From owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Oct 11 02:13:11 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0A6A16A4B3 for ; Sat, 11 Oct 2003 02:13:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fubar.adept.org (fubar.adept.org [63.147.172.249]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D16543FA3 for ; Sat, 11 Oct 2003 02:13:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@adept.org) Received: by fubar.adept.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 0DD6115227; Sat, 11 Oct 2003 02:13:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fubar.adept.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 090B315226 for ; Sat, 11 Oct 2003 02:13:10 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 02:13:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Hoskins To: advocacy@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <200310110148.42949.j.e.drews@worldnet.att.net> Message-ID: <20031011015915.D56283@fubar.adept.org> References: <002801c38fb1$95e804e0$0200a8c0@sbcgolbal.net> <200310110148.42949.j.e.drews@worldnet.att.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: Re: A case of FreeBSD users shooting all FreeBSD users in the foot? X-BeenThere: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: FreeBSD Evangelism List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2003 09:13:11 -0000 On Sat, 11 Oct 2003, Jonathan wrote: > I read a few of the comments and they paint a very unflattering view of the > FreeBSD community. actually, they paint an unflattering view of IRC. that's nothing new. > 1) Most newbies require CD's to do an install yet FreeBSD mall has terrible > advertising for it's CD's. There are no screenshots of Gnome or Kde and no > package descriptions whatsoever. You don't see anything like this (GNOME) > http://www.FreeBSD.org/gnome/screenshots.html or this (KDE) > http://freebsd.kde.org/screenshots.php at FreeBSD mall. Furthermore > OpenOffice is not on the RELEASE Cd's. That is a huge mistake. screenshots have marginal value. (since some of us don't want gnome or kde environments installed, the screenshots would tell us nothing about the specific operating environment we would configure.) still, it can't hurt and it seems like it'd be easy enough for freebsdmall to link to screenshots if they're already hosted on freebsd.org. how big is openoffice again? how much space are free on the release CDs? i wouldn't want to second guess packaging decissions like that without having all the facts. > 2) The documentation is sometimes too vague and aimed at computer > professionals. I tried to configure a firewall using "Dialup firewalling with > FreeBSD" and I could not get it to work ( http://www.freebsd.org/doc/ this is a result of starting as a "server OS" (that's really still the goal, it just happens to make a great desktop too). a lot of the system and misc docs are written by computer professionals. :) the best way to get a plethora of docs at various reading levels/styles is to have a lot of people writing documentation. if possible, document (from your perspective) what you have to do to get things working and submit that back to the doc project. http://www.freebsd.org/docproj/index.html (of course you can also host docs yourself of submit articles to any of the bsd/opensource pubs.) > 3) While FreeBSD ports are generally very good there is little coordination > amongst the ports maintainers. That is if the ghostscript port gets changed, > I find out about it when it breaks printing in the word processors. For a > hobbyist it's an annoyance, for a company using FreeBSD desktops it's a > disaster. this is a complex issue to manage, but i'm sure there's always room for improvement. how would you propose increasing coordination or the effectiveness of communication amongst ports maintainers? for a company using opensource desktops, you should be installing standardized packages from your gold/build server(s). don't build randomly updated ports resulting in differing files/libraries/bins on each machine. ;) packages are you friend. at times there are problems with packages too, but that's the case on every OS... and most people i know that have strict requirements build their own packages so they can roll any machine with known results. -mrh -- From: "Spam Catcher" To: spam-catcher@adept.org Do NOT send email to the address listed above or you will be added to a blacklist!