From owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Sep 21 12:59:53 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 557221065670; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:59:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wjw@digiware.nl) Received: from mail.digiware.nl (mail.ip6.digiware.nl [IPv6:2001:4cb8:1:106::2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA7198FC1A; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:59:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost.digiware.nl [127.0.0.1]) by mail.digiware.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDC97153434; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 14:59:51 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at digiware.nl Received: from mail.digiware.nl ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rack1.digiware.nl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pa6OhOkhSsTw; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 14:59:48 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (opteron [192.168.10.67]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.digiware.nl (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 78DA7153433; Tue, 21 Sep 2010 14:59:48 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <4C98AC42.1040104@digiware.nl> Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2010 14:59:46 +0200 From: Willem Jan Withagen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.9) Gecko/20100915 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andriy Gapon References: <201009011653.o81Grkm4056064@fire.js.berklix.net> <201009011902.06538.hselasky@c2i.net> <4C8627A6.1090308@icyb.net.ua> <4C989989.4050408@icyb.net.ua> In-Reply-To: <4C989989.4050408@icyb.net.ua> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: vadim_nuclight@mail.ru, freebsd-security@freebsd.org, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: HEADS UP: FreeBSD 6.4 and 8.0 EoLs coming soon X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2010 12:59:53 -0000 On 2010-09-21 13:39, Andriy Gapon wrote: >> The Project is ultimately about the users, right? There are early signs that >> some old FreeBSD users get tired from those changes, those removals, lesser >> POLA adherence, marketing-not-technical-stuff for time-not-feature-based >> releases, not so stable -STABLE as it used to be, and so on, migrating to >> other systems. And older users are more valuable to project than newer ones. >> May be it's time to revert to some of thet Old Good Things, if decade-long >> project is mostly ended, while those signs are still early and not a strong >> tendency?.. Given this thread, I've mentioned earlier about 12 messages in >> announce@ from 2002 with such public calls for volunteers - there are several >> years already without these. Well, let me pitch in here a bit, because this discussion has had me on the edge of commenting already for too long. I'm a FreeBSD user as early as 1993, still have the first 1.0 CD here as nice remembrance. So I guess that I qualify as one of those "old FreeBSD" users. And I completely disagree with you. If you have been such an old freebsd user,then you should know the immense effort there has been to move GIANT out of the way. I cann't even get close to describing what a huge respect I have for the people that dared to undertake such a humongous effort. With an high probability of being flamed to death... But still ever since 5.x I've seen things really improve for the better. And yes, I was sorry to see ISDN being removed, but as things have progressed another version has been returned instead. And sure I have more hardware than you can imagine that is no longer supported. But it is all old, and worn down, sometimes it is even still VESA stuff. And right,there have been variations in the level of what you would like to call stable. But compared to the "old days" I would say, it has always been above my expectation. And note that I have and still do run 24*7 business on this. FreeBSD has never NEVER ever let me down. So as far as I'm concerned you are barking up the wrong tree here. --WjW