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Date:      Fri, 22 Jan 1999 14:20:50 -0800 (PST)
From:      Pete Carah <pete@nntp1.interworld.net>
To:        freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: Writing a HUGE file to tape (SCSI, a DLT7000)
Message-ID:  <199901222220.OAA13418@nntp1.interworld.net>
In-Reply-To: <19990108154736.L92409@freebie.lemis.com>
References:  <grog@lemis.com> <199901080349.VAA46613@nospam.hiwaay.net>

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In article <19990108154736.L92409@freebie.lemis.com> you write:
>
>On Thursday,  7 January 1999 at 21:49:24 -0600, David Kelly wrote:
>> Greg Lehey writes:
>>> On Wednesday,  6 January 1999 at 18:33:15 -0600, David Kelly wrote:
>>>> To write a tar file larger than 2G on an SGI system requires a special
>>>> option to SGI's tar. Wonder if FreeBSD's GNU tar has a 2G filesize
>>>> limit?
>>>
>>> No.
>>
>> I didn't word things right. Correct wording is, "To write a file larger
>> than 2G with tar on an SGI system..." The way I said it before suggests
>> the tar archive itself was limited to 2G without the special option.
>
>Well, in fact the problem isn't with tar, it's with System V's file
>systems, which still limit files to 2 GB, and usually even the file
>systems can't be larger, though I believe there are exceptions.
>
>Of course, this means that having files larger than 2 GB limits their
>portability.

Actually, SGI has supported filesystems up to 8gb since irix 4.x; with
5.2 (or so) they introduced xfs which has no practical limit (it's at
least 300gb for both files and filesystems since I have such a filesystem 
in a video lab I work with (40-way striped fiberchannel on 4 controllers;
does 300megabytes/sec reading to memory).

Note that since irix 3.x (late 1980's) sgi has not used anything resembling a sys5
file system (efs is basically an extent-based ufs, and xfs is a partly
log-structured version of that with 64bit pointers (grossly oversimplified).

Sun has esentially never used a sys5 file system (always ufs), and still 
stops at 2gb for files (but not filesystems; those had no limitations that 
I could find even under solaris 2.3).  (actually they finally went to 64-bit
internal inode values in 2.6 so they no longer have a practical limit
either.)

Also, I seem to recall writing more than 8g on a *tape* on an sgi under
4.0.5 when filesystems certainly were limited to that.  It required
tar'ing multiple mount points (obviously).

Since irix 6.x now defaults to xfs these limitations no longer apply.
The reason sgi uses extent-based file systems is that they are optimized
for streaming video; the extent-based systems are very suboptimal for
things like netnews.

One problem with DLTs is that the system tape parms often don't match
the drive config.  (density settings vs minor number; this normally happens 
on both Sun and SGIs; I'd expect it on FBSD too.)  Also the drives go bad
with much use (make 4-5 tapes/day and the drive won't last a year; similar
to exabyte.)  In particular, if you try to use a fixed-block driver on
a DLT the tape won't hold anything like its real capacity (picture
inter-block gaps 10x longer than the data :-)  This last may well be
your problem.  man mt has *some* pointers to the meaningful datatypes
and the Quantum web site has *some* info on what the proper ansi
format designators are for their drives (*very* indirect; it is
not easy to find.  I tend to copy a sun or sgi kernel-format string
and hand interpret it).

For more fun, try to tar the above video filesystem...  There is currently
only one (commercial) tape drive out there that will do it, from Ampex,
and VERY expensive.  (well, DLT jukeboxes can (barely) do it, but it takes a
while...)

-- Pete

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