From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Apr 11 10:50:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from techunix.technion.ac.il (techunix.technion.ac.il [132.68.1.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFA6537BBDB for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 10:50:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mellon@techunix.technion.ac.il) Received: by techunix.technion.ac.il (Postfix, from userid 14309) id C9D5F86B2; Tue, 11 Apr 2000 19:50:30 +0200 (IST) Message-ID: <20000411195029.00602@techunix.technion.ac.il> Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 19:50:29 +0200 From: Anatoly Vorobey To: chat@freebsd.org Cc: "Thomas M. Sommers" Subject: Re: BSDCon East Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.88 In-Reply-To: <38F2D1E7.7119FA0F@mail.ptd.net>; from tms2@mail.ptd.net on Tue, Apr 11, 2000 at 03:19:03AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, Apr 11, 2000 at 03:19:03AM -0400, Thomas M. Sommers wrote: > Christian Weisgerber wrote: > > > > ... this is a wide-spread belief and--excuse me--pure rubbish. > > I have _A Comprehensive Grammar of the English Language_ by Quirk > > et al. sitting here, which explains the "non-existent" intricacies > > of English grammar on nearly 1800 pages. And it's probably not > > exhaustive. > > > > For many linguistically naive people, the simplicity of a language's > > grammar seems to hinge on the degree of inflection. Having a few > > noun cases, adjective/noun agreements, and a few verb conjugations > > does not make for an objectively(!) difficult grammar. English has > > the same complexity, it's just expressed differently. Once you get > > beyond the basic level of "me Tarzan, you Jane", English syntax > > becomes fiendishly difficult. > > In what ways is it fiendishly difficult? Many so-called grammatical > rules, such as to not split infinitives, are nothing but some 18th > century antiquarian's idea of what the language should be, not what it > really is. There are many, many complex syntactical constructions which are difficult for a foreigner to understand and master. Consider, for instance, just off the top of my head, "many a X", or "Would that Y". Such constructions aren't covered in dictionaries or texts for foreigners. How would one know that the former is used as a deliberate archaism? Consider a sentence going "Granted, X has blablabla..., but...". How is a dictionary going to help a foreigner to parse it? Granted what? Granted who to whom? :) As another random example, speakers of Slavic languages often find it intensely difficult to remember and obey the time-shift rules in English, or the no-double-negatives rule. English syntax *is* fiendishly difficult, no in the least *because* it's so irregular: "rules" are violated so often that one has the feeling that anything goes -- except that it doesn't. -- Anatoly Vorobey, mellon@pobox.com http://pobox.com/~mellon/ "Angels can fly because they take themselves lightly" - G.K.Chesterton To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message