Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2014 12:39:36 +0400 From: Dmitry Selivanov <sd@rlan.ru> To: "Alexander V. Chernikov" <melifaro@FreeBSD.org> Cc: freebsd-ipfw <freebsd-ipfw@freebsd.org>, "freebsd-net@freebsd.org" <freebsd-net@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: ipfw named objejcts, table values and syntax change Message-ID: <53F45EC8.7030004@rlan.ru> In-Reply-To: <53F38B18.60409@FreeBSD.org> References: <53DC01DE.3000000@FreeBSD.org> <CA%2BhQ2%2BgNjA0rucTYAaPYQKtEMt9GZLC6RCi%2BOgPVRpuDC5Ei7Q@mail.gmail.com> <53DCA25C.1000108@FreeBSD.org> <53DF55FA.8010303@FreeBSD.org> <20140804115817.GA13814@onelab2.iet.unipi.it> <53DFE438.5050209@FreeBSD.org> <53E4BE62.4050303@rlan.ru> <53EE0A30.4020800@FreeBSD.org> <53EE16DE.9020209@rlan.ru> <53EE252D.10109@FreeBSD.org> <53F3563D.6020107@FreeBSD.org> <53F3760E.9070206@rlan.ru> <53F38B18.60409@FreeBSD.org>
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19.08.2014 21:36, Alexander V. Chernikov пишет:
> On 19.08.2014 20:06, Dmitry Selivanov wrote:
>> 19.08.2014 17:50, Alexander V. Chernikov пишет:
>>> On 15.08.2014 19:20, Alexander V. Chernikov wrote:
>>>> On 15.08.2014 18:19, Dmitry Selivanov wrote:
>>>>> 15.08.2014 17:25, Alexander V. Chernikov пишет:
>>>>>> On 08.08.2014 16:11, Dmitry Selivanov wrote:
>>>>>>> 04.08.2014 23:51, Alexander V. Chernikov пишет:
>>>>>>>> On 04.08.2014 15:58, Luigi Rizzo wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 04, 2014 at 01:44:26PM +0400, Alexander V. Chernikov wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On 02.08.2014 12:33, Alexander V. Chernikov wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 02.08.2014 10:33, Luigi Rizzo wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Aug 1, 2014 at 11:08 PM, Alexander V. Chernikov
>>>>>>>>>>>> <melifaro@freebsd.org <mailto:melifaro@freebsd.org>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello all.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm currently working on to enhance ipfw in some areas.
>>>>>>>>>>>> The most notable (and user-visible) change is named table support.
>>>>>>>>>>>> The other one is support for different lookup algorithms for different
>>>>>>>>>>>> key types.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> For example, new ipfw permits writing this:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ipfw table tb1 create type cidr
>>>>>>>>>>>> ipfw add allow ip from table(tl1) to any
>>>>>>>>>>>> ipfw add allow ip from any lookup dst-ip tb1
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ipfw table if1 create type iface
>>>>>>>>>>>> ipfw add skipto tablearg ip from any to any via table(if1)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> or even this:
>>>>>>>>>>>> ipfw table fl1 create type flow:src-ip,proto,dst-ip,dst-port
>>>>>>>>>>>> ipfw table fl1 add 10.0.0.5,tcp,10.0.0.6,80 4444
>>>>>>>>>>>> ipfw add allow ip from any to any flow table(fl1)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> all these changes fully preserve backward compatibility.
>>>>>>>>>>>> (actually tables needs now to be created before use and their type needs
>>>>>>>>>>>> to match with opcode used, but new ipfw(8) performs auto-creation
>>>>>>>>>>>> for cidr tables).
