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Date:      Tue, 24 Jan 1995 21:09:36 +0000 (GMT)
From:      "Rodney W. Grimes" <rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com>
To:        phk@ref.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp)
Cc:        terry@cs.weber.edu, bde@zeta.org.au, freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com, kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de
Subject:   Re: disklabel (1.1.5.1), partitions
Message-ID:  <199501242109.VAA10844@gndrsh.aac.dev.com>
In-Reply-To: <199501241823.KAA21387@ref.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Jan 24, 95 10:22:58 am

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> 
> > > > Not all SCSI devices are thus translated?
> > > mostly they are, unless the "> 1GB" option is set.
> > 
> > Sorry, this isn't really a valid reason for lying about the geometry
> Hey terry, you lost the reason:  A scsi-disk >HAS< no geometry we should
> care about.

The keywords there are ``should care about''.  SCSI disk only report 3
items, total number of sectors, physical number of heads and physical
number of cylinders.  The sectors/track is what we ``fake''.

> > > > Hold on! How about because the kernel should know the real BIOS apparent
> > > > geometry for instead of making things up like that?
> > > true, except we cannot trust this one anymore :-(  Some IDE and SCSI
> > > drivers get their "geometry" in CONFIG.SYS these days.
> > 
> > Actually, most EIDE controllers get them from a modified system boot block
> > installed by the OEM for the machine.  Blowing the system boot block in
> > that case really screws you up.
> No, 540Mb and above seems to get it from various "disk-managers" loaded
> in the config.sys with an increasingly annoying frequency.

There are many ways this problem is solved:
1)  NEW BIOS'es that are LBA aware can handle drives into the GBytes
2)  Special boot code that munges with the drive paramter table
3)  Disk managers hidden on track 0
4)  Device drivers loaded by config.sys

> > I don't understand... what's wrong with:
> > 
> > 	Geometry CCCC/HH/SS (Physical CCCC/HH/SS)
> The Physical isn't true, It's two years since I saw anything which added
> (multiplied actually) up to the number of sectors available.
> The numbers are fiction, make belive, has no use, value or connection
> with our use of the drive.

I think it is time to change the sd probe message to ONLY output the
total sectors, since that is the relevant number.  And/Or clearly label
the geometry as fictitious.

> > > Has nothing to do with it.  If you pass some of the weird geometries to
> > > newfs it will become very confused...  32/64 works sensibly most of the
> > > time.
> > 
> > This is a bug in newfs, like the one where it doesn't create a lost+found,
> > not a reason to bogify other parts of the system to hack around it.
> Not true.  Newfs and UFS was optimized to know about disk-geometry.  Since
> most (95%) drives these days are zoned (variable sectors/track), this isn't
> of any particular use.  The existense of caches on the drives doesn't improve
> it either.
> All the geometry is really used for is to size the "cylinder"-groups.

Probably time to rewrite newfs and parts of ufs to deal with reality :-).


-- 
Rod Grimes                                      rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com
Accurate Automation Company                   Custom computers for FreeBSD



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