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[64.223.192.211]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id af79cd13be357-7e67f75596dsm881228585a.76.2025.08.06.15.21.35 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 06 Aug 2025 15:21:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <0124906a-a19e-4068-a198-bea029810ea3@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2025 18:21:34 -0400 List-Id: Packaging the FreeBSD base system List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-pkgbase List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-pkgbase@FreeBSD.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: PKGBASE Removes FreeBSD Base System Feature To: "FreeBSD-pkgbase@freebsd.org" Cc: vermaden References: <7E69E694-963C-4D69-B5B5-891330FF16A2@submonkey.net> Content-Language: en-US From: Darren Henderson Autocrypt: addr=darren.henderson@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBFiou5oBEACruBRieOQ4IDz0ybQeHm+GSA04ckSsHsFsC5fIEMJiRf5hW5XQ8aMU78VX Khp9MFB769a2K5oz45vlfnhRYZQ/jK5ABq7yC3IzzyLhknYXtAPnCBjvHMa811O0/ZHwVWSk JPOZxDTFJzFd+SNeHVXz03M6UfEJ963hj78oF3bcR8ou3+GScGcSGeHdf1UYsPDOus1uUIo4 8pjIp0P9mCy+OffUIGm06lQCeq/w0YTXJ1V4wBBm83J5Lbdrwzb1KUHJqCs/QovpduIgjav0 bwPQjqzNi20tVlZwwnQasJ06anWQGC/pQSxwC8/EjeM8xtun0pXmCcEaVZf5Cul26p9dMe5W WNzi+5edIirXvdnFscoROiT7QPU5IRj+Mvq2oOQ0tN4gnAnlhInS31yilcpP6RelA1de+1Wk JsIJ8dgG0pmEYyMNByrumulQ2zZ8yAvN8LYiVD5WVfrEsnrUvifMi0/kBAJmBvQNtNk62hP9 O0jIfnERtcnzAdNZbCIR8C42ZbJ50vZhUkWrvmYja6pDeFync4jd9c/RT8to6AgK4NbMN9K+ Rkp85v5PTeIdjfRTjFXOV0HDGi/SmyfgXSpfGsTkAzZvZO+3TacAc3yWnBVL7zXdgq3dIgII tShoKronNeFj9Qzygsvo0NF3l6nadS391eDP9SQK29Ry8OTZIwARAQABzS1EYXJyZW4gSGVu ZGVyc29uIDxkYXJyZW4uaGVuZGVyc29uQGdtYWlsLmNvbT7CwY4EEwEIADgWIQRRbTdstlJ2 L0k6UCPYhvzxDD9nTQUCWKi7mgIbAwULCQgHAgYVCAkKCwIEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAAKCRDYhvzx DD9nTZXYD/4h/rE+qayd/3NHHDdhOt4IKb+a+/xrIdLoG+0S1fWslHYxdej9hBH9ISBEGxfQ 1Wo6FMnvTYufQHYfFdJKVXky7z4SsEsiO1pRP/v9BNHD264YHHd9zuG+j4SGWFJKnj76PX8o KoeIsgYXzvf/5qo+/vIX8Qrm73VTOQ9jCucXehIIjfTagis1PDn12jTKWlEV664ErUgG3KY2 Ljq0039HW1ThkY10VQtkWcQ9jqLipbYpnrL11eisC5FwMh0NHy/gi0dwlG1HikzUFkRfnYfT GbWhECGttYhgyBYjjZLyJc4YAYTynls5NfuYHQGGQKp05laUnYzf6WLHxPb8IsMrUzOLzXRd DOZmpk20q+4qz9ZLQsqs0LqfVer7bj9RldfqvfJJgcKsJ22hAdCF62K+bjykbXP1VC7KlYcP irNsPraHH5HPHeO3qm7vZ5JpXmqcrmsaCtpj2e8qNbt8GnbfkIf/ysGqcH0IOPtgO7AewLVd tO1BcXr5fPaznY5RXLJUerMBTaFma7nkAsAdvyi4yp2D5YZvZ7jvoNj/uP2597Lx+Lm8p/Hw L/D3m+BP79oBwUj+Eh3VRBAJn0DkBxuxHQzqdrBCslpRzQT7GkDML3KpEHN3PJR9r+1+0exD hES3YcgMrvnwMcXYgh5lCKXK7MvLFxS1EfmBkxMaBlmvZc7BTQRYqLuaARAA5Yjyml76KUkN iitvqPohdIOkFsYuT0cM6UTFSXGIPzlaBMs7LMYdCAZhtiKHSsuWlWrbdhuFZEyXMJYzBXOH hfs4nDa98UGfnsXJXsq5LVVr3E4Jjm0ZsAO7yHbzUcn/zLhZGIQTV8EgY2yXSOMQVp98y9gA AHT10gOemlVD/KW3xOAJFFWUYrYePeyu89D4LWWjrJjF4Xn0Pj+1gprT6mgiWDXTja526ify mgx0BSZo8dO37hacbRPHPIePU50+vfdBPkaAL3u7+sxf/44IfhLGoQrWfCD0+6YhwPmMzVGG q9oldrbXH8wKhRjfR4V3C+S7Eu6JCMsK90g46Oag3uYERGR01x5hiSlWdZefYgM0aGtOUQSQ 