELEASE_701/final 349250) (based on LLVM 7.0.1) WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. VT(vga): resolution 640x480 -Preloaded elf kernel "/boot/kernel/kernel" at 0x2501000. -Preloaded boot_entropy_cache "/boot/entropy" at 0x2509b20. -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/cpuctl.ko" at 0x2509b6c. -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/if_ath.ko" at 0x2509f68. -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_dfs.ko" at 0x250a314. -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_rate.ko" at 0x250a6c0. -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar9300.ko" at 0x250aa70. -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5416.ko" at 0x250ae9c. -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5212.ko" at 0x250b2c8. -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5211.ko" at 0x250b6f4. -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5210.ko" at 0x250baf8. +Preloaded elf kernel "/boot/kernel/kernel" at 0x2528000. +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/cpuctl.ko" at 0x2530b20. +Preloaded boot_entropy_cache "/boot/entropy" at 0x2530f1c. +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/if_ath.ko" at 0x2530f68. +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_dfs.ko" at 0x2531314. +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_rate.ko" at 0x25316c0. +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar9300.ko" at 0x2531a70. +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5416.ko" at 0x2531e9c. +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5212.ko" at 0x25322c8. +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5211.ko" at 0x25326f4. +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5210.ko" at 0x2532af8. Table 'FACP' at 0xdf6c1c9c FACP: Found table at 0xdf6c1c9c -Calibrating TSC clock ... TSC clock: 1995051200 Hz -CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.05-MHz 686-class CPU) +Calibrating TSC clock ... TSC clock: 1995040840 Hz +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 Features=0xbfebfbff Features2=0xe3bd @@ -53,14 +53,15 @@ Physical memory chunk(s): 0x0000000000001000 - 0x000000000009dfff, 643072 bytes (157 pages) 0x0000000000100000 - 0x00000000007fffff, 7340032 bytes (1792 pages) -0x0000000002829000 - 0x00000000db998fff, 3642163200 bytes (889200 pages) -avail memory = 3639914496 (3471 MB) +0x00000000026ff000 - 0x00000000da2bcfff, 3619414016 bytes (883646 pages) +0x0000000100000000 - 0x000000011ffe7fff, 536772608 bytes (131048 pages) +avail memory = 4154175488 (3961 MB) MADT: Found CPU APIC ID 0 ACPI ID 0: enabled SMP: Added CPU 0 (AP) MADT: Found CPU APIC ID 1 ACPI ID 1: enabled SMP: Added CPU 1 (AP) Event timer "LAPIC" quality 100 -LAPIC: ipi_wait() us multiplier 45 (r 4401300 tsc 1995051200) +LAPIC: ipi_wait() us multiplier 45 (r 4401350 tsc 1995040840) ACPI APIC Table: Package ID shift: 1 L2 cache ID shift: 1 @@ -76,7 +77,6 @@ CPU1 (AP): APIC ID: 1 APIC: CPU 0 has ACPI ID 0 APIC: CPU 1 has ACPI ID 1 -Pentium Pro MTRR support enabled bios32: Found BIOS32 Service Directory header at 0x4ffa00 bios32: Entry = 0xffa10 (4ffa10) Rev = 0 Len = 1 pcibios: PCI BIOS entry at 0xf0000+0xab56 @@ -84,6 +84,7 @@ pnpbios: Entry = f0000:e2f4 Rev = 1.0 pnpbios: Event flag at 4b4 Other BIOS signatures found: +Pentium Pro MTRR support enabled random: read 3840 bytes from preloaded cache random: unblocking device. arc4random: read 32 bytes from preloaded cache @@ -117,7 +118,7 @@ lapic1: LINT1 trigger: edge lapic1: LINT1 polarity: high ioapic0 irqs 0-23 on motherboard -lapic: Divisor 2, Frequency 99752593 Hz +lapic: Divisor 2, Frequency 99752070 Hz cpu0 BSP: ID: 0x00000000 VER: 0x00050014 LDR: 0x00000000 DFR: 0xffffffff lint0: 0x00010700 lint1: 0x00000400 TPR: 0x00000000 SVR: 0x000001ff @@ -129,7 +130,7 @@ timer: 0x000100ef therm: 0x00010000 err: 0x000000f0 pmc: 0x00010400 TSC timecounter disables C2 and C3. SMP: passed TSC synchronization test -Timecounter "TSC" frequency 1995051200 Hz quality 1000 +Timecounter "TSC" frequency 1995040840 Hz quality 1000 random: entropy device external interface wlan: <802.11 Link Layer> snd_unit_init() u=0x00ff8000 [512] d=0x00007c00 [32] c=0x000003ff [1024] @@ -138,7 +139,7 @@ [ath_hal] loaded nfslock: pseudo-device crypto: -module_register_init: MOD_LOAD (vesa, 0x1669cc0, 0) error 19 +module_register_init: MOD_LOAD (vesa, 0x166cb90, 0) error 19 io: kbd: new array size 4 kbd1 at kbdmux0 @@ -152,9 +153,9 @@ [ar5211] loaded [ar5210] loaded [ath] loaded -hpt27xx: RocketRAID 27xx controller driver v1.2.8 hptnr: R750/DC7280 controller driver v1.1.5 hptrr: RocketRAID 17xx/2xxx SATA controller driver v1.2 +hpt27xx: RocketRAID 27xx controller driver v1.2.8 nexus0 vtvga0: on motherboard cryptosoft0: on motherboard @@ -204,8 +205,8 @@ PCIe: Memory Mapped configuration base @ 0xf8000000 ioapic0: routing intpin 9 (ISA IRQ 9) to lapic 0 vector 48 ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: -ACPI: SSDT 0x0000000009FFEA00 000043 (v01 LMPWR DELLLOM 00001001 INTL 20050624) -acpi0: wakeup code va 0xa1d1000 pa 0x1000 +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A404A80 000043 (v01 LMPWR DELLLOM 00001001 INTL 20050624) +acpi0: wakeup code va 0x1a452000 pa 0x1000 Table 'FACP' at 0xdf6c1c9c FACP: Found table at 0xdf6c1c9c Table 'FACP' at 0xdf6c1c9c @@ -234,15 +235,15 @@ cpu0: Processor \134_PR_.CPU0 (ACPI ID 0) -> APIC ID 0 cpu0: on acpi0 ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: -ACPI: SSDT 0x000000000A21C000 000286 (v01 PmRef Cpu0Ist 00003000 INTL 20050624) +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A422C00 000286 (v01 PmRef Cpu0Ist 00003000 INTL 20050624) ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: -ACPI: SSDT 0x000000000A22D800 0004B6 (v01 PmRef Cpu0Cst 00003001 INTL 20050624) +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A44B800 0004B6 (v01 PmRef Cpu0Cst 00003001 INTL 20050624) cpu1: Processor \134_PR_.CPU1 (ACPI ID 1) -> APIC ID 1 cpu1: on acpi0 ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: -ACPI: SSDT 0x000000000A235100 0000C4 (v01 PmRef Cpu1Ist 00003000 INTL 20050624) +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A428D00 0000C4 (v01 PmRef Cpu1Ist 00003000 INTL 20050624) ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: -ACPI: SSDT 0x000000000A235000 000085 (v01 PmRef Cpu1Cst 00003000 INTL 20050624) +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A428C00 000085 (v01 PmRef Cpu1Cst 00003000 INTL 20050624) Table 'FACP' at 0xdf6c1c9c FACP: Found table at 0xdf6c1c9c atrtc0: port 0x70-0x71,0x72-0x77 irq 8 on acpi0 @@ -526,7 +527,7 @@ vgapci0: port 0xeff8-0xefff mem 0xfea00000-0xfeafffff,0xe0000000-0xefffffff irq 16 at device 2.0 on pci0 agp0: on vgapci0 pcib0: allocated type 3 (0xf0000000-0xf0000fff) for rid 64 of agp0 -agp0: Allocated flush page phys 0xf0000000 virt 0x18fba000 +agp0: Allocated flush page phys 0xf0000000 virt 0xd522000 agp0: aperture size is 256M, detected 7676k stolen memory agp0: AGP_I965_PGTBL_CTL2: 00000000 agp0: AGP_I855_GCC1: 0x30 @@ -933,9 +934,9 @@ IPsec: Initialized Security Association Processing. tcp_init: net.inet.tcp.tcbhashsize auto tuned to 32768 AcpiOsExecute: enqueue 6 pending tasks -hpt27xx: no controller detected. hptnr: no controller detected. hptrr: no controller detected. +hpt27xx: no controller detected. hdacc0: at cad 0 on hdac0 hdaa0: at nid 1 on hdacc0 hdaa0: Subsystem ID: 0x10280200 @@ -1057,27 +1058,27 @@ pcm0: Automatically set rec source to: monitor pcm0: Recording channel set is: Front Left, Front Right, pcm0: Recording channel matrix is: 2.0 (unknown) -ugen1.1: at usbus1 +ugen5.1: at usbus5 ugen6.1: at usbus6 -uhub0: on usbus1 +uhub0: on usbus5 uhub1: on usbus6 -ugen2.1: at usbus2 -ugen5.1: at usbus5 -uhub2: on usbus2 -ugen4.1: at usbus4 ugen0.1: at usbus0 -uhub3: on usbus4 +ugen4.1: at usbus4 +uhub2: on usbus0 ugen3.1: at usbus3 +ugen1.1: at usbus1 +uhub3: on usbus3 +uhub5: on usbus1 +ugen2.1: at usbus2 ata0: reset tp1 mask=03 ostat0=50 ostat1=01 -uhub4: on usbus3 +uhub6: on usbus2 acpi_acad0: acline initialization start acpi_acad0: On Line acpi_acad0: acline initialization done, tried 1 times battery0: battery initialization start -battery1: battery initialization start battery0: battery initialization done, tried 1 times -uhub5: on usbus5 -uhub6: on usbus0 +battery1: battery initialization start +uhub4: on usbus4 ata0: stat0=0x00 err=0x01 lsb=0x14 msb=0xeb ata0: stat1=0x01 err=0x04 lsb=0x00 msb=0x00 ata0: reset tp2 stat0=00 stat1=01 devices=0x10000 @@ -1092,10 +1093,6 @@ ses0 at ahciem0 bus 0 scbus3 target 0 lun 0 ses0: SEMB S-E-S 2.00 device ses0: SEMB SES Device -cd0 at ata0 bus 0 scbus0 target 0 lun 0 -cd0: Removable CD-ROM SCSI device -cd0: 33.300MB/s transfers (UDMA2, ATAPI 12bytes, PIO 65534bytes) -cd0: 680MB (348277 2048 byte sectors) ada0 at ahcich0 bus 0 scbus1 target 0 lun 0 ada0: ACS-4 ATA SATA 3.x device ada0: Serial Number 1B0607771A0800257271 @@ -1104,11 +1101,15 @@ ada0: 114473MB (234441648 512 byte sectors) ses0: Generation Code 0x0 has 1 SubEnclosures pass0 at ata0 bus 0 scbus0 target 0 lun 0 -ses0: pass0: SubEnclosure ID 0, 1 Types With this ID, Descriptor Length 36, offset 8 - Removable CD-ROM SCSI device -ses0: pass0: 33.300MB/s transfersWWN: 0 -ses0: Type Desc[0]: Type 0x17, MaxElt 3, In Subenc 0, Text Length 0: +ses0: SubEnclosure ID 0, 1 Types With this ID, Descriptor Length 36, offset 8 +pass0: ses0: Removable CD-ROM SCSI device +WWN: 0 +ses0: pass0: 33.300MB/s transfers Type Desc[0]: Type 0x17, MaxElt 3, In Subenc 0, Text Length 0: (UDMA2, ATAPI 12bytes, PIO 65534bytes) +cd0 at ata0 bus 0 scbus0 target 0 lun 0 +cd0: Removable CD-ROM SCSI device +cd0: 33.300MB/s transfers (UDMA2, ATAPI 12bytes, PIO 65534bytes) +cd0: 680MB (348277 2048 byte sectors) pass1 at ahcich0 bus 0 scbus1 target 0 lun 0 pass1: ACS-4 ATA SATA 3.x device pass1: Serial Number 1B0607771A0800257271 @@ -1119,15 +1120,15 @@ Trying to mount root from ufs:/dev/ada0s1a [rw]... WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. uhub0: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered +uhub2: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered +uhub5: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered uhub3: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered uhub4: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered -uhub5: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered -uhub6: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered -uhub2: 4 ports with 4 removable, self powered +uhub6: 4 ports with 4 removable, self powered +uhub1: 6 ports with 6 removable, self powered GEOM: new disk ada0 atrtc0: providing initial system time start_init: trying /sbin/init -uhub1: 6 ports with 6 removable, self powered ugen6.2: at usbus6 umass0 on uhub1 umass0: on usbus6 @@ -1146,7 +1147,7 @@ da0: quirks=0x2 da0: Delete methods: ugen4.2: at usbus4 -ukbd0 on uhub3 +ukbd0 on uhub4 ukbd0: on usbus4 kbd2 at ukbd0 kbd2: ukbd0, generic (0), config:0x0, flags:0x3d0000 @@ -1154,10 +1155,10 @@ wlan0: bpf attached wlan0: Ethernet address: 00:1c:bf:90:ab:44 lo0: link state changed to UP -firmware: 'wpifw' version 153229: 150100 bytes loaded at 0x2f809000 +firmware: 'wpifw' version 153229: 150100 bytes loaded at 0x34009000 wlan0: link state changed to UP -ums0 on uhub3 +ums0 on uhub4 ums0: on usbus4 ums0: 16 buttons and [XYZT] coordinates ID=2 -uhid0 on uhub3 +uhid0 on uhub4 uhid0: on usbus4 -- Steve 20170425 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWUpyCsUKR4 20161221 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbCHE-hONow From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 09:19:42 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39B84150DD4E for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 09:19:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from kib.kiev.ua (kib.kiev.ua [IPv6:2001:470:d5e7:1::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 37DAB821C1; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 09:19:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from tom.home (kib@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by kib.kiev.ua (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1N9JWb0005338 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 23 Feb 2019 11:19:35 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 kib.kiev.ua x1N9JWb0005338 Received: (from kostik@localhost) by tom.home (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1N9JVCE005337; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 11:19:31 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) X-Authentication-Warning: tom.home: kostik set sender to kostikbel@gmail.com using -f Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 11:19:31 +0200 From: Konstantin Belousov To: Steve Kargl Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, pho@freebsd.org, markj@freebsd.org Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd Message-ID: <20190223091931.GE2420@kib.kiev.ua> References: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190223032644.GA14058@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20190223032644.GA14058@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED,FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD,FREEMAIL_FROM, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on tom.home X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 09:19:42 -0000 On Fri, Feb 22, 2019 at 07:26:44PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 10:04:10PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 07:39:25PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > r343567 merges the PAE vs non-PAE pmap headers for i386 > > > freebsd. After bisection and dealing with the drm-legacy-kmod > > > fallout, I bisected /usr/src to r343567. Building world and > > > a GENERIC kernel and the minimum set of ports to start Xorg > > > on my Dell Latitude D530 laptop, results in a black screen > > > of death and a locked up laptop (no keyboard, mouse, or video). > > > > > > A comparison of /etc/log/Xorg.0.log for r343566 (Xorg loads > > > and functions) and r353467 (Xorg black screen of death) shows > > > that /boot/modules/i915kms.ko loads correctly as the log > > > files are identical. > > > > > > Comparing dmesg for r343566 to r343567 shows the following > > > > > > --- dmesg.343566 2019-02-20 08:13:07.727202000 -0800 > > > +++ dmesg.343567 2019-02-21 19:02:24.469562000 -0800 > > > @@ -3,11 +3,11 @@ > > > Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 > > > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > > > FreeBSD is a registered trademark of The FreeBSD Foundation. > > > -FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343566 GENERIC i386 > > > +FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343567 GENERIC i386 > > > FreeBSD clang version 7.0.1 (tags/RELEASE_701/final 349250) (based on LLVM 7.0.1) > > > WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. > > > VT(vga): resolution 640x480 > > > -CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.05-MHz 686-class CPU) > > > +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) > > > Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 > > > Features=0xbfebfbff > > > Features2=0xe3bd > > > @@ -16,7 +16,7 @@ > > > VT-x: (disabled in BIOS) HLT,PAUSE > > > TSC: P-state invariant, performance statistics > > > real memory = 4294967296 (4096 MB) > > > -avail memory = 3639914496 (3471 MB) > > > +avail memory = 4154175488 (3961 MB) > > > > > > Somehow the r343567 kernel found an addition 490 MB of memory, > > > which leads me to believe the after loading i915kms.ko there > > > is some serious memory stomping issues. > > > > > > I willing to do whatever is necessary to fix this issue (shorter > > > of mailing the laptop to someone). Is it possible to revert > > > r343567 and move forward? > > > > > > > More info from sysctl. With the "good" r343566, I see > > > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1187033088 > > vm.kmem_map_size: 27234304 > > vm.kmem_size_scale: 3 > > vm.kmem_size_max: 1715470336 > > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > > vm.kmem_size: 1214267392 > > hw.physmem: 3714269184 > > hw.usermem: 3650867200 > > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > > > With the problematic r343567, I see > > > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1683152896 > > vm.kmem_map_size: 28123136 > > vm.kmem_size_scale: 1 > > vm.kmem_size_max: 1711276032 > > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > > vm.kmem_size: 1711276032 > > hw.physmem: 4252360704 > > hw.usermem: 4146999296 > > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > > > Ideas? > > > > Here's the 'diff -uw' between a verbose dmesg boot of r343566 > and dmesg boot of r343567. The memory size looks rather puzzling. > Can the people responsible for the i386 pmap.h merging take a > look? What is puzzling ? When kernel boots in PAE mode, it can (and will) get a use for physical memory mapped above 4G. I highlighted the SMAP entry which represents such memory, below. kmem_scale was changed in the PAE commit, see the commit message for explanation. > > --- dmesg.343566.verbose 2019-02-22 19:08:33.458559000 -0800 > +++ dmesg.343567.verbose 2019-02-22 08:55:21.623310000 -0800 > @@ -8,25 +8,25 @@ > Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > FreeBSD is a registered trademark of The FreeBSD Foundation. > -FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343566 GENERIC i386 > +FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343567 GENERIC i386 > FreeBSD clang version 7.0.1 (tags/RELEASE_701/final 349250) (based on LLVM 7.0.1) > WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. > VT(vga): resolution 640x480 > -Preloaded elf kernel "/boot/kernel/kernel" at 0x2501000. > -Preloaded boot_entropy_cache "/boot/entropy" at 0x2509b20. > -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/cpuctl.ko" at 0x2509b6c. > -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/if_ath.ko" at 0x2509f68. > -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_dfs.ko" at 0x250a314. > -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_rate.ko" at 0x250a6c0. > -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar9300.ko" at 0x250aa70. > -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5416.ko" at 0x250ae9c. > -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5212.ko" at 0x250b2c8. > -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5211.ko" at 0x250b6f4. > -Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5210.ko" at 0x250baf8. > +Preloaded elf kernel "/boot/kernel/kernel" at 0x2528000. > +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/cpuctl.ko" at 0x2530b20. > +Preloaded boot_entropy_cache "/boot/entropy" at 0x2530f1c. > +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/if_ath.ko" at 0x2530f68. > +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_dfs.ko" at 0x2531314. > +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_rate.ko" at 0x25316c0. > +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar9300.ko" at 0x2531a70. > +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5416.ko" at 0x2531e9c. > +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5212.ko" at 0x25322c8. > +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5211.ko" at 0x25326f4. > +Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/ath_hal_ar5210.ko" at 0x2532af8. > Table 'FACP' at 0xdf6c1c9c > FACP: Found table at 0xdf6c1c9c > -Calibrating TSC clock ... TSC clock: 1995051200 Hz > -CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.05-MHz 686-class CPU) > +Calibrating TSC clock ... TSC clock: 1995040840 Hz > +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) > Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 > Features=0xbfebfbff > Features2=0xe3bd > @@ -53,14 +53,15 @@ > Physical memory chunk(s): > 0x0000000000001000 - 0x000000000009dfff, 643072 bytes (157 pages) > 0x0000000000100000 - 0x00000000007fffff, 7340032 bytes (1792 pages) > -0x0000000002829000 - 0x00000000db998fff, 3642163200 bytes (889200 pages) > -avail memory = 3639914496 (3471 MB) > +0x00000000026ff000 - 0x00000000da2bcfff, 3619414016 bytes (883646 pages) This change is most likely due to some early data shuffled around because initial VM structures sizes were