From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Mar 19 12:38:56 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B5E016A4CE for ; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:38:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail002.syd.optusnet.com.au (mail002.syd.optusnet.com.au [211.29.132.32]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 096FA43D1D for ; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:38:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from PeterJeremy@optushome.com.au) Received: from cirb503493.alcatel.com.au (c211-30-75-229.belrs2.nsw.optusnet.com.au [211.30.75.229]) i2JKbjG31302; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:37:50 +1100 Received: from cirb503493.alcatel.com.au (localhost.alcatel.com.au [127.0.0.1])i2JKbjSU033211; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:37:45 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from jeremyp@cirb503493.alcatel.com.au) Received: (from jeremyp@localhost)i2JKbRCQ033209; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:37:27 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from jeremyp) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:37:27 +1100 From: Peter Jeremy To: Miguel Mendez Message-ID: <20040319203727.GO56509@cirb503493.alcatel.com.au> References: <20040315134745.1eb201f4.manlix@demonized.net> <20040315125121.GC91150@abc.123.org> <20040315135725.3cc70f97.manlix@demonized.net> <20040317110938.GA86023@dragon.nuxi.com> <1079544327.63000.5.camel@scienide.energyhq.es.eu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1079544327.63000.5.camel@scienide.energyhq.es.eu.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2i cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Pkg-based base system. X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 20:38:56 -0000 On Wed, Mar 17, 2004 at 06:25:28PM +0100, Miguel Mendez wrote: >On Wed, 2004-03-17 at 12:09, David O'Brien wrote: > >> 3. Sounds like you want Linux with its RPM's, not BSD. We consciously >> don't wrap the base system in pkg_add tarballs. We generally LIKE the >> entire system being a single integrated blob. > >Yes and no. Perl was removed from base, wasn't it? Anyone needing perl >can install install it from ports (read: it's one of the first ports >most people install). Why can't the same be applied to bind and >sendmail? As others have noted, sendmail and bind have always been part of BSD. Perl was developed independently and integrated into FreeBSD because it was useful. Perl was removed from the base system because: 1) Perl is maintained independently of FreeBSD and has been undergoing very rapid evolution. 2) The perl build system is essentially incompatible with FreeBSD's "buildworld". The perl build system assumes that perl is being built on exactly the same system as it will be run whereas buildworld is essentially a cross-build system. For a buildworld to be able to upgrade a system it cannot allow anything to assume that the runtime environment is the same as the build environment. Integrating perl into the FreeBSD build environment requires major surgery on the perl build system. Upgrading the base system to a new version of perl requires a major investment of effort - which inherently discourages anyone from upgrading the base perl. At the same time, users want/need the features from newer perl versions - which meant they had to install perl from ports anyway. Removing perl from the base system was the most logical outcome. Peter