From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu May 23 05:05:39 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4C5E1598A69; Thu, 23 May 2019 05:05:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4D5A782DF8; Thu, 23 May 2019 05:05:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x4N55Yek088441; Wed, 22 May 2019 22:05:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x4N55YRl088440; Wed, 22 May 2019 22:05:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201905230505.x4N55YRl088440@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: newbie question In-Reply-To: <20190523024951.GA91834@eureka.lemis.com> To: "Greg 'groggy' Lehey" Date: Wed, 22 May 2019 22:05:34 -0700 (PDT) CC: "Rodney W. Grimes" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org, Alexandru Goia X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4D5A782DF8 X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.97 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.18)[0.185,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: gndrsh.dnsmgr.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.16)[0.155,0]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.70)[0.696,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.05)[ip: (0.16), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.08), asn: 13868(0.05), country: US(-0.06)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 May 2019 05:05:40 -0000 > On Tuesday, 21 May 2019 at 21:10:38 -0700, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: > >> On Wednesday, 22 May 2019 at 1:36:24 +0300, Alexandru Goia wrote: > >>> greetings. how can do i get attuned in a logical manner with the > >>> *bsd/freebsd kernel source code ? thank you very much ! > >> > >> Clearly you know how to get it (otherwise > >> https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/ is your > >> friend). To understand it better, I'd suggest reading "The Design and > >> Implementation of the FreeBSD Operating System" by Kirk McKusick and > >> George Neville-Neil (Addison-Wesley). > >> > >> Understanding the code requires some work. People will happily answer > >> detail questions, but you'll be responsible for finding out the > >> overall structure yourself. > > > > During a somewhat recent session of working with a not new, > > but also not seasoned developer, they noted a great deal of > > confusion when I was reading through and explaining code > > to them when I would actually read "pcb" on screen as > > "Process Control Block" when verbalizing it. They could not > > see what I had just read to them. > > Heh. I ran into something like this decades ago, using an "operating > system" that will be nameless. > > The program to copy files was... IEBCPY. Most people pronounced it > "Eye Ee Bee Copy". And some had their card decks returned after hours > of queueing to discover that some completion code (13?) saying "NOT > FOUND: IEBCOPY". I think your copy of OS/360 is borked, or is this one of the names they mangled in MVS? I have a vague memory of JCL that had those types of issues. > Clearly, we decided, pronouncing names for what they mean is *bad*. > From then on I spelt names out, or at least tried to pronounce them > the way they're spelt ("Eye Ee Bee Cpy"). It confuse[ds] people, but > it avoided some misunderstandings. Pronouncing spellings is bad, yes, but that is not what I was doing. I was pronouncing the proper full names, usually as defined either in "The design and implementation book" or in the code comments themselves. I was not saying Pee See Bee for pcb, I was saying process control block. > > Greg -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org