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Date:      Wed, 21 Oct 2015 07:37:16 -0400
From:      Julio Merino <jmmv@freebsd.org>
To:        Mark Linimon <linimon@lonesome.com>
Cc:        Ian Lepore <ian@freebsd.org>, freebsd-arch <freebsd-arch@freebsd.org>, Bryan Drewery <bdrewery@FreeBSD.org>
Subject:   Re: Retiring in-tree GDB
Message-ID:  <6E0B7D30-78A6-4ABF-A617-01E43B093CB2@freebsd.org>
In-Reply-To: <20151021000029.GB24405@lonesome.com>
References:  <2678091.es0AGJQ0Ou@ralph.baldwin.cx> <5626B15C.4080408@FreeBSD.org> <1445377905.99375.22.camel@freebsd.org> <20151021000029.GB24405@lonesome.com>

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> On Oct 20, 2015, at 20:00, Mark Linimon <linimon@lonesome.com> wrote:
>=20
> I do not think we can ask "how many people need the base compiler".
> Well, if asked, answered: all of them, if we want to keep being
> FreeBSD.

And why would that be? What makes this FreeBSD?

Traditionally, a compiler has always been required because the only way =
to upgrade a BSD system was by recompiling it from source, and the only =
way to install extra software was by building it from ports.  Things =
have changed: it's now possible to have a fully-functional, up-to-date =
system, with packages without ever compiling anything.  Having a =
compiler in the base system is not a necessity any more (for amd64, at =
least).

No, I'm not in favor of removing the compiler from the base system; I =
think it has to stay for various other reasons.  I'm just questioning =
the axiom you threw above.

What I'll argue is that subjecting the user to ever have to recompile =
anything, for the majority of use cases, is bad.  And FreeBSD does not =
do this any longer: as mentioned above, it's now possible to have a =
functional system without compiling anything, so the compiler could now =
be optional.

Also, as a long-time NetBSD user, I was a bit surprised when I came to =
FreeBSD to find that the compiler tools were not optional.  In NetBSD, =
the compiler tools have always been part of a comp.tgz set separate from =
base.tgz.  Both are built from the source tree in unison, but when =
installing a new machine you can easily choose not to have comp.tgz.  I =
have run lean servers without compilers for a long time, and it was just =
fine.

I guess we are off-topic now...=



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