From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Sep 17 16:28:50 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E80EF10656FD for ; Mon, 17 Sep 2012 16:28:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lichray@gmail.com) Received: from mail-iy0-f182.google.com (mail-iy0-f182.google.com [209.85.210.182]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACC458FC0C for ; Mon, 17 Sep 2012 16:28:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: by iayy25 with SMTP id y25so6914334iay.13 for ; Mon, 17 Sep 2012 09:28:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=tz+Ey8PgJiPgIHwxjrzmlUg9RRyH9Xg2g5lXf0F0F/I=; b=IM6r7N+DKr8bNLHgnE8EUIfja/jIvysxJon2cNqYjCLmEG7KHPttm8LVmbnbdLPpmz oujvOeOlOCB7IMw1ZDPTUVa5rKUf0wRbrNbnSUxGpvqOLOpMWZ9zUCpjAE8X5SwaNUKL UZnVMBwfCR2o633X4OIDQ+N9JK/j9yzjsSTvKLl5wR24Ili5XYPWOYWU61Y3diIYeSTD RX+2HE5cuLD0pEToN9jOoZmUL/CSxbNyR+4IQZS+cfrrvPeedv1SJMt1fMyOkNW1e1Hi UqAmYJfm+p0h9Tn94K/aLV3HgePCQP87qUl1VNDqPT/DfubwUY+OosaF671+zqON0IG8 daYw== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.50.17.230 with SMTP id r6mr7407027igd.16.1347899330031; Mon, 17 Sep 2012 09:28:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.231.127.76 with HTTP; Mon, 17 Sep 2012 09:28:49 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20120917161427.GB11773@e-new.0x20.net> References: <20120917161427.GB11773@e-new.0x20.net> Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2012 11:28:49 -0500 Message-ID: From: Zhihao Yuan To: Lars Engels Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Cc: FreeBSD Hackers , Lorenzo Cogotti Subject: Re: Providing a default graphical environment on FreeBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2012 16:28:51 -0000 On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Lars Engels wrote: > On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 11:00:21AM -0500, Zhihao Yuan wrote: >> On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 10:35 AM, Lorenzo Cogotti wrote: >> > Hi, >> > I was wondering about the possibility of FreeBSD to provide an official >> > supported graphical environment. >> > >> > Currently FreeBSD doesn't provide any standard desktop environment, this >> > means that, in a way much similar to Linux, a developer cannot know in >> > advance which GUI will be available on the system. This leads to another >> > problem, again much similar to Linux, tools are usually provided in a >> > text based fashion only, because that's the only sure and reliable way a >> > tool can work in a relatively dependency free and independent way. As >> > another effect, many utilities and graphical tools are provided for a >> > toolkit, but not for another, needlessly duplicating efforts and >> > applications, achieving barely half the result. >> > >> > Though, in a different way than Linux, FreeBSD doesn't get much support >> > from developers in this regard, mainly because development focuses over >> > Linux rather than FreeBSD, which remains known only as a good and >> > reliable server platform, many technologies remain relatively unknown >> > and doesn't get attention from developers, like devd vs udev, and other >> > solutions that FreeBSD provides since a very long time. >> > >> > The idea would be choosing a default desktop environment and providing >> > it as the official supported way to develop GUI applications on FreeBSD, >> > thus tools provided on FreeBSD would be able to get official GUIs and >> > supported graphical tools in a standard and non-redundant fashion, like >> > a GUI for tools like pkgng, geli(8), gpart(8). This choice would also be >> > motivated by the fact that often technologies move toward Linux support, >> > like GNOME3, dbus and consolekit, without taking into account BSD. >> > >> > In this regard CDE[1] is could be an interesting choice, since it was a >> > diffuse and reliable UNIX environment, and it is lightweight, relatively >> > Linux-like dependencies free solution, which could be updated to today >> > standards and extended to support FreeBSD features. >> > CDE was just recently released with open source license[2] and some >> > effort is being made to support FreeBSD. >> > >> > Of course CDE isn't the only possibility, the idea is "desktop >> > environment agnostic", also I don't mean that FreeBSD shouldn't work >> > with other environments, which could still be installed and used as long >> > as they support the platform properly. I don't mean forcing a graphical >> > environment over installed FreeBSD systems either, which could be >> > unwanted for server installations. >> > >> > [1] http://sourceforge.net/p/cdesktopenv/wiki/Home/ >> > [2] >> > https://sourceforge.net/p/cdesktopenv/code/ci/978aff3dc9c7d009423a3d7fd0624d12f9df0734/tree/cde/COPYING?format=raw >> > >> > I see this as an interesting opportunity to let FreeBSD gain more >> > visibility in the desktop field, would this idea be useful and worth >> > implementing? >> > >> > Thanks, >> > >> > -- >> > Lorenzo Cogotti >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list >> > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers >> > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >> >> I definitely agree with this. Sun has a book, "UNIX Essentials >> featuring the Solaris...", and GUI takes a big part in the book. A >> default GUI is essential to a modern UNIX. FreeBSD can no longer >> regard GUI as a third-party bonus. > > If you want a default GUI, install PC-BSD. It provides several graphical > management tools for FreeBSD. I hope you *really* used PC-BSD. I don't think an OS installing programs under /Programs can be a "GUI-replacement" to FreeBSD. -- Zhihao Yuan, nickname lichray The best way to predict the future is to invent it. ___________________________________________________ 4BSD -- http://4bsd.biz/