From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 22 22:59:47 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BD0BF999 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 22:59:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-la0-x22a.google.com (mail-la0-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c03::22a]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G2" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 42762F6C for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 22:59:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-la0-f42.google.com with SMTP id gf13so4249757lab.15 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 15:59:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=OAP32XKYpDMwyrJ+LRclZ9yJqVu0PfZiY15po/sAoVg=; b=M4z0ZTZFKVGK2sL4QvjaBHqMxX227uj1zVg2/FyLpNjs6V3gosWilRBZzvVz5w+ZHn 8paHqGl3+XGEhqMIgRcJjFQ0GKYH+n0s5uiyqSS4s08T3ryLgEiQianre5zBoJSxw9qr P0Di2HHWxUqswFApwroGZOIY8TnKu+VDg7DXhSFicUPtvq3oEBBMfa9u4JXNfXrL5e0d fSJ9tCdX+TQ9IyaQXkDrgHp1GsJEdrX3Sr0aUoxYhml5TAvuG54mwgngmzdTHzCp021F 25OHQB4hg2efbIXj/SAw2hipkr2CrDc1+/pGUbsTBL97VMsbX0LvVQGqdpoborqX1g5w BReA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.112.156.168 with SMTP id wf8mr1114114lbb.28.1414018785063; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 15:59:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.152.22.195 with HTTP; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 15:59:45 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <54482A5E.2050303@NTLWorld.com> References: <54430B41.3010301@NTLWorld.com> <5443191E.5050208@mu.org> <34F30D28-DE9B-444F-885E-F438FEEA46EC@mu.org> <54482A5E.2050303@NTLWorld.com> Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2014 09:59:45 +1100 Message-ID: Subject: Re: nosh version 1.9 From: Outback Dingo To: Jonathan de Boyne Pollard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.18-1 Cc: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18-1 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2014 22:59:47 -0000 On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 9:06 AM, Jonathan de Boyne Pollard < J.deBoynePollard-newsgroups@ntlworld.com> wrote: > Outback Dingo: > >> >> IMHO I think we'd be better off with launchd... but this does show >> intelligence.... >> >> > A while ago, I lived in a comfortable little world. Yes, everyone else > was getting the likes of Solaris SMF, AIX SRC, systemd, upstart, and > whatnot. But BSD was alright. Someone was bound to come along and package > up launchd. After all, MacOS is BSD ... right? > > Then I did some investigation. > > There have been, to my knowledge, three attempts (in 2005, 2008, and 2013) > to give launchd to the general BSD world that have involved more than just > talk. All have foundered. The discomforting truth is that we aren't going > to get launchd for doing service and system management for the very same > reasons that we aren't going to get systemd for doing service and system > management. systemd is full of Linuxisms. launchd is full of Machisms. > It's simply not a BSD program. It's a Mach program. (The fact that the > initial process program isn't portable is obvious in hindsight. I kicked > myself. I've written several initial process programs before. They aren't, > and cannot be, limited to non-operating-system-specific stuff.) One > attempt to port launchd involved stubbing out the Machisms. There has been > a recent attempt to port systemd to FreeBSD that is in the same boat: stub > out or remove all of the operating system specific parts, and one can get a > program that will compile (with a lot of compiler warnings); but it doesn't > function. > > The launchd train is never coming. It's this realization, in addition to > several other motivating factors, that spurred me to aim high with nosh, > and actually set that task of converting those rc.d scripts. Feel free to > thank the valiant and noble failures of the launchd porters for the fact > that there's one alternative to BSD init that doesn't put an XML parser > into the program for process #1. (-: > > Actually thats not true..... We did successfully port it, and it is not released on github..... and it does work. https://github.com/outbackdingo/launchd_xml > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >