From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Dec 4 15:57:10 2011 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87873106566B; Sun, 4 Dec 2011 15:57:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rwatson@freebsd.org) Received: from cyrus.watson.org (cyrus.watson.org [65.122.17.42]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 610798FC0C; Sun, 4 Dec 2011 15:57:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [192.168.2.115] (host86-161-238-124.range86-161.btcentralplus.com [86.161.238.124]) by cyrus.watson.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 916BA46B0C; Sun, 4 Dec 2011 10:57:08 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Robert N. M. Watson" In-Reply-To: <20111204143145.GA44832@stack.nl> Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2011 15:57:06 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <1E0AAB37-952A-49B4-94AF-B67B84E6957B@freebsd.org> References: <86y5wkeuw9.fsf@kopusha.home.net> <20111016171005.GB50300@deviant.kiev.zoral.com.ua> <86aa8qozyx.fsf@kopusha.home.net> <20111025082451.GO50300@deviant.kiev.zoral.com.ua> <86aa8k2im0.fsf@kopusha.home.net> <20111204143145.GA44832@stack.nl> To: Jilles Tjoelker X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: Mikolaj Golub , Kostik Belousov , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: "ps -e" without procfs(5) X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 15:57:10 -0000 On 4 Dec 2011, at 14:31, Jilles Tjoelker wrote: > On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 01:32:39PM +0300, Mikolaj Golub wrote: >> [KERN_PROC_AUXV requires just p_cansee()] >=20 > If we are ever going to do ASLR, the AUXV information tells an = attacker > where the stack, executable and RTLD are located, which defeats much = of > the point of randomizing the addresses in the first place. >=20 > Given that the AUXV information seems to be used by debuggers only > anyway, I think it would be good to move it to p_candebug() now. >=20 > The full virtual memory maps (KERN_PROC_VMMAP, procstat -v) are = already > under p_candebug(). Agreed. In general, my view is that p_cansee() should be used for very = few of our process inspection APIs. I like your example of ASLR = especially, as it illustrates how debugging information can aid even = local attacks (i.e., user vs. setuid binary). Robert=