From owner-freebsd-arch Mon Jun 19 12:47: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from cypherpunks.ai (cypherpunks.ai [209.88.68.47]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5901137BBB6; Mon, 19 Jun 2000 12:47:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jeroen@vangelderen.org) Received: from vangelderen.org (grolsch.ai [209.88.68.214]) by cypherpunks.ai (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6FA449; Mon, 19 Jun 2000 15:46:56 -0400 (AST) Message-ID: <394E78B0.9B3C427A@vangelderen.org> Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 15:46:56 -0400 From: "Jeroen C. van Gelderen" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Poul-Henning Kamp Cc: Dag-Erling Smorgrav , Dan Moschuk , Mark Murray , arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: (2nd iteration) New /dev/(random|null|zero) - review, please References: <44778.961423462@critter.freebsd.dk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > In message , Dag-Erling Smorgrav writes: > >Poul-Henning Kamp writes: > >> In message , Dag-Erling Smorgrav writes: > >> > The idea of built-in hardware RNGs bothers me a little. [...] > >> And just because you went out and bought your RNG separately, what > >> difference would it make ? If an RNG has a fingerprint, you may > >> be identified by it, no matter where you bought it or how. > > > >Hmm, yes, that wasn't quite what I meant. I was actually thinking > >about purpose-made RNGs vs. custom-made (e.g. lava lamp + webcam), the > >idea being that with the latter, a) you know it doesn't contain an > >intentional steganographic fingerprint and b) you have complete > >control over the RNG and can vary its output in unpredictable ways > >(moving the camera, changing the background...) which hopefully defeat > >recognition without affecting randomness. > > Run your Intel built RNG through a cryptographic quality hash ? > > If you frustrate the output by running it though MD5 and feed a few > random bits from your keyboard interrupt in there as well ? It's not that simple but the problem can be dealt with. This is what constructions like Yarrow and Gutmann-PRNG are designed for and hence what MarkM is taking care of. Cheers, Jeroen -- Jeroen C. van Gelderen o _ _ _ jeroen@vangelderen.org _o /\_ _ \\o (_)\__/o (_) _< \_ _>(_) (_)/<_ \_| \ _|/' \/ (_)>(_) (_) (_) (_) (_)' _\o_ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message