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Date:      Mon, 18 Dec 1995 10:11:34 -0700
From:      Nate Williams <nate@rocky.sri.MT.net>
To:        "Frank ten Wolde" <franky@pinewood.nl>
Cc:        Nate Williams <nate@rocky.sri.MT.net>, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   Re: Order of rules in ip_fw chain
Message-ID:  <199512181711.KAA23836@rocky.sri.MT.net>
In-Reply-To: <9512181801.ZM8519@pwood1.pinewood.nl>
References:  <9512151302.ZM27077@pwood1.pinewood.nl> <199512151611.JAA16380@rocky.sri.MT.net> <nate@rocky.sri.MT.net> <9512151720.ZM309@pwood1.pinewood.nl> <199512151639.JAA16535@rocky.sri.MT.net> <9512181801.ZM8519@pwood1.pinewood.nl>

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> I think we disagree here, or our needs differ greatly :-) I still think 
> it's better for safety that *if* my Bastion host is compromised (someone 
> evil becomes root) they still cannot flush the fw chain.

Agreed.  My statement was made to say that I think we need to have more
security levels than the current version, so we can still have a secure
system and *still* allow modifications of the ipfw chain.  It doesn't
have to be an all or nothing affair.

> I accept 
> bringing down the host to single user mode for adding/deleting rules -- 
> after *careful* consideration of the new rules.

I can't do that w/out wiping out my internet connection, and I'd rather
not do that for the sake of other people in my company. :)

> Should we make the save-fw-chain a configuration option in the kernel?
> Perhaps we must add a new level to securelevel to allow for secure fw
> chains *on top of* the very secure mode (e.g., securelevel 3).  Maybe
> we need to re-define securelevel to be a bit-field to enable secure mode
> for independent sub-systems in the kernel?  Would this be too large a
> deviation from the original 4.4BSD definition?

I think having multiple secure levels is a good thing, but I don't have
time to think about how it should best be done. :(


Nate



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