From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Fri May 14 14:17:24 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65BD416A4CE for ; Fri, 14 May 2004 14:17:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.soaustin.net (mail.soaustin.net [207.200.4.66]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E990443D39 for ; Fri, 14 May 2004 14:17:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from linimon@lonesome.com) Received: from [192.160.235.2] (cs242743-143.austin.rr.com [24.27.43.143]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-MD5 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.soaustin.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76625141F3; Fri, 14 May 2004 16:17:23 -0500 (CDT) From: Mark Linimon Organization: Lonesome Dove Computing Services To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 14 May 2004 16:14:33 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.6.2 References: <40A3F1D5.5010209@bellsouth.net> <40A4CCB1.8010700@cronyx.ru> <20040514210157.GA96254@xor.obsecurity.org> In-Reply-To: <20040514210157.GA96254@xor.obsecurity.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <200405141614.33302.linimon@lonesome.com> X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 15 May 2004 04:57:41 -0700 cc: Ion-Mihai Tetcu cc: Roman Kurakin cc: Kris Kennaway Subject: Re: but withoutI WITNESS and INVARIANTS ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 14 May 2004 21:17:24 -0000 On Friday 14 May 2004 04:01 pm, Kris Kennaway wrote: > On Fri, May 14, 2004 at 05:42:09PM +0400, Roman Kurakin wrote: > > The possibility that by disabling this debug stuff you will get some > > instability is > > very very .... very low :-) > > Not so low..it changes the timings of operations, which can expose > race conditions. I'll echo what Kris said. The difference between "should have no effect" and "can be proven to have no effect" is basically what Software Engineering (capitals intended) is all about. And after doing it for decades, lemme tell you, it's much more fun to just fool around and code than it is to do all that stuff. Especially given the, oh, say, 1:10 ratio of the one to the other ... mcl