From nobody Fri Nov 4 17:07:00 2022 X-Original-To: current@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4N3nB05wdbz4hFQk for ; Fri, 4 Nov 2022 17:07:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from max@baroi.com) Received: from mailin02.mxof.com (mailin02.mxof.com [72.20.134.35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "*.mxof.com", Issuer "GeoTrust TLS DV RSA Mixed SHA256 2020 CA-1" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4N3n9z6sfKz3NYt; Fri, 4 Nov 2022 17:07:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from max@baroi.com) Received: from mta01.mxof.net (mta01.mxof.net [10.1.0.31]) by mailin02.mxof.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Debian-8) with ESMTPS id 2A4H725J015126 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Fri, 4 Nov 2022 17:07:24 GMT Received: from mta01.mxof.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mta01.mxof.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EC5D32607E0; Fri, 4 Nov 2022 10:07:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mta01.mxof.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDC312612A0; Fri, 4 Nov 2022 10:07:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mta01.mxof.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mta01.mxof.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id qNSA1t9aPSct; Fri, 4 Nov 2022 10:07:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.239] (cpe-172-116-59-145.socal.res.rr.com [172.116.59.145]) (Authenticated sender: max@baroi.com) by mta01.mxof.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A213B2607E0; Fri, 4 Nov 2022 10:07:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <558fd211-3d92-240c-f33c-5377a1684444@baroi.com> Date: Fri, 4 Nov 2022 10:07:00 -0700 List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-current List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.4.1 Subject: Re: trpt(8) to be decomissioned Content-Language: en-US To: Gleb Smirnoff Cc: current@freebsd.org References: <97286FA9-DD47-4EB2-BD7A-C2A8BC8B62B5@karels.net> <4e69d854-e872-4833-b836-f9caf5fe76f0@baroi.com> From: Max Baroi In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Bayes-Prob: 0.0001 (Score 0, tokens from: outgoing:default, base:default, @@RPTN) X-Spam-Score: 0.00 () [Hold at 7.10] X-CanIt-Geo: No geolocation information available for 10.1.0.31 X-CanItPRO-Stream: outgoing:default (inherits from base:default) X-Canit-Stats-ID: 028Eh732k - 80a069bfb220 - 20221104 X-Antispam-Training-Forget: https://spamblock.prxy.com/b.php?c=f&i=028Eh732k&m=80a069bfb220&rlm=outgoing&t=20221104 X-Antispam-Training-Nonspam: https://spamblock.prxy.com/b.php?c=n&i=028Eh732k&m=80a069bfb220&rlm=outgoing&t=20221104 X-Antispam-Training-Phish: https://spamblock.prxy.com/b.php?c=p&i=028Eh732k&m=80a069bfb220&rlm=outgoing&t=20221104 X-Antispam-Training-Spam: https://spamblock.prxy.com/b.php?c=s&i=028Eh732k&m=80a069bfb220&rlm=outgoing&t=20221104 X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . roaringpenguin . com) on 10.1.0.12 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4N3n9z6sfKz3NYt X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of max@baroi.com designates 72.20.134.35 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=max@baroi.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.30 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.999]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:72.20.134.32/28]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:394437, ipnet:72.20.134.0/24, country:US]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[current@freebsd.org]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[baroi.com]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FREEFALL_USER(0.00)[max]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-ThisMailContainsUnwantedMimeParts: N Gleb, Thank you for the response. I rescind my suggestion. -Max On 11/4/2022 9:40 AM, Gleb Smirnoff wrote: > Max, > > the reason I want to retire it is not that it consumes 40 Kb > in the repository. The reason is that knows kernel structures, > and fails to compile after changes to them. So the tool that > nobody uses requires special care when working on TCP. The > kernel headers disclose the structures for trpt (with some > protection with _WANT_TCPCB, though) and some software from > ports (not calling names!) would start use them too. Now a > kernel developer needs to care not only about trpt, but > about this software, too. > > On the kernel side there is also TCPDEBUG code that needs > to be kept compilable, while apparently nobody uses it. > > On Fri, Nov 04, 2022 at 07:19:19AM +0000, Max Baroi wrote: > M> I'm sorry if this is an inappropriate suggestion, but I think it wou= ld be neat if there was a place in the ports hierarchy for retired progra= ms like trpt. Maybe a "historical" or "archival" directory for programs p= hased out of from base, especially ones that are almost four decades old. > M> > M> -Max > M> > M> Nov 3, 2022 11:04:07 PM Mike Karels : > M> > M> > On 3 Nov 2022, at 22:48, Gleb Smirnoff wrote: > M> > > M> >> =C2=A0 Hi, > M> >> > M> >> trpt(8) is utility to pull TCP debugging data from the kernel > M> >> in 4.2BSD. We still have it in the base, with corresponding > M> >> TCPDEBUG option in the kernel and SO_DEBUG socket option. > M> >> > M> >> At the same time we have much more powerful debugging facilities > M> >> for TCP, e.g. the Dtrace probing, the TCP black box logging and > M> >> siftr.=C2=A0 These are the tools that modern developers use. > M> >> > M> >> Already touched this topic with rscheff@, tuexen@, rrs@ and jtl@. > M> >> None of them new what trpt(8) is :) Looks like a good justificati= on > M> >> to me. > M> > > M> > I have used trpt, but not for many years.=C2=A0 It was done before= tcpdump > M> > as well.=C2=A0 Its time has long since gone. > M> > > M> > =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Mike > M> >> -- > M> >> Gleb Smirnoff > M> > M> >