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> There is another thing I'm going to change and I'm not sure I can keep
>>>>>>>>>>>> the same compatibility level.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Table values, from one point of view, can be classified to the following
>>>>>>>>>>>> types:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> - skipto argument
>>>>>>>>>>>> - fwd argument (*)
>>>>>>>>>>>> - link to another object (nat, pipe, queue)
>>>>>>>>>>>> - plain u32 (not bound to any object)
>>>>>>>>>>>> (divert/tee,netgraph,tag/utag,limit)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> There are the following reasons why I think it is necessary to implement
>>>>>>>>>>>> explicit table values typing (like tables):
>>>>>>>>>>>> - Implementing fwd tablearg for IPv6 hosts requires indirection table
>>>>>>>>>>>> - Converting nat/pipe instance ids to names renders values unusable
>>>>>>>>>>>> - retiring old hack with storing saved pointer of found object/rule
>>>>>>>>>>>> inside rule w/o proper locking
>>>>>>>>>>>> - making faster skipto
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ??????i don't buy the idea that you need typed arguments
>>>>>>>>>>>> for all the cases above. Maybe the case that
>>>>>>>>>>>> may make sense is the fwd argument (and in the future
>>>>>>>>>>>> something else).
>>>>>>>>>>>> We already discussed, i think, the fact that now it
>>>>>>>>>>>> is legal to have references to non existing things
>>>>>>>>>>>> (skipto, pipes etc.) implemented as u32.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Removing that would break configurations.
>>>>>>>>>>> It depends on actual implementation. This can be preserved by
>>>>>>>>>>> auto-creating necessary objects in kernel and/or in userspace, so
>>>>>>>>>>> we can (and should) avoid breaking in this particular way.
>>>>>>>>>> Can you please explain your vision on values another time?
>>>>>>>>>> As far as I understand, you're not against it in general, but the
>>>>>>>>>> details matter:
>>>>>>>>>> * IP address can be one of the types (it won't break much, and we can
>>>>>>>>>> simply skip that one for MFC)
>>>>>>>>>> * what about typing for nat/pipes ? we're not going to convert their ids
>>>>>>>>>> to names? (or maybe you can suggest other non-disruptive way?)
>>>>>>>>>> * everything else is type "u32"
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Correct, I am mostly concerned about the details, not on the general concept.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> To summarize the discussion Alexander and I had about converting
>>>>>>>>> identifiers from numbers to arbitrary strings (this is partly related
>>>>>>>>> to the values stored in tables, but I think we should have a coherent
>>>>>>>>> behaviour)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 1. CURRENTLY ipfw uses numeric identifiers in a small range (16 bits or less)
>>>>>>>>> for rules, pipes, queues, tables, probably nat instances.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 2. CURRENTLY, in all the above contexts, it is legal to reference a
>>>>>>>>> non existing object (rule, pipe, table names, etc.),
>>>>>>>>> and the kernel will do something reasonable, namely jump to the
>>>>>>>>> next rule, drop traffic for non existing pipes, and so on.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 3. of course we want to preserve backward compatibility both for
>>>>>>>>> the ioctl interface, and for user configurations.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 4. The in-kernel representation of identifiers is not visible to users,
>>>>>>>>> so we can use a numeric representation in the kernel for identifiers.
>>>>>>>>> Strings like "12345" are converted with atoi() or the like,
>>>>>>>>> whereas for other identifiers or numbers outside of the 2^16 range
>>>>>>>>> the kernel manages a translation table, allocating new numeric
>>>>>>>>> identifiers if a new string appears.
>>>>>>>>> This permits backward compatibility for old rulesets, and does not
>>>>>>>>> impact performance because the translation table is only
>>>>>>>>> used during rules additions or deletion.
>>>>>>>> Yes. However this requires either holding either (1) 2 pointers (old&new
>>>>>>>> arrays), or (2) 65k+ index array, or (3) chained hash table.
