Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 00:31:56 +0000 From: "Frank Pawlak" <fpawlak@execpc.com> To: malte@webmore.com, Frank Pawlak <fpawlak@execpc.com> Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG, Joao Carlos Mendes Luis <jonny@jonny.eng.br> Subject: Re: Funny, but true... Message-ID: <980616003156.ZM3307@darkstar.connect.com> In-Reply-To: malte@webmore.com "Re: Funny, but true..." (Jun 15, 8:41am) References: <XFMail.980615084102.malte@webmore.com>
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Paradox? Not so sure that it is. They case you make is true. No matter how the questions are answered, if you are an undesirable alien you are either not admitted or kicked out. That is how things should be. In effect we already have more than our quota of naive terrorists. prostitutes, and other assorted criminals without importing any more. The primary function of a central government is to protect its' citizens from those individuals or groups that wish us harm. The end result is that if you are a citizen of a foreign country, and don't belong to any of those classes of people, you are entirely welcome to enter, visit, and enjoy the USA. If you are a person of such stature that has a problem truthfully answering those questions, I'm not so sure that I'd want you here either. Be it paradoxical or not, mission acomplished. Whether or not the State Department is paranoid or not, personally I'd prefer that they were a little paranoid. As I stated, there are citizens of other countries, rightly or wrongly, that don't hold Americans or the USA in high esteem. We really don't need outsiders doing World Trade Center bombings or opening up with an AK47 and hosing the shit out of a bunch innocent civilians just to get their rocks off. Frank On Jun 15, 8:41am, malte@webmore.com wrote: > Subject: Re: Funny, but true... > The whole thing has somewhat of a classical paradoxon. > - Assume you are a person that wants to enter US-territory and > belongs into the class of people that are covered by the > questions (terrorist, prostitute, criminal, ... whatever). > > 1. If you tell the truth when asked this questions, you will be > kicked off and are not allowed to enter US-territory. > So you are forced to lie. > 2. If you lie on the questions, you will be kicked off, when they > find out you did not tell the truth; so you are forced to tell > the truth. > 3. Goto 1. > > Malte. > > On 15-Jun-98 Frank Pawlak wrote: > > On Jun 13, 4:59pm, Joao Carlos Mendes Luis wrote: > >> Subject: Funny, but true... > >> How to get an American Visa ? > >> > >> I noted that american people coming to Brasil do not understand > >> why they must get a visa. The reason is that the brasilian > >> foreign politics is to give foreigners the same treatment brasilians > >> receive in their country. Well, I want to take my vacations at > >> Disneyland (who said I'm too old for that ? :) ), and the United > >> States require a visa for me (Portuguese residing in Brazil) to enter > >> its territory. > >> > >> The most laughable thing is the form I was required to fill. > >> It is composed of some reasonable questions: Name, Address, > >> Documentation, etc., but also has these question (in portuguese, > >> the translation is mine): > >> > >> - Have you ever traded drugs or practiced prostitution ? > >> - Have ever tried to get into USA or help others to get into USA > >> using a false visa, or any other kind of fraud or false > >> information ? > >> - Do you intend to get into USA to practice export control violations, > >> subversive or terrorist activities, or with any ilegal objective ? > >> - Have you ever ordered, incited, helped or in any way practiced > >> persecution of any person because of his race, religion, nationality, > >> or politic beliefs, under the direct or indirect command of the > >> Nazi German Government or any Government allied with it ? > >> - Have you ever participated in a genocide ? > >> - Are you a member or representative of a terrorist organization ? > >> > >> Do these guys really expect some real terrorist or similar to > >> answer yes to any of these questions ??? > >> > >> > > > > Jonny, > > > > I am not an official of the US Government, but I would suspect that the > > answers > > to these questions would enhance the ability to prosecute those that enter > > the > > USA and commit various crimes. It would allow prosecution and deportations > > based on entery under false pretense. That document you have to fill out is > > probable done under oath and is thus a sworn deposition. > > > > Basically it means that your leagal rights while here can depend on how > > truthful the answers to those questions are. > > > > I am aware that Americans, citizens of the USA, are often not well liked by > > citizens of other countries, but, we are not all fools either. So if you > > think > > about the implications of answering those questions falsely, you may get a > > clearer picture of why they are there. > > > > Frank > > > > Jonny > >> > >> -- > >> Joao Carlos Mendes Luis M.Sc. Student > >> jonny@jonny.eng.br Universidade Federal do Rio de Janeiro > >> > >> To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > >> with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message > >>-- End of excerpt from Joao Carlos Mendes Luis > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message > > ---------------------------------- > E-Mail: malte@webmore.com > Date: 15-Jun-98 > Time: 08:23:17 > ---------------------------------- >-- End of excerpt from malte@webmore.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message
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