From owner-freebsd-java@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Sep 10 15:37:33 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-java@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CC59106564A for ; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 15:37:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from achill@matrix.gatewaynet.com) Received: from smadev.internal.net (host3.dynacom.ondsl.gr [62.103.35.211]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD7728FC1B for ; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 15:37:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smadev.internal.net (localhost.internal.net [127.0.0.1]) by smadev.internal.net (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id o8AFbVCC010250 for ; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 18:37:31 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from achill@matrix.gatewaynet.com) Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by smadev.internal.net (8.14.2/8.14.2/Submit) id o8AFbU94010249 for freebsd-java@freebsd.org; Fri, 10 Sep 2010 18:37:30 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from achill@matrix.gatewaynet.com) From: Achilleas Mantzios Organization: Dynacom Tankers Mgmt To: freebsd-java@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 10 Sep 2010 18:37:30 +0300 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.7 References: <86occ5k6yo.fsf@red.stonehenge.com> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <201009101837.30844.achill@matrix.gatewaynet.com> Subject: Re: this is probably a little touchy to ask... X-BeenThere: freebsd-java@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting Java to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Sep 2010 15:37:33 -0000 =CE=A3=CF=84=CE=B9=CF=82 Friday 10 September 2010 17:47:50 =CE=BF/=CE=B7 Ei= rik =C3=98verby =CE=AD=CE=B3=CF=81=CE=B1=CF=88=CE=B5: > On 10. sep. 2010, at 16:29, merlyn@stonehenge.com (Randal L. Schwartz) wr= ote: >=20 > >>>>>> "Mark" =3D=3D Mark Sommer writes: > >=20 > > Mark> That's a pretty idealistic view of the upcoming release of HTML5. > > Mark> I have yet to see a release of HTML that is compatible across > > Mark> browsers, i.e. adapted universally by all browsers uniformly. > > Mark> Java is still a very viable platform, even on the browser. > >=20 > > Whenever I see Java firing up on my browser, I cringe. (Flash too.) > >=20 > > There are darn few things either of these do that a good modern > > cross-platform library, like jQueryUI, can't do instead. > >=20 > > Except for video playback, which HTML5 fixes as well. And yes, until > > then, we're stuck with Flash. > >=20 > > We needed Java before we had good JavaScript. Now we have good > > JavaScript. > >=20 > > I repeat... Java had its day. Time to move on. >=20 > You are forgetting - or conveniently ignoring - that many still NEED Java= support in their browsers - and not of their own choice. Banks, insurances= , digital signature services etc. Still frequently use Java as carrier for = their services. Often this cannot be changed easily as such organizations h= ave long turn-around times and make investments in the long term.=20 >=20 > Java is still very much alive, and until html5 can validate and run signe= d code it'll stay that way even on the client. And that is just one of the = reasons/scenarios.=20 >=20 > I'm not using FreeBSD on the desktop for just this kind o reasons. I'm su= re it would be a great choice in an ideal world but we are unfortunately li= ving in a real one. So either one takes the time to implement what people _= need_ in addition to what you would prefer them to need, or the desktop can= as well be ditched and focus moved to improving FreeBSD for servers, where= it already excels.=20 Point is that FreeBSD is just a touch away from rocking in the desktop aren= a as well. Alright i took me (partially) a week (with ubuntu it would have been just 1= =2D2 hours) to finally build an ultra-modern (KDE4.5)=20 environemt in my new box (with flash10 + firefox 3.6 + icedtead 1.6 browser= plugin + virtualbox/ubuntu) but the point is that the overall=20 experience is much better with FreeBSD. Given the extra time needed to debug, report bugs, fix bugs, etc.. the end = result is really good! >=20 > /Eirik >=20 >=20 > >=20 > > --=20 > > Randal L. Schwartz - Stonehenge Consulting Services, Inc. - +1 503 777 = 0095 > > > > Smalltalk/Perl/Unix consulting, Technical writing, Comedy, etc. etc. > > See http://methodsandmessages.vox.com/ for Smalltalk and Seaside discus= sion > > _______________________________________________ > > freebsd-java@freebsd.org mailing list > > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-java > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-java-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > >=20 > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-java@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-java > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-java-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >=20 =2D-=20 Achilleas Mantzios