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[93.72.151.96]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id w11sm2882599lfe.32.2019.05.28.05.52.11 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 28 May 2019 05:52:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: Amazon AMIs To: Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>, Matthew Seaman <matthew@freebsd.org> Cc: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" <freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org>, Colin Percival <cperciva@freebsd.org>, Alex Dupre <ale@freebsd.org>, Jonathan Anderson <jonathan@freebsd.org> References: <f002c020-1e63-c12f-456e-e20f8546a701@FreeBSD.org> <8a139c9c-b98b-4a54-1d7c-0ea1e3dc7a72@freebsd.org> <53a0bd68-a6ba-e8ad-4af2-abeb22e92c03@FreeBSD.org> <E396A0C7-F939-48A1-9B57-D643806B303B@FreeBSD.org> <f51b836f-6a40-9be3-425a-e1afd301507b@FreeBSD.org> <CANCZdfp0ZWe11jXw_xnPi8G2QhyEeBTOcN_ks=sqJCqDjDYcQg@mail.gmail.com> From: Andriy Gapon <avg@FreeBSD.org> Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=avg@FreeBSD.org; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= xsFNBFm4LIgBEADNB/3lT7f15UKeQ52xCFQx/GqHkSxEdVyLFZTmY3KyNPQGBtyvVyBfprJ7 mAeXZWfhat6cKNRAGZcL5EmewdQuUfQfBdYmKjbw3a9GFDsDNuhDA2QwFt8BmkiVMRYyvI7l N0eVzszWCUgdc3qqM6qqcgBaqsVmJluwpvwp4ZBXmch5BgDDDb1MPO8AZ2QZfIQmplkj8Y6Z AiNMknkmgaekIINSJX8IzRzKD5WwMsin70psE8dpL/iBsA2cpJGzWMObVTtCxeDKlBCNqM1i gTXta1ukdUT7JgLEFZk9ceYQQMJJtUwzWu1UHfZn0Fs29HTqawfWPSZVbulbrnu5q55R4PlQ /xURkWQUTyDpqUvb4JK371zhepXiXDwrrpnyyZABm3SFLkk2bHlheeKU6Yql4pcmSVym1AS4 dV8y0oHAfdlSCF6tpOPf2+K9nW1CFA8b/tw4oJBTtfZ1kxXOMdyZU5fiG7xb1qDgpQKgHUX8 7Rd2T1UVLVeuhYlXNw2F+a2ucY+cMoqz3LtpksUiBppJhw099gEXehcN2JbUZ2TueJdt1FdS ztnZmsHUXLxrRBtGwqnFL7GSd6snpGIKuuL305iaOGODbb9c7ne1JqBbkw1wh8ci6vvwGlzx rexzimRaBzJxlkjNfMx8WpCvYebGMydNoeEtkWldtjTNVsUAtQARAQABzR5BbmRyaXkgR2Fw b24gPGF2Z0BGcmVlQlNELm9yZz7CwZQEEwEIAD4WIQS+LEO7ngQnXA4Bjr538m7TUc1yjwUC WbgsiAIbIwUJBaOagAULCQgHAgYVCAkKCwIEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAAKCRB38m7TUc1yj+JAEACV l9AK/nOWAt/9cufV2fRj0hdOqB1aCshtSrwHk/exXsDa4/FkmegxXQGY+3GWX3deIyesbVRL rYdtdK0dqJyT1SBqXK1h3/at9rxr9GQA6KWOxTjUFURsU7ok/6SIlm8uLRPNKO+yq0GDjgaO LzN+xykuBA0FlhQAXJnpZLcVfPJdWv7sSHGedL5ln8P8rxR+XnmsA5TUaaPcbhTB+mG+iKFj GghASDSfGqLWFPBlX/fpXikBDZ1gvOr8nyMY9nXhgfXpq3B6QCRYKPy58ChrZ5weeJZ29b7/ QdEO8NFNWHjSD9meiLdWQaqo9Y7uUxN3wySc/YUZxtS0bhAd8zJdNPsJYG8sXgKjeBQMVGuT eCAJFEYJqbwWvIXMfVWop4+O4xB+z2YE3jAbG/9tB/GSnQdVSj3G8MS80iLS58frnt+RSEw/ psahrfh0dh6SFHttE049xYiC+cM8J27Aaf0i9RflyITq57NuJm+AHJoU9SQUkIF0nc6lfA+o JRiyRlHZHKoRQkIg4aiKaZSWjQYRl5Txl0IZUP1dSWMX4s3XTMurC/pnja45dge/4ESOtJ9R 8XuIWg45Oq6MeIWdjKddGhRj3OohsltKgkEU3eLKYtB6qRTQypHHUawCXz88uYt5e3w4V16H lCpSTZV/EVHnNe45FVBlvK7k7HFfDDkryM7BTQRZuCyIARAAlq0slcsVboY/+IUJdcbEiJRW be9HKVz4SUchq0z9MZPX/0dcnvz/gkyYA+OuM78dNS7Mbby5dTvOqfpLJfCuhaNYOhlE0wY+ 1T6Tf1f4c/uA3U/YiadukQ3+6TJuYGAdRZD5EqYFIkreARTVWg87N9g0fT9BEqLw9lJtEGDY EWUE7L++B8o4uu3LQFEYxcrb4K/WKmgtmFcm77s0IKDrfcX4doV92QTIpLiRxcOmCC/OCYuO jB1oaaqXQzZrCutXRK0L5XN1Y1PYjIrEzHMIXmCDlLYnpFkK+itlXwlE2ZQxkfMruCWdQXye syl2fynAe8hvp7Mms9qU2r2K9EcJiR5N1t1C2/kTKNUhcRv7Yd/vwusK7BqJbhlng5ZgRx0m WxdntU/JLEntz3QBsBsWM9Y9wf2V4tLv6/DuDBta781RsCB/UrU2zNuOEkSixlUiHxw1dccI 6CVlaWkkJBxmHX22GdDFrcjvwMNIbbyfQLuBq6IOh8nvu9vuItup7qemDG3Ms6TVwA7BD3j+ 3fGprtyW8Fd/RR2bW2+LWkMrqHffAr6Y6V3h5kd2G9Q8ZWpEJk+LG6Mk3fhZhmCnHhDu6CwN MeUvxXDVO+fqc3JjFm5OxhmfVeJKrbCEUJyM8ESWLoNHLqjywdZga4Q7P12g8DUQ1mRxYg/L HgZY3zfKOqcAEQEAAcLBfAQYAQgAJhYhBL4sQ7ueBCdcDgGOvnfybtNRzXKPBQJZuCyIAhsM BQkFo5qAAAoJEHfybtNRzXKPBVwQAKfFy9P7N3OsLDMB56A4Kf+ZT+d5cIx0Yiaf4n6w7m3i ImHHHk9FIetI4Xe54a2IXh4Bq5UkAGY0667eIs+Z1Ea6I2i27Sdo7DxGwq09Qnm/Y65ADvXs 3aBvokCcm7FsM1wky395m8xUos1681oV5oxgqeRI8/76qy0hD9WR65UW+HQgZRIcIjSel9vR XDaD2HLGPTTGr7u4v00UeTMs6qvPsa2PJagogrKY8RXdFtXvweQFz78NbXhluwix2Tb9ETPk LIpDrtzV73CaE2aqBG/KrboXT2C67BgFtnk7T7Y7iKq4/XvEdDWscz2wws91BOXuMMd4c/c4 OmGW9m3RBLufFrOag1q5yUS9QbFfyqL6dftJP3Zq/xe+mr7sbWbhPVCQFrH3r26mpmy841ym