different due to larger amount of total memory to describe. We allocate memory early by reducing the size of SMAP entries. > +0x0000000100000000 - 0x000000011ffe7fff, 536772608 bytes (131048 pages) This is your memory above 4G, now found and used. > +avail memory = 4154175488 (3961 MB) > MADT: Found CPU APIC ID 0 ACPI ID 0: enabled > SMP: Added CPU 0 (AP) > MADT: Found CPU APIC ID 1 ACPI ID 1: enabled > SMP: Added CPU 1 (AP) > Event timer "LAPIC" quality 100 > -LAPIC: ipi_wait() us multiplier 45 (r 4401300 tsc 1995051200) > +LAPIC: ipi_wait() us multiplier 45 (r 4401350 tsc 1995040840) > ACPI APIC Table: > Package ID shift: 1 > L2 cache ID shift: 1 > @@ -76,7 +77,6 @@ > CPU1 (AP): APIC ID: 1 > APIC: CPU 0 has ACPI ID 0 > APIC: CPU 1 has ACPI ID 1 > -Pentium Pro MTRR support enabled > bios32: Found BIOS32 Service Directory header at 0x4ffa00 > bios32: Entry = 0xffa10 (4ffa10) Rev = 0 Len = 1 > pcibios: PCI BIOS entry at 0xf0000+0xab56 > @@ -84,6 +84,7 @@ > pnpbios: Entry = f0000:e2f4 Rev = 1.0 > pnpbios: Event flag at 4b4 > Other BIOS signatures found: > +Pentium Pro MTRR support enabled > random: read 3840 bytes from preloaded cache > random: unblocking device. > arc4random: read 32 bytes from preloaded cache > @@ -117,7 +118,7 @@ > lapic1: LINT1 trigger: edge > lapic1: LINT1 polarity: high > ioapic0 irqs 0-23 on motherboard > -lapic: Divisor 2, Frequency 99752593 Hz > +lapic: Divisor 2, Frequency 99752070 Hz > cpu0 BSP: > ID: 0x00000000 VER: 0x00050014 LDR: 0x00000000 DFR: 0xffffffff > lint0: 0x00010700 lint1: 0x00000400 TPR: 0x00000000 SVR: 0x000001ff > @@ -129,7 +130,7 @@ > timer: 0x000100ef therm: 0x00010000 err: 0x000000f0 pmc: 0x00010400 > TSC timecounter disables C2 and C3. > SMP: passed TSC synchronization test > -Timecounter "TSC" frequency 1995051200 Hz quality 1000 > +Timecounter "TSC" frequency 1995040840 Hz quality 1000 > random: entropy device external interface > wlan: <802.11 Link Layer> > snd_unit_init() u=0x00ff8000 [512] d=0x00007c00 [32] c=0x000003ff [1024] > @@ -138,7 +139,7 @@ > [ath_hal] loaded > nfslock: pseudo-device > crypto: > -module_register_init: MOD_LOAD (vesa, 0x1669cc0, 0) error 19 > +module_register_init: MOD_LOAD (vesa, 0x166cb90, 0) error 19 > io: > kbd: new array size 4 > kbd1 at kbdmux0 > @@ -152,9 +153,9 @@ > [ar5211] loaded > [ar5210] loaded > [ath] loaded > -hpt27xx: RocketRAID 27xx controller driver v1.2.8 > hptnr: R750/DC7280 controller driver v1.1.5 > hptrr: RocketRAID 17xx/2xxx SATA controller driver v1.2 > +hpt27xx: RocketRAID 27xx controller driver v1.2.8 > nexus0 > vtvga0: on motherboard > cryptosoft0: on motherboard > @@ -204,8 +205,8 @@ > PCIe: Memory Mapped configuration base @ 0xf8000000 > ioapic0: routing intpin 9 (ISA IRQ 9) to lapic 0 vector 48 > ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: > -ACPI: SSDT 0x0000000009FFEA00 000043 (v01 LMPWR DELLLOM 00001001 INTL 20050624) > -acpi0: wakeup code va 0xa1d1000 pa 0x1000 > +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A404A80 000043 (v01 LMPWR DELLLOM 00001001 INTL 20050624) > +acpi0: wakeup code va 0x1a452000 pa 0x1000 > Table 'FACP' at 0xdf6c1c9c > FACP: Found table at 0xdf6c1c9c > Table 'FACP' at 0xdf6c1c9c > @@ -234,15 +235,15 @@ > cpu0: Processor \134_PR_.CPU0 (ACPI ID 0) -> APIC ID 0 > cpu0: on acpi0 > ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: > -ACPI: SSDT 0x000000000A21C000 000286 (v01 PmRef Cpu0Ist 00003000 INTL 20050624) > +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A422C00 000286 (v01 PmRef Cpu0Ist 00003000 INTL 20050624) > ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: > -ACPI: SSDT 0x000000000A22D800 0004B6 (v01 PmRef Cpu0Cst 00003001 INTL 20050624) > +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A44B800 0004B6 (v01 PmRef Cpu0Cst 00003001 INTL 20050624) > cpu1: Processor \134_PR_.CPU1 (ACPI ID 1) -> APIC ID 1 > cpu1: on acpi0 > ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: > -ACPI: SSDT 0x000000000A235100 0000C4 (v01 PmRef Cpu1Ist 00003000 INTL 20050624) > +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A428D00 0000C4 (v01 PmRef Cpu1Ist 00003000 INTL 20050624) > ACPI: Dynamic OEM Table Load: > -ACPI: SSDT 0x000000000A235000 000085 (v01 PmRef Cpu1Cst 00003000 INTL 20050624) > +ACPI: SSDT 0x000000001A428C00 000085 (v01 PmRef Cpu1Cst 00003000 INTL 20050624) > Table 'FACP' at 0xdf6c1c9c > FACP: Found table at 0xdf6c1c9c > atrtc0: port 0x70-0x71,0x72-0x77 irq 8 on acpi0 > @@ -526,7 +527,7 @@ > vgapci0: port 0xeff8-0xefff mem 0xfea00000-0xfeafffff,0xe0000000-0xefffffff irq 16 at device 2.0 on pci0 > agp0: on vgapci0 > pcib0: allocated type 3 (0xf0000000-0xf0000fff) for rid 64 of agp0 > -agp0: Allocated flush page phys 0xf0000000 virt 0x18fba000 > +agp0: Allocated flush page phys 0xf0000000 virt 0xd522000 > agp0: aperture size is 256M, detected 7676k stolen memory > agp0: AGP_I965_PGTBL_CTL2: 00000000 > agp0: AGP_I855_GCC1: 0x30 > @@ -933,9 +934,9 @@ > IPsec: Initialized Security Association Processing. > tcp_init: net.inet.tcp.tcbhashsize auto tuned to 32768 > AcpiOsExecute: enqueue 6 pending tasks > -hpt27xx: no controller detected. > hptnr: no controller detected. > hptrr: no controller detected. > +hpt27xx: no controller detected. > hdacc0: at cad 0 on hdac0 > hdaa0: at nid 1 on hdacc0 > hdaa0: Subsystem ID: 0x10280200 > @@ -1057,27 +1058,27 @@ > pcm0: Automatically set rec source to: monitor > pcm0: Recording channel set is: Front Left, Front Right, > pcm0: Recording channel matrix is: 2.0 (unknown) > -ugen1.1: at usbus1 > +ugen5.1: at usbus5 > ugen6.1: at usbus6 > -uhub0: on usbus1 > +uhub0: on usbus5 > uhub1: on usbus6 > -ugen2.1: at usbus2 > -ugen5.1: at usbus5 > -uhub2: on usbus2 > -ugen4.1: at usbus4 > ugen0.1: at usbus0 > -uhub3: on usbus4 > +ugen4.1: at usbus4 > +uhub2: on usbus0 > ugen3.1: at usbus3 > +ugen1.1: at usbus1 > +uhub3: on usbus3 > +uhub5: on usbus1 > +ugen2.1: at usbus2 > ata0: reset tp1 mask=03 ostat0=50 ostat1=01 > -uhub4: on usbus3 > +uhub6: on usbus2 > acpi_acad0: acline initialization start > acpi_acad0: On Line > acpi_acad0: acline initialization done, tried 1 times > battery0: battery initialization start > -battery1: battery initialization start > battery0: battery initialization done, tried 1 times > -uhub5: on usbus5 > -uhub6: on usbus0 > +battery1: battery initialization start > +uhub4: on usbus4 > ata0: stat0=0x00 err=0x01 lsb=0x14 msb=0xeb > ata0: stat1=0x01 err=0x04 lsb=0x00 msb=0x00 > ata0: reset tp2 stat0=00 stat1=01 devices=0x10000 > @@ -1092,10 +1093,6 @@ > ses0 at ahciem0 bus 0 scbus3 target 0 lun 0 > ses0: SEMB S-E-S 2.00 device > ses0: SEMB SES Device > -cd0 at ata0 bus 0 scbus0 target 0 lun 0 > -cd0: Removable CD-ROM SCSI device > -cd0: 33.300MB/s transfers (UDMA2, ATAPI 12bytes, PIO 65534bytes) > -cd0: 680MB (348277 2048 byte sectors) > ada0 at ahcich0 bus 0 scbus1 target 0 lun 0 > ada0: ACS-4 ATA SATA 3.x device > ada0: Serial Number 1B0607771A0800257271 > @@ -1104,11 +1101,15 @@ > ada0: 114473MB (234441648 512 byte sectors) > ses0: Generation Code 0x0 has 1 SubEnclosures > pass0 at ata0 bus 0 scbus0 target 0 lun 0 > -ses0: pass0: SubEnclosure ID 0, 1 Types With this ID, Descriptor Length 36, offset 8 > - Removable CD-ROM SCSI device > -ses0: pass0: 33.300MB/s transfersWWN: 0 > -ses0: Type Desc[0]: Type 0x17, MaxElt 3, In Subenc 0, Text Length 0: > +ses0: SubEnclosure ID 0, 1 Types With this ID, Descriptor Length 36, offset 8 > +pass0: ses0: Removable CD-ROM SCSI device > +WWN: 0 > +ses0: pass0: 33.300MB/s transfers Type Desc[0]: Type 0x17, MaxElt 3, In Subenc 0, Text Length 0: > (UDMA2, ATAPI 12bytes, PIO 65534bytes) > +cd0 at ata0 bus 0 scbus0 target 0 lun 0 > +cd0: Removable CD-ROM SCSI device > +cd0: 33.300MB/s transfers (UDMA2, ATAPI 12bytes, PIO 65534bytes) > +cd0: 680MB (348277 2048 byte sectors) > pass1 at ahcich0 bus 0 scbus1 target 0 lun 0 > pass1: ACS-4 ATA SATA 3.x device > pass1: Serial Number 1B0607771A0800257271 > @@ -1119,15 +1120,15 @@ > Trying to mount root from ufs:/dev/ada0s1a [rw]... > WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. > uhub0: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered > +uhub2: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered > +uhub5: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered > uhub3: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered > uhub4: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered > -uhub5: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered > -uhub6: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered > -uhub2: 4 ports with 4 removable, self powered > +uhub6: 4 ports with 4 removable, self powered > +uhub1: 6 ports with 6 removable, self powered > GEOM: new disk ada0 > atrtc0: providing initial system time > start_init: trying /sbin/init > -uhub1: 6 ports with 6 removable, self powered > ugen6.2: at usbus6 > umass0 on uhub1 > umass0: on usbus6 > @@ -1146,7 +1147,7 @@ > da0: quirks=0x2 > da0: Delete methods: > ugen4.2: at usbus4 > -ukbd0 on uhub3 > +ukbd0 on uhub4 > ukbd0: on usbus4 > kbd2 at ukbd0 > kbd2: ukbd0, generic (0), config:0x0, flags:0x3d0000 > @@ -1154,10 +1155,10 @@ > wlan0: bpf attached > wlan0: Ethernet address: 00:1c:bf:90:ab:44 > lo0: link state changed to UP > -firmware: 'wpifw' version 153229: 150100 bytes loaded at 0x2f809000 > +firmware: 'wpifw' version 153229: 150100 bytes loaded at 0x34009000 > wlan0: link state changed to UP > -ums0 on uhub3 > +ums0 on uhub4 > ums0: on usbus4 > ums0: 16 buttons and [XYZT] coordinates ID=2 > -uhid0 on uhub3 > +uhid0 on uhub4 > uhid0: on usbus4 > > > -- > Steve > 20170425 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWUpyCsUKR4 > 20161221 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IbCHE-hONow From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 09:20:22 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51038150DD8F for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 09:20:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jakub_lach@mailplus.pl) Received: from n6.nabble.com (n6.nabble.com [162.255.23.37]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB68C821F8 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 09:20:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jakub_lach@mailplus.pl) Received: from n6.nabble.