From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Sep 9 15:46:38 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F097616A4BF for ; Tue, 9 Sep 2003 15:46:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp2.knology.net (smtp2.knology.net [24.214.63.14]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id BE65643FBF for ; Tue, 9 Sep 2003 15:46:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dkelly@HiWAAY.net) Received: (qmail 19418 invoked from network); 9 Sep 2003 22:46:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO user-24-214-34-52.knology.net) (24.214.34.52) by smtp2.knology.net with SMTP; 9 Sep 2003 22:46:36 -0000 From: David Kelly To: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 17:46:33 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/1.5.3 References: <3F50C956.70603@carebears.mine.nu> <20030831065010.GA23179@titan.klemm.apsfilter.org> <20030909221106.GA31532@dds.nl> In-Reply-To: <20030909221106.GA31532@dds.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200309091746.33282.dkelly@HiWAAY.net> Subject: Re: strip FreeBSD a bit X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 09 Sep 2003 22:46:39 -0000 On Tuesday 09 September 2003 05:11 pm, Alex de Kruijff wrote: > I think there has to be a clear reason if components where removed. > This still doesn't mean that it couldn't come installed by default. > It just meant useing the package / port system. Why sould we not use > it? I think the consensus (which I agree with) is that the FreeBSD ports system is a miracle in simplicity but is not up to the task of managing each and every file of an installation, versions, and the dependencies. JKH mentioned this a few times on the lists that I saw. Apparently there have been some nibbles at the task but nobody has bit off enough to chew. IRIX has/had a tool which seemed up to the task on SGI systems I once ran. I don't have any idea how hard it was to load files into their "inst" format, but once done it was easy enough to later replace any one suspect file on the machine with the original from CDROM. There are several projects providing examples of how to strip and build a custom minimal FreeBSD. MiniBSD comes to mind. Earlier this year I started with MiniBSD and worked it over quite a bit for my former employer. Was under 10 MB for a fairly complete running system. Then I threw Apache, Perl, and a lot of other stuff in nearly whole hog and was still under 30 MB. They didn't release my work to be shared. I wrote a Makefile which checked out sources via cvs, then manually drove ./usr/src/Makefile and ports Makefiles with parameters more to my liking. Most significant was the FreeBSD utilities were dynamically linked when normally /bin is statically linked. Everything was going on one filesystem so dynamic saved a lot of disk space. -- David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@hiwaay.net ===================================================================== The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its capacity -- the rest is overhead for the operating system.