From owner-freebsd-net@freebsd.org Wed Oct 24 00:04:51 2018 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-net@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87F441037CCC for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2018 00:04:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-vk1-xa2a.google.com (mail-vk1-xa2a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::a2a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DEAFF77A33 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2018 00:04:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-vk1-xa2a.google.com with SMTP id m199-v6so807149vke.9 for ; Tue, 23 Oct 2018 17:04:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=HL9+HPYGeQgvgzfdIkooQvpdti3UDljW1vYu7T7v8gg=; b=ZQEsVQyt/tBqmo9KSS9Qy5GxVbWyaGO14qcFSOa+toTgHeSdckI73cZvvmrLq/SRCt Yyx8UK+4KWMhlZCF7yCQAk8bjeH0rArU+UbAWZ86lL2uBRCMZvUGOlWeL1MdJGLPaEeW jVpVnFQOiiHrjgJSvypTNU9D4/+Lcp1j8/qr0tRomm/jls/9/tl2pzxHPnL7h3fzE5ew zyYq45NbNwUl0smaHwzzQOroJrsEBRzxKXmRT8aAC0oOJZy4mtHUmoEFVEMGiUxSlrG3 OUmZ+SSCiTqWDEpe0uMtPU7rx6LjZXw1vhL0MS78Om4z1GedOw++OmRhIRxYSsniFLef 1CJg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=HL9+HPYGeQgvgzfdIkooQvpdti3UDljW1vYu7T7v8gg=; b=VQK1cgBZEoC77M7+QBqZdiXOQzwSByu1X1DWsT8y/xC4ADTOA40X5uDOeG+HKBW7lf p/BFwpK6M47i5TLfqquaB4wLGPss7MW1dw5/15RPTkobPnZC/rnc0cLPzfvAl39BMvXW tdmTWFH48q7YH5AEOLBQluRPjijhed9wZJ2rgkWGszvUwadX2DnkxcB0tuFiQNqHPkXt IKYgk5g7CY/f+bHdFEP8kG3V13K5CtjOxXaHgn5672PFGNuRUZRnQFrbDsj+Hw+ejsGZ 9ky7g8Sy0rwuKIR1q09Dy4qUN8+gEr8MsfpHTHqZ6of843254VcmVsoAsR15ogiGwRds IH0g== X-Gm-Message-State: AGRZ1gLmI/TRjN4OSisQc5Fp0tHe3Ek3A8j4EnI8HEpdhcvWlkKwPBOl VbaYcrEQ7bpjMikQbR07dqCALIBiSHEdX9Objx3kRA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AJdET5fWey/EJ5M4YXEzYWaPf/lgUdOUEH6m4VIK15pRM/L89W3YDbPIGP+carkF0Toc5l81MbE7u3AYQyXve0MhxUw= X-Received: by 2002:a1f:9255:: with SMTP id u82mr166903vkd.85.1540339490149; Tue, 23 Oct 2018 17:04:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <201810232326.w9NNQjtK024759@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> In-Reply-To: <201810232326.w9NNQjtK024759@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> From: Warner Losh Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2018 18:04:38 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: FCP-0101: Deprecating most 10/100 Ethernet drivers To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: Brooks Davis , FreeBSD-STABLE Mailing List , Ian Lepore , FreeBSD Net , "Julian H. Stacey" , Michelle Sullivan , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" , freebsd-fcp@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-net@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Networking and TCP/IP with FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2018 00:04:51 -0000 On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 5:26 PM Rodney W. Grimes < freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 5:07 PM Rodney W. Grimes < > > freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.cn85.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > > > > > On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 11:33:35PM +0200, Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > > > > > I'd also suggest that rl stands in stark contrast to the cs, wb, > sn, > > > smc, > > > > > > sf, tl, tx and vr drivers, which nobody has mentioned in this > > > thread, and > > > > > > which I doubt are in use in any FreeBSD system of any age today. > > > > > > > > > > vr is used by my TV driver laptop: > > > > > http://www.berklix.com/~jhs/hardware/laptops/novatech-8355/ > > > > > vr0: flags=8843 metric 0 > mtu > > > 1500 > > > > > options=82808 > > > > > ether 00:40:d0:5e:26:38 > > > > > inet 192.168.91.65 netmask 0xffffff00 broadcast > 192.168.91.255 > > > > > media: Ethernet autoselect (100baseTX > > > ) > > > > > status: active > > > > > > > > > > Which currently runs 8.4-RELEASE & eg xrandr, but I'll upgrade soon > > > > > when I also configure it to receive from a raspberry-pi TV VPN > server. > > > > > > > > The above was a typo. vr is on the the STAY list. > > > > > > > > -- Brooks > > > Brooks, > > > Is there a public revised version of FCP-0101 that reflects the > > > feedback which is what core is voting on? > > > > > > > Its on github, just like it's been the whole time for anybody to see, > > submit pull requests against and track: > > I have no gh account, desires no gh account, so have no way to > submit a change request other than through direct email to > brooks or another gh user. This is fundementally flawed. > The fcp process was officially approved by core.9. You can make suggestions to core for improvements to the process. Lord knows this FCP hasn't been trouble free (though we've learned some valuable lessons). Submissions to the author is always an option should you choose not to use the widely used technology we've chosen to automate this process. Some FreeBSD users don't have accounts, however, many non-developers have github accounts and I think it's a reasonable way to do outreach to the larger community w/o requiring everybody to get a freebsd account (since they are already likely to have a github account, and if not they are trivial to get). So yea, it's a flawed process, and we'd love feedback on actionable items we can do to make it better. Warner