From nobody Sun Aug 10 08:30:31 2025 X-Original-To: freebsd-pkgbase@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4c09vG29wKz648q3; Sun, 10 Aug 2025 08:30:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from truckman@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::24b:4]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R11" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4c09vG1RZ8z3lnC; Sun, 10 Aug 2025 08:30:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from truckman@FreeBSD.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1754814634; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=/ugQ7XAv3eLIhWcWQdi0geNUTyRYuvP/HFxhsYV5HVQ=; b=VKBbAe4wa9bDeUgdCz9Lx9h8v/ctJk7meLUXF/8jc2qCzWrvHp1oFYYw+hbH2blOV5ya6e FbT1+rItV9vY1NSGCfPNB3x4nD+iJ/4aYejDhTIAJQy4hy+Ulw8ubABUr1I+wN3xJ2DHST tKbrWNG+hcymlCQ7BcEtJOh1rxqYEacCF5nl3CStyF1Ie98ivzfJ1+at5q559TJ6patIBz 79rjHxGlSjzUZ0tVM4JzbSZwAbi1A+m1sCcgn52TamKxWaMi2KgT73CgEo6vTKoHSKxXQC 2FyuAwzYLx/Ljw3AvBAi3DX9hzRnAOOHAUNndQRu0RJy7w0XRcldMdR7yXI4Jg== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1754814634; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=/ugQ7XAv3eLIhWcWQdi0geNUTyRYuvP/HFxhsYV5HVQ=; b=EGL1j/cHhF+EMrHmZuq7QBntquFw/pwvS4YbSt6JWjtIg9WxDRE987NOyY1LWv0VAjZvur 9C16OX1Y+YXu+MlBLMqdhQnG3C5YnLLe81dRTU0O3Uw64ZHwY6lPaLpcK9zLjvV70M/Ytq Wil8UdA/TjIm8JCEhuAM97BHizfMn8OXFS84B6D9rjvmZ/aYIiVAMUy2wS+OXAO5X565hU s0Z6g0VF1HRDUTB3T2WzPiIljlPFiaO8KF7J0jc7OUT02faeCkItWUIaGJMCpiIO14Dh62 jhbm3g1AIVv10d/r6GIex8L0nGODsxa19KfUbbrDienE68BzPrZGnEqiaOyaEg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1754814634; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=G3iCtO33VCN0urUuDhSFHvXtCjRRthBljvNGmO4Mmr9NapRFWYXrth7fgmKAY4s5mBjbWZ 0FpjCWWMotymcta8HyKQyr4ofDxWmoHoaQcI0snxrbVwM133kuwMjGiKlfoDwg0GMyWcQB 6tfMgQUhgHGSWtfXkC4Wtmu+9oEpLz2MwntHYFnU2BrYLlbtyzr6yeGGdja8WbEvTGF/5g EhSi9CYptAbG95wD8MheA7Pd2YbdzfjyMfDa9lIzEtITpM5JNAvI2E45ZXXHaFWR0HVKCc XaRgHNBJoll+cXOYwA3M/I71tAgvU4AfJHKCBNVFTAZF2lfavsm+N3rVYOLJng== Received: from mousie.catspoiler.org (unknown [76.212.85.177]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: truckman) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4c09vF2MW5zFMS; Sun, 10 Aug 2025 08:30:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from truckman@FreeBSD.org) Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2025 01:30:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Lewis Subject: Re: PKGBASE Removes FreeBSD Base System Feature To: Helge Oldach cc: Brandon Allbery , DutchDaemon@freebsd.org, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <202508081619.578GJTKR028195@mp80.oldach.net> Message-ID: References: from Brandon Allbery at "8 Aug 2025 11:44:26" <202508081619.578GJTKR028195@mp80.oldach.net> List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=us-ascii Content-Disposition: INLINE On 8 Aug, Helge Oldach wrote: > Brandon Allbery wrote on Fri, 08 Aug 2025 17:44:26 +0200 (CEST): >> As stated earlier in the thread: embedded hardware which wants as minimal a >> base system as they can get away with. The flip side of the >> all-encompassing base system is that it's *big*. And grown considerably >> since the early days, making the early-days management of base a problem >> now. > > Traditional tweaking of make.conf works almost as well. We have that > knob for low-end gear already; I know of several users happy with that > approach and not seeking a better (?) one. That works, but pretty much requires that you to do source upgrades. That is time consuming if you have a bunch of customized VMs to maintain, and is problematic if the target is small and low peformance. I recently retired an old single-core i386 machine with only 256 MB of RAM. It was still powerful enough for its daily work, but too difficult maintain. I have no idea how long it would take for buildworld. I didn't have another machine running the same OS release, and its network connectivity wasn't suitable for NFS mounting /usr/obj. What I did was set up a VM with that release on a host running -CURRENT. tweak src.conf on the VM to what I desired, and then do "make release". Then I fed the release artifacts to the scripts that generate the files for binary updates and uploaded those to a web server. Then I could run freebsd-update to update the target machine. This is not compatible with applying security fixes in a timely manner. > As long as building from source is still supported, it'll be fine. That's what I do with my -STABLE and -CURRENT machines. For machines running -RELEASE, I would prefer something faster. > > Kind regards > Helge >