From owner-freebsd-wireless@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 23 22:31:52 2013 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-wireless@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E13CC681; Wed, 23 Oct 2013 22:31:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vince@unsane.co.uk) Received: from unsane.co.uk (unsane-pt.tunnel.tserv5.lon1.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f08:110::2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5E5212600; Wed, 23 Oct 2013 22:31:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from vincemacbook.unsane.co.uk (vincemacbook.unsane.co.uk [10.10.10.20]) (authenticated bits=0) by unsane.co.uk (8.14.7/8.14.6) with ESMTP id r9NMVaTE061865 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 23 Oct 2013 23:31:38 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from vince@unsane.co.uk) Message-ID: <52684E48.20709@unsane.co.uk> Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2013 23:31:36 +0100 From: Vincent Hoffman User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.0.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eitan Adler , Adrian Chadd Subject: Re: [rfc] removing the NDISulator References: <5265878B.1050809@yandex.ru> <201310212146.r9LLkqZ1044966@fire.js.berklix.net> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 1.6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.14 Cc: "Julian H. Stacey" , "freebsd-wireless@freebsd.org" , freebsd-current X-BeenThere: freebsd-wireless@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Discussions of 802.11 stack, tools device driver development." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2013 22:31:53 -0000 On 23/10/2013 18:35, Eitan Adler wrote: > On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 6:29 PM, Adrian Chadd wrote: >> If there are drivers that people absolutely need fixed then they should >> stand up and say "hey, I really would like X to work better!" and then >> follow it up with some encouraging incentives. Right now the NDISulator >> lets people work _around_ this by having something that kind of works for >> them but it doesn't improve our general driver / stack ecosystems. > I doubt most people prefer to use the ndisulator over a native driver. > However, many people don't have the skills, time, or money to provide > the incentives you are talking about. At this point ndisulator > provides a means to an end: working wireless and it isn't causing > significant strain on the project in terms of development effort. > > Our end users are not always developers and I think removing this > feature will hurt more than it will help. > > As an end user, the main issue I have is that according to the manpage it supports ndis 5.1 According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_Driver_Interface_Specification this is the version supported by Windows XP , Server 2003 , Windows CE 4.x, 5.0, 6.0 As you might guess most new devices wont be coming with drivers for XP, so does this mean I wont be able to use drivers for a recent windows version (my understanding is that it will but happy to learn differently) If this is the case and there is no active development on it, a gradual depreciation over the 10.x series is probably a good idea. If however its likely to support current drivers/devices it does have a place (I've used it once or twice in a pinch.) Vince ^