>>>>>>>> (1) would require additional pointers for each subsystem (and some
>>>>>>>> additional management),
>>>>>>>> (2) will definitely upset embedded guys and
>>>>>>>> (3) is worse in terms of performance
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> With this in mind, i think we should follow a similar approach for
>>>>>>>>> objects stored in tables, hence
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> if an u32 value was available in the past, it must be
>>>>>>>>> available also in the new implementation.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The issue with tables is that some convoluted configuration could
>>>>>>>>> use the same table to reference pipes _and_ rules _and_ perhaps
>>>>>>>>> other things represented as numbers (the former is not too strange,
>>>>>>>>> if i have a large configuration i might place sections at rules
>>>>>>>>> 12000, 13000, 14000... and associate pipes with the same numberic
>>>>>>>>> identifier to each block of rules).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Typed table values would clearly disturb backward compatibility
>>>>>>>>> in the above configurations. However it should not be difficult
>>>>>>>>> to accept arbitrary strings as the values stored in tables, and
>>>>>>>>> then store multiple representations as appropriate, including:
>>>>>>>> Well, I've thought about thas one. It may be an option, but the details
>>>>>>>> are not so promising (below)
>>>>>>>>> - the string representation, unconditionally
>>>>>>>>> - for names that can be resolved by DNS, the ipv6 and ipv4 address(es)
>>>>>>>>> associated with them. ipfw already translates hostnames in rules
>>>>>>>>> so this is POLA
>>>>>>>> I'm not happy what ipfw(8) is doing instead of translation. The proper
>>>>>>>> way would be not simply using first AF_INET answer but saving ALL
>>>>>>>> IPv4+IPv6 records inside rule (and some more tracking should be done
>>>>>>>> afterwards, but that's totally different story). Additionally, I'm
>>>>>>>> unsure if we really need next-hop value expressed as hostname (how can
>>>>>>>> we deal with multiple addresses and diffrent AFs?). We may store strings
>>>>>>>> (and I think we should do it) but I'm unsure about this particular
>>>>>>>> option of interpreting them.
>>>>>>>>> - for other strings, a u32 from the translation table as previously
>>>>>>>>> indicated
>>>>>>>>> - and for numeric values, the u32 representation (truncated if needed,
>>>>>>>>> according to whatever is the existing behaviour)
>>>>>>>>> - <add other representations if needed>
>>>>>>>>> If we cannot generate an u32 we will put some value (e.g. 0)
>>>>>>>>> that hopefully will not cause confusion.
>>>>>>>> As far as I understand, we accept some string "s" as table value inside
>>>>>>>> the kernel, than, we have some logic that says:
>>>>>>>> oh, dummynet pipe has the same name "s"s, oh, nat entity with name "s"
>>>>>>>> has just been created, let's save indices.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That would require additional indirection table like:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> index | [ skipto idx | nat idx | pipe idx | queue idx | fwd index ]
>>>>>>>> ( so we will have 2-level indirection table for fwd if we do IPv6)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We can optimize this if we use "same name -> same kidx" approach
>>>>>>>> regardless of kernel object we're refering to. That might require some
>>>>>>>> more memory, but that's OK from my point of view.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So we end up with
>>>>>>>> int [ skipto idx | fwd idx | obj idx ]
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> idx "0" is special value which means the same as 2.CURRENT
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That looks better, but still way to complex.
>>>>>>>> I do care about compatibility, but it's hard to improve things without
>>>>>>>> changing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'd like to propose the following:
>>>>>>>> * Split values into 3 types ("ip|nexthop", "number", "object")
>>>>>>>> * Do not insist on object existence, use value "0" to mimic 2.CURRENT
>>>>>>>> behavior.
>>>>>>>> * Retain full compatibility by introducing special value type "legacy"
>>>>>>>> which matches any type and is backed by given indirection table.
>>>>>>>> * Issue warning in ipfw(8) binary on all auto-created tables that
>>>>>>>> auto-creation is legacy and this behavior will be dropped in next major
>>>>>>>> release (e.g. 11.0)
>>>>>>>> * Save this behavior in MFC but drop "legacy" tables in head after a
>>>>>>>> month after actual MFC.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That do you think?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If we do it this way, we should be able to preserve backward
>>>>>>>>> compatibility _and_ add features that people may need.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> cheers
>>>>>>>>> luigi
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Here is my idea: tablearg should contain more than one value. I think getting several values from one table lookup is faster than several table lookups with one value.
>>>>>>> Let tablearg be not just uint32, but array with different value types inside it.
>>>>>> There are some use cases where we might need 2-level value lookup (e.g. algo returning index for index table where actual data reside) and each data item can
>>>>>> really be up to 64-bytes long. The problem is in actual partitioning and compatibility.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For example I have many such rules:
>>>>>>> allow src-ip 1.2.3.4 MAC any 11:22:33:44:55:66 recv vlan1234 dst-ip 1.1.1.1
>>>>>> Sorry, what task are you solving by using given rules?
>>>>> Small ISP, clients have static IP with MAC-authorization. Src iface must be checked to prevent IP-spoofing. Dst-IP sometimes is used for p2p-channels.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> These rules can be replaced with such construction:
>>>>>>> allow src-ip table(1) MAC any tablearg[1] recv tablearg[2] dst-ip tablearg[3]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But I don't think indexing by value is a good idea. I think index==starting byte is a better way:
>>>>>>> allow src-ip table(1) MAC any tablearg:0 recv tablearg:6 dst-ip tablearg:32
>>>>>>> where MAC's 6 bytes are from 0 to 5 in tablearg; iface string is from 6 and till \0, but less than 26 bytes; and IPv4's 4 bytes are from 32 to 35.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So we need to create table for it:
>>>>>>> table 1 set MAC:0 string:6:26 ip:32
>>>>>>> table 1 add 1.2.3.4 11:22:33:44:55:66 vlan1234 1.1.1.1
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> String can be used both for iface and comment.
>>>>>>> Other possible value types:
>>>>>>> uint16 for nat, pipe, skipto and other 2-bytes actions
>>>>>>> IPv4 4 bytes
>>>>>>> CIDRv4 5 bytes
>>>>>>> IPv6 16 bytes
>>>>>>> CIDRv6 17 bytes
>>>>>>> table_id 2 bytes - link to another table
>>>>>> Well, it seems we have enough space to store most of these, however, problems seem to remain the same: typing and compatibility.
>>>>>> When you're creating new table (or it is auto-created) which values types should be assumed ? All of them?
>>>>> Default - as usually uint32.
>>>> I can't see "uint32" value in the list you have specified before. I'll rephrase:
>>>> what value types (from the list above or similar) should ipfw(8) or kernel fill in case of "default" table?
>>>> (And once again, what should we print as value) ?
>>>> Please think about
>>>> a) old ipfw binaries
>>>> b) new ipfw binaries using exactly the same ruleset they are already using (with, for example, both "skipto tablearg" and "fwd tablearg " tables).
>> At that time I meant default table "header" is "ip:0" (in my context). It would be completely compatible with old ipfw tables.
>>
>>> I've increased kernel<>userland 'struct tentry' value field to 64 bytes.
>>> It looks like we were talking about a bit different things.
>>> Let me try to explain the problem I'm stuck with:
>>>
>>> We may take the road you've suggested, it looks OK:
>>>
>>> * by default tables are created with "all-values" mask.
>>> * ipfw(8) value treats default "ipfw table X add Y val" input where value is u32 number as input data for each type specified in all-values without returning error
>>> * for non-default mask value data should be validated.
>>>
>>> e.g. if we have table with valtype="skipto,nat,pipe,ip4,ip6" and "100" as input -> it turns to "100,100,0.0.0.0,::".
>> I don't fully understand. One "100" value for all valtypes? Then "100" can't be equal "0.0.0.0" and "::". Or you meant "100,100,0,0" as input?
> We have to handle the case when user with _unmodified_ scripts tries to use new ipfw (either with new binary or the old one).
> The goal is not to throw error and break everything, of course.
>
How can valtype="skipto,nat,pipe,ip4,ip6" appear in _unmodified_ scripts? I thought default valtype was uint32.
>>
>>> If we have value with valtype="skipto,ip6" and "100" as input -> error while the valid one would be "100,2a01::1:111", for example.
>>>
>>> I'm unsure how should one be able to update _specific_ value (e.g. update nat id or skipto arg), but that's not the problem.
>> Maybe new command would help, like "ipfw table X set Y newval".
>>
>>>
>>> The problem arises if we start talking about using names for nat/pipe/queue ids instead of numbers.
>>> If we have nat instances "nat1", "11" and "23", and one specifies "44" as part of value, logic starts to be complex:
>>>
>>> we either require nat "44" to exists (and I'm unsure if we can auto-create it *) or start doing complex stuff like tracking all those non-existing objects:
>>> e.g. add some special record somewhere that we're wating for nat instance "44" to be created, than auto-update given value with its kernel index,
>>> than, do something reasonable if nat "44" instance is destroyed (OK, nat instance can't be destroyed, but pipe can).
>>> .. and we have to do the same for pipes/queues and any following kernel object.