9AFrvoUTP7MpT60ETToO4cqC4VNeTYM+yGXlGS6FqfykrR/cOMVYbaKwF6jLOpsZiocqHP4f mKWeLhTVkvlb/8vSN5fFGn03eKEMY2AwFZp//wUrT0Jm/ftFSRySJQDOUphZtUTUtuEXfeXF R4r/bRJdRNTClpjVkCDQJQ7BHZqYJYyIpxPFC+ldO/QiqCEkKTzGswMUzfe7rT/NvFUy1bPF +bMfRi1sHzl5ZwYEI2HfdXElTPAgvoVrXGPeeYwqPb7OCgvp68tSwHvOaYWzjcYAq/+5NgAE VvJtqOnb2Ik5AIH5ji828asAEQEAAcLBdgQYAQgAIBYhBFFtN2y2UnYvSTpQI9iG/PEMP2dN BQJYqLuaAhsMAAoJENiG/PEMP2dNcTAP/i1x1jl3pOhoHnEI3gA5EXpF+e2AefL3KRPDgVwE C1LdLBNLHIZW/0HuL/tikbyzgQE8MA/GciwwMn35aM2tzWQbeYo587kN3HXi4mZ8t8+PnwwG gt1L21d0RRdxSABWcDQBYE+2/Cxa8MW5ifDRKJJc6hmLXGWQ/b3jQ20Z20PTgQsmRg1kJ7Sa rn+HZYGNQrAyTcwC3EDtNDTccJE4fX9jM18jU9DQPGlmutloP9HJXc8SHFcnjb82XZ4zPZ1X vGoOgs9pCyKRDIFkXEGsghbTN6LPEThQK+UTV+tJ/e/9PSTqFxDCTLGTiqkIbFHB3icmdnGp 4wRWa/pitHAcEiiYwUKnXHsdIosW9rmK/ZKUh0b6v+GmJQMga0tJsZxpcWS9FUZxhDs/0Hdz bVOe/e4ae4xpHA3wndUcDtzGywoSxEeAYx0eS+3+cVwM6JIXP6yy5d6hZ/K8ipr3adQ46/3r E3hQG4CxHTiR2Rd80A8gpyXL15fL+dNfd0On2QfNT8ztu2zYlbp1MbsGkYWKX+Kfa8c2XZ/h E0B1YVch2oSLiBm9FcBHkpxmUkmyY2XxElZiqXDmGi7KSiJtm7LONFePRoQhQKrAN8uZyFt7 NHOQiI3XcTLWXt6wqbzuKxIl+FW90JOE4FzJQiR9Hjj3gpVmobsdb3fTiAYGNByygDSK In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4by4X60Gd9z3SLL X-Spamd-Bar: ---- X-Rspamd-Pre-Result: action=no action; module=replies; Message is reply to one we originated X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US] On 8/6/2025 1:40 PM, vermaden wrote: >> Because that’s what you asked for. >> Why would the command do anything other than that? >> If it did not, what command should and would you oppose it existing? > The problem is that the same 'pkg delete -af' command - will behave DIFFERENTLY with PKGBASE and without PKGBASE on the same FreeBSD version system - that is the center of the problem. > > Everyone that use FreeBSD got used to the fact that pkg(8) command maintains only third party packages and Base System is untouched. With current state of PKGBASE FreeBSD is no different then a Linux distribution with yum/dnf/apt package manager - the Base System 'security' is broken The suggestion re the addition of "pkgbase" command, using its own configuration files, is the best, most straightforward,  fix for those of us who have qualms with the current implementation. The back-end stuff doesn't really need to change as far as I can see. But keeping the base separated is paramount. If for some reason that is beyond the pale, another solution would be to add a new directive to the repository configuration syntax that allows us to exclude a given repo from the pkg default actions. Something like 'OnlyWhenSpecified: "yes"' or 'ExcludeFromDefaults: "yes"'. Terrible names but I expect something better could be found. The effect should be that the given repo is only operated on when the -R argument calls for the associated repo directly.  So "pkg upgrade" would operate on all repos except the repos that have that setting.  Think of it as an 'ENABLED' but with restrictions. The exclusion should be the default for the config that's being tagged as FreeBSD-base.