From owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Fri Aug 24 22:23:54 2018 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 460221095839 for ; Fri, 24 Aug 2018 22:23:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-it0-x236.google.com (mail-it0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CD78F799DA for ; Fri, 24 Aug 2018 22:23:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-it0-x236.google.com with SMTP id t69-v6so3814587itb.4 for ; Fri, 24 Aug 2018 15:23:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=vKhoMMpGKE9lNkEItER0HyK1G0fm5LHWkB+cZdxBBUs=; b=Tm46sNEzvv5fEwL4c6caaep9rf4komRDgJOlhLCHUYLUI3oydkuQzfa7rDDmazJqWg V1UVx89S1oMdY4yRBenZxow+z/v+ZA8A4PJ3VnLYa643nNZdtcnVD6OCKccFf9oKvMGY s8H9WMTlvqij6a4el6Lztp3WEPdFQHts3nY/rq5i5RcK2Ly9prx6XzYaWFKmF+CqfrX6 6yasvxAmuP4vXgeK2YBcCzPK7eb6G/xsfMarngdNVAvjwHEFzrdKMaE4m7kH3MRIsGmX 0ZCkuMZHTScu+Utw7HuzwlnxQ1K7UN7L/1OGGCMkDyVqxBnaULitXsjO0BKNgkZV00vR 1DWQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=vKhoMMpGKE9lNkEItER0HyK1G0fm5LHWkB+cZdxBBUs=; b=AiBDnuyzBLWQRAXHOIle9m+FjnphM0xJEWDUjWaV/Eyw2mX6KUV64fByuMqlPgv/UU qSHaB/rakZHqcRb+WQuDf/IivnAMFxSEGWKtSc7aDFPrblLIXt/DX6Yn82+bM90WZvPD 2dZLD9lLjJJ8SS/2B21rrIV6yBEXiRsdDLOUIE7Wuwv6WcOZchIv7hysQFSpQjUDA1gS mLezm6UbIu1BmD1Ps1UiaRZp5tHPVtN+Ay1PUsU2Ba3HuwBOF1ul2pnMDZy37ifNHBNJ xbihDqeA8wzJR+WOiWT8+U49WsUFDBWNWIikaBeJOMbDpTQJasq6zJLXwjSnE+8nvT8w fBaA== X-Gm-Message-State: APzg51AjkzDgbXTfPNTjsqJMWHJT/b6gIhwTg+eKP8uXIO9/to+xd1o8 hlZ1SKcn9EoBlHjNyBAyodORdOtIT218z1N+zT8JbQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ANB0VdbnUnvi0MSDZK960yxVFVElo8m4610NAnX4JYKUE1k0KKi+Li9uE6v1j75lxEeQP0njDFIye+bdcc+ZQgBpKHQ= X-Received: by 2002:a24:9197:: with SMTP id i145-v6mr2762608ite.39.1535149432879; Fri, 24 Aug 2018 15:23:52 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20180824215302.ivfna55jtrtc5trg@freebsd480.station> In-Reply-To: From: Warner Losh Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2018 16:23:42 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: drm / drm2 removal in 12 To: Matt Macy Cc: aliovx@gmail.com, FreeBSD Current , FreeBSD-STABLE Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.27 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.27 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2018 22:23:54 -0000 On Fri, Aug 24, 2018 at 4:20 PM Matthew Macy wrote: > On Fri, Aug 24, 2018 at 14:53 Ali wrote: > > > On Tue, Aug 21, 2018 at 06:54:54PM -0700, Matthew Macy wrote: > > > Just in case anyone misses the change to UPDATING: > > > > > > 20180821: > > > drm and drm2 have been removed. Users on powerpc, 32-bit > > hardware, > > > or with GPUs predating Radeon and i915 will need to install t= he > > > graphics/drm-legacy-kmod. All other users should be able to u= se > > > one of the LinuxKPI-based ports: graphics/drm-stable-kmod, > > > graphics/drm-next-kmod, graphics/drm-devel-kmod. > > > Note that this applies only to 12. > > > > I see that The removal of drm and drm2 has been reverted on svn. Could > > you please kindly share the reasons behind the re-inclusion? > > > > > I can=E2=80=99t really give the blow by blow of internal project drama, b= ut the > gist of it is that =E2=80=9Cbest practices=E2=80=9D (which are not yet ac= tually documented > anywhere that I=E2=80=99ve seen) were not followed with regards to the de= precation > process. Warner and others believe that we can address the objectives of > the drm removal (improving the user experience and communicating that > drm/drm2 are _completely_ unsupported apart from continuing to compile) > through less disruptive means. > Just so. Our only continued frustration is that we were never given any guidance by > RE or core on said =E2=80=9Cbest practices=E2=80=9D when the discussion w= as taking place in > May and then those groups behaved as if this were a surprise when the > removal happened. I=E2=80=99m cautiously optimistic that this well expedi= te > improving communications on those matters. > All the problems that are exposed by this aren't technical. This one is social, but no less important. Warner