From owner-freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 4 03:28:10 2014 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:1]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8E511923 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2014 03:28:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from nm46-vm7.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (nm46-vm7.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com [216.109.115.110]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2DAB91AA9 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2014 03:28:09 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=gcom1024; t=1391484166; bh=4RJ88YS59ROnABv8t/uoo3/Yiisw/nw4LSdgFFwOCeo=; h=Received:Received:Received:DKIM-Signature:X-Yahoo-Newman-Id:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-Rocket-Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:CC:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=c0G3zteONgBmYhMOL//eMJPINI/QYnOP/dcbGvl2hwDNLwDbXgAJe3LrxTrtgyVXcATay4Kf5wQeurYZNGMzaOGMd1OaY78Y9FS87riTV45aufZN4ZqbAXDb++kuDbyCdh6v0XdbvgZ90VGsWq1dtKEPEe2t0h12bdnhR6+6lOw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=gcom1024; d=yahoo.com; b=cwOinFY2naygNLHioTPL69udrFqW3mpQO4UvfS272gZEu0IehYDRoU8ZXm4UccMkxtsn+Lgzc1vdiuxyhkt7eyV6bYjYRdzkf9TNYXUdsoJtWSbJ3VtTu/DgpRVt2fzbGMPr9fLeZoTqqrJKLZC6G8oHJccronDy3EVpXKeSQ30=; Received: from [98.139.215.143] by nm46.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2014 03:22:46 -0000 Received: from [98.139.211.194] by tm14.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2014 03:22:46 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp203.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2014 03:22:46 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s1024; t=1391484166; bh=4RJ88YS59ROnABv8t/uoo3/Yiisw/nw4LSdgFFwOCeo=; h=X-Yahoo-Newman-Id:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-SMTP:X-Rocket-Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:CC:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=Fx4+GzuHs9N8dIvyc5cd6HnuRdVX4DTORBoxfanMP4T/0c4T85zRRU5DcAOYtx1NKu0mCdf/k5B71tqkH4lUeaxRJX2syxlX66e4UULzzP8d43MMiANc0HFYEzII4FFszHUbVonDbKb77QsZNnbODVSNr3g8G0OH29gN1UZK/HM= X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 704836.42173.bm@smtp203.mail.bf1.yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-YMail-OSG: 87VFAZUVM1lvLDiCVI9GXFXHT3cBE3bTyvQG8iJZst72Vgp i4DFSnsjF2XsFAy7ac5HPpafD1eQ5.ORCfg7P7x5ayGof4k30pIEeU5kgz5n XFywrCCjpUJHdoeIDBakTt9RUzzjxAf.kibD1jgEJJErG_V7x_qKlnTueXvE 3_bzSsw6dYoNtQCrT7g5FyRxw1eJ73mA9fA.NP7Ul2Cb9a2Q5p0zJjESeGlX N2CTkhb0XEg2t9ObhF9revxtbsU7AS8YN96hBYGGvix.oUHbtXYPoO2AnPp6 BQqTTVtCsUDLZ1EKyeJ6pY0qs4M_trabS8.XltLtRn21kcWB62xNLN8zWSOM IuzvWhtw8rqf9ydoPPL_hQTPSK4GlrdrVaGIuCCkMG8v9N3Gcb4ZON2ZIDOR DBnGSNSFW7J_vHMWYPjE9dZILelwY6vemhMIpBesbNdffLLIXOZ5PPsQWLDq 6U9RVOKB.KckYaa3GaFyR4Kc3bk8kIJjY_U1UlRcVCnsCV2eAoh.9S4DvP6y RwMOt0mmmWK_e2BXFRnhwUrNxLGBn5hyVVNCA8T.97tbTh1AUw8MhA_r8kLc JXJ5fPeHof9p9ZXK2Rapr5uLHvUqSnnicAQ-- X-Yahoo-SMTP: 6IZaPQyswBAeyzp3urHRlQfBxGxx4Js3YAIn X-Rocket-Received: from gateway.FBSDbouq.com (jeffreybouquet@66.92.43.99 with plain [63.250.193.228]) by smtp203.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with SMTP; 03 Feb 2014 19:22:46 -0800 PST Message-ID: <52F05D20.7090803@yahoo.com> Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 19:23:12 -0800 From: Jeffrey Bouquet User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD i386; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matthew Seaman Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Ports-Announce] Time to bid farewell to the old pkg_ tools References: <201402032124.s13LOS4r042824@fire.js.berklix.net> <52F01A75.7050409@FreeBSD.org> In-Reply-To: <52F01A75.7050409@FreeBSD.