From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Feb 25 22:21: 1 2003 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8483C37B401 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 22:21:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from lakemtao02.cox.net (lakemtao02.cox.net [68.1.17.243]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B7E543FBF for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 22:20:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tech_info@threespace.com) Received: from vwinxp.threespace.com ([68.11.249.216]) by lakemtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030226062057.KAJE6744.lakemtao02.cox.net@vwinxp.threespace.com> for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 01:20:57 -0500 Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20030225234336.01a452b8@threespace.com> X-Sender: tech@threespace.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 23:50:40 -0600 To: FreeBSD Chat From: Chip Morton Subject: Re: jive (was RE: was this really necessary?) In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Paul, I personally have to thank you for this bit of history. While I certainly had the feeling that the authors of this program were engaging in the worst kind of racial stereotyping, I couldn't manage to quite find any proof until I had the references to the Legion of Doom and Masters of Deception. They produced the following excerpts in my searches: ..... Using the jive program is the electronic equivalent of appearing in blackface - a crude, minstrel show in cyberspace: "Some nigga' name Co'rupt, havin' been real active befo'e, duzn't gots' some so'kin' computa' anymo'e and so ... sheeit, duh." (at http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/2.12/hacker_pr.html) Jive turns regular English into "the electronic equivalent of blackface" -- replete with uses of the word "nigger" and phrases like "slap mah 'fro." (at http://www.kkc.net/eyenet/1995/net0817.htm) ...... So I think we can pretty much kill the pseudo-ignorant "Oh it wasn't poking fun at anybody specifically" attitude. --Chip Morton At 07:15 AM 2/25/2003, Paul Robinson wrote: >Actually, the history of jive is an interesting one. If I remember >correctly, the Legion of Doom created to make fun of another hacking group >that they hated called Masters of Deception. LoD was composed mostly of >white middle-class kids whose parents would buy them the latest and greatest >hardware they asked for. MoD had to make do with scrabbling around for bits >of kit in bins and were generally C64 freaks at the time. I'm sure that the >fact that they were all Afro-Carribean didn't come into. > >In other words, jive owes it's existence to a desire of white middle-class >pricks to make fun of black working-class kids. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message