>>>
>>> Or we have to require user to reference existing objects only (create explicitly before use). This one makes things easier in code, but require user to change their scripts.
>>> It looks like there is no consensus on that point.
>> User can destroy object after table creating. I think this way: "no object - no packet (explicitly deny)". No need to check object existence.
> Yes, but even this behavior has to be supported by kernel:
> Let me explain in more details:
> user calls -> ipfw nat "23" iface ...
> Kernel sees string "23" which is not the name of any existing nat instance, so it creates one and allocates new kernel index for that (let it be 1).
> The same for "nat1" -> 2 and "11" -> 3. Kernel indexes are purely internal and can not be referenced by userland.
>
> So, when you enter "44" inside new value, the following happens:
> 1) some special object binding name "44" and value of record X is created
> 2) nat instance list is searched to see if "44" is and existing name. If entry is found, its kernel index is saved to "value", 0 is saved otherwise.
> 3) If nat entry is destroyed, we have to walk all entries and set their appropriate parts back to 0 (otherwise some other entry may use this index later leading to packes being aliased to another nat
> instance. "show" command would print incorrect values, too).
>
> This can be done (and we have to write code for each type of kernel object, e.g. one for nat, one for pipe/queue, etc..), but require a lot of code which we would have to support forever.
> I'd like an idea to enforce hard bindings (with, maybe, some intermediate period of compatible behavior for MFC).
>
In fact, I haven't ever needed strings instead of IDs. I always use named vars in shell scripts for table/nat/pipe IDs. And I can't advice you with this question.
>>>
>>> * Maybe auto-creation is not so tricky and we should try to evaluate it..
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> What should `ipfw table X list` show as "value" field ?
>>>>> I added table "header" in this line:
>>>>> table 1 set MAC:0 string:6:26 ip:32
>>>> I don't think that user should be able to set any offsets in userland. Exact offsets of variable of given type needs to be enforced by kernel,
>>>> so you may fill that you want "mac" and "ip" as values for given table, but not lengths or offsets.
>> Does your way allow to use strings (e.g. iface or comments)?
> I'm not sure on what you're going to do with interfaces as values.
For rules flexibility. My idea was to extend using of tablearg with additional rule options (dst-ip/src-ip, MAC, recv/xmit/via; maybe dst-port/src-port, fib and other options with number/string
parameters).
As for iface, I explained above this rule: allow src-ip table(1) MAC any tablearg[1] recv tablearg[2], where MAC is checked for authorization and iface for antispoof.
> Comments - per value or per table entry? I can think of it, but probably not all algorithms will support that functionality.
Comment per table entry initially. But it would be worth to be implemented only if iface valtype was implemented (I think both of them can be string).
Even more, we can use such valtype (in your form): skipto,nat,comment,pipe,ip4,ip6,comment,ip4 - I think nothing prevents use more than one value with the same type. I understand that my example is
very unreal, but it's example only.
>>
>>>>> So `ipfw table X list` should show something like this:
>>>>> ---table(0)---
>>>>> 1.2.3.4/32 11:22:33:44:55:66 vlan1234 1.1.1.1
>>>>> We can also add "header" description in output (with or without additional parameter - depends on compatibility needs) like this:
>>>>> ---table(0)--- addr MAC iface IPv4
>>>>>> How should ipfw(8) treat "add 1.1.1.1 0" input?
>>>>> It should look at table "header" and return error message like "Value doesn't match table header"
>>>>
>>>>>> What will happen if we want to add another type field to this list? (MAC address of Infiniband MAC address, for example).
>>>>> I don't think there is a sense to mix both MAC[6] and MAC[20] values in 1 table. It is easier to create 2 tables with different "headers".
>>>>> For Infiniband we can add another type: MAC20 (or something like this). Or we can use "MAC"-type like string type(see above): MAC:6:25 (1st and last bytes, or 1st and length).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Table value length can be set for example with loader tunable like net.inet.ip.fw.table_value_length.
>>>>>>> Even with default uint32 value length we can get 2 uint16 values or 4 uint8 values, this can help in some configurations.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This way is more complex, but much more flexible. It's like netgraph subsystem.
>>>>>>> I think it suites both Alexander and Luigi requests.
>>>>>>>
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