From owner-svn-src-head@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Oct 31 19:50:55 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: svn-src-head@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16E25106566C; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 19:50:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: from mail.garage.freebsd.pl (60.wheelsystems.com [83.12.187.60]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADBF18FC13; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 19:50:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 91FE745CAC; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 20:50:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (chello089073192049.chello.pl [89.73.192.49]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix) with ESMTP id E33B245C8A; Sun, 31 Oct 2010 20:50:41 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2010 20:50:03 +0100 From: Pawel Jakub Dawidek To: Ulrich Spoerlein , src-committers@FreeBSD.org, svn-src-all@FreeBSD.org, svn-src-head@FreeBSD.org Message-ID: <20101031195003.GE2160@garage.freebsd.pl> References: <201010310921.o9V9LSo4075408@svn.freebsd.org> <20101031160603.GD2160@garage.freebsd.pl> <20101031191119.GM46314@acme.spoerlein.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="5oH/S/bF6lOfqCQb" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20101031191119.GM46314@acme.spoerlein.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.3i X-PGP-Key-URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~pjd/pjd.asc X-OS: FreeBSD 9.0-CURRENT amd64 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on mail.garage.freebsd.pl X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.6 required=4.5 tests=BAYES_00,RCVD_IN_SORBS_DUL autolearn=no version=3.0.4 Cc: Subject: Re: svn commit: r214596 - head/bin/rm X-BeenThere: svn-src-head@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: SVN commit messages for the src tree for head/-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2010 19:50:55 -0000 --5oH/S/bF6lOfqCQb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 08:11:19PM +0100, Ulrich Spoerlein wrote: > On Sun, 31.10.2010 at 17:06:03 +0100, Pawel Jakub Dawidek wrote: > > IMHO this option should be removed and rm(1) should fail when a user is > > trying to use it. >=20 > No, this is a POLA violation for no apparent gain. The flag has been in > FreeBSD since at least '94. Remember, that we are in the rope-selling > business. We empower the users to shoot themselves in the foot. >=20 > I, for one, am using the -P option in a certain case where I can be sure > that ~99% of the data will be obliterated and I'm fine with that. For > all other cases I'm using geli or gbde (where I can make sure, that data > is lost). The question remains unanswered: If it is not a security feature then what's the purpose? IMHO this is a security feature, just a really lame one. Too many requirements have to be meet to make it work.=20 I don't think you would want to read in GELI or GBDE manual page that it encrypts the data sometimes, or if all the given requirements are meet. Of course requirements are fine, but they have to be really clear to the user and the list should be as short as possible, which is not the case here. > So we can either fix -P for all cases (impossible), or at least document > its shortcomings. Documenting them clearly is better than what we had a > couple of days before. I don't argue that the previous version of manual page was better I just pick your commit to discuss it mentioned functionality further. Maybe we could implement few simple checks which when satisfied don't emit a warning, ie. if this is UFS, on top of partition, on top of a slice and on top of a regular SCSI or SATA disk don't emit a warning, but if there is a doubt, do emit a warning. This might not be trivial, but might be doable. Alternatively we could always emit a warning. --=20 Pawel Jakub Dawidek http://www.wheelsystems.com pjd@FreeBSD.org http://www.FreeBSD.org FreeBSD committer Am I Evil? Yes, I Am! --5oH/S/bF6lOfqCQb Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iEYEARECAAYFAkzNyGsACgkQForvXbEpPzT4yACg7TwsX93Bsgp2iIzgDbjbQLw8 prUAoIKipWPTiD3irUKPavBvNus31g2Q =ALQ7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --5oH/S/bF6lOfqCQb--