From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sun Jan 6 20:30:53 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A714B14999ED for ; Sun, 6 Jan 2019 20:30:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wojtek@puchar.net) Received: from puchar.net (puchar.net [194.1.144.90]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "puchar.net", Issuer "puchar.net" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E88438E00A for ; Sun, 6 Jan 2019 20:30:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wojtek@puchar.net) Received: Received: from 127.0.0.1 (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by puchar.net (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x06KUxha068205 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 6 Jan 2019 21:30:59 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from puchar-wojtek@puchar.net) Received: from localhost (puchar-wojtek@localhost) by puchar.net (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id x06KUsxd068201; Sun, 6 Jan 2019 21:30:54 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from puchar-wojtek@puchar.net) Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2019 21:30:54 +0100 (CET) From: Wojciech Puchar To: Cy Schubert cc: Wojciech Puchar , Enji Cooper , Igor Mozolevsky , Hackers freeBSD Subject: Re: Strategic Thinking (was: Re: Speculative: Rust for base system components) In-Reply-To: <201901061912.x06JCKCa004324@slippy.cwsent.com> Message-ID: References: <201901061912.x06JCKCa004324@slippy.cwsent.com> User-Agent: Alpine 2.20 (BSF 67 2015-01-07) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: E88438E00A X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of wojtek@puchar.net designates 194.1.144.90 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=wojtek@puchar.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.87 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[puchar.net]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: puchar.net]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.985,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[90.144.1.194.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; IP_SCORE(-3.57)[ip: (-9.41), ipnet: 194.1.144.0/24(-4.71), asn: 43476(-3.76), country: PL(0.03)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:43476, ipnet:194.1.144.0/24, country:PL]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2019 20:30:53 -0000 >> dependencies (or should be) - cannot be run simply as processes on >> different user accounts? > > Because each is a jail, not a full blown jail like but a lite-jail. > > Think of it this way. When I first got into this business everything > was run on a huge machine, a mainframe. Later applications were moved > from the mainframe to individual machines, databases to database and this was wrong. under unix system it could just run in separate user accounts. The latter virtualization or jails is just wrong attempt to solve a problem that was created. Instead of simply doing it right. > web or proxy servers. Now these services are run on microservices. > > You are suggesting we go back to the 1960's and 1970's mainframe model. Something. just without overpriced IBM hardware and strange IBM software - using instead cheap hardware and good unix system. This is the solution that works. All others only create problems while solving others.