From nobody Fri Dec 19 20:18:04 2025 X-Original-To: dev-commits-src-main@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4dXzPD4Pxyz6KBVV; Fri, 19 Dec 2025 20:18:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from glebius@freebsd.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::24b:4]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "R13" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4dXzPD2wPNz3HHV; Fri, 19 Dec 2025 20:18:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from glebius@freebsd.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1766175488; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=2RLsuhhiTflY+kqa8u3Vdk37rlF6TJtH6Y2EnK722FU=; b=KyhaSSZb1aUAXsHF694zS9yCXcncVxoxjcvtrJKIDWdNkck0s2EvyHlvgfIddHL25QkoIe DGJuxVWfVNoLv1vhOyelG0ms7I1OeihQJBvoytXzD0/oyrtJHDFeoyX3vLTZM8xtqZk3CK veUeypvjeTiN0LncP46+zefzoLmFPGx6YEb06pijIE8bmdO0k7HV82/vENC0g6EOS8+WNS OK0tgqAJUyBK/uKW95Si9JCpxHo5A59gNE16DK1BUCliS9r1+l7BOkNNTphXnos0lUdopO +PN16uulG1tj7FwzXwy7p3PA4i5cse9gL7Q4vRa2oDKKZPKv5mQhmA0urhozbQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1766175488; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=2RLsuhhiTflY+kqa8u3Vdk37rlF6TJtH6Y2EnK722FU=; b=LfGdHnfQF8pEbRRgHyotoCllLymLnQknMrPRZO0lW1zPASsip7Y5lhGrcF8bOozq5UGT1b 81tMURx5XYwAixgbdEzq9vXrAm6/XNG0yYXmCt/dyskBg3eF5FV9EjUndsmDH6pxdWzbu/ z8GyS2yEg4JXkfYrYarrQ7Um358UI5EdsUkjgsCiv0knII5oeij5LJnZkyB2jCdO0hqKrr YiOINEpMZargGTG7xRPI7mXcV6TqWEXCFeA++LQljgF4vXaJL/OUw6ZtRcuPQ4lhohMAQT 4hh1AdOVkXoeQigOnqBYMlkGQV2LdU2UF/J6COcsIzFhkhejdts3FCLVgl+bKg== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1766175488; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=M09JjP6RXgc80limNvL1jt3C1vAHKm29maynXjE6G8BwmFYvvsGAEXa/ONCmYypKnSV62I BeT+rtPOE0D8aG1ECv93ZgKdrYIcpd4tk1j590P+dlfMms80E+VMtVF3ynR7tUHXXUlyKk oZMYqAzC8kqx8t8d3O/Vtp6308V89L1Oam3NajeOX6vJBBZytg3cq6j11u254e9DfiOjlB +IcVJODyfHeSVR28C8RwEcvv+W773mlNkJWijGILpFUmeBsGZmv6q9P4PbzGCKXFn01tt5 X5EfYIh+ST0vCS7j9WsDP6+LXl1+8emHDMH3zJwGkUMTr7ibpI4ACZLyuCV8Mw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org; none Received: from cell.glebi.us (glebi.us [162.251.186.162]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: glebius) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4dXzPC3kmzztQP; Fri, 19 Dec 2025 20:18:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from glebius@freebsd.org) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2025 12:18:04 -0800 From: Gleb Smirnoff To: Konstantin Belousov Cc: Mark Johnston , src-committers@freebsd.org, dev-commits-src-all@freebsd.org, dev-commits-src-main@freebsd.org Subject: Re: git: e967a2a03677 - main - sockets: remove compat shim for divert(4) Message-ID: References: <693a275a.2e7b3.1858af56@gitrepo.freebsd.org> List-Id: Commit messages for the main branch of the src repository List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-BeenThere: dev-commits-src-main@freebsd.org Sender: owner-dev-commits-src-main@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: On Fri, Dec 19, 2025 at 09:57:17PM +0200, Konstantin Belousov wrote: K> We are discussing different things altogether. K> K> I am saying that you are breaking binary compatibility, and asking why. K> I do not see a reason. K> K> It has no relation to the fact that there are other ways to get the same K> behaviour from the system. The removal of that three lines breaks existing K> binaries. Also it does not matter that e.g. newer versions of some apps K> do not use that feature (feature as in binary interface, not a system K> behaviour). The existing binaries must continue to work. We already have had this argument before for a different kind of issue - POLLINIGNEOF. The existence of such binaries is like existence the the God. You can't prove they exist. I can't prove they do not exist. You advocate for the compat shim to exist forever. I advocate to limit it existence to some countable number of years. For this particular case all open source software had been addressed. There are no known shareware binaries in the wild that used AF_INET/IPPROTO_DIVERT. Those hypothethical binaries that we can't prove/refute existence of in some corporate environments would print a warning on 14.x and on 15.x providing a time to their owners to recompile. If we speculate that somewhere in the universe exists a corporate body that uses AF_INET/IPPROTO_DIVERT tuple in their internal software and have lost its source code, they have a solution. The solution is a tiny preloaded library that would intercept socket(2). Of course you may say that somewhere in the world exists a closed ecosystem that uses AF_INET/IPPROTO_DIVERT in a binary AND the sources for the binary were lost AND the binary is statically compiled. If you decide to go that deep into the rabbit hole, I would reply that owners of such a binary should bit hack it to use the correct tuple before call to socket(2). -- Gleb Smirnoff