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by n6.nabble.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EB12C80A28F for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 02:20:14 -0700 (MST) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 02:20:14 -0700 (MST) From: Jakub Lach To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Message-ID: <1550913614539-0.post@n6.nabble.com> In-Reply-To: <201901071626.x07GPtW6049111@fire.js.berklix.net> References: <3BB1A8CA-272D-4B48-81A2-CBAF7EE23507@gmail.com> <20181227140706.748bf173@ernst.home> <201901060714.x067DqZP016183@fire.js.berklix.net> <20190106130206.56332774@ernst.home> <201901062231.x06MV3OP028712@fire.js.berklix.net> <201901071626.x07GPtW6049111@fire.js.berklix.net> Subject: Re: ld-elf.so.1: /usr/local/lib/libglib-2.0.so.0: Undefined symbol "environ" (RPI/arm64) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: CB68C821F8 X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=fail (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jakub_lach@mailplus.pl does not designate 162.255.23.37 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jakub_lach@mailplus.pl X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.71 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_SPF_FAIL(1.00)[-all]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.89)[0.892,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.31)[0.306,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[mailplus.pl]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mx.tlen.pl]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.40)[0.398,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[37.23.255.162.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; IP_SCORE(0.13)[ip: (0.52), ipnet: 162.255.20.0/22(0.14), asn: 21624(0.04), country: US(-0.07)]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:21624, ipnet:162.255.20.0/22, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 09:20:22 -0000 Hello, I'm on FreeBSD 12.0-STABLE #0 r344261 amd64. I've rebuilt all ports after clang 7 import to 12-STABLE. Now I get with mplayer ld-elf.so.1: /lib/libc.so.7: Undefined symbol "__progname" -- Sent from: http://freebsd.1045724.x6.nabble.com/freebsd-current-f3875308.html From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 10:22:49 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C267B15100B5; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 10:22:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vladimir@kondratyev.su) Received: from corp.infotel.ru (corp.infotel.ru [195.170.219.3]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EFC884BCC; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 10:22:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vladimir@kondratyev.su) Received: from corp (corp.infotel.ru [195.170.219.3]) by corp.infotel.ru (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03C712A3DE; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 13:22:40 +0300 (MSK) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at corp.infotel.ru Received: from corp.infotel.ru ([195.170.219.3]) by corp (corp.infotel.ru [195.170.219.3]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9NJtgaw757Vg; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 13:22:35 +0300 (MSK) Received: from mail.cicgroup.ru (unknown [195.170.219.74]) by corp.infotel.ru (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D1A22A3D2; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 13:22:35 +0300 (MSK) Received: from mail.cicgroup.ru (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cicgroup.ru (Postfix) with ESMTP id 511A442211F; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 13:22:31 +0300 (MSK) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at cicgroup.ru Received: from mail.cicgroup.ru ([127.0.0.1]) by mail.cicgroup.ru (mail.cicgroup.ru [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with SMTP id yQsB0WUB2rLH; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 13:22:28 +0300 (MSK) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cicgroup.ru (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 453C842211C; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 13:22:28 +0300 (MSK) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 13:22:28 +0300 From: Vladimir Kondratyev To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd In-Reply-To: <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> References: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Message-ID: <47aa4d16ea33b4f9daa4cf7cb799df03@kondratyev.su> X-Sender: vladimir@kondratyev.su User-Agent: Roundcube Webmail/1.3.5 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 9EFC884BCC X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.93 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.32)[-0.319,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.89)[0.885,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.63)[-0.626,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kondratyev.su]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mail.kondratyev.su]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8299, ipnet:195.170.192.0/19, country:RU]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[country: RU(0.00)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 10:22:49 -0000 On 2019-02-22 09:04, Steve Kargl wrote: > > Ideas? Place hw.above4g_allow=0 into /boot/loader.conf? -- WBR Vladimir Kondratyev From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 15:49:03 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56462151A133 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 15:49:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jbeich@freebsd.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [96.47.72.132]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "freefall.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EE8B88FD1A; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 15:49:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jbeich@freebsd.org) Received: by freefall.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 1354) id A88421BD74; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 15:49:02 +0000 (UTC) From: Jan Beich To: Jakub Lach Cc: Thomas Zander , freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ld-elf.so.1: /usr/local/lib/libglib-2.0.so.0: Undefined symbol "environ" (RPI/arm64) References: <3BB1A8CA-272D-4B48-81A2-CBAF7EE23507@gmail.com> <20181227140706.748bf173@ernst.home> <201901060714.x067DqZP016183@fire.js.berklix.net> <20190106130206.56332774@ernst.home> <201901062231.x06MV3OP028712@fire.js.berklix.net> <201901071626.x07GPtW6049111@fire.js.berklix.net> <1550913614539-0.post@n6.nabble.com> Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:48:57 +0100 In-Reply-To: <1550913614539-0.post@n6.nabble.com> (Jakub Lach's message of "Sat, 23 Feb 2019 02:20:14 -0700 (MST)") Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: EE8B88FD1A X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.87 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.996,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.88)[-0.879,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:96.47.64.0/20, country:US]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.997,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 15:49:03 -0000 Jakub Lach writes: > Hello, > > I'm on FreeBSD 12.0-STABLE #0 r344261 amd64. > > I've rebuilt all ports after clang 7 import to 12-STABLE. > > Now I get with mplayer > > ld-elf.so.1: /lib/libc.so.7: Undefined symbol "__progname" https://svnweb.freebsd.org/changeset/ports/490727 needs to be adjusted for -STABLE as well. Details are in https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=220103 From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 16:39:50 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73D60151C153 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:39:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B5A6C92866; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:39:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1NGdl7T019071 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:39:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1NGdlrF019070; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:39:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:39:47 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Conrad Meyer Cc: freebsd-current Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd Message-ID: <20190223163947.GB18805@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190223032644.GA14058@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: B5A6C92866 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.79 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.52)[0.521,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.59)[-0.587,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; IP_SCORE(0.06)[ip: (0.12), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.17), asn: 73(0.09), country: US(-0.07)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.10)[0.100,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:39:50 -0000 On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 08:32:23AM -0800, Conrad Meyer wrote: > On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 12:44 AM Steve Kargl > wrote: > > Ideas? > > ... > > +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) > > Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 > > https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/31728/intel-core-2-duo-processor-t7250-2m-cache-2-00-ghz-800-mhz-fsb.html > > > Intel® Virtualization Technology (VT-x) ‡ Yes > > Intel® 64 ‡ Yes > > > Merom is the first Intel mobile processor to feature Intel 64 architecture. > > So, as a workaround, maybe run amd64? This is the only i386 FreeBSD system that I have. This is the system where all the libm changes I've made have been tested. i386 floating point is different than amd64 floating point. See npx.c and the history of any of the long double