dwQnNcsbIGiBASBSKksOvIDYKa2Wy8htPmWFTEOPRpFXdGQ27awcjjnB42nngyCK5ukZDHi6 w0qK5DNQQCkiweevCIC6wc3p67jl1EMFY5+z+zdTPb3h7LeVnGqW0qBQl99vVFgzLxchKcl0 R/paSFgwqXCZhAKMuUHncJuynDOP7z5LirUeFI8qsBAJi1rXpQoLJTVcW72swZ42IdPiboqx NbTMiNOiE36GqMcTPfKylCbF45JNX4nF9ElM0E+Y8gi4cizJYBRr2FBJgay0b9Cp Message-ID: <74ed9ad5-58d9-db02-2e20-b053ba5eeb87@FreeBSD.org> Date: Tue, 28 May 2019 15:52:11 +0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <CANCZdfp0ZWe11jXw_xnPi8G2QhyEeBTOcN_ks=sqJCqDjDYcQg@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 46BA877B34 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of agapon@gmail.com designates 209.85.167.68 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=agapon@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.09 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.93)[-0.931,0]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[avg@FreeBSD.org,agapon@gmail.com]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[avg@FreeBSD.org,agapon@gmail.com]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[FreeBSD.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[68.167.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(-1.15)[ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-3.39), asn: 15169(-2.28), country: US(-0.06)]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[68.167.85.209.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD <freebsd-hackers.freebsd.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/options/freebsd-hackers>, <mailto:freebsd-hackers-request@freebsd.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-hackers/> List-Post: <mailto:freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org> List-Help: <mailto:freebsd-hackers-request@freebsd.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers>, <mailto:freebsd-hackers-request@freebsd.org?subject=subscribe> X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 May 2019 12:52:17 -0000 On 21/02/2019 18:17, Warner Losh wrote: > On Thu, Feb 21, 2019 at 1:02 AM Matthew Seaman <matthew@freebsd.org> wrote: > >> On 20/02/2019 22:32, Jonathan Anderson wrote: >>> On 20 Feb 2019, at 18:50, Alex Dupre wrote: >>> >>>> Colin Percival wrote: >>>>> Last time I looked at this, we weren't handling hotplug/hotunplug of >>>>> "NVMe" >>>>> disks properly on the m5/c5/etc. instances. I opted to recommend the >>>>> instance >>>>> which completely works rather than the one with slightly better >>>>> performance... >>>> >>>> It does happen only on a few instances, but I get some freezes on new t3 >>>> machines: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=235856 >>>> >>>> They are indeed cheaper and more performant, but not 100% reliable in >>>> every workload. >>> >>> https://www.xkcd.com/937 ? >>> >> >> Yes, indeed. That's a very good reason not to recommend the newest and >> shiniest. I haven't seen any problems so far, but then again it's only >> been a day or so and we haven't got into the full testing regime quite >> yet. I'll let you know if we do run into problems. >> >> Is there work on hot-plug NVMe going on? ISTR jmg@ mentioning hotplug >> PCI at the dev summit at Stockholm EuroBSDCon, but not much since then. >> > > It's hot-unplug that doesn't work quite right. Hotplug works, I believe, if > you have PCI_HP in your kernel, I believe. > > What's needed is about a solid week of cleanup and testing in this area, > however. I am not sure about the context of the latest question... whether it was about NVMe hot-plug on real modern hardware or whether it was still about AWS. In the latter case, as Colin pointed out earlier[*], PCI_HP would not help at all, because the emulated bridge is not a PCIe bridge. It seems that they use a mechanism based on an older specification, PCI Standard Hot-Plug Controller and Subsystem Specification. I believe that FreeBSD never implemented it. [*] http://www.daemonology.net/blog/2017-11-17-FreeBSD-EC2-C5-instances.html -- Andriy Gapon