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Date:      Wed, 31 Jul 2002 13:01:11 +0930
From:      Greg 'groggy' Lehey <grog@lemis.com>
To:        Jud <jud@myrealbox.com>
Cc:        Hostmaster@Video2Video.Com, mwvw@adelphia.net, FreeBSD-Questions@FreeBSD.Org
Subject:   Re: What do we need in a FreeBSD desktop? (was: Peter heads back to M$FT WinBloze [support groups])
Message-ID:  <20020731033111.GK17787@wantadilla.lemis.com>
In-Reply-To: <20020729215629.435b4356.jud@myrealbox.com>
References:  <00d301c23504$9bbe0c60$0a01a8c0@mswolf> <20020726210341.N20468-100000@earl-grey.cloud9.net> <20020728023016.GA51076@wantadilla.lemis.com> <20020729215629.435b4356.jud@myrealbox.com>

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[Format recovered--see http://www.lemis.com/email/email-format.html]

Incorrect quoting.

On Monday, 29 July 2002 at 21:56:29 -0400, Jud wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Jul 2002 12:00:16 +0930
> Greg 'groggy' Lehey <grog@lemis.com> wrote:
>
> [snip]
>> So what's in instant-workstation?  Currently I have:
>>
>> 	acroread
>> 	bash
>> 	cdrecord
>> 	dos2unix
>> 	emacs
>> 	fetchmail
>> 	gs
>> 	grip
>> 	gimp
>> 	gv
>> 	gpg
>> 	ispell
>> 	startkde
>> 	mkisofs
>> 	...
>> 	mutt
>> 	netscape
>>
>> My questions to you: is there anything missing?  Has anybody
>> tried instant-workstation?  I'd be interested in suggestions
>> about how to improve it.
>
> I haven't tried instant-workstation, so of course I'll rush in
> where angels fear to tread.
>
> One of the instant-workstation ports I have not tried is mutt,
> though I've read much praise for it and no negatives that I can
> recall.

It's not perfect.  It does strange things on the screen.

> I wonder, though, whether a gui mail application might be a good
> choice for this "target market," in addition to, instead of, or as
> another choice besides mutt.  Sylpheed happens to be the one I
> prefer, and it seems to be well liked by many other users.  Speaking
> as someone who didn't know a thing about Unix a couple of years ago
> (and hasn't improved on the situation all that much since:), it was
> very easy to learn.

That's a good point.  I've added sylpheed to the list.

> Another place where options might be appreciated is browsers -
> perhaps Galeon, Opera, Mozilla?  And Lynx I think is excellent for
> getting around on the Net at times when one doesn't want to or can't
> be in X.

See http://ezine.daemonnews.org/200208/ports.html when it appears in a
couple of days' time.  Basically, I can't find one good browser, but
with a combination, I can do most things.

> Perhaps that's taken care of by w3m (I don't remember ATM whether
> that's part of the default emacs install)?  That brings me to my
> last and likely most controversial thought.  Emacs does everything
> but bake blueberry muffins, but it might be more intimidating (or
> puzzling - took me awhile just to understand what "M-x" meant) than
> useful to someone fairly new to Unix.  It does take a while to build
> and install (and download, for those of us on dial-ups).  And the
> configuration options! - not exactly 'instant.'  If it's part of the
> install, it seems to me users will try it, and may wind up thinking
> "Jeez, this stuff is hard" as a first impression of FreeBSD.

Well, Emacs is still basically an editor.  For all the complexity,
it's the only one I can put complete beginners in front of and have
them be able to use it.  But it's not a browser.  The
instant-workstation had Netscape, and it has Konqueror from kde, but
I've now added Mozilla and Opera.

Greg
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