From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jun 10 16:30:56 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C45B11065673 for ; Thu, 10 Jun 2010 16:30:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from m.seaman@infracaninophile.co.uk) Received: from smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (gate6.infracaninophile.co.uk [IPv6:2001:8b0:151:1::1]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 489F98FC13 for ; Thu, 10 Jun 2010 16:30:56 +0000 (UTC) Received: from seedling.black-earth.co.uk (seedling.black-earth.co.uk [81.187.76.163]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id o5AGUqjd077132 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 10 Jun 2010 17:30:52 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from m.seaman@infracaninophile.co.uk) Message-ID: <4C11133C.1070203@infracaninophile.co.uk> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 17:30:52 +0100 From: Matthew Seaman Organization: Infracaninophile User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-US; rv:1.9.1.9) Gecko/20100317 Thunderbird/3.0.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <201006101147.40385.j.mckeown@ru.ac.za> <201006101432.23605.j.mckeown@ru.ac.za> <4C10E2F5.70806@infracaninophile.co.uk> <201006101512.48246.j.mckeown@ru.ac.za> <20100610121250.6ae70dfb@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <20100610121250.6ae70dfb@scorpio> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.96.1 at lucid-nonsense.infracaninophile.co.uk X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,DKIM_ADSP_ALL, SPF_FAIL,TO_NO_BRKTS_DIRECT autolearn=no version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on lucid-nonsense.infracaninophile.co.uk Cc: Jerry Subject: Re: Midphase Hosting X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 16:30:56 -0000 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 10/06/2010 17:12:50, Jerry wrote: > On Thu, 10 Jun 2010 15:12:48 +0200 > Jonathan McKeown articulated: > >> On Thursday 10 June 2010 15:04:53 Matthew Seaman wrote: >>> >>> The only other mechanism might be to tag each list e-mail with a >>> unique value for each recipient in such a way that it is preserved >>> in the message that mpcustomer.com's help system sends out. That >>> has severe problems of scale and load on the FreeBSD mail servers, >>> but it might be possible. There is a similar technique (whose name >>> I have temporarily forgotten) that some mailing lists use where >>> they tag the envelope sender address with the recipient name in >>> order to identify addresses that are bouncing back the list e-mail. >> >> Isn't that called VERP (variable envelope return path)? I agree - the >> load it would impose isn't worth it. I'm just shocked that midphase >> care so little about their reputation or the impression this is >> giving, on one of the more widely-archived mailing lists, of their >> competence and diligence. > > I have employed VERP with mailing lists that I controlled. I never > noticed any adverse effects. I know of several technical lists > like Dovecot that employ it. Obviously, they find it useful. VERP itself is reasonably lightweight, as it modifies the envelope sender address -- something that can be applied during processing by the MTA as part of sending the message. Unfortunately, I suspect that to get the message through to mpcustomer.com and then have it spammed back to the sender *with the tag intact*, VERP per se won't do the trick. It will probably be necessary to put the tag into the body of the message. As far as mail delivery goes, that's a very different story -- it goes from one message with tens of thousands of recipients, to tens of thousands of messages each with one recipient. Cheers, Matthew - -- Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 7 Priory Courtyard Flat 3 PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate JID: matthew@infracaninophile.co.uk Kent, CT11 9PW -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.14 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkwREzsACgkQ8Mjk52CukIyueACfRxA92D363Qf73nqRmoDLAYSu 7NcAnRl9BdZfax3+65N0y9Wxr3yy22hQ =2Edq -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----