From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Feb 21 21:27:36 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D3233CE7; Fri, 21 Feb 2014 21:27:36 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail110.syd.optusnet.com.au (mail110.syd.optusnet.com.au [211.29.132.97]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F1DD1DF3; Fri, 21 Feb 2014 21:27:36 +0000 (UTC) Received: from c122-106-144-87.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au (c122-106-144-87.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au [122.106.144.87]) by mail110.syd.optusnet.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6DF4A780B78; Sat, 22 Feb 2014 07:57:39 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2014 07:57:37 +1100 (EST) From: Bruce Evans X-X-Sender: bde@besplex.bde.org To: Ian Lepore Subject: Re: terminfo In-Reply-To: <1393008267.1145.117.camel@revolution.hippie.lan> Message-ID: <20140222072702.X4354@besplex.bde.org> References: <5304A0CC.5000505@FreeBSD.org> <1392997589.1145.91.camel@revolution.hippie.lan> <20140221183512.GP34851@funkthat.com> <1393008267.1145.117.camel@revolution.hippie.lan> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Optus-CM-Score: 0 X-Optus-CM-Analysis: v=2.1 cv=bpB1Wiqi c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=p/w0leo876FR0WNmYI1KeA==:117 a=PO7r1zJSAAAA:8 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=JzwRw_2MAAAA:8 a=IIIIMO1WzoMA:10 a=Q_5l-ThESSo6xtWxTxIA:9 a=ujLsXuiRjwK7CVcR:21 a=rQXDIDA40SY-SDBI:21 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 Cc: arch@freebsd.org, John-Mark Gurney , Bryan Drewery , Ed Schouten X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2014 21:27:36 -0000 On Fri, 21 Feb 2014, Ian Lepore wrote: > On Fri, 2014-02-21 at 10:35 -0800, John-Mark Gurney wrote: >> Ian Lepore wrote this message on Fri, Feb 21, 2014 at 08:46 -0700: >>> >>> All of that seems to assume that every terminal actually being used in >>> the world today is either xterm or something that emulates it. Try >>> using vi on a serial console on an embedded ARM board and you'll get a >>> quick frustrating lesson in how not-xterm a serial console is. I've yet >>> to find a combo of serial comms program and TERM setting that actually >>> works well and lets you edit a file with vi. >> >> Have you used screen? >> >> screen /dev/ttyXXX 9600 >> >> It's pretty much the only serial console program I use because I use >> screen, and remebering how to use tip/cu w/ a new random USB serial >> device is anoying... > > screen is what I finally settled on as the least-horrible option, but it > barely works for anything except scrolling text and typing command > lines. Anything fullscreen works a bit and fails a bit in different > ways with different TERM= values. I used it a bit over 20 years (just for local shells) but was happy to rmrf it. IIRC, it used curses, at least back them, and had slow screen refresh and/or scrolling and display artifacts. (I am sensitive to these and wasn't happy until the average scrolling speed reached a few hundred thousand lines per second (this happens partly virtually in syscons)). Virtual ttys work better for text displays and xterms work better for bitmapped displays. > I've never used cu, forgot it even exists, but several people have > mentioned it, so I'll give it a try. I tend to shy away from > 1980s-vintage tools because they're so... 1980s. (tip, for example, is > just an abomination). tip is too bloated for me, though I sometimes miss its ability to send a line break. I don't know what you are doing to for TERM to not just work. I can barely see the difference between a serial tty login and an ssh login. Serial logins at only 115200 bps are a bit slow, but so are intercontinental ssh's to freefall. Bruce