functions that I've worked on. If this laptop does not run i386, there will be no testing of libm changes on the architecture. -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 16:36:22 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35D4D151C04E for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:36:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C0EE59270F; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:36:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1NGaJ1B019061 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:36:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1NGaJDP019060; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:36:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:36:19 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Konstantin Belousov Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, pho@freebsd.org, markj@freebsd.org Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd Message-ID: <20190223163619.GA18805@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190223032644.GA14058@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190223091931.GE2420@kib.kiev.ua> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20190223091931.GE2420@kib.kiev.ua> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: C0EE59270F X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.96 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.961,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:36:22 -0000 On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 11:19:31AM +0200, Konstantin Belousov wrote: > On Fri, Feb 22, 2019 at 07:26:44PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 10:04:10PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 07:39:25PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > r343567 merges the PAE vs non-PAE pmap headers for i386 > > > > freebsd. After bisection and dealing with the drm-legacy-kmod > > > > fallout, I bisected /usr/src to r343567. Building world and > > > > a GENERIC kernel and the minimum set of ports to start Xorg > > > > on my Dell Latitude D530 laptop, results in a black screen > > > > of death and a locked up laptop (no keyboard, mouse, or video). > > > > > > > > A comparison of /etc/log/Xorg.0.log for r343566 (Xorg loads > > > > and functions) and r353467 (Xorg black screen of death) shows > > > > that /boot/modules/i915kms.ko loads correctly as the log > > > > files are identical. > > > > > > > > Comparing dmesg for r343566 to r343567 shows the following > > > > > > > > --- dmesg.343566 2019-02-20 08:13:07.727202000 -0800 > > > > +++ dmesg.343567 2019-02-21 19:02:24.469562000 -0800 > > > > @@ -3,11 +3,11 @@ > > > > Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 > > > > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > > > > FreeBSD is a registered trademark of The FreeBSD Foundation. > > > > -FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343566 GENERIC i386 > > > > +FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343567 GENERIC i386 > > > > FreeBSD clang version 7.0.1 (tags/RELEASE_701/final 349250) (based on LLVM 7.0.1) > > > > WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. > > > > VT(vga): resolution 640x480 > > > > -CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.05-MHz 686-class CPU) > > > > +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) > > > > Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 > > > > Features=0xbfebfbff > > > > Features2=0xe3bd > > > > @@ -16,7 +16,7 @@ > > > > VT-x: (disabled in BIOS) HLT,PAUSE > > > > TSC: P-state invariant, performance statistics > > > > real memory = 4294967296 (4096 MB) > > > > -avail memory = 3639914496 (3471 MB) > > > > +avail memory = 4154175488 (3961 MB) > > > > > > > > Somehow the r343567 kernel found an addition 490 MB of memory, > > > > which leads me to believe the after loading i915kms.ko there > > > > is some serious memory stomping issues. > > > > > > > > I willing to do whatever is necessary to fix this issue (shorter > > > > of mailing the laptop to someone). Is it possible to revert > > > > r343567 and move forward? > > > > > > > > > > More info from sysctl. With the "good" r343566, I see > > > > > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1187033088 > > > vm.kmem_map_size: 27234304 > > > vm.kmem_size_scale: 3 > > > vm.kmem_size_max: 1715470336 > > > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > > > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > > > vm.kmem_size: 1214267392 > > > hw.physmem: 3714269184 > > > hw.usermem: 3650867200 > > > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > > > > > With the problematic r343567, I see > > > > > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1683152896 > > > vm.kmem_map_size: 28123136 > > > vm.kmem_size_scale: 1 > > > vm.kmem_size_max: 1711276032 > > > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > > > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > > > vm.kmem_size: 1711276032 > > > hw.physmem: 4252360704 > > > hw.usermem: 4146999296 > > > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > > > > > Ideas? > > > > > > > Here's the 'diff -uw' between a verbose dmesg boot of r343566 > > and dmesg boot of r343567. The memory size looks rather puzzling. > > Can the people responsible for the i386 pmap.h merging take a > > look? > What is puzzling ? Supposely, the laptop only has 4 GB of memory. Not sure how it finds memory above 4 GB. I build 343566 and minimum ports needed for Xorg including drm-legacy-kmod. I can load xorg, and in fact, I am typing this email now on the laptop with vi in xterm. I build 343567 and minimum ports needed for Xorg including drm-legacy-kmod. I try to start Xorg. Black screen of death. No mouse. No keyboard. Just a hard reset. I build 343567 and minimum ports needed for Xorg including drm-legacy-kmod. I load i915kms.ko, do not start Xorg. There are surprising strikes/blotches of color on screen. Building any port with the system's cc results in occasion segfaults. > When kernel boots in PAE mode, it can (and will) get a use for physical > memory mapped above 4G. I highlighted the SMAP entry which represents > such memory, below. > > kmem_scale was changed in the PAE commit, see the commit message for > explanation. > I read it multiple times. It does not explain how to get the old pre-343567 behavior where the laptop is usable. It mentions two new sysctl entities. One is irrelevant as I don't have 24+ GB of memory. The other has this in the commit message: There are two tunables added: hw.above4g_allow and ..., the first one is kept enabled for now to evaluate the status on HEAD, ... Well, here's a report that indicates the status is "not okay". The commit message also has the afterthought: Also, VM_KMEM_SIZE_SCALE changed from 3 to 1. Okay, so what does that mean. Will setting vm.kmem_size_scale to 3 fix what appears to be some memory corruption or mismanagement? -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 18:04:11 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABCAE151F5DE for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 18:04:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B3057967E8; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 18:04:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x1NI47YP031173; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 10:04:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x1NI47Ko031172; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 10:04:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201902231804.x1NI47Ko031172@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd In-Reply-To: <20190223163619.GA18805@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 10:04:07 -0800 (PST) CC: Konstantin Belousov , freebsd-current@freebsd.org, pho@freebsd.org, markj@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: B3057967E8 X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.63 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.92)[0.915,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[ip: (0.01), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.01), asn: 13868(-0.01), country: US(-0.07)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.19)[-0.194,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.03)[0.031,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 18:04:12 -0000 > On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 11:19:31AM +0200, Konstantin Belousov wrote: > > On Fri, Feb 22, 2019 at 07:26:44PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 10:04:10PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 07:39:25PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > > r343567 merges the PAE vs non-PAE pmap headers for i386 > > > > > freebsd. After bisection and dealing with the drm-legacy-kmod > > > > > fallout, I bisected /usr/src to r343567. Building world and > > > > > a GENERIC kernel and the minimum set of ports to start Xorg > > > > > on my Dell Latitude D530 laptop, results in a black screen > > > > > of death and a locked up laptop (no keyboard, mouse, or video). > > > > > > > > > > A comparison of /etc/log/Xorg.0.log for r343566 (Xorg loads > > > > > and functions) and r353467 (Xorg black screen of death) shows > > > > > that /boot/modules/i915kms.ko loads correctly as the log > > > > > files are identical. > > > > > > > > > > Comparing dmesg for r343566 to r343567 shows the following > > > > > > > > > > --- dmesg.343566 2019-02-20 08:13:07.727202000 -0800 > > > > > +++ dmesg.343567 2019-02-21 19:02:24.469562000 -0800 > > > > > @@ -3,11 +3,11 @@ > > > > > Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 > > > > > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > > > > > FreeBSD is a registered trademark of The FreeBSD Foundation. > > > > > -FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343566 GENERIC i386 > > > > > +FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343567 GENERIC i386 > > > > > FreeBSD clang version 7.0.1 (tags/RELEASE_701/final 349250) (based on LLVM 7.0.1) > > > > > WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. > > > > > VT(vga): resolution 