From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Jul 22 08:56:44 2011 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1676106566B for ; Fri, 22 Jul 2011 08:56:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from mx01.qsc.de (mx01.qsc.de [213.148.129.14]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A5D58FC1F for ; Fri, 22 Jul 2011 08:56:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from r55.edvax.de (port-92-195-103-124.dynamic.qsc.de [92.195.103.124]) by mx01.qsc.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1CA23CEF3 for ; Fri, 22 Jul 2011 10:56:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from r55.edvax.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by r55.edvax.de (8.14.2/8.14.2) with SMTP id p6M8ug1L001612 for ; Fri, 22 Jul 2011 10:56:42 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Date: Fri, 22 Jul 2011 10:56:42 +0200 From: Polytropon To: FreeBSD Message-Id: <20110722105642.d21067c0.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: <20110719085529.1671ec7f@scorpio> References: <20110717071059.25971662@scorpio> <4E22DFE9.7050007@pathscale.com> <201107172016.30727.lobo@bsd.com.br> <4E23989F.7010701@gmail.com> <4e242fab.s4vpgxxZEUq0LFDq%perryh@pluto.rain.com> <1311017168.44397.YahooMailRC@web36508.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <13800_1311018255_4E248D0F_13800_81_1_D9B37353831173459FDAA836D3B43499C521864F@WADPMBXV0.waddell.com> <20110718162245.0d426239@scorpio> <20110719032131.GA29635@guilt.hydra> <20110719085529.1671ec7f@scorpio> Organization: EDVAX X-Mailer: Sylpheed 2.4.7 (GTK+ 2.12.1; i386-portbld-freebsd7.0) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Lennart Poettering: BSD Isn't Relevant Anymore X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Polytropon List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 22 Jul 2011 08:56:44 -0000 On Tue, 19 Jul 2011 08:55:29 -0400, Jerry wrote: > On Mon, 18 Jul 2011 21:21:31 -0600 > Chad Perrin articulated: > > > This is where we find a dividing line between users who want different > > things. Yes, you turn on your Win7 laptop (or wake it up) in a coffee > > shop, and it connects automagically -- in fact, you probably don't > > even realize it has connected. Hopefully it connected to the coffee > > shop's network, and not one of those occasional skimming networks that > > masquerade as coffe shop networks and exist to harvest login data and > > the like. The dividing line between two schools of thought on the > > matter in this example should be obvious. > > You do realize that all of that is configurable; ie, auto connect, > preferred network, etcetera. If you have not taken the time to read the > documentation and properly configure the wireless app correctly then > why bitch? I am not implying that it is perfect; however, given the > grave limitations that FreeBSD places on wireless connections; > specifically lack of drivers, and the inordinate amount of manual > intervention to accomplish what Microsoft and other OSs, (does the name > Ubuntu sound familiar) have achieved, it is readily apparent that the > FreeBSD implementation is trailing the pack. Want it like this? :-) ---> http://xkcd.com/416/ But coming back on topic (partially): What's missing in my opinion is a system-provided user land program or script for interacting with the driver and the settings (as well as with "templates" for automated setup). There _are_ however tools provided by the "big ones" (the big desktop environments KDE, Gnome, maybe Xfce, haven't checked) to help configuring wireless adaptors. Of course this only applies where they are supported by the OS. A program I could imagine would be something like the ppp control program that other programs, typically GUI ones, could interface with, just as gmencoder interfaces with the incredible power of mencoder, or gmplayer adds lots of stuff at the GUI front to the one-size-fits-all fantastic mplayer. So all DEs or programmers who are interested in providing a setup tool could interface with that specific program. So they don't have to implement "low level things" on their own or even care for supporting particular adaptors. This tool could also be integrated in the FreeBSD startup system, and maybe even activated at pre-install time, so you could install via Internet, where Internet is provided by a wireless adaptor that got setup automatically. This would _also_ have the advantage of providing an abstraction layer that was OPTIONAL, and if you really need a better implementation (from a developer's point of view), you can still do it on your own, interfacing with the standard system means. Jerry, see this as an "I agree" in relation to your statement, given the comment that wireless isn't relevant to _me_ at the moment. :-) -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...