From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 31 19:26:37 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48BEC16A4DF for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:26:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mycroft@MIT.EDU) Received: from biscayne-one-station.mit.edu (BISCAYNE-ONE-STATION.MIT.EDU [18.7.7.80]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4DFB43D49 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:26:35 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from mycroft@MIT.EDU) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (OUTGOING-AUTH.MIT.EDU [18.7.22.103]) by biscayne-one-station.mit.edu (8.13.6/8.9.2) with ESMTP id k7VJQNuS005148; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:26:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from multics.mit.edu (MULTICS.MIT.EDU [18.187.1.73]) (authenticated bits=56) (User authenticated as mycroft@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.13.6/8.12.4) with ESMTP id k7VJQFU5023552 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:26:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from mycroft@localhost) by multics.mit.edu (8.12.9.20060308) id k7VJQEmj028930; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:26:14 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:26:14 -0400 From: "Charles M. Hannum" To: Johnny Billquist Message-ID: <20060831192614.GA10101@multics.mit.edu> References: <20060830232723.GU10101@multics.mit.edu> <98f5a8830608301731s2b0663e3g94b0bd32f8a06a78@mail.gmail.com> <950621ad0608310654h78ae0023g346abd108815ae72@mail.gmail.com> <20060831110112.J82634@hub.org> <78a2305a0608310830l923f83pbd03b2c89d417505@mail.gmail.com> <44F703C0.30604@softjar.se> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <44F703C0.30604@softjar.se> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 1.217 X-Spam-Level: * (1.217) X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.42 Cc: miros-discuss@mirbsd.org, misc@openbsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org, netbsd-users@NetBSD.org Subject: Re: The future of NetBSD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 19:26:37 -0000 On Thu, Aug 31, 2006 at 05:44:00PM +0200, Johnny Billquist wrote: > Andy Ruhl wrote: > >On 8/31/06, Thorsten Glaser wrote: > > > >>BSD is about an operating system, not about a kernel. > > > >Bingo. Good point. This point is lost sometimes. > > > >I believe NetBSD has the proper philosophy in regards to the entire OS > >as well. I don't want apache built in, for instance. > > This is a silly definition (imho) which I first heard Stallman use, but > seems to be spreading. > Every book on operating systems that I own, or have read, defines an > operating system as the kernel. Different applications, including even > shells, are not the operating system. > > But that's just my opinion, of course. But most of all, I don't see the > relevance of bringing the discussion down to a hair-splitting of what an > operating system is. Actually, defining (poorly) the OS to include so much else has been a liability for NetBSD in many ways. It has massively slowed the adoption of new software versions (e.g. GCC), for one. It also contributed to the perception that a better package system and automatic updates were not a serious issue.