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting software to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2014 03:28:10 -0000 My first post that quotes good: Thunderbird rather than the webmail... [As this one is about to be send, I see that it is a restate/duplicate of the one lost in a webmail glitch ... so apologies...] On 02/03/14 14:38, Matthew Seaman wrote: > On 03/02/2014 21:24, Julian H. Stacey wrote: >>> be beneficial in a very short amount of time. Even if you prefer to >>> compile from source, >> I use source, rarely if ever use packages, (except pkg_delete >> to remove old broken dependencies). No opinion which scrips are better. >> >> >>> you will still reap the benefits of the modern >>> packaging system. >> In 10.0 FreeBSD `reaped the benefit` of a default new horrible >> registry that smells like Microsoft with quasi binary local.sqlite >> needing special tools. (Yes I know there's an export function.) >> >> For 2 decade we've poured scorn on Microsoft & its opaque easily >> damaged hard to access registry, & lauded how with FreeBSD we can >> examine & manipulate & repair our text based equivalent with any >> number of personal choice text tools, & now FreeSBD is burdened by >> this horrible Microsoft style registry. > You're being absurd. local.sqlite is nothing like the Microsoft > registry[*]. It's a database of all the files etc. that are managed > through the ports system. No more, no less. ... our TEXT based ... /# find /var/db/pkg -type d -name "p5*" | xargs -J % find -type f -name "+CONTENTS" -exec grep -H "5.12" {} \; | grep pm | gtr -s \/ "\n" | grep p5 | sort | uniq | xargs -J % portmaster -d -B -P -i -g % && yell || yell That pipe, corrected ( the working version includes an incrementing | head -NN | thru hundreds of p5 upgrades, 15-25 at a time, so easy completion of the upgrade with only a repeat with the up arrow and a minor edit ,) handily upgraded a /perl5/ subdirectory to the default on several installs. > > All we have done is replace an unreliable collection of text files -- > hard to keep consistent, impossible to update in an atomic fashion and > woefully pessimal for certain quite legitimate queries A subset of the above pipe? > -- with a RDBMS, Which a user may be expected to learn > which quite neatly disposes of those problems. No, it isn't ascii text > which you can grep through. That here is a source of dismay... less creativity in pipes etc... > It's a set of relational tables, which you > can query using SQL. That here is also a lessening of the fun. > And that is a deal more powerful in many ways than > grep, but not so familiar to most; so we've provided a scripting > interface in the form pf pkg-query(8). > Do you complain because ZFS doesn't have it's configuration data in some > ascii text files? How about procstat(8)? Or ld.so(1)/ldconfig(8)? > Truth is, unix has always adopted a pragmatic approach to system data > and stored it in whatever form would be most effective. In our case, > we're pretty clear that a relational database is streaks ahead of a > directory tree full of text files. For those reluctant to switch over, maybe a concurrent /usr/ports/ports-mgmt/pkg_legacy_tools Maybe even concurrent installs [both package systems, ] , if they are both tweaked to be co-existable, and each in parallel improved over time. What if an urgent upgrade to a server failed in one method, the other could "env -i" in , this one "env -i " out, and the upgrade proceed apace. Or a command to test which method would work best of on a specific upgrade, and that pkg system default (the other backup) until the next "switchover" Can't do that in ".... [ insert other favorite operating system here ]... " > > Cheers, > > Matthew J. Bouquet