From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Tue May 4 08:39:11 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [69.147.83.52]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EC881065670 for ; Tue, 4 May 2010 08:39:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from reinhard.haller@interactive-net.de) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.17.10]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C57288FC08 for ; Tue, 4 May 2010 08:39:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from interactive.dnsalias.net (ppp-93-104-84-240.dynamic.mnet-online.de [93.104.84.240]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrbap1) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MHajE-1O5ube19rQ-003lFO; Tue, 04 May 2010 10:26:34 +0200 Received: from scalix.interactive.de ([fd08:e8a3:4825:0:20c:29ff:feaa:3622]) by interactive.dnsalias.net with esmtp (Exim 4.71 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1O9DSb-0005PI-IK for freebsd-current@freebsd.org; Tue, 04 May 2010 10:26:33 +0200 Received: from scalix.interactive.de (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by scalix.interactive.de (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id o448QViX005150 for ; Tue, 4 May 2010 10:26:32 +0200 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (Core2Duo.interactive.de [192.168.0.196]) by scalix.interactive.de (Scalix SMTP Relay 11.4.5.13150) via ESMTP; Tue, 04 May 2010 10:26:31 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 4 May 2010 10:26:29 +0200 From: Reinhard Haller To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Message-ID: <4BDFDA35.9010608@interactive-net.de> In-Reply-To: References: <4BBFD502.1010507@elischer.org> References: References: References: References: <4BC03ABA.6090309@elischer.org> References: References: <4BC0CC6F.7010009@freebsd.org> References: References: <4BDEDECD.70508@pcbsd.org> References: x-scalix-Hops: 1 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.0; de; rv:1.9.1.9) Gecko/20100317 Lightning/1.0b1 Thunderbird/3.0.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Disposition: inline X-ACL-rcpt: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-ACL-Send: reinhard.haller@interactive-net.de X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX189vATTm/52cuAJ9puH1tPlNdQ/NcZTTmpt3uv kxCFsJ7uwNSqLmm5JcDTCDLsGzmCl/WDm/JJ8suq4j64ng6o8V M12VaxPK3OAu0aZ0M2NZrCm4tiLudGORHOdg9Phh9gjmg9VRw+ wxw== Subject: Re: ports and PBIs X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 04 May 2010 08:39:11 -0000 Am 03.05.2010 21:55, schrieb Garrett Cooper: > Also, for services like cups, there could have per-application > virtualized networking stacks Hi Garret, one jail per application -- theoretically the best idea -- no conflict due to the elimination of cross-dependencies. Havig updated a server with 10 jails last week going thru 11 boring mergemaster sessions I'm not convinced this a practicable way. Considering my problems with the update of all installed applications my keypoints are: 1) We have too much applications to manage ports, oftly you have to use 2 different applications to do the job, so even forcing all applications to compile/update doesn't eliminate the need to set up the update more than once. 2) Ports like db (40-50), python (2, 25, 26) need a proper handling by the ports management. Over time I had installed 4 db versions; apr doesn't compile with db >48. 3) Configuration dependencies are not properly handled (Installing xorg in a jail due to a unneeded configuration default is no fun). The goal of PBIs as Julian proposed is to simplify the automatic generation of simple apps. To achieve this goal we get another ports management application and hope it handles also the non trivial tasks of the non simple apps. If the PBIs come with all libraries and resources we get even more problems with multiple db installations not less. Are configuration dependencies (exim with or without ldap) addressed with the PBI format? I believe we need a more precise way to express the dependencies between the ports. Reinhard