640x480 > > > > > -CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.05-MHz 686-class CPU) > > > > > +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) > > > > > Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 > > > > > Features=0xbfebfbff > > > > > Features2=0xe3bd > > > > > @@ -16,7 +16,7 @@ > > > > > VT-x: (disabled in BIOS) HLT,PAUSE > > > > > TSC: P-state invariant, performance statistics > > > > > real memory = 4294967296 (4096 MB) > > > > > -avail memory = 3639914496 (3471 MB) > > > > > +avail memory = 4154175488 (3961 MB) > > > > > > > > > > Somehow the r343567 kernel found an addition 490 MB of memory, > > > > > which leads me to believe the after loading i915kms.ko there > > > > > is some serious memory stomping issues. > > > > > > > > > > I willing to do whatever is necessary to fix this issue (shorter > > > > > of mailing the laptop to someone). Is it possible to revert > > > > > r343567 and move forward? > > > > > > > > > > > > > More info from sysctl. With the "good" r343566, I see > > > > > > > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1187033088 > > > > vm.kmem_map_size: 27234304 > > > > vm.kmem_size_scale: 3 > > > > vm.kmem_size_max: 1715470336 > > > > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > > > > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > > > > vm.kmem_size: 1214267392 > > > > hw.physmem: 3714269184 > > > > hw.usermem: 3650867200 > > > > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > > > > > > > With the problematic r343567, I see > > > > > > > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1683152896 > > > > vm.kmem_map_size: 28123136 > > > > vm.kmem_size_scale: 1 > > > > vm.kmem_size_max: 1711276032 > > > > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > > > > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > > > > vm.kmem_size: 1711276032 > > > > hw.physmem: 4252360704 > > > > hw.usermem: 4146999296 > > > > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > > > > > > > Ideas? > > > > > > > > > > Here's the 'diff -uw' between a verbose dmesg boot of r343566 > > > and dmesg boot of r343567. The memory size looks rather puzzling. > > > Can the people responsible for the i386 pmap.h merging take a > > > look? > > What is puzzling ? > > Supposely, the laptop only has 4 GB of memory. Not sure how > it finds memory above 4 GB. It probably has what is called UMA and the graphics framebuffer is mapped into memory below 4G and the original memory is mapped above 4G, giving you this little bit of >4G memory that is trigger PAE now. This may not be desired, is there any performance advantage to not turning on PAE in this situation? > I build 343566 and minimum ports needed for Xorg including > drm-legacy-kmod. I can load xorg, and in fact, I am typing > this email now on the laptop with vi in xterm. > > I build 343567 and minimum ports needed for Xorg including > drm-legacy-kmod. I try to start Xorg. Black screen of death. > No mouse. No keyboard. Just a hard reset. That would be a regression caused by PAE coming into play. > I build 343567 and minimum ports needed for Xorg including > drm-legacy-kmod. I load i915kms.ko, do not start Xorg. There > are surprising strikes/blotches of color on screen. Building any > port with the system's cc results in occasion segfaults. > > > When kernel boots in PAE mode, it can (and will) get a use for physical > > memory mapped above 4G. I highlighted the SMAP entry which represents > > such memory, below. > > > > kmem_scale was changed in the PAE commit, see the commit message for > > explanation. > > > > I read it multiple times. It does not explain how to get the > old pre-343567 behavior where the laptop is usable. It mentions > two new sysctl entities. One is irrelevant as I don't have 24+ GB > of memory. The other has this in the commit message: > > There are two tunables added: hw.above4g_allow and ..., I think trying to set that sysctl to 0 in a post 343567 system is worth a try. > the first one is kept enabled for now to evaluate the status > on HEAD, ... > > Well, here's a report that indicates the status is "not okay". The > commit message also has the afterthought: > > Also, VM_KMEM_SIZE_SCALE changed from 3 to 1. > > Okay, so what does that mean. Will setting vm.kmem_size_scale to 3 > fix what appears to be some memory corruption or mismanagement? > -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 16:32:43 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5F73151BF28 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:32:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cse.cem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-it1-f179.google.com (mail-it1-f179.google.com [209.85.166.179]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B931F92647 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:32:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cse.cem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-it1-f179.google.com with SMTP id z131so7355362itf.5 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:32:41 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:reply-to :from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=IQPrG7B8Gw4ZRL0rwzITBkOtbkDUzqdxf+EPFdDKCVc=; b=PJxFnQz49S/hKUHNPK4QZbBDkCz9Nqna6ooIgyIffa4J9jtBV/z0suBtJEd0OOpW/W LDLEwMiRXV5x5QN+eXqmad6ToqIm+m96cw9WGXwpScMkJ9AqLW1o1qb5gNH8HjJD8jQM 8lKGzM0ySa3d97ebS8P7acFF6wf9uqzT3zgyW4f8dcZ+fHWvU6+Khk5+tcpGxjx9yYOb BAX1I6gWatzBHK5cLj0QfeGVGf0Y7hKvl0VGLqgdNiV0ClYqAjHw/wwP5SCXmgQj4Pg0 rPcKJrAGnL3N1lbA8wiiALKwN1ovJQ09Y8welCPi/YjREfE3opt5KOQcjaequg4w7A7R jeEg== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAub2FdkhxrtAZ5HhbOhks2ARlJ6iWZs1oW6N3PmMekfUmRCe/3+T j9+YADYzWhzWTIwMqjskaxyVvu81 X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IZpYuMimDTFfeoHtt+3p7yAapG9HymSIpk9I6Hkb3EqeYgtTRoUsMlCtNGHbUlC73HNRctGYw== X-Received: by 2002:a05:660c:2c4:: with SMTP id j4mr4398805itd.168.1550939554562; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:32:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-io1-f45.google.com (mail-io1-f45.google.com. [209.85.166.45]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p11sm1865355ios.15.2019.02.23.08.32.34 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:32:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-io1-f45.google.com with SMTP id x4so4319085ion.2 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:32:34 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a5e:9412:: with SMTP id q18mr5070795ioj.233.1550939554036; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:32:34 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190223032644.GA14058@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> In-Reply-To: <20190223032644.GA14058@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: cem@freebsd.org From: Conrad Meyer Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:32:23 -0800 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu Cc: freebsd-current Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: B931F92647 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of csecem@gmail.com designates 209.85.166.179 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=csecem@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.88 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[cem@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.979,0]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[cem@freebsd.org,csecem@gmail.com]; IP_SCORE(-2.89)[ip: (-8.57), ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-3.80), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[cem@freebsd.org,csecem@gmail.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[179.166.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[179.166.85.209.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:32:43 -0000 On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 12:44 AM Steve Kargl wrote: > Ideas? > ... > +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-cl= ass CPU) > Origin=3D"GenuineIntel" Id=3D0x6fd Family=3D0x6 Model=3D0xf Steppi= ng=3D13 https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/31728/intel-core-2-duo= -processor-t7250-2m-cache-2-00-ghz-800-mhz-fsb.html > Intel=C2=AE Virtualization Technology (VT-x) =E2=80=A1 Yes > Intel=C2=AE 64 =E2=80=A1 Yes > Merom is the first Intel mobile processor to feature Intel 64 architectur= e. So, as a workaround, maybe run amd64? From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 17:26:46 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FB6B151E05F for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 17:26:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dim@FreeBSD.org) Received: from tensor.andric.com (tensor.andric.com [IPv6:2001:470:7a58:1::1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "tensor.andric.com", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DCB5E94E20; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 17:26:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dim@FreeBSD.org) Received: from [IPv6:2001:470:7a58::4b8:333f:3b4d:68b8] (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:7a58:0:4b8:333f:3b4d:68b8]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tensor.andric.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id BA33C32719; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 18:26:43 +0100 (CET) From: Dimitry Andric Message-Id: Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_C65BCC25-F40E-4EC4-B553-9B9280767154"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.2 \(3445.102.3\)) Subject: Re: ld-elf.so.1: /usr/local/lib/libglib-2.0.so.0: Undefined symbol "environ" (RPI/arm64) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 18:26:43 +0100 In-Reply-To: Cc: Jakub Lach , Thomas Zander , freebsd-current@freebsd.org To: Jan Beich References: <3BB1A8CA-272D-4B48-81A2-CBAF7EE23507@gmail.com> <20181227140706.748bf173@ernst.home> <201901060714.x067DqZP016183@fire.js.berklix.net> <20190106130206.56332774@ernst.home> <201901062231.x06MV3OP028712@fire.js.berklix.net> <201901071626.x07GPtW6049111@fire.js.berklix.net> <1550913614539-0.post@n6.nabble.