From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Oct 26 16:51:28 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7557F4494C9 for ; Mon, 26 Oct 2020 16:51:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf-mardorf@riseup.net) Received: from mx1.riseup.net (mx1.riseup.net [198.252.153.129]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "*.riseup.net", Issuer "Sectigo RSA Domain Validation Secure Server CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4CKgpR4MvNz4T1d for ; Mon, 26 Oct 2020 16:51:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf-mardorf@riseup.net) Received: from bell.riseup.net (bell-pn.riseup.net [10.0.1.178]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "*.riseup.net", Issuer "Sectigo RSA Domain Validation Secure Server CA" (not verified)) by mx1.riseup.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4CKgpF6RQSzFdsk for ; Mon, 26 Oct 2020 09:51:17 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=riseup.net; s=squak; t=1603731077; bh=WF7JssNru5iF0Vd0kjFsIaQWvzxN/XZYgMGzM+hZEj8=; h=Subject:From:To:Date:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=JQ29iGQj4cA3XUx6NIcEqsA3G3IVv9O/hrnbNaTV+dX9AmfouOJhpP31Y7KdIeOzK uTIObttATNOaDXlGW+djnBuGYy8zbKUChzsRWD0KAHIn8wwI5jiS5vCjeHwbfFV3ZV 7lcWLAqrdPBmENXYFBRJxsrtyQrd+giX/Px8ovpQ= X-Riseup-User-ID: FB0D7B4B6B24FB3823FEBBA57E6294FF2468E9C77959D0E76854BB914B26EFF1 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bell.riseup.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4CKgpF29vZzJn9Q for ; Mon, 26 Oct 2020 09:51:13 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <10e0134ddb726ac78174a63bd20ec0bdeb3c896d.camel@riseup.net> Subject: Re: What is the "better / best " method to multi-boot different OSes natively WITHOUT VirtualBox(es) ? From: Ralf Mardorf To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2020 17:51:04 +0100 In-Reply-To: <20201026153012.0cf46ec8@gumby.homeunix.com> References: <20201024111010.5c867e8540a369b826d26703@sohara.org> <20201025065025.6a13dc89@archlinux> <20201025173321.8adee3e5.freebsd@edvax.de> <20201026153012.0cf46ec8@gumby.homeunix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4CKgpR4MvNz4T1d X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=riseup.net header.s=squak header.b=JQ29iGQj; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=riseup.net; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ralf-mardorf@riseup.net designates 198.252.153.129 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ralf-mardorf@riseup.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.89 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[198.252.153.129:from]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[riseup.net:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[riseup.net,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.82)[-0.819]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16652, ipnet:198.252.153.0/24, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[198.252.153.129:from]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.977]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[riseup.net:s=squak]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.996]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; DWL_DNSWL_LOW(-1.00)[riseup.net:dkim]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; MAILMAN_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-questions] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.33 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2020 16:51:28 -0000 On Mon, 2020-10-26 at 15:30 +0000, RW via freebsd-questions wrote: > On Sun, 25 Oct 2020 17:33:21 +0100 > Polytropon wrote: > > > On Sun, 25 Oct 2020 06:50:25 +0100, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > > I also want to add for consideration, if reboots between operating > > > systems are often wanted and HDDs are used, it's way better when all > > > drives, even the unused drives are spinning all the time. Parking > > > and releasing heads very often, does shorten the life span the > > > most. > > I think this is mostly a myth. In my experiences it isn't a myth. The intern HDDs of my PCs did last for around 2 years, when turning the computer off and on several times a day and they did last for around 7 years, if the machine runs more or less 24/7. > A few year ago Western Digital made some green drives, with extremely > aggressive power saving, that parked within seconds. With some usage > patters these could fail in months. I think it was around this time > that people started talking about heads as if they were like sledge > hammers. This is not true. I'm the owner of such an external green WD drive. It does park the heads and if people aren't careful right after parking something like gvfs or smartd etc. does wake up the drive immediately, for absolutely no reasons. There probably were a few drives where this happened every few seconds, but more common is, that it happens after around 30 minutes, which already is way to often. If you remove gvfs, don't enable smartd etc. those green drives get very old. Mine already is very old and still alive. It should be years older than this dummy package, I build in 2013 to fulfill idiotic hard dependencies against gvfs. [rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ pacman -Qi gvfs Name : gvfs Version : 2013.08.18-1 Description : Dummy package Architecture : any URL : None Licenses : None Groups : None Provides : gvfs Depends On : None Optional Deps : None Required By : caja libgnome nautilus nemo Optional For : evince ffmpegthumbnailer inkscape thunar Conflicts With : dummy Replaces : None Installed Size : 4.00 KiB Packager : Unknown Packager Build Date : Sun 18 Aug 2013 18:06:40 CEST Install Date : Fri 06 Sep 2013 12:34:40 CEST Install Reason : Explicitly installed Install Script : No Validated By : None These days home drives at 2TB or bigger are usually shingled - often without any mention, even on the data sheets. All inexpensive TiB drives are SMR drives. There's no data sheet needed. If the drive is inexpensive, then it must be a SMR drive. Btw. I'm using a lot of external, inexpensive "Toshiba P300 - Desktop" drives.