From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 24 06:32:40 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 361E916A41F for ; Thu, 24 Nov 2005 06:32:40 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from tedm@toybox.placo.com) Received: from mail.freebsd-corp-net-guide.com (mail.web-strider.com [65.75.192.90]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C727A43D76 for ; Thu, 24 Nov 2005 06:32:26 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from tedm@toybox.placo.com) Received: from tedwin2k (nat-rtr.freebsd-corp-net-guide.com [65.75.197.130]) by mail.freebsd-corp-net-guide.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id jAO6ZNb80114; Wed, 23 Nov 2005 22:35:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tedm@toybox.placo.com) From: "Ted Mittelstaedt" To: "Micah" Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2005 22:32:20 -0800 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1506 In-Reply-To: <438332CB.9040800@ywave.com> Importance: Normal Cc: Hans Nieser , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: RE: Does FreeBSD 6.0 fully support PCI-Express? X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 06:32:40 -0000 Micah, Would you please list a cite that the nv driver is open source? There is also another site here: http://news.com.com/2061-10795_3-5762319.html although I will admit this is 5 months old - please cite a more recent article where nvidia has reversed their policy? As Mike Harris eloquently said a couple years ago: Nvidia doesn't release their technical specifications for their hardware to *anyone*, not even under NDA (non-disclosure agreements). One might be tempted to think "well you have the source code though right?", however the source code isn't enough. None of the video hardware registers are documented, instead they are programmed as a series of random "magic" numbers, so you have absolutely no idea what the purpose of a given register is, that is getting written seemingly random information into it in the driver. The driver is for all intents and purposes obfuscated unless you have the hardware documentation which turns numbers like 0x3432 into a useful name like NVIDIA_SUCH_AND_SUCH_REGISTER with documentation of WTH that register actually does. That's the long story, the short story is, that even though the "nv" driver is open source, it is more or less supplied as-is and the only way it gets updated is if Nvidia updates it, because nobody outside Nvidia has the foggiest clue how their hardware works. So if a card isn't supported, that's unfortunate. If 2D doesn't work, that's also unfortunate. By reporting bugs that occur in the "nv" driver to http://bugs.xfree86.org, the bug report will get assigned to Mark Vojkovich, who is the official driver maintainer, working at Nvidia, who has access to pretty much every Nvidia card ever made, and the technical specifications to go along with them. If he can't fix the bug, then more or less, nobody can. Not without getting hired by Nvidia to work on the 'nv' driver. ;o) Micah, if this has changed, please cite where. I myself also happen to have a system with an onboard nvidia card so I really am interested, not just trying to flame-bait. Ted >-----Original Message----- >From: Micah [mailto:micahjon@ywave.com] >Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 7:02 AM >To: Ted Mittelstaedt >Cc: Hans Nieser; freebsd-questions@freebsd.org >Subject: Re: Does FreeBSD 6.0 fully support PCI-Express? > > >Ted Mittelstaedt wrote: >> As far as I know Nvidia hasn't allowed Xorg to write drivers >> for their cards, all the nvidia drivers out there are >> binaries from Nvidia. This for me would cross that card >> off my list. > >Just to correct this bit of mis-information, there are two drivers >available for nvidia. The nv driver is an open source driver provided >by xorg, and the nvidia driver is a closed source driver >provided by nvidia. > >Later, >Micah > >--