From owner-freebsd-x11@freebsd.org Tue Jan 3 23:02:47 2017 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-x11@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9E45C9EE21 for ; Tue, 3 Jan 2017 23:02:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andrnils@gmail.com) Received: from mail-vk0-x236.google.com (mail-vk0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c05::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7B98412F0 for ; Tue, 3 Jan 2017 23:02:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andrnils@gmail.com) Received: by mail-vk0-x236.google.com with SMTP id y197so132074219vky.2 for ; Tue, 03 Jan 2017 15:02:47 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=s3b9+wszDddsBlVvgTJLwlZsUJCXeiqo1DWZjuZCjxk=; b=LzM9f5mJjhR8QFNVqiJ6Az/ns1xed200ea2kdZhsvLHConsmfwqS0RMqjpT6tuC3Hj Ltyi2tx0bF7vfMCrLoa4BLSx9Ks7GxfQDU+IfXqpyrFRmjunJ457pL+2EWa++cmyiqoP Y8OcfToSXqqhDHoKTGi0POV2S607lhOS29S5Ayes283kiAi0keTf4Afn5yEgx5pgATz4 uoAzE5KkCvjcX+3H4qGmGT3ifg/lrSokW3TqN7AbzGw1p/fcqQGLGFzaFh1bJb3I1AHU KTTzqiTPnALRsKTj4qFGixRfGOuq0OpApJGj7lsmN4LVYg0qAk8e22Oyb/8U87LNdZEI knSA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=s3b9+wszDddsBlVvgTJLwlZsUJCXeiqo1DWZjuZCjxk=; b=sl9gacQaBx2E5L83n/JWRySiC5ML2jC3jSRcxk0RUfPTf+QkcBgvp6fLFtp+QzVAWC DSI5EAD0gYYyhmZ/dIcq+UQs9NRz0WlX0E6kErUMuVqiXjFb5ZItJJCl2NKDnh2cyML5 jrRlqNkQZxbH/Y94/c3cNHssscSzI3Ka/OQ7Dk6klLH/2DWBMrMppsXepjdK2k8l1mUK Cv1tS6ROqClggnCjmRe2LiS3zYY8a0tSQCdGLEJ6gzSDhAUv/6eSUH1jE4Q+XuV92Tc1 wFXMWkqD8WtS2KINYhHtQL5Nqae33m+gZualezIJNj/K+abPg6gOdh3CP8aoajk+Swtl 3jaQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AIkVDXKmW6eNqSCST0uyIechRqYdb9pVpAli65ygTWjyj4KVY4BueVTVF7DVNFKgq5kBVHV2a3toNI8A+i0vHQ== X-Received: by 10.31.227.130 with SMTP id a124mr18230982vkh.45.1483484566554; Tue, 03 Jan 2017 15:02:46 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.176.5.200 with HTTP; Tue, 3 Jan 2017 15:02:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.176.5.200 with HTTP; Tue, 3 Jan 2017 15:02:45 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <20161230163653.54909631@rsbsd.rsb> <15952279f17.e0be0d8c34357.732964216134709731@nextbsd.org> <20161231120453.13adf858@thor.walstatt.dynvpn.de> <20161231145143.18e6ac99@rsbsd.rsb> <20161231131150.GA3514@lonesome.com> <20161231160319.1a77a8fd@azsupport.com> <822e64b6a6efa38ad5331e2be3f175f9@vvelox.net> <20170103183149.GA86111@slackbox.erewhon.home> <15965d3f462.e563526350116.951917747823032795@nextbsd.org> <159663a3ce5.1150200c6170891.7342168662165756909@nextbsd.org> <159666235c7.123958e86174268.1988566489792006158@nextbsd.org> From: Andreas Nilsson Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2017 00:02:45 +0100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: End of year Xorg status rant To: Matthew Macy Cc: FreeBSD X11 mailing list , blubee blubeeme Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.23 X-BeenThere: freebsd-x11@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: X11 on FreeBSD -- maintaining and support List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Jan 2017 23:02:47 -0000 On Jan 3, 2017 23:10, "Matthew Macy" wrote: ---- On Tue, 03 Jan 2017 13:37:30 -0800 blubee blubeeme < gurenchan@gmail.com> wrote ---- > Well, knowing things like this up front would be helpful or is it just insider knowledge from people who were around at that time this stuff was going on. These are genuine questions I'm asking. It's not widely discussed. It reflects badly on FreeBSD as well to have a former contributor react like that. Nonetheless, it illustrates the frustration that contributors to this area might experience. > There's no reason for any corporation to fund BSD graphics work so I'm not even thinking about that. I doubt there's any funds to pay even a single developer. Barring tablet / kiosk development - which I see no case for, given the wide adoption of Android, Google's deep pockets, and the fact that no one is really making money off of *that*. > The more you look around the more it seems like there's a lot more to this issue. I am going to make contributions but I'd like to avoid reinventing the wheel but I also don't want for freebsd to be dependent on things outside its control which seems nuts. Every year new graphics hardware comes out and applications come to depend on new interfaces. The FreeBSD community has little say in either. -M _______________________________________________ freebsd-x11@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-x11 To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-x11-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" I for one would like to Matthew Macy for advancing the graphics stack as far as it has come. I find it easier to keep up with drm-next 4.7 than xorg-next. I do have some issues on a x1-yoga, where chromium sometimes distorts X, without any real logs. Anyhow, FreeBSD in this state is more productive than win10-dev builds which certainly have come a long way. OS X have some other benefits. Suspend-resume that is. Osx failed me 3 times in 3 years of 20-times a day usage, vs fbsd which on my x1 yoga has never worked. oh, it suspends fine, but video is borked on resume. But that is fine, sometime that will be worked out. FreeBSD is where I feel at home. X might be somewhat behind, but it is better now than what it has been. With Mr. Macy's patches we are getting there. Let's hope his foundational patches gets included so we can move on with integrating linux-upstream releases as ports in a more timely fashion. I wish Mr. Macy and all of you a good 2017. Best regards Andreas