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.102.3) X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 17:26:46 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_C65BCC25-F40E-4EC4-B553-9B9280767154 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On 23 Feb 2019, at 16:48, Jan Beich wrote: > > Jakub Lach writes: > >> Hello, >> >> I'm on FreeBSD 12.0-STABLE #0 r344261 amd64. >> >> I've rebuilt all ports after clang 7 import to 12-STABLE. >> >> Now I get with mplayer >> >> ld-elf.so.1: /lib/libc.so.7: Undefined symbol "__progname" > > https://svnweb.freebsd.org/changeset/ports/490727 needs to be adjusted > for -STABLE as well. No, the correct solution is to fix mplayer's linker script, or better, to delete it entirely. :-) Afterwards, r490727 can be reverted. -Dimitry --Apple-Mail=_C65BCC25-F40E-4EC4-B553-9B9280767154 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.2 iF0EARECAB0WIQR6tGLSzjX8bUI5T82wXqMKLiCWowUCXHGCUwAKCRCwXqMKLiCW o1+mAKCKXoLiAmQtgSrfvl8NESB+DBnJNQCfenHaYV0tzF1iCntgm6+/xfCdnRI= =N3T2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_C65BCC25-F40E-4EC4-B553-9B9280767154-- From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 18:24:09 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DAF715207A1 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 18:24:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from kib.kiev.ua (kib.kiev.ua [IPv6:2001:470:d5e7:1::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8A94B978AB; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 18:24:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from tom.home (kib@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by kib.kiev.ua (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1NINxO9030916 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 23 Feb 2019 20:24:02 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 kib.kiev.ua x1NINxO9030916 Received: (from kostik@localhost) by tom.home (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1NINx7S030915; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 20:23:59 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) X-Authentication-Warning: tom.home: kostik set sender to kostikbel@gmail.com using -f Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 20:23:59 +0200 From: Konstantin Belousov To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, pho@freebsd.org, markj@freebsd.org Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd Message-ID: <20190223182359.GI2420@kib.kiev.ua> References: <20190223163619.GA18805@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <201902231804.x1NI47Ko031172@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <201902231804.x1NI47Ko031172@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED,FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD,FREEMAIL_FROM, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on tom.home X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 18:24:09 -0000 On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 10:04:07AM -0800, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > > On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 11:19:31AM +0200, Konstantin Belousov wrote: > > > On Fri, Feb 22, 2019 at 07:26:44PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 10:04:10PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 07:39:25PM -0800, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > > > r343567 merges the PAE vs non-PAE pmap headers for i386 > > > > > > freebsd. After bisection and dealing with the drm-legacy-kmod > > > > > > fallout, I bisected /usr/src to r343567. Building world and > > > > > > a GENERIC kernel and the minimum set of ports to start Xorg > > > > > > on my Dell Latitude D530 laptop, results in a black screen > > > > > > of death and a locked up laptop (no keyboard, mouse, or video). > > > > > > > > > > > > A comparison of /etc/log/Xorg.0.log for r343566 (Xorg loads > > > > > > and functions) and r353467 (Xorg black screen of death) shows > > > > > > that /boot/modules/i915kms.ko loads correctly as the log > > > > > > files are identical. > > > > > > > > > > > > Comparing dmesg for r343566 to r343567 shows the following > > > > > > > > > > > > --- dmesg.343566 2019-02-20 08:13:07.727202000 -0800 > > > > > > +++ dmesg.343567 2019-02-21 19:02:24.469562000 -0800 > > > > > > @@ -3,11 +3,11 @@ > > > > > > Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 > > > > > > The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. > > > > > > FreeBSD is a registered trademark of The FreeBSD Foundation. > > > > > > -FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343566 GENERIC i386 > > > > > > +FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r343567 GENERIC i386 > > > > > > FreeBSD clang version 7.0.1 (tags/RELEASE_701/final 349250) (based on LLVM 7.0.1) > > > > > > WARNING: WITNESS option enabled, expect reduced performance. > > > > > > VT(vga): resolution 640x480 > > > > > > -CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.05-MHz 686-class CPU) > > > > > > +CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7250 @ 2.00GHz (1995.04-MHz 686-class CPU) > > > > > > Origin="GenuineIntel" Id=0x6fd Family=0x6 Model=0xf Stepping=13 > > > > > > Features=0xbfebfbff > > > > > > Features2=0xe3bd > > > > > > @@ -16,7 +16,7 @@ > > > > > > VT-x: (disabled in BIOS) HLT,PAUSE > > > > > > TSC: P-state invariant, performance statistics > > > > > > real memory = 4294967296 (4096 MB) > > > > > > -avail memory = 3639914496 (3471 MB) > > > > > > +avail memory = 4154175488 (3961 MB) > > > > > > > > > > > > Somehow the r343567 kernel found an addition 490 MB of memory, > > > > > > which leads me to believe the after loading i915kms.ko there > > > > > > is some serious memory stomping issues. > > > > > > > > > > > > I willing to do whatever is necessary to fix this issue (shorter > > > > > > of mailing the laptop to someone). Is it possible to revert > > > > > > r343567 and move forward? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > More info from sysctl. With the "good" r343566, I see > > > > > > > > > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1187033088 > > > > > vm.kmem_map_size: 27234304 > > > > > vm.kmem_size_scale: 3 > > > > > vm.kmem_size_max: 1715470336 > > > > > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > > > > > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > > > > > vm.kmem_size: 1214267392 > > > > > hw.physmem: 3714269184 > > > > > hw.usermem: 3650867200 > > > > > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > > > > > > > > > With the problematic r343567, I see > > > > > > > > > > vm.kmem_map_free: 1683152896 > > > > > vm.kmem_map_size: 28123136 > > > > > vm.kmem_size_scale: 1 > > > > > vm.kmem_size_max: 1711276032 > > > > > vm.kmem_size_min: 12582912 > > > > > vm.kmem_zmax: 65536 > > > > > vm.kmem_size: 1711276032 > > > > > hw.physmem: 4252360704 > > > > > hw.usermem: 4146999296 > > > > > hw.realmem: 4294963200 > > > > > > > > > > Ideas? > > > > > > > > > > > > > Here's the 'diff -uw' between a verbose dmesg boot of r343566 > > > > and dmesg boot of r343567. The memory size looks rather puzzling. > > > > Can the people responsible for the i386 pmap.h merging take a > > > > look? > > > What is puzzling ? > > > > Supposely, the laptop only has 4 GB of memory. Not sure how > > it finds memory above 4 GB. > > It probably has what is called UMA and the graphics > framebuffer is mapped into memory below 4G and the > original memory is mapped above 4G, giving you this > little bit of >4G memory that is trigger PAE now. The PCI window takes between 300M up to 1G, so if 4G of RAM is installed, the same amount is wasted because it is remapped above 4G, regardless of the CPU bitness. > > This may not be desired, is there any performance > advantage to not turning on PAE in this situation? PAE enables nx bit, this was the main reason for the PAE commit. > > > I build 343566 and minimum ports needed for Xorg including > > drm-legacy-kmod. I can load xorg, and in fact, I am typing > > this email now on the laptop with vi in xterm. > > > > I build 343567 and minimum ports needed for Xorg including > > drm-legacy-kmod. I try to start Xorg. Black screen of death. > > No mouse. No keyboard. Just a hard reset. > > That would be a regression caused by PAE coming into play. > > > I build 343567 and minimum ports needed for Xorg including > > drm-legacy-kmod. I load i915kms.ko, do not start Xorg. There > > are surprising strikes/blotches of color on screen. Building any > > port with the system's cc results in occasion segfaults. > > > > > When kernel boots in PAE mode, it can (and will) get a use for physical > > > memory mapped above 4G. I highlighted the SMAP entry which represents > > > such memory, below. > > > > > > kmem_scale was changed in the PAE commit, see the commit message for > > > explanation. > > > > > > > I read it multiple times. It does not explain how to get the > > old pre-343567 behavior where the laptop is usable. It mentions > > two new sysctl entities. One is irrelevant as I don't have 24+ GB > > of memory. The other has this in the commit message: > > > > There are two tunables added: hw.above4g_allow and ..., > > I think trying to set that sysctl to 0 in a post 343567 system > is worth a try. To disable PAE auto-selection, later kernels provide vm.pmap.pae_mode=0 loader tunable. > > > the first one is kept enabled for now to evaluate the status > > on HEAD, ... > > > > Well, here's a report that indicates the status is "not okay". The > > commit message also has the afterthought: > > > > Also, VM_KMEM_SIZE_SCALE changed from 3 to 1. > > > > Okay, so what does that mean. Will setting vm.kmem_size_scale to 3 > > fix what appears to be some memory corruption or mismanagement? > > > > -- > Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 16:41:05 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05F94151C1BD; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:41:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1D49B92A27; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:41:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x1NGf2JS019081 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:41:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x1NGf23U019080; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:41:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 08:41:02 -0800 From: Steve Kargl To: Vladimir Kondratyev Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd Message-ID: <20190223164102.GC18805@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Reply-To: sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu References: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <47aa4d16ea33b4f9daa4cf7cb799df03@kondratyev.su> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <47aa4d16ea33b4f9daa4cf7cb799df03@kondratyev.su> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.2 (2019-01-07) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 1D49B92A27 X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.39 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.86)[0.862,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[washington.edu]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; REPLYTO_ADDR_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.56)[-0.561,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[21.76.95.