Date: Sun, 3 Sep 1995 06:04:14 -0500 (CDT) From: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" <karl@mcs.com> To: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com (Rodney W. Grimes) Cc: karl@Mcs.Net, pete@RockyMountain.rahul.net, pete@kesa26.kesa.com, jbryant@argus.iadfw.net, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, pete@rahul.net Subject: Re: 4GB Drives - Another Hawk bits the dust after a a short 3 month flight; Loading NetBSD ! Message-ID: <m0spCqV-0003kwC@mercury.mcs.com> In-Reply-To: <199509030618.XAA16309@gndrsh.aac.dev.com> from "Rodney W. Grimes" at Sep 2, 95 11:18:34 pm
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> > Warning! > > > > I have had THREE Micropolis bearing failures on drives which are less than > > one year old in the last 72 hours! > > When ever you present failure data like this please include full details, > Ie, model number of the drive is a _minimum_ piece of data. 1 4110, two 4221s, all manufactured roughly at the same time. > Also unless > you happen to have a failure analysis lab you are _assuming_ the noise > you hear is a bearing failure, and it may very well be that the bearing > has failed, but without the lab you don't know why it failed (contamination, > over heating, design flaw, damaged during manufacturing, etc.) I know what a head crash sounds like -- and what a bearing failure sounds like. Different sounds, different consequences. > Given that 3 drives failed in a 72 hour period I would say, IMHO, this > was a field induced failure (ie, something happened in comon to these > 3 drives at the end users sight). It just has a horrible probablity of > being much else with the little data given. You'd think so, but the facts are that these drives are three of about 30 in the same room, all are in enclosures with others, the machines they were on had not been rebooted or touched for two weeks, and there is enough physical security (and environmental control and monitoring) that I am dead-nuts certain that nothing had affected the disks physically. The disks are not on the same machine, nor in the same cabinet. The other point is that none of the OTHER drives in the room failed, and most of these were from Seagate rather than Micropolis. > What has Micropolis had to say about this? Or have you even contacted > them yet? They don't know what could have happened here -- they tried to point to physical issues, as I expected, but the fact is that we *know* there weren't any. Its not like these disks are 2,000 miles away and they just had an earthquake! > > I like the Seagate Hawk series, and the 'Cudas *IF YOU CAN KEEP THEM COOL*. > > The Hawk is okay, and already stated as my model of choice on a price/size/ > performance/reliabity point at the 4G mark. The Barracuda is off the > bottom of the scale given the ``KEEP THEM COOL'' requirement and the > significant initial product failure rates from Seagate gave them a very > bad name in many communities. Even though Seagate has corrected the head > meltdown/media flake problem that sour taste remains in many peoples > mouths. I have no problem meeting environmental requirements as long as I know what they are! In the case of the 'Cudas, I do. > that was not specifically designed to handle the heat dissapation of > the Barracuda. SGI's official statement is ``don't put them inside > the system boxes, but them in external enclosures''. AAC's official > statement is ``don't use them at all''. Our official statement is "Install only in our 4-drive enclosures" (which have five fans :-)) Case temperature never exceeds 82 degrees F if you do this; we have a pyrometer and check such things. On the other hand, they will reach in excess of 120 F in a typical PC case, and at that temp they WILL fail. > > The Hawks run with about 30% less power, and throw about 30% less heat as a > > result. They will run in a PC cabinet with no problems, assuming you pay > > moderate attention to airflow. > > And spins at a 30% slower rate :-) :-) :-). Yep. -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | (shell, PPP, SLIP, leased) in Chicagoland Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 7 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's *Three STAR A* Clarinet feed!
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