From owner-svn-src-all@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Mar 22 18:16:39 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: svn-src-all@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D11367C2 for ; Sat, 22 Mar 2014 18:16:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-ig0-f179.google.com (mail-ig0-f179.google.com [209.85.213.179]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 953D68EE for ; Sat, 22 Mar 2014 18:16:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-ig0-f179.google.com with SMTP id t19so4359364igi.0 for ; Sat, 22 Mar 2014 11:16:33 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:content-type:mime-version:subject:from :in-reply-to:date:cc:content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references :to; bh=724Ss+HDYcKE3AVHGJ7IgVRV8+CUN/vTJXwN/++YS6c=; b=g4LpYCNM5g9cSrzuX8b1qTor4bh0rHQIHov38Wbh60vEbvqXEI5V7QORPDGSDrG0Ou Z0K+wv60FlGlBMPteiXMXygQzQ2207VddACkkDWf7Y4THjtPvUYSF7OVH2eo+ksjPRU5 Q1PqBMUjJa18aSVJjls80fDqbvoIwqBNEoJzLx4/EAkxl2w2x1JE+TsY/h9AKMrjbwiv N/Wa5Kr2aPLGtQQmN5p7ME0gYKzLxk8Imc8rOWJvYkuKMHvYLr+kyif7bwuBO4R1pRku wDhwCRgWXwZTexqRFrPFMtBY/Y7DJiyG98khzZfOMtnDPJvbwc3LNMiejd2n2mvR6YRC nx4Q== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQkRpHYkLmZmSuwEIeW0EqyL1ar1pgau52rT29jvwgQQxxYkM7RWr94LZdaxtz45klK2YZrz X-Received: by 10.50.83.38 with SMTP id n6mr3743290igy.30.1395512193288; Sat, 22 Mar 2014 11:16:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from netflix-mac.bsdimp.com (50-78-194-198-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net. [50.78.194.198]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id s9sm11644044igw.16.2014.03.22.11.16.32 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Sat, 22 Mar 2014 11:16:32 -0700 (PDT) Sender: Warner Losh Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.2 \(1874\)) Subject: Re: svn commit: r263424 - head/sys/arm/conf From: Warner Losh In-Reply-To: <20140322180151.GY32089@funkthat.com> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2014 12:16:30 -0600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <201403201701.s2KH1L84024044@svn.freebsd.org> <20140321094316.76ccf459@bender.Home> <1395412070.81853.8.camel@revolution.hippie.lan> <20140321190402.GT32089@funkthat.com> <1395494755.81853.38.camel@revolution.hippie.lan> <20140322180151.GY32089@funkthat.com> To: John-Mark Gurney X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1874) Cc: src-committers@FreeBSD.org, Ian Lepore , svn-src-all@FreeBSD.org, Andrew Turner , svn-src-head@FreeBSD.org, Ruslan Bukin X-BeenThere: svn-src-all@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "SVN commit messages for the entire src tree \(except for " user" and " projects" \)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2014 18:16:39 -0000 On Mar 22, 2014, at 12:01 PM, John-Mark Gurney wrote: > Ian Lepore wrote this message on Sat, Mar 22, 2014 at 07:25 -0600: >> On Fri, 2014-03-21 at 12:04 -0700, John-Mark Gurney wrote: >>> Ian Lepore wrote this message on Fri, Mar 21, 2014 at 08:27 -0600: >>>> On Fri, 2014-03-21 at 09:43 +0000, Andrew Turner wrote: >>>>> On Thu, 20 Mar 2014 17:01:21 +0000 (UTC) >>>>> Ruslan Bukin wrote: >>>>>=20 >>>>>> Author: br >>>>>> Date: Thu Mar 20 17:01:21 2014 >>>>>> New Revision: 263424 >>>>>> URL: http://svnweb.freebsd.org/changeset/base/263424 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> Log: >>>>>> Disable debugging by default. >>>>>=20 >>>>> I don't like this on head. I have found a number of issues that = were >>>>> hidden because the kernel config most people were using for = development >>>>> had WITNESS, INVARIANTS and DIAGNOSTIC disabled. >>>=20 >>> I agree... HEAD needs these to make sure they are production = ready... >>>=20 >>>> I disagree. Witness is essentially useless anymore, because there = are >>>> so many known LORs that nobody cares about when you report them = that all >>>> it does is spews noise. Maybe it's useful when you're looking for = a >>>> particular problem, but leaving it on all the time has just lost = its >>>> value. >>>=20 >>> I wouldn't be tracking down an AVILA bug if it wasn't for = INVARIANTS.. >>>=20 >>> Also, your complaint is solely about WITNESS not the other ones... >>>=20 >>> Considering how many people are writing new drivers for ARM, and = might >>> be introducing locking issues w/ those new drivers, WITNESS should = be >>> included, plus, if you disable INVARIANTS, it means that all the >>> lock assert functions will be turned off, and we might miss an odd >>> calling stack which doesn't hold a lock or something... >>>=20 >>> If you're using HEAD for performance, it's easy to turn these off.. >>>=20 >>=20 >> My complaint is only about witness. >=20 > echo debug.witness.watch=3D0 >> /etc/sysctl.conf >=20 > :) Not as fast as completely turning it off, but almost there.. >=20 >> But... about being easy to turn off... how do they get turned off on >> non-head branches? Does re@ really have to go grovel through 77 = config >> files turning off diagnostic options? Do we have to handle that >> difference when merging things to stable branches? >=20 > Apparently they do: > https://svnweb.freebsd.org/base?view=3Drevision&revision=3D256283 >=20 > Though, handling merging is an issue for all arches... possibly more > anoying for ARM since it's so actively developed... >=20 >> Last time I tried to put something into arm/conf/DEFAULTS I got my = hand >> slapped, but... putting the diagnostic options in there on head and = not >> on stable branches would make the "touch 77 config files" problem go >> away. >=20 > Yes, I agree this is a problem and needs a solution, and I do agree > DEFAULTS would be a resonable place, but since there are others that > feel more strongly about what goes in DEFAULTS, they should speak = about > it.. DEFAULTS is only for mandatory options. WITNESS isn=92t a mandatory = option so it doesn=92t belong there. That was the agreement when we created = DEFAULTS and if we want to have another file that=92s always included, we should = go the std.all route. Or better yet, switch to a system that=92s not so creaky = and cranky that we can more easily expand... Warner=