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: troutmask.apl.washington.edu]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.34)[0.338,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.06)[ip: (0.12), ipnet: 128.95.0.0/16(0.17), asn: 73(0.09), country: US(-0.07)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 16:41:05 -0000 On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 01:22:28PM +0300, Vladimir Kondratyev wrote: > On 2019-02-22 09:04, Steve Kargl wrote: > > > > Ideas? > > Place hw.above4g_allow=0 into /boot/loader.conf? > Tried that. sysctl -a does not report hw.above4g_allowed, so have no idea if it set. -- Steve From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 19:04:11 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63E2415012A3 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 19:04:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-qt1-x836.google.com (mail-qt1-x836.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::836]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6C5226AD76 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 19:04:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-qt1-x836.google.com with SMTP id d2so6240515qti.11 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 11:04:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=dOU0vRQ/W5I5+ZNFneJX181UmEyH0BNH0Ryb1x3SREY=; b=yofz9r+dD+R2JMMogpT2hxvI55ZmF4emAMmV5vDYSmR3oQGbxx7TCt29M07eb9/plS nhowqHLEguR1hNEu6lW0P+OObuN/ly7+HLgK3nW9byJt3QvDF9vQVF3E83EzJ7nYF1cs R1x6atlcxmJzAO/dnNnEcfmZsVhhBgo7cCn3iZHJvWoULXDiELRxtqaaPq9XxobhuGd/ ZYbCnVBrZlHU00YMpQIYhzQlrwEp17t7u0N3MgiPYzFfkrNX9jdptd8rIdCaFuHrVlfB rR51N0leo/UgMSZx1W6g/HoT7YxstugCeYAl/+/MP5/CWg/YpTJp2EnM79Qua12k+X6b +rcA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=dOU0vRQ/W5I5+ZNFneJX181UmEyH0BNH0Ryb1x3SREY=; b=DpIaTiJykXfw1GmG1u9j1mgfqHAyfHt3QB4nlmAaeI1PFGIQkMcswjLS/4zzQgl6d5 XqdcXUENhQScPb31D6tP6SZiTSUP/lYSd+DJUflGHu0TmCx90K3FbAVwZdjVVUN660Qp xjAGBiwKxHLA6UUKKHXrOAE1f4RYP0vQwaJjXRnc+lMtNaO9/8j/cS1f6Xzg0diB+izE rC0ZhaoE3VGi0+h4n3L+XBiAG9njESwZM8LSKsTrCoS1RHlkuRtZelWLBlOi6teDoWUY bRlvom1yoabePiNMesjQw8J4v7wyWUmaJydKDYtef1F7QLjROqv26wwIoIGGWb1m7NTZ xPrQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuYu4RyDf5I0yUx9TMssOZVwc2HV4uICj1/awe9ycWmX2Xfi8+N7 z+dVIfE77cI07dueY7L7miR+XbA6S8/vGhjIk5oXoQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IbusW7bXj78b/BGoOq67sRSA3xKe8RT7sDNsE+G8WsGvrEkUdyLg+aYWPuQTf07eV0e7q19Ks6KenzBzakiKEY= X-Received: by 2002:aed:3964:: with SMTP id l91mr8053587qte.33.1550948649765; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 11:04:09 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20190222033924.GA25285@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190222060410.GA25817@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190223032644.GA14058@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190223091931.GE2420@kib.kiev.ua> <20190223163619.GA18805@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> In-Reply-To: <20190223163619.GA18805@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> From: Warner Losh Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 12:03:58 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd To: Steve Kargl Cc: Konstantin Belousov , FreeBSD Current , Peter Holm , Mark Johnston X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 6C5226AD76 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=yofz9r+d X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.58 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-current@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[ALT1.aspmx.l.google.com,aspmx.l.google.com,ALT2.aspmx.l.google.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[6.3.8.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.92)[-0.923,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; IP_SCORE(-2.64)[ip: (-8.53), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.63), asn: 15169(-1.99), country: US(-0.07)]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 19:04:11 -0000 On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 10:57 AM Steve Kargl < sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote: > Supposely, the laptop only has 4 GB of memory. Not sure how > it finds memory above 4 GB. > Some older chipsets had a 'hole' in memory that they mapped the PCI bus into and then remapped RAM in that range up above the 4GB boundary. That's how it can find memory above 4GB when you have only 4GB of RAM. I hit it with the PC Card stuff I did back in the day since it broke certain heuristics I had in the code that turned out to be unwise for many reasons (not just this one). I don't recall all the details, since it's been so long ago. So I think kib@ is right when he highlights > +0x0000000100000000 - 0x000000011ffe7fff, 536772608 bytes (131048 pages) as the memory, since this is indeed above the 4GB limit. It's about 128k of 4k pages (just shy of the 131072 I'd expect), which is a surprisingly round number. Also one that's easy to implement in hardware. So it certainly "smells" the same... That's why I agree with others that hw.above4g_allow=0 is worth a shot, for at least diagnostic purposes. This memory wasn't used before and if it's used now by the drm drivers, and those aren't PAE safe (meaning they cope with allocations beyond 4GB), then that's quite useful to know. Or maybe it's a different driver hating things and stomping on video memory due to wrap around. Warner From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sat Feb 23 20:14:11 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4E4C1504021 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 20:14:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B208E6DBD0; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 20:14:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: from pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x1NKE7lD031716; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 12:14:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x1NKE7aO031715; Sat, 23 Feb 2019 12:14:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201902232014.x1NKE7aO031715@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: r343567 aka PAE vs non-PAE merge breaks i386 freebsd In-Reply-To: To: Warner Losh Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 12:14:07 -0800 (PST) CC: Steve Kargl , Konstantin Belousov , FreeBSD Current , Peter Holm , Mark Johnston X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: B208E6DBD0 X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.57 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.05)[-0.050,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.96)[0.956,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.22)[-0.216,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[ip: (0.01), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.01), asn: 13868(-0.01), country: US(-0.07)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2019 20:14:12 -0000 > On Sat, Feb 23, 2019 at 10:57 AM Steve Kargl < > sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> wrote: > > > Supposely, the laptop only has 4 GB of memory. Not sure how > > it finds memory above 4 GB. > > > > Some older chipsets had a 'hole' in memory that they mapped the PCI bus > into and then remapped RAM in that range up above the 4GB boundary. That's > how it can find memory above 4GB when you have only 4GB of RAM. I hit it > with the PC Card stuff I did back in the day since it broke certain > heuristics I had in the code that turned out to be unwise for many reasons > (not just this one). I don't recall all the details, since it's been so > long ago. > > So I think kib@ is right when he highlights > > +0x0000000100000000 - 0x000000011ffe7fff, 536772608 bytes (131048 pages) > > as the memory, since this is indeed above the 4GB limit. It's about 128k > of 4k pages (just shy of the 131072 I'd expect), which is a surprisingly > round number. Also one that's easy to implement in hardware. So it > certainly "smells" the same... > > That's why I agree with others that hw.above4g_allow=0 is worth a shot, for It sounds like that this sysctl didnt show up for him, he said he set it, but it does not show up in sysctl when he is booted, that seems very odd, unless it didnt get added until a later commit. > at least diagnostic purposes. This memory wasn't used before and if it's > used now by the drm drivers, and those aren't PAE safe (meaning they cope > with allocations beyond 4GB), then that's quite useful to know. Or maybe > it's a different driver hating things and stomping on video memory due to > wrap around. I'll see if I can spend a few moments this afternoon duplicating this, I have 2 thinkpads that are 64 bit, with >4G of ram, that I can install i386 on and test. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org