From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sun Sep 20 17:16:33 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D4F63E849C for ; Sun, 20 Sep 2020 17:16:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.21]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "troutmask", Issuer "troutmask" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4BvZ405j6Tz3YG3 for ; Sun, 20 Sep 2020 17:16:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPS id 08KHGTZp051450 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 20 Sep 2020 10:16:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.16.1/8.16.1/Submit) id 08KHGST2051449; Sun, 20 Sep 2020 10:16:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2020 10:16:28 -0700 From: Steve Kargl To: Pete Wright Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Warner Losh , Lucas Nali de =?iso-8859-1?Q?Magalh=E3es?= , Chris , Kristof Provost , FreeBSD Current Subject: Re: Plans for git Message-ID: <20200920171628.GC50963@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> References: <202009201400.08KE0PBd028190@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> <13a965d9-ef02-f876-dd6c-aa872b66d114@nomadlogic.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <13a965d9-ef02-f876-dd6c-aa872b66d114@nomadlogic.org> X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4BvZ405j6Tz3YG3 X-Spamd-Bar: - X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.99 / 15.00]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[washington.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.82)[-0.823]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.66)[-0.663]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.51)[-0.508]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[no SPF record]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:73, ipnet:128.95.0.0/16, country:US]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gndrsh.dnsmgr.net,bsdimp.com,gmail.com,bsdforge.com,freebsd.org]; MAILMAN_DEST(0.00)[FreeBSD-current]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.33 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2020 17:16:33 -0000 On Sun, Sep 20, 2020 at 08:41:13AM -0700, Pete Wright wrote: > > > > making quarterly reports about this for almost a years as well. We put out > > > calls for people to help with the efforts about the same time. We have > > > tried at every step of the way to be open and honest that this was going to > > > happen. > > All developer centric communications.... > > I would argue that quarterly reports are actually one of the few methods of > getting accurate information about the state of the project as a > non-insider.  i've been following the progress of this work via the > quarterly status reports for years now, and as someone who is merely a > freebsd operator felt like i was more or less kept up to date on this > eventuality. > > honestly there has to be *some* responsibility of operators to at least make > an effort to keep up to date on the status of the various efforts in such a > large project.  and as an outsider the idea that comms can only happen on > the mailing list isn't the greatest - how am i to know that the idea of one > person on the ML carries more weight than another, or one persons opinion is > the "official" stated opinion of the core group? > Traditionally, this has been done through the freebsd-hackers and freebsd-current mailing lists. Admittedly, the freebsd-current mailing list has never recovered from the jenkins debacle. Making an announcement or seeking input about a conversion from subversion to git on the freebsd-git mailing list is self-fulfilling. People interested in git on FreeBSD will subscribe to that list. People not interested in git, oh well, they'll find out eventually. Of course, not seeking input on the mailing lists avoids the inevitable bikeshed. A discussion about a conversion from subversion to git would devolve rather quickly. -- Steve