From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jul 21 01:29:00 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7615A247 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 2014 01:29:00 +0000 (UTC) Received: from zoom.lafn.org (zoom.lafn.org [108.92.93.123]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D2C821C9 for ; Mon, 21 Jul 2014 01:28:59 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [10.0.1.2] (static-71-177-216-148.lsanca.fios.verizon.net [71.177.216.148]) (authenticated bits=0) by zoom.lafn.org (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id s6L1SuQR032899 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Sun, 20 Jul 2014 18:28:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bc979@lafn.org) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.6 \(1510\)) Subject: Re: Freebsd-update to 9.3 from 9.2 From: Doug Hardie In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2014 18:28:55 -0700 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <4CA0146F-BD4E-4613-9050-DB0C1FDB7EA4@lafn.org> <53C8B7A2.1060504@my.hennepintech.edu> <494D0D9E-ED60-4187-ABCF-8E18CDEAB911@lafn.org> <53C8E2A7.6000000@my.hennepintech.edu> <7154054C-47D0-454C-8601-3F17095476EC@lafn.org> <066C2341-F26F-4817-B681-97119FB7EB7C@lafn.org> <0A5E66FF-D8B0-4619-91AC-C99BC2AEA04D@lafn.org> <0501F769-338A-4B23-AC7B-DBFC55C9387E@lafn.org> To: Warren Block X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1510) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.98 at zoom.lafn.org X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Andrew Berg , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2014 01:29:00 -0000 On 20 July 2014, at 17:54, Warren Block wrote: > On Sun, 20 Jul 2014, Doug Hardie wrote: >=20 >>> Is there anything else we can do to help make it more clear? I = don't mean to put you on the spot, just that I've found these types of = problems often can be used to make valuable improvements in the = documentation. If you think of somewhere else it should be mentioned, = or a better way to explain it, please let me or the freebsd-doc mailing = list know. >>>=20 >>=20 >> I would appreciate either examples or instructions with examples on = how to setup and properly update a system using svn. Those are the most = common things admins do if they are not involved in the development of = FreeBSD. There used to be some good info on that in the handbook back = when we used cvsup. Think more tutorial and less man page constructs. = If I knew enough about the process, I'd try writing it, but so far most = of the things I have tried have not worked. Only one of the several = systems I have tried to update to use svn and pkg still works. >=20 > pkg is not involved. I don't use binary packages, so someone else can = address that. >=20 > The problem with exact Subversion examples is there are numerous = repositories and mirrors, so it's a factorial combination. And we (or = at least, I) have found that giving specific examples means people will = use those examples verbatim, even if there is a warning not to do so. >=20 > So, keeping that in mind... >=20 > Check out source for 10-stable from the western US mirror, first time > only: >=20 > # rm -rf /usr/src > # svn checkout https://svn0.us-west.freebsd.org/base/stable/10 >=20 > The first time, Subversion will ask to accept a security certificate > fingerprint. These are shown in the Handbook Subversion appendix. >=20 > To update that source later: > # svn up /usr/src >=20 > That's it. The process for ports is identical, just a different = repository: >=20 > # rm -rf /usr/ports > # svn checkout https://svn0.us-west.freebsd.org/ports/head /usr/ports >=20 > And then update periodically: > # svn up /usr/ports >=20 >=20 > The desire to avoid that repetition is why there is a generic = Subversion appendix in the Handbook. Still, we have a lot of repetition = of Subversion instructions elsewhere. There's a section in the = Handbook. There's another in the Committer's Guide. There's another in = the FDP Primer. Hence my idea to factor all that out and make our own = Subversion for FreeBSD book. My outline for it already has separate = sections for end-user usage for ports, source, and docs. However, it is = one of many projects on the list. >=20 I brought up pkg because both it and svn were introduced at about the = same time. Thus completely breaking the model we have used for = maintaining systems for over 10 years. Its been a bit difficult. On the documentation, the above appears fine. I would include examples = on how to upgrade OS to new version. I don't think I would remember the = commands I used earlier, especially as I try to keep upgrades to once a = year. System downtime is a real hassle for my users. I would not = recommend putting that in a separate document though. The handbook = should have it all. I have never heard of the Committer's Guide or the = FDP Primer. I've never seen a reference to them